Amanpour – “The Latest on the Ceasefire Deal”

Podcast: Amanpour (CNN Podcasts)
Date: October 20, 2025
Host: Bianna Golodryga (sitting in for Christiane Amanpour)

Episode Overview

This episode delivers a multi-part exploration of global crises, focusing first on the latest developments in Gaza amid a fragile ceasefire, and the diplomatic efforts attempting to prevent renewed escalation. The discussion shifts to conflicting U.S. and European strategies on Ukraine, and includes a historical dive into the 1929 Wall Street crash's relevance today. Additionally, the episode spotlights the life and revolutionary music of Fela Kuti, highlighting how art can serve as political resistance.

1. Gaza Ceasefire: Tremors Beneath the Truce

Current Situation

• Despite a ceasefire, Gaza experienced another deadly weekend: Israeli airstrikes killed dozens of Palestinians after Hamas killed two Israeli soldiers ([00:36]).
• President Trump maintains that the ceasefire stands, sending envoys Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner to Israel to reinforce the agreement.
• Aid to Gaza is still insufficient, with Israel holding the Rafah crossing closed pending the return of deceased hostages ([00:36]).

Forces Sustaining the Truce

Guest: Dennis Ross, Veteran Diplomat and Former Peace Negotiator ([03:40])

• Stakeholders for Peace:
  • Trump is invested in keeping the ceasefire.
  • Turkey, Qatar, and Egypt pressure Hamas for compliance.
  • Netanyahu, under Trump’s pressure and possibly seeking closure, is unlikely to break the truce independently ([03:40]).
• Fragility Points:
  • Hamas withholds 16 deceased hostage remains, returning them only under pressure.
  • Ongoing attacks (e.g., anti-tank missile attack on IDF) test limits.
• Pressure Dynamics:
  • U.S. and regional actors (Turkey, Egypt, Qatar) are actively containing both sides.
  • Trump’s dual approach: public threats toward Hamas coupled with acceptance of the explanation that attacks may be by rogue Hamas elements ([04:57]).

“Everybody seems to have a stake in wanting to preserve this, at least for the time being.” – Dennis Ross [05:37]

Viability of the Ceasefire

• Hamas “Playing Games”: Delays in returning hostage remains interpreted as strategic, not logistical ([06:32]).
• Possible Breakdown:
  • Repeated violations and soldier deaths could force Netanyahu to abandon the truce.
  • “If you keep having killings, it will not hold…” – Dennis Ross [06:32]
• Human Toll: The unresolved hostage issue imposes devastating psychological burden on families ([07:21]).
• Kushner’s Outlook on Phase Two:
  • Emphasizes integrating Israel into the broader Middle East by helping Palestinians “thrive and do better.”
  • When pressed on the “how,” Kushner replies, “We’re just getting started.” ([07:38])
• The Next Phase:
  • Creating a technocratic Palestinian administration (“Board of Peace”) and deploying an international stabilization force as Israeli forces withdraw ([08:30]).
  • Arab states (Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar, Egypt, Turkey) strongly motivated to stabilize Gaza but won’t invest unless Hamas is sidelined ([10:11]).

“The key here...is to get that Council of Peace, that technical administration up and running...” – Dennis Ross [11:37]

Palestinian Authority’s Role

• Realpolitik vs. Rhetoric: Netanyahu says publicly the PA won’t be allowed in Gaza, but practical collaboration is ongoing ([11:41]).
• Two-Phase Vision:
  • Interim: Technocratic government includes PA personnel in functional, non-political roles.
  • Long term: Broader PA involvement depends on substantial reform – “appointing a highly credible, independent, empowered prime minister” ([12:41]).

2. Ukraine Crisis: Stalemate and Strategic Dilemmas

White House Drama & Mishandled Diplomacy

Guest: Kurt Volker, Former U.S. Ambassador to NATO and Ukraine Special Envoy ([16:21])

• Recent White House Meeting:
  • President Trump rebuffs Zelensky’s plea for Tomahawk missiles; instead, he pursues a negotiation-first approach with Putin.
  • Meeting was “not what President Zelensky was looking for, but it’s also fine. We basically are where we have been for a long time.” – Kurt Volker [16:29]
• Putin’s Position:
  • Remains inflexible; maximalist territorial demands persist.
  • Trump’s outreach is seen by Volker as unlikely to prompt Putin to compromise ([17:41]).
• Miscommunication at Alaska Negotiations:
  • Envoy Witkoff misunderstood Putin’s willingness to swap territory; Trump ultimately left negotiations discouraged ([18:35]).

Territorial “Freeze”: Trump’s Proposal & Putin’s Intransigence

• Trump’s Words:

  “Let it be cut the way it is. It’s cut up right now. I think 78% of the land is already taken by Russia...cut and stop at the battle. I go home, stop fighting, stop killing people.” – President Trump [18:40]

• Volker’s Analysis:

  • Putin “wants to keep fighting to get more” and his negotiating posture is designed to extract additional concessions ([19:20]).
  • Trump’s freeze proposal ignores Ukrainian and European concerns about rewarding aggression ([20:13]).

• European Role:

  • With U.S. stepping back, Europeans are urged to:
    • Convert frozen Russian assets into Ukrainian funding.
    • Form a coalition to provide military assistance and integrate air defenses.
    • Take more initiative as the “coalition of the waiting” has yet to act ([24:33]).

U.S. Reluctance and Sanctions Dilemma

• Trump’s Mindset:
  • Avoids escalation (sanctions, arms) to keep negotiations alive.
  • Volker: “Putin is using President Trump’s desire to get a deal to get him to back off of tougher measures…” ([26:07], [26:59])

“Rubio won’t make that mistake. Rubio will get it right in terms of what the Russians are saying. But unfortunately, there’s no reason to think that Putin wants anything other than all of the Donbas...” – Kurt Volker [21:20]

3. Art and Resistance: Fela Kuti’s Enduring Power

Guest: Jad Abumrad, Host of the “Fela: Fear No Man” podcast ([28:29])

Fela Kuti’s Impact

• Music as Weapon:
  • Pioneer of Afrobeat, Fela blended political messaging with irresistible dance rhythms, becoming a catalyst in challenging Nigeria’s dictatorships ([28:30]).
  • Songs such as “Zombie” directly attacked the military, leading to brutal state reprisals.
• Memorable Quote:

  “His music was…a weapon that challenged authority. And that, for me, is the story I just really need to hear right now.” – Jad Abumrad [29:09]

Confronting State Power

• “Zombie” (1976):
  • Lyrics satirized soldiers’ blind obedience; song sparked the infamous army raid on Fela’s compound.
  • “A thousand soldiers encircling the compound, pouring gasoline on the thing and burning it…Because of a song?” – Jad Abumrad [30:42]
• Cycle of Resistance:
  • Fela repeatedly turned police violence into further creative output.
  • “The more they came after him, literally, the more music he made…” ([33:36])
• Human Cost:
  • Fela’s mother killed during the military raid; he responded publicly by placing his mother’s coffin at the government’s doorstep.

  • “No matter what they did, he never backed down…If they think I’m going to change or compromise, they’re making me stronger.” – Fela Kuti (archival, [33:25])

Fela’s Legacy and Influence

• “Unsummarizable” Figure:
  • Described variously as Bob Marley, Mandela, James Brown, and Muhammad Ali rolled into one ([35:49]).
  • “We really have no figure like him in the West…simply can’t put him in any one place.” – Jad Abumrad [36:23]
• Personal Journey:
  • Early in career, Fela wrote songs “about soup”—later transformed into a chronicler of national struggle ([34:32]).

4. Lessons from 1929: Financial Crisis and its Echoes

Guest: Andrew Ross Sorkin, Author
Host: Walter Isaacson ([38:14])

Revisiting the Crash

• The Forgotten Dominoes:
  • 1929 crash often misunderstood as a singular event, but it set off a chain reaction leading to global depression ([38:17]).
• Key Mistakes:
  • Bad decisions and misjudgments after the crash escalated rather than prevented the Great Depression ([39:20]).
• Modern Parallels:
  • Ongoing debates about the Federal Reserve’s independence and policy echo those of the 1920s ([40:00]).
• Crucial Factor – Leverage:
  • Every crisis hinges on “too much credit in the system” – then, margin loans; now, private debt often hidden from view ([41:52], [43:06]).

Inequality and The Real Economy

• Exuberance and Credit:
  • The 1920s marked the birth of consumer credit, leading to euphoria and mass speculation ([44:32]).
• Social Unrest and Parallels Today:
  • Extreme inequality then and now; the rise of “cultural superstars” in finance ([45:49]).
• Aftermath:
  • Roosevelt’s reforms (Glass-Steagall, FDIC, SEC) fundamentally altered the financial landscape.
  • “We are not destined to have this happen again…Let’s hope that’s all it is.” – Andrew Ross Sorkin ([51:27], [52:38])

Notable Quotes by Timestamps

• [05:37] – “Everybody seems to have a stake in wanting to preserve this, at least for the time being.” – Dennis Ross
• [06:32] – “If you keep having killings, it will not hold…” – Dennis Ross
• [18:40] – “Let it be cut the way it is. It’s cut up right now...stop fighting, stop killing people.” – President Trump
• [21:20] – “Rubio won’t make that mistake...But unfortunately, there’s no reason to think that Putin wants anything other than all of the Donbas…” – Kurt Volker
• [29:09] – “His music was…a weapon that challenged authority. And that, for me, is the story I just really need to hear right now.” – Jad Abumrad
• [30:42] – “A thousand soldiers encircling the compound...Because of a song?” – Jad Abumrad
• [33:25] – “If they think I’m going to change or compromise, they’re making me stronger.” – Fela Kuti (archival)
• [36:23] – “We really have no figure like him in the West…simply can’t put him in any one place.” – Jad Abumrad
• [38:17] – “...the crash of 1929 was so much more because, yes, it led to the Great Depression, but the number of dominoes that did begin in 1929...will surprise a lot of Americans and a lot of readers.” – Andrew Ross Sorkin

Key Moments by Timestamp

• [03:40] – Dennis Ross views on ceasefire prospects in Gaza
• [08:30] – Ross outlines the critical next steps for Gaza stabilization
• [16:21] – Kurt Volker dissects Trump-Zelensky-Putin diplomatic tangle
• [18:40] – Trump’s stance on freezing the Ukraine conflict
• [29:59] – Fela’s song “Zombie” and its impact
• [33:00] – Segment on the raid that killed Fela’s mother and his defiant response
• [35:49] – Compilation description comparing Fela to various Western icons
• [38:17] – Sorkin explains why the ’29 crash is misunderstood
• [44:32] – Connecting 1920s credit culture to modern debt concerns

Tone and Language

The episode skillfully balances analytical depth with empathy, candidly conveying the impossibility of separating politics from real human suffering. The tone is direct, urgent in moments of crisis, and reverent when describing cultural icons or historical lessons. Guests and hosts engage with clarity, skepticism, and a search for pragmatism in world affairs.

For Listeners

This episode offers vital updates and insights for anyone following Middle East peace efforts, U.S.-Russia-Ukraine dynamics, or historic/modern financial crises, and serves as a vivid reminder of music’s power to challenge oppression. Even without prior context, listeners will find rich, timely discussion that bridges geopolitics, economic history, and cultural resistance.