Chapter 4 Ep. 19 Incomplete Information

Summary

Ante Up Poker Magazine Podcast

Chapter 4, Episode 19: "Incomplete Information"

Date: May 22, 2026
Host: Joe Scales
Co-hosts: Elle, Patrick
Special Segment Guest: Elliot Scheckter

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Episode Overview

This week’s episode of Ante Up Poker Magazine blends poker news, community updates, and sharp strategic insights with Joe Scales’ signature warmth and humor. The central theme is "Incomplete Information"—how poker and life both force us to make tough calls without all the answers. Discussion ranges from new WSOP patch rules and how Vegas is changing, to a spirited unboxing and the invaluable lesson of acting with only partial information.

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Key Segments & Discussion Points

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1. WSOP Patch Controversy: Rules, Sponsorships, and Player Autonomy

[03:24 – 10:07]

• Stricter Patch Rules:
  • The WSOP has announced stricter rules requiring patches (sponsorship logos) to be approved 24 hours before play—not just for the final table, but for the whole event.
  • Elle: "So they have announced some stricter rules for wearing patches at...is it the final table? ...so specific. Your patch has to be approved." [03:56]
• Player Pushback and Business Autonomy:
  • Joe raises the dilemma: Can independent poker players be told what to wear if they’re paying their own way and negotiating their own sponsorship deals?
    • Joe: "If I paid to enter a tournament...you’re going to tell me I can’t wear a patch for a company that is sponsoring me?" [05:33]
  • Elle points out WSOP’s rights in protecting broadcast partnerships (like ESPN) and upholding brand integrity.
    • Elle: "WSOP has the right to protect their product. I know they have a big contract with ESPN..." [06:44]
• Uneven Patch Approvals & Ambiguity:
  • Not all brands are treated equally—ACR patches are allowed because Chris Moneymaker is their ambassador, despite ACR not being a regulated US site, while Club WPT Gold is rejected.
    • Elle: "To be clear, Moneymaker has permission to wear ACR. Not every player." [08:13]
    • Joe: "But to my...further my point, Club WPT Gold not approved. Kibosh." [08:28]
  • Both hosts agree there’s “more to the story” and this debate exemplifies persistent poker world politics whenever the WSOP approaches.

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2. Vegas Evolves: F1’s Arrival and the Changing Poker Destination

[10:07 – 15:30]

• F1 in Vegas:

  • With F1’s deal extended through 2037, hosts discuss how Vegas is transformed annually into a full-on race destination.
    • Elle: "F1 is here to stay in Vegas. It is happening. They’ve re-upped their deal with Las Vegas, which does not surprise me..." [10:13]
  • Elle emphasizes the need for the city to balance tourism with livability for residents, voicing concern over how future decades of F1 closures will affect daily life and access.
    • Elle: "The city needs to work with the residents to make this a good experience for them as well." [12:39]

• Old vs. New Vegas:

  • Nostalgia for the past—gone are the days of cheap buffets and free coffee makers. Now, resort fees, surcharges, and modern entertainment dominate the scene.
    • Joe: "The buffets are gone...that was a huge—for the most part anyway." [13:34]
    • Elle: "I actually pack my coffee maker now. Thank you." [13:59]
  • Final advice: if you’re a poker player or tourist, plan around the F1 schedule!

• Tour Announcement:

  • Ante Up announces they’ll be in San Diego around October 23–25, encouraging listeners to join for poker and community events.
    • Elle: "We know it is going to be at least at minimum around October 24...plan accordingly." [15:06]

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3. Unboxing: The Swiss Army Knife of Tumblers

[15:35 – 18:46]

• Elle's Excited Unboxing:
  • Elle unveils her new multi-functional beverage tumbler (the “Pour Caddy”)—complete with light, shot glasses, and versatility for any outing, poker table included.
    • Elle: "This thing is here to stay, man...you automatically have cups to share. Shut the front door. I cannot wait to use these over and over again." [17:22]
  • The segment ends with everyone excited for a relaxed Friday, family visits, and—of course—a party supplied with wings.

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4. Call the Floor: Should Players Be Forced to Show Their Chips?

[19:41 – 36:59]

• Issue Raised by Listener Darren Halpern:
  • Situation: In a tournament, a player asked to see another player's stack. The player gave a verbal count but refused to show chips visually, resulting in a tense floor call. Was this the right procedure?
• Ruling by Floor Expert Elliot Scheckter:
  • Rule: Players are obligated to make their chips clearly visible upon request—not just to give a verbal estimate (which can be wrong or misleading).
    • Elliot Scheckter: "Refusing to show your chips to a fellow player who’s in the hand with you is distinctly both of those [a breach of rules and etiquette]." [24:22]
    • Elliot Scheckter: "Is the player obligated to make their stack visible? Yes. Is verbally stating the amount in their stack enough? No, it is not." [26:21]
  • Floor should explain the rule and could (and should) penalize repeat offenders.
    • Elliot: "When I have to come to the table to deal with somebody who’s being a smart ass, I generally just can’t find it in me to find a whole lot of mercy..." [28:38]
    • Penalties should be public for habitual non-compliance.
  • Rule Reminder: Stacks are only counted by the dealer when it’s an all-in situation. Otherwise, the obligation is for chips to be visible, not for an exact count to be provided or made.
    • Joe Scales: "Counting the stack is wrong. Wrong." [32:19]
  • Live poker requires active participation; online poker provides all info instantly.

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5. Hand of the Week: Wild Opponent and Tough River Decision

[37:15 – 62:57]

• Setting:
  • Listener Michael Trent submits a hand from a $2/$5 live game featuring a notorious table maniac.
  • Joe Scales and Patrick dissect the action with humor and relatable groans about tough spots.
• Hand Breakdown:
  • Michael holds A♣K♣, faces a big preflop 3-bet from the wild player, and calls. On a K♦10♠6♣ flop, he bets and is raised. Turn (2♥) checks through. River (A♦) completes K♦10♠6♣2♥A♦. Opponent overbets $1,000 (into an $860 pot), says, "You probably have exactly what you have"—a cryptic, Yogi Berra-style taunt.
    • Patrick: "It's like opening up a fortune cookie and going, you are exactly where you are. Hey, thanks Confucius." [55:53]
    • Joe Scales: "You probably have exactly what you have. Yeah, I mean listen, it sounds like somebody trying to talk me into a folding a strong, strong one pair hand..." [55:42]
  • Michael tanks and folds. Opponent reveals Q♠J♠ for a rivered straight.
• Discussion Points:
  • Was checking the turn too passive? Verdict: No, it’s sound given the wild action.
  • Is top two pair (after rivering it) too strong to fold? Patrick says he’d likely call and lose to the straight: "There's no alternate universe where I don't lose an extra thousand dollars worth there. But I might even look at him and be like, you want to clarify?" [60:58]
  • Moral: Against unpredictable opponents, you’ll sometimes save money folding—but long term, top two may be too strong to fold to maniacs.

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6. Joe’s One Outer: Poker’s Life Lesson – Making Decisions with Incomplete Information

[63:38 – 68:20]

A closing, philosophical monologue from Joe:

• Poker as a Life Teacher:
  • "Every hand in poker is a decision made with incomplete information...You can't sit there forever waiting for perfect certainty, because the dealer is eventually going to look at you and say, sir, action's on you. Life does the same thing." [63:52]
• Action Over Analysis:
  • Prepare, evaluate, decide—knowing the outcome is never guaranteed, and "quality of your decision and the quality of the outcome—they’re not always the same thing."
  • Learn to trust your process, not the results: "Your control was in the process...Did you make the best decision you could with the information you had at the time? That’s all we really have." [66:17]
• Final Reflection:
  • "Let’s gather what we can, trust our preparation, make the best decision available to us, and let the cards fall where they may."

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the patch debate:
  "If I paid to enter a tournament...you’re going to tell me I can’t wear a patch for a company that is sponsoring me?" (Joe Scales, [05:33])

• On Vegas change:
  "I actually pack my coffee maker now. Thank you. Because there is no way that part of Vegas is gone." (Elle, [13:59])

• On floor rulings:
  "Refusing to show your chips to a fellow player who’s in the hand with you is distinctly both of those [a breach of rules and etiquette]." (Elliot Scheckter, [24:22])

• On the poker/life connection:
  "Every hand in poker is a decision made with incomplete information...Life does the same thing." (Joe Scales, [63:52])

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• [03:24] – WSOP Patch Controversy
• [10:07] – F1 & "New" Las Vegas
• [15:35] – Unboxing: “Pour Caddy” Tumbler
• [19:41] – Call the Floor with Elliot Scheckter
• [37:15] – Hand of the Week: AK vs. the Maniac
• [63:38] – Joe’s One Outer: Poker as a Metaphor for Life

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Tone & Community Feel

The conversation is warm, honest, and filled with camaraderie—equal parts strategic, funny, and philosophical. Joe and co-hosts keep it real for recreational players, with recurring jokes, candid admissions of mistakes, and a sense of inclusive community.

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For Listeners Who Missed the Show

• Community: Ante Up’s identity is cemented as “the podcast for everyday poker players.”
• Strategy: Real, relatable scenarios in both tournament rules and hand discussions.
• Life Lessons: Poker’s incomplete information mirrors the big (and small) decisions we all face, and Joe leaves listeners with an upbeat, empowering message.

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Missed out? You’ll walk away with the latest in poker controversies, tales from the tables, tactical wisdom, and a reminder that life’s best decisions are made—even when you can’t see all the cards.

Transcript

[Commercial Announcer]

Apro vecha los ahoros de Memorial Day in los y compra los vasicos parelo gar pormenos ahoro centadolares en la parria gas de cuatro que madores Charbroil Performance Series.

[Podcast Intro Announcer]

Take your seat, the cars are flying high. Shuffle up and deal at the Aces Light Longest running show. Yeah, we've seen it all. From the river to the rail we answer the call.

[Joe Scales]

Hello 18 and welcome back to another episode of the Ant Yet Poker podcast where every hand is an opportunity, every player is a friend, and every episode is a winning experience. I'm your host, Joe Scales, and as always, thanks for hanging out with us this week. Before we jump into the show though, I just want to remind everyone that if you've been enjoying the podcast, make sure you subscribe to the Anti Up Poker Media YouTube channel. Hit that like button on the videos. It really does help us to continue to grow this thing and reach out to more everyday poker players out there. And while you're at it, stop by the merch store over@anyup magazine.com we love seeing members of the A team out there showing off ante up gear at the tables, in home games, on cruises, at our tour stops. Every time someone sends us a picture wearing an Antioch hoodie or a hat in a poker room somewhere, it really just reminds us how cool this community really is. Also, don't forget about all the ways to get involved with us. Join us on Patreon for our monthly games. Jump into the discord conversations, send us your Hand of the week submissions or your call the floor situations or just share a poker story with us. This show has always been about the everyday poker player and the community is what makes it special. Also, if you haven't checked out the digital magazine lately, go take a look. We've got new features, interviews, strategy content and stories from all around the poker world built, I don't know, specifically for players who love the game. Not just those like nosebleed crushers. Right? All right, we've got a fun show lined up this week and that's all I have, so let's get on with the show.

[Podcast Intro Announcer]

Welcome to the show. You're on the A team. Stack your chips and chase the dream. Joe's got the booth, his mic's on fire. Got the laugh, she's taking it higher.

[Joe Scales]

Elle and I are back around the poker table.

[Elle]

Happy Friday.

[Joe Scales]

Happy Friday. How are you?

[Elle]

Good, how are you?

[Joe Scales]

I am good.

[Elle]

I'm excited about today's show because it's got Some light hearted, important, fun stuff to discuss.

[Joe Scales]

Yes. We've got everything from patches to F1 to a surprise unboxing to. Saquon. So let's start, let's start with this patch controversy.

[Elle]

Yeah. This might not be the light hearted part, but there's some rules coming out from the WSOP that poker players and sponsors are seeing differently.

[Joe Scales]

Correct.

[Elle]

So they have announced some stricter rules for wearing patches at. Is it the final table? This is the part that's unclear to me.

[Joe Scales]

No, it's.

[Elle]

This is why I wanted to talk about it because I'm like hearing this and that and whatever. So specific. Your patch has to be approved.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. You have to be approved 24 hours before you play.

[Elle]

Okay.

[Joe Scales]

I don't know how long the approval process takes from, you know, once you submit it.

[Elle]

Right.

[Joe Scales]

But they have to get approval 24 hours ahead of time and it's for play overall, so you know, it, it's going to cut out some. Like, obviously everybody just kind of exploded talking about their opinions, right?

[Elle]

Oh, yeah. The poker community is a buzz.

[Joe Scales]

I think my biggest thing, my question with all of this is who controls the business side of poker players?

[Elle]

Say more. Well, because I think that's a curious question. Your reaction's slightly different than mine, which is pretty typical.

[Joe Scales]

Well, poker players, we're basically independent contractors. Right.

[Elle]

That's fair.

[Joe Scales]

We pay our own way to the buy ins, the travel. Yes. We build our own relationships with brands and we negotiate sponsorship deals.

[Elle]

Of course. You say we as a whole.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Elle]

We as poker players. Yes. Have the ability to do all of those things.

[Joe Scales]

So if I paid to enter a tournament. Right. You're going to tell me I can't wear a patch for a company that is sponsoring me in said tournament?

[Elle]

Yeah. I would say WSOP is letting you know that you can negotiate that for any other game but this one. And I think that's where the flip side comes in. That's why I mentioned the, the players and sponsors and the WSOP all have a different viewpoint. And so I think what's happening is the WSOP is like, sure, you are an independent contractor, but you need approval in our tournament.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elle]

So it doesn't mean halt on your sponsorships, it doesn't mean halt on your negotiations, it doesn't mean don't work with brands and that kind of thing. Right. It is just simply during an WSOP tournament, you've got to have approval to wear a patch.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elle]

And they want to know why you're wearing it and who you're wearing it.

[Joe Scales]

For.

[Elle]

And I think, I think that's what I've heard.

[Joe Scales]

And they have every right to do that, for sure.

[Elle]

Yeah. Because the flip side is, and I think you've looked at this as, as the business and business side of the tournament, WSOP has the right to protect their product. I know they have a big contract with espn, so this could be some of what they've agreed to. Who knows, right?

[Joe Scales]

I think the problem is, and as poker players, we always want to be able to have this explained to us. And it doesn't seem like, for instance, acr, okay, they are reportedly, they're approved,

[Elle]

so they're on the list of approvals

[Joe Scales]

so people can wear their patch.

[Elle]

You don't have to get permission.

[Joe Scales]

Well, they've been approved. Okay, but they're not regulated. They're not a regulated site in the

[Elle]

U.S. so wait, is it the brand's responsibility to go to WSOP and say we'd like to have our patches worn, or is it the players respons? Okay, but so how can ACR be already approved?

[Joe Scales]

Because someone, someone, Chris Moneymaker is their, their brand ambassador and he's already worked to get that, that's approved for, for him to wear that patch. Okay, they're not a regulated site in the US but because they've got a big name. And of course, Moneymaker is a huge name in World Series of Poker, Standing Poker as a whole. Standing, but especially World Series of Poker.

[Elle]

But to, to be clear, Moneymaker has permission to wear acr. Not every player. That's what I'm. I want to know if, if one

[Joe Scales]

person is approved, is everyone approved? I don't know.

[Elle]

Okay, So I still think there's more to uncover in this, in this arena.

[Joe Scales]

But to my, to further my point, Club WPT Gold not approved, Kibosh.

[Elle]

I mean, we probably know what that's related to and that could be revisited.

[Joe Scales]

But so it just, it makes you wonder if they're not approved because of the collusion issue. And if so, didn't they already address that issue with the ruling that we talked about already with the no longer being able to receive extra or bonuses based on your, your WSOP play.

[Elle]

There's more to the story. Is all I can ever say in situations like this is there's got to be more to the story. But we do know patches are not decorations, right? Then I think that's, that's why there's so much brouhaha, right? I mean, like, the people behind the patches are getting their name and brand and product visible and are Making conscious decisions on who they're partnering with and why. Right. And then the poker players doing the reverse, they want to partner with particular brands for personal and maybe professional reasons as well. So still more conversation to come. And again, once again, there's always something that happens right around this time of year of what's going to flip everybody upside down. So I'm curious to see. We will definitely be paying attention and watching. I'm sure the rest of the poker community is going to be curious about this as well. But if you are headed there, be aware.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. And you know, F1 has a lot of sponsorships all over their. Their cars.

[Elle]

Yeah, that's another. That's a whole nother topic you wanted to discuss today. So little segue into F1 is here to stay in Vegas. It is happening. They've re upped their deal with Las Vegas, which does not surprise me, considering maybe the direction that Vegas as a city as a whole is heading.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elle]

But they've extended a deal through 2037. That is a long time. Like a long time.

[Joe Scales]

I'm really curious to hear another 10 years, how some of the people that we know that live in Vegas, how they feel about that. Because, you know, when we were there, even for the Ant Tour a year ago, there were some people that were upset.

[Elle]

So here's what I would say. The city is working hard. They're bringing in NFL teams, they have a hockey team, they have a baseball team. They're building a new stadium. Their food market is exploding. Vegas is not only about getting into a casino anymore. It's about the shows, it's about the food. It's about what you can experience when you're in Vegas. Okay. So I believe this partnership is bringing people in from all over the world. It's making it a destination spot. I don't blame them. However, personal opinion, Come at me if you want to. I guess the city needs to work with the residents to make this a good experience for them as well. So, blocking their storefront. What are you going to do in return? How are you going to be able to get pedestrians there? Blocking off streets? How are you going to work with Uber and Lyft drivers?

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elle]

How are you going to make accommodations over the next 10 years? What is your plan? What are you going to try to do? Because I can tell you from the small experience we've had, not the time that we would pick to go to Vegas.

[Joe Scales]

Correct.

[Elle]

Not the time I would choose if I have anything to do with it.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Unless I'm going to See the race.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elle]

Really, really and truly. Like I would not want to plan one of our stops. I would not want to plan one of our times that we go there during the year. Unless we are there for F1 because it flips the city upside down.

[Joe Scales]

Right. And we saw plenty of people that were there for the race.

[Elle]

Sure. And if you're there for it, I mean they make it spectacular. They really do. I mean our, if we could take our son in law. Oh my gosh.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

But again, I think, I really feel strongly if the city is, is wants to utilize this as a, as a way to get people there, then what are you going to do for the people that live there?

[Joe Scales]

Right. And people were avoiding the trip altogether and plan Uber and Uber and Lyft didn't want to come down there at all.

[Elle]

Which is why we're even discussing it. OK. Okay. Vegas is a destination spot for poker players. 247365. Okay. So FY, FYI, F1's not leaving.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Plan accordingly. That's the only reason we wanted to talk.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

But it's also kind of funny to me because I could not imagine talking to some of the old school gamblers from way back, way back in the day and explaining to them what Vegas looks like now. Because you mentioned there's an NFL team, there's a hockey team that's actually won the Stanley Cup. There's Formula one.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

The A's are coming.

[Elle]

They are.

[Joe Scales]

You know, and that stadium is going to be beautiful. Right. But on the flip side of that, the buffets are gone. You know, that was a huge. For the most part anyway.

[Elle]

That's all my grandfather ever talked about.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Ever, ever talked about. And my stepmom too. She was like, Lauren, you can get the most bang for your buck in food.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah.

[Elle]

And when I came home the first time, I was like, no, you cannot.

[Joe Scales]

And now they're.

[Elle]

And I actually pack my coffee maker now. Thank you.

[Joe Scales]

Correct.

[Elle]

Because there is no way.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elle]

That that part of Vegas is gone.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. And the rooms are charging resort fees. They charge you for a refrigerator, they charge you for a coffee maker. They charge you for all these different things.

[Elle]

Anything. It's the JetBlue of hotel experience. I mean, that type of experience. Right. Where if you, if you want this, then you got to pay for it. If you want this, then you got to pay for it. Just know going in.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. Whether you love it or hate it.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

It's going to be there.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

Formula one.

[Elle]

We got to talk to our. Stop. We know we are going to be in San Diego. Yes, we know we're going to be in San Diego. We already let you know that a couple weeks ago. We know it is going to be at least at minimum around October 24,

[Joe Scales]

25, 26, 23, 24, 25.

[Elle]

Damn. October 23, 24, 25. Okay. Whether we're going to be there before or after, I don't know if we're going to be spending Halloween there or not.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, that would.

[Elle]

I would love.

[Joe Scales]

That would be so fun.

[Elle]

I would love that. But we are going to be there plan. That's another planning thing we just wanted to let people know about. If you are in that area, if you want to be in San Diego with us. We would love to have you at the end of October. So stay tuned. We're nailing those dates down. You should see something in the magazine from them this month. And we just love, love, love that we're going to be able to be out there this year.

[Patrick]

Yes.

[Elle]

So super excited about that. And then last but not least,

[Commercial Announcer]

you've

[Joe Scales]

been so excited about this.

[Elle]

I have, I have. I'm even unboxing. That is a term. If you, if you're not a full influencer.

[Joe Scales]

If you look at this, then you think it's just a Stanley cup until you get down to here and you notice.

[Elle]

Yeah, Stanley. Stanley. Yeti. Arctic out. Gone. Moving on. This is, this is where it's at. The poor caddy. I mentioned it. It was on the Today show. Do not know what their inventory is. I cannot even predict with their inventory how little inventory or how much inventory they have right now. I am, though, for the people who are watching, instead of listening, I am just. I'm going to unbox this bad boy. So literally here it is in real life. That looks the same. Okay. The speaker.

[Joe Scales]

This is vibe.

[Elle]

Yeah, that's. That's actually the. I think that's. They all have names, right? So this is the vibe. I did not. This is the large. I don't know what it's called. I should know, but that is a different size. You can tell the silhouette's a little different. This is how everything screws on. Long story short, I also got the light that goes underneath.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Elle]

So it's a 10 foot radius. So like tonight when we're at our friend's house, we're gonna be able to see to walk home or walk there. And then very quickly, I also. So I ordered the tumbler and I ordered the one that I didn't realize you got two. Okay. Yeah. I wanted three, and I hopefully will get the third one I ordered. That's the one I got in the red for us. So we can take anything we want. Makers.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, this is the.

[Elle]

We can take anything we want in this bad boy. It comes with a whole bunch of shot glasses. Yes.

[Joe Scales]

I thought it came with four. It comes with a ton.

[Elle]

Oh, no, look, there's even more in there.

[Joe Scales]

They know.

[Elle]

Listen, this is. This thing is here to stay, man. There. We're here to have a good time. So this version of the tumbler. I told you, Swiss army knife of tumblers, the top third holds your booze or whatever you want to put in there. It does not have to be booze. It could be sparkling water. It could be whatever you want. Right. You can pour and share at the pool or the beach or the campsite or the poker table, wherever you want. If you're gonna take this for yourself and you want to keep your beverage cold. Oh, highball glass right there. Have it ready. Should fit in the poker table. I'm not using our cup holders as, like, real life. These are small, right? Anyhow. Or it holds shot glasses in that bottom high glass, so you automatically have cups to share. Shut the front door. I cannot wait to use these over and over again. I'm packing them for the cruises. I'm packing them for our vacation. We are taking one for our party tonight. It's. We're taking 30 wings from Wingstop. Shout out to Wingstop. Free. Shout out to Wingstop.

[Joe Scales]

I was gonna say free advertising.

[Elle]

Yeah, I mean, just in general. Like, we're gonna. We're gonna go have a good time tonight because our friends are getting together on a Friday night. We ordered 30 wings to pick up on the way, and that's a ball marker for people who play.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, it's golf.

[Elle]

So anyhow, lots and lots and lots of, I would say, exciting stuff happening in the poker community this week. Really enjoyed a lighthearted conversation around the table because I've been waiting for one. There's been so much going on in our world, but lots to look forward to this weekend. Our granddaughter. Long weekend. Our granddaughters are coming to stay the night. Two of the six are coming.

[Joe Scales]

Yep.

[Elle]

And gonna break in the bunk beds. Maybe. We'll see. But anyhow, as always, Joe, it's a pleasure being around the table with you.

[Joe Scales]

Likewise.

[Podcast Intro Announcer]

Wisdom cuts like a blade. Big blinds, big stakes. Raise it up. Let's make no.

[Joe Scales]

Elliot Scheckter joins us each week to say how he would rule on situations that come up in your Games, and he's with us again this week. Elliot, how's it going?

[Elliot Scheckter]

Things are going pretty well, thanks. How you doing today?

[Joe Scales]

I'm doing well. I was thinking about you actually the other day because I was sitting in traffic and I know, you know, over there on the west coast, traffic is never a. Never a good thing. But how long does it take you to commute to work every day? Does it take you forever?

[Elliot Scheckter]

Not really. It takes longer than it should. It takes me about half an hour to get to work generally, but when there's no traffic, it only takes me 11 minutes. So, yeah, the traffic's pretty heavy even in or small distances.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I. I was. I was sitting in traffic the other day and I was like, this is probably what Elliot has to deal with every day.

[Elliot Scheckter]

Oh, the rest of my team has it a lot worse.

[Joe Scales]

Oh, I bet. Yeah.

[Elliot Scheckter]

Because they come from all different areas. They don't all live in the same neighborhood as it is. So. Yeah.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Elliot Scheckter]

Traffic through here, especially if we're trying to get to obviously sporting events, concerts, other events. Yeah, the traffic just gets ridiculous. Luckily, I mean, a good number of places are. Are accessible by the train system. BART, as it's effectually known. So, yeah, we can get out of our car sometimes, but finding a parking spot at a. At a parking lot close to a BART is, of course, yet another challenge.

[Elle]

Right.

[Joe Scales]

Well, thankfully, people are usually having something great to listen to like this on their commutes, so most assuredly we'll give them. We'll give them another call of floor this week. This one is sent in by Darren Halpern, and Darren says, I had a situation come up in a tournament recently that turned into a tense moment over something that seems simple. Action folds to a player in middle position who raises. It gets around to me, and I'm considering a raise. I ask, how much do you have behind? The original raiser verbally answers, around 42,000. I ask if I can see his stack and the refrain. The razor refuses and says, I told you what I have. I continue insisting that I want to see the chips, and the razor repeats that he already gave the count verbally. Eventually, I asked the dealer to call the floor before the floor even gets to the table. The other player raises his arms to show the chips for a few seconds, but not long enough for me to really get a good look at them, especially since I didn't know he was going to show the chips at that point. So I asked to see them again. The other player says, I only showed you in the first place because I didn't want to slow the game down. Now by this time the floor arrives and asks the dealer to count the other player's stack, which he says, which is not what I was asking for and doesn't seem like the right solution either because I believe that is usually reserved for all ins, which this was not. When the floor came over, they were already annoyed that they had had to be at the table. So I feel like that led to the ruling of just counting the stack so that we can all just move on. So he says, Elliot, here are a few questions. One, is a player obligated in a tournament to make their stack visible if asked, or is verbally stating the amount in their stack enough? If verbally stating is enough, then what if they're wrong? And also if a player only complies after the floor is called, could that warrant a warning from the floor? Or is it just considered a misunderstanding of etiquette and procedure?

[Elliot Scheckter]

So wow, let's start with this is a great submission. I mean you just don't run into this kind of stuff anymore. Okay, let's break it down in sequential order.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elliot Scheckter]

How much do you have behind original razor answers? Okay. Then the request to see their chips is refused. Well yeah, that's not how this works. The second rule for the TDA is players responsibilities and amongst them is knowledge and compliance with the rules and not to breach proper etiquette. So refusing to show your chips to a fellow player who's in the hand with you is distinctly both of those. It's written in the rules also under cards and chips visible, that your chips must be stacked and must be easily readable by the floor, but also by the players. Yeah, this is uncalled for. And to Darren's point, what, what happens when a player gives a grossly inaccurate estimate of their own stack size, whether intentionally or not. So yeah, asking to see the chips is quite reasonable, is allowed and is much more preferred than asking for an amount because we're not obligated to count somebody's chips down, we're just obligated to make sure that somebody with the need has an unobstructed view of all of their chips. So yeah, again this is not right and it needs to be thoroughly and thoughtfully explained to the. To the player who's refusing to comply.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elliot Scheckter]

I'm especially entertained by their flashing of the chips in spots where they know the other player can't see them. Oh, he's looking away. I better lift my hand so I can prove that I. I'm showing him my chips. It seems almost intentional. That's how comical it is. The floor arrives and ask the dealer to count the other player stack again. Not supposed to do that ever. Once again that stack has not been bet and certainly not what the player is asking for. But it does seem as there is confusion because the original question asked by our hero here is how much do you have behind? Not May I see your chips? So it appears as though the floor is complying with that exact request, which they're good for the floor. They're trying to expedite the tournament and, and bypass the sarcasm of the offending player. So yeah, so let's answer the questions exactly. Is the player obligated to make their stack visible? Yes. Is verbally stating the mountain they're stacking up? No, it is not. And in fact I just assume they didn't because they can be wrong and they can be misleading and they can be both. So doesn't help. If a player only complies when the floor is called, could that warrant a warning from the floor or is it just called a misunderstanding? Well, generally when you go into a court of law, the judge doesn't really care if you were ignorant or not understanding of the applicable laws and regulations. And as I've stressed before, the poker table is not a court of law only because the people making judgment calls don't have to actually follow the letter of the law to produce the best outcome. So we don't have to go by technicalities and this is not a technicality in any way. And the rules are, are pretty clear

[Joe Scales]

and

[Elliot Scheckter]

I would be very inclined to award a penalty here, especially after a protracted situation when I've got to give clarifications on things that are, are truly interesting and concepts that are not easy to grasp right at the moment or commonly. I'm glad to come to the table and give those clarifications and make sure that everybody understands that everybody's happy about it. When I have to come to the table to deal with somebody who's being a smart ass, I generally just can't find it in me to find a whole lot of mercy in my, in my well of reactions and emotions. The bucket comes up empty. I, I, I work the pulley and draw that rope up and all of a sudden the bucket's had nothing in it. I just can't find it. No mercy? Yeah, I just, yeah, you wasted everybody's time and now you're wasting my time on top of it because I've got nothing else to Do. Apparently now I've become very happy to deal with the situation because now I can very calmly and rationally explain to the player and everybody at the table how what just transpire should not have happened ever. And then to punctuate it with the exclamation point, the penalty is then awarded, and rather publicly, too. I'm not doing this in private. I'm going to embarrass the hell out of this particular person because they chose to act the way they did. Usually they try to make the punishment fit the crime. I try to make the punishment fit the criminal. So in a happy accident, it looks like both purposes are served simultaneously by the application of a penalty and assistance.

[Joe Scales]

Right. I. I also want to say, you know, Darren says when the floor came over, they were already annoyed that they had to be at the table. And it's not necessarily that they were annoyed that they had to be at the table. They were maybe annoyed because this is a habitual person doing this.

[Elliot Scheckter]

If that's the case, then penalties absolutely need to be applied. This guy needs to be taken to the side and explained how this has to stop. So if that's the case, if that's why the floor was annoyed, if this has been going on for quite a while, why is nothing being done about it other than the rolling of their eyes and shrugging of their shoulders? That doesn't make sense. If that's the case. I'm not annoyed to go to tables. That's my job as tournament directors. We're supposed to go to tables and make sure things are clear, expedited, corrected, and. And solved. I, I'm never upset to go to a table. I, I will be annoyed when I have to deal with player behavior, especially behavior that I have dealt with before, in which case we have the rules at hand that allow us to deal with it more drastically and severely. I mean, shoot. It doesn't seem like the floor's reaction to all of this was the fact that they had dealt with this before. It seems like they were just in the middle of something and were annoyed they had to go to a table to solve what. What shouldn't have had to be solved at all. Which, hey, people are people, and we all have emotions and we can all be frustrated or happy.

[Joe Scales]

Right?

[Elliot Scheckter]

It doesn't seem like they had dealt with this specific issue with this specific person and now have to deal with it again, because the resolution here doesn't speak to any of that.

[Joe Scales]

Well, let's talk about that resolution because you, you already mentioned it to some degree. But counting the stack is wrong. Wrong.

[Elliot Scheckter]

Yes, it is not correct.

[Joe Scales]

And so, you know, I get, I get if you're annoyed, whether it be because they have habitually caused you issues or you were in the middle of something, whatever your reason is, you still have to play within the rules or rule according to the rule book.

[Patrick]

Right?

[Joe Scales]

And so, I mean, speak to this because as a floor, you can't let those emotions get the best of you either. No, you can't.

[Elliot Scheckter]

You still gotta follow the rules. And apparently they just forgot about them. And maybe they don't insist on thorough TDA knowledge or general tournament rules at that specific venue. Anything's possible. Maybe the that individual as a floor didn't really know how the rules read or how they were to be interpreted and wasn't guided correctly. I think there's a whole number of possibilities, but they certainly didn't come up with the right solution. It's certainly not in the rules that you can just have anybody counted down anytime they make a bet. That's not how this game works. And for all the online players out there, I appreciate the fact that all the information you need is right on the screen. Everybody's chip amounts and bet amounts are right there every single time. That's great. Poker in a live setting, as I always say, takes a much more active participation on the part of the players. If you pay attention, you'll find that you're getting just about the same information that you would in an electronic game. So, yeah, there's no need to count somebody stack down unless they bet it. If it's an all in bet. Yeah. How much is that? That's acceptable. You have to know how much to put in the pot. But if that money hasn't been placed into the pot, man, you don't have a right to know to the, to the chip exactly how much it is. You have a right to an unobstructed view to figure it out for yourself.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Elliot Scheckter]

And that's in the rules. That's how the rules are set up. And maybe we need to clarify them, but that's how the rules read. So the floor screwed this up here. There's no other way to say it. They're not supposed to just instruct a stack to be counted down when it hasn't been bet yet. So yeah, that's not good. And I, I hope whoever's operating this room gets a chance to discuss this and, and clarify things both in fact, to make sure that any player stack that hasn't doesn't get counted. And when people Are. Are insisting on not showing their chips to other players in the pot upon request that this is stamped out and eliminated as well.

[Joe Scales]

I'm. I'm shocked that this player who refused to show his chips did not throw an absolute fit when they wanted to count his chips.

[Elliot Scheckter]

So I think they're smart enough not to throw tantrums in front of tournament directors.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. Yeah, that's what I was gonna say. So kudos to him for that, right? For not. Not losing his mind there. But also, it sounds like Darren has a pretty good grasp on the rules himself because he even said, you know, that's not. He. He. I believe that is usually reserved for all ends is what he was saying. Which you're absolutely right there.

[Elliot Scheckter]

Quite correct. Absolutely.

[Joe Scales]

And Darren, I really appreciate you sending that in. It's. It's an interesting topic. Like you said, Elliot, you don't see these situations that often anymore. So it's a great topic. And if anyone has a call before they would like to know how Elliot would rule, send it to podcastnetmagazine.com Elliot, thanks again.

[Elliot Scheckter]

You're welcome. Glad to do it.

[Joe Scales]

And we'll see you next week.

[Elliot Scheckter]

Looking forward to him.

[Joe Scales]

Welcome to Hand of the Week where Patrick, resident Fish and I dive into listener submitted hands each week. We tackle everything from questionable bluffs to hero calls and the hands that make you scratch your head. Whether you're looking for strategy tips or you just want to see if you would have played it any better, we've got you covered. Patrick, how's it going?

[Patrick]

You know what, my friend? I. I'm doing pretty good. I would like to just go ahead and get this out of the way. You can just sit back.

[Joe Scales]

I think we've got a hand. You're really, really breaking up now. I can't.

[Patrick]

This is a baseball podcast segment for everyone out there that doesn't care about baseball. Joe is a Kansas City Royals fan, God rest his soul. I am very, very. I'm just a millimeter above him as a Red Sox fan this year. But that being said, those two teams happen to square off in a midweek three game set. And the brooms came out only three games.

[Joe Scales]

It felt like it was eight.

[Patrick]

You had enough pitchers for eight games, let me tell you that much. Yes, they. They got the. The Red Sox swept the. The Royals. We're still five games below.500. So there. I'm not bragging. All you Yankees fans out there, stay out of the dms. I don't care.

[Elliot Scheckter]

You.

[Patrick]

You guys are brutal. The Steinbrenners Suck. But yes, we're still. I think we're 11 and a half games out of first of the AL East. We're still in the height of the wild card and it's only May 20th. You know, whatever.

[Joe Scales]

No, even that being said, it is not even June yet.

[Patrick]

No, you're right, it's not June. But it's making me feel a little bit better that we're only a couple of games out of that. So it's not like it's a lost season. That being said, it was a lot of fun winning three games and helping out, you know, the. The stats. So we appreciate that. We. As speaking as far as all Red

[Joe Scales]

Nation, that is every. All the teams can look forward to the Royals coming into town so they can pad their stats. I love it.

[Patrick]

They play all right on the road. It's at home that they don't play all that great.

[Joe Scales]

Well, that's fair.

[Patrick]

So now that that's out of the way, I don't think we have any other housekeeping items, do we? That I know of?

[Joe Scales]

No, I don't. Next week will be the week that we do the no limit 08 that.

[Patrick]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Joe Scales]

It will be one that had. That Scott and Chris had submitted or it was submitted to Scott and Chris and they broke down 2012.

[Podcast Intro Announcer]

Wow.

[Joe Scales]

And so we will be doing that and see how we do how much different it is. Whether it be because that was 2012 or because you've got a joker in your sidekick. But. But that will be next week. So prepare yourself for that. I'm just getting you mentally prepared so it's not sprung on you.

[Patrick]

I like it. Full disclosure, you give me a week's heads up. So there will. There will be little to no surprise next week that I can't promise that it's gonna be played great. But you know what? I like it like the challenge.

[Joe Scales]

So everyone I, you know, I will

[Patrick]

guarantee you come back and see that one.

[Joe Scales]

I will guarantee right now that you forget until we record. So

[Patrick]

you're not far off from being right.

[Joe Scales]

But we'll.

[Patrick]

Okay, what do we have this week?

[Joe Scales]

This week we have a hit of the week sent in by Michael Trent. And Michael has a hand from a 25 game. He says the game has been running for a few hours and there was one player at the table who was driving everybody insane.

[Patrick]

So Joe was playing.

[Joe Scales]

He was a mid-50s guy talking non stop, showing bluffs, splashing chips around, ordering drinks for the table. This doesn't sound like a bad thing. Like this guy's Having fun. So I. I think maybe, you know, he's not even trying to have fun alone. He's, like, buying drinks for the table. So he's spreading the love here. And showing bluffs is not a bad thing, I'd say. I'd say this. Maybe relax a little bit. The game's supposed to be fun.

[Patrick]

Could have been a little bit on the arrogant side, depending on what he was talking about. I can see Michael's side of it a little bit.

[Joe Scales]

Okay.

[Patrick]

You know, and every. And every.

[Joe Scales]

Look, if it's slowing the game down to a crawl, I get it. But that doesn't sound like what is the case here. But if that's the case, I get it. But Michael says every pot with him felt like chaos. He is in the big blind in this particular hand, and we are in the cutoff. So under the gun limps. Another player limps, and we are in the cutoff with ace of clubs, king of clubs.

[Patrick]

Oh, well, time to shut. Pop us up. That's. That's pretty much what I. What you just told me by saying king, king, ace, ace, king of clubs.

[Joe Scales]

What is it?

[Patrick]

All right, that. This is. Break it. No, I'm just kidding. Ace of clubs, king, clubs, Right? Is that what you just told me?

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. Ace of clubs, king of clubs.

[Patrick]

That's what I jotted down in my notes there. You know, talking's hard. It's not like we do it for a living or on a podcast or anything every week. Anywho, back to our regular schedule broadcast. So, yeah. What? We're at least three. I mean, we got one, two. Two limpers. So 20 at a minimum, right? Yeah, I'm going 20.

[Joe Scales]

I mean, I would have said 25 at a minimum. I'm probably going 25 to 30.

[Patrick]

Okay. I thought you were gonna go something out right now.

[Joe Scales]

I thought for a split second that we could limp and see how this wild guy goes. You know, how big he's gonna put. Put in. But we do have a premium hand, and we do.

[Patrick]

You want to get a little bit of value. So meet it. Meet it halfway and go with 20.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I was thinking maybe I go on the smaller side of 25. So 25. I would say 25 to 30. And maybe we get big blind to raise us.

[Patrick]

I like it. So Michael, he's the Karen of poker players. Sorry, all Karens out there.

[Joe Scales]

Listen, Michael raises to 35.

[Patrick]

Beautiful. Not a problem.

[Joe Scales]

Button folds. Small blind folds. And the wild player in the big blind makes it 125. Both the limpers fold. All Right now. What do we want to do?

[Patrick]

Well, first question. Did Michael say what our stack might be?

[Joe Scales]

No, that was what I was just getting ready to say is he did not say what our stacks are. And I feel like if we raise, though, we may be getting it all in already.

[Patrick]

I could not agree more. And I'm a okay with that. I mean, I. The only other better hand is. I mean, aces or kings themselves, right? Pocket aces or pocket kings, at least.

[Joe Scales]

Well, yeah, we would have overs the queens and jacks and. Yeah, tens.

[Patrick]

On that note, my glass half full point of view, I'm shoving and looking straight into this guy's soul.

[Joe Scales]

Okay? He. I mean, here's the thing. He's wild. He could do. He could. He could put 125 out there with just about anything. So think about this. If we 4 bet, if we do come over the top of it, does he maybe fold some junk

[Patrick]

Fury. You want to get him to continue to play? It's not a terrible move, especially with him being a wild card. Chaos.

[Elliot Scheckter]

Whatever.

[Patrick]

All right,

[Joe Scales]

just say maybe. Maybe more that way. I don't know, Michael calls as well. So we go heads up to the flop. With $267 in the pot already, the flop comes king of diamonds, 10 of spades, six of clubs. Our friend in the big blind checks to us.

[Patrick]

Well, if we're going to go that route, then we need to. Then we need to continue to play the, you know, innocent. I did not have. Don't have my hand in the cookie jar kind of thing. But I don't want to check again. No, I don't want to check back. So I'm going to throw out like 7500 maybe.

[Joe Scales]

I was thinking maybe a hundred, I could go. If I wanted to go less, I could go. No, I don't want to go less. A hundred.

[Patrick]

I don't want to go less.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I don't. Like you said, I don't want to check. I don't want to give up any value here.

[Patrick]

So I feel like I. I don't either. And if he folds and he folds, he would have folded for anything. But, you know, around that 7,500 number, you know, it's kind of saying, okay, well, I've got something. And if, you know, the, you know, big bad bluffer over there wants to continue to, you know, poke out the chest and come over the top and we'll just sit there and count our chips.

[Joe Scales]

Michael says, I bet 90 right there. He immediately grabs chips and makes it 300.

[Patrick]

And this is where you sit there and you tank and you stress and you wipe your brow and you shove.

[Joe Scales]

He says this guy had shown complete nonsense earlier in the night, including a bluff with queen high and another hand where he over bet middle pair because he said he felt strong spiritually.

[Patrick]

Okay. I kind of like this guy. I kind of like him a little bit. Like, I want to play at a table. I don't know that I would want to be friends with the guy, but, like, I kind of want to play with him. I mean, this is. You remember that old movie, Maverick, I think it was called? No, what was it? It had. Yeah. Is that what it's called, Maverick? Yeah. How did I pull that card? And this is what that guy's thinking

[Joe Scales]

is a good, good show. Good movie.

[Elliot Scheckter]

Yeah, great movie.

[Joe Scales]

All right, so before we put all the chips in, let's talk this through a little bit. What are we beating right now? Worst kings, obviously.

[Patrick]

Yep. Worst kings, for sure. Pocket queens, pocket jacks, pocket, well, tens. I don't see him with sixes, but at the same time, this guy's range is huge.

[Joe Scales]

Right, Right.

[Patrick]

So we're beating everything other than tens or sixes. Right. Or two pair.

[Joe Scales]

Right.

[Patrick]

So we're the only thing we're not beating. Let's go that route is pocket tens, pocket sixes or two pair.

[Joe Scales]

Right. Which I feel like he could have King 10. It's possible for sure.

[Patrick]

It's possible.

[Joe Scales]

I think it's possible for the guy

[Patrick]

to have deuces and think spiritually that another deuce is coming out. This episode's gonna go viral, by the way. I can feel it.

[Joe Scales]

I, I, I just, I feel like the Czech raise feels more strong than if he would have just let out. So.

[Patrick]

Okay,

[Joe Scales]

I, I, I'm not folding for sure. I'm not folding. Top pair, top kicker right now. But I don't know that re raising accomplishes much either. I, I don't want to see him fold better hands. And we may just get ourselves in trouble if he has something like King 10. So I'm just going to call and see what happens.

[Patrick]

I would love to know the thought process later, though. Do you think, Let me ask you this. Do you think we're ahead right now, really? Probably.

[Joe Scales]

I think we could be ahead, but I think we could be in trouble with King 10. So, yeah, I, I, I don't want to put, I don't want to put it all in because I, I want to see how he reacts on this next street.

[Patrick]

Fair enough. Okay.

[Joe Scales]

Michael also calls, and the turn is the two of hearts, which makes the board king of diamonds, 10 of spades, six of clubs, two of hearts. And he checks again. So he check, raises us and then checks again. That's a weird line.

[Patrick]

I think we've established that this guy's not what we would quote unquote saying to normal. But playing the hand as is, as Michael's done it, I'm going to probably see the river for free. I'm probably going to check back here.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, it means one of two things. He has showdown value but is nervous or he's giving up or he's worried

[Patrick]

about his next drink order. One of the three.

[Joe Scales]

Well, fair.

[Patrick]

But yeah, I think you're right.

[Joe Scales]

If we end up betting here and he feels like he has showdown value, he's going to at least call. Maybe he comes over the top again and then we're putting all the chips in. Or if he's given up now, then he's going to throw it away. So we end up having worse hands, fold. Same same as the previous year. We end up having worse hands, fold. Or we reopen the bedding for him to potentially jam on us. And yeah, so I'm with you. I'm going to see the, I'm going to see the river card for free and check back here. Michael says we have a strong one pair hand, but not a hand that I necessarily want to pile money in against a guy whose range makes no sense. Honestly, this confused me more than the flop raise though.

[Patrick]

Absolutely back.

[Joe Scales]

I checked back. So there's $860 in the pot and the river is the ace of diamonds. So our final board, king of diamonds, 10 of spades, six of clubs, two of hearts, ace of diamonds. So now we improved the top two, but there is a possible straight out there. Do we think, do we put him on queen jack?

[Patrick]

It's definitely in the realm. I think we're going to find out.

[Joe Scales]

Before I can even think. I should probably read what he did here. Before I can even think about betting, this guy grabs two stack of black chips and puts out $1,000 and over

[Patrick]

a lot of money in these pots. I guess it is 2, 5. There's a little bit more there than one 1, 3.

[Joe Scales]

Then he, he says he leans back in his chair, smiling, not talking, not moving, just staring directly at me. About 20 seconds into me tanking, he says, you, you probably have exactly what you have.

[Patrick]

What the this guy should have one less apple martini. You have exactly what you have.

[Joe Scales]

This guy sounds like, was it, was it, was it Yogi Berra? That was known for the, for the one liners that just made no sense. Yeah, if you have. He says this somehow confused me but made me feel worse. Against a normal player the tendency is to say they under bluff these spots. So my thought is you could make a discipline fold here against those players. But that's not what Michael describes this player as.

[Patrick]

No. And I gotta tell you, I think at the end of the day I'm going to be. If I lay this down and save my thousand chips, I'm still going to be ticked off. I'm going to look at him and I'm going to feel better about myself losing to a straight calling knowing that he might end up flipping it over anyways. But I'm going to feel better about myself. And I just don't think he's got it. I think he's got like king, queen or you know, king, jack or you know, Queen 10 maybe, hell, even Ace 10, I don't know. I just don't think he's got it.

[Joe Scales]

You probably have exactly what you have. Yeah, I mean listen, it sounds like somebody trying to talk me into a folding a strong, strong one pair hand or something.

[Patrick]

It's like opening up a fortune cookie and going, you are exactly where you are. Hey, thanks Confucius. Tell me Michael calls.

[Joe Scales]

Well, you're calling.

[Patrick]

Yes. Yep.

[Joe Scales]

I think I, I think I am too. I, Michael says I start replaying the hand and can't figure out what value hand makes sense besides maybe pocket tens or some bizarre slow played aces. But at the same time, this is also the kind of guy who could absolutely show up with king, queen or complete air because the ace is a scary card. He says I tanked for way too long while the entire table was silent and eventually I folded.

[Patrick]

Oh, ouch.

[Joe Scales]

He immediately slammed his cards face down into the muck and said, good fold. The dealer asked, did you want a show? And he just smiled and said sure, he earned that one. Well first of all, the dealer should never be asking that question. Let's just address that right now. This is a problem.

[Patrick]

Absolutely not. That's like getting to thanksgiving dinner and going, so let me ask you about your political and religious beliefs real quick. Have they changed since last thanksgiving? No, you can't do that. I love the guy that he did it because if not we would have never known. But thank you know, don't do that.

[Joe Scales]

Right. So he says sure, he's earned that one and turns over the queen of spades. Jack of spades for the rivered straight.

[Patrick]

Well then Michael, touche good fold. I would have been out of another thousand chips.

[Joe Scales]

I still think I feel better about losing that and than I do folding that in. He says my questions are, is checking the turn way too passive with top pair, top kicker against a player like this. You want to take that first?

[Patrick]

Yeah, I'll take it first. I, I don't think it is at all. I think that's the right play. I think I go back to both you and Michael not shoving over the flop. Right. Didn't they cut. Didn't he come into us hard on the flop?

[Joe Scales]

Yeah, I think you shove there.

[Patrick]

He's got, he's got queen. He's got what? Queen, Jack, and King 10 on the board. I think you're probably. I think he's probably calling.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. I was gonna say it doesn't change anything. Doesn't change anything. We end up. Well, it doesn't change anything for me, I should say, because I made that call and Michael did not. So Michael ended up saving money. But yeah, but yeah, I think we end if I shove. If we end up shoving pre flop, then we just end up getting it in because I don't think he's folding either.

[Patrick]

No, I don't think you.

[Joe Scales]

The answer is question no, the turn is not, not too passive at all. I think it's the right play. And then his next question, once the ace hits the river, is top two. Just too strong to fold against someone capable of bluffing. I mean, I don't want to be results oriented. So I, I, I, I feel like it's. It is. I feel like it's too strong to fold. They're against this particular guy. Against other players, no, but against this particular guy. I think so.

[Patrick]

Yeah. I think, I think you're absolutely right. I mean, I'm glad Michael and sea with things. I'm glad you folded. I hope you took back all your chips and, and then some. But yeah, I think it is. I think it's way too strong to fold.

[Joe Scales]

Yeah. He says third and Patrick, how fast are you calling here? After hearing the words, you probably have exactly what you have. I don't know why he pinpointed you on that question.

[Patrick]

A snap. In all honesty, I, no, not a snap, but I would have. Honestly, my. The sitting at that table, I'm going to think about what an absolute clown show comment that was for like, maybe three to four seconds. And then I'm going to look right at him and be like, all right, here you go. It's going to be a quick call. I'm definitely Losing those chips. There's. There, there, there's, there's no alternate universe where I don't lose an extra thousand dollars worth there. But I might even look at him and be like, you want to clarify?

[Joe Scales]

I have a better question. I have a, I have a better question. Or maybe just a follow up question. Maybe it's not a better question, but I have follow up question. If he ends up turning over just like some random. Instead of, instead of the straight he has just queen high.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe Scales]

Then do you spend the next 20 minutes patting yourself on the back for such a great call?

[Patrick]

Yeah, that's probably a good point. I probably do. I probably, I probably, probably riding really high the rest of the way.

[Joe Scales]

So then, then the next three hands, you make the most ridiculous calls because you're like, I have the chips.

[Patrick]

I. Yep, I have the chips. I have the feeling. I, yeah, I, there's, there's a lot. I, I definitely lose a lot of those. A lot, a lot of those next few hangings because I'm feeling myself. What a. Michael, I'm sorry, man. That's. What a crappy hand. I lose my chips every time.

[Joe Scales]

I mean it's, it's. Congratulations on not losing as much as we did, I guess. But yeah, you know, being, not being result results oriented, I think it's, it would have been better to make that. I think you win more times than you lose there, but against that player,

[Patrick]

against that quagmire of a guy.

[Joe Scales]

Against that particular player. Yes. Not necessarily against. Yeah, I probably don't make that call against.

[Patrick]

If you have someone that's a little

[Joe Scales]

more some random guy that's not, not going crazy at the table. But. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Michael, thank you for sending that in. I, I love the, the commentary from this guy. It makes it a great hand. If anyone has a hand of the week that they would like to know how Patrick and I would play it, send it to podcastneupmagazine.com

[Patrick]

send it in. Joe, you have yourself a great week. We'll do this again next week with just a regular old hold em hand, right? Wink, wink, nudge, nudge.

[Joe Scales]

No, no, next week is the hand. Next week is bring it all limit, no limit, no limit. Omaha 8. Study up.

[Patrick]

Got it. We'll see you then.

[Joe Scales]

I want to talk about something poker has taught me that reaches way beyond the felt. If you know me at all, you know I can overthink just about anything. I can analyze a situation from 12 different angles, come up with 17 possible outcomes, and somehow still convince myself I Don't have enough information to decide. And honestly, life just doesn't always give you enough information. But you know what else doesn't give you enough information? Poker. That's one of the biggest lessons I've taken from the game. Every hand in poker is a decision made with incomplete information. You don't know what cards your opponent has. You don't know what card is coming next. And you certainly don't know if the guy across from you is bluffing or value betting, if he's tilted or tired or just got lucky for three straight hours. But eventually, you still have to act. You can't sit there forever waiting for perfect certainty, because the dealer is eventually going to look at you and say, sir, action's on you. Life does the same thing. There are decisions in life we desperately want. Guarantees, career moves, relationships, business opportunities, big purchases, even little everyday choices. Sometimes we want complete clarity before we move forward. But poker reminds me that complete clarity, it just doesn't exist. Very often, you gather the information you can. You trust your preparation. You evaluate probabilities, and then you make the best decision possible. That doesn't mean the outcome will always be good. And I guess that's the hard part, right? Sometimes in poker, you make the right decision and still lose the pot. And if you play long enough, you realize the quality of your decision and the quality of the outcome. They're not always the same thing. That applies in life, too. You can do everything right and still have things go sideways. You can prepare, work hard, make the smart move, take the most calculated of risks, but variance still shows up. That doesn't mean the decision was wrong. Poker trains you to separate those two things. And honestly, I need that reminder sometimes because I have a tendency to replay decisions over and over in my head. You know, what if I had done this? What if I waited longer? What if I chose this other option? But poker teaches you, once you put the chips in the middle, the results no longer in your control. Your control was in the process. Did you think it through? Did you stay disciplined? Did you make the best decision you could with the information you had at the time? That's all we really have. There was this line I heard somewhere, but it really stuck with me. It said, life is basically a series of probabilistic outcomes. Did you ever hear anything that sounded more poker? And maybe that's why the game teaches us so much about ourselves, because poker exposes how we react to uncertainty. Some people are going to freeze and some people are going to panic. But some of us, we learn to trust ourselves enough to act anyway. I think that's one of the healthiest things poker has ever taught me. Not certainty, not perfection, just the ability to make a thoughtful decision and live with the result. And I think that's a skill a lot more people need right now. So if we're all struggling with a decision this week, maybe we can stop waiting for perfect information. Maybe it doesn't exist. Let's gather what we can trust our preparation, make the best decision available to us, and let the cards fall where they may. That's today's one outer and that's today's show. I'll see you next week, a team. And until then, I'll see you at the tables.

[Patrick]

The Antiop Podcast is a production of anyupmagazine.com contact the show at podcastsyupmagazine.com or call the show at 54032. If you'd like to advertise, send an email to editoriopmagazine.com

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Aprobecha Los Ahoros de Memorial Day in Los y Compasicos Pare logar porrocentadolares en la Parria's Char Royal performance series. For selection Estaki and Lowe's. Lowe's nosotros ayudamos 2 ahoras.