Americast - “What does Donald Trump want from his UK state visit?”
BBC News — September 17, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode dives into former President Donald Trump’s unprecedented second UK state visit, exploring its symbolism, the political context at home and abroad, and the controversies shadowing Trump, including thorny debates on free speech following the assassination of right-wing US influencer Charlie Kirk. The hosts unpack what Trump wants from the visit, the UK’s motivations, and how ongoing US-UK divisions – from trade to culture wars – may play out during Trump’s stay amid heightened ceremony at Windsor Castle.

Hosts:

• Sarah Rainsford (Reporting live from Windsor, UK)
• Justin Webb (London)
• Marianna Spring (London, “misinformation” correspondent)

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Grandeur and Significance of Trump’s State Visit

• Elevated Ceremony:
  Windsor Castle, rather than Buckingham Palace, is hosting the state visit, a move seen as an upgrade in royal hospitality. Trump is deeply invested in the prestige and ceremony.

  • Sarah Rainsford [03:03]: “They’ve really amped up the kind of regal grandeur of the whole thing to try and impress Donald Trump...he seems to be convinced that somehow Windsor Castle is a step up from Buckingham Palace and that he’s really getting the full VIP treatment this time.”
  • Justin Webb [03:35]: “Windsor Castle is genuinely grand...It’s got something about it that the palace hasn’t got...American presidents and Americans generally are impressed by elderly English things, aren’t they?”

• Trump’s Priorities:
  Trump is less interested in politics or diplomacy, more about the spectacle and mingling with the royalty—especially the state banquet and the prestige attached.

  • Sarah Rainsford [04:05]: “He’s interested in seeing and being seen among the Royal family and I think probably quite particularly a rather glittering state banquet...there’s nothing Donald Trump loves more than being honoured and particularly if members of the British royal family are there to do it.”

• Relative Isolation & Tension:
  The visit is happening away from the public, with a frayed relationship between Trump and London Mayor Sadiq Khan, who publicly criticized Trump’s “hate filled rhetoric.” This underlines why so much of the visit is behind closed doors.

  • [05:33] “He isn’t going to see much of ordinary people and...the relationship of Sadiq Khan, the mayor of London, to the Trump administration is still poor.”

2. Trade, Tariffs, and US-UK Relations

• Trade Talks Are Secondary:
  While some trade issues are on the table, most notably a slight tariff concession for UK steel and aluminum (still 25%, not 50% like other countries), Trump frames this as a friendly gesture but the visit is mainly ceremonial:

  • Donald Trump [06:38]: “They want to see if they can refine the trade deal a little bit. We made a deal and it’s a great deal...But primarily it’s to be with Prince Charles and Camilla. They’re friends of mine for a long time…”

• What’s Actually on Offer:

  • UK not exempt from tariffs, but receives better treatment than some—still not a breakthrough.
  • Sarah Rainsford [07:30]: "They're not going to get a break. They're still going to be tariffs at 25%...But it's not getting any better than that."

3. The US Political Storm Trump Leaves Behind

• Assassination of Charlie Kirk:

  • Trump leaves the US in turmoil after the assassination of right-wing influencer Charlie Kirk, sparking a fierce national debate over the limits of “free speech” and what constitutes “hate speech.”
  • Sarah Rainsford [07:30]: “Donald Trump is leaving behind an absolutely fevered situation in the United States...a real contrast...for this terribly polite kind of affair at Windsor...”

• Contrast in Atmosphere:

  • Trump’s UK visit offers him and British PM Keir Starmer a temporary respite from domestic troubles, including Starmer’s own issues with UK ambassador Peter Mandelson.

4. Press Conferences: Pitfalls and Wildcards

• Potential for Fireworks:

  • At upcoming joint press conferences with Keir Starmer, Trump’s unpredictability with journalists (escalated by recent questions about Jeffrey Epstein and his business interests) is a risk.

    • Sarah Rainsford [09:32]: “The great potential pitfall, of course, is a press conference at Chequers...Donald Trump can't necessarily control what comes out of his mouth in the heat of the moment…”
    • Donald Trump [10:33]: “My kids are running the business. You know what the activity. Where are you from?” (bristles at an Australian reporter’s question about his earning in office).

• Epstein Controversy:

  • The Epstein storyline, resurfacing via social media and protests in the UK, is likely to dog Trump during the visit.

    • Marianna Spring [11:09]: “There was this image...projected, it’s been going really viral...of Donald Trump with Jeffrey Epstein and various photos and a timeline of their relationship and it was being projected onto Windsor Castle...he won’t be able to escape that conversation.”

• Unscripted Chaos:

  • Unlike previous presidents, Trump’s press conferences are now a “free-for-all”—he picks questioners at random, prolonging exchanges and raising the chance of off-script moments.
    • Sarah Rainsford [13:12]: “With Donald Trump, it is an absolute free for all. He will just pick people out of the crowd…”

5. Trump & King Charles: Personal Relations vs. Ideological Gaps

• Dynamic Between Trump & Charles:

  • Trump calls Charles a friend, but hosts believe their values are worlds apart—especially on climate and the environment.

    • Sarah Rainsford [16:23]: “Charles’s big issue is the environment and conservation...Donald Trump is going backwards on fossil fuels...I mean, given how central that is to Prince Charles’s work...it’s difficult to imagine how he could have much respect for somebody whose policy is moving in that direction.”

    • Justin Webb [16:55]: “I just think there’s an awful lot of people of King Charles that would be completely outside the kind of epistemological orbit of Donald Trump …they’re both consequential people...consequential people kind of always do get on, don’t they?”

6. The “Free Speech” Debate: US vs UK, and the Fallout from Charlie Kirk’s Assassination

• Cultural and Legal Differences:

  • The US “absolute” free speech tradition clashes with growing European (and UK) moves to regulate hate speech, particularly online.

• Pam Bondi’s Comments:

  • Bondi, speaking after Kirk’s assassination, vows to criminally target “hate speech.” Trump is evasive when asked to support her, instead attacking the media.

    • Pam Bondi [20:13]: “There’s free speech and then there’s hate speech. And there is no place, especially now, especially after what happened to Charlie...we will absolutely target you...if you are targeting anyone with hate speech...”
    • Donald Trump [21:00]: “She’d probably go after people like you [ABC News]...Maybe they’ll have to go after you. Look, we want everything to be fair...”

• Criticism from All Sides:

  • Many US conservatives see Bondi’s stance as a dangerous flirtation with European-style speech regulation, viewing it (and current job losses in response to Kirk’s death) as a betrayal of core US free speech traditions.

    • Justin Webb [22:43]: “Whether Pam Bondi has the foggiest notion of the Constitution. And this is a criticism that’s coming not from the left, but from the right...this is a British thing. This has nothing to do with us. You can say anything you like in America, provided you don’t foment violence.”

  • Marianna Spring [24:56]: “What Pam Bondi is saying is the exact argument that people on the other side of the political spectrum have been making for quite a long time...when we talk about hate speech, hate speech is not being criticized by the press.”

  • Social Media & Tech Companies’ Role:

    • Positioning US tech giants as beneficiaries of weak speech laws. UK’s tougher Online Safety Act is a potential sticking point between the Biden/Trump administration and UK government.

    • Marianna Spring [27:59]: “Decisions to go after the social media companies and hold them more accountable or even hold...bosses of big tech companies criminally liable...those things are not things that would be very good for the companies and therefore wouldn’t be very good necessarily for Donald Trump.”

7. Hypocrisy and Fractures on Both Left and Right

• Both Sides Want “Free Speech”—Except When They Don’t:

  • Debates on both political sides reveal hypocrisy: absolute speech for me, not for thee.

    • Justin Webb [29:33]: “Donald Trump, in a sense, doesn’t really believe anything in an ideological sense...A lot of it’s about business interests...But...a lot of people on the American right actually do have principles and beliefs, very strongly held beliefs, particularly about freedom.”
    • Marianna Spring [31:49]: “At the crux of all of this...is this real hypocrisy, which is the belief that you want everyone to be able to say what they think...But...if people say the things that are wrong, then for you, that doesn’t fall within your parameters of freedom of expression.”

• Democrats’ Search for Their Own Kirk:

  • Ezra Klein (NYT) states the left lacks figures like Charlie Kirk, sparking introspection and backlash on the left regarding willingness to debate opponents openly.
    • Justin Webb [32:15]: “[Ezra Klein] came out...and said we on the left ought to have a Charlie Kirk figure...set off a firestorm now on the American left about what do we do about discussing things openly...it’s not just a Republican, Democrat...thing.”
    • Sarah Rainsford [34:24]: “The Democrats need some kind of Charlie Kirk...They just need somebody who’s eloquent and evangelizing on social media and using modern ways of communicating with young people...they are going to have to find a way to respond...”

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Trump on the Visit:
  Donald Trump [06:38]: “It’s a great honor...it’s to be with Prince Charles and Camilla. They’re friends of mine for a long time, long before he was king...”

• On Press Conferences Going Off the Rails:
  Sarah Rainsford [13:12]: “With Donald Trump, it is an absolute free for all. He will just pick people out of the crowd.”

• On Hypocrisy in Free Speech Debates:
  Marianna Spring [31:49]: “You want everyone to be able to say what they think...but...if people say the things that are wrong, then for you, that doesn’t fall within your parameters of freedom of expression.”

• On US-UK Differences:
  Justin Webb [22:43]: “This is a British thing. This has nothing to do with us. You can say anything you like in America, provided you don’t foment violence.”

• Justin Webb on Trump & the King:
  [16:55] “I just think there’s an awful lot of people of King Charles that would be completely outside the kind of epistemological orbit of Donald Trump...but I’m not sure that necessarily means that they won’t be able to get on.”

Noteworthy Timestamps

• Ceremonial context & state visit analysis: 03:00–05:00
• Trump’s own words on the trip and trade: 06:38–07:30
• Charlie Kirk assassination context/contrast with UK visit: 07:30–08:45
• Press conference unpredictability: 09:32–14:10
• Trump-King Charles relationship analysis: 16:23–19:15
• Pam Bondi’s controversial “hate speech” stance: 20:13–21:28
• US-UK split on free speech/hate speech law: 24:56–29:33
• Ezra Klein’s challenge to the left: 32:15–34:24

Conclusion

The episode offers a dynamic, multi-layered reflection on what Trump wants from his elaborate UK state visit (primarily respect, spectacle, and to “be seen”), the symbolic chess of US-UK relations, and the fraught, shifting boundaries of free speech and hate speech in both countries. The assassination of Charlie Kirk looms large, coloring American debates and complicating Trump’s overseas posture.

Even as the visit is stiff with pomp, the underlying tensions—from press freedom and tech regulation to the personal gulf between Trump and King Charles—make for a visit less about substance and more about symbolism… but one likely to reverberate on both sides of the Atlantic.

End of summary. For listener questions, feedback, or to join the Americast online community, check the episode notes.