Episode 18: Pat Kelsey & Josh Heird

Summary

Podcast Summary: Episode 18 - Pat Kelsey & Josh Heird

Podcast Information:

• Title: Andy Beshear Podcast
• Host: Andy Beshear
• Description: The Andy Beshear Podcast offers real, unscripted conversations with a diverse range of guests, focusing on human experiences beyond politics. Topics include family, faith, current events, pop culture, and the connections that unite us. Hosted with empathy, curiosity, and kindness, each episode provides honest dialogue and diverse perspectives.

Episode Details:

• Episode: 18: Pat Kelsey & Josh Heird
• Release Date: August 7, 2025

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Introduction

In Episode 18, Andy Beshear welcomes Pat Kelsey, the head coach of the University of Louisville (UofL) men's basketball team, and Josh Heard, the athletic director for UofL. The episode is divided into two main segments: a sports-focused discussion with Pat and Josh, and a broader conversation on current events, concluding with a Gen Z lingo segment.

Sports Segment: Interview with Pat Kelsey and Josh Heard

Career Journeys and Mentorship

The conversation begins with Pat and Josh sharing their paths to their current roles. Josh Heard recounts his humble beginnings as a freshman basketball coach at Elder High School in Cincinnati, Ohio, and his rapid rise to becoming the athletic director at UofL. He humorously notes, “[02:29] ...my greatest class that I ever took was his practice floor every day from 3 o'clock to 6 o’” in reference to his mentor, Skip Prosser.

Pat Kelsey reflects on the importance of mentorship in his journey from Villanova to Louisville. He emphasizes foundational values instilled by his father, stating, “[04:15] ...my dad just taught me what it means to work hard, to be honest, to do the right thing.”

Building a Winning Culture

A significant portion of the discussion focuses on the cultivation of a strong athletic culture at UofL. Josh Heard highlights the alignment and support among the various head coaches, noting, “[07:37] ...our culture is prevalent within the athletic department that we are all on the same team. We fight for each other, we root for each other, we support each other.”

Pat Kelsey shares insights into creating a team environment that prioritizes character and collective commitment over individual accolades. He states, “[08:07] ...unrelenting effort, competitive excellence and the power of the unit. That's way more important than skiing. That's way more important than pick and roll coverage.”

Success Across Athletic Programs

The hosts commend the widespread success of UofL’s athletic programs beyond basketball, including baseball, volleyball, and track. Andy Beshear attributes this success to hiring exceptional coaches and fostering a collaborative environment: “[11:06] Hire really good coaches... we've created a culture where they understand, hey, I may not get everything that I want, but it benefits the program as a whole.”

Adapting to Changes in College Sports

The episode delves into the evolving landscape of college athletics, particularly the impact of NIL (Name, Image, Likeness) rights and the transfer portal. Josh Heard discusses the necessity of adapting to these changes, explaining, “[14:20] ...this is what it is right now. And you can either say, hey, we're going to adapt to it and navigate it, or we're not. And if you're not, you're going to fall behind.”

Pat Kelsey adds, “[14:20] ...the transfer portal allows us to rebuild quickly, bringing in talent that aligns with our culture and goals.”

Athlete Pressures and Mental Health

Addressing the increased pressures faced by student-athletes in the age of social media and NIL deals, Andy Beshear remarks, “[18:09] ...they really do view some of their value through the social media lens.” The guests acknowledge the challenges young athletes face in balancing their personal lives and public personas.

Balancing Personal and Professional Life

The conversation shifts to personal lives, with Pat and Josh discussing the challenges of maintaining work-life balance. Josh Heard shares, “[25:15] ...no such thing as balance. Is true balance. People say there's, there's got to be. There's no such thing.”

Andy Beshear emphasizes the importance of being present for family despite the high-stress nature of their jobs: “[27:13] ...you've got one family, take care of them. And there's going to be moments where it's like, hey, I might miss something at work.”

Current Events Discussion

Following the sports segment, Andy Beshear and co-hosts engage in a discussion about pressing current events:

Redistricting in Texas

John McConnell raises concerns about Texas passing a draft congressional map to add up to five new Republican seats, highlighting potential threats to democratic processes. “[41:03] ...this is cheating... [Redistricting] is the definition of that party choosing their voters instead of voters choosing their congressman or woman.”

John Rabinowitz compares it to Kentucky's experience in 2022, noting the accelerated pace driven by political motivations.

Economic Implications of Tariffs

The team discusses the negative impacts of tariffs on the economy, referencing a recent jobs report that prompted President Trump to fire the official responsible for the report instead of reconsidering tariffs. “[43:15] That’s like the ultimate form of kill the messenger, right?”

They explore how tariffs create uncertainty for businesses, discourage investment, and ultimately harm American consumers by increasing prices.

Presidential Physical Fitness Test

The conversation briefly touches on the return of the presidential physical fitness test, sparking humorous exchanges about the challenges of meeting its requirements. “[46:02] ...I was sore for about three days.”

Gen Z Lingo Segment

Concluding the episode, Will Bashir introduces the Gen Z term of the week: “fam.” The segment breaks down its meanings and usage within different contexts, highlighting generational differences in communication. For example:

• Will Bashir: “When you're a part of a group or a collective, you're a part of that fam. Like the baseball team. We're all fam.”

The hosts engage in light-hearted banter about the authenticity and application of the term, bridging the generational gap with humor.

Notable Quotes

• Josh Heard: “[02:29] ...I wasn't the best player in the world, but I played for a man named Skip Prosser, who was the best teacher I've ever had.”
• Pat Kelsey: “[08:07] ...unrelenting effort, competitive excellence and the power of the unit. That's way more important than skiing.”
• Andy Beshear: “[18:09] ...they really do view some of their value through the social media lens.”
• Josh Heard: “[14:20] ...you can either say, hey, we're going to adapt to it and navigate it, or we're not. And if you're not, you're going to fall behind.”

Conclusion

Episode 18 of The Andy Beshear Podcast offers a comprehensive look into the intricacies of managing a successful athletic program at the University of Louisville, the importance of culture and mentorship, and the challenges posed by modern changes in college sports. Additionally, the episode provides insightful commentary on current political and economic issues, wrapped up with a relatable Gen Z language segment. Whether you're a sports enthusiast or interested in the broader implications of leadership and culture, this episode delivers valuable perspectives and engaging conversations.

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Transcript

[Andy Beshear]

Foreign.

[John Rabinowitz]

Welcome to episode 18 of the Andy Beshear Podcast. Remember, you can download us on all major platforms, but please go to our YouTube channel, Andy Beshear Podcast and subscribe. Today is a really fun episode. For the first part, you're not going to hear about any politics at all because we have UofL basketball coach Pat Kelsey and UofL athletic director Josh Hurd. We, plus John Rabinowitz have known each other a while, and so you're going to hear four friends talking about the changes in college athletics and even talking about how we try to be present with our families after coming home from stressful jobs. Then I'm going to have our conversation with the Johns, where we'll talk about redistricting tariffs, the jobs report, and even the presidential physical fitness test. And then Will Bashir is going to teach us some new lingo. So this is a great episode. I hope you enjoy it.

[Pat Kelsey]

This is the Andy Beshear Podcast. On this episode, we're welcoming a couple of our friends. Pat Kelsey, the head coach of the University of Louisville men's basketball team, and Josh Heard, the athletic director for the university. So, folks, with the guests this week, no politics, just college athletics. Thank you all for joining the podcast.

[Andy Beshear]

Happy to be here.

[Josh Heard]

Thanks for having us.

[Pat Kelsey]

Coach, why don't you start by telling.

[John Rabinowitz]

Us about your coaching journey?

[Pat Kelsey]

I was just down in Charleston, South Carolina, where you still have an amazing reputation. How did you become a Division 1 University of Louisville ACC basketball coach?

[Josh Heard]

I think it starts with my playing career, and I tell this joke a lot. Whenever I get introduced, they talk about my coaching career. Not as much my playing career, but that's because I missed a thousand points by 912. I wasn't the best player in the world, but I played for a man named Skip Prosser, who was the head coach at Xavier, and then he became the head coach at Wake Forest. And he was the best teacher I've ever had. I feel like I got a great education at Xavier. I was a business major, graduated cum laude. I'm bragging a little bit right now, but the greatest class that I ever took was his practice floor every day from 3 o' clock to 6 o'.

[Andy Beshear]

Clock.

[Josh Heard]

And that inspired me more than anything to go into coaching. I started at the bottom, you know, like they say, now we're here.

[Pat Kelsey]

Did you have one of those jobs where you almost had to pay them to coach?

[Josh Heard]

Yeah, one of those. I was the freshman basketball coach at Elder High School in Cincinnati, Ohio.

[Pat Kelsey]

Wow.

[Josh Heard]

And somehow, one year later, I was there three years. And Skip hired me as director of basketball operations at Wake Forest. And he said that was the biggest meteoric rise in coaching history. Freshman basketball at Elder to the ACC in one year, you know, and then just. Just loved what I did every day. And the Lord blessed me with really good situations. I was around great people and, you know, became a head coach at. At Winthrop University and then became the head coach at the College of Charleston. And here I am at. At one of the most storied programs in the history of college basketball, the University of Louisville. Go, Cards.

[Pat Kelsey]

Josh, you, when you tell me, have told. Told me about your experience in the past, you've also talked about great mentors.

[Andy Beshear]

Yeah, it's something that's extremely, extremely important, I think for anybody is they're just trying to climb the ladder, whether it's their career or their family, whatever it may be just somebody, and usually it's going to be more than one person that you can lean on and say, hey, you know, I'm experiencing this or that. And maybe you didn't have that exact experience, but talk to me a little bit about how something similar. You navigated something along those lines because, you know, experience in life, they're all different, but they're all pretty similar, too, as far as the challenges that we're going to face professionally, personally. And so it's always good to have those folks that you can lean on and just say, hey, help me out here.

[Pat Kelsey]

Tell us a little bit about your mentors along your journey from Villanova to Louisville.

[Andy Beshear]

Yeah, I've got to start with my dad, even before I got to Villanova, just because he just taught me what it means to. To work hard, to be honest, to do the right thing, all those things that I think we all try to do, or at least a large majority of us try to do. And then from there, you know, I would tell you I'll take just stops along the way before I get to Villanova and athletics. George Phillips, who was U.S. attorney for a number of years in Mississippi and then was legal counsel for Senator Thad Cochran. So we are getting into politics a little bit here, but I share this line with people. He was just. Once again, I think it was one of those situations where I was calling him, asking for some advice, and he said, josh, don't ever forget that everybody deserves an opportunity. And it just, it just, it resonated with me, you know, no matter who you are, what you've been through, everybody deserves an opportunity. And so then getting into college athletics, my time at. My time at Villanova was really, really impactful just from the leadership as a whole. It was the first job that I was really in. You know, I was here for 10 years and then went to Villanova, but I didn't really have that experience with the presidential level or the board level. It was really with within the athletic department. So being able to be at Villanova and see the leadership from the top down, from the president and Father Peter to the athletic director and Mark Jackson, there's another gentleman, Father Rob Jay Wright. Just that whole ecosystem, and they were just. They were aligned on nearly everything they did. And it was really pretty similar to the things I just talked about with my dad. Right, we're going to do the right thing. We're going to give people an opportunity. We're going to be transparent, fair, honest. And that's, you know, as I've had the chance to lead this athletic department, that's what we try to do here.

[Pat Kelsey]

I remember when you were launching the coaching search, what you told me was you were only going to bring somebody in who had that character and who would build a great culture. And now I've seen a coach over here really build that out and have success in the. In the first year. Talk to us about the importance of culture, of the expectations for the team and leadership.

[Josh Heard]

You know, Josh talks so much about alignment and the alignment that he had at Villanova that he has here. From my first conversations with him, you know, there was a great understanding that we were two peas in a pod in a lot of ways. Different in a lot of ways, in that he runs 13 miles a day, and I've run 13 miles in my life. But, you know, I just appreciate it. First of all, the way he went about the entire coaching search, you know, he did it his way. It wasn't the search firms. It wasn't all that. It was. He was going to have conversations with people of interest, and we had ton of them, you know, and then when we finally had the last one, and I started getting the feeling that he was going to offer me the job, and he was talking about all this other stuff, and I said, josh, are you offering me the job? Because I'm offering you this job. And I love, stood up and went crazy and did a backflip. And that's probably where our alignment veers a little bit, because I've been described as making coffee nervous.

[Andy Beshear]

I'm.

[Pat Kelsey]

You do have a lot of energy.

[Josh Heard]

I have energy, and Josh does, too, you know, because he runs a million miles a day and he never stops working. I could text him at 12:30am and he hits me back within about four seconds, which shocks me all the time. I try not to do that very much to him, but you know, culture, obviously, he's built an unbelievable culture here at University of Louisville athletics. There is such alignment amongst the head coaches. You know, Jeff Brahm has become a great friend of mine, unbelievably supportive. I got calls from the head women's soccer coach and the head field hockey coach on Saturday, a day after we all finished our summer training. They asked me to come in and talk to recruits and I was, they said, what time do you need me to be there? And they said 9am I said I'll be there at 8:30 because they would do the same exact thing for us. And it's so apparent that culture is prevalent within the athletic department that we are all on the same team. We fight for each other, we root for each other, we support each other. And then, you know, each organization has a culture. You know, some are bad, some are good. We like to think ours is by design and not by default. By default, you throw. It's very intentional. You throw spaghetti at the wall and sees what sticks. That's not what we're going to be about our players. If I brought them all in this room and I could ask them what our standards are, what does ABC mean? Academics, basketball, character. I could ask them what our AC or our cultural blueprint is. And they would recite it with their eyes closed in their sleep. Relentless effort, competitive excellence and the power of the unit. The, the uncommon commitment to the person next to you. That's way more important than skiing. That's way more important than pick and roll coverage. That's may way more important than your set play package. It's how you operate. It's what your DNA, it's what your beliefs are. And that's, that's what we try to be about, John.

[Pat Kelsey]

We got to see how the players respond to that energy and, and that culture firsthand, especially in a pregame speech. The coach let us come in and watch or Josh snuck us in to watch. But how prepared they were in the game plan and excited that they were to play. What you've been able to do, the.

[John Rabinowitz]

Two of you is one of the.

[Pat Kelsey]

Biggest one year turnarounds that I've ever seen in college basketball. But then land a heck of a great recruiting class and transfer. So how are you feeling about this next year?

[John McConnell]

They kept their players, kept their stars, kept.

[Andy Beshear]

Very true.

[Josh Heard]

Yep, we're excited. You know, we Had a great summer. We just finished eight weeks of training. And we're talented. We have an experienced team. You know, you talk about the. A lot of people talk about the decorated recruit that Mikel Brown is, but, you know, he's a very, very good player, but he's got veteran guys around him. So we think we have the makeup of. Of a championship team.

[Pat Kelsey]

Josh, the basketball program isn't the only. Only winning program at UofL right now. Obviously, they made the NCAA championship first year under this coach, as did your women's team. The baseball team went to the College World Series and took down Vanderbilt and some other really great teams. The volleyball team went to the national championship. You've got programs all across the board that are really succeeding. So what's the secret?

[Andy Beshear]

Hire really good coaches. And, you know, that's obviously an oversimplification, but. But it's not. You know, they. I think I look at all of our head coaches as running, basically running their own business and trying to give them as many resources as you can possibly give them. Now, every coach that we have is going to say that they need more.

[Pat Kelsey]

They want all the nil money.

[Andy Beshear]

They. Yes, amongst other things. But Pat hit the nail on the head. I do think we have created a culture where they understand, hey, I may not get everything that I want, but it might be benefiting this program over here, so I'm okay with that. And I think it's really hard to develop that culture when you have a bunch of type A, highly, highly competitive people running their own organizations. You know, and it's. I didn't hire Pat to worry about the field hockey team. I didn't hire Justine or I didn't hire Justine at all. I didn't hire the track coach to worry about the basketball program. That's not their job. Right. And that's where, for me, I say that's the administration's job to help them understand, like, hey, Pat, I know you would love some more nil money, but if we can do something over here with football or whatever sport it may be, that's going to help the department as a whole. And when you can get coaches that they may not like it, but they understand it, that's where I think you really start to see them interact and say, hey, how do we. How do we all become successful? And I do feel pretty good about that right now. But you look at the coaches that we have, obviously, Coach Kelsey, coach Brom winning 19 games in two years with the football program, our new volleyball coach, who is just, I Think he's going to do a phenomenal, phenomenal job. I think he's going to pick off, pick up right where Danny Left off. Dan McDonnell just finished and finished his 19th year. Jeff Walls. I could go on and on and on. Our track team, our men's and women's program just finished in the top 25 for the first time ever for both programs. Arthur Albiero, what he's doing with our swimming and diving program, he's actually coaching the US Swim team right now in Singapore, I believe. It's a lot of fun to be a Louisville Cardinal right now.

[John McConnell]

You know, as a proud alumni. One thing I think of, when I went to school there, it was kind of like the coaches seem to be there as a stepping stone. Now it's a final destination. And so when you see the coaching staff top to bottom, it's really impressive what you've built, what you continue to build and how you maintain. And so even the scheduling now, the teams that they're playing, they're not hiding from anybody.

[Pat Kelsey]

I often think about how different the world is from when we were growing up. You know, the computers and cell phones, how much it's changed. It feels in a way that college sports have changed that much over the last, you know, 10 years alone. It may be in part of the play in basketball where it seems like the three point shot is much more dominant than it used to be, but it's also this era of nil and the, the transfer portal. Talk to us about how you adapt.

[Andy Beshear]

I, it doesn't matter if it's nil or, you know, the three point shot. We, we talk about it pretty frequently because it's something I do think we think very similar on Evolve or die. And, and you can say, hey, this isn't why I got into college athletics, or it's different than what I expected it to be. Well, this is what it is right now. And you can either say, hey, we're going to adapt to it and we're going to navigate it, or we're not. And if, if you're not, you're going to fall behind.

[Pat Kelsey]

That sounds very Game of Thrones. You either win or you die.

[Andy Beshear]

But, but I tell our staff all the time, like, bitching about it's not going to do anything. Okay. And so if you want to complain about it, then you need to really think about whether or not you want to be in this industry.

[Pat Kelsey]

You got to figure it out.

[Andy Beshear]

You know, is, is it probably how we all expected it to be five, 10 years ago when we Got into it? No, but it's where it is today. And so we're going to navigate it the best that we can, and that's what we're going to try to do. And we're going to hire people the same way.

[John McConnell]

And speaking of the nil, you know, as from the Morgan and Morgan side of things, you know, you say I plug stuff every time, so you do a good job. We're big believers in it. We love it as a corporate partner. But it's year over year, even week after week now it seems that to your point, it's evolving and it's changing. And I think the only way you see some of these schools that are falling behind, it's because they're not willing to adapt. Now, one thing we've talked about all the time is where it must be really challenging for a school like Louisville is how you deal with the $20.5 million cap and how you divvy it up amongst the teams in the sports.

[Andy Beshear]

Yes, more than once I've heard that the Big east is spending a lot more than we're spending on basketball.

[John McConnell]

But I, I was wondering that.

[Pat Kelsey]

I have to think there's some advantages too. So you come in last year, coach, and you're able to put together a whole new team based on that transfer portal.

[Josh Heard]

You better, you know, you better five, six years ago when you took over a job and the program was in the state that it was, you'd be given know some rope to, hey, this might take two or three years and we're going to be patient. That's not the world anymore. Especially just because you mentioned your ability to rebuild very quickly because of the transfer portal. It does giveth and taketh away. You know, the support that we get here, the resources that that were given, how attractive the University of Louisville and the tradition that we have here is. We knew that we could get good and we could get good really quickly. It is a different world. There is elements of professional sports. There's. There's no question, but Josh knows this and we talk about this all the time. That 45 by 94 foot rectangle is still my classroom. And the 19, 20, 21, 22 case, and Prior's case, 36 or whatever he is now, they're still in the formative years of their life and there's a business component to it. But just like Skip Prosser and the coaches that poured into me as I was developing throughout my life made a major, major impact on my life, I still feel like we can have that same impact on the future of the young men that are under our charge. And that'll never change. I don't care how much professional sports becomes college sports. It's still my classroom.

[Pat Kelsey]

It also seems that the pressures that the athletes face have only grown in the age of social media and probably hearing about different nil deals that other people are getting. Constantly trying to weigh your worth, unfortunately, probably on some of those things. Do you all see the athletes themselves going through more than in the past?

[Andy Beshear]

Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think a large part of it's probably social media.

[Pat Kelsey]

Yes.

[Andy Beshear]

I think if you have a good culture that you can sort through the nil money component and say, hey, this is, we're leaving that at the door. And if your culture is strong, that's what happens. But social media, you can't tell an 18 year old to not look at their phone or not get on social media. It's impossible. Right. I'm, I'm amazed. I have an 8 year old and a 10 year old and I'm amazed at how quickly they don't have phones, but they pick mine up, they pick my wife's up and I'm like, put the phone down. And so 18, 19, 20, you know, they really do view some of their value through the social media lens. And as I always say to a fan who's complaining about a student athlete, I can't believe this happened or that happened. It's like, imagine being 19 years old and don't give me this, they're making a bunch of money and you know they had it. No, you're 19 years old and you missed a shot and you've got millions of people saying, I can't believe you missed that shot. Like, that's not, that's really hard, really hard to cope with. Because once again, they don't have that ability to just say, hey, I'm putting my phone down. And they've got people left and right saying, you know, you lost this game, you lost money for me, you know, because we, you know, that's the other piece of. It is, it's fortunate. Exactly. And so.

[John McConnell]

And they're kids.

[Pat Kelsey]

And they're kids. You're listening to the Andy Beshear podcast. This week we have Louisville's Pat Kelsey and Josh heard. Pat, in this first year at Louisville, did you have a favorite moment? A moment where you knew it was all clicking together and this was going to be a really fun team?

[Josh Heard]

My favorite moment. And there was lots of them. And it's funny, we talk about the transfer era and many times Players come into a program and stay for one year, and you hear fans and they lament about the old days when guys would come in as a freshman, they'd stay till their senior year. And it's like you don't get to know the players well. The team last year was full of great personalities. They played hard, they represented this city in a first class manner. And one guy amongst a bunch of them that I would point out is Chucky Hepburn. Chunky. Played three years at Wisconsin with a decorated player there, won a championship, transferred to Louisville for one year, and he happened to be on the revival train. And part of the year that, you know, we reestablished what Louisville basketball is all about. And he was beloved by the fan base. His hair, his charisma, his game, his success, his personality. And when we were playing Stanford on senior night and, you know, there was 14,000 people in our first game. And there was a couple months later, there was 16, 17, 18. There's 20,000 people at the Yum Center. And Chucky checks out of the game for the last time at the Yum center in front of the great Cardinal fans, the best fans in college basketball. And he's getting ready to run to the sideline. And Peyton Siva kind of like winks at him because they had talk about it ahead of time. And Chucky runs back to the. To the. The bird, the dunking bird, the Cardinal on center court. And he gets down, he kisses the court and like, wow, I got goosebumps. I get them right now when I talk to people around the city and they talk about this year's team and they bring up that moment, tears.

[Pat Kelsey]

It's pretty darn cool, pretty special. Josh, when you look back at this last year and everything that happened, what type of expectations do you have for the athletic programs moving into all these new seasons? The bar is high.

[Andy Beshear]

Yeah. No, but that's. You're chasing excellence, right, in anything that you do. And I talk to our coaches all the time about, are we making progress? And that. That isn't always measured and judged in wins and losses. You know, you think about, let's take basketball, for example. The expectation for this basketball program isn't to exit in the first round of the NCAA tournament, but this program, this team last year, will be one that was remembered not for that first round loss, but for everything that they did to get this program back and the amount of progress that they made. And so what does that progress look like for each of our programs? And say, all right, can we make some progress in this area or that area. And it's not. You know, you won nine games last year. I expect you to win 10 this year. It's too hard to measure it in wins and losses. As I say, the other team's trying to win, too.

[John McConnell]

You know, we were talking on the way up here, what we. We kind of laughed. We said, you see these preseason rankings coming out, and we can't imagine how people can have any idea. I know you have good players, but how can you know how good you will be as a team with all the transfers coming in? How can you rank one way or the other? How. How are you guys always remaining competitive? And how do you know you'll have a team?

[Josh Heard]

You know, Josh mentioned Jay Wright. And it's funny, during the interview process, I actually talked to Coach Wright. There's so many moments where I go, holy cow, how did all this happen? Like, all of a sudden, I'm on a podcast with the governor of Kentucky. This is nuts. But, you know, Jay Wright, I read it in a book one time, and this was after he won his second national championship, and the media asked him, national championship or bust?

[Andy Beshear]

Right?

[Josh Heard]

I mean, what else? You won two in a row. I mean, that. That's. That's the standard. That's the goal for the season. And he said, our goal is never a number of wins or national championship. Our goal for the season is to have the number one culture in the country. And he said, if we establish that, and that's really hard to do, that might be harder than win a national championship, to have that standard of excellence every single day in what you do. But his whole thing was, if your approach is about excellence every single day and those habits are built, the outcomes will take care of themselves. That'll put us in the best position, the best chance to win a national championship, but it's just that standard every single day.

[John Rabinowitz]

So he won two.

[Josh Heard]

He won two.

[John Rabinowitz]

But he had. He had to wait a while to build that culture.

[Andy Beshear]

He did. I was actually telling the story somebody the other day that 2016, they win it. 2018, they win it. 2017, they were the number one overall seed in the tournament. And most people don't remember that because they had. They just had a terrible matchup in the second round against Wisconsin and literally missed a running shot in the lane to tie it as time expired. But you think about having three years there where they were arguably the best team in the country. Uh, it's. It's hard to believe. Yeah.

[Pat Kelsey]

So let me get a little more personal. You all both have families, kids that you love, wife that you love, but you have really high stress jobs, which I know a little bit about.

[John Rabinowitz]

How do you.

[Pat Kelsey]

How do you compartmentalize that and, and try to be present when you come home to the family.

[Andy Beshear]

You want to take this one?

[Josh Heard]

Um.

[Andy Beshear]

Cause I'm.

[John McConnell]

I'm.

[Pat Kelsey]

I'm asking for a friend.

[John McConnell]

You're looking at me. I do have three daughters. I get it. Well, the.

[Pat Kelsey]

Well, the really cool thing was when.

[Josh Heard]

We were off air before this, we all have teenage daughters, and we. You guys start telling some stories about being a teenage dad, and I go, this was the best conversation I've had all day. To know that I'm not all by myself. You guys are going through the same thing, therapy. You know, there's no such thing as balance. Is true balance. People say there's, there's, there's got to be. There's no such thing. My bride, Lisa, the best recruit I ever signed.

[Pat Kelsey]

She.

[Josh Heard]

We dated for a long time, you know, when. When I was an assistant and grinding and trying to make my way in this business, and she kind of knew what she signed up for, but it's the old quality over quantity, you know, when you're home. So you try to be present. That's hard. Right, because you're getting. You got to make calls to recruits and all that. But it's just the lifestyle. And Josh is unbelievable because he allows my personal life to be a part of my professional life. Like my son Johnny, he leaves school every day at 3:00, and he comes to the practice facility and he's there all day, and he leaves late at night with me, and he goes home, gets his homework done during the day. So if. Lisa, when you watch this, you know, and he lets Johnny sit on the sideline, he lets him be in the locker room. I mean, there's not all athletic directors in the country who allow that to happen, but we. I mentioned that alignment. You know, I know how much family means to him. He's a phenomenal father and husband and family man, A great mentor and role model.

[Andy Beshear]

For me, it's. It's something that I've had to practice, and I'm a long way from perfecting it. Abby can attest to that. You know, I laugh because Abby is fiercely loyal. And when I. Talking about not being able to handle social media. Yeah. See how it's like, make sure she.

[Pat Kelsey]

Does not read the comments.

[Andy Beshear]

That's exactly it.

[Pat Kelsey]

And if she feels bad about the comments on Louisville, have her come read ma.

[Andy Beshear]

That's. But I mean, you know, it's like, can you believe this idiot said that? I'm like, yeah, yeah, I can't. But I Pat hit the nail on the head, I think, being present. And once again, when you've got all the, all the things that you've got going on, and we've got a fraction of the things going on compared to what you've going on. What you have going on. I say it all the time. We're not curing cancer. We're not splitting the atom. We're in college sports. We're lucky to be in college sports. And yes, it's extremely, extremely important, but let's not lose sight of what it is. And I think if you can do that, you can manage it a lot better. And so that's what I try to do and make sure that people understand, you've got one family, take care of them. And there's going to be moments where it's like, hey, I might miss something at work. And guess what? The place isn't going to come crashing down. We're going to be okay. And that's also a tribute to staff around me because I actually just came back from vacation and there was a few times where I got a phone call and I didn't answer it. Texted, I said, hey, is the house on fire? And they're like, nope, just hit me over the next couple of days. And it's like, all right, they got it covered. And so I think when you combine all those things, you start to kind of figure it out a little bit. But you're never gonna have it figured out in jobs like this.

[Pat Kelsey]

So if you all had to do something other than college sports, what would the job be?

[Josh Heard]

Man.

[Andy Beshear]

That'S a great question. And I don't know if I've ever really thought about it.

[Pat Kelsey]

I think you might be worse in this trend.

[John Rabinowitz]

I don't know.

[Pat Kelsey]

I think you might be in the government sector too.

[John McConnell]

Yeah.

[Pat Kelsey]

You follow it?

[Andy Beshear]

I, I do, and I enjoy it, but I, I, it, I think it's what I get to be a fan of.

[Pat Kelsey]

I, I got it a little bit removed.

[Andy Beshear]

Exactly, exactly.

[Pat Kelsey]

Right now that's probably a good thing.

[Andy Beshear]

It's. I'm right where I want to be from a political standpoint.

[Pat Kelsey]

What about you, Pat?

[Josh Heard]

I would be the play by play announcer for the Cincinnati Reds.

[Pat Kelsey]

Oh, see, easy.

[John Rabinowitz]

We, we, we've talked about some of.

[Pat Kelsey]

Our favorite Reds players and how my son wears 11 because Barry Larkin. How about 11? And I wore 11 in between, except Barry played very well. Will plays well, and I was on a team.

[John McConnell]

Let's be very clear. Will got his athletic ability from his.

[Pat Kelsey]

Mother, green, which we all know very well.

[John McConnell]

Been put out almost every episode.

[Pat Kelsey]

No one knows where he got his height, though, so we'll figure that out.

[Josh Heard]

Well, when Will watches this, I get videos from your dad. He's a proud dad, but I love seeing his progress. And that last home run he hit in that tournament, I would have gone out in any park in the country, including Yellowstone. That was a bomb.

[Pat Kelsey]

You could have told.

[Andy Beshear]

That was awesome for the Reds.

[Pat Kelsey]

Favorite, favorite type of food.

[Andy Beshear]

I eat two things basically five days a week. It's tostitos, lime chips, and macaroni and cheese. I. I eat like a 12 year old. Abby lets me know this on a daily basis. But that's, you know, as I say, that's why I run. So I can eat Mac and cheese.

[Josh Heard]

And tostitos, literally, like 13 miles a day. So he eats more food for a guy. Yes, it is him. It is unbelievable. I got to give a little shout out to, to my hometown of Cincinnati, Ohio. A little skyline chile.

[Andy Beshear]

Okay.

[Pat Kelsey]

Like the chili cheese coney.

[Josh Heard]

I go with a coney with onions and mustard.

[Andy Beshear]

Okay.

[Josh Heard]

And then. And then a little grater's ice cream too, which is here in Louisville.

[Pat Kelsey]

That's hard to beat. Hard to beat. We often ask people what their secret superpower is, and I'll give you a couple examples. Mine is only good one day a year. I can cook a Thanksgiving turkey better than anyone I know. My wife Brittany packs a suitcase better than anyone I know. We could be in Hawaii and there's a freak snowstorm and she would have parkas for us. So. So what's that secret superpower that nobody knows?

[Andy Beshear]

Oh, the secret superpower that nobody knows. Man, you're asking some good questions. I should watched a few more. I've watched a handful of them, but I still watch.

[Pat Kelsey]

Amy Klobuchar said that she didn't need much sleep, which would be wonderful.

[Andy Beshear]

It's funny, I was actually just getting ready to say that because once again, Abby, Abby needs her eight hours minimum. And for the life of me, I can't understand that. Like, I cannot comprehend. Like, what do you. What do you mean? You can't just go off five hours sleep. So if I get about five hours of uninterrupted sleep, I feel great. Feel absolutely terrific. And I can assure you my wife would say that is not a superpower power of mine.

[Josh Heard]

We were talking about the presidential physical fitness tech that's coming back right I have this. I have an uncanny knack for doing a ridiculous amount of pull ups for a 50 year old.

[Pat Kelsey]

So let's.

[John McConnell]

If he has to do.

[Pat Kelsey]

They're like, hey, humble brag superpower.

[John McConnell]

I am tapping coach Kelsey in for my pull ups.

[Andy Beshear]

Yes.

[John McConnell]

We have to do a new lifeline on the Bella.

[Andy Beshear]

You are.

[Pat Kelsey]

I think I could hit the sit ups. I'm not sure about the pull ups. And then I just go back to gym class and remember the rope which was the beat of my existence.

[John McConnell]

I love it.

[Andy Beshear]

So we're. We're at the beach last week and I don't even know how we got on to this idea but we literally had a contest to see who could do the most situps in a minute, me or Hadley. I. I still beat her. I was amazed. And.

[Pat Kelsey]

And what did you tear and how long will it.

[Andy Beshear]

I was sore for. I was sore for about three days. Yeah.

[Pat Kelsey]

I remember trying to teach Will how to. How to run the basis in that explosive first step did not work out well for me.

[Josh Heard]

So Hadley and Gus who are we live in the same neighborhood. They are two of the most entrepreneurial. How old are they? 10 and 11.

[Andy Beshear]

8 and 10.

[Josh Heard]

Like they. So yesterday we leave at about 8am and they're putting up their lemonade stand. We get back at about 6pm and they are still rocking, grinding. And then at times they'll go door to door to sell the lemonade. Oh yeah, the herd kids are like.

[John Rabinowitz]

So we have.

[Pat Kelsey]

We had Mark Cuban on and. And he went to his dad to get new shoes. His dad was drinking and playing poker with his friends. He said why don't you get a job? One of his friends said I've got some extra trash bags. And he's laughing and saying why don't you go sell those to the neighbors? And he does. And that was the start of his hustling. So maybe we have two Mark Cubans.

[Andy Beshear]

Oh, they came back yesterday and I think they made $11 and 55 cents. And then I started asking them what they're operating and operating costs were and production costs and all that.

[John McConnell]

But you're working on the net with them already.

[Andy Beshear]

Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

[Pat Kelsey]

That's that. That was paid for by the Royal bank of Dads.

[Josh Heard]

I know one thing, Linda Kelsey. My mom was in town so they might have made 11:27. That's what they told you. I think she dropped them a 20.

[Andy Beshear]

Well that might be. That was each. And there was five of them. So I mean they made like 50. $50 good for there Total. That's great. With lemonade.

[Pat Kelsey]

Coach, tell me a little bit about how you use social media. I know, especially when you were announced as coach. And then since in many ways I see you as this mix of basketball coach and venture capitalists and how you're out there getting attention.

[Josh Heard]

I have this quote that I love. And there was a civil rights leader. He lives in Utah now. His name's Francis Davis. And I saw him give a.

[Andy Beshear]

Graduation.

[Josh Heard]

Speech at the University of Louisville or Utah a couple years ago. And he grew up in rural Mississippi, very poor. His mom was his hero and his greatest teacher he ever had. And his quote was, be who you is and not who you ain't. Because if you ain't who you is, you is who you ain't. Be who you are. And it's one of our rules.

[Pat Kelsey]

It is the authentic.

[Josh Heard]

So I get on social media and, you know, I just try to be myself a little bit. And I got a great creative team around me. The resources we have. For instance, we went out and surprised and greeted season ticket holders the other day.

[Pat Kelsey]

That's great.

[Josh Heard]

And they had this really, really, like, detailed script. You could tell there was a ton of thought put into it. And we get in the van and we pull up to the first place, and I'm like, now we're just going to go off the rail. So we got real spontaneous. I just went in and kind of tried to be myself. And my. They edited carefully and ended up being pretty good.

[John Rabinowitz]

Is that one of those times where.

[Pat Kelsey]

You knock on the door, they look at you and say, has anyone ever told you you look like Pat Kelsey?

[Josh Heard]

So when I first got the job here, I was walking down the street, and a student did just that. He came up to me, goes, hey, anybody ever tell you you look like that new basketball coach, Pat Kelsey? And I was like, yeah, I get that all the time. Like, roll my eyes. He goes, man, that must really tick you off. Wow.

[Andy Beshear]

Oh, that's great.

[Josh Heard]

Wow.

[John Rabinowitz]

So.

[Pat Kelsey]

So. Favorite thing about living in Kentucky.

[Andy Beshear]

For me, it's. It's Louis. It really is, because it checks all the boxes. You know, it's. It's big enough that it's got anything you could ever want. Food, scenes. Terrific. You just go through all the things that you might think you want or need in a really big city. Louisville has it, but you can be in the country literally in 10 minutes. So I just. I. I love the simplicity and the ease of living in Louisville.

[Josh Heard]

The derby was, like, the coolest sporting event experience that. That I've ever experienced in my life, but I'm a little biased as a basketball coach. It's just the passion that this state has for who, Governor?

[Andy Beshear]

Yes.

[Josh Heard]

You know, we all know very well. It's. There's houses divided. It's a state divided that day in November this year, the state just stops in their tracks. And my wife went to the grocery store the morning of the Louisville, Kentucky game this year, and she was just, like, wearing jeans and a white shirt. Somebody went up to her and he.

[John Rabinowitz]

Goes, where is your red?

[Josh Heard]

How can you not have red on? I mean, it's. It's. The passion for basketball here is palpable, and it's like no other place in America.

[Pat Kelsey]

All right, last question. You all have jobs that you might be able to go on vacation for a week, but if you could take a month, totally unplug. What's that bucket list thing that you do?

[Andy Beshear]

It would probably be just spend. Spend a month in Europe with. With Abby, with my wife. She. We were able to go to the Olympics last year, which was incredible.

[Pat Kelsey]

I think I saw you at the airport leaving for that.

[Andy Beshear]

I think that's right. Yeah, I think that's. That is. I remember that. I remember that. But just to be able to spend some time. No agenda, no itinerary. Hey, where do you want to go? Because there's just so many amazing places over there, so many amazing countries that I haven't been able to experience. Abby's been able to experience a number of them when she was on the US national team for field hockey. But just traveling with her and spending a month doing it would be. Would be incredible.

[Pat Kelsey]

It's a lot of pressure to have a good field hockey team.

[Andy Beshear]

Yeah.

[Josh Heard]

You talk about competitive now.

[Andy Beshear]

Yes.

[Josh Heard]

And Hadley gets it, too, from her mom. Like, it's what's cool about that. I know I'm getting off topic here. What's cool about the herd? Kids, it's like old school. Like, they. They go out in the morning, they play. They're playing different games. They're playing football. It's lemonade stands. It's like Americana. It's how it should be. It's how it used to be. So I really appreciate that about the herd family. I know you said you'd love to travel, you know, Europe with. With Abby. I would love to travel around for a month and go to every major league baseball stadium. But guess what? My wife probably don't want to do that.

[Pat Kelsey]

So I. I think Will and I'll go with you.

[Andy Beshear]

All right.

[John McConnell]

I go.

[Pat Kelsey]

Oh, I can probably get us A ride.

[Andy Beshear]

Let's do it. How many have you been to?

[Josh Heard]

I haven't really been to a ton. Yeah, I mean, that'd probably be more fun for me to just go on a road trip with the Reds and just watch every single game because I'm not a big MLB guy. I'm a Reds guy, so that makes sense.

[Andy Beshear]

Yeah.

[Josh Heard]

But if you can get us a ride, I'm down.

[Andy Beshear]

Let's.

[John Rabinowitz]

I think I can find, I mean, where.

[John McConnell]

They just play.

[Pat Kelsey]

Yeah, they, they just played at Bristol at the Sun Speedway. It would, you know, they hyped that game. It was going to be the most fans they've ever had. And it rained out. The, the Saturday biblical rain they had and they had to come back on, on, on the Sunday.

[Andy Beshear]

It was still the largest crowd for a regular season game.

[Josh Heard]

Yeah, but it was raining cats and dogs. They started the game for 12 minutes. The puddles all over the field. They had to shut it down. They ran out of food. It was bad.

[Pat Kelsey]

So, gentlemen, grateful you're here. Good luck in the season and seasons to come. I really appreciate you joining the Andy Bashir Podcast.

[Andy Beshear]

Thanks for having us.

[John McConnell]

Go Cards. And if you're watching on YouTube, can we focus on Andy Shoes Now?

[Pat Kelsey]

We know red and black, there's not.

[Josh Heard]

A governor in the country that has a better shoe game than you. I can tell you that without question.

[Pat Kelsey]

There's a guy named Jared Polis that has a few, but I think mine are the right ones.

[Andy Beshear]

I know yours are the right ones.

[John Rabinowitz]

You're listening to the Andy Beshear Podcast. We just ran wrapped up a sports only segment with Pat Kelsey, the head coach of Louisville, and Josh Heard, the athletic director. And now we're going to switch to our Conversation among Friends where we process all the things that happened last week and we try to get you prepared for the week to come. And we've got some really interesting topics this week. I'm here with John McConnell, John Rabinowitz. I think John Rabinowitz is going to kick us off.

[John McConnell]

I'm going to kick it off. And I think we have to kick it off with, with the drama. It is Monday, so we don't know what's going to happen later this week. But the drama that's going on in Texas, where we have the advancement of a draft congressional map passed on Saturday to add five new, potentially five new Republican seats. In response to that, it appears that on Sunday night, I think 51 Democrats flew across the country and they're outside of Texas. So as to make sure that today There is not quorum to vote on these new maps. And so I'd like to hear what we think of this. I know that in 2022 it happened in Kentucky, so we can kind of relate it back, but it is unbelievable.

[John Rabinowitz]

In 2022 it happened in Kentucky under a regular schedule. These things are supposed to happen every, every 10 years. This one, they're doing faster. They're doing faster because Donald Trump is worried about losing control of the House. And to me, this is cheating. This is knowing that you're losing in the middle of a game and trying to change the rules and the precedent it's going to set. You know, you can't unilaterally disarm. So what you're going to see are democratically led states doing the same thing. And to me, I think that's bad for democracy doing this every couple of years, which is what it'll lead into. And really, this type of redistricting which is aimed at electing a certain party, is the definition of that party choosing their voters instead of voters choosing their congressman or woman. We had another really interesting story this week when the President got a bad jobs report. It showed that not as many jobs were being created under his economy. And it very much looks like tariffs are slowing down hiring and slowing down investment. When the President saw this jobs report, he had two options. The first one, he could say maybe we should reconsider tariffs. But he didn't do that. Instead, he fired the person who ultimately signs off on the report.

[E]

That's like the ultimate form of kill the messenger, right? Yes, the person just bringing the news to you.

[John Rabinowitz]

Well, they're almost in ultimate form.

[E]

Almost. Yeah, exactly.

[John McConnell]

Well, listen, this is week after week after week for us talking about tariffs, like which country's going to have the deal, how is it going to affect the consumer? And it has the trickle down effect. I mean, last week we also found out what interest rates didn't change. They stayed the same.

[John Rabinowitz]

That's right. And what the analysts are seeing about the impact of tariffs is pretty negative. And so businesses aren't going to invest with those types of outlooks. Some have even said a recession may happen that otherwise was not going to happen at all. You know, the federal government is bragging about the amount of money that's coming in, but who's paying for it? We all know that other countries aren't paying for it. It's typically either the American company that's eating it, which isn't good for that company because it's not going to grow, or pay higher wages or they're passing it along to the consumer. So you could say, and the consumer is the American public. So you could say, hey, we did $70 billion of tariff revenue, but if that's $70 billion that the American people and American families are paying, then we're worse off.

[John McConnell]

And John, I mean, we talked about this a little before we started to shoot today. What are your thoughts on the tariff on Brazil?

[E]

Well, when you look at the tariff on Brazil, I mean, he's talking 50% because he's mad at the president there. And we actually have a deficit. Actually they have a deficit with us. We have a surplus. So, you know, it's not targeting people that take more. It's actually coming back that's going to hurt us on how much we can bring in.

[John Rabinowitz]

And he's doing that one because there is a criminal prosecution of the former president which he believes is is not right. He seems to connect it to the prosecution that he went through. But what we know under the law is you have to have an emergency. You have to claim an emergency under some different situations for a president to have unilateral tariff power. Big question about whether he has it at all for any of these. But you certainly don't get it because you don't like what is happening in another country in a criminal prosecution.

[John McConnell]

And we still have no deal with China, no deal with Canada, so. Right.

[Andy Beshear]

Yeah. Nothing.

[E]

Nothing in place formally other than the fact that if you do run a business and you're trying to plan on making changes or growing, it's so difficult to do it because what we just stated of. How do you plan on the uncertainty?

[John McConnell]

And I guess we don't see the manu manufacturing jobs we expected based on those labor numbers.

[John Rabinowitz]

And to close us out, the return of the presidential physical fitness test yalls take.

[E]

I wonder how long I could pass.

[John McConnell]

It right now, but I'm not sure I don't want to. We can do this. I knew it was going to happen if I said that. I think the mile run would be a challenge. I can't remember the time frame, but the pull ups, I mean, we got to nail the pull ups. John.

[John Rabinowitz]

I want to encourage people to go to our YouTube channel at Andy Bashir podcast and subscribe. If we get enough subscribers, I bet I can get John and John in their July 4th attire doing the presidential fitness.

[Pat Kelsey]

I don't know.

[John McConnell]

That shirt was like polyester. I can't do pull ups in polyester.

[E]

I haven't never tried to jog wearing that kind of an outfit. I'm not sure how that's going to work with suspenders, but we can give it a shot. I'm in.

[John McConnell]

You were saying earlier, part of your test was pulling up on a rope. I mean, when did they do that?

[E]

I vote for mine.

[Andy Beshear]

I don't know.

[John Rabinowitz]

So remember, you can download us on all major platforms, but make sure you go and subscribe to that YouTube channel, because we might just do the Presidential Physical Fitness Test. You're listening to the Andy Beshear Podcast. And now the return of everyone's favorite segment, Gen Z lingo with where Will makes us all look a thousand years old. Welcome back, Will.

[Will Bashir]

Thank you. It's good to be back on the tiny couch again with John. Our word today is fam. F A M. Fam. So I know you guys are thinking, like, oh, that obviously means family.

[John McConnell]

Seems easy.

[Will Bashir]

Seems easy, right?

[John Rabinowitz]

Yeah, but it's not like, Will, you and I are fam.

[Will Bashir]

We're fam. We're Andy Beshear podcast fam. You know, part of that. And that's where I'm going with that. When you're a part of a group or, like, a collective of something, you're a part of that fam. Like the baseball team. We're all fam, you know, so what.

[John Rabinowitz]

What type of emotional bond does it take to be fam? If the baseball team had not gotten along, would it have been fam?

[Will Bashir]

Well, it's still. I think there's still like. Like, levels of fam. Like, when you're fam, you know, you're, like, really close. You're tight, you get along. But if you're fam, you know, you're just, like, in a collective thing together. Like, you're on the team together, but you're not really tight.

[John Rabinowitz]

So how much you enunciate fam is how tight the bond is?

[Will Bashir]

No, but it's funny, so we're gonna roll with it.

[John McConnell]

Are you immediately part of the fam by just being in the group?

[Will Bashir]

Well, I mean, I feel like you kind of have to be, like, initiated. Like, you're not part of a fraternity. A fraternity until you're, what's the word?

[John Rabinowitz]

That's right. Initiated.

[Will Bashir]

Initiated, Right. So you're not really part of the fam, but you're invited your fam. Right.

[E]

It could be a work thing, too. Like, if John had a small business and for sales and I was to work there, I mean, I could be part of that work family.

[John Rabinowitz]

If, like, the Morgan and Morgan guys are calling themselves fam at work, is that cringe.

[Will Bashir]

That is very cringe. That's not very skippity behavior. And definitely not fire. No, definitely not fire.

[E]

Okay.

[John McConnell]

Definitely no emoji.

[Andy Beshear]

Yeah. No cap.

[John Rabinowitz]

So what we've learned today is right here in this segment is the Andy Beshear Podcast fam.

[Will Bashir]

We're all fam.

[John Rabinowitz]

And all our listeners. You're part of the fam too. We've come to the end of one of my favorite episodes of the Andy Beshear Podcast. A big thanks to coach Kelsey. A big thanks to athletic director Josh Heard. Big thanks to Will for teaching us even more Gen Z lingo. We'll see you next time. For great guests, a conversation with the Johns. And who knows what we'll learn then. Remember, you can download us on all major platforms or subscribe to our YouTube channel @andy Beshear Podcast. Your downloads and your subscriptions are what keep us going and keeps this conversation going. So make sure you're a part of it, and let's do this together.