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America's Most Infamous Crimes with Katie Ring
Idaho Murders: How DNA Linked Bryan Kohberger to the Crime Scene Pt. 3
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This is Crime House.
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He studied criminals, analyzed their thoughts, their motives, and even their step by step methods. Then four college students were stabbed to death in a quiet Idaho town. A white Hyundai Elantra circling the house, a single knife sheath left behind a phone that mysteriously went dark for two crucial hours, and a criminology PhD student who thought he understood how to get away with murder. In this final chapter of the Idaho Student Murders, we'll follow the digital trail that led police straight to Bryan Coburger and examine the shocking decision that left families with justice. But not answers. Because even after a conviction, one question still lingers. Why. Every crime tells a story about the people involved, the system that tried to stop it, and the nation that couldn't look away. Some cases are so shocking, so deeply woven into who we are, that decades later, we're still asking, how did this happen? I'm Katie Ring and this is America's Most Infamous Crimes. Every Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday, I'll take you deep into cases that have a lasting imprint on society and still haunt us today. I want to thank you for being part of the Crime House community. Please rate, review and follow America's Most infamous crimes wherever you get your podcasts and to get all episodes at once. Ad free. Subscribe to Crime House plus on Apple Podcasts.
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Today I'll tell you how the police zeroed in on Kohberger as a suspect, the quest to bring him to justice, and where things stand. Today, on November 13, 2022, Madison Mogan, Kaylee Goncalves, Zanna Kernodle and Ethan Chapin were found brutally stabbed inside their home on King Road in Moscow, Idaho. The killer was nowhere in sight, but the police had some valuable information to work off. Dylan's description of a man about 6ft tall with bushy eyebrows, a footprint matching a van's brand shoe, a leather knife sheath and a white Hyundai Elantra. While investigators waited for DNA testing on the knife sheath, they focused on tracking down the car. And on November 29, 2022, 16 days after the murder, campus police at the University of Washington in Pullman flagged a white 2015 Elantra that was registered to 28 year old PhD student named Brian Coburger. They also discovered that Coburger had recently changed his license plates. He'd been pulled over in August while driving a white Hyundai Elantra. At the time, he had Pennsylvania plates which were set to expire on November 30th. He'd finally gotten new Washington plates on November 18th, just five days after the murders. It could have been a coincidence. After all, his plates were just set to expire. Or it could have been an attempt to cover his tracks. Based on what the authorities knew so far, Coburger checked a lot of boxes. He was the right height and his eyebrows matched the description Dylan had given. Except when the MPD received the tip, their department initially dismissed it. I know it's shocking, but they had some valid reasons. Last episode I mentioned that the FBI expert thought the Elantra they were looking for was a model from 2011 to 2013. Coburger's was a 2015. And remember, the operating theory was that the killer knew at least one of the victims. But Coburger had no known connection to any of them, which made him seem like a long shot suspect. But before I keep going, it's time to tell you a bit more about Rock Brian Kohberger. Because if the police had known this stuff initially, they may have changed their minds sooner. Kohberger grew up in Pennsylvania and he didn't have it easy. As a teenager, he was quiet, awkward, and often kept to himself. According to his classmates, he could be unpredictable and sometimes started fights with no warning. Kohberger also struggled with a neurological condition called visual snow, where a person's vision is obscured by scattering dots. The condition is still being studied, but according to some neurologists, it can be debilitating. Now, there's no direct causation between visual snow and mental illness, but one research team has found that people who experience visual snow also reported high levels of anxiety, depression, and depersonalization. And this was definitely true for Bryan Kohberger. He claimed he developed visual snow as a teenager around the same time he noticed his lack of emotions. And when Kohberger was 16, he wrote about feeling detached from reality in an online forum. He said he felt like a, quote, organic sack of meat with no self worth. He also posted that he constantly considered suicide and felt guilty for treating his father like dirt. On that same forum, he also said that he felt no remorse and could do whatever he wanted. Here's another quote from one of his posts. I am blank. I have no opinion. I have no emotion. I have nothing. Can you relate? The problem only got worse when he added drugs into the mix. Kohberger started using heroin in high school when he was deeply depressed and experiencing suicidal ideation. At some point, it seemed like he got a handle on his visual snow, but the heroin use didn't stop. Kohberger was in and out of rehab a few times until he eventually claimed he'd gotten a handle on it. By 2018, he'd cleaned up his act enough to go to DeSales University in Pennsylvania, where he studied psychology. But there were some Reddit posts during this time at DeSales that were more than alarming. Under the username criminology student, he surveyed criminals about topics like how they prepared for their crimes and what their emotions were while leaving their homes with the intent to commit a crime. And I have to point out this isn't all that strange for a criminology student, but given what we know about him, definitely a red flag. However, nobody thought anything about it at the time, and Brian stayed at DeSales long enough to graduate with a master's degree in 2022. That fall, the 28 year old started at the Washington State University Ph.D. criminology program, where he also worked as a teaching assistant. And it only took a couple of months for him to get a reputation for being rude, sexist, lazy, and arrogant. There were 13 complaints filed against him in total and and he was specifically described as being rude and belittling towards women. Kohberger's female colleagues and students said that he would stand at their desk, stare at them, and physically block them from leaving the room. And this kind of thing happened on multiple occasions. Coburger even followed a woman out to her car. And in the weeks shortly before and after the murders, he also started getting into verbal altercations with his professors over his work ethic. And the crazy thing is that Pullman police knew who he was already, but not for committing a crime. It was because he applied for a research internship with them. They turned him down because he seemed awkward and they thought he would have trouble getting cops to talk to him. Kohberger was also known to the police in Moscow. He'd been pulled over there In October of 2022, just a month before the murders. Detectives were able to find body cam footage of the stop. You can see that Kohberger tried pretty hard to talk his way out of the ticket, although he doesn't come off as violent. But in the immediate aftermath of those reports on November 29, he was just another name in the sea of possible suspects. Although it wouldn't be long before the FBI expert revised their conclusions on the Elantra and said it could actually be a model between 2011 and 2016. And since Coburger's car was a 15, he was back on their radar. Then on December 19, the case took another turn. When DNA results finally came in, the lab had been able to test a sample from a button on the knife sheath found in Maddie's room. And they had some promising news to share. Do you have $10,000 or more in credit card debt? Maybe you're even barely getting by by making minimum payments. 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Ask your doctor about ebglis and visit lily.com or call 1-800-LILYRX or 1-800-545-5979. Testing the DNA found on the knife sheath hadn't been an easy process in the immediate aftermath of the murders. The Idaho crime lab had been able to pull a male profile, but it wasn't a match for anyone in the law enforcement database. Luckily, though, that wasn't the end of the road. They contacted a lab in Texas that specializes in genetic genealogy, which involves finding a distant relative through a site like Ancestry.com who has uploaded their DNA and narrowing the list down from there. And on December 19, 2022, that lab confirmed Bryan Kohberger could be their suspect, although they'd have to get a direct sample from him to be sure. But it wouldn't be that easy, because they couldn't just march up to Coburger and get his DNA. Not only that, but he wasn't even in town anymore. By the time the police got those results, Coburger was already back home in Pennsylvania. He'd driven there with his dad after he got fired from his TA job and lost funding for his PhD program because of his concerning behavior. But just because he was in another state, that didn't mean that he was out of the woods. On December 20th, FBI agents started monitoring the coworker's house 24 7. They wanted to make sure Brian didn't try to run. And if they saw him throw away some trash, they were legally allowed to go through it to get a DNA samp. In the meantime, the authorities in Idaho kept looking into him. On December 23, they got a search warrant for Coburger's cell phone records from November 12th to the 14th, which was just before, during, and right after the murders. Here's what they found. At 2:47am on the night of the murders, the phone connected to a tower that would have provided service to Pullman, Washington, where Coburger lived. After that, there was a gap until about 4:48am where the phone didn't connect to any towers, which meant Kohberger had physically turned his phone off. When the phone came back on at 4:48, it connected to a series of towers that were consistent with driving south from Moscow, then across the state border to the area of Uniontown, Washington, then north to Pullman, Washington. And this route was a bit odd because it's not the most direct way to get from Moscow to Pullman. The two towns are only 10 miles apart, and there's a route that would be basically a straight shot from one to the other. The way Coburger went, it makes both the distance and the drive time four times longer. It was definitely a mystery, but it was suspicious enough to get a warrant for more data, this time going back to June 2022, five months before the murders. And it turned out that Coburger's cell phone connected to two towers that cover 1122 King Road 12 times between June and November 13th. Not only that, but looking at the data again, the investigators realized that Coburger's phone went back to Idaho. On November 13, at 12:36pm about eight hours after the murders and a half an hour after the police arrived at the scene, the phone was traveling backwards on the same route it had taken from Moscow to pullman. And at 12:49, almost exactly an hour after the 911 call, Brian and his Elantra both appeared on security footage at the Albertsons in Clarkston, Washington, right by the Idaho border and very close to the route that the phone had traveled earlier that morning. This made it seem like he returned to his own crime scene. Then Coburger's phone went dark again at 5:36pm and didn't ping again until 8:30pm in the area of Johnson, Washington, about 25 minutes north of the house. That part has never been explained, but there's one possibility that Kohberger was driving around getting rid of evidence like blood stained Clothing or even the murder weapon. Regardless, the evidence against Kohberger was mounting. But it would all be circumstantial unless they could get a definitive DNA sample. FBI agents were patiently waiting outside the Kohberger's house. And on December 27th, they finally took out their trash and the FBI agents swooped in to grab it before it was collected. And as they looked through it, they found a used Q tip that would help them crack the case. They sent it in for testing and the results were clear. Whoever left the DNA on the knife sheath at the crime scene was the biological son of whoever used the Q tip. And they knew Coburger's dad was at the house, which meant the Q tip was his and Brian was the killer. At 3am on December 30, 2022, six weeks after Maddie, Kaylee, Zanna and Ethan were murdered, 40 members of the Pennsylvania State Police SWAT team surrounded the Coburger family home. The officers blew through the Coburger's front door. They figured they'd be waking everyone up. But Brian was already in the kitchen wearing latex gloves and was methodically sealing his trash into separate Ziplocs apart from the rest of the family's garbage. As a criminology student, he knew his DNA could give him away. But apparently he didn't realize his father's DNA could too. As officers zip tied his wrists, Kohberger was weirdly calm and asked one question that has now become a central topic in many forums online. Was anyone else arrested? He also suggested to people on the SWAT team that they should get coffee after all of this. But that was not going to happen. Instead, Bryan Kohberger was charged with four counts of first degree murder and one count of burglary. Within days, FBI agents started the process of extraditing him back to Idaho to face trial. The question now was what would justice look like?
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As the prosecution got their case together, they were able to directly test Kohberger's DNA against the sample from the knife sheath. As expected, it was a match. They also got a warrant to Coburger's Amazon purchase records for any activity related to knives or knife accessories and discovered that he'd bought a Ka Bar knife and a sharpener in March of 2022, eight months before the murders. On the same day that Kohberger was arrested, police had also searched his apartment in Pullman, Washington, and it was unsettling to say the least. It had been cleared out almost completely. Completely. The trash was also empty, all of which you'd expect for someone moving out, but even the shower curtain was removed. Investigators also found two small blood stains that were tested and found to be possible blood on a pillowcase and a mattress. But as of this recording, the results haven't been released or the samples weren't tested. But Coburger's apartment wasn't the only thing that had gotten a deep clean his white Hyundai Elantra was spotless. While the authorities were collecting all of this information, Kohberger's trial was slowly moving forward. In September of 2024, almost two years after the murders, a judge ruled that the venue would be moved to a different county. The local media had publicized the case non stop, and the judge believed that Kohberger wouldn't get a fair trial. So it was moved to Boise, nearly 300 miles away and set for the summer of 2025. In the meantime, the defense had submitted a ton of motions, mostly trying to get prosecution evidence excluded. They pointed out that there was unidentified male blood on the handrail outside of the crime scene, which they wanted to use to point to a possible alternate suspect. And remember, Coburger asked if anyone else had been arrested when he was Taken into custody, making some people think he had an accomplice. Or maybe he planted that bloodstain to throw the police off. But no one was really buying that. As for an alibi, the defense claimed that on the night of the murders, Coburger was just out for a pleasant nighttime drive between Pullman and Moscow to stargaze. But nobody was buying that, either. With the charges he was up against, Coburger was facing the death penalty. And with all of the evidence against him, getting acquitted was the long shot. So on July 30, 2025, Hoberger agreed to plead guilty in exchange for dropping the death penalty. Madison Mogan and Ethan Chapin's family supported the idea. But Kaylee Gonzalez's loved ones felt blindsided and were upset the death penalty was taken off the table. Either way, prosecutors believed it was the cleanest path to justice, a way to guarantee Bryan Kohberger would never walk free again. But what was eating at all of the families was that they still didn't know why Kohberger had done what he did. They needed that information to make sense of their children's death and find closure. But without a trial and without anything written into a plea deal, they would never get that information. And Kohberger wasn't interested in talking. When he returned to court on July 2, 2025, Kohberger barely said a word. When the judge read each victim's name. Kaylee Gonzalez, Madison Mogan, Zanna Kernodle, Ethan Chapin. He was asked the same question. Did you murder this person? Each time, Kohberger replied, yes, he was guilty. His voice never changed, with no emotion on his face. But at the sentencing hearing a few weeks later, the victim's friends and families got their turn to speak. And all of them had powerful statements. I don't think I will ever forget the power and fierceness behind Kaylee's sisters Olivia's statement. As each person spoke, Kohberger sat there silently. And when he was given the chance to respond, he declined. With that, the case was officially closed. Per the plea deal, Bryan Kohberger was sentenced to four consecutive life sentences, plus 10 years. And while there's comfort in knowing he'll never be free again, there are still so many questions people have about this case, especially because he has yet to speak about his motive, and there's a good chance he never will. But people have plenty of theories. Many believe that Kaylee was the main person Kohberger targeted because of how extreme her injuries were, along with the stalking she endured. Not only that, but investigators also learned that Kaylee had been receiving strange messages in the mail and online. Another creepy possibility is that Coburger somehow befriended Kaylee's dog Murphy before the murders as a way to make sure he wouldn't bark when Coburger entered the house. One of the victim's friends said that Murphy had started running off into the bushes behind the house and wouldn't come back when they called him. Another friend said that there was one time when Kaylee came home to find the rear side door of the house open and Murphy was missing. He eventually came back, but the roommates didn't know where he'd gone. According to Kaylee's family, there's evidence suggesting he followed both Kaylee and Maddie on Instagram and that he liked a few of Maddie's pictures. So if he was targeting one of them, it would explain why he went up to the third floor and that the other girl, as well as Zanna and Ethan were killed because they happened to be there. As for why he didn't go after Dylan and Bethany, according to Dateline, there was an imprint on Zanna's chair from someone sitting in it, which leads many to theorize that Coburger was too exhausted to fight two more people after killing four victims. Whatever his reasons were, the tragic truth. Truth is that we'll likely never know with how viral this case went. There's still so much speculation online, and it's important to remember that there are real people involved here. Maddie, Kaylee, Zanna, and Ethan all had promising futures ahead of them, and it was all ripped away in a tragic act of violence. We want to honor their memories as best we can, and if you're interested in contributing something in their name, you can buy lip bulbs from the Ethan Smile foundation, which his parents established to raise money for scholarships. There's also the Made With Kindness foundation, honoring the memory of the victims in this case. It can be found at www.madewithkindnessfoundation.com. at the end of each episode, we'll be going off the Record, where I'll give my thoughts about the case and answer any questions you've submitted. What are your thoughts about this case not going to trial? I really wish this case would have gone to trial because I've watched a few interviews with Steve and Christy Gonzalez, and I feel like this door won't be shut for them for a long time. Not that a door is ever shut on your child being brutally murdered like this or a child ever dying, but I feel like they won't get closure, especially because evidence is still being dropped like the last drop was last month. So everyone on the Internet is going through all of these documents and are bringing all of this back up for them. Each time there's a new drop of evidence, and it's still going to be happening because not all of the evidence is out there yet. So I really wish this went to trial. And I think that all the speculation on this case will last pretty much forever. Like, this will be one of the cases that is known in America because people didn't really get the answers. There was no trial. There's no questioning of witnesses, questioning of experts, questioning, you know, on either side. We get the evidence that's now being presented in the documents for this case, but not seeing it play out in real time. I think people are just going to have these conspiracy theories and that they unfortunately won't really ever go away. Even though, I mean, the guy pleaded guilty and waived his right to an appeal. And people are still absolutely adamant that he's innocent. If he was innocent, he would have had a much better chance fighting it in court. And nowadays prisoners who get the death penalty sit on death row for years and go through appeal process after appeal process. So personally, I feel like that would have given him a better chance at walking free if people still thought he was innocent. What are your thoughts about what would have happened in trial? Unfortunately, I don't think we'll ever fully know. In this last document dump, though, we got a few insights into what CO Burger's lawyers may have argued. And especially there's a document with Dr. Brent Tarvey, who's a forensic criminologist. And he was going to argue that the autopsy reports show that it was impossible that there was one killer and that there were two killers. He claimed that one killer could not have contained both Ethan and Zanna, saying, quote, it is not reasonable to think that Ethan would have remained in his bed after waking up or being awake while Zanna was being attacked in front of him. This evidence and context begin to suggest the existence of a second attacker. He also believes that one person couldn't render the two different types of lethal force used on Kaylee Gonzalez. Although, as I mentioned in the last episode, A K bar is basically two weapons. It's a knife on one side, it's a blunt end that's you can use as a hammer on the other end. So I don't really agree with that one. He also said that the bodies were posed and that there's direct evidence of a cleanup. Again, I'm not sold either way. But these experts that the defense are bringing up are hired to fit their narrative, if that makes sense. So, again, we have to take all of these with a grain of salt. He claims that the knife sheath was placed there, that it didn't fall there or wasn't left there. The sheath was precariously placed just slightly under the bed of Maddie and partially covered by the comforter that was placed atop the midsection of her body by the suspect. So I think one of their big things was that they were going to say that it wasn't just one murderer, it was two murderers. But with all the evidence the state has against Brian, like, I. If anything, it would be like, okay, well, Brian had a partner, so I don't know how that would exactly exonerate Brian. I think they would probably lean into the fact that the DNA at the scene is touch DNA and it's on the sheath and not on any of the victims. That can work in court. Although I think the fact that there were drops of aspirated blood on the knife sheath and his DNA means that the sheath had to be there when the victims were killed because you couldn't get the blood on there without it. So I don't think they had been placed there later and, like, blood was wiped on it. I think he had it in his possession. His DNA was on it, and he left it at the crime scene. I don't think he was there to kill four people. I think his plan went wrong, and I think he. That's why he made mistakes. Those are my personal thoughts. I think obviously there would have been a lot more of that played out in trial. And hearing from all the different witnesses, I think would have been very interesting and given people answers that they, I don't think will ever stop looking for. What would you say to the pro burgers? So if you don't know the pro burgers are the people who think that Brian Kohberger is innocent. What I will first say is that he pleaded guilty, he waived his right to an appeal, he waived his right to post conviction challenges, and accepted a sentence of life in prison without the possibility of parole. You don't do that unless you know you are losing a fight and you know you are guilty. In my opinion, he gave no statement trying to say he was innocent. He has not given any interviews. He has never said that he had an accomplice. So you have to explain, why is he silent? Why isn't he defending himself at all? There's no real answer for that. To believe he's innocent you also have to explain why his DNA was on the sheath, why there's aspirated blood of the victims from the sheath, meaning the DNA had to be there when the victims were actually killed. So that takes out, again, as I said earlier, the possibility of the sheath being planted. You have to believe that Coburger just randomly lent his K bar weapon to someone that he had just bought on Amazon a few months prior. You have to believe that his phone was just completely randomly turned off at the exact same time of the murders. To quote Stargaze, you have to believe that the same car was randomly circling the area of the house and randomly drove off right after the murders. You have to justify why he randomly returned to the crime scene eight hours after the murders. You have to justify why he was googling places to get his car detailed and how to sell his car before he was arrested. You have to explain why he was wearing latex gloves and sorting through his own trash and separating it before he was arrested. Why else would you do that if you weren't trying to hide something? And this is a guy who sexually harassed multiple women on campus, who was reading profiles of serial killers on Christmas Eve after he had already dropped out of school. So there was no scholastic reason for doing that. This guy had violent porn of girls being raped while they were passed out and other much more disturbing things that I won't even say here. And again, he pleaded guilty. In your opinion, what impact did this case have on American crime history? I think this is going to be one of those cases that people don't forget about. I feel like it almost, as I said earlier in the question about what are my thoughts on not having a trial, I think it's made it a cold case to a lot of people on social media who are doing this digging. So unfortunately, especially unfortunately for the families, I don't think people will ever let this go. And especially now as more documents are consistently being dumped. It's just going to be at the center. It's going to be always one of the biggest true crime cases. I mean, even there was just a lawsuit because a psychic on TikTok had claimed that one of the professors at University of Idaho was actually the person who was the real killer. And she was having an affair with someone in the house. And that's why she put a hit out to murder all of the students. And she was told this by her tarot reading and her intuition. She just got sued and the professor got a $10 million payout. I don't know if she has enough money to pay it out. But again, I think this is always going to be ingrained in true crime history and go down as, you know, one of the biggest cases. Thanks so much for joining me for this episode. If you're watching on YouTube, make sure to subscribe. If you're listening on audio, please rate, review and follow America's Most Infamous Crimes. And to get all episodes at once ad free. Subscribe to Crime House plus on Apple Podcasts. Come back next week for another deep dive into a true crime that changed America. 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