Americast (BBC News)

Episode Title: Can Denmark convince Trump not to “conquer” Greenland?
Date: January 15, 2026

Episode Overview

In this episode, the Americast team dissects two highly charged transatlantic stories:

1. The mounting confrontation between President Donald Trump and Federal Reserve Chairman Jerome Powell over interest rates and independence of the central bank;
2. Intensifying US pressure to “take control” of Greenland, leading to tense talks in Washington with Denmark and Greenland’s foreign ministers.

Hosted by Sarah Smith (BBC North America Editor), Anthony Zurcher (BBC North America Correspondent), and Justin Webb (BBC Radio 4), the episode provides in-depth analysis, on-the-ground updates, and critical context, capturing the rapidly evolving standoffs at the heart of US politics and global relations.

1. Trump vs. Jerome Powell: Independence of the US Federal Reserve

Key Issues and Insights

• Jerome Powell Under Criminal Investigation ([03:51] onwards)

  • Powell, traditionally reserved, took the unusual step of addressing the nation by video, revealing that the Trump administration’s Department of Justice had launched a criminal probe into his conduct.
  • The official rationale centers on alleged mismanagement and testimony regarding a multi-billion-dollar Federal Reserve building renovation. Powell asserts the real motivation is political retaliation for not lowering interest rates as Trump desires.

• Powell’s Public Response

  • Powell directly accused the White House of politicizing the Fed, warning of unprecedented and dangerous interference with US monetary policy:
    • Quote (Jerome Powell, [05:03]):
      “This new threat is not about my testimony … The threat of criminal charges is a consequence of the Federal Reserve setting interest rates based on our best assessment of what will serve the public … This is about whether the Fed will be able to continue to set interest rates based on evidence and economic conditions, or whether instead monetary policy will be directed by political pressure or intimidation.”

• Roundtable Analysis

  • Anthony ([04:37], [07:18]): Emphasizes Powell’s “line in the sand”—interprets this as a remarkable escalation with global stakes.
    • “Here he was with a conscious decision to go straight at Donald Trump, really, the first time he's ever done that publicly and knowing what that would amount to, a declaration of war or a line in the sand, that this has to stop.”
  • Sarah ([07:52]): Notes bipartisan applause for Powell’s stand, reflecting growing alarm about Trump’s tactics.
    • “A lot of respect going towards Jerome Powell … If only everybody had the courage to call Donald Trump out when he's using the justice system in this way ...”

• Details of the Dispute ([08:19] onwards)

  • Trump has long criticized Powell’s pace on interest rate cuts (“Jerome Too Late Powell”) and fixated on the $2.5–3.1 billion renovation costs for the Fed’s headquarters, accusing Powell of mismanagement.

  • The dispute spilled into public view, with Trump even touring the renovation site and bickering with Fed officials on TV ([09:38] onwards).

    • Memorable Exchange ([09:56] onwards):
      • Anthony: “The original estimates for the renovation were $2.5 billion. Trump says now it's going to cost maybe upwards of $3.1 billion to finish the project ... Powell has denied that.”
      • Justin: Ironic back-and-forth about who is responsible for cost overruns, highlighting the public nature of the spat.

• Presidential Power Over the Fed ([13:19], [15:29])

  • The Fed was designed to be insulated from short-term political influence, explaining the significance of Trump’s attempt to remove or coerce Powell:
    • Host in London ([15:29]):
      “There is an argument about whether or not you are giving away too much democratic power when you allow central bankers to set interest rates ... But the counter argument is ... an economy that is well run and stable ... is an economy where there is a separation between the political and the technical ... Trump is moving in the direction of directly challenging that and saying, no, it should be me, because I am elected by the people ...”

• National and Global Impact ([16:53], [17:46])

  • Economists and global finance leaders voiced alarm, likening Trump’s approach to “developing country tinpot, dictatorship type of behavior.”

    • Anthony ([16:53]):
      “If the United States does this, then is it going to be in a position to tell all of these other countries that, no, what you're doing is a bad economic idea? ... We're leading by example one way or the other.”

  • Stock markets wobbled but quickly recovered, showing the US economy’s resilience and possibly underestimating the long-term risks.

• Trump’s Own Words ([19:00]):

  • Trump, speaking to the Detroit Economic Club, signaled his wish for direct Fed support for market gains and within earshot said of Powell, “That jerk will be gone soon.”
    • Quote ([19:00], Trump):
      “Today, if you announce great numbers, they raise interest rates to try and kill it… We have a real stiff in the Fed. But that's for another day. If I had the help of the Fed, it would be easier. But that jerk will be gone soon.”

• What’s Next for Powell? ([23:23], [24:53])

  • Powell’s term as chair ends in May, but he could technically remain as a governor. Congressional Republicans are pushing back, threatening to block Trump’s replacement pick unless the attack on Powell ceases (notably Thom Tillis). This may paradoxically keep Powell involved for years.
    • Sarah ([14:23]):
      “If anything is going to make him determined to stay on, it's going to be this row that he's having with Donald Trump.”

2. The Greenland Gambit: Can Denmark Hold Its Ground?

Key Issues and Insights

• High-Stakes White House Meeting ([24:53] onwards)

  • Foreign ministers from Denmark and Greenland meet with US Vice President JD Vance, Marco Rubio, and other top officials to discuss escalating US demands to “take control” of Greenland—whether by annexation or purchase.

• Trump’s Determination

  • Trump continues to champion outright American ownership of Greenland, citing US security and the “golden dome”—a major missile defense system he wants stationed there.

    • Quote ([25:53], Sarah paraphrasing Trump):
      “You don’t defend something if you just have a lease on it the same way you do if you own it.”

    • Trump on Social Media:
      “The United States needs Greenland for the purpose of national security. It’s vital for the golden dome that we’re building. NATO should be leading the way for us to get it. If we don’t, Russia or China will, and that’s not going to happen.”

• Denmark’s Response: Frank but Firm

  • Lars Løkke Rasmussen, Danish Foreign Minister ([26:55]):
    “The President has made his view clear and we have a different position … for US ideas that would not respect territorial integrity of the Kingdom of Denmark and the right of self determination of the Greenlandic people are of course totally unacceptable. And we therefore still have a fundamental disagreement, but we also agree to disagree.”
  • The BBC hosts identify this as diplomatic code for stalemate; the fundamental disagreement persists.

• Military and Economic Underpinnings

  • Despite existing agreements giving the US wide military latitude in Greenland, Trump insists only outright sovereignty is acceptable. Allies are increasing their own military presence as both a deterrent and a gesture of seriousness—troops from Germany, Denmark, possibly the UK.

    • Sarah ([30:59]):
      “Not to defend against an American incursion, but rather in order to show to Donald Trump that they and NATO are taking the security of Greenland very, very seriously.”

  • Trump dismisses these gestures, saying Denmark’s efforts amount to “one more dog sled.” Danish FM responds:

    • Lars Løkke Rasmussen ([31:36]):
      “The Kingdom of Denmark has already stepped up our own contribution by committing additional fund for military capabilities. Not dock sleds, but ships, drones, fighter jets, etc. And we are definitely ready to do more.”

• Underlying Drivers

  • Beyond defense, there is US interest in Greenland’s critical mineral resources, as melting ice reveals untapped economic potential.
    • Anthony ([30:00]):
      “They said they're open to American investment and mineral development. But I think you get at the real point here and that is changing the color of Greenland on a map.”

• Risks of Escalation

  • Speculation about military conflict remains remote, but the build-up of NATO troops functions as a “tripwire” in case of further provocation.
    • Anthony ([30:33]):
      “That's almost like a tripwire, right? … You can't just land troops on the frozen tundra of Greenland and begin to occupy it. There would be a conflict.”

3. Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• Jerome Powell on Public Service ([05:03]):
  “Public service sometimes requires standing firm in the face of threats. I will continue to do the job the Senate confirmed me to do with integrity and a commitment to serving the American people.”

• Host in London on the Gravity of the Conflict ([06:48]):
  “My reaction to that, Sarah, is, wow, because you don't often hear in those terms with that degree of bluntness, Jerome Powell say anything about anything that isn't specifically monetary policy. The fact that he is taking the President on and doing so so nakedly, so openly now, this is a new world.”

• Anthony on External Alarm ([16:53]):
  “This is kind of developing country tinpot, dictatorship type of behavior…”

• Trump on Powell ([19:00]):
  “If I had the help of the Fed, it would be easier. But that jerk will be gone soon.”

• Lars Løkke Rasmussen on Denmark's Stance ([26:55]):
  “[US] ideas that would not respect territorial integrity of the Kingdom of Denmark and the right of self determination of the Greenlandic people are of course totally unacceptable. And we therefore still have a fundamental disagreement, but we also agree to disagree.”

4. Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:07] – Sarah opens with Greenland and the Denmark/Greenland–White House meeting
• [03:51] – Sarah details the criminal investigation into Jerome Powell
• [05:03] – Jerome Powell’s statement in full
• [07:52] – Analysis: bipartisan support for Powell and political risks
• [09:38] – On-site recounting of Trump and Powell’s building cost argument
• [13:19] – Federal Reserve structure and independence explained
• [16:53] – Global reaction and worries about precedent
• [19:00] – Trump’s remarks at the Detroit Economic Club
• [24:53] – Shift to the Greenland issue and context for new White House meeting
• [26:55] – Danish Foreign Minister’s official statement
• [31:36] – Denmark’s response to Trump’s “dog sled” jibe

5. Tone and Takeaways

Faithful to the BBC’s signature style—measured, occasionally wry, and precise—the Americast hosts break down the nuances, stakes, and ironies of these headline-dominating clashes. The episode’s tone is urgent yet skeptical, balancing gravity with dry humor.

Final Reflections:

• The challenges to US institutions—both monetary and diplomatic—are acute, with even allies responding nervously to Washington’s new direction.
• The episode leaves open whether the Trump administration will succeed in either ousting Powell or “conquering” Greenland, but signals that resistance, both domestic and international, is formidable and growing.