Chapter 4 Ep. 22 Stack Chips, Not Headlines

Summary

Ante Up Poker Magazine - Episode Summary

Podcast: Ante Up Poker Magazine
Episode: Chapter 4 Ep. 22 - "Stack Chips, Not Headlines"
Host: Joe Scales, with Elle, April, Elliot Schter, Patrick
Date: June 13, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of Ante Up Poker Magazine is a lively and strategy-filled roundtable featuring regulars Joe, Elle, April, Elliot, and Patrick. Recording their regular tour around the Rivers Casino in Schenectady, NY, the gang dives into upcoming poker events, local room dynamics, spectacular wins from the wider poker world, strategy and ruling nuances, and a classic war story in the “Hand of the Week.” The main thematic thread: emphasizing substance over noise both at and away from the poker table—reflected in the episode's title, "Stack Chips, Not Headlines."

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Table Talk: Upcoming Tournaments & Community Vibes

Local Tournament Updates – Schenectady & Rivers Casino

• Recently Held: Deuces Wild Tournament
  The first Deuces Wild event went over well: “Biggest complaint was that people wanted to throw more money at it. They wanted registration to last longer. But everybody was laughing, having a great time. It was fun to be present for.” (Guest Poker Room Staff, 01:35)

• Upcoming Events:

  • Pineapple Tournament at the end of June (02:05)
  • Win the Button Tournament on June 16 – “If you win the pot, you win the button. The blinds adjust accordingly. So if you get stuck at a table with an aggressive player, you better find a way to get that button away from them.” (April, 02:24)
  • Joe’s Favorite: Rivers Revival (Father’s Day Special): “You bust. As long as you have your revival token, you get 20 big blinds at whatever hand or whatever level you busted in.” (April, 03:28)
  • Electric City Mini Event: July 5th–9th and 12th. “$300 buy-in, $50,000 guaranteed prize pool, five day ones, day two on a Sunday.” (April, 03:37)

• Monday Night Showdowns:
  Standard $240 NLH (No Limit Hold'em); qualifies for a quarterly leaderboard with $5,000 freeroll, where “for every point you have, you will get 100 bonus chips. So it should be a lot of fun... a little competitive.” (April, 06:01)

Community Atmosphere

• Competitive & Friendly:
  • “One thing I know about that room is a lot of people know each other. A lot of people like to come and have some bragging rights… I like that competitive atmosphere amongst like a community. Fun.” (Elle, 04:14)
  • “Pretty sure we’re in the works to change our poker room to name it Cheers.” (April, 06:39)
  • “The players are repeat visitors but they also know each other outside of the poker room; good conversation, but also a high level of competition.” (Elle, 06:39)

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Poker Culture & Side Talk

Quirky Stories and Bizarre Headlines

• Coors “Taller Boy” Cooler:
  Elle shares the saga of a limited-edition beer cooler and how temperature is measured with Coors cans: “If the mountains are blue, it’s at optimal temperature…” (Elle, 08:55-09:13)

• Fireworks Mishap:
  Joe relays a viral story: “Somebody decided to celebrate the Fourth of July a little early—his truck caught on fire on the interstate in Tennessee, and he was carrying a trailer full of fireworks… it just went on for so long… cool because nobody got hurt.” (Joe, 10:46-11:26)

• Riverwalk & TV Production:
  The group discusses local changes: “They’ve changed the Riverwalk… now you’ll walk down where they’ve been filming pieces of the Gilded Age for HBO.” (April, 13:21 & 13:40)

  • “It is fascinating to watch how many people behind the scenes have to be actively working together to make this thing happen.” (Elle, 14:48)

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World Series of Poker (WSOP) Highlights

Notable Player Spotlights

• Kristen Foxen’s Breakout Win

  • “My girl, Kristen Foxen, she is on fire right now … she just took down the $25k super high roller.” (Elle, 20:00, 20:37)
  • “$1.77 million.” (Joe, 20:40)
  • “She’s just a great player, overall.” (Joe, 21:08)
  • “You know, women play this sport and do so well. And it’s such an inspiration to the other women… step in and play these small tournaments and get your feet wet and try it out.” (April, 21:53-23:05)

• Mike Holtz’s Second Bracelet

  • “He had one bracelet that was online—he took a pretty big ribbing … but he’s now won his second bracelet … live at the $1,500 Super Turbo Bounty—outlasted over 2,100 people. He won $238,000 plus; biggest score of his career.” (Joe, 25:26 & 25:54)
  • “During his acceptance speech ... 'I want to start by acknowledging that I have been hard on Maurice Hawkins and, you know, I want to apologize. And then he says for absolutely nothing…'” (Joe, 26:29-26:45) — 26:35 memorable quote

Encouraging Female Participation

• The entire panel celebrates Foxen’s example for women in poker:
  • "A lot of women are not as confident to step in and play poker. I think it's great to see this. And it encourages other women to step in and play…" (April, 22:54-23:05)
  • “The one thing I walked into—it's no secret I married into poker and I walked into it completely blind ... It is really nice when you have an example in front of you to say that's a goal I can make for myself.” (Elle, 23:38)

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Poker Strategy & Rules: Table Scenarios

WSOP Hand Breakdown – Table Talk (15:54–19:22)

• Misunderstanding All-Ins
  • Classic scenario: Small blind thinks they’re completing, but actually calls an all-in by mistake (“His biggest downfall is he says ‘call.’” – Joe, 16:33)
  • TDA rules discussed. “If he had said ‘call for 5,000’ [instead of just ‘call’], TDA rules would allow us to rule that as a misunderstanding … would still have to keep that money in, but could fold without calling the full all-in.” (April, 17:19)
  • All-in buttons encouraged to avoid confusion: “That way… you should be able to see this giant red button … signifying this person is all in.” (April, 18:10)
  • Outcome: Despite the blunder, the mistaken caller wins with Jack-3: “Flop comes King-Queen-9, Ace-Queen has top pair, but 10 comes giving the small blind the straight … ends up busting Ace-Queen with Jack-3.” (Joe, 18:51)

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Feature Segment: Call the Floor (35:06–47:47)

Rabbit Hunting Debate (36:11–47:47)

• Scenario:
  Players rabbit hunt (see what community cards would have been dealt after folding) repeatedly. A player in the hand objects, saying “I didn’t want to see it.”
• Ruling (Elliot Schter):
  • Most houses don't allow rabbit hunting: “Most players are playing under a clock … we don’t need players becoming bitter and angry after seeing what could have been.” (Elliot, 38:09)
  • If it’s against the rules, “it’s against the rules.” (Elliot, 39:56)
  • “Just because it’s been going on all night doesn’t mean you can’t object. If you’re in the hand and you win the hand and you don’t want to see the next card, I think that’s eminently reasonable.” (Elliot, 41:22)
  • Memorable analogy: “I actually tried that argument [everyone else was speeding] when I was, like, 18. It didn’t work.” (Joe, 40:02)
  • In club/paid-time rooms there’s sometimes more leeway, but the consensus is to keep the game moving and avoid emotional fallout.

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Hand of the Week (47:57–69:51)

Listener Submission: Mike Riley’s Pocket Deuces

• Hand Details:

  • $1/3 cash game, $400 effective, cutoff with 2♠2♣
  • Overlimps against two limpers; five to the flop
  • Flop: K♦ 8♣ 2♥ (set for hero)
  • Action: Limpers bet, hero raises to $35, heads up to turn ($85 pot)
  • Turn: 9♠, villain checks, hero bets $60, villain calls ($205 pot)
  • River: J♣, villain checks, hero bets $125, villain snap-calls with Q♠10♠ (nut straight)
  • Discussion around: Should hero have checked river? Is Q-10 line predictable? “Should I have recognized that a limp-call-call line can contain a lot more Queen-Tens than I gave it credit for?” (Mike’s question, 68:06)

• Critical Analysis:

  • “Queen-10 just made a straight, but after checking three times, I wasn’t convinced he had a monster ... I also felt one-pair hands would have a hard time calling a large bet, so I settled on a $125 value bet.” (Mike, 64:12)
  • “My opponent smiled and rolled over Queen-10 for the rivered straight. He just called with the nuts. Is that even legal? Can he just call with the nuts there?” (Joe, 64:58)
  • “I don’t think you have to give them credit for it there... I can see it as a possibility, but you don’t have to slow down because of one possible hand in the range.” (Joe, 68:38)

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Upcoming Ante Up Tour – Schenectady (September) (30:23–34:34)

• Expanded Schedule, Pending Approval:
  • Main event satellites, $400 mini main with $100k guarantee, $1,200 main event ($250k guarantee)
  • Side features: Monster Stack, Win the Button, Double Bounty, PLO, Omaha 8 or Better, Seniors, Deuces Wild ($222 buy-in on 9/22!), Rivers Revival, last-chance satellites
  • “Once that New York board approves, please send over so we can add that to our website and people can start looking forward to that and planning their visits and their stays and get hotels locked in…” (Elle, 33:50)

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One Outer – Joe’s Editorial Corner (70:24–75:15)

“It’s a huge mistake to assume that the loudest player at the table is the most dangerous. ... Some of the strongest people you’ll ever meet are the ones who don’t feel the need to constantly prove anything. ... As poker players, we should probably spend less time worrying about being noticed and more time worrying about being effective.” (Joe, 70:24–75:15)

• Compares Martin Cabral’s showmanship to Kristen Foxen’s quiet excellence:
  • “Martin Cabral … impossible to ignore…. Kristin Foxen … shows up, she plays, she wins—six bracelets, millions in tournament earnings… and yet somehow she manages to accomplish all of that without making herself the story. The story is her results.”
• “Don’t automatically focus on the loudest person. Take a look at the player quietly stacking chips in seat four, the one who hasn’t said much all day, the one nobody is paying attention to. Because in poker … that’s usually the person you should be learning from the most.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Verbalize your bet. Verbalize your bet. Verbalize your bet. If… keep going.” – Elle, 16:36
• “A lot of women are not as confident to step in and play poker. ... It encourages other women to step in and play.” – April, 22:00
• “The loud player wants you looking at them. The quiet player, they really, they want you looking anywhere else.” – Joe, 70:42
• “You want to be remembered for how well you played at the table, not for how much you talked.” – Joe, 74:25

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Deuces Wild/Pineapple Tournaments Discussion: 01:35–03:17
• Rivers Revival & Electric City Events: 03:28–04:14
• Schenectady Room Community: 04:39–07:10
• WSOP Mishap - Miscalled All-in: 15:54–19:22
• Kristen Foxen’s Victory & Women in Poker: 20:00–23:38
• Mike Holtz’s Second Bracelet: 24:43–27:19
• Bluffers WSOP Satellite Discussion: 27:23–30:18
• Schenectady Tour Preview: 30:23–34:34
• Call the Floor (“Rabbit Hunting”): 36:11–47:47
• Hand of the Week (Pocket deuces hand): 47:57–69:51
• One Outer – Joe’s Editorial: 70:24–75:15

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Summary & Takeaway

This episode blends animated local reporting, relatable strategy debates, and reflections on what truly makes a player dangerous—not the noise, but the results. The panel celebrates inclusivity, sportsmanship, and the learning curve for all levels of players. Schenectady’s poker community spirit is highlighted as a model for healthy competition, while wins by Foxen and Holtz show that breakthroughs come from substance and consistency.

Key Theme:
In poker, as in life, don’t be distracted by headlines—those quietly and consistently stacking chips are often the real players to watch, and the best lessons may come from those who let their actions, not their volume, speak loudest.

Transcript

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[Podcast Host]

Take your seat. The cards are flying high. Shuffle up and deal at the Aces Lie Longest running show. Yeah, we've seen it all. From the river to the rail, we answer the call.

[Joe]

Welcome back to another episode of the Antioch Poker Podcast, where every hand is an opportunity, every player is a friend, and every episode is a winning experience. Elle and I are back around the

[Elle]

poker table with our friends in Schenectady. Hey, guys.

[Elliot Schter]

Hi.

[April]

How are you?

[Elle]

Good. Happy Friday. I'm really glad to be here with you both. I missed you. Last time was with my stepmom. Taking care of her. She's doing great, actually. Shout out to her permission to walk. So we are allowed to be out of a wheelchair now.

[April]

Nice.

[Elle]

So exciting. So exciting. What's going on up in Rivers Casinos, Connectady?

[April]

Keeping busy, getting ready for our next set of events and dealing with all these silly tournaments that April talked me into.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

I'll tell you that. We just had our Deuces Wild Tournament, our very first Deuces Wild Tournament. And yeah, it went really well. The biggest complaint was that people wanted to throw more money at it. They wanted registration to last longer.

[Joe]

Okay.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

But everybody was laughing, having a great time. It was fun to be present for.

[Elliot Schter]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Good. And what about the Pineapple?

[Elliot Schter]

That's what.

[Elle]

Sorry, I was jumped ahead of you,

[Joe]

but yeah, Pineapple is coming up at the end of the month, right?

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

Absolutely. We have a Pineapple at the very end of the month. That one is the 30th. And then we also have another fun one coming up on the 16th. That's a win the button tournament.

[Joe]

Oh, yeah. I've seen that in cash games. I've never seen that as a tournament style. How is that going to work?

[April]

If you win the pot, you win the button. And the blinds adjust accordingly.

[Joe]

Nice.

[April]

So if you get every hand. So if you get stuck at a table with an aggressive player, you better find a way to get that button away from them.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

Change your style up.

[Joe]

Wow. Yeah.

[Elle]

Can we have that in September?

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

I think you had it on, didn't you?

[Elle]

Let's get a little special request.

[April]

We will have one in September.

[Elle]

Okay. Fantastic.

[Podcast Host]

Yay.

[Elle]

Can't wait. Well, I didn't mean to jump a jump ahead. I thought Pineapple had already happened. So, any other fun, fun events? I can only imagine deuces wild in that room. Yeah, like, I really. I'm kind of sad that I didn't have like a webcam to watch that.

[April]

Well, you'll get a chance for that one again in September as well.

[Joe]

Nice. We're gonna have some fun ones.

[Elle]

Yeah. Fantastic. This is something we've been looking forward to having on tour stops.

[April]

So before we get to the tour stop schedule, we'll just touch, touch base real quick on the things that are coming up for Father's Day, we are doing Joe's favorite, the Rivers Revival.

[Joe]

Yes.

[April]

That's always a fun tournament. You know, you bust. As long as you have your revival token, you get 20 big blinds at whatever hand or whatever level you busted in.

[Elle]

Okay.

[April]

That tournament is, is always a lot of fun. Lasts a long time. A lot of value for your money. And then right after that, coming up July 5th through the 9th and then again on the 12th, we will have our next Electric City mini event. So that's the 300 buy in, $50,000 guaranteed prize pool, five day ones. Day two is on the Sunday, so you get to take a little break on the Friday, Saturday. And then for those who want more action, we do the $340 Electric City mini event Blackjip Bounty tournament. So again, these mini events are always a lot of fun. You know, double bag bonuses, the works. So it's a good time to do it well.

[Elle]

And the community there is probably pretty well versed in getting a little competitive with each series. So really glad to be hearing you're throwing some other opportunities in there as well. Because one thing I know about that room is a lot of people know each other. A lot of people like to come and have some bragging rights, you know, and I like that. I like that competitive atmosphere amongst like a community. Fun.

[Joe]

Yeah. I don't remember if you were on. I think you were. When we had Dustin on and we were talking about the last mini main winner and he had bagged, what was it, three times. Right?

[April]

Yeah, I thought, I think he, I think he came in at four total bags, really, if, if I'm not mistaken.

[Joe]

And, and he makes money on each of those bags. So that makes that, that mini mane so fun because you get, you, you get to have more opportunities to not only carry over a bigger stack if if need be, but also more bang for your buck. Yeah, get some, get paid for that extra bag. I love it. I, I saw on the schedule, and I was wondering about the Monday night showdowns. Tell me about those.

[April]

Those are just our standard Monday night tournaments. It's $240 to get in. They fire off at 6:15pm Participation fluctuates pretty wildly, but I would say the average comes in around 50 or 60 players a night. Okay, but again, it's just a standard, no limit hold' em tournament. No, no tricks, no gimmicks. Just get in, have fun, and take it down. And that tournament does qualify for our quarterly leaderboard, which has been going pretty well this year.

[Joe]

I think we're gonna talk about that a couple of times.

[April]

We're almost done with the Q2 leaderboard. The qualifying tournaments will last through the rest of this month, and then we will invite the top 27 players to come back on July 18 to play in a $5,000 free roll. But we're making one twist this time that we didn't do last quarter. For every point you have, you will get 100 bonus chips. So it's a hundred extra points for bonus chips on top of the starting stack for that leaderboard. So that should be a lot of fun. And it, you know, again, a little competitive. I'm pretty sure we're in the works to change our poker room to name it. Cheers.

[Elle]

Well, that's exactly what I was thinking. And getting to is like, I know a lot of, a lot of the players are repeat and visitors, but they also know each other outside of the poker room. And so there's some, there's some good conversation, but also, like, a high level of competition there that I love to see, and you're just amping that up even more. So can't wait to get up there in person and see it in action too, because it sounds like it's been a lot of fun. And you're adding that, what is it? A hundred chips?

[April]

You said it's a hundred extra points in chips.

[Elle]

100 extra points in chips. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that would motivate you.

[Joe]

Oh, to be there when you were 100%. And I'm also glad that, April, I'm glad that you were able to you talk Dustin into this pineapple tournament.

[Elle]

Yes. Can't wait to hear about that.

[Joe]

So, yeah, I, I, I'm, I'm excited to see what the turnout's like with that and what people say when, when that one's done too.

[Elle]

Have you Guys, had any World cup watching going on up there?

[April]

I think we have approximately 1.5 people who really like to see soccer in our poker room.

[Elle]

Football. The football.

[Joe]

I don't know who the half a person is.

[Elle]

I know that's enclosed throughout the country. Who's watching? I've just been keeping up honestly, through the news, but so many products right now. Joe and I have two things that we just want to. To discuss. Some of it has to do with fireworks, the other with a cooler. But Coors Light has come up with this awesome limited edition Coors.

[Joe]

Not Coors, no.

[Elle]

If you're from Kansas, you say Coors and you carry a cooler. If you're from the east Coast. That is not the correct pronunciation. So what they've created. I don't know if you guys have seen this. It's called a taller boy cooler.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

I haven't seen it.

[Elle]

Okay, so it's like three beers high. The top unscrews, you drop your beers in, which you could put anything in there. You can put sparkling water, you can put sodas. You can do whatever you want.

[Elliot Schter]

Sure.

[Elle]

Through the top on keeps it at optimal beverage temperature, which is a hard thing to do. And the reason I'm excited about this is because I have.

[Joe]

Which is 40 degrees, by the way.

[Elle]

Oh, yeah, you researched this. 40 degrees, the optimum beverage. Because did you also know that on a Coors can, if the mountains are blue, it's at optimal temperature for partaking?

[Patrick]

I heard that.

[April]

I didn't know if that was true.

[Elle]

It is.

[Joe]

It is.

[Elle]

It is. It's absolutely true. So. But the one reason I'm super excited about this is because we like to take beverages with us wherever we go. And I had bought a sling bag that's supposed to hold all of these, you know, series of drinks, because you can put it down in your golf bag. We were giving them as presents. They didn't keep anything cold. But this one is supposed to be like, spot on. But it's seriously selling out.

[Joe]

So, yeah, we. We tried to get it. They. They released it the 11th. Well, but they had one. One small release before that.

[Elle]

Okay.

[Joe]

Then the 11th, and we tried to get that one. We have one more chance on the 18th to try and get it.

[Elle]

Alarms are set.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

You may have to go to ebay. And.

[Elle]

Right. That's where they're. Yeah, maybe that's where they're going. Everyone's buying them up, and then they're going to resell.

[Joe]

So talking about soccer, the reason that they are kind of gearing this towards Soccer. And it's supposed to be like, the guy who goes, go. It says, cool.

[April]

How would. How would Elle pronounce that, though?

[Elle]

Coarse.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

I like that better.

[April]

It is.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

That was good.

[Joe]

I did count also. It is 14 O's.

[Elle]

You would count. You would. All right, so what is the other story that you really wanted to get to in Tabletop? Because I. I asked Joe, I said, really? Do we really want to talk about this? He said, yeah, because I would talk about it at my home game. I said, okay, that's what we're here for. So.

[Joe]

So why.

[Elle]

What. Tell us.

[Joe]

It's, you know, somebody decided to celebrate the 4th of July a little early is all. He was. Apparently his truck caught on fire as he was driving down the interstate in Tennessee, and he was carrying a trailer full of fireworks. And, I mean, if I will put a link to the video in the show description. It just went on for so long. You can hear one guy in the. In the background in the video. He's like, is that the grand finale? I think it was. It was cool because.

[Elle]

Because everybody.

[Joe]

Nobody got. Nobody got hurt.

[Elle]

Yeah, everybody was okay.

[Joe]

Emergency crews had to shut down all the traffic, though. So the. The people waiting in their cars, even though they got a show, probably didn't think it was that cool. But I. I wasn't in the traffic, so I thought it was cool.

[Elle]

Yeah. Coming from the guy who used to drive across the border to buy fireworks to come back.

[Joe]

That is true.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

So this is.

[Elle]

This is something. Fireworks is something that Joe's very passionate about. Coming up. Do you guys shoot off like you

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

still have all your fingers?

[Joe]

I know I do. I do. I was not the smartest kid either, so it's. It's a miracle that I have all my fingers because I. We would. We would play the game where you would light it and then wait and then throw it so it pop in the air. Not recommended for. That's smart people.

[Elle]

Bad, bad habits. I'm just going to put out a psa. Anyone who is doing fireworks, please have

[Joe]

a bucket of water nearby and don't listen to me.

[Elle]

Right. Do you guys have a. Like, a big spectacular up in Schenectady, or is there anything happening, like, here? They're actually celebrating the 4th of July on the 3rd because it's cheaper to buy the fireworks so they can put a better show out on July 3rd than they can on the 4th.

[Elliot Schter]

Wow.

[April]

We usually do a big fireworks show right here by the casino on the river.

[Elle]

Beautiful. Because I love that view. And I. We love getting up and walking the river. Actually, we go one way one morning and go the other way the next morning. And it's a. It's. I think that's also a really nice place to shake off a bad beat, is just take a break, go for a walk, get your senses renewed.

[Joe]

That's true.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

Fresh air, sunshine.

[Elle]

Yeah, Hit up the Starbucks as you go back, maybe. Or get a steak at the steakhouse. There's lots of opportunity.

[April]

I think they've changed the Riverwalk a little bit since you guys have been here last.

[Elliot Schter]

Really?

[Elle]

Okay.

[April]

When you went to the left, it would you just hook around and kind of end in the neighborhood? Well, they changed that path now to go straight, and then you can make a right and continue the walk on the. The other side of the neighborhood by the rest of the river.

[Joe]

Really.

[April]

I don't know if it's the bridge, but you'll see it. You'll go down. You'll go down around the water, and it takes you further down into the neighborhood, which now you'll walk down. And it's basically the same neighborhood if you keep walking into it. It's where they've been filming bits and pieces of the Gilded Age for hbo.

[Joe]

That's cool.

[Elle]

Are they shutting roads down or, like, people migrating in to watch particular actors now?

[Elliot Schter]

They.

[April]

They definitely shut the roads down. You know, when the camera crews are there, they. They blockade the roads. You got cones everywhere, so people can't park. And it's neat. I was driving by the other day, and they had a semi truck, and the back of the semi was like a fake door for one of the filming scenes. So it just. It was just kind of neat to see this. This fake prop set where, you know, they would just film in front of it. But it's neat to see them do stuff like that. And they're. They're filming in other areas around here. I know they're doing some of the shots over in Troy, which is close by.

[Elle]

That's really cool. I've only ever come across. Do you guys remember Mr. Popper's penguins?

[Joe]

Does anybody remember you remember? I don't know that I ever watched it.

[Elle]

I was in New York when they were filming outside the Guggenheim Museum. I don't know why. I don't literally. What era of my life was it? High school or college? It's been at least 20 years, so I don't know. That's the only time I've ever come across a movie set. And it is fascinating to watch how many people behind the scenes have to be you know, actively working together to make this thing happen. So I'm gonna now tune in because I'll be able to say I know where that is. Right. Cool.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

I just wrote down Mr. Popper's penguin so I can look that up later.

[Elle]

Go for it. It's a good one. It's a good one. It's a good kids movie.

[Joe]

And.

[Elle]

But speaking of good movies, Summertime.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Elle]

I mean, is for it. And the WSOP is there's.

[Joe]

There's a lot happening, lighting up.

[Elle]

We thought the first two weeks was exciting. I'm not sure that we've seen the most exciting. Exciting yet, because we've got some really fun commentary from those folks, but. And an honest commentary, which we'll get to. But also, you know, the mistakes keep happening, and sometimes they work out and sometimes they don't. And you even tried to explain this to me, and I was like, how does that happen? And then I went and watched the video and I went, okay, that could have been me.

[Joe]

Right?

[Elle]

So set it up for us.

[Joe]

I mean, it's hard every. We all know how hard it is to see. If you're in, like, seat nine or eight and you're in seat one or two. It's hard to see because you've got a dealer here.

[Elle]

Sure.

[Joe]

And a lot of dealers sometimes will lean back trying to help you, but it. It's still hard. The player over on the left side of the dealer, he went all in. It folds around to the small blind who thinks he is just completing the big blind. So he says, call, and puts out calling chips for the big blind. And his. I mean, his biggest downfall is he says call.

[Elliot Schter]

Call.

[Joe]

He said. He says the words.

[Elle]

Which. Which I always say. Verbalize your bet. Yeah, verbalize your bet. Verbalize your bet. Verbalize your bet. If. Keep going. Well, what else happens, though? Because I have a question about this.

[Joe]

Okay. We happen to have some people that can answer that way better than me. But the. The guy who went all in, he had ace, queen, right? The guy who thinks he's just calling the. The Big Blind has Jack 3, and

[Elle]

he's now committed because he said call instead of. If they had verbalized, like, let's say he's. The small blind is 2500, and the big blind was 5. If he had said call for 5000, would it have been the same?

[April]

In that case, the TDA rules would allow us to rule that as a misunderstanding of calling the opening bet or the previous bet. And while he couldn't take that money back, he would still have to keep that 5,000 in. In fold. At least. In that case, they wouldn't be required to call the full all in.

[Elle]

Okay. Because. Verbalize your bet. Verbalize your bet. Verbalize your bet is in my brain, and I. I do it as often as I can when I'm playing live because I'm still learning and because I'm still getting comfortable. But.

[Joe]

And that is correct. The other side to that is also. Pay attention. Pay attention. Pay attention.

[Elle]

Yeah, exactly. Because C8 or 9 thought they were calling the big blind. They were not. And you're. You've got jack three. And I thought for sure, goner.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[April]

Well, that's another reason that casinos and TDA encourages the use of all in buttons. You know, that way, in addition to just someone saying all in, because, you know, not always does someone put all the chips out so that you can clearly see that they might say all in and throw one large chip out. But if you have, like, this giant red button or red plaque that is going out in front of the player, if you're paying even the slightest bit of attention, you should be able to see this giant red button that signifies this person is all in.

[Joe]

Right, right, right. So that's. That's a.

[Elle]

To your point.

[Joe]

Pay attention.

[Elle]

Pay attention. Pay attention.

[Joe]

But it did work out for him because the flop comes king, queen, nine. So ace queen has top pair, but the 10 comes giving the small blind the straight, and the river was no help. So he ends up busting ace, Queen with Jack 3. Ace Queen ended up in 103rd place, which is respectable, but, no, not what you're thinking. That's very little consolation as you're walking away.

[Elle]

Yeah. And I wouldn't if you. I don't know if you're gonna add the link to that video as well, but quite the interesting commentary.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Elle]

From. From both the person who scoops that pot who mistakenly was calling a big blind instead of an all in. That was interesting to say the least.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Because I thought for sure goner. And he took the whole thing.

[Joe]

And you even hear somebody in the background being like, you want that call all day long. Just didn't work out in this case.

[Elle]

Right, so. Exactly.

[Joe]

That's poker for you.

[Elle]

Disappointments and surprises around every turn.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

Yeah, that's what I'll say.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Elle]

Someone who is very familiar and is also just rolling like crazy lately. My girl, Kristen Foxen, she is on fire right now. I'm super excited for her because I feel like the last couple of years, we've seen her in person at the series or been watching. Yes. She has been just accomplishing, accomplishing, accomplishing over and over and over in different tournaments and different styles of play. But she's also made it a point to be in more high roller events, to be visible as a female player. But she just took down the 25k super high roller.

[Joe]

Yeah. And earned how much?

[Elle]

A lot.

[Joe]

$1.77 million.

[Elle]

Yeah. And the whole reason I said what I mentioned earlier is because she's just really feels that this is, I mean, it's the biggest win so far. But also the guts and the determination and the preparation it takes to play in these stakes is different. And so she's pushing herself as a player. And I think you mentioned, you know, at what point are we going to say she's a great female player versus she's a great tournament player?

[Joe]

She's a great player overall.

[Elle]

Yeah, she really.

[Joe]

Yeah, I know that, you know, because she's at the top of that women's what was all time earning earning list.

[Elle]

Absolutely.

[Joe]

So everybody says she's a great female player, but yeah, at some point you've got to say she's just a great player.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And I'm going to put you on the spot because I sent you a video and I know you've had a lot going on, so I don't know if you saw that either, but she was at a table with Cabrell and actually Texas Mike and Cabrel at the same time. Yeah, Texas Mike Busted. Busted her and her and Cabrel had a few words.

[Elle]

Oh, interesting, interesting. Have you guys been able to see that yet?

[April]

I haven't seen it, no. But it's so great to see, you know, Kristen. I feel like every time we join you guys around the table, we're talking about Kristen one way or another. But it's just, honestly, it's so great to see, you know, women play this sport and do so well. And it's such an inspiration, you know, to the other women. And when you, you know, you talk about Kristen, you know, stepping up her game and playing in these larger stakes, you know, putting herself out there and, you know, rising up to that challenge. And I mean, it really does speak. A lot of women are, you know, not as confident to step in and play poker. I think it's great to see this. And it encourages other women to step in and play. And it doesn't have to be at the stakes that Kristen is playing at. I mean, step into your local room and play $100 ladies tournament. Shameless. Plug to Rivers, because that's coming up. You know, step in and play these, these small tournaments and get your feet wet and try it out. You know, join in a little bit of the friendly banter that goes in the room and the camaraderie. You know, I think if more women did it, I think they'll find that this sport is a lot more fun and less pressure than some of the television leads us to in such a

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

historically male dominated field. It really is great to see women excel. I love it as a woman. I love seeing a room full of women for a ladies tournament. It's amazing. Kudos to her and I will have to watch.

[Elle]

Yes, please do. It's, it's, it was quite impressive. But also, I guess she is a running theme when we're together. So sorry, sorry for that repeat, but

[Joe]

I'll make sure that we add something in there next time, even if she hasn't won't.

[Elle]

But I'd love to echo and just agree with everything that both of you just said. Is it, it's invigorating and it's encouraging because you're using skills that you don't realize you're going to apply somewhere else. And the one thing that I, I walked into, you know, there's, it's no secret I married into poker and I walked into it completely blind. Had no idea this was his, this was Joe's, you know, favor favorite activ, leisure activity and fun. And I ended up learning and now I can't get enough of it. So it is really nice when you have an example in front of you to say that's a goal I can make for myself or I'm going to walk into whatever room and sit down at whatever table with as much confidence as she does. If I put forth the effort in learning the game and learning myself at the table. And that is what I find encouraging about her. And that's what she, that's what she said when she was interviewed was, I just hope this was exciting for me as a personal accomplishment, but I hope that it encourages other people to just try the game.

[Joe]

Right.

[Elle]

Enjoy it, play at your level where you are and continue to grow. So super excited. And then also another big name this week, Mike Holtz. Yeah, tell us all about what Mike's been doing.

[Joe]

So he, he had one bracelet that was online. He took a pretty big ribbing over time because they were like, well, it's not a real bracelet. You want it online. But.

[Elle]

Oh, is this during the, the podcast that he, is it common to you, Toron?

[Joe]

No, I mean, just in general, people are, you know, they hide behind social media and we'll say all kinds of crazy things, of course, but it's a

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

real physical bracelet, though. It is not real.

[Elle]

Exactly.

[Joe]

But he also, he has now won his second bracelet and this was in a live setting at the fifteen hundred dollar Super Turbo Bounty.

[Elle]

And would you catch me never sitting at that table?

[Joe]

I don't know what a Super Turbo. I don't know Super Turbo is in World Series times because the, their, their tournaments are typically so long. Anyway, Super Turbo, maybe what we're used to.

[Elle]

Okay, well, I don't know. It's a fair point, actually.

[Joe]

He outlasted over 2100 people. He won 238,000 plus. And it was the biggest score of his career.

[Elle]

Right.

[Joe]

You know, he's.

[Elle]

And he was obviously so excited because again, we've talked about social media and how we're all actually watching everything from the WSOP. I mean, Cloud 9 is a. Not even touching how you could tell he was just speaking in all different directions and talking about the sweatpants he was wearing, like, but he was excited.

[Joe]

So he also, during his acceptance speech up on the stage.

[Elle]

Oh, yes.

[Joe]

He was like, I want to start by acknowledging that I have been hard on Maurice Hawkins and you know, I want to apologize. And then he says for absolutely nothing,

[Elle]

which why I even mention that, because there's that comp, that competitive spirit amongst poker players.

[Joe]

No love lost between those two for sure.

[Elle]

But again, the game's competitive. He's excited for his win. I don't blame him.

[Joe]

Yeah, the thing, the reason that I like this, this one from Mike Holtz, is that he plays a lot.

[Elle]

Yes, he does.

[Joe]

And so it's kind of one of those reminders that consistency and putting yourself out there for a long time usually puts good players in position for big moments like this. So congratulations to him.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

He's walking around with two bracelets now.

[Joe]

Yes, exactly.

[April]

One for each wrist.

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

Yeah, wear them on the same wrist so they jingle.

[Elle]

Girls know. Stick with girls. We know. It's true. It's absolutely true. Gets people's attention for sure. So also, something exciting that we can actually talk about finally is bluffers. If you're wanting to get in on the WSOP action and you haven't quite saved up the bankroll or the extra cash to fly or drive or get there. Bluffers Poker, that hosted our satellite tournaments to our August Poker Cruise, has a package satellite to the wsop.

[Joe]

Right.

[Elle]

So for the, for the main event.

[Joe]

Right. So it's airfare, hotel and Main event

[Elle]

buy in, which is huge.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Elle]

And you can also speak to how huge that is, because this is how you played in the World Series.

[Joe]

That is true.

[Elle]

That is many moons ago.

[Joe]

I played it in a free poker league and made it that way. But yeah, it is worth it is exactly how I. How I got in there. And.

[Elle]

But there's certain steps that you have.

[Joe]

This is done in steps. Now you can buy into each step.

[Elle]

Okay.

[Joe]

So you don't have to do it that way. But the first step is only $3.

[Elle]

Yeah. It's worth the chance.

[Joe]

Can you imagine if you made it the whole whole way through and you just had a $3 investment for a $12,000 trip?

[Guest Poker Room Staff]

We're speaking of bragging rights, right?

[Elle]

Agreed. Agreed. So first step is three bucks. Second step is 14.

[Joe]

Third step, 1:35.

[Elle]

Third step is 1. 135.

[Joe]

Yeah. And fourth step is 1,260. So that's the main. That's your winner take all event there.

[Elle]

And there was a person that actually cashed for this particular package last year, I think.

[Joe]

Caitlin Sloan. Yes.

[Elle]

And she ca. So not only did she make it free entry also walked out.

[Joe]

Right.

[Elle]

Well, maybe not free entry. Depends on which step she played. But still close. As close to free. Free 99 as you can get, you know, so I pass the word around. Toss that information like confetti. If you want more information, you can check out actually the bluffers Facebook page, Right. To join in. They have tons and tons of tournaments. They have leader leaderboards. They have all sorts of things there. We go with every day, every day of the week. They've got like a Sunday starter, Sunday at noon eastern, a bounty tournament, lots of rebuys. There's more Sunday evening. I'm pretty sure if you want to play poker at any time of the day, there's somebody on the bluffers platform that wants to play poker with you.

[Joe]

Right.

[Elle]

So make sure people know if you're interested, check them out. What other information do you have about it?

[Joe]

Well, they can. They can click on that banner on our website to get to it as well.

[Elle]

Okay.

[Joe]

So then from there, I want to circle back because we. We started to talk about the main of our. The Antiap tour stop in Schenectady in September.

[Elle]

Right.

[Joe]

But I want to come back and talk more about that because I know, you know, it's. It's an. First of all, it's one of our favorite events to go to every year.

[Elle]

We look forward to it, and that's for sure.

[Joe]

Now I. Now I can't wait to go on that walkway. The, the walk by the river. Yeah, but tell us about some of the more some of the other action that we've got going on during that time.

[April]

All right, so we've got limited information. This is all asterisk unofficial. Waiting on New York State gaming approval. But this is the gist of the plan. So last year we had limited events that were not the mini event and the main event. You know, that was some of the feedback we received as people wanted some more opportunities to play in some of the other feature events. So we are going to be expanding the schedule for this tournament. We're going to start with some main event satellites right at the beginning of the month. The first two Tuesdays and Thursdays we are going to run the milestone satellites for the main event. These will be the cheaper versions of the satellites with one in ten advancing to the main. We will then do the Sunday right before the event kickoff. We will run two more satellites for the main event before we start on Monday the 14th with the Mini main event. So we will run the traditional six flights of the mini main. The guarantee this year is going to increase to $100,000 with the same $400 buy in as last year. The main event we are going to expand to one additional flight. As of right now the plan is to run that as a $1,200 main event. That is a slight increase from last year. But we are also going to increase the guarantee to 250,000. So hopefully those the price points and the guarantees we feel pretty good about. But here is the planned list of feature events. We are going to feature a monster stack which is 100,000 in chips. We're going to do the Win the button tournament. We'll do a double green chip bounty. We'll do a PLO tournament. We're going to try a $450 black chip bounty tournament. That'll have a 25,000 guarantee on it. A 200 Omaha 8 or better limit tournament. That one's just going to be straight Omaha 8 or better. This year we're not going to mix it with stud. We will do our classic seniors 50 plus tournament, a deuces wild which will aptly cost $222 and it will be on September 22nd. So all the deuces.

[Elle]

That is so fun. That's actually all four of them.

[April]

Yes. On the final day we will run our classic Rivers Revival tournament. And then for those who want a last minute chance to get into the main event on Wednesday the 23rd and Thursday the 24th, we will run one and five milestone satellites. Those will cost just 285 to get into for your chance at a $1200 seat.

[Elle]

Well, once that New York board approves, please send over so we can add that to our website and people can start looking forward to that and planning and planning their visits and their stays and get hotels locked in, because let me just tell you, if you're coming to play, you want to stay there. I promise it's. I promise.

[Joe]

Beautiful property.

[Elle]

I promise it is. Literally when Joe said this is something we look forward to every year, we. We love coming to River Schenectady, and

[Joe]

we look forward to seeing anybody. I. I know we've already had a couple of people that have said, give us the dates because we want to come.

[Elle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

So some of our Patreon team is

[Elle]

gonna make the trip.

[Joe]

Yeah. So. So looking forward to seeing the A team out there and looking forward to seeing you guys.

[Elle]

Thank you so much for joining us today.

[April]

Thank you.

[Joe]

As always, it's a pleasure being around the table with you.

[Elle]

Likewise.

[Podcast Host]

Big blinds, big stakes. Raise it up. Let's make no mistake.

[Joe]

Elliot Schter joins us each week to say how he would rule in situations that come up in your games. And he's with us again this week. Elliot, how are you?

[Elliot Schter]

I'm doing very well, thanks. How are you doing, Joe?

[Joe]

Good. We've got a little bit of a rain spell here, which is much, much, much needed, so all of the plants and everything can breathe once again. And then we'll. Then we'll be back into the heat. I think it's supposed to be 95 tomorrow. So we do have a call the floor this week sent in by Wes Roman. And Wes says that for most of this session, players had been rabbit hunting. And in case people don't know what that means, I assume most. Most of you know what rabbit hunting is, but in case you don't, if you fold and want to see the last two cards or one card of the. Of the board, then you ask the dealer to run that out, and in some places, they will let you. I would say probably the majority of places that are not home games will not allow it.

[Elliot Schter]

The vast majority, yeah.

[Joe]

But in this session, it sounds like players had been rabbit hunting occasionally whenever a hand ended on the flop return. Nobody had objected to this point, and the dealer had been happy to peel off the remaining board cards before moving on to the next hand. Right then a hand came up where Wes says, I was heads up with Another player on the turn. I bet they folded. The player who folded immediately asked to see the river before the dealer could put out the card. I said I didn't want to see it. The rest of the table was apparently surprised that he had made this declaration because he hadn't objected to any of the previous rabbit hunts during the session. But Wes says, I explained that I wasn't in the other hands, so I didn't really care if they wanted to torture themselves.

[Patrick]

Right.

[Joe]

But this time it was my hand, and I didn't want to know if the river would have improved the player who folded. And I didn't think the player who folded had any right to see the card he hadn't paid to see.

[Elliot Schter]

There's some water.

[Joe]

The player who folded argued that rabbit hunting had been happening all night and it was absurd for me to object when I'm in the hand. We never called the floor. I thought this was interesting. We never called the floor because the player who wanted to see the river offered to tip the dealer $5 to see it. And I wasn't going to object to the dealer getting a little extra money. But my question is, if a room allows rabbit hunting, does either player involved in the hand have veto power? Or if rabbit hunting is allowed, it's just allowed. And that's the precedent. So it is.

[Elliot Schter]

In the words of Elmer Fudd, be very, very quiet. We are hunting rabbits. Most rooms don't allow it. I don't know one that does, although I'd imagine it occasionally still happens. And there's a couple of reasons. Primarily, it's a waste of time. Yeah, most players are playing under a clock, whether it's high hand or tournaments or. Or just bad beats. So you got promos or the tournament clock running. You want to see the next hand. The dealer wants to see the next hand. They. They only get on a tipped on a per hand basis. They got to deal another one. Likewise for the house wheeling in rape games. We're only getting our revenue on a per hand basis. Deal the next hand. So, yeah, most houses don't allow. The other reason is we don't need players becoming bitter and angry after seeing what could have been right. It shouldn't be happening. I don't allow it in any of the rooms I've operated, and it will continue to not allow it. That being said, if it's been going on all night, you have a right to object. You're in the hand, you made the bet. I don't see why you wouldn't have the right to Overrule. The excuse is, oh, we. We've been doing it all night. It doesn't matter if it's against the rules. It's against the rules. I'm pretty sure if you're pulled over for speeding and you explain to the officer how all the other cars were speeding and he's not gonna, oh, well, let me go get them, too.

[Joe]

You.

[Elliot Schter]

You can go. I'll get them first. No, he's gonna say, well, yeah, but I caught you.

[Joe]

I actually tried that argument when I was, like, 18. It didn't work.

[Elliot Schter]

Well, did it?

[Joe]

No, it did not. I was like, I'm just following the flow of traffic. And they were like, yeah, well, like you said, we got you.

[Elliot Schter]

So it's not gonna work with a police officer. It's not gonna work in a court of law. If you. If you explain to the judge how seven people were taking $20 bills out of that cash register, how come I'm the one that got arrested? The judge isn't. Isn't really going to be too concerned with those other seven people at that point in time. So the same goes for. For this. I mean, if it's against the rules, it's against the rules. Many things in poker are not up to discussion or debate. Players generally can't suspend rules just because they feel like it or the group agrees to it. The rules still apply only to keep the game fair. As far as rabbit hunting, not only does it keep it fair, but it keeps it moving fast. So, I mean, I've never been around a room that would basically, oh, you can rabbit how all you want. Don't worry about it. Especially if you bribe them or tip them. Right. I mean, I appreciate the fact that they were tipping the dealer for their waste of time, but I. Speaking as an operator, where's our share of the revenue? Where's our lost revenue? Because we're not getting more hands out.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Elliot Schter]

I certainly want all of the dealers to make all the money they can, but the business model sort of means that we get to make some money, too. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, I think. I think our. Our hero here has applied some pretty good logic. I mean, if you're in the hand and you win the hand and you don't want to see the next card, I. I think that's eminently reasonable. I don't have a problem with that. It makes sense.

[Joe]

His point about torturing yourselves is. Is valid, too. Like, I. I never understood why anybody wanted to see what card would have come out, because it's either going to Be, oh, I can pat myself on the back or it's going to haunt you for the next three hands.

[Elliot Schter]

Yeah. So I mean you're welcome to call every bet in front of you. You'll see the next card.

[Joe]

Yeah. Well, do you think that these like a poker club like in Texas, you know, that person is paying for that seat by the hour, so the club is technically making the money regardless. So maybe they're, they allow a little bit more leeway with things like rabbit hunting or whatever.

[Elliot Schter]

That's entirely possible. So yeah, the, the club based model and, and the bigger games in casinos tend to charge time as opposed to a rake per hand in the casinos, you're still not going to find a whole lot of rabbit hunting. You may get the occasional river in those time games. And again, it's certainly going to happen too often in Texas. I mean, shoot, there is no regulatory body. There is no standard rule book. I would assume that for tournaments, most of them are using TDA rules. Hopefully they are. As far as cash, they're all coming up with their own compiled rule books from, I'd imagine, several sources. A couple of them are saying explicitly they use the, the World Series of Poker cash game rules. Even then there's no rabbit hunting. As a dealer, it's great. I mean if they're going to be tipping for the privilege, the house has already gotten their revenue. I mean, I see your point. If I'm another player in the game, I just want to see the next hand. I mean if you're, if you're already paid up for your rake for the entire hour as a player, it would make sense that you would want to see as many hands as possible for the time you've already paid for. You're not paying for time you've used, you're paying for time you're going to use. Just like renting an apartment or a car, you're paying for the use of not paying for what you have used. Got to be very picky about the use of words you use. So you're paying for the future, you're not paying for the past. So yeah, I don't want to see anybody wasting time. I want to see my next hand.

[Joe]

Yeah. And that's where if I were, if I were Wes in this game, I probably would have said something about the rabbit hunting. Even if I wasn't in the hand, I probably would have said I can we not, can we just forget the rabbit hunting, you know, the very first time somebody said it? So that's, that's actually the other side of what I was thinking is, is he only said it because he was in the hand. But honestly, it's slowing the game down for everybody at the table.

[Elliot Schter]

Right. We don't need to rabbit hunt every single card. Well, plus, I mean, if you're not seeing enough rivers in a game, I mean, that sounds like a pretty tough game to be playing in. I mean, if everybody's making moves before the river comes down, heaven forbid, or even before the turn comes down, I mean, shoot, you may meet an easier lineup to play against.

[Joe]

Yeah, I mean, that's not to say they could just be everybody's wild.

[Elliot Schter]

So that's entirely plausible too.

[Joe]

But yeah, Wes, I would say to speak up before you're in the hand, but it sounds like if that room is allowing it, then you have the right to say no.

[Elliot Schter]

You have the right, I guess. No, I mean, if they allow it, they allow it. I don't know if they allow it. I don't know if they're going to allow a veto or, or a disallowance just because a player on the hand objects.

[Joe]

So, yeah, I do, I do like that the dealer was able to make a little extra money off of it, I think.

[Elliot Schter]

Yeah, but at some point, I mean, if the room allows it, that's great. If the room doesn't allow it, he's basically taking bribes to violate the rules. And that doesn't work in the long run and generally doesn't work in the short run either. If he's not going to speak up for that and all of a sudden he's going to start not enforcing other rules and that's there. Chaos reigns and then the game falls.

[Joe]

Right. Right. There you go, Wes. I appreciate you sending that in. Rabbit hunting is not one that we've talked about before so much.

[Elliot Schter]

No,

[Joe]

mostly because it's not allowed in most rooms. But. But yeah, I do appreciate that. And if anyone has a call to floor, they would like to know how Elliot would rule. Send it to [e-mail]. elliot, we'll see you next week.

[Elliot Schter]

Absolutely. Look forward to it.

[Podcast Host]

Patrick's a fish, but he's learning. In this hand might be his last.

[Joe]

Welcome to Hand of the week where Patrick, our resident fish and I dive into listener submitted hands each week. We tackle everything from questionable bluffs to hero calls and the hands that make you scratch your head. Whether you're looking for strategy tips or you just want to see if we would have played it any better, we've got you covered. Patrick, how's it going?

[Patrick]

If you're wondering if I'm still riding high. The answer is absolutely yes.

[Joe]

All right, at some point, it's time to move on and act like you've been there before.

[Patrick]

I have not been there before, and I will absolutely do that before the next Patreon game in three weeks. Until then.

[Elliot Schter]

Okay.

[Patrick]

Going to bask in my glory. I'm going to remind anyone that walks in my presence or is on the other end of a mic. Yeah, it feels good. You know, what we didn't do the other day, you know, talking to unl. We never actually did, you know, talk about the winning hand. You want to chat about that real quick before we get in?

[Joe]

Okay. Yeah. Because it was kind of a cooler on Mortise's part.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Where he. He had what he had. He had.

[Patrick]

I've got it right here in front of me. He had 8.5of hearts. You know, it's. It's just here for anyone watching online, it's just saved in the archive. I have not framed it yet. Once my wife lets me have a true, true male, you know, Dan, if you will, that. That might be framed. Yeah. So mortis had 8.5of hearts and I had jacks.

[Joe]

Okay.

[Patrick]

And there was. There was a handful of raises to. To, you know, to get going back and forth of, you know, testing each other and then calls. And then the flop came out. Jack of hearts, five of spades, queen of hearts.

[Joe]

Okay.

[Patrick]

So I had trips, and he had his heart draw and a pair of fives.

[Joe]

Yeah. And then the turn came.

[Patrick]

And the turn came the five of clubs.

[Joe]

How much betting was on the flop?

[Patrick]

There was a decent amount. He let in. And. And I. And I called. He let in pretty solid, if I remember. And he called. Or. Excuse me. And then I just called. I just called. Yeah. So slow. Played that one, you know.

[Joe]

And you called knowing you were ahead, though, is that.

[Patrick]

Oh, yeah, 100%. Yeah. Yeah, 100% knew I was ahead. I mean, unless he's got queens, you know, that's. But I didn't make him on it. I mean, he could have, but I wasn't thinking he did, you know, in that case. And then the turn came the five of clubs, which was ultimately Mortises downfall, unfortunately, because I paired the board. I've got my boat, he's got his trips, and still a flush draw.

[Joe]

And so he's feeling like even. You know, even if I'm behind, I've got outs.

[Patrick]

Even though he didn't many outs in his head. So he. He let in pretty good. I raised then and he snapped all in and it was a snap call and then he's drawing dead.

[Joe]

Yeah, Well, I think the more impressive to me, and I don't know if I mentioned this when you were with us on Table Talk or not, the more impressive part to me was how you were down considerably. I think it was 64,000 to like 20 something thousand.

[Patrick]

And he had me doubled up for sure. Yeah.

[Joe]

And I thought for sure you were done at that point, that you were just gonna dunk off the rest of your chips and, and you didn't. You. You played. You played poker and you came back and you won. So congrats again.

[Patrick]

It was a lot of fun. It was a lot of fun. Can't wait to do it again. I will see how quick. And you know that that happens next week especially or next month with the bounty on me. But you know, that being said, it is.

[Joe]

It is a different game than the bounty's on you, so.

[Patrick]

Oh, there's a lot.

[Joe]

I mean, I think the bounty probably was on you anyway. Just people like to. To knock you out anyway. But it's going to be extra incentive now.

[Patrick]

It is.

[Joe]

But in the meantime, we do have a hand of the week that was sent in to us by Mike Riley. All right, And Mike says in this hand, effective stacks are about 400 playing 1 3. And he's in the cutoff with the two. Oh, you've got the ducks, pocket deuces, two of spades, two of clubs. And we've got a good position, too. So a player from under the gun plus one and middle position, both limp and. And before me, I'm in the cut off with the pocket twos. So, Patrick, we love the deuces.

[Patrick]

Good position, paired up. We love twos. I'm probably going to 10. Probably should be closer to 12, but I'm definitely going to race two callers or two lippers. Probably should. Probably should be 12, but I'm going, I'm going 10.

[Joe]

All right, well, I, I feel like this is one of those hands where we're either going to have a huge upside if we hit our set or we're going to fold and move on.

[Patrick]

So I'll say I'll save an extra dollar. Two raids.

[Joe]

Yeah. What we've have position on the table, except, I mean, most of the table, I should say from the, from the cutoff.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Which only matters really if we flop a set, because in this case it's no set, no bet for me. You know, I like that.

[Patrick]

Did you just coin that phrase or is That a.

[Joe]

No. No, I didn't. I never came up with that. That is. That is.

[Patrick]

See, this is where. This is where we're still learning terms over here on the. The novice sides, so. Okay,

[Joe]

I feel like if we raise here, we're raising a hand that's going to miss the flop over 80% of the time, so. Almost 90% of the time.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And then we're stuck with a weak hand and a bigger pot, so. So I'm going to just call. But I. I want to pose this question to you, Patrick. What if you were under the gun or under the gun plus one with pocket twos? What are you doing? You know, the one who's learning the power of a fold.

[Patrick]

We did address that. That is my new favorite word. Not gamble anymore, but fold. You know, other things would go into it, you know, when during the game it is, you know, how. How's the run been going? I. I, you know, in a weird, silly, stupid, idiotic, Whatever adjective you want to use, I do actually like to think it's like my hand, so, you know, if a flop ever comes out with a two and I'm playing, you better look out. That being said, I'm probably gonna call and see the flop, but, you know,

[Joe]

I was actually. I was trying to hit a buzzer, but I couldn't find one.

[Patrick]

That's okay. The cloud, the. The crowd laughing is right. I'm probably still calling and seeing the flop, so.

[Joe]

But at least you're only calling from under the gun. You're not raising.

[Patrick]

No, I'm not raising. No. And if someone raises, then, you know what? Here's my three bucks, so, you know, I'm good. But I'm. I'm gonna. I'm gonna call and see the flop if I can.

[Joe]

That's fair. All right.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Well, in this one, you're raising to 10. I'm just calling. Mike says normally pocket deuces aren't setting the world on fire, but with a couple of limpers and deep stacks, I decide to over limp and try to flop a set. The button folds, and both blinds come along. So he just limped in as well. Now there's five players to see a flop, and there's $15 in the pot. And the flop comes. King of diamonds, eight of clubs, two of hearts.

[Patrick]

Let's go.

[Elliot Schter]

Bet.

[Joe]

You wish.

[Patrick]

You bet.

[Podcast Host]

No.

[Joe]

The small blind checks, the big blind checks, the first limper checks, and the second limper bets $10.

[Patrick]

I'm ready to get a few folks out of this hand. Ten's probably Going to take care of at least one or two of them. Anyone holding kings or eights has got us. I would like to get a few more folks out. I'm raising.

[Joe]

Okay. What are you going to raise? 2.

[Patrick]

What was the bet? You said? 10.

[Joe]

10.

[Patrick]

I'm going 25.

[Joe]

Okay. I also want to raise. I also want to put some more in here. I think our thinking on the reasoning is different, so it's not for me so much about wanting to get people out as much as it is wanting to build a pot now. Fair. But I also don't want to fold out hands that have a king in them. So I'm probably gonna go a little bit bigger than you. I want to go 35. And if I'm. If I've been at the table for a while and I think that we can get people to call 45, I would go that high. But 35 is my. My safe bet here. So Mike says with several players still to act and plenty of hands that can continue. I raised to 35. We are on the same page.

[Patrick]

There you go. You and Mike.

[Joe]

Today, the blinds fold. The first limper folds, and the better calls. So now we're heads up to the turn. The pot is $85.

[Patrick]

Before we move on, let me just put. Before we move on, let me pose this question. Obviously, we're not at this table, but do you think 25 gets one. One more caller?

[Joe]

No, I think. I think everybody else missed probably, and they weren't playing. They weren't going anywhere. But that's a good point. You know, maybe

[Patrick]

you got to know the table a little bit too. I mean, you know, while we're playing. So, you know, your table.

[April]

Sure.

[Joe]

The pot's $85. The turn is the nine of spades. So the board is king of diamonds, eight of clubs, two of hearts, nine of spades. And our opponent checks.

[Patrick]

We're making them on, you know, king, 10, king, jack, king, queen, you know.

[Joe]

Right.

[Patrick]

That's where we're at. Right.

[Joe]

Ace, eight. Yeah, maybe. But some. Yeah, somewhere in that. That realm.

[Patrick]

So we went 35 on top. I. I'm probably going 50. 45 or 50.

[Joe]

Okay. You and I are just, like, $10 behind each other. Because I was thinking 60. I. I think that top pair hands will be too sticky, stickier than they should be. Like, if somebody has that king, Jack, King, 10, something like that, then they're gonna call too much. So we definitely. We're on the same page about betting here. So, yeah, 60 bucks. Mike says, I decide to keep betting and building the pot, Mike bets $60. We are right on the same page.

[Patrick]

You two are spot on to it.

[Joe]

My opponent thinks for a few seconds and calls. Now there's $205 in the middle. And the river is the jack of clubs. So final board reads king of diamonds. Eight of clubs, two of hearts, nine of spades, Jack of clubs. And our opponent checks again for the third time.

[Patrick]

Keep, keep pressing.

[Joe]

Yeah, I mean, Queen 10 got there, right?

[Patrick]

Yeah, but we, I mean, I mean, I saw that too, but I mean we're really making him. It's a lot of calling on, not a. I mean, it's not very hopeful.

[Joe]

Right. And I don't think, I don't think he's gotten this far with 10, 7 either.

[Sling TV Advertiser]

No.

[Joe]

So I think, I mean, queen 10 is, is in that realm probably. But with him checking a third time then I, I'm, I'm not afraid of it too much. If he has it, then we'll hear about it, I'm sure.

[Patrick]

Yeah, I would imagine so.

[Joe]

So you said to keep pushing. What are you thinking?

[Patrick]

I. Probably in that 120 range. 115 to 120 range.

[Joe]

Yeah, I was, I was thinking 110, 120. So, yeah, that's going to leave us something like 200 behind somewhere close to it, maybe a little less. Bottom set's still good. I mean, still a strong hand. I, I'm certainly not going to miss value here because we're afraid of really just Queen 10. Because I feel like if he had a set of kings or he had a set of eights, we would have already heard about it.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe]

So really the only concern now would be queen 10. I don't think 10, 7. Mike says at this point I'm trying to put him on a range. He could certainly have a king. Maybe a hand like King Jack got there. That's true. King Jack could have definitely got there with a two pair.

[Patrick]

Oh, that's definitely.

[Joe]

There are other two pair combinations available now. Queen 10 just made a straight. But after checking to me three times, I wasn't convinced he had a monster. I also felt like a lot of one pair hands would have a hard time calling a large bet. So I settled on what I thought was a reasonable value bet of $125. They immediately announced call. I tabled my set of deuces. My opponent smiled and rolled over. Queen of spades. 10 of spades for the river straight.

[Elle]

What

[Joe]

he just called with the nuts. Is that even legal? Can he just call with the nuts

[Patrick]

there, you know, I think it's, I think it's legal and I think it's one hell of a slow play. I mean, he's sitting there, he is banking on us continuing the action. Here's my thing though. How do you not if you're sit. If you're, if you're middle position, how do you not come over the top and shove right there?

[Joe]

Right.

[Patrick]

What, what are we doing?

[Joe]

Like, I know that he can't check if he's last to act there with the nuts, but I guess the rule is just that you can't check. I'll just, I'll have to ask Elliot about this next week because when you're last act, if you check, that's a penalty in this case. He called, so maybe that's legal. Damn.

[Patrick]

The is king.

[Joe]

I'm glad he didn't raise.

[Patrick]

Yeah, well, let me ask you this. If he does raise, do you take a step back and wonder if he's got it?

[Joe]

Yeah, I don't know. I'm not sure I would have called off my last 200, but it definitely would have, it definitely would have put me in the blender. Like I would have been tossing and turning on this one.

[Patrick]

I think I'll lose all my chips if you raise this.

[Joe]

I mean, I may, I, I, I may.

[Patrick]

I mean, because that to me, he checks, he checks to us three times in a row and then he comes over the top after we bet. That to me, that is, you know, it's very well, a guy that is sitting there going, well, this is the only way that I can lot loose chips.

[Joe]

I mean, that's fair. That's fair too. But the fact that he checked the whole time like he didn't have anything. And then, I mean, really, he just kind of continued his story at the end, checking and getting us to put the money in, but.

[Patrick]

Ouch.

[Joe]

Yeah. Mike says my questions are, should I have checked back the river once that board got so coordinated? And no, I, no, I, like I said, I'm not, I'm not interested in missing value because Queen 10 got there.

[Patrick]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And I don't think there's much else that I needed to think about. He says, if you are betting, do you like my 125 sizing?

[Patrick]

I think it's perfect.

[Joe]

We went a little bit smaller, but 110 to 130 I think was the range I was thinking. So I wanted to go on the bottom end of that in the hopes of getting even a really weak king, like king four, something like that to call as well. But yeah, 125 is fine.

[Patrick]

And yeah, I think, I think I lose that hand every single time.

[Joe]

Then his last question. Is this simply a cooler or should I have recognized that a limp call, call, call in line can contain a lot more queen tens than I gave it credit for? I think you did recognize it. I mean, he mentioned Queen 10 got there. Just because, just because you see it as a possibility, that doesn't mean you, you have to give them credit for having it.

[Patrick]

And I act on it.

[Joe]

That may be one of the biggest leaks in my game too, though, so I don't know that I can speak great about that. I can, I can see. I did it in the home game, just not that long ago. I called out the person's hand, knew that they had king jack and still called off all of my chips. They had the high end of the straight and I had the low end of the straight and just couldn't find a fold button. It was the second hand of the night, too.

[Patrick]

Ouch.

[Joe]

Yeah, so I, I, I bought more chips in on that one, but I don't think that you have to give them credit for it there. I can't believe you. We all got off lucky that he didn't do anything more than just call, so. Yeah, Mike, thanks for sending that in. It's a good one. It's, I think it is just a cooler.

[Patrick]

Yeah, I agree.

[Joe]

If anyone has a hand of the week that they would like to know how Patrick and I would play it, send it to podcastanyupmagazine.com Patrick, we'll see you next week.

[Patrick]

Sounds like a plan T, buddy.

[Podcast Host]

From the flop to the turn we play it all changing Hearts and diamonds never fold in the boots we're dealing stories that clean poker legends rise on the 18.

[Joe]

It's a huge mistake to assume that the loudest player at the table is the most dangerous. Don't get me wrong, sometimes a loud player is a great player. Sometimes they're just entertaining or trying to create action, and sometimes they're doing it just because that's just who they are. But after a while, you start to realize the players you shouldn't really be paying attention to. A lot of the times are the ones saying almost nothing at all. There's this confidence that comes with not needing attention. The loud player wants you looking at them. The, the quiet player, they really, they want you looking anywhere else. And poker has always been a game of information, right? Well, one of the most valuable pieces of information is understanding what motivates people. Some players, they want recognition, somewhat validation. Some want everyone to know they're the smartest person in the room. The truly dangerous players, I think, don't need any of that. They just need your chips. A great example of this contrast is between Martin Cabral and Kristin Foxen. Martin Cabral, he's impossible to ignore. He's talking, he's joking, he's needling opponents, he creates controversy and makes sure every camera in the room knows exactly where he is. Love him or hate him, he does command attention. Kristin Foxen is almost the exact opposite. She shows up, she plays, she wins six bracelets, millions in tournament earnings, one of the most respected players in the game, and yet somehow she manages to accomplish all of that without making herself the story. The story is her results. All of this is not just true. In poker. We do see it everywhere. We've somehow convinced ourselves that confidence has to be loud, that success has to be announced, or leadership means being the person talking the most. But some of the strongest people you'll ever meet are the ones who don't feel the need to constantly prove anything. They're comfortable letting their work speak for them at the poker table. Those players are especially dangerous because people tend to underestimate them. A quiet player folds for an hour, and everyone assumes they're weak or they. They don't celebrate a win, so everyone assumes they're passive. A quiet player isn't joining into that bad beat story that everybody's telling. And so they all assume they're not paying attention. Meanwhile, they've been collecting information the entire time. They know who's tilting or who's opening too wide. They know who can't fold top pair or exactly where the money is coming from. And when the moment arrives, they'll take it. There won't be a speech, there won't be a performance. It'll just be action. As poker players, we should probably spend less time worrying about being noticed and more time worrying about being effective. Because the goal isn't to be remembered for how much you talked. The goal is to be remembered for how well you played at the table. Don't automatically focus on the loudest person. Take a look at the player quietly stacking chips in seat four, the one who hasn't said much all day, the one nobody is paying attention to. Because in poker, well, honestly, in life, that's usually the person you should be learning from the most. And who knows, maybe that's the image you should be building for yourself. That's today's one outer and that's today's show. I'll see you next week, a team. And until then, I'll see you at the tables.

[April]

The Antioch Podcast is a production of anyupmagazine.com contact the show at Podcasts at any up or call the show at 540-339-7741.

[Sling TV Advertiser]

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[April]

email to editorneupmagazine.com Tired of juggling sales

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