Chapter 4 Ep. 18 Don’t Play Scared

Summary

Ante Up Poker Magazine Podcast – Chapter 4 Ep. 18: “Don’t Play Scared”

Host: Joe Scales
Co-hosts: Elle, Patrick, and guest Elliot Schechter
Date: May 15, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode focuses on the dangers of playing “scared” at the poker table, whether that’s related to money, reputation, or fear of failure. The hosts discuss critical poker news—including WSOP dealer ratings, poker room reopenings, and tech concerns—while blending in their trademark humor and actionable strategy. Multiple regular segments (Table Talk, Call the Floor, Hand of the Week, One Outer) provide advice on everything from home game etiquette to exploiting monster draws, with the show closing on a broader lesson about overcoming fear at and away from the felt.

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Table Talk & Poker News

[03:00–17:00]

Patreon Game Recap & Announcements (03:15–06:49)

• Joe recaps the last Patreon Hold’em game, congratulating himself (modestly) on the win, and plugs upcoming Omaha Hi-Lo and Hold’em double bounty games. Bounties and prizes are doubled in the next event, making now a great time to join.
• Elle: “Five dollars can win you a hundred... Or even 30 if you knock Joe out. And that's like bragging rights.” [06:18]
• The ongoing friendly competition and leaderboard banter highlight the supportive community aspect of the Patreon events.

Poker Room Updates—The Lodge Reopens (06:49–08:52)

• Elle: “The Lodge is reopening! 9:00am May 26. Cash games and tournaments are going to resume.”
• Both hosts are “tickled” that staff are returning after the recent raid/scandal and note the importance of patience in poker news, contrasting it with instant TV resolutions.

Poker World Controversy—WSOP Dealer Ratings Debate (08:52–17:03)

• New WSOP dealer rating system stirs controversy:
  • Elle: Draws from PokerNews and other podcasts: “If dealers can be rated, then players should be able to be rated, and that should be taken into account.”
  • The panel discusses dealer training gaps, fairness of rating systems, and views from poker personalities like Jeff Madsen (favoring positive feedback over demerits) and Mike Holtz (prefers comment cards for actionable feedback).
  • Joe: Argues WSOP should've invested in better dealer training rather than complex rating systems: “I would have rather seen that money spent in the training.”
  • The conversation covers the nuances of ratings versus incentives and concludes with a call for more constructive feedback and transparency on how input is used.

TDA Summit: Ban on Headphones Discussion (17:03–21:35)

• New rules may prohibit headphones at tables due to concerns over tech advances (e.g., Ray-Ban camera glasses, possible camera earbuds).
  • Elle: Relates it to personal sports experiences—gear checks as a routine for fairness.
  • The hosts appreciate TDA’s transparency and willingness to discuss rule changes, even as tech intrusion forces new considerations.

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Poker Adjacent News & Charity Tournaments

[21:35–32:42]

Dan Weinman’s RF Labs Social Card Lounge (21:47–25:17)

• 2023 Main Event champ Dan Weinman is now co-founder of RF Labs, launching a “social card lounge” in Alpharetta, GA, featuring classic games (blackjack, uno, spades), “showdown” (like Hold’em), and event night themes—but for points/social play, not gambling.
  • Elle: “This is like, I want to have a cool date experience...host a social event where I don't have to do anything...this can be. This concept is going to be really exciting to watch.” [24:21]
  • Joe and Elle highlight the potential for this kind of live, host-led social gaming to build community beyond just poker.

Bluffers Poker—Alaskan Cruise Satellites (26:13–29:01)

• Bluffers is hosting dozens of satellites for a $3,500 Alaskan cruise package (including airfare/tourney entries); one-in-ten chance at winning for those in final satellite.
• Call for listeners to check out socials for details.

Charity Poker Events—Bet on Better Series (29:01–32:42)

• Chicagoland’s “Gaming for Green”: June 11, $225 buy-in; casino games/poker/blackjack at Galleria Marchetti, afterparty at Celeste. Discount for group registrations. Supports green spaces in Chicago.
• Rhino Rumble—Vegas, June 28: Hosted by Shannon Elizabeth, MC’d by Matt Savage (Sterling Club), for endangered wildlife protection. Early bird special until May 31 (extra chips).
• Joe: “I do love how, like you said, it just continues to expand... people are realizing you can use poker for some really good things.” [32:56]

“Poor Caddy”—Poker Adjacent Promo (33:39–38:17)

• Elle introduces a new ambassadorship: Poor Caddy, a customizable stainless steel tumbler system with attachable lights, speakers, and even a hidden shot glass/highball feature. (Discount code: ANTEUP for 15% off.)

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Call the Floor (with Elliot Schechter)

[39:01–53:02]

Segment Overview

Elliot, the show’s resident Floor expert, tackles tricky rules and home game ethics.

Messy Desk or Clean Desk? (40:25)

• Fun icebreaker: Most prefer a “messy desk,” but Elliot keeps his chips carefully stacked to set an example in live games.

Main Ruling—Single Chip, Declared Raise (41:47–52:30)

• Situation: Home game, action folds to cutoff who bets $15, SB calls, BB (new player) puts a single $25 chip in with “raise,” but doesn’t specify an amount. Another (uninvolved) player blurts “How about $60?”, and BB agrees.
• Ruling:
  • If you declare “raise” and put in a single chip, your raise is limited to the value of that chip or the minimum allowed—NOT any arbitrary amount.
  • Elliot: “…they were limited to what the chip was. If they had thrown in a hundred dollar chip they wouldn't be able to bet 2 or 300... they would have to make the smallest available raise.” [46:22]
  • Uninvolved player suggesting an action violates “one player to a hand.” For discipline: in friendly games, make the offender deal a few rounds or sit out briefly to reinforce etiquette.
  • Deep dive into string bets, minimum raise rules, and differences in tournaments/cash games.

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Hand of the Week (with Patrick)

[53:14–72:31]

“Perfect Storm” Hand—Eight-Seven of Spades in a Straddled $1/3 Game (55:39–72:31)

• Scenario: $6 straddle, aggressive opener to $20, multiple callers, cutoff (listener-submitted) calls with 8♠7♠; pot balloons to $120, six-way.
• Flop: K♠9♠6♠ — cutoff flops a flush and open-ended straight flush draw.
• Action: Bet ($45), raise ($125), hero (cutoff) calls, becomes 3-way.
• Turn: 10♠ — straight flush hits. MP bets, hero deliberates on raising vs. slowplaying; just calls, third player tanks but calls.
• River: A♣; checks to MP who jams for $180. Hero calls, third player folds; MP has A♠K♦ for the nut flush, hero tables the straight flush.
• Twist: MP (listener Darren) was the supposed cutoff in the narrative twist—he wanted to know if the line looked strong enough from the winner’s view to get away from the nut flush. It did not.
• Strategy Discussion:
  • Should you raise with a flopped/turned straight flush to build value? Joe leans toward aggression; Patrick notes careful trapping paid off with a third caller. There’s no way to avoid losing maximum with the nut flush in a loose home game.
  • Patrick: "In this instance...you really hope that middle position has the nut flush...this is a perfect storm." [68:48]
  • They cover balancing getting value vs. not scaring off action, and reinforce that monster vs. monster happens.

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Joe’s One Outer: “Don’t Play Scared”

[72:52–77:41]

Key Theme:
Don’t let fear—of losing money or reputation—drive your decisions at the table or in life.

Notable Quotes:

• Joe: “Scared money isn’t always about money… [it’s] the perception, the fear of embarrassment, the fear of not living up to this image people might have of me. And that is still scared money. Because fear changes decision making no matter what form it takes, right?”
  • [73:00]
• “When you play scared, you stop trusting yourself. Maybe you fold in spots you should continue or avoid aggression because you’re trying not to fail instead of trying to succeed…Great players, they’re not fearless people. They just understand that fear can’t be in charge of the decision making process.” [74:30]

Lesson:
You should orient your mindset to make good decisions one hand at a time, free from attachment to the outcome or the opinions of others. This applies to all aspects of life—business, relationships, or taking creative risks.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Dealer Ratings: “I would have rather seen that money spent in the training rather than the, oh, you get this many stars.” — Joe Scales [14:20]
• On Poker Tech Threats: “It is standard and we all knew and it was something we all did. And so it’s like if you know that you show up to the poker room at check in or at the table quick—check for cameras…Random inspections.” — Elle [19:48]
• On Not Playing Scared: “The tighter you squeeze trying to avoid failure, the worse you usually perform. Poker’s always been funny that way. The game really punishes fear.” — Joe Scales [73:30]
• On Charity Poker: “You can use poker for some really good things.” — Joe Scales [32:56]

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Key Timestamps

• 03:15 – Patreon game recap & next events
• 06:49 – The Lodge reopening news
• 08:52 – WSOP dealer ratings debate
• 17:03 – TDA Summit: headphone ban discussion
• 21:47 – RF Labs Social Card Lounge news
• 26:13 – Bluffers Poker cruise satellites
• 29:01 – Charity poker event rundown
• 33:39 – Poor Caddy product announcement
• 39:01 – “Call the Floor” rules segment
• 53:14 – Hand of the Week: “perfect storm” straight flush hand
• 72:52 – One Outer: “Don’t Play Scared” monologue

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Summary

This episode blends practical poker advice (from home game disputes to deep strategy for maximizing monster hands), community highlights (charity tournaments and social gaming spaces), and big-picture wisdom—reminding players not to let fear dictate their play at the table or their lives off it. The dynamic between the hosts, their playful ribbing, and thoughtful tangents about both the nuances of poker etiquette and broader human behavior make this episode a must-listen for the serious but everyday player.

Transcript

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

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[Joe Scales]

Liberty. Liberty.

[Patrick]

Liberty.

[Joe Scales]

Liberty.

[Show Announcer]

Take your seat. The cards are flying high. Shuffle up and deal at the Aces Lie Longest running show. Yeah, we've seen it all from the river to the rail we answer the call.

[Joe Scales]

Hello a team, and welcome back to another episode of the Anti Up Poker podcast, where every hand is an opportunity, every player is a friend, every and every episode is a winning experience. I'm your host, Joe Scales, and I had a great time as usual in last night's Patreon game. And that's not because I won last night. It's just it's always fun getting together with all of you guys. Each month. The next game is going to be on the 28th and it'll be Omaha high low or 08. Then somehow we're already rolling into the June games and the June hold' Em game is gonna be double bounty and double prize. So if you've been thinking about joining Patreon, now's probably a pretty good time to jump in. And Patreon isn't just the games either. I try to, even though I don't do it all the time, I try to throw in some outtakes from the show in there from time to time, which usually means Patrick and I saying something ridiculous. Then you've got the monthly games and if nothing else, you always have a shot at winning a good karma seat when I spin the wheel each month. But even if you don't win the good karma seat, you still get a seven day free trial. So if you time it right, you can jump into a game, check everything out and see if it's something you enjoy. I'm also going to be changing things up a little bit for Hand of the Week. This week I updated some of the graphics to hopefully make everything even easier to follow when you're watching along on YouTube. The style is it's a lot closer to when Hand of the Week used to be its own standalone piece on YouTube, and I think it gives the hand kind of a smoother flow. Speaking of YouTube, though. You guys keep watching. The audience keeps growing and it's because of what all of you are doing. So keep sharing the episodes, keep liking them, keep commenting, and keep helping the A team continue to grow. That's all I have for now. So let's get on with the show.

[Show Announcer]

Welcome to the show. You're on the A team. Stack your chips and chase the dream. Joe's got the booth, his mic's on fire. Elle's got the laugh.

[Joe Scales]

She's taking.

[Show Announcer]

Get it higher.

[Joe Scales]

Elle and I are back around the

[Elle]

poker table with a winner.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I was able to take one down last night.

[Elle]

Yeah. How's that feel?

[Joe Scales]

It was good. It was good. Decaded. Duke played really well.

[Elle]

Let's just. Let's just have a conversation about that. For those of you just tuning in, Patreon, we play twice a month a Patreon game. If you want to pay to be a member of Patreon, all of that money goes to prize money and bounty money. So we don't take a break. It goes straight back to players. Right. Our monthly hold em game was last night. The numbers were pretty light and I was like, where is everyone? And you were like, I think they're over there on Bluffer's poker platform playing to win a chance to go on the Alaskan cruise, which we'll talk more about later.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elle]

So that made me. That made my heart happy because the stuff that Bluffers is doing for us to get some satellites onto the boat is amazing. But congratulations, partner.

[Joe Scales]

Thank you.

[Elle]

You took it down. You were also the bounty because one of our members wasn't able to show up. Who won last night. And somehow you end up pulling this off. When you're tired, you like go with the games that Joe goes into. Like, okay, I'm just a little tired. On this Thursday, you end up in it for the longest.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. I don't know what that's all about. I don't know why that is, but maybe I feel like I have to concentrate more or maybe I just think less. Yeah.

[Elle]

And play more.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, it's possible. But the cards went my way last night. Obviously that helps. You know, Decade Duke pushed at a time when I had pocket aces. And so, yeah, that. That never hurts.

[Elle]

Decade dude knocked me out.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. With. You had. You had. I don't remember.

[Elle]

Ace, king versus king seven.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Elle]

He hit a seven on the river. I emailed him and I said, did you really just knock me out with. With king seven? And you know what he wrote back. He said, yeah, I Did. But then Joe turned around and knocked me out. Da da, da. Why do. This is a stupid game. That's what he said. So yeah, decade.

[Joe Scales]

We've all been there before. We're all like, I hate this game.

[Elle]

I know.

[Joe Scales]

When's the next one?

[Elle]

I know very. It's very true. It's very true. But congratulations. Now bounty is officially on your head. But that also doubles.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I was gonna say that means.

[Elle]

So we never take. Yeah, we never take anything home. So the usual 50 winning will be a hundred dollars next month. The Bounty goes from 15 to $30 and therefore double bubble trouble something next month.

[Joe Scales]

So if you want to get into the game, now is the time to do it.

[Elle]

Yeah. Patreon.

[Joe Scales]

Five dollars can win you a hundred.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

Or even 30. I mean both of those are if you knock Joe out.

[Elle]

And that's like bragging rights.

[Joe Scales]

Well that's fair.

[Elle]

Knock Joe out.

[Joe Scales]

Somebody even said last night when, when I was the manny, they said as if people weren't trying to knock you out. Anyway. True.

[Elle]

That's fair. And Ben mentioned I still got no points in the leaderboard. We both made some mistakes along the

[Joe Scales]

way and I wonder who's atop of that leaderboard. I wonder if.

[Elle]

Moving on to poker news, there are. Let me tell you, we've got a lot of stuff, a lot of stuff to talk about.

[Joe Scales]

I almost, I almost put the leaderboard behind us.

[Elle]

You did not.

[Joe Scales]

Just instead of this.

[Elle]

You did not. Okay, let's not and say we did. There's a lot of poker news going on. There's a lot of poker adjacent news going on and there's a lot of bet on better. There is like a ton. So within poker news.

[Joe Scales]

But I'm really excited about what.

[Elle]

Well, I'll let you tell them.

[Joe Scales]

The Lodge is reopening.

[Elle]

Yes. 9:00am Mace 26. I'm going to steal your thunder there. Cash games and tournaments are going to resume live stream maybe.

[Joe Scales]

Maybe on the 26th as well. But not, not 100% sure on that.

[Elle]

Yeah. So we are. We've mentioned this for two months in all of our. Most of our table talk conversations. But if you have been following along.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, it's, it's exciting news. Exciting for, for the staff that gets to come back. I don't, you know, hopefully they were able to bring everybody back. But yeah, it's just, we were just tickled.

[Elle]

Tickled to be able to say that.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. What a crazy turn of events from you know, the raid all the way to. Oh, never mind. Here you go. Your money Back and.

[Elle]

Yeah, but what did I say?

[Joe Scales]

Now they're opening.

[Elle]

Patience. Yeah, patience. Until all of the info comes out. I think the hardest part of some of these, like, CSI shows, and I keep thinking, like, something blue.

[Joe Scales]

Nypd.

[Elle]

Yes. All of these things.

[Joe Scales]

I don't know. I just made that up.

[Elle]

Yeah. We get a resolution in an hour. We get to find out about what happened.

[Joe Scales]

Sure.

[Elle]

Go through the whole investigation. Da, da, da. And now we're like, you mean we have to wait weeks, maybe months to get to the bottom of this? The lodge is back. We're excited. In other news, there's some conversations and debate.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I was going to say, were you trying to skirt around the word

[Elle]

debate around this new WSOP dealer rating?

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. I'm curious about what you think about this, because I know what I think from a. From a player standpoint, but you're, You're. You're newer to the game than I am, so I'm, I'm curious to see what you think of it.

[Elle]

Well, I can't say that I haven't. I have lots of thoughts, but some of those, I'll just be frank and straightforward. They've been influenced by the things I've been seeing on social media and some of the other, you know, podcasts that I've watched. Poker News puts on a really great podcast with Chad Holloway. He dives into subjects with Mike Holtz, Jeff Madsen, and their podcast number, 964. I think it's cool that they have those numbers. I like that Jeff, Mike and Chad dive into this subject. And so that's probably the most recent thing in my mind. Number one, when I heard it, I thought, if dealers can be rated, then players should be able to be rated, and that should be taken into account. However, I know that that is a massive undertaking, but it would be really nice if other players are saying to players or dealers are saying about players, like, this really is an issue.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

You know, the number of times I've had to call the floor, the number of times that play has been interrupted, the number of times I've caught them on their phone, the number of times, whatever. Right. If they're stopping play or being disrespectful, then that can be noted. But I also understand, after watching, is it Jeff Clapp and him introducing. The idea of this is, I think what the WSOP is really trying to do is get to the bottom of, like, what's happening with dealers throughout the series, because so many people are being brought in and so many different tables and games. Are being dealt. So I think, I think they're trying, but I'm concerned.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

And I understand that that's one of the biggest complaints we've heard over the years. And we haven't covered the World Series nearly as much as some of the other people outlets.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

But the common thread is the dealers haven't had training. They come in and they just are thrown to the wolves.

[Elle]

Or the training that they do have is very basic. It's virtual. It does not actually put them in the live setting. Doesn't review anything. So in considering and thinking about these topics and listening to other people, you know, Jeff Madsen said most dealers get better as the series goes on.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elle]

If you pay attention, his opinion is he would like to see credits given, not demerits.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Elle]

Like, here's the positive. Hey, awesome, awesome, awesome. You can pretty much judge based on that. Mike has a whole different idea. He, he, he was very funny in saying I give a one or a five star rating. You don't get an in between. So like I, I would like to come to the series with perfect dealers and they should all be getting fives. But he doesn't agree this is a great idea either. He's like, what about just like a comment card? Because it gives you more data.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

It gives you actual things that, that, let's say they take it. What is a, what does a five star mean? You know, or what does a one star mean? How can a dealer get true feedback and improve as a dealer if they're getting 1 stars and they don't know what it's reflecting?

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. That's 100% true. And, and I mean, I've been in marketing my whole life. Right. So I've dealt with this rating system with businesses all the time.

[Elle]

Right.

[Joe Scales]

So from that standpoint, I understand. But I also see those ratings come in. I've seen ratings come in because we were confused with another business, so.

[Elle]

Exactly.

[Joe Scales]

You've got to make sure that was that the dealer that even did that. You know, maybe there was a dealer change and you're confusing who did what.

[Elle]

Lots of things can, can possibly go sideways. The, the one thing that I think they're trying to address and, and I, I would love to have a conversation with Mike Holtz about this because I thought he brought up a really good point, is let's get to the root of this, which is how the WSOP hires and trains their employees. And, and I'm like, have so many ideas, I don't even want to share them because I'm wondering if I could craft something by next year, if it would be a huge undertaking. But, you know, I've been in education and training my entire professional life, and I have so many ideas of how to improve this process and make it a much better experience for people who are coming to the World Series of Poker, spending their money, taking their time off, and expecting to get what they see at their home, casino or better. And then they're devastated by their experience.

[Joe Scales]

Well, I will say this. My thought, whenever people were complaining about the dealers in the past, my thought was, well, okay, the, the WSOP doesn't have the time nor money to throw into training everybody because you have a lot of dealers coming in.

[Elle]

Right.

[Joe Scales]

And so they, they can't take the time to train each one of them to this nth degree. Right. But you just spend a ton of money. Yep. Developing a rating system for these dealers. So I would have rather seen that money spent in the training rather than the, oh, you get this many stars.

[Elle]

Right. And I can see, I can see both sides. I can see how the WSOP is like, we need feedback from the horse's mouth.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

We need feedback from the people who are sitting in front of these dealers and who are receiving cards from these dealers. Right. Because the WSOP can't be everywhere all the time. They cannot. I wouldn't want them to go to the extreme of like, you have a monitor at a table who's monitoring every single thing that goes on in note taking. Right.

[Joe Scales]

It's like the hall monitor, only at your table.

[Elle]

Yeah, exactly. Because nobody, nobody performs to the best of their ability when they feel like somebody's breathing down their neck. So even excellent dealers would probably feel like I'm going to make a mistake because somebody's watching every single thing I'm doing. Right.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

So I think WSOP is trying to hear directly from the source. I think they could do a better job at what data they're asking for. And then I want to know, what are they doing afterwards.

[Joe Scales]

That's a fair point.

[Elle]

So how are you? It sounds like we want to incentivize people who are doing a great job. Fantastic. I'm all for it. I love getting a bonus once a year. I love it if I've met my goals and whatever. I mean, we're going on vacation with that bonus money. Right. But at the same time, if you're a low performer, you need to know how to improve should you want to. And that's bottom line. What, what I would like to have a conversation about. And get to the. And get fixed.

[Joe Scales]

I will say this, too. And we can. I know we're, we're harping on the, the subject, but it's a big deal. I will also say that usually if you get incentives, you want to do better anyway. If somebody. Even if it's just recognition.

[Elle]

Right.

[Joe Scales]

You know, that kind of stuff makes you want to do better. So from that standpoint, who was it, Jeff, you said made the point about wanting to give people recognition rather than demerits? Yeah, I think that from that standpoint, that's, that's true. I would rather see somebody than people. I would rather see people saying, yeah, this is great. You're doing a great job. Here. Here's. Here's some pieces you can improve on. You know, as long as we're. We're putting them together, fine. I want to see people improve, but here's how to get better.

[Elle]

Right.

[Joe Scales]

You know, and here's where you're doing a great job. So that's the.

[Elle]

That's my thoughts also really quick. And we do not have to go down a deep, dark rabbit hole about this.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, Lord.

[Elle]

But in watching episode 964, Chad Holloway brought up that the TDA summit is going to be discussing another potential whammy, which is ban on headphones at the tables.

[Joe Scales]

Like, across the board.

[Elle]

Like, okay, now, the reason. It sounds like, and I've not done a ton of research, but the reason for this is technology is improving and improving and improving. Much like the Ray Ban sunglasses.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, yeah.

[Elle]

With the camera. I mean, we got recorded in Arizona and had no idea. And somebody put it out on their social media that they had met us and whatever. And we're like, whoa, now we have to start paying attention right now.

[Joe Scales]

Apparently they didn't even get my best side.

[Elle]

I know. Well, same. That's what I was thinking, too. Like, whoa, at least give a girl a heads up.

[Show Announcer]

Right?

[Elle]

You know, but there it's. What's worrisome is technology is growing and expanding and changing as it always has, and cameras are now going to be in earbuds, which I don't know why you need a camera in your ear.

[Joe Scales]

I was going to say, I don't.

[Elle]

But it's some. It's something coming down the pike as a possibility or maybe already in development. And so they're concerned about,

[Joe Scales]

well, what are.

[Elle]

What could happen, you know?

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. So they're basically saying for the same reasons as not allowing people to have their, their phones at the table, you know, or whatever. I don't know that it Gets to the point of ridiculous at some point, right. Like you can't have this, you can't have that, you can't have this, you can't have that. And um, people like me or you or the everyday poker player, we're going to the table and we're like, I just want to go and have fun.

[Elle]

Yeah. But I will say this. I, I, I was never a college or pro soccer player.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Elle]

But I did play in high school and every high school game, especially as the captain of our team, we had to line up and be checked and checked for what? And it took no time whatsoever because female players, we all had like clips and stuff. You weren't allowed to have any metal on your head. So you couldn't have bobby pins, you couldn't have metal on your hair tie, you couldn't have anything. Right. They check heads, they check arms to see if you have any bracelets or jewelry. They check ears for earrings. And then you all turn around and you pick up your left cleat and then you put your, put it down and you pick up your right cleat and put it down to make sure you don't have metal on your cleats.

[Joe Scales]

Sure.

[Elle]

And it is standard and we all knew and it was something we all did. And so it's like if you know that you show up to the poker room at check in or at the table quick.

[Joe Scales]

Check for cameras.

[Elle]

For cameras or for whatever. I don't know. I mean, random inspections. Yeah. It's one more thing. But long story short, it's up for discussion. Let's stay tuned like we did with the lodge. I'm not trying to cause alarm or concern, especially the folks that we know that run the TDA summit. We certainly respect the hard work and effort that you put in to make sure that the rules are the same everywhere because that's what we expect as poker players. I just think it's interesting that they are starting to look into it and will look forward to what decision is being made. Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

And the summit this year. I don't remember what the dates are. I have to find those. But I know that mass been promoting it. Matt Savage has been promoting it pretty hard.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

It's going to be at the Poker Go studios, I believe. And so we'll have to wait to

[Elle]

see what they come up with. And maybe they don't make a decision this year. Maybe it's just, it's a discussion I do that somehow people found out about.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. And I do, I do like that they have these Discussions. Yeah. They bring these, these points to light. Anybody that has issues is able to, to submit, you know, their, their concerns

[Elle]

and well, it's for the health and the well being of the game. So let's look at it. No decision's been made. I just. Part of me is sad that we have to look at it.

[Joe Scales]

That's exactly right.

[Elle]

Do you know what I mean?

[Joe Scales]

That's exactly right. Yeah. I feel like it's going to be to the point where when people are walking up the, the, out of the poker room, they're going to get the check like they do off the baseball

[Elliot Schechter]

field with the glove.

[Elle]

See, it happens in professional sports. I'm saying like they're, they're. Some of this stuff has evolved over time. We've got to do it anyways. Poker adjacent news. Okay, please humor me because I'm super excited.

[Joe Scales]

Okay. What is this?

[Elle]

You know, social. I'm on social. I know I'm on socials. And Dan Weinman.

[Joe Scales]

Oh.

[Elle]

Posted two images and I was like this looks cool.

[Joe Scales]

The, the main event winner in from 2023.

[Elle]

Yeah. I want, I still want one of his shirts. It was a wine glass and the guy. It's the emojis from your iPhone. Wineman. I really, really wanted one of those. Anyhow. What. I'm assuming investing some of his winnings, I don't know, in something pretty wild and exciting.

[Joe Scales]

What is it?

[Elle]

So he is now the co founder and chief game designer at RF Labs.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Elle]

The founder is, I hope I'm pronouncing your name correctly, Manit Madden. And these two have come together to build some incredible stuff for the poker community. Not to mention a social card lounge in Alpharetta, Georgia.

[Joe Scales]

Okay. When you say social card lounge it

[Elle]

is like imagine sports bar with card rooms slash karaoke slash throwback. Like you go in to a sports bar.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

But you can also reserve a space to play a social card game with your friends.

[Joe Scales]

Well, I noticed you're saying card game, not poker. So there's like all kinds of different games.

[Elle]

Yeah. So. So I would love to invite. Maybe I'll try to reach out to Dan and see and if you're listening, Dan, we'd love to have you tell us more about this. He has created games that he are labeled Ace Face, which is like blackjack Chain reaction, which is similar to Uno Pass the trash which people have to pass there. I love this. They have to pass their, their hands around. Card mafia. Did you play mafia in college?

[Joe Scales]

No.

[Elle]

Ooh. Danger. Danger. Drinking game associated. We'll Skip right over that ladder up, which is like bs.

[Joe Scales]

I played that.

[Elle]

Okay.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Elle]

Spoons. You know, you play spoons, whatever. So there isn't a spoons, but Heartbeat is an innovative spin on spades and hearts. And then there also is a game called Showdown, which is similar to Texas hold'.

[Elliot Schechter]

Em.

[Joe Scales]

Okay, so they do have a. A poker aspect in there.

[Elle]

Yes. Now, no chips, no money. Okay, maybe chips that equal points.

[Joe Scales]

Sure.

[Elle]

But is not equitable bragging rights? Yes, exactly.

[Joe Scales]

So this is like, next round's on the loser. Yes.

[Elle]

So this is. This is like, I want to have a cool date experience. I want to get the group out of the chat. I want to have a birthday party. I just want to host a social event where I don't have to do anything, because guess what? In that room that you reserve, there's a host. They do everything for you. You just show up and have fun. You can have drinks delivered, food delivered, all the things. You can go out and hang out at the bar afterwards. I'm telling you, like, this can be. This is going. This concept is going to be really exciting to watch as they. They just opened yesterday. They did the river.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, really?

[Elle]

Well, I think they opened maybe a soft launch, but the ribbon cutting was yesterday.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Elle]

Manic Mondays, karaoke. Tuesdays, wine win derful. Wednesdays, throwback. Thursdays, Friday, they just let it be. It's whatever. It ends up happening.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Elle]

Saturday, they have live music or DJs, and then their brunch on Sundays is coming. Tell me that that is not fun. Go ahead.

[Joe Scales]

I think this is great because the social games that we play right now are on your phone. Yeah, on the. You know, this is taking it away and actually making people be in person. And I love that.

[Elle]

Right?

[Joe Scales]

And.

[Elle]

And like me, when we have a home game, I'm worried about snacks.

[Bus Driver PSA Speaker]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Trash can. Does everybody have a space? Where's everybody gonna park? Because we don't have a huge space for people to park. How do I tell people to park down here and walk up here? What about if we run out of food? None of that is a concern. Now. Guess how many of our friends would show up to this because it's at no one's house. Yeah, we all get to go have a good time. Somebody else is leading it and telling us the rules. There's no nitpick like, wait, you didn't tell me that. I mean, how many times that happened in our family?

[Joe Scales]

We get halfway through, oh, I forgot to tell you.

[Elle]

And no. And it's not even just with my family it's with our family when our kids play, who does that create a whole mess. When you have another rule that shows up, whatever, I'm going to be silly and say show then them some love. Showdown.com and showdown showdown.com Alpharetta, Georgia I think it's like north of Atlanta, but there's your poker adjacent social news. In addition to that, Bluffers poker. We love Eric Morris and Mike. Leah, thank you so so much for everything you're doing this week. This community is awesome. The way they celebrate their players, player profiles are like anything but boring around here. Eric is a master at really getting to know people and also introducing them to one another. It's very interactive. There are 39 satellites going on that get you into the $325 satellite on Monday, May 18th. Okay, what are you playing for? You're playing for a $3,500 package onto our Alaskan cruise in August means it's

[Joe Scales]

more than just paying for the cruise. That could be air, air flight tickets.

[Elle]

Yes.

[Joe Scales]

That means you have some spending, spending money on the, on the ship or in San Francisco. You know, go see the town for a little bit.

[Elle]

I would hope that they'd be using it for entries into tournaments, but sure. But anyhow, you've got $3,500 to reserve a room however you want. So if it's single and you need to find somebody to go with you, if it's a double occupancy, that can cover it. You can put the left over to whatever you need which is airlines entries. Having fun. Okay, so here's the bottom line. If you hear nothing other than this, it's one in 10. So however many they have participating, we already have seven qualifiers. One in 10 of you are going to win a $3,500 package. We're going to work with you immediately, I believe on Tuesday to find out what kind of booking do you want. We're going to get you in touch with poker player cruises. Knock that out and we'll see you on the ship. So if this is something you're interested in. $35 satellites are going on all weekend to get into Monday, which is the final satellite. I think this, this weekend is called step two. Step ones were earlier and I think they're $5 or maybe you can play those anytime. Step twos are more scheduled. $39 and the final satellite is Monday. Go to our socials, check it out. There's a whole post about it. It's on our website as well. Scroll to the Bottom click on bluffers. Please, please, please. Check it out.

[Joe Scales]

And then there's some bet on better stuff going on.

[Elle]

Yeah. We cannot go into June without mentioning two opportunities, and they're in very different places. So Chicagoland area Gaming for Green. It's the party of the summer, man. Thursday, June 11th at 5:30 at Galleria Marchetti. 2:25 buy in.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, the early bird, it's gone.

[Elle]

He's already gotten the worm. So sorry for you, but.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, but it's going to be amazing. Still, 225 is not bad.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

Like, because they're not. They're not just poker. You want to go and, you know, maybe the couple goes and one plays blackjack and one plays poker. Maybe you both jump into poker. Maybe you bust out of the poker and go play blackjack. Like, there's so much to do. They have all kinds of casino games, so.

[Elle]

Well, I also, in checking out that pricing, if you go for five, it's 700. So if you have five friend, you and four other friends that want to go, you can save some cash and pay 700 bucks instead of the 225 each. So that's. That's a possibility. Right. And then also, just a slight difference between Gaming for Green and Camp One Step, they're both located in the same place.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Two different causes. Okay. So Gaming for Green is green spaces in Chicago. And also they have an after party, which is a little different than Camp One Step. Camp One Step goes late, late, late, late, late into the night. This one starts a little earlier. And so they're going to Celeste as their afterparty. And I just think that's important to mention because the fun continues after the poker tournament. If you want to leave, if you get knocked out and you want to go to the after party, you don't have to hang around. You get it? Sounds like to me you can just go to the after party, too.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, cool.

[Elle]

I think that's.

[Joe Scales]

So Celeste is like a whole different place. Like, it's a whole.

[Elle]

It's like a whole club, social club, bar, whatever. So you don't want to hang there. You can go to Celeste. Your. Your wristband gets you in for free.

[Joe Scales]

Nice.

[Elle]

I think that's really. I really think it's a really cool opportunity.

[Joe Scales]

So $225 gets you a lot.

[Elle]

A lot. Yeah, a lot, a lot. And you're supporting a great cause. The other one that we cannot go into June without mentioning is the Rhino Rumble.

[Joe Scales]

Okay, say more.

[Elle]

Matt Savage is going to be the master of ceremonies. So microphone man's gonna be doing what he does best. This is a really cool. It is Sunday, June 28, at the Sterling Club in Vegas. It's poker. We call it bet on better. They call it poker for a purpose.

[Joe Scales]

I like that too, though.

[Elle]

I do, too. I do too. It has a nice ring to it. Um, they focus on rescue, rehabilitation. I'm reading this, to be sure. Protection of endangered wildlife and habitats. And they do this through all sorts of partnerships. They do it through education, nonprofits, you name it. Sounds like they're involved in it. Um, Shannon Elizabeth is hosting this. Matt Savage is master of ceremonies. But poker pro Matt Stout is going to be curating the festivities. So their early bird is still available until May 31st.

[Joe Scales]

Matt Stout has the charity series of Poker. And so.

[Elle]

Okay, see? Fantastic.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. So that's perfect for him. Yeah, I love it.

[Elle]

It's a. It's a great combination. But early. Early bird is May 31, and you get an additional 5,000 chips if you want to join in on that.

[Joe Scales]

So where is that one?

[Elle]

Sterling Club in Vegas.

[Joe Scales]

In Vegas. Okay.

[Elle]

It looks like a really cool opportunity.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

I just think the wide variety of causes and people that you can support through poker is just continuing to grow. And we're always going to mention that.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. And I. I do love how, like you said, it's just continues to expand and expand and expand, and I think people are starting to realize that you can use poker for some really good things. So I'm. I'm happy to see that.

[Elle]

Yeah. We look forward to hearing your results and. And all the things that you're able to do that comes out of the poker games that you guys are hosting. So last but not least, I feel like we're running a marathon today. So many things to chat about. But I have partnered with another brand as an ambassador. I've been a comforter, a comfort clothing ambassador for almost a year, maybe a year and a half. So if you see that in our magazine or on our link tree, what does that mean? Just get a code for extra percent off. Comfort clothing is all about supporting mental health, which it is Mental Health Awareness Month. So I definitely want to mention them, but I just signed on with a new brand.

[Joe Scales]

Okay. I. I've seen this. So I've gotten a sneak peek of this. It's kind of cool.

[Elle]

And it's called Poor Caddy. P O U R C A D D Y. Okay. So I want you to think all things stainless steel tumblers.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Elle]

Okay. But so completely reimagined.

[Joe Scales]

Reimagined how reimagined.

[Elle]

Nerd alert. If you like. If you like cups or tumblers or customized things. I cannot wait to get this in the mail. Okay. It is three simple things. Drink, pour, chill. Drink, pour, drink pour, and chill. Okay, so drinking from a tumbler, they have a small tumbler or a large tumbler, which everybody has a preference. Okay. But. But this is where the customization comes in. They have attachments on the bottom that are coasters, they are lights that give you like a ten foot radius. So just imagine campground.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Or around the fire this summer with the kids. Or wherever you're going, you have a light. I'm gonna have my beverage while we walk the dog. And I don't have to have a flashlight and my beverage. And the leash. Poor caddy. Okay. I'm just telling you. Bluetooth speaker.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, that's cool.

[Elle]

And USB charging station.

[Joe Scales]

So I think whoever has invented this has had lots of evening with friends. Like, or children they've thought about.

[Elle]

Or children. Or they like to be social and be able to have their stuff. This is where I'm like, this is sort of like the Swiss army knife of tumblers.

[Joe Scales]

Yes.

[Elle]

Okay. Like it. Truly.

[Joe Scales]

That's exactly right.

[Elle]

You can. And you can change these things in and out. Right. So the space fits anything you want. You don't, you don't even have to have one if you don't. If you just want the tumbler, fine. Okay, so that's the, that's the drink part. The poor part is imagine new tumbler.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Okay. With a very small pour spout. Fits a whole bottle of wine. And as you pour it, it aerates. Do you know one of them says on the, on the side, corks are for quitters?

[Joe Scales]

I just, I was just getting that. I saw.

[Elle]

And which I'm not encouraging anyone to drink an entire bottle of wine by themselves. That is not what I'm saying. However, you can put an entire bottle of wine and share it. If that's not your jam.

[Joe Scales]

This whole conversation made me thirsty.

[Elle]

I know. If that is not your jam, they have another tumbler that's like split in half. This holds your beverage. I mean, you. Whatever you want. Okay, so liquor, a mixed drink, lemonade. I don't care what you want to share. It doesn't matter. The bottom portion. Okay. Unscrews immediately your highball glass.

[Joe Scales]

What?

[Elle]

Shut.

[Joe Scales]

I didn't even see that one.

[Elle]

Shut up. Yes, unscrews. If you are like, oh, I just want to share some of this with my friends. And you want to pour shots. 4 shot glasses fit in that bad boy. So you unscrew that and you have. You can share everything. Well, the Swiss army knife of tumblers. Okay, now the chill part is they also have these that, that, like the ones we've ordered a bajillion times where you put your soda, your beer, your sparkling water. It keeps it cold. Cans and bottles that will fit. That's the chill part. Tell me, tell me that is not phenomenal.

[Joe Scales]

Right? Yeah, they thought of everything. Okay, I like your. Your phrase. The Swiss army knife of Tumblrs tumblers.

[Elle]

Okay, they are going to, I think, just take off because they're going to be on the Today Show May 20. On Wednesday, there's a segment called Jill Steals and Deals. And if you are a Today show watcher, they're going to be on May 20th. And I just feel like they're just going to take off. Okay, so. And I'm also mentioning this now because I have a code. I have a code. Ante up. Literally all caps. A, N T E U P gets you an additional 15% off. I just went on last night. There's tons of stuff that's 50% off already.

[Joe Scales]

So you get 15% off of.

[Elle]

As far as I know. Yes, as far as I know. You can stack, you can stack that code on top of items that are already on sale.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Elle]

If you are like, oh my gosh, El, you're asking me to do a lot. Find poor caddy.com and put in a code, whatever, you should just be able to use the link on our link tree and it should show up in your basket. So what am I saying? Poor Caddy is, is. Is the newest, exciting. So they're humbler in our life.

[Joe Scales]

They're a fairly new company then.

[Elle]

I think so, yeah, it sounds like it. I've never heard of them before. Our stuff is arriving, I believe next week. So maybe next week you'll actually get to see the. I wish I had it with me, but it just hadn't been delivered yet. So I didn't want to go into next week without saying anything, let you guys know about it. We have, per usual with our family crew, birthday parties galore and tons of things to get ready for. So as always, Joe, it's a pleasure being around the table with you.

[Joe Scales]

Likewise.

[Show Announcer]

Elliot's wisdom cut like a blade. Dropping true bombs with a poker parade. Big blinds, big stakes. Raise it up. Let's make no.

[Joe Scales]

Elliot Schechter joins us each week to say how he would run situations that come up in your games, and he's with us again this week. Elliot, how's it going?

[Elliot Schechter]

Things are going pretty nicely, thanks. How are you doing today?

[Joe Scales]

I'm. I'm really good, but Colby Wyatt sent in this week's Call the Floor, and he asked a question. We got to talking about some. Some different pieces. We really kind of talking about the last week's one outer. And then it led into a question. He asked me if I was a messy desk or clean desk. And it came up because we were talking about the way people stack their chips at the table and how you can tell a lot about somebody's play by the way they stack their chips. So he asked me if I was a messy desk or a clean desk guy, and I told him I'm kind of a messy desk, but I'm just the opposite at the table. My chips are always stacked exactly. You know, if they're 20 high, they are neat. They're probably. I probably play with them too much to make sure that they're in exactly the right order that I want, but that's not the way my desk turns out. But I told him I would ask you as well. Are you. Are you messy desk or clean desk?

[Elliot Schechter]

I'm generally a messy desk guy, and I say generally because every. I guess, about two to three weeks, I see my messy desk, and it bothers me, and then I clean it up, and. And then, of course, it gets messy again because I'm working on several things at once, and then I clean up again. So, yeah, I'd say I generally veer towards messy desk, as the people who have worked with me for most of my career will attest to.

[Joe Scales]

And I think that's what it all comes down to. Right.

[Show Announcer]

We're.

[Joe Scales]

We're.

[Elliot Schechter]

Me.

[Elle]

We're.

[Joe Scales]

We're working on so many different things all at once that it's. It's all of the things out there on the desk. So. So there you go, Colby. How did. Well, how does that translate into your chips? Are your chips, you know, stacked right and whatever? Are they kind of all over the place?

[Elliot Schechter]

As. As somebody who obviously operates poker rooms, I. I. When I sit at the table and play, in the rare occasions when I actually do that, I try to set the example. I keep my chips very neatly and. And very readable and stacked correctly, separated by color. And, of course, the biggest chips most visible and most easily seen by anybody else.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, that was the most floor answer ever. Well, let's jump into Colby's. Call the floor. He says, I've got a weird one from a local 12 home game. We've had a lot of home game questions lately. I like that. That's for sure. We're down to six players, he says, and the action folds around to the cutoff, who opens to $15. The small blind calls, and the big blind grabs a single $25 chip and says raise while tossing it into the middle. The dealer stops and asks what he is raising to. The big blind is fairly new to live poker and has been taking a long time to figure out his bet sizing. And he says, I guess he's used to the computer doing all that for him. Before he answers what his raise amount is, another player at the table who's not even in the hand apparently says, how about $60? And the big blind points at the player and says, yeah, $60. This small blind speaks up. The small blind speaks up and tells the other player that it's one player to a hand and that he cannot influence action by declaring an amount. He put in one chip that is over $15, so he should be able to make it. He should only be able to make it a min raise. The big blind argues that he verbally declared raise, so it should be any amount he wants it to be. So, Elliot, the question to you is saying raise without an amount and putting out a chip that is over the current bet, sizing enough for this player to give the big blind all of their options. Or is it only allowed to be a men raise? And then because we all seem to be infatuated with punishment of players, he asks what sort of punishment should the player that's not in the hand receive as well?

[Elliot Schechter]

It's not punishment so much as consequences.

[Joe Scales]

Yes.

[Elliot Schechter]

Which may be a distinction without a difference. Now, let's talk about the race first, because that's obviously the most important question.

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Elliot Schechter]

The days of just throwing your call or placing your call in the pot and then cogitating and engaging a reaction from your other players before you place your rays in the pot, those days are done. So it's generally been accepted, especially in tournaments. It's actually written into the rules. But in cash games, too, if you throw out a chip and say raise, your raise is generally limited to the amount of that chip. So in this case, that chip doesn't represent a complete raise, because obviously 25 is not 30. So in this particular case, having announced raise in turn, they would have to make the smallest available raise based on the chips they've already placed in the pile. So obviously a min raise is in order. Here they don't get to decide. A string bet is when you start moving your chips into the pot and then basically stop and gauge reaction from the players who are supposed to act after you. It's not just making two bets or three bets or, or placing a bet after you've already placed a bet that's making two bets. People very, very commonly and almost all the time mistake that for a string bet. It's not classically a string bet. You're just making two actions. You only get one bet per turn. A string bet is when you try to string your opponent along until they give you some information on which to act and then you act on that information.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elliot Schechter]

So by placing a call in the pot when your intention is to raise, you are stringing. That is a string bet. And that's why we changed the rule to make things more fair and to expedite the game. So that was all a long way of saying that yes, they were limited to what the chip was. If they had thrown in a hundred dollar chip they wouldn't be able to bet 2 or 300. They their raise was to a total of 100. The the 15 plus the 85. So the principle applies for a smaller chip like a quarter chip. So yeah. Now let's get to the other issue. The other player suggesting what he should bet one player to a hand is pretty important concept for the game and is not merely a recommendation or a suggestion. There's no team entries except in designated team tournaments. And even then the individual players are supposed to play as individuals and not as, as partners while in a hand, right? Yeah, most of the time. So yeah, some consequence should be meted out. As this is a home game, it all depends on how you want to get your point across. If it's a deal, your own game and everybody passes the deal every hand, I would certainly make this player deal for any number of rounds to get the message across that he should be paying attention and following the rules. And by putting him in a spot of enforcing the rules on the other players more readily by being in charge of the deal, that point will be made. If this is one of those home games that is a little more sophisticated and has dealers brought in, having this guy sit out for a round or two would get the point across that breaking, breaching etiquette, especially in a matter of such importance, is not going to be ignored or accepted. So I leave it to your discretion. I certainly don't want you alienating players, but you obviously do see a need to enforce the right rules. At the right time. And I, I completely agree with that. And I, I think that needs to be done. So all I can do is offer suggestions here. I certainly don't want you to bar the guy unless he's habitually doing this all the time, in which case you're probably better off without them. But that doesn't appear to be the case based on the narrative. Although who knows, maybe that detail was not placed in there.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I want to go Back to the $25 chip too, because it seems like that's significant as well. Because. And you'll have to remind me exactly what this rule is, but there's something about if it's over half of the.

[Elliot Schechter]

That's when you state a number, then it has to be. Okay, that's when you state a number. If you, if somebody, if the blinds are. Are 2 and 4 or let's say 1 and 2 and somebody places a $500 chip in the pot and says 5 without actually clarifying whether it was 5 or 500. The rules are basically to say, well, you just made it $5, congratulations, based on the blinds and the reasonable. And the reasonable amount to be expected would be 5, not 500. So that might be the principle to which you're, you're referring.

[Joe Scales]

Well, I was thinking about the, the over half of the over half of the bet or what the blind or whatever. In this case, then it would be a raise versus that's placing multiple chips in the pot.

[Elliot Schechter]

This was, this was a placement of a single chip and it was a declaration of race. So those combined to lead us to a bet of the size of the chip, in which case that would still not be a full race. So we would have to bring it up to the minimum amount to raise. Yeah. If you're placing multiple chips in the pot, say the bet is six and somebody placed ten in the pot, ten chips, ten dollar chips, or even two red chips. They had placed enough in the pot to more than call, but to almost raise. And in a spot like that, they would be brought up to the minimum rate. If the bet was $6 and they placed $8 in the pile, especially eight white chips, they would be forced to draw down to the $6 call because the extra $2 was not half or more of the current that in play. That concept is pretty important. But isn't what happened here because it was obviously a single chip placed.

[Joe Scales]

Right. Not applicable here. Okay, that makes sense. So it sounds like in this case, the min raise is the only option that this guy has. He's not able to do 60 as whoever it is shouted out. And the consequence, as you said, for the other player, there needs to be one for sure.

[Elliot Schechter]

Oh, God, yeah, certainly. And again, one player to a hand is very, very, very important. As individuals cannot beat team entries, it would make the game unplayable and would certainly tilt the odds in the team's favor. So there must be a consequence of some sort.

[Joe Scales]

Right? So that's it. That's a good one. And Colby, I enjoyed the back and forth that we had about the messy and straightened desks as well, but I'll try to get that. Colby, thank you for sending that in. If anyone has a call the floor that they would like to know how Elliot would rule, send it to podcastnetmagazine.com Elliot, thanks for joining us again this week.

[Elliot Schechter]

Ah, you're welcome.

[Joe Scales]

Glad to.

[Show Announcer]

In this hand might be his last.

[Joe Scales]

Welcome to Hand of the Week, where Patrick, our resident fish and I dive into listener submitted hands each week. We tackle everything from questionable bluffs to hero calls and the hands that make you scratch your head. Whether you're looking for strategy tips or you just want to see if you would have played it any better, we've got you covered. Patrick, how's it going, man?

[Patrick]

Another week, man. I'm, I'm good. You know, we're, we're surviving. All in all, not too shabby.

[Joe Scales]

I literally sat outside and watched that storm last night. It was pretty awesome to, to watch,

[Patrick]

but it was very nice and it got out of here just in time enough for our four and five year olds to play a little T ball and get muddy and I, you know, memories forever. My car is destroyed between the coach is shoes. My shoes, little one. I mean he, they thought it was hilarious. So yeah, kids and mud just go hand in hand, but cars and mud not. So that's, that's the project after work today.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, there's nothing like a Kansas thunderstorm. It's nothing, you know, here it's nothing like that. But, but, you know, I, I do miss those. But it was a, it was a good one to sit out and watch last night. So the good thing of different.

[Patrick]

The good difference between a Kansas thunderstorm and a, and a Virginia thunderstorm is that here, here in Virginia we're not going to wind up end up on the wizard of Oz, you know, with our house being lifted. So. Yeah, I'm good. I'm good.

[Joe Scales]

Fair enough. Fair enough.

[Patrick]

Great movie twister though. The Twister series. And you can, anyone can come at me that the second one wasn't graded too. It was just different. It was, but it was great. The original is always.

[Joe Scales]

I have not watched the second one. The first one was good, but I have not watched the second one good.

[Patrick]

You mean like cinematic classic?

[Joe Scales]

It was. That's a. That's a little green cinematic classic.

[Patrick]

The. I mean, just the people in that movie. I mean, Helen Hull, Helen Phillip Seymour, you know, rest his soul. I mean, just, you know, Seymour Hoffman.

[Joe Scales]

I mean, just.

[Patrick]

God, what a. What a cast. Absolutely amazing. Okay, we can argue that one a different time. Let's play poker.

[Joe Scales]

All right. Our hand of the week this week is sent in by Darren Whitlock, and he says this was a 13 game with a $6 under the gun straddle. The effective stacks were around $400. It was late, the table was loose, and people were definitely in that. I didn't come here to fold mood.

[Patrick]

I like that. Dangerous, but I like it.

[Joe Scales]

Patrick has been in that. That mode in every game he's played so that the fits fits perfect years

[Patrick]

and years and years. So I don't fold it. Where to play?

[Joe Scales]

Darren says I'm in the cutoff with the eight of spades, seven of spades. So the under the gun posted the $6 straddle. Under the gun plus one is a younger, aggressive player who'd been firing all night. I don't know if that means he's been like, firing bullets like he re buying or if that means he's been just aggressive on every street, but he raises to $20. Middle position calls, hijack calls, and it's to us.

[Patrick]

I call. I want to play.

[Joe Scales]

You didn't come here to fold.

[Patrick]

I didn't come here to fold. I don't think I came here to raise with 8, 7 suited. But I want to play. I want to see it.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, it's a fun, speculative hand. It's made for probably this exact type of scenario, I feel like.

[Patrick]

So a raise would have to be really big to get things going. And, you know, we're just not sitting with enough to really.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I definitely don't want to raise. That's what that would be something that I would call fancy play syndrome. Somebody just wants to get in there and. And do some kind of fancy play to raise here. I think that would be the only way that we get a raise. I'll take the cheap price and play in position with a hand that this kind of built for this scenario. So I call as well.

[Elliot Schechter]

Yep.

[Joe Scales]

Darren calls the button folds the small blind, folds the big blind, calls the under the gun straddle calls. So 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6.

[Elliot Schechter]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

Six ways to the flop. Which means there's around $120 in the pot. And the flop comes pretty damn good. King of spades, nine of spades, six of spade.

[Patrick]

Seeing as we're not sitting in Darren's table, I can act like an absolute fool when that hits the board and I could just start laughing and geeking out. Well, just for clarification purposes, we've hit our flash. We have an open ended straight flush draw and we're sitting in the cut off with a bunch of yahoos that are not folding for shit in front of us.

[Joe Scales]

Correct.

[Patrick]

Did I miss anything?

[Joe Scales]

No, I think that's that. That pretty much sums up our, our game right now. It checks to under the gun plus one. Who bets $45. Middle position raises to $125 and the hijack folds.

[Patrick]

Shove.

[Joe Scales]

Okay, yeah, I, I, I, okay, I go back and I'm going back and forth here because yes, we can shove. We can also continue to give them some rope because they're obviously wanting to put some money in here.

[Patrick]

You're right. And as of right now, the only thing, the only thing that's beating us, correct me if I'm wrong, Ace of spades, queen of spades, jack, spades or tennis spades. And they have to have another one in their hand as well.

[Joe Scales]

Correct.

[Patrick]

Okay, continue.

[Joe Scales]

That's why, that's why I'm saying maybe it would be good to give them the rope. Let them, let them hang themselves, so to speak. You know, it's, it is a loose table. They didn't come here to fold. So maybe if we put the money in there, they're going to call anyway.

[Patrick]

Can I play devil's advocate for a second?

[Joe Scales]

Sure.

[Patrick]

What if young aggressive yahoo over, you know, to, to our side here is sitting on the ace of Spades, you know, 10 of hearts, and he's only a spade away. Don't we want to make him pay for it or do you think he's probably going to go in anyway? I mean. Yeah, kind of talking myself out of it. I'm still shoving. I think we're going to catch at least a call.

[Elliot Schechter]

Maybe, maybe more.

[Joe Scales]

Right. I'm just thinking if, if we, if we just call, maybe we get the other guy under the gun plus one to call as well. And if we shove, maybe they fold

[Patrick]

fair.

[Joe Scales]

So I don't know. I can see both sides of this one. This is a tough one. I think I talked to myself into a call because I was going back and forth myself. I don't take issue with a shove here either though.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

Darren says now I'm sitting there with a flopped open ended straight flush draw. Obviously I'm not going anywhere. So I call the blinds and the straddle fold. But under the gun plus one calls three ways to the turn with about $500 in the pot. I don't know what the exact total is. We just have about 500 in the pot and we have about 330 behind. Oh my God. The turn is the tennis spades. Well then we just scored. I hope there's a high hand promotion going on too because the board now reads the king of spades, 9 of spades, 6 of spades, 10 of spades. We have hit the straight flush under the gun plus one checks middle position bets 150.

[Patrick]

Now can we shove? Yeah, okay.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I feel like if we don't raise here then we don't get another penny in the pot. So I'm just going to go ahead and shove here. Darren says now I'm trying to not look too interested because I just made the straight flush and honestly this is where I froze mentally. If I raise, do I lose everybody? If I just call, do I miss value? Could somebody have the ace high flush and refuse to fold? I decide to just call under the gun plus one tanks forever before also calling. Okay, so I'll say this, that tank call probably means Darren made the right choice by just calling because more than likely they would have folded if.

[Patrick]

Yeah, if we win.

[Joe Scales]

So we got them both in here with the call, so there's that. Yeah, the river is the ace of clubs. So the final board, king of spades, nine of spades, six of spades, ten of spades, ace of clubs under the gun plus one checks middle position, immediately jams for about $180. I Hollywood for a little bit and then call under the gun plus one. Snap folds and middle position proudly tables ace of spades, king of diamonds for the nut flush.

[Patrick]

What a hand.

[Joe Scales]

So let's, I assume the question's going to be how could we make sure we. I don't, I don't know.

[Patrick]

Oh, nothing.

[Joe Scales]

Okay, here's the twist. I told the story from the cutoffs perspective, but I was actually the middle position player with ace king. Oops. I wanted to know if the hand sounded as strong to other people as it did to me while I was playing because when he just flatted the turn I complete completely convinced myself he either had a smaller flush or was Terrified of the fourth spade. So.

[Patrick]

So let me make this. My, My. My head's in a pretzel, too. So Darren is actually the middle position.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, Darren is actually the middle position player. And he's trying to figure out if there was any way basically that he could have not lost all of his money.

[Patrick]

Absolutely not. You have the nut flush. It was played well by the cutoff, I. E. Joe and Patrick. Yeah, you're going to lose every single time there unless you just. Yeah, no, there's no just. You have the nut flush. There's no way the way that that's played. You make them out to have the straight flush.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I mean, even if I think there's a chance that he has a straight flush, then I'm not folding here. So he also says my question to you guys. He has a few of them, so let's take him one by one. Once the fourth spade hits, should the straight flush ever raise the turn or is calling the best way to keep action alive? All right, so we definitely shoved there. So, But I. I do think that by not raising, they got paid a little bit more than we would have.

[Patrick]

So, yeah, I would have definitely not been paid as much playing that hand. I mean, obviously I was ready to shove pretty early. You definitely don't get the under under the gun plus one to. To call. I mean, he snap folds and had already tanked on the turn. So you're probably losing out there.

[Joe Scales]

They, like I said, they made more money because they just called. I don't have a problem with the raise there. Obviously, that's the direction I went. In your case, the ace high flush, you have to call either way, the raise or not. The raise question is all about the under the gun plus one player, not us. So, yeah, I think he made the right play. But for our hand, it doesn't matter. We're in there no matter what. Did the river shove from middle position make sense or is that lighting money on fire once called? So I feel like the shove there is pretty standard. We got unlucky against the straight flush. I'm going broke in that hand if they shove right. So, yeah, if they. If we. If it checks to them, they're shoving. So either way we go broke in the hand.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

So it's the same result, just a

[Elliot Schechter]

different road to get there.

[Joe Scales]

Then he says, finally, and most importantly, if you flop or turn a monster like a straight flush, how do you balance getting value versus completely killing the action?

[Patrick]

Well, in this instance, and Darren, you're not going to like to Hear it. You really hope that middle position has the nut flush.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Patrick]

Because then you're going to catch a lot of value. I mean, this is a perfect storm. I mean, you know, this is, you got young, aggressive, you know, yahoo at under the gun plus one who was probably in it longer than he should have been. You've got unfortunately middle position with Darren's got the nut flush. You know, the cutoff literally couldn't have drawn this up any better.

[Joe Scales]

Right. Typically I would say a slow play approach in, in a situation like this in 13 is a mistake. So when you make the nuts, you build the pot and kind of if you build it, they will come kind of thing. Right.

[Patrick]

We're on a lot of movie references today, by the way, you know.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Patrick]

Twister. You got George Clooney in the Perfect Storm. Yeah. Costner and Field of Dreams.

[Joe Scales]

Man, I like this.

[Patrick]

All right.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. Yeah. This slow playing usually misses value or it allows for some really bad beats. But that said, in this case, it actually was a good play, uh, because he knew he had you on the hook. Apparently he was just trying to reel in that under the gun plus one player as well.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

These situations are rare, so you have to make the mo the max that you can when they show up. And it's a tricky, the game's a tricky spot to do that. You have to know your table a little bit. I think a lot of that comes into play there.

[Patrick]

But, but again, and, and you know, I, I have had issues with this and at times is okay. So let's go back to the cutoffs point of view. If Darren at middle position doesn't have the nut flush, let's say he's got the, you know, the 10, you know, well, the 10 came out. Let's say he's got the jack, the jack of spades.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Patrick]

It, you know, I think that gets played a little bit different. I think he, you know, you've got things that can beat you on not, you know, not the eight of spades, seven of spades, the straight flush. There's other cards out there, including that, that can beat you. I just think again, this was just the perfect storm. And it happens from time to time. It's just one of those, you can't, you know, there's not, but so much. I, I don't think, I mean, you could have played this hand a hundred times and I find it very unlikely that in as middle position you'll bust. I, I, I really don't think so. So sometimes you're just up against it.

[Joe Scales]

I don't, Yeah, I don't. All of that is to say you didn't play it poorly, even.

[Patrick]

No.

[Joe Scales]

Even if they played this hand faster, you're not folding. So it just is what it is. But Darren, that's, that's awesome. I, I, I hate that that was the case.

[Elliot Schechter]

Right.

[Joe Scales]

You know, for you. But you have to be a marvel when you see a straight flush at your table, period. I'm sure that, I'm sure that the reaction around the table was disbelief. Like, I, I love seeing like that around the table because.

[Elle]

Oh,

[Joe Scales]

yeah, Darren, thanks for sending that in. Thanks for putting our brain and a pretzel by switching it up. And if anyone has a hand of the week that they would like to know how Patrick and I would play it, send it to podcasty. Com. Patrick, we'll see you next week.

[Patrick]

Sounds like a plan.

[Joe Scales]

A fold in the boots.

[Show Announcer]

We're dealing stories that clean poker legends rise on the 18.

[Joe Scales]

One thing we say all the time as poker players is don't play with scared money. Usually we mean, don't sit in a game with money you can't afford to lose, because the second you're emotionally attached to every dollar, your decisions change. You stop playing your game and stop thinking clearly. You really start protecting instead of competing. But scared money isn't always about money. This week, I played in my local home game for the first time in a very long time. And this was a game I used to play in every single week. These are my friends, their familiar faces and comfortable surroundings. It should have felt easy, but before I even walked through the door, I caught myself thinking something dangerous. I just don't want to play badly. On the surface, that sounds reasonable. Of course, nobody wants to play badly. But that wasn't really what I meant. What I meant was I didn't want to look bad. This was a game I'd played in all the time, and I never once thought about looking bad. But I hadn't played there in a long time, and I knew it was going to be a while before I could go back again after that night. So I didn't want to be the guy who talks strategy every week and then goes in there and punts off a stack. It wasn't about the buy in. It was the perception, the fear of embarrassment, the fear of not living up to this image people might have of me. And that is still scared money. Because fear changes decision making no matter what form it takes, right? Maybe we're afraid of losing money, or maybe we're afraid of criticism or looking foolish. Maybe it's failure that we're afraid of. The source changes, the effect doesn't. When you play scared, you stop trusting yourself. Maybe you fold in spots. You should continue or avoid aggression because you're trying not to fail instead of trying to succeed. You spend so much more energy protecting your reputation than you would if you just worked on making good decisions. And honestly, that mindset exists far beyond poker. How many people stay quiet in meetings because they're afraid of sounding dumb? How many people never take a shot at something because they might fail publicly? How many relationships, careers, businesses or dreams get played cautiously because people are terrified of losing what others think of them? That's scared money too. And the weird thing is, the tighter you squeeze trying to avoid failure, the worse you usually perform. Poker's always been funny that way. The game really punishes fear. Now I'm not saying go blast off chips and call it courage. I'm saying you have to get yourself mentally into a place where the outcome doesn't own you before the cards are even dealt. And I had to do that this week before the game even started. I had to remind myself that my job wasn't to impress anybody. My job wasn't to protect some imaginary poker reputation. My job was simply to make good decisions one hand at a time. That's it. Because once you stop worrying about how you'll look if things go wrong, you actually free yourself up to play well. Great players, they're not fearless people. They just understand that fear can't be in charge of the decision making process. That's today's one outer and that's today's show. I'll see you next week. A team. And until then, I'll see you at the tables. The Antioch Podcast is a production of

[Elliot Schechter]

Antioupmagazine.com contact the show at podcastsniopmagazine.com or

[Patrick]

call the show at 540-339-7741.

[Joe Scales]

If you'd like to advertise, send an

[Elliot Schechter]

email to [e-mail]

[Bus Driver PSA Speaker]

I drive my bus in a busy city. That's why road safety is so important to me. I know that I must slow down and be extra careful when I make a wide turn. Buses need more room than cars. Everyone can help keep our roads safe. Next time you're driving, remember to give buses plenty of time and space to finish turning before driving ahead. Let's all plan to share the road safely. Learn how at www.sharetheroadsafely.gov.