Americanswers… on 5 Live! Why does Trump want to shut down the Education Department?

Summary

Americast Episode Summary

Podcast: Americast (BBC News)
Episode: Americanswers… on 5 Live! Why does Trump want to shut down the Education Department?
Date: March 24, 2025
Hosts: Sarah Smith, Matt, Marianna Spring, Anthony Zurcher

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Episode Overview

This episode of Americast dives into listener questions on three major topics swirling in US politics: Donald Trump’s push to shut down or drastically reduce the Department of Education, persistent speculation about Trump seeking a third presidential term, and what “Making America Great Again” (MAGA) actually means to Trump’s supporters. The team also covers Trump’s policies’ impact on issues like special education, economic tariffs, and the high-profile grumblings over his presidential portrait in Colorado. The hosts maintain their signature blend of insight, humor, and accessible analysis, peppered with listener interactions and real-world examples.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Would Trump Shut Down the Department of Education?

[04:52] Listener Question: Susan from Milton Keynes asks about the effect of closing the Department of Education on her American grandson in special needs education.

Federal vs State Powers (05:19)

• Sarah Smith: Trump has moved from wanting to eliminate the department entirely to proposing a much smaller version due to practical and legal barriers:

  "He'd really need congressional approval to completely close it down... Most things that govern schools, the curriculum, the funding, teachers’ qualifications...is actually administered by the individual states, not centrally by the Department of Education in Washington."
  (05:19)

• Federal Department’s real power: Distributing funds to support low-income and special needs students.
• Most everyday schooling would remain unchanged for many, but vulnerable populations could be affected by a loss of federal oversight.

Potential Risks to Kids with Special Needs (06:25)

• Anthony Zurcher: The Department is especially important for special needs and low-income education:

  "Without the federal oversight...it will all fall down onto the states. It’s going to vary state by state how they use that money... because there’s no one in the federal government now who can enforce it."
  (06:25)

• States would gain freedom, but support for special needs children could become inconsistent, potentially jeopardizing protections.

Notable Quote

“Most things that govern schools...is actually administered by the individual states, not centrally by the Department of Education... the Department disperses funds to help low income students and grants and all that kind of thing.”
— Sarah Smith (05:19)

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2. Could Trump Get a Third Term?

[08:15] Listener Question: Catherine from Oxfordshire asks: will Trump try to change the rules for a third term, and how plausible is it?

Constitutional Barriers (08:44; 09:42)

• Sarah Smith: Trump teases the idea for political effect:

  "He teases us all the time by saying he wants a third term... You never entirely know. And that’s part of the clever politics around all this."
  (08:44)

• Anthony Zurcher: Constitutionally almost impossible:

  "There’s a constitutional amendment... limits presidents to only two terms... You either have to have a Constitutional Convention—that’s never been tried—or both chambers of Congress and a majority of states must ratify. That’s a very, very high bar."
  (09:42)

• Fringe theories exist (Trump returning as VP, interregnum interpretations), but all are very unlikely.

Notable Quote

“All of these things kind of operate in the realm of the very unlikely to absurd, but it’s something that keeps people chatting and it keeps me busy talking about.”
— Anthony Zurcher (11:13)

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3. What Does "Make America Great Again" Actually Mean?

[11:54] Listener Question: Tracey from Shrewsbury asks what “great” means in “MAGA,” and about Trump’s claims about tariffs generating income.

The Fuzziness of "Great" (12:32)

• Sarah Smith: "Great" is subjective and moves with political winds:

  “Great is whatever you want it to be...it’s what happens when Donald Trump’s in the White House and very much not what happens when Joe Biden’s in the White House...”
  (12:32)

• MAGA revolves around supporter values: restoring traditions, toughness on immigration, undoing "woke" policies.
• Cultural nostalgia, with Trump supporters idealizing the 1950s (strong America, traditional families).

  "Donald Trump himself has actually said the 1950s were his idea of American greatness..."
  — Anthony Zurcher (14:36)

What Happens to the Money from Tariffs? (16:19)

• Sarah Smith: Trump says tariff revenue and fiscal reforms would fund:
  • Big tax cuts, mainly benefiting the wealthy
  • Expensive new defense projects (e.g., US “Golden Dome” missile shield)
  • National debt payments (though debt rose under Trump first term)

  “Tax cuts for the very wealthiest, which will make some people feel great... a lot of money could go into defense... and they say into paying off the national debt...”
  (16:26)

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4. Has Trump Delivered on Promises?

[17:53] Listener Comments: Audience asks for a balanced take: has Trump delivered on anything?

Immigration as a Success (18:22)

• Anthony Zurcher: Trump gets credit for slashing illegal border crossings, a central campaign vow:

  "Undocumented migration across the border... has dropped down to a minuscule level... An accomplishment that Donald Trump has had and one that I think American public will give him credit for."
  (18:22)

Cutting Government, Keeping Promises (20:07)

• Marianna Spring: Supporters say Trump is actually doing the things he promised, which is rare in politics.

  “...for all the criticisms it draws... if that’s what you voted for... he is doing what he said, which a lot of people who feel disillusioned by politicians would say, well, often they don’t do what they say they’ll do.”
  (20:07)

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5. How Powerful Are US Senators?

[22:38] Listener Question: Do senators have real influence?

• Senators have more insulation from public pressure (six-year terms), greater legislative and confirmation powers than House reps, but less than the president.

Notable Moment (24:17)

“...senators always aspire to become president... They like to think they have a lot of power. There are things they can do, but nothing compared to, say, the President.”
— Anthony Zurcher

• Anecdote: US senators are considered “sleek, well groomed, glamorous” with an aura of power different from British MPs.
• Exception: John Fetterman, who famously wears “hoodies and shorts.”

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6. Trump’s Colorado Portrait Uproar

[25:23] Discussion: Trump complained on Truth Social about his unflattering portrait at the Colorado Capitol.

• Trump says it is “purposefully distorted,” and worse than Obama’s.

  “She must have lost her talent as she got older. In any event, I would much prefer not having a picture than having this one.” (Trump, quoted by Matt) (25:23)

• Hosts agree the portrait is unflattering: “He looks pasty...a little pudgy...not like his official portrait...” (Anthony Zurcher, 27:01)
• The portrait’s funding: Colorado raised private funds for it, and Republican donors had to create a GoFundMe, due to lack of interest after Trump left office.

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Memorable Quotes

• "Without the federal oversight, it will all fall down onto the states...it’s going to vary, state by state, how they use that money, and whether they even use it for special needs.”
  — Anthony Zurcher (06:25)
• "He teases us all the time by saying he wants a third term...But then, you know, with him, you never entirely know."
  — Sarah Smith (08:44)
• “Great is whatever you want it to be. If you’re a deeply committed MAGA supporter, it’s what happens when Donald Trump’s in the White House.”
  — Sarah Smith (12:32)
• "Donald Trump himself has actually said the 1950s were his idea of American greatness...”
  — Anthony Zurcher (14:36)
• "It definitely is not flattering. ...Here he looks more kind of like a pasty elderly man. And I can see why he wouldn’t like it hanging in this hall of presidents."
  — Anthony Zurcher (27:01)

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Key Timestamps for Reference

• [04:52] — Listener asks about impact on special needs education if Dept. of Education is closed
• [06:25] — Anthony on the real effects for special education and funding
• [08:15] — Listener asks about Trump securing a third term
• [09:42] — Constitutional barriers to a third presidential term
• [12:32] — "What does 'great' mean in MAGA?"
• [14:36] — The 1950s and Trump's idealized version of America
• [16:26] — How Trump would supposedly use tariff revenues
• [18:22] — Has Trump succeeded on immigration?
• [24:17] — The power and glamour of US Senators
• [25:23] — Trump’s Colorado portrait complaint and the hosts’ reactions

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Final Thoughts

The episode shines a light on how US federalism, Trump’s politics, and American nostalgia intersect in complex and sometimes surprising ways. The hosts deftly navigate fact, perception, and political theater, making it clear that in America, the meaning of “greatness”—and the locus of power—depends on where you’re standing.

Listeners with questions or comments are encouraged to reach out to Americast for future Americanswers editions.

Transcript

[Matt]

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[Matt]

Hello to.

All the new Americasters who've joined us in the last few months. More of us now, Marianna, than ever before.

[Mariana Spring]

I know it's brilliant and that's really good because there's so much going on that we want to tell you about.

[Matt]

So if you have any questions or comments, do get in touch. Americastbc.co.uk, we'll be publishing episodes on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays.

[Mariana Spring]

And if you don't want to miss an episode, which of course you don't, you can subscribe to AmericaSt on BBC Sounds. You can turn on push notifications, which means you get an alert when we publish an episode.

[Matt]

So here is today's Enjoy BBC Sounds.

[Mariana Spring]

Music Radio Podcasts hello there.

[Sarah Smith]

We're recording this on Monday, which means of course, AmericaST is AmeriCancers that we record with Matt Charlie on Five Live. Mariana and Anthony are here and and we are answering some of the questions that you have sent in on the snap election in Canada and what closing down the education department will really mean for kids in school. And why is it that Donald Trump is insisting that a portrait of him as president gets taken down from one of the state houses. Welcome to americancers.

[Mariana Spring]

Americast americast from BBC News.

[Anthony Zurcher]

You're gambling with the lives of millions of people. You're gambling with World War three. President Trump's message is very simple. We are done being taken advantage of.

[Mariana Spring]

Mr. President, in the name of our God, have mercy upon the people who.

[Sarah Smith]

Are scared now are you supportive of these onesies?

[Anthony Zurcher]

I'm supportive of vaccines.

[Sarah Smith]

What is happening?

[Mariana Spring]

Like this is not America.

[Matt]

This is a terrible nightmare.

[Sarah Smith]

This is what victory feels like.

[Mariana Spring]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Here we are again then. Hello, Sam, where in the world are you?

[Sarah Smith]

Hello, I'm in our bureau in Washington.

[Matt]

Very good. How are you? Eggs?

[Sarah Smith]

Well, I was thinking of you Matt as I had two soft boiled eggs this morning. Very good.

[Matt]

Now and after our conversation about eggs last week, Sarah sent me details of a gadget in order to boil eggs which has arrived. I just haven't yet had a chance to use it.

[Anthony Zurcher]

So you've got one?

[Mariana Spring]

Oh yeah, Sarah's an influencer.

[Matt]

Yeah, with one emailed link at a time. So yeah, I've got these gadgets and I will. They're sort of egg shaped and do they change colour? Is that what they do?

[Sarah Smith]

Yes, they do, they do. And you don't have to hover over the pan waiting to spot the moment it boiled.

[Matt]

Perfect. So I will report back on that next week. Anthony, where are you? How are your eggs?

[Anthony Zurcher]

I am across the river in Arlington, Virginia. My eggs are non existent. I think we have a few in the house but they're mostly used for baking and certainly not for eating.

[Mariana Spring]

You don't like eating eggs?

[Anthony Zurcher]

No, I'm not an egg person. I don't never have liked eggs so I stay away from. I'm not a big breakfast food person. But eggs in particular splits in the.

[Matt]

North America BBC bureau. Well, we'll interrogate that further. Mariana, how are you? Where are you? How are your eggs?

[Mariana Spring]

Sorry, I'm still also in New Broadcasting House, not with you in the studio in Westminster because I'm dashing about but I'll be back soon. I'll be back soon and I'm. Because I'm in the studio, I'm not surrounded by any eggs but I do like eggs in general. I didn't have any this morning, had a hot cross bun.

[Matt]

Oh God, I love hot cross bun season. I'm such a fan of hot cross buns. Absolutely plowing through. Anyway, that's not what we're here for. Let's get on to the questions. We'll start with education. It's really interesting story this and have we got Susan?

[Caller/Listener]

Yes, I'm here, Matt.

[Matt]

Hello Susan. Where are you Susan? And how are your eggs?

[Caller/Listener]

I'm in Milton Keynes and I have plenty of eggs, thank you.

[Matt]

Very good. What is your question, Susan?

[Caller/Listener]

Well, my seven year old American grandson is in the special educational needs class in his local public school and since Trump wants to close the Department of Education. Is this likely to affect my grandson and other children in his situation?

[Matt]

This is great. So this is a great, great question from Susan. Donald Trump signing executive order to dismantle Department of Education. What is going on? So what does that mean?

[Sarah Smith]

Well, it means that he would get rid of, not its entirety. In fact, he's gone from wanting to entirely eliminate the Department of Education to just reducing it to a much, much, much smaller department. And that's partly because there are some functions he needs it to carry out and also partly because actually he'd really need congressional approval to completely close it down. Now it sounds incredibly dramatic, closing an ent. In fact, most things that govern schools, the curriculum, the funding, teachers, qualifications, all that kind of stuff, is actually administered by the individual states, not centrally by the Department of Education in Washington. They do, though, disperse funds to help low income students and grants and all of that kind of thing. So Anthony may know better than me whether special educational needs students would be particularly affected by federal funding that would be being sent to the states to pay for those students. But actually a huge number of people just going to school, primary or secondary school, in the normal run of things, probably wouldn't notice very much change at all if they just completely got rid of the Department of Education.

[Anthony Zurcher]

Yeah, the area that the Department of Education is really involved in is in special needs education and lower income education. That's where not only do they provide funds to the states, but they also provide standards and rules and regulations governing how that money is used. So say in New Jersey of a special needs student in special needs classes, there's a federal law that they have to come up with a plan on how to address the things that the student needs in order to facilitate his or her education. Without the federal oversight, without the federal employees who are there monitoring and managing this, it will all fall down onto the states. And so it's going to vary state by state, how they use that money and whether they even use it for special needs and for disadvantaged students or if they use it for something else in theory, because there's no one in the federal government now who can enforce it, I suppose.

[Matt]

So this is a sort of reminder, actually this is something that Brits might forget is just how much stuff goes on at the state level, which is why not just in education, but sort of in policy generally, which is why there can be differences, quite marked differences in different states.

[Sarah Smith]

Yeah, I mean, the individual states basically have more power than any one of our devolved nations. In the United Kingdom, it's kind of remarkable how much they run. And that goes for transport and infrastructure. And, yeah, you name it, the states are considerably more powerful than, well, have more influence over more things than the federal government in all sorts of ways.

[Matt]

Thank you for that, Susan, really appreciate it. That's a great question about something which people might have seen in sort of the periphery of the news, but it's why we wanted to do it. Right, let's move on. This question from Catherine in Oxfordshire gets asked by lots and lots of listeners almost every day.

[Caller/Listener]

It seems to me the obvious next step for Trump is to change the rules so he can stand for a third term. How might he be able to do this, and how soon do you think he'll try?

[Matt]

So before we get to Anthony, I think has answered this several times, even while I've been a part of America.

[Mariana Spring]

I was about to say Anthony's poised and ready.

[Matt]

Well, Anthony, hold that thought before. Let's go to Sarah first. Sarah, has Donald Trump given any indication that he wants to change the Constitution to secure a third term?

[Sarah Smith]

He teases us all the time by saying he wants a third term. And once or twice he's said a couple of things about needing to change the Constitution. He has never set out an actual plan to say, look, I want a third term and I'm going to introduce a constitutional amendment to allow me to do it. But quite often when he's speaking to supporters, he'll drop some little hints and, you know, in a very Donald Trump way, you could say, oh, it's just a joke. He's just, you know, he's winding up the liberals, he's, you know, just putting it out there to please his supporters. But then, you know, with him, you never entirely know. And that's part of the sort of, you know, the clever politics around all of this. So. So, I mean, there's reason for people to speculate about it online. Those who love the idea and those who hate it. He keeps it alive with mentions.

[Matt]

So, Anthony, let's come to you on the exactly it were Donald Trump to move from teasing to actually, I do want a third term. What is the process he needs to get through and how difficult would that be?

[Anthony Zurcher]

Well, he's going to have to, as Sarah mentioned, change the U.S. constitution. There's a constitutional amendment that limits presidents to only two terms. That's a total of eight years in the White House. To change the Constitution, you either have to have a Constitutional Convention, which would bring all the states together and they would meet and they'd Discuss ways of changing the Constitution. That's never been tried. It would open a huge can of worms because you could propose pretty much any kind of amendment and have a chance of getting it tacked on to the Constitution. The other way is for both chambers of Congress to approve a change to the Constitution, and then that has to be ratified by the states. By a majority of the states, I believe. Or yes, it's a majority of the states. So that is a very, very high bar for anything. And it takes time. It takes time for things to get through Congress. It takes time for states, the state legislators, to meet and to ratify. Seems unlikely that Donald Trump would be able to get the gears rolling fast enough in the next four years for that to happen. Although there are some conservatives who say, no, no, the Constitution, the language of the Constitution says you can't serve more than two terms. But because Donald Trump, there was four years between the two terms. It's not really what the Constitution meant. He could serve another one. Or maybe you could have someone run for president and Donald Trump be vice president and then have that person resign after taking the oath of office, and then Donald Trump moves up and takes over the presidency. All of these things kind of operate in the realm of the very unlikely to absurd, but it's something that keeps people chatting and it keeps me busy talking about.

[Matt]

It's an important service that you provide. So thank you for that. I'm glad Catherine is not alone in asking that question. We get texts about asking that almost, almost every week, so I'm sure we'll sporadically come back around to that again. Let's get a new question, though. Now. Tracy's on the line. Hello, Tracy. Where in the world are you?

[Caller/Listener]

Hello, I'm in Shrewsbury today.

[Matt]

Very nice. How are your eggs?

[Caller/Listener]

Very good, thank you.

[Advertisement/Announcer]

Good.

[Matt]

What is your question, Tracy?

[Caller/Listener]

Right. I have two questions. The first question is if that's okay in MAGA terms, what does great stand for? And the second question is Trump is consistently promising billions and trillions of additional income that will come into. Will flow into the American economy as a result of the tariffs and the result of all of his fiscal changes. But what actually is going to happen with that money?

[Matt]

Yeah, what does great America looking great again look like, Sarah? And how is it is greatness in the eye of the beholder?

[Sarah Smith]

Yeah, great is whatever you want it to be. And if you're a deeply committed MAGA supporter, it's what happens when Donald Trump's in the White House and very much not what happens when Joe Biden's in the White House, so you can interpret statistics any way you'd like. I mean, to stick with the eggs. For instance, it will consistently be Joe Biden's fault that the price went up. If it doesn't come down soon, then that's Joe Biden's fault as well. But when it does, that will be Donald Trump's responsibility, and that will be one more way in which America being made great again. Now, I mean, he is actually already imposing a whole lot of policies that his supporters really, really like, like the crackdown on illegal immigration, which has shown, I mean, we're down to very, very few, almost no crossings on the southern border at all, and seeing large numbers of people being deported. So they think that that is a great thing. But of course, it's never been defined in terms where you can say, look, you know, the stock market needs to hit this level or inflation needs to come down to that level in order to define gray, because that would be to defeat the whole purpose of using that kind of loose language and allowing you to celebrate what you see as wins and brush any failures under the carpet.

[Mariana Spring]

It's interesting as well, Matt. But what great meant, perhaps the first time for Trump also feels a little bit different to what it means now. And a lot of the greatness, certainly, if you spend any time scrolling on X, which is owned by Elon Musk, who is obviously very closely allied with Donald Trump at the moment, greatness almost centers actually around the kind of culture wars. Like, it's about a set of values and the kinds of priorities that the country has in terms of what they support and who they support and. And how all of that works. And we spoke about this actually before. Anthony, you. You spoke about how one of the ways that the Republican campaign, or the Donald Trump's campaign specifically, was so effective last election is because it managed to make a villain of the bureaucrats, the kind of government elites who are out to get you. And I guess the suggestion is that it wasn't great when they were in charge, in the view of Donald Trump's campaign, because they were making it woke, and they were making it. They were making the country kind of move away from its original values of being. They're back to that.

[Anthony Zurcher]

Yeah, I'll go and jump in. The BBC has asked Trump supporters when they thought America was great originally and how it could become great again. And there have been polls to this effect, too. And a lot of Trump supporters, they kind of have this idea of the 1950s, maybe early 1960s, late 1940s, after World War II, when America's power was at its peak and the traditional family was more respected and intact in their view. Donald Trump himself has actually said the 1950s were his ideas, idea of American greatness, although recently he has also Talked about the 1890s, the late 19th century, as far as American trade policy. That was when America was great because they had all these tariffs. So it is. It's kind of a fuzzy target. But when you press, you do find that many Americans, many Trump supporters, they view a time when America was great, and they're trying to recapture that now.

[Matt]

I remember, actually, I just looked it up because I remember some polling around a similar thing of when were the good old days in the UK And I think you had to get all the looks looking. You had to get all the way back to the, essentially the 50s, before people started saying life was better then than it is now. And. And then, you know, anything before the 1940s, they said that the life, life is better now than it was then. But I suppose it's all in the eyes of a whole lot, isn't it? Quite often when you're in your 20s, as always seen as the. If you do it by age, it's always, you know, the music was better. Everything was better when you're in your 20s.

[Mariana Spring]

Like, my life now. My life now, Matt.

[Matt]

Yeah. I mean, but life doesn't get better than sitting in a cupboard while I ask people, how are your eggs?

[Mariana Spring]

I've really peaked.

[Matt]

It's what the young people dream of. Well, that's a brilliant couple of questions. Thanks so much for that, Tracey.

[Caller/Listener]

Thank you.

[Sarah Smith]

Oh, we haven't answered what they'll do with all the money.

[Matt]

Oh, yeah. What would he do with all the money? Yeah, go on, then. Yeah, what we do with all the money.

[Sarah Smith]

Tax cuts for the very wealthiest, which will make some people feel great and will, you know, he'll be able to say, Donald Trump will be able to say that he's fulfilled a promise of cutting taxes, but the biggest benefit of that will go to the people who earn the most. And also, what he's talking about now in terms of defense will be very expensive. He wants to build a golden dome, which is be similar to the Iron Dome in Israel, which is basically missile defense. You will be able to shoot down any incoming missiles coming into the United States. That involves a whole lot more satellites and infrastructure that would be very, very expensive. So a lot of money could go into defense and they say into paying off the national debt as well, because the interest Rates are well, the interest payments on that are so high. Although it is worth noting that the national debt went up considerably during Donald Trump's first term. So we'll see if he fulfills his promises on that.

[Matt]

Thank you for that, Sarah. You were right to pick me up on the fact we hadn't answered Tracey's second question. Tracey, thank you for that. James is texting and saying as a leftist centreperson in the uk, probably radical to Trump. Looking on at America, it seems that Trump is just making a mess of everything. What would you say? He's done well. And then David is a disgruntled listener. Hello David, how are you? Eggs, he says. Can your presenters not find anything positive from the Trump administration, for example, their approach to illegal immigration, doge or their net zero policy? Maybe I'm expecting too much, as is a BBC podcast with left wing views. Come on. Americast says David Fake news.

[Mariana Spring]

David we don't have views.

[Matt]

We don't have views. I've got time.

[Mariana Spring]

We're spending too much time analyzing things and boiling eggs.

[Matt]

But from domestic, I suppose internationally sort of what breaks through internationally to people in is the sort of the big whiz bang controversial stuff which is sparking around all of that. Is there another world of domestic policy unfolding which is going smoothly and resonating with voters? Anthony?

[Anthony Zurcher]

Well, I think on immigration a lot of voters agree with him. It was an issue that they cared about greatly. Undocumented migration across the border, which a lot of Americans viewed as disrupting social services in cities far from the border, driving up costs, taking away jobs, driving up the cost of housing. And if you look at what Donald Trump has done and people will argue about the methods he's employed and the harshness of them, but cross border migration has dropped down to a miniscule level. There just aren't many people coming across the border right now. And that is an accomplishment that Donald Trump has had and one that I think American public will give him credit for. I think that we've talked a lot about Donald Trump's battles with the judiciary and these judges that are challenging and disrupting his plans. But he is, it's something that Democratic presidents have complained about too. The idea that there can be single federal judges of some district, far from district, selected by people who are advocating a certain policy step and they pick those judge because they're sympathetic and then those judges will block policies that presidents tried to roll out across the country. And they did it for Biden with his student loan forgiveness and Obama with his immigration policies. And now they're doing it with Donald Trump with his cuts to the federal government and laying off of federal employees and his immigration policies. And it's something that he's putting a spotlight on, maybe not in the most elegant sort of way, but it is something that I think that people across the aisle can look at and say, okay, the judges need to be addressed and their powers need to have some limits.

[Matt]

Thanks, Anthony.

[Mariana Spring]

What's it worth saying as well? Is it worth saying as well that actually one of the things that certainly, again, this is just from looking at stuff people are posting on social media and what's popping up on the undercover voter feeds. But a lot of the stuff, you know, the positive content about Donald Trump is saying, well, he said he'd do these things and he's doing the things, and particularly around this issue of, you know, the belief that the certain arms of government have been ineffective or not serving people. Well, stuff like Doge, the Department of Government Efficiency, for all the criticisms it draws from people who don't like it, if that's what you voted for, like, you genuinely voted for that and you knew how close Elon Musk was to Donald Trump and you didn't want the Department of Education and all of those things then from your point of view, I mean, it remains to be seen how it plays out. But he is doing what he said, which a lot of people who feel disillusioned by politicians would say, well, often they don't do what they say they'll do.

[Matt]

Thank you very much for that rebuttal. And hopefully is it David will be slightly less disgruntled in future.

[Mariana Spring]

Right.

[Matt]

We've had some texts in. I like these. George says now Mark Carney's called a quick Canadian election. Will Donald Trump hike tariffs even further just as a temporary measure to get Conservatives in? Although, Sarah, I saw a clip of Donald Trump over the weekend where he was saying that he would probably rather a liberal one rather than a Conservative, although who knows what, like Machiavellian thoughts were going into that. But how does the Canadian election play out in the US or will Donald Trump try to insert himself into it?

[Sarah Smith]

I mean, he'll inevitably get dragged into it, I would think, because of course, he's going to be the absolute focus and feature of that election. And you're right, I saw him giving that answer as well. He seemed to be saying, basically, we know he's never really liked Justin Trudeau, but that he'd be perfectly happy with Mark Carney and some of the Canadian politicians who are standing up to him the most. Doug Ford is a conservative, but actually he's kind of leading the anti Trump opposition in Canada. So it doesn't break down necessarily on those right wing, left wing ideological lines is basically more who's going to argue the hardest and the firmest against them? Donald Trump. And of course he'll love that because it's all about him. So I'm sure he won't be able to resist mischievously sticking an oar in there. But what he's not going to do is have any candidate at all who's going to agree with him and say, hey, we should talk to Donald Trump about changing our relationship with America, because that would be the quickest way to lose votes in Canada right now.

[Matt]

Great question. Thanks for that, George. This one is probably for you, Anthony. Some. There's no name on it, but somebody's texting and saying what influence, if any, do senators have? My colleague from Texas recently wrote to Ted Cruz to object to the UK's Chagos island deal. And I wondered if there was any.

[Anthony Zurcher]

Point, probably not much point in one person writing this sentence to a senator. And you've got to remember, unlike members of the House of Representatives, they're only up for election every six years. So they're a little more insulated from the twists and turns of political sentiment. There are only 100 senators in the US Senate, so they do have more power. And the Senate does have considerable power in confirming political appointees from the president, judges as well. They also have a big say in the legislative process. And there's more power by individual senators to kind of gum up the works and slow things down. So they have to kind of all try to work together and they have more respect for each other or they're supposed to, at least in order to keep the legislative gears grinding. It's, you know, senators always aspire to become president, so a lot of them have higher ambitions and so they might be more willing to listen to their constituents because of that. But individually they, they like to think they have a lot of power. There are things they can do, but nothing compared to, say, the President.

[Matt]

Yeah. What wasn't clear from that message?

[Sarah Smith]

Have you ever met a senator, Matt?

[Matt]

Have I ever met a senator? Good question. I don't know if I have.

[Sarah Smith]

They're quite different. Sorry to interrupt, but they're really quite different from meeting British politicians. There's something very sleek, well groomed, glamorous about them. They look like they've come off television or the movies. They don't look like ordinary people, like a really kind of, you know, rich CEO or something. They're like a kind of class apart. And so there's an aura of power and invincibility, I think, that comes from them that you just see even in.

[Anthony Zurcher]

British Cabinet members, except for John Fetterman, the senator from Pennsylvania, who goes around wearing hoodies and shorts all over. Very unusual postman.

[Matt]

Right, before I let you all go, then, talking of looking sleek and in a class apart, let's talk about the portrait of Donald Trump. So Donald Trump has posted on Truth Social a portrait of him which has gone up. He says nobody likes a bad picture or painting of themselves. But the one in Colorado, in the Capitol, put up by the governor, along with all other presidents, was purposefully distorted to a level that even I perhaps have never seen before. The artist also did President Trump, and he looks wonderful, but the one on me is truly the worst. She must have lost her talent as she got older. In any event, I would much prefer not having a picture than having this one. But many people from Colorado have called and written to complain. In fact, they're really angry about it. And on and on he goes. He's really. He's really not happy. Mariana, how would you rate this portrait of Donald Chubb?

[Mariana Spring]

Well, I mean, it doesn't look that unlike him. You know, sometimes you get those funny, like, examples of really bad statues. Like there's one of the footballer Cristiano Ronaldo that, like, looks absolutely nothing like him from the airport in Madeira. I think that was so bad, it sort of had to be. I don't know what's happened to him, if it's still there. This feels like. Think maybe it's not that bad. I mean, I was really interested in the fact that in his condemnation of the portrait, Trump said it was purposely distorted to a level that even I perhaps have never seen before. And I'm not sure there whether he's referring. What he's quite referring to, that he often has distorted portraits of himself or that he.

[Sarah Smith]

Well, maybe.

[Mariana Spring]

Maybe the people just images deal with distortion. Yeah, I don't know.

[Matt]

I. Well, I have. Just because I. I had a portrait. I've got a. Somebody painted a portrait of me once. Yeah.

[Caller/Listener]

Yeah.

[Mariana Spring]

Did you demand. It was taken down and their talent had got bad as they got older.

[Matt]

For Sky Arts, the people who do the portrait painting of the year, and they were doing a thing, and this is a ridiculous sentence to say, but they've got something like cultural influences or something, and they were going to give to It, I think it was an anniversary or something and they wanted, you know, they got lots of people to have their portrait. And we were given like half a dozen artists to choose from. And the one that I chose was really good, but I was slightly conscious, like, if it's bad, what do you do with. And I'll be at some of the other people who had theirs done. I would say with less good. So I have some sympathy for Donald Trump being confronted with a painting and thinking, I don't, I don't know if I like that, but I probably wouldn't have written a long essay online. I'd have just popped it in the loft and forgotten all about it.

[Caller/Listener]

Anthony.

[Anthony Zurcher]

What looks pasty?

[Mariana Spring]

Yeah, he does look pasty.

[Anthony Zurcher]

He looks a little pudgy. It definitely is not flattering. It's not like his official portrait that hangs in federal buildings all over this country now with him kind of tilting his head and ominous lighting glaring at the camera. Here he looks more kind of like a pasty elderly man. And I can see why he wouldn't like it hanging in this hall of presidents.

[Matt]

The head is also too small for the body. The head looks too small, Sarah?

[Sarah Smith]

Yeah, I don't think it's flattering. He does. He looks as though he's puffy in the face. But of course, it wasn't the Democratic governor of Colorado who commissioned this. I looked this up and it's really, really interesting. They have in the state house portraits of all previous presidents. And not all state houses do this. It's a Colorado project that they're rather proud of, but they have to raise the funds to pay for them. It doesn't come out of state financing. And when Donald Trump left office in 2020, nobody contributed to the fund. They had to get a prominent Republican to put together a special Go fund me page to raise the money for this, to even get him to sit among all the other former president. And, well, and as Trump himself says, they did commission the same person who had done the previous president, Barack Obama. I wonder if when he says, you know, her talent had left her as she got older, is deeply insulted about the idea that, you know, an older, middle aged woman was painting his portrait.

[Mariana Spring]

It's a bit like an Instagram without a filter. It kind of has that vibe, you know what I mean? It's like the photo that you put up and you're like, oh, actually that was a bit too.

[Matt]

Yeah, I might have another go at that one. Well, maybe. It definitely lacks what Sarah was talking about, the glossy sheen that only people at the top of American politics has.

[Mariana Spring]

Yeah, it's sort of normal. It actually, yeah, there's a really funny random reference it reminds me of, but I feel like it's too much information.

[Sarah Smith]

So I'll tell you another time. Matt.

[Matt]

Well, something to look forward to. Mariana Spring, Sarah Smith, Anthony Zurcher, thanks so much for joining us for America. Thanks for all of your messages as well.

[Sarah Smith]

Thanks, Matt. Talk to you again next week. Bye bye bye.

[Mariana Spring]

Ameracast Ameracast from BBC News.

[Sarah Smith]

Well done for getting all the way to the end of another AmericasT episode that makes you officially an AmericasT. It's not easy navigating your way through the news in America, particularly at the moment, but you did it and we're delighted to have you with us. So if you do have a comment or a question about any of the stories we've talked about or anything you'd like us to talk about, do please get in touch. You can email us americastbc.co.uk you can WhatsApp us a message on 033-01-2390. And we do answer your questions every single week on the podcast. You can always join the discussion in our online community on Discord. The link is in our podcast description in your app. And we'll be back with another episode very soon. Till then, see you all later. Bye bye.