Unidentified and Waiting

Summary

America's Crime Lab — “Unidentified and Waiting”

Podcast: America’s Crime Lab
Host: Aylin Lance Lesser (iHeartPodcasts & Kaleidoscope)
Episode Date: October 22, 2025

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Brief Overview

This episode dives into the crisis of unidentified human remains in the United States, focusing on Mississippi’s daunting backlog of such cases. Featuring forensic anthropologist Anastasia Holobenko and others at Othram, the episode highlights how breakthroughs in DNA analysis and genetic genealogy are restoring names to people once considered lost forever. Through stories like the post-Katrina disappearance of Tonette Jackson and the decades-old mystery of Luther Ezell, the podcast explores the interplay of science, bureaucracy, and family in the search for resolution and justice.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Problem of Unidentified Remains

• Scope: Coroner’s offices across the U.S. house countless boxes of unidentified human remains, each representing a stalled investigation and the grief of families left searching ([02:12]).
• Systemic Issues: Traditional forensic methods—relying on skeletal measurements and limited DNA techniques—often fall short, leaving many cases unresolved for decades ([03:30]).

2. Forensic Anthropology and Othram’s New Approach

• Anastasia Holobenko's Journey: Originally interested in marine biology, Anastasia switched focus after taking a forensic anthropology course in college ([04:22]). Her fascination with the human skull—“that’s a person”—sparked a lifelong commitment to the field.
• Mississippi’s Backlog: Upon joining the Medical Examiner’s office in 2016, Anastasia encountered a massive backlog of over 40 unidentified remains cases ([05:14]).
• Othram's Technology: Othram’s advanced DNA sequencing examines tens of thousands of genetic markers, dramatically improving the odds of identification through genealogical comparison ([06:36]).
• Challenges: Many remains—including Katrina victims—had been subjected to harsh cleaning and environmental degradation, complicating DNA retrieval ([07:10], [07:52]).

3. Case Study: The Disappearance and Identification of Tonette Jackson

• Background: Tonette and Hardy Jackson were stranded by Hurricane Katrina; Tonette was swept away by a wave while Hardy clung to a tree, heart-wrenchingly letting her go with a promise to look after their kids ([08:39]).
• Emotional Coverage: The initial media interviews captured the trauma—“We ain’t got nowhere to go” ([09:45], Hardy Jackson).
• Recovery and Struggle: Weeks later, remains believed to be Tonette’s were found, but identification obstacles led to her being buried as a Jane Doe ([10:40]).
• Breakthrough:
  • Exhumation and Testing: Almost 19 years later, Anastasia initiated exhumations, and despite highly contaminated samples, Othram filtered out non-human DNA to finally confirm her identity ([14:22]).
  • Outcome: Tonette’s family received closure; Hardy, having passed away, never learned the truth ([15:12]).
• Quote:
  • “And so it came full circle.” — Anastasia Holobenko ([15:09])

4. Case Study: The Identification of Luther Ezell

• Discovery of Remains: Anastasia’s investigation led to the retrieval of remains from various university labs—some unidentified bodies had been out of state for years ([16:07]).
• Ezell’s Story:
  • Ezell, born in 1913, went missing on a trip in the 1980s, leaving behind six children. His family searched for decades ([17:15], [17:27]).
  • Genetic genealogy established his identity 32 years after his disappearance ([18:05]).
  • His daughters finally had closure, learning he hadn’t abandoned them but had died far from home ([18:17]).
• Quote:
  • “They know he didn’t stay away on purpose. They know where he is now.” — Aylin Lance Lesser ([18:39])

5. Ethical Reckonings: The Treatment of Unidentified Remains

• Teaching Specimens: Unidentified remains were sometimes retained in university collections for teaching—without proper consent or authorization ([21:58], [22:14]).
• Changing Attitudes: The rise of genetic technology prompts institutions to reassess old practices and return remains for possible identification ([24:01]).
• Quote:
  • “I had no idea that a body found without any ID might end up as a classroom tool.” — Aylin Lance Lesser ([22:05])

6. Hope and Progress Amid Continuing Backlog

• Growing Submissions: Othram’s success has led to more cases being submitted, with the backlog increasing—not due to neglect, but because of renewed hope ([24:01]).
• Legislative Attention: Anastasia testifies before state legislatures, advocating for investments in identification efforts ([25:59]).
• Quote:
  • “It really is just, it's moving forward one name at a time.” — Anastasia Holobenko ([25:25])

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• “Bones, they're not really viewed as people because they don't have soft tissue. They're not visually recognizable as a human. And then sometimes the investigation is not prioritized.”
  — Anastasia Holobenko ([03:30])

• “The explanation that, well, we don't have advanced technology so we can't identify this person, so why even try... nowadays, many practitioners or professors, they've changed their outlook over the years.”
  — Anastasia Holobenko ([23:27])

• “There are thousands, tens of thousands of unidentified human remains cases. It can become so overwhelming… but it really is just, it's moving forward one name at a time.”
  — Anastasia Holobenko ([25:25])

• “Money.”
  — Kristin Mittleman, on the primary obstacle to solving cases ([05:44])

• “You either get used to [the smell] completely or you don’t. And it’s something that I still am struck by the fact that I haven’t completely gotten used to it.”
  — Anastasia Holobenko ([04:56])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:12] – Introduction to the Mississippi unidentified remains crisis
• [03:30] – Humanizing bones & forensic anthropology’s challenges
• [05:14] – Othram’s technological advances and funding hurdles
• [06:36] – Advanced DNA analysis explained
• [07:10] – Challenges with degraded Katrina victim remains
• [08:39] – Story of Tonette and Hardy Jackson’s ordeal
• [10:40] – Discovery and attempts to identify Jane Doe (Tonette)
• [14:22] – Othram overcomes sample contamination to solve the case
• [15:09] – Case comes full circle; news for the family
• [16:07] – Remains lost in university storage
• [17:15] – Identification of Luther Ezell and family’s long search
• [21:58] – Unidentified remains used as teaching tools
• [24:01] – Institutional reckoning and the push for change
• [25:25] – Closing thoughts: hope and determination “one name at a time”

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Conclusion

“Unidentified and Waiting” highlights both the heartbreak and hope embedded in the work of forensic identification. The episode weaves together scientific innovation, personal stories, and ethical questions, demonstrating that—with new tools and relentless advocates—lost loved ones can finally come home, even decades after they first vanished.

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Transcript

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

This is an Iheart podcast. This is Alec Murdoch.

[Alec Murdoch]

I need police and an ambulance immediately. Murdoch Death in the Family official podcast is here. I'm joining Patricia Arquette, Jason Clark and the cast to uncover all things Murdoch.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

Family first to unravel the story piece.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

By piece was really surprising because you.

[Alec Murdoch]

Don'T want to believe it. Murdoch Death in the Family official podcast Wednesdays and stream Death in the Family on Hulu and Hulu on Disney for bundle subscribers terms apply.

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[Alec Murdoch]

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[Aylin Lance Lesser]

It was August 2005. Tenet Jackson and her husband Hardy lived with their four children in a small house in Biloxi, Mississippi. The Jacksons and their neighbors had seen their fair share of hurricanes and prepared like they would for any other storm. But no one was prepared for Katrina. In a matter of hours, Toanette's name would be added to the list of 12,000 missing people. This is America's Crime Lab. I'm Aylin Lance Lesser. Coroner's offices around the country are filled with boxes of unidentified human remains. We've talked about this many times on the show. These boxes represent dead ends. Times when traditional DNA testing didn't work. Meanwhile, there are families who never stopped looking for their lost loved one who might have ended up in one of those boxes without a name. Today we talk with someone who's been trying to solve this problem to learn about her experience as someone with a very unusual job and a special role when it comes to IDing mysterious remains.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

Bones, they're not really viewed as people because they don't have soft tissue. They're not visually recognizable as a human. And then sometimes the investigation is not prioritized.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Anastasia Holobenko is a forensic anthropologist, which means she steps in when law enforcement runs out of leads. Think Temperance Brennan from the TV show Bones, studying skeletal remains to find clues about things like gender and biogeographical ancestry. For nine years, Anastasia worked for the Mississippi State Medical Examiner's Office. This year, she joined OTHRAM as the special projects coordinator for anthropology. In college, Anastasia thought she might study marine mammals until she took an elective course in forensic anthropology. That changed her life.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

I actually got my first look at human bones and I was just fascinated, fascinated. And particularly viewing the skull that's a person. I mean, I don't know what that person looked like in real life, but that skull represents a human.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

One of Anastasia's first cases using forensic anthropology involved a lost boater on Lake Erie. The body was discovered one spring as the ice on the lake thawed out.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

So that was really my first autopsy, seeing what that body looked like. And I have to say, I used Vicks under my nose because the odor is something. And I think you either get used to it completely or you don't. And it's something that I still am struck by the fact that I haven't completely gotten used to it.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

By 2016, Anastasia was working in Mississippi's medical examiner's office, where she faced the state's long backlog of unidentified remains cases. When she first learned about othram, she was intrigued. Maybe the problem wasn't that these cases were impossible to solve. Maybe they just needed new technology. At othram, Kristin Mittleman shared an interest in clearing Mississippi's backlog. She knew the science was there, but she was facing a different obstacle.

[Kristin Mittleman]

Money.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

There were no funds to work the cases. Then a Mississippi native, Carla Davis, offered to fund the project. Carla had spent years researching DNA and family trees for adoptees, and she later joined OTHRAM to lead their genetic genealogy. But before that, she was compelled to help identify remains in her own state with her own money. Now, with Carla involved, they could begin to tackle the backlog of unidentified human remains at the medical examiner's office. At the time, there were 43 unidentified remains cases on the backburner. People had assumed that technology was the limiting factor and that many cases were just unsolvable. See, anthropologists would measure features of the skull or skeleton to try and figure out clues about where someone was from. That was helpful, but it was also inexact. And in tough cases, it didn't give investigators enough information. Now, Othram's technology offered a way to look at tens of thousands of DNA markers and compare them to other people with well documented family histories. Think big family trees. Kristin was confident that this would reveal a much clearer picture of an unknown person's origins. But looking at the Mississippi remains, there was a problem. In many cases, all that was left were bones, some completely stripped of DNA before they were shelved years ago.

[Kristin Mittleman]

The Mississippi bones are difficult to work with for a couple reasons. A lot of them have been cleaned off with detergents that make it more difficult to do DNA testing Because back then, advanced DNA testing wasn't a thing. Even DNA testing may not have been a thing. And so what they did is they washed these bones, boiled them, used detergents so that they can clean them to be able to better look at them, not knowing that, you know, decades later, DNA testing would be able to give them the answer. But the worst thing you can do to DNA is boil it or wash.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

It with a detergent on top of that. Unlike most states, Mississippi's backlog included a lot of hurricane Katrina victims.

[Kristin Mittleman]

Katrina victims, as you can imagine, there would be a lot of contamination there that make the DNA testing a little bit more difficult. There's a lot of degradation because a lot of them were left in water or out in the field for decades and decades and decades.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

This is where Othram's tech may be able to help. Kristen and Anastasia started working together. To start, they had a particular Jane Doe in mind and they had a hunch that her name might be Tonette Jackson.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

There are several that really I will remember for a very long time. That would be one of those cases. Tonette Jackson and her husband were trying to seek refuge in their house on their property, and she was swept away during the storm.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Tanette and Hardy Jackson were climbing up to their attic to escape the rising water when a 20 foot wave crashed into their home and split the house in two. Hardy clung to a tree with one hand and held on to Tanette with the other. When Tonnette realized Hardy wouldn't be able to hold her for much longer. She made him promise to take care of their children and grandchildren. Then they let go.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

When the storm cleared and people were coming out onto the streets, a Reporter came across Mr. Jackson, who was visibly distraught, and she was able to talk to him about his story.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Reporter Jennifer Mayerly from WKRG, a local CBS affiliate, saw Mr. Jackson walking with his two young sons. After he told her about his wife's disappearance. The reporter asked him to describe her so people could keep an eye out.

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[Alec Murdoch]

Can put this out there? Tony Jackson. Okay, and what's your name?

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Hardy Jackson. Where are you guys going?

[Alec Murdoch]

We ain't got nowhere to go.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Nowhere.

[Alec Murdoch]

I'm going.

[Kristin Mittleman]

I'm lost.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

That's all I had. That's all I had. In the video, the reporter does something you don't see on TV as she holds the microphone to Hardy Jackson. Listening to him, she starts to cry at the end. When she turns the story back to the news anchors, they seem speechless behind their desk. I think we need to go to a break, one of them says, and then bursts into tears.

[Alec Murdoch]

I think we need to go to a break. We'll return with more in just a moment.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Weeks later, in the neighboring community of St. Martin's a search crew located a body. It was in between the slabs where two houses once stood.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

They believed them to be those of Ms. Jackson, but there were technical difficulties in achieving an identification.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Was this Tinette? No one could tell for sure and her remains were buried as a Jane Doe. But to Nette's husband, Hardy Jackson never stopped looking. This is Alec Murdoch.

[Alec Murdoch]

I need police and an ambulance immediately. Murdoch Death in the Family Official podcast is here. I'm joining Patricia Arquette, Jason Clark and the cast to uncover all things Murdoch Family First.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

To unravel the story piece by piece.

[Alec Murdoch]

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[Anastasia Holobenko]

Perfect for anyone with kids, pets or.

[Alec Murdoch]

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[Aylin Lance Lesser]

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[Aylin Lance Lesser]

See Mint mobile.com 19 years after Hurricane Katrina swept to net Jackson away, Anastasia took up the case. The Mississippi Bureau of Investigation decided to exhume two bodies and that were buried as unidentified individuals in the wake of Katrina. One man and one woman, a Jane Doe.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

I took samples from both sets of remains to send to Othram.

[Kristin Mittleman]

I do know that there was a lot of bacterial non human DNA there in her sample specifically. And if you don't have purpose built methods to filter that stuff out, genome sequencing sequences, everything, plant DNA, bacterial DNA, anyone else's DNA that may have touched those remains. It's super powerful. But if you have markers from all of these genomes, you actually aren't going to get any relatives because they're all mixed together.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

By selectively analyzing the human genetic material hidden among DNA from non human sources, Othram was able to reveal the truth about Jane Doe's remains. These Remains did belong to Tenette Jackson, the woman who hadn't been seen since a 20 foot wave tore her away from her husband.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

And so it came full circle.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Unfortunately, Hardy, her husband, had passed away a few years earlier. He never got to hear the news. But Tenet's family did.

[Kristin Mittleman]

And he did spend the rest of his days keeping his promise to her and looking for her.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

This was just one of dozens of cases that were solved through Anastasia's partnership with OTHRAM for the Mississippi Backlog. But it wasn't long before Anastasia discovered another hurdle. Before she arrived at the Mississippi Medical Examiner's Office, Mississippi had relied on universities or forensic anthropologists who were out of state for, for help with investigations. And when she tried to get a full picture of how many unidentified remains were actually in state custody, she realized something. Mississippi's remains were sitting in university labs and storage rooms all across the South. So she started making calls to nearby universities. Slowly, and sometimes with a lot of pushback, they agreed to send them back. One box of remains they got back posed a new problem. The remains were recovered in 2022. But when Anastasia looked at them, it was clear they were much older. She dated them to the 1980s, and she didn't have much else.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

It was an incomplete case that I received, meaning not all of the skeletal elements were present. And there were some personal effects, but there was no documentation with the remains.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

But the big problem was they weren't sure when this person went missing. This made it harder to know which generation this person might belong to on a family tree. Anastasia sent the evidence to othram. Their scientists were able to build a genealogical profile that was used to conduct genealogical research. This helped them identify Luther Ezell.

[Kristin Mittleman]

They realized that he was born in 1913, I believe he was a father to six children. He was married. He loved fishing and went missing in 1980.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

And he lived in California and traveled cross country in his vehicle to assist a family member with a move. And somewhere around Mississippi, he checked in with his family, but then was not heard from again. And they hired private investigators and they searched for their father for decades.

[Kristin Mittleman]

And I know that he was a family man that his family honestly thought really loved being a family man. And then one day, he was gone.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

32 years after he disappeared, Anastasia contacted Luther Ezel's family. She returned the few personal belongings found with his body.

[Kristin Mittleman]

I know his daughters were really, really happy to hear from us and figure out what happened to their father. I think this is one of those cases where they weren't sure if he just left and decided not to come back to the family. And now they have answers and they know that that's not what happened.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

We still don't know exactly what happened to Luther during that cross country trip, why he died or how his body ended up where it did, but at least his family has some closure. They know he didn't stay away on purpose. They know where he is now. This is Alec Murdoch.

[Alec Murdoch]

I need police and an ambulance immediately. Murdoch Death in the Family Official Podcast is here. I'm joining Patricia Arquette, Jason Clark and the cast to uncover all things Murdoch.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

Family first to unravel the story piece by piece.

[Alec Murdoch]

Piece was really surprising because you don't want to believe it. Murdoch Death in the Family Official Podcast Wednesdays and stream Death in the Family on Hulu and Hulu on Disney for bundle subscribers. Terms apply. There's nothing like sinking into luxury. At washablesofas.com, you'll find the Annabe sofa which combines ultimate comfort and design at an affordable price. And get this, it's the only sofa that's fully machine washable from top to bottom. Starting at only $699, the stain resistant performance fabric slipcovers and cloud like frame duvet can go straight into your wash.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

Perfect for anyone with kids, pets or.

[Alec Murdoch]

Anyone who loves an easy to clean spotless sofa. With a modular design and changeable slipcovers, you can customize your sofa to fit any space in style. Whether you need a safe single chair, loveseat or a luxuriously large sectional, Annabe has you covered. Visit washablesofas.com to upgrade your home. Right now you can shop up to 60% off store wide with a 30 day money back guarantee. Shop [e-mail] Add a little to your life. Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

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[Alec Murdoch]

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[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Now the story of Luther Uzel unveils another surprising part of how unidentified bodies are treated. Because if Anastasia hadn't gotten his remains back from that university lab, what would have happened to him?

[Anastasia Holobenko]

Probably the long term use of unidentified human remains as teaching specimens.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

This kind of blew my mind because I had no idea that a body found without any ID might end up as a classroom tool.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

And we're not talking about legitimate or official anatomical donations where the individual has signed off on donation of his or her body to a teaching institution or maybe the next of kin authorizing this donation.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Teaching specimens. Now typically when people donate their bodies to science, they're donating a cadaver, a complete body with skin and tissue and organs. When the cadaver is no longer needed as a teaching tool, most medical schools return the bodies to families for burial or cremation. This means that medical schools do have cadavers, but they don't have a lot of access to skeletal remains. In the past, since unidentified human remains were more difficult to identify and since universities needed skeletal remains for teaching purposes and law enforcement wasn't clamoring for the remains to be returned, universities and historical institutions may have been using unidentified remains to teach students remains that really should be returned to the state and ultimately families.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

I can't speculate as to what goes through people's minds. The explanation that, well, we don't have advanced technology so we can't identify this person, so why even try with the technology we have nowadays, many practitioners or professors, they've changed their outlook over the years and as well as the development of standards. But really until the death investigation systems became more structured, I'm not surprised that this sort of thing happened.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

There's been a reckoning of sorts. Many university systems and cultural institutions are taking a closer look at their skeletal remains collections. State police are also asking universities to check their storage rooms for unidentified remains. And then you have medical examiners offices calling universities to see if unidentified remains are sitting on their shelves like what Anastasia has been doing. Because there is no need to wait. The technology exists to solve the puzzle. Kristin, Anastasia and Carla started with 43 unidentified remains cases in Mississippi, and since then, they've helped identify most of them. But in the meantime, the backlog has continued to grow. As of September 2025, there are 69 new unidentified remains cases waiting to be solved in Mississippi. But this growth doesn't reflect neglect, it reflects renewed hope. Kristin says more people in the state are submitting cases for review because of the success the team's had. Anastasia has appeared before many state legislatures. She wants them to know that there's a solution and that solving cases is a choice. Some states are beginning to get on board.

[Anastasia Holobenko]

There are thousands, tens of thousands of unidentified human remains cases. It can become so overwhelming. But I think most of us who do this type of work are very good at compartmentalizing. And of course, if you're not good at comparison compartmentalizing, then you become much more proficient at it through this work. But it really is just, it's moving forward one name at a time.

[Aylin Lance Lesser]

Anastasia Hohobenko is a former forensic anthropologist for the state of Mississippi. She's now a special projects coordinator in anthropology and at othram. America's Crime Lab is produced by Rococo Punch for Kaleidoscope. Erica Lance is our story editor and sound design is by David Woje. Our producing team is Catherine Fenollosa, Emily Forman, and Jessica Alpert. Our executive producers are Kate Osborne, Mangesh Hadigadur, and David and Kristin Mittleman. And from iHeart, Katrina Norville and Ally Perry. Special thanks to Connell Byrne, Will Pearson, Kerry Lieberman, Nikki Etor, Nathan Etosky, John Burbank and the entire team at othram. I'm Aylin Lance Lesser. Thanks for listening. This is an I Heart podcast.