Ep 30. Experience and Dedication Matter

Summary

AR NET Podcast - Ep 30: "Experience and Dedication Matter"

Host: David Bratton
Date: July 28, 2026
Guests: Larry Binky (Independent Candidate for Sheriff of Lonoke County), Julie Binky (Retired Law Enforcement, Trainer)

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Episode Overview

This episode of AR NET focuses on law enforcement experience, community leadership, and public service in Arkansas, spotlighting Larry Binky’s candidacy for Lonoke County Sheriff and the career achievements of his wife Julie. The conversation examines the importance of experience, training, policy, and proper evidence handling in modern law enforcement, as well as community engagement strategies for rural and agricultural areas.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Clarifying Professional Histories and Recent News (00:51–04:22)

• Ballot Update: Larry Binky is now officially on the November ballot as an independent candidate for sheriff.
• Media Correction: A recent Cabot Leader article misattributed Julie’s 25-year law enforcement and detective background to Larry, when in fact it’s Julie’s history.
  • Quote: “It was falsely attributed to me. So I just wanted to make sure that that should be attributed to Julie.” – Larry (03:26)
  • Larry addressed the error directly with the newspaper, maintaining transparency.

2. Julie’s Pioneering Law Enforcement Career (04:24–19:59)

• Early Work: Julie’s career began with criminal justice studies and advocacy at a women’s shelter, contributing to Arkansas’ first order of protection legislation in 1991.
  • Quote: “That was actually one of my first experiences … working with some legislation.” – Julie (05:11)
• Trailblazer in Detective Roles: Among the first domestic violence detectives in Little Rock, later the city’s only rape detective; also worked homicide and sex crimes in Oklahoma City and North Little Rock.
• Experience Highlights:
  • Over 2,600 assigned cases in North Little Rock alone.
  • President of Little Rock’s Rape Crisis Center Board.
  • Trained thousands of officers in domestic violence, sexual assault, and human trafficking response.
  • Authored key training policies still in use statewide.
  • Quote: “For me... when you’re interviewing a child about sexual assault, you need as many tools on your tool belt that you can have.” – Julie (13:23)

3. Importance of Training, Policy, and Cold Case Work (19:59–36:21)

• Ongoing Professional Development: Emphasis on regular training for officers beyond the academy.
  • Policy and training must continually reflect current best practices, especially for trauma-informed responses.
  • Quote: “If the patrol response is not right, nothing’s right.” – Larry (24:37)
• Julie’s Advisory Role: Would include policy development, officer training, and cold case reviews if Larry is elected sheriff.
  • Detailed explanation of Arkansas’ statute of limitations (not retroactive, varies by year and case type).
  • Importance of filing reports even if prosecution seems out of reach, as evidence can build patterns via “404B evidence.”
    • Quote: “If people don’t make a police report, the investigators don’t know to call someone if a new report comes in on the same offender...” – Julie (36:21)
• Memorable Moment: Julie describes reuniting evidence and survivors in a cold case just before retirement, illustrating the real-life impact of diligent file review (30:22–31:56).

4. Evidence Handling and Preventing Dismissals (38:15–48:19)

• Critical Failures: Local candidate’s case recently dismissed due to evidence mishandling by the sheriff’s office.
• Best Practices: The team discusses standard and supervisory oversight for evidence collection, chain of custody, and proper documentation.
  • Quote: “It’s not a policy problem... if you don’t have an environment or a culture where that is important... you don’t have supervisory oversight...” – Larry (38:49)
  • Transition in handling rape kits: No longer refrigerated—a practical illustration of why ongoing training matters.
• Julie’s Legacy: Authored policies still in use for domestic violence and sexual assault response in North Little Rock.

5. Implementing Training in Smaller Agencies (48:28–62:19)

• Training Strategies: Small agencies need flexibility—shorter, repeated, scenario-based trainings; using “reserves” and retired officers as mentors.
• Tech Innovations: Adoption of online training modules through the Criminal Justice Institute.
• Staffing Challenges: High personnel turnover amid election uncertainty; need to leverage former officers’ expertise.

6. Agricultural Crime and Community Policing (66:00–77:49)

• Importance of Ag Crimes Investigator: Recognizing rural crime trends—farm equipment theft, vandalism, livestock issues—are vital for county well-being.
  • 75–80% of Lonoke County’s revenue comes from agriculture, so responsive policing there is essential.
  • Quote: “Everything is tied in. That’s why I think it’s important to at least give a nod to agricultural crimes as being important, very important.” – Larry (76:12)
• Farm Watch & Crime Networks: Proposed farm watch program and engagement with regional crime information networks.

7. Community Engagement & Social Media (78:02–84:16)

• Modern Outreach: Larry is active on all major platforms and emphasizes the necessity of being transparent and approachable (“radical transparency”).
  • Website: binky4sheriff.com
  • Frequent presence at polling places and venues.
  • Quote: “We just got to face it. The genie… is out of the bottle… What do we do as leaders? To be radically transparent up front.” – Larry (83:19)
• Changing Dynamics: The team reflects on how complaints and public feedback have shifted in the social media era.

8. Leadership, Mentorship, and Law Enforcement Values (84:16–92:38)

• Supervisory Experience: Larry’s approach is “working supervisor”—actively engaged, not desk-bound.
• Diversity of Officers: Julie discusses the “Three Bs” of police motivation—Betterment of society, “Just Because,” and “Bullies.” (89:43–92:38)
  • Memorable Quote: “There’s three reasons that people become police officers… The people that got on… for the betterment of society… The second B… the ‘just because-ers’… The third B, the bullies.” – Julie (89:50–91:58)
• Service-Driven Approach: Both Larry and Julie view this stage of their careers as a chance to give back, not an effort to build their own resumes.

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• On Experience:

  “If not the best, she [Julie] is one of the best trained and most experienced sex crimes detective[s] that we have in the state of Arkansas.”
  — Larry, (21:16)

• On Community Engagement:

  “The people wearing the badge are your most important asset in the organization… All those are equipment we need… but unless you invest in your personnel, you’re never going to move the needle.”
  — Larry, (56:35)

• On Statute of Limitations:

  “There is no longer a statute of limitations for child sexual assault in Arkansas. And that’s true to a point, but that legislation was not passed until 2013.”
  — Julie, (27:47)

• On Training Approach:

  “You can retain and transfer knowledge better if you do a shorter duration class over a longer time.”
  — Larry, (50:52)

• On Social Media’s Role:

  “That genie is out of the bottle… What do we do as leaders in that situation? To be radically transparent up front.”
  — Larry, (83:03)

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Timeline of Important Segments

• 00:51 — Larry and Julie rejoin the podcast; ballot update
• 03:09–04:22 — Correction of media misreporting Julie’s career
• 04:24–19:59 — Julie recounts her career and contributions to law enforcement and training
• 22:04–24:37 — Larry’s vision for policy/training if elected sheriff
• 27:47–36:21 — In-depth on statute of limitations and cold case process
• 38:15–48:19 — Evidence handling and preventing case dismissals
• 48:28–62:19 — How to implement officer training in a small agency
• 66:00–77:49 — Addressing rural/agricultural crimes and patrol strategies
• 78:02–84:16 — Social media, transparency, and community engagement tactics
• 89:43–92:38 — Julie’s “Three Bs” of policing explained

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Final Takeaways

• Experience and Dedication: Both Larry and Julie passionately advocate for ongoing training, proper policy, and hands-on leadership as the hallmarks of effective law enforcement.
• Community Matters: Localized strategies, agricultural crime prevention, and leveraging existing resources are key for Lonoke County.
• Transparency and Engagement: Modern law enforcement requires visible, responsive community outreach and transparency — especially in the digital age.
• Leadership Spirit: The couple’s commitment is rooted in service, experience, and giving back, not self-promotion.

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Social & Contact Info

• Website: binky4sheriff.com
• Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, TikTok: Search “Larry Binky for Lonoke County Sheriff”
• Julie’s educational reels: “Julie Eckert” on social platforms

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For Listeners

This episode is a masterclass in how law enforcement experience, policy, and community service intersect in rural Arkansas. It’s full of honest, practical, and often personal perspectives on leading and modernizing a sheriff’s department, conveyed in the candid, conversational style AR NET is known for.

Whether you’re a voter, a member of law enforcement, or someone interested in public service, this episode offers deep and meaningful insights into how experience and dedication truly matter.

Transcript

[A]

Hello and welcome to arnet, the show that shines a light on the trailblazers, game changers and hardworking heroes driving Arkansas forward. From bold entrepreneurs to community champions, we bring the stories that inspire and ignite progress. Now here's your host, David Bratton.

[B]

Hello, hello and welcome to the arnet podcast. We are sitting here with a return guest. I got them here in the Mallard island lawn service studios. And I have got candidate for sheriff of Lonoke County, Larry Binky. Larry, how are you?

[C]

Great, Dave, thanks for having me, man.

[B]

It's good to see you. And you brought your wife, Julie. Julie, how are you doing?

[D]

I'm doing great, man.

[B]

It's good to see you guys.

[C]

Me too.

[B]

So what's new? Since, since the primaries? What's been going on?

[C]

Wow.

[D]

We got our signatures turned in.

[C]

Yeah. So since we've been here last. Great catch, honey. Since, since we've been here last, we're officially on the ballot for November.

[B]

That's awesome.

[C]

So, yeah, that's like the biggest thing as an independent candidate.

[B]

Yes. Yes. Well, I'm so glad you came back to visit with us because there's some things that, that's been going on and I'd just like to visit with you guys about. Well, I know there was recently an article that was brought to my attention in the Leader, the Little Leader paper here in Cabot Lonoke county. And there was some misprint in there that was brought to my attention about something they had printed about your. Your history.

[A]

Right.

[B]

What, what exactly was that about?

[C]

Yeah, so I'm not sure exactly what day it came out. It was this week. But I received just a snapshot of this through text yesterday and it's about the Democratic candidate, Brian Mitchell Sr. He had some, he had some medical issues and he also bought. They purchased a house in Jefferson County. So he has officially dropped out of the race. So that's been confirmed. Got you through the county clerk's office and the Democrat committee. So. Okay, so what it did is that. That's what, that's what the. I have the article here. It's. It's entitled Democrat quits race for Sheriff versus Spencer and it says independent candidate Larry Binky left to challenge for Hot Topic Lonoke county role. Everything's accurate down to the bottom. And so the bottom paragraph references a 25 year career in law enforcement working for the Little Rock and North Little Rock police departments with 21 years being a detective in domestic violence and sex crimes. So that information was mistakenly taken from my campaign literature.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

And that was taken cuz in my campaign literature that was an explanation of my wife of Julie's. Gotcha history.

[B]

That's Julie's.

[C]

That's Julie's. And so I mean you know what, that's a. That's an awesome history.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

You know and I mean yeah, it's not that I'm ashamed for anybody to. But it's not mine. And so it was, it was falsely attributed to me. So I just wanted to. I just wanted to make sure that that should be attributed to Julie.

[D]

Right.

[C]

And so today I stopped by the Leader publishers and spoke to Mr. Feldman and I just. I just drew his attention to that. And so they understand. But you know the rest the.

[B]

The rest you don't want any stolen valor.

[C]

Exactly, exactly.

[B]

Right, right.

[C]

So yeah. So the rest of the article is basically had previously been. Been published and it's all accurate. So that was just. That was just that small thing.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

And so you know tonight I'm going to be making a small reel just putting it out there just so everybody knows that how that should be attributed.

[B]

Sure, sure.

[C]

To the guru over here now Julie.

[B]

So that was your history, correct?

[D]

So that was my history.

[B]

Give us just briefly, very briefly your history.

[D]

As briefly as I can. So was finishing up my criminal justice degree at ualr. While I did that I was geared. So criminal justice. I'd always wanted to become a police officer. The whole time that I was majoring in criminal justice and no one had told me that I didn't have to have a degree to get on the police department. I thought you did. Right. That's gotcha. That's what I thought. Not. My advisor didn't tell me anything different than that. So why would he.

[C]

Because you were paying them

[D]

grant that I had to pay back. Right. So was finishing that up. Ended up doing a project at the local women's shelter back then that was called Advocates for Battered Women. That was a semester project. But at the end of the semester they asked me to stay on as overnight supervisor. Now I'm pretty young back then and finishing college it's around 1991. And that was actually one of my first experiences not necessarily within but in working with some legislation. So I actually worked with the committee on the initial order of protection when it was invented.

[B]

Okay, the order of protection.

[D]

Gotcha. Yeah.

[C]

You know in 1991 during the legislative session when that was the new domestic violence laws because before that it was wife battering and we had to observe it and they had to go get a warrant if we didn't See it.

[B]

Gotcha. Okay. That was before my time in law enforcement.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

I remember the first.

[B]

I didn't come on until 97.

[C]

Yeah. So the first criminal code that I was issued was a 19, because I came in in 1992. It was a 1991 session that still had the old statutes in it. Wow. Of wife battery, wife battering. That you were required to actually witness in order to make an arrest.

[D]

Because it was a misdemeanor.

[C]

That's right.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

There was no warrantless exception at that time.

[B]

I'm sorry.

[C]

Go ahead.

[D]

That's okay. But they'd already passed that before I got on the police department. That was in 94.

[A]

4.

[D]

But a lot of the. The guys. When I was on the midnight shift, and I say guys loosely, we had three women and the rest were guys. They were still under the old. Trying to act under the old law. And.

[B]

Yeah. Because it takes a while to implement,

[D]

and you've got to update every two years. The laws can change. You've got to keep your department updated and know what the changes are and follow the criminal code and what it says. But.

[B]

Right.

[D]

So did that while I was finishing college and also for a different class project, I volunteered at Rape Crisis and became their president of their board at the rape Crisis at the Rape Crisis Center.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

In Little Rock. And so we. I got on after I finished college, ended up at Little Rock in 94. We got to pick our shifts then in the academy, and I picked the midnight shift around Central High School.

[B]

Sure.

[D]

Because I wanted to learn how to be the very best police officer I could be. So worked midnight shift for a couple of years, and then they came up with a position for a domestic violence detective. They hadn't had that position before.

[B]

Right.

[D]

And having now worked at the women's shelter for three years and be an overnight supervisor, and I. I decided to go for it.

[B]

Sure.

[D]

Even though, you know, normally with the detective division, you have on just a little bit longer than I did. But I went ahead and put in for it. And so I was one of the first two detective detectives, domestic violence detectives in the city. So they needed a lot more than two of us. And after about a year working there, there was a position that came open in homicide for the rape detective. And they asked me if I would move over and become the rape detective for the city of Little Rock. Right.

[C]

The only rape detective.

[B]

Right. Cause I believe when I hired on in 97, I think that's where you were at.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

Does that sound about right? 1997. Because I came on 97, graduated the academy. So it was actually. It was 98 when it hit the street. So it would have been 98. The very first part of 98. And I think you were in that position when I got there.

[D]

Yeah. So I. I did that for a couple of years, and then I ended up relocating to Oklahoma City for about a year. I ran their rape crisis program in Oklahoma City and ended up coming back. Worked at, actually, a spiritual renewal center out off of Canis, which is now a rehab place. It was called the Oasis Spiritual Renewal Center. I worked out there as a volunteer coordinator for a little while, and then I just couldn't stay away from police work and came back and I had talked to Little Rock, and I ended up talking to North Little Rock, and I ended up at North Little Rock.

[B]

Oh, there you go.

[D]

And. Yeah.

[B]

So did you do the same thing in North Little Rock?

[D]

So when you. When you start over at a larger department, you start back on patrol.

[B]

Absolutely.

[D]

So here you are, back on patrol, which was fine and fun. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

It's a good time.

[B]

Troll's the best.

[D]

Patrol is the best.

[C]

Absolutely.

[B]

A lot of fun.

[D]

You don't have to worry about what's on your plate tomorrow because you finished all your reports.

[C]

You don't have to get up in the morning and wonder what you're going to wear to work.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

It's like it's made for you.

[D]

Right. You don't have to worry about. Yeah.

[B]

Yes.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

Because I know when I got to the vice detail and I was working Internet crimes against children, I. We. Our paths crossed again. I was in Little Rock, you were in North Little Rock. We were both on the ICAC task force, I believe.

[D]

Well, we didn't have the ICAC at North Little Rock. They.

[B]

Okay, okay.

[D]

They had their own thing that they had.

[B]

Well, I know we worked some cases. We did.

[C]

It was the SIU Special Investigations Unit.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

That was doing a lot of that similar stuff.

[D]

Similar. Yes. The same thing, but.

[B]

Right.

[C]

It was a lot of like. Remember the Dateline stuff? Catch a Predator? They were doing stuff like that.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

With the computer. With the computer setting up me.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

Right.

[D]

Using my picture. And then I'd be in the River Market, and I wouldn't know who these guys were talking to. And I'd be walking down the street and they'd be like, lisa, my name. Name is not Lisa. That's what they used on the computer. And so it would take me a minute to go, oh, ooh. Because Lisa was supposed to have a daughter Who?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've done those operations.

[D]

But, yeah, that happened a couple of times. And I went in, I said, y' all gotta take my picture down because I don't know.

[B]

Still out there. If it's out there, it's still out.

[C]

Once you post a picture, it's not yours anymore.

[D]

It was just me. And like this. It was. I was in, like, a purple pants suit. I mean, it wasn't. It wasn't sexy. It was a mom picture.

[C]

It's not the fact that the picture that was there, it was the context that the picture was used.

[D]

Absolutely. And I think they had some dating service like Yahoo Dating back there way before any of that other stuff had. And, yeah, I told them, y' all got to take this down because I don't know who you're talking to or what you're saying. Right, right, right. So, yeah, I came back, went to North Little Rock, couple years on patrol, and then they. The detective division actually reached out to me and said, hey, we. We haven't done this before, but we are about to start being able to specialize in different areas. And so one of the areas is going to be domestic violence, sexual assault, and child abuse. And I was a little nervous at first, because over at Little Rock, I worked sex crimes with women that were 18 and older and a couple of men, not very many, but victims that were 18 and older. And in this new position, I was going to be also working child sexual assault cases.

[B]

Right.

[D]

And that was. That was very unknown to me and how. How that was was going to work. But they ended up sending me to forensic interviewing school. North Little Rock was fabulous. They. They would send our sex crime. Our child sex crimes detectives to trainings as often as they could, and they wanted us to have that. The most updated training. And for me, some of these interviewers, they'll go to 1:1 training, and then they're trained. But for me, I want to go to as many different trainings as I can, because I feel like when you're interviewing a child about sexual assault, you need as many tools on your tool belt that you can have. If the child zigzags you. You got to be able to zigzag wherever they go with whatever they're telling you or whatever they're not telling you and try to figure out a way to. To work back around to the reason that they might not want to talk about something or, you know, funnel down to asking them, you know, the questions or presenting evidence. That was another good training that I went to and that was through the FBI.

[A]

Yes.

[D]

They had a. Introducing evidence in child interview courses, which evidence can be things like pictures, but evidence can also be things like when you're funneling down, your mother told me that's evidence. So. And that's training from the FBI, but also the FBI training on interviewing victims of human trafficking, which we were on that task force together.

[B]

Exactly. Why, sure. So, yeah, I mean, your certifications are as long. Miles long.

[D]

I thought they were going to ask me about that in court a couple of weeks ago. And so I was prepared. And I had written down all of the trainings that I had gone to because the. The defense attorney, who was very good, said he thought he was going to call me back up to the stand. And I wasn't exactly sure what he was going to call me about. So I brought my notebook just in case because they had already asked me, not this attorney, but a different attorney had asked me on the stand how many cases I had worked well.

[B]

And I said, take a while to get that information.

[D]

Since 1996. And I'm looking at the jury, like, really?

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

So after he asked me that, I ended up, I was already retired and I called, got hold of North Little Rock, and I said, I hate to do this to you, but can you send me a list of my assigned at my assigned cases at North Little Rock?

[B]

Sure.

[D]

And she did. And I counted them and it was 2,611 cases. And that's. That is just my personal assigned cases. That does not include being on call every three weeks and getting called out to Homicide almost every week.

[B]

Sure.

[D]

Right. So it doesn't include any assist. It doesn't include homicide call outs.

[B]

It doesn't include your Little Rock cases.

[D]

Doesn't include Little Rock. I called Little Rock and. And I said, I've got my. I still know my old employee number. And they said, we can't pull it up by that. And I said, well, what about my old detective number? And they said, well, your cases are so old that we would have to get someone for Major crimes off of. From work in a homicide to go down to the basement and count them.

[B]

You got to remember when we started, it was way before computers. Right.

[D]

All that was paper we had to hand write. Somebody said something about computers.

[B]

That was a whole different world.

[D]

And I said, we didn't even have top rod. Our. Our transcriptionist had a top router.

[B]

That was it.

[D]

We didn't have top rotters.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

It took me so long just to like train myself to have really good handwriting.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

For Your case for all your stuff. And then about that time, they throw a computer on your desk, throw a computer in your car and say we're typing everything. Now I've got to learn how to type with one hand or three fingers. You know the, the lobster claw?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, it's like, and that was

[D]

so funny because my, my instructor for Intro to Criminal justice, the one that didn't tell me that I didn't have to be there to try to apply, I wasn't 21 yet, so it really wasn't right. And I really needed more maturity before I got on the police department, before I'm responding to people's crisises. Right. To know what I'm talking about.

[B]

So you've been doing this your whole adult life?

[D]

Yes, yes.

[B]

Your whole adult life.

[D]

Yes, I have. And loving it.

[B]

Sure.

[D]

And loving it.

[B]

Sure. No, that's, that's a great history and great qualifications right there.

[C]

I, I, I'd like to add that's how she worked, but it's starting in 96, as you well know. She was training people. She started training people.

[B]

Oh, yeah. She trained me in the academy.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And so starting training in rookie schools.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And so for, also for me, it's like that in law enforcement. You know, there's a point where it's not always about what, you know, what are you, how are you developing the team, how are you developing other officers so they can go out and do a better job. Right. So that's what she was doing since 96. And, and to this day, the Criminal Justice Institute over off of Markham still uses her information for the online, the

[D]

online classes for, yeah, for Patrol Response to Sexual assault and Patrol Response to Domestic violence. They actually had me update the domestic violence training for patrol right before I retired. So that's actually my training on the Criminal Justice Institute website. And anyone that's in an agreement with the Criminal Justice Institute, any officers can go on there and take that online course for free.

[B]

Sure.

[D]

Yeah, sure.

[B]

So that's, well, let me ask you this because this has been brought to my attention back during the primaries. What would be, and this is for either one of you guys, what would be Julie's role when you in sheriff?

[C]

Sure. So, you know, most importantly right now, I think there's, there's a lot of information out there that may be inaccurate. Right. Officers are required to revisit. And you need to tell me if I'm mistaken, Julie. 40 hours of domestic violence training with practicum in the academy. Correct.

[D]

I don't think it says with practicum. Okay.

[C]

But it's 40 hours of domestic violence and 20, 20 hours on sexual assault. Right.

[D]

Response that used to be actually in the code.

[C]

Okay. So the issue becomes if you only get that once in the academy and you are not revisiting that in, you know, at least every two years. But we also know that cases are always happening. And so case laws always, always come. And there's always, there's always best practices or something that's coming out that should inform both your investigations, your response and your training, your policies. And so with her background and her expertise in those, in those fields, I'm gonna, you know, I'm probably not a completely objective person, but I can say, I think it's fair to say that she, if not the best, she is one of the best trained and most experienced sex crimes detective that we have in the state of Arkansas.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Now, there are a lot of folks out there doing good work.

[B]

Absolutely.

[C]

Like I said, I'm a little partial.

[B]

Absolutely.

[C]

Because I've seen her work.

[A]

Right.

[C]

And so for me as sheriff, I think it's critical to utilize the assets that you have. Right.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

And first of all, we have to work to make sure our policies reflect current best practices. Trauma informed, you know, victim based actions and responses. And then. Because policies, policies will take you so far, but then we have to make sure that we're doing the training. Right. Right. Now I'll also say that there are, there are also competent people still there at the sheriff's office.

[B]

Right.

[C]

But I don't know. What, I don't know because I've never worked there. Right, right.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

No, so obviously we need to identify, when they identify the detectives who are there, what, what is their level, you know, and then get everybody on the same page and then spread that to patrol. So for Julie, policy development, training development and delivery. And then once we get that done, I would really like to see, and I know this is a passion of Julie's is just like in homicide. Right. We need to go back and look at cases that have previously been submitted or cases that have previously, previously been investigated.

[D]

Right.

[C]

And whether they were closed out for some reason, had some type of clearance regardless of it.

[A]

Right.

[C]

Prior to submission for prosecution. But we need to look, have, have her look at those with a, with a, with a fresh set of eyes, like a cold case.

[B]

Man, you took it right out of my mouth.

[C]

Cold case.

[B]

Exactly what I was fixing to say. You're talking about a cold case.

[C]

Cold case. And that way when we look at cold case now, again, I'm going to have to defer to Julie. She should pick up on this. But it's different than a, than a homicide. Right. Because there are time frames.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

And we have to go back because of the nature of those crimes based on when they occurred, certain years, because there has been changes in the statute of limitations.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

And so I'm gonna, I'm gonna defer to Julie. So that's what I envision Julie doing. Right. As an advisory role, doing that kind of stuff. I think that's the most important, critical thing we need to do. Because if the patrol response is not right, nothing's right.

[B]

Right.

[D]

So and to tag off that if, if, if patrol responds and they haven't had the proper training in trauma and, and they're not trauma informed, how likely is it that the person's going to come in and want to talk to a detective? Yeah, not very likely. So we've got to make sure that everybody's coming from the right heart space. Also when they're responding to sexual assault, domestic violence, child abuse, and you know, you've gotta, you know as well as I do when you're responding to human trafficking that can take all kinds of different looks and training.

[B]

Why. Sure.

[D]

These runaway girls are acting really bad. Right.

[B]

Oh, right.

[D]

So you've got, that's my forte. Yeah, you've got it. You've got to dig a little deeper into what's going on and then you really are not going to like what you find because now you're going to

[C]

be really busy and even me is just a, just a street cop. I know there's a huge difference between. They're both victims.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

But they're not alike.

[B]

No.

[C]

We don't put them together.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Because that creates a lot, a lot of downstream problems for the victims themselves.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Cool.

[D]

So you had just said. Oh, so I, I see some misinformation out there and I'm actually going to start doing some short reels on things that, that I see that come up. And I'm also going to do some short reels on like some patrol tips also.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

That I teach. Right. So. So that also happened with a defense attorney that. Well, the prosecutors, the prosecutors for court wanted to ask me on the stand how many in person trainings I had provided for police officers in the state of Arkansas because they wanted me to talk about statute of limitations. And that's something that I addressed during the training. It's over a thousand.

[B]

Oh, easily.

[D]

It's easily over a thousand officers. Sure. So it was. While I was doing my detective job. They would, you know, if we had rookies that were going up to Pocahontas for. For training or here at Camp Robinson when they started that training. We had started the training over at North Little Rock, where I provided a week long. And my focus would be domestic violence, sexual assault, human trafficking, and child abuse. And so I had to add that up for them, too, because that's not something that I kept up with. But they asked me, so I figured that out. So one of the things that there's a misconception about is that there is no longer a statute of limitations for child sexual assault in Arkansas. And that's true to a point, but that legislation was not passed until 2013.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

Okay. So you have to go back if. If you're. If your incident happened in Arkansas and it was. And you also have to realize every single second state has completely statute. Completely different statute of limitations.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

Every state has different ones. So you have to go back to what the law was actually on the books and the statute of limitations before 2013. If you were a victim back then.

[B]

Sure.

[D]

See, if your assault happened after 2013 and you lived in Arkansas. That is true. Right, Right.

[B]

So if the incident was prior to

[D]

2013, then you've got to go back. You've got to. And I've worked with the prosecutor on a lot of these cases and would call and say this happened on this particular day if they were still within the current statute of limitations, which in 2013, they had changed it from six years after you turn 18 to 10 years after you turn 18. And that happened in 2000 when they changed it to 10 years. So if you were still in those 10 years and 2013 happened, you're. Okay.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

But it takes a lot of math to try to figure out.

[C]

And this is the reason you can go. Yeah. And this is the reason we never throw away the old criminal code.

[D]

Bet you got to go back because

[C]

you have to just. If you. Once you determine jurisdiction, Okay. I can investigate this now. And if it's a delayed report or whatever, now I have to go back and see what was the. When that occurred.

[B]

Right.

[C]

What law was on the books. Because most of these laws are not retroactive.

[D]

Right.

[B]

I get it.

[D]

So that's, you know, that's the misinformation that's out there that I want to. Because people get their hopes up.

[B]

Sure. They do.

[D]

And I don't. I don't want them to get their hopes up if it took them this

[B]

long to come forward.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

But I don't not want them to come forward either. So even though they might be out of the statute of limitations now in Arkansas, this is some legislation that I'm working on right now for a variety of crimes. A lot of felonies only have a six year statute of limitations, including rape, even if you don't know who the suspect is. So say you've got a cold case, Detective. And they put all these cases together, which is what I did two weeks before I retired.

[C]

Yep.

[A]

Wow.

[D]

I was working light duty and I was going through some old evidence and I was about to have court on a fella in about two weeks. And we knew that the victim was unknown to this man. He drove a white Cadillac, he was bald headed, he was overweight, and he lived in Row City. And he also told her that he had a nickname of Kilo, which turned out not to be true, but, but that was his nickname. So I've got court coming up on him in a couple of weeks. I'm going through this old evidence. I find a case from 2017, white Cadillac, overweight, ballheaded, saw a woman walking on the side of the road. You can call me Kilo, lived in Row City.

[B]

Wow.

[D]

Wow. Didn't know. So I still have to do a photograph lineup with this woman. So I try to find her, find her at the hospital. I'm still kind of light duty, but I'm at the hospital, so I figure I'm okay and it's a victim, it's not a suspect.

[B]

Right, Right. Yeah.

[D]

So I walk in, I introduce myself and I said, ma', am, I've been going through some old police reports. She sat right up in the bed and said, did you get the guy with the white Cadillac? And started crying. Wow. And I said, well, I don't know. I need to show you something. Did you look at the spreadsheet? Did you look at these pictures? You know, and so she did. Now that one actually had had a DNA hit on it, but there wouldn't follow up. And it, that wasn't my case.

[B]

Right, right.

[D]

So I don't know what happened on that.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

But, but I'd found the, the DNA hit. I found another one from 2017, black Cadillac over, overweight, ball headed, took her to Rose City. No DNA. Out of luck. Out of luck because there's no DNA. If there's DNA. That, that, that is also true. If, if there's DNA on an adult case that matches the suspect DNA. Now there's not a statute of limitations.

[B]

No kidding.

[D]

But not if you don't have DNA.

[B]

You have to have the.

[D]

You have to have the DNA right now. And so that was one of the things that I have been working on with the legislature since 2022, since right after I retired, I started working on this. Yeah. But as I looked at it, I got a hold of the commission and they sent me the criteria on the crimes. And so I went through all these crimes that have six years statute of limitations, and some of them are pretty, pretty serious. So like terrorism has a six year statute of limitation right now. Death by delivery. So like if, if later on, if you figure out that someone has given fentanyl to a bunch of people but you didn't figure out who it was until six and a half years later, they can't be charged.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

Because the statute of limitations is up. They did add some trafficking stuff this last session to extend that because you could be trafficked for several years. But like kidnapping. Kidnapping, six years. And we see cases in Texas all the time where now with the ancestry, DNA stuff. Yeah, right. 23 and me are able to go back and say, oh my gosh, y' all aren't my parents. I was kidnapped.

[B]

Right, exactly.

[D]

Right. So. But I, but I went through the list and I pulled out the most egregious crimes that, that the sentencing commission had and I added those because there are three legs. Right. To the criminal justice system. So you're gonna have the law enforcement investigative part, right?

[B]

Sure.

[D]

Then you're going to have the pro prosecutor that's going to review your investigation to actually see if probable cause exists. Right, Right. And of course it's going to be a cold case. So you're. It's going to have to be fairly strong, or at least the statement about what happened, or one person comes in, makes a statement and then more people come forward, Right?

[B]

Sure. Oh, yeah, you see that?

[D]

They see that all the time. So. And then you have the judge that's going to sign off on your warrant. Right. So. So it's not just law enforcement running around arresting people on these cold cases. Right. That's. Yeah, they're not doing that. So. But I still want people to make a report, even if they do their research and say, well, I'm outside of the statute of limitations because federally there's something called 404B evidence.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

Now, 404B evidence, if the detective is doing due diligence and they find other victims, they can do an information section in the back of their case file with those reports and those statements, and the prosecutors can actually call Those victims, If the judge allows it. It's completely up to the judge.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

If the judge allows it. And that's called 404B evidence. And they can testify if it's the same MO if it's the same. You know, if they're around the same age when it happened or something along those lines. It's got to be a similar. Right.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

It's got to have similarities to it. It's always up to the judge whether they're going to allow that. But more and more judges are. Are allowing that in. But if people don't make a police report, the investigators don't know to call someone if a new report comes in on the same offender, Right?

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[D]

And that's nationwide. So a good example of that was. And that's when a lot of people, A lot of states went and changed their statute of limitations was in 2019, during the Cosby.

[B]

Oh, no kidding.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

Because nobody could file charges because all these adults were outside of the statute of limitations already. So they went in and changed. Changed their statute of limitations after that, but then it was too late. Right. But some of these women were able to go up and testify on the other cases because they were still under the statute of limitations in those states.

[B]

I'll be dang.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Because it was similar, right? Yeah. Yeah. So we still want people to file reports no matter what.

[B]

And we need to come in, take

[D]

the report no matter what, make the report, because you don't know what these people have. System. Get it in the system. And if you don't get it in the system, we don't know to. To find you.

[B]

Right. Yeah, absolutely.

[C]

You know, the deal. Didn't write it down. It never happened.

[B]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. You got document. Document.

[D]

Got a document.

[B]

Which brings me to my next. My next kind of question here. Based on the recent information of your opponent, he got his case dismissed due to the Loanoke County Sheriff's Department mishandling of evidence. Larry, what is your take and what would you do to correct how the sheriff's department handles evidence?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

So,

[C]

yeah, just make sure that we understand. Right. That the. That the listeners understand that that dismissal with prejudice was because of a ruling by that judge on. Right on. You know, due process violations.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

So, you know, all of us at this table, we have. We have worked in organizations and, you know, I think we almost take it for granted on evidence handling procedures.

[B]

Oh, yeah. Because where we worked, it was very strict.

[C]

Sure. And, you know, I mean, it's not. It's not rocket science. Right. I mean, these, these are one of the most standard policies out there. But the issue is, it's not the policy. It's not a policy problem. You can have policies all day long, but if you don't have. If you don't have. If you don't have an environment or a culture where, where that is important. Right. Where that. Where you don't have supervisory oversight or when you go out on a crime scene, I mean, I think all of us, we would go out on a crime scene and you had a crime scene team, and I know what little rock you had. You had crime scene unit. Right. But you still understand crime scene procedures as a detective. Right. We've all been to that training. My experience as a detective was we had a call out team and there was always either a major crimes detective or supervisor that oversaw that. So before you even went, before you even got near the crime scene tape, there was a game plan and everybody had a task and they knew what the task was.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And the team leader was there to make sure that everything was done. And so something as simple as scene photography from outward in, Right. Yep. Identifying those things, marking your evidence before you move anything, it has to be documented with a placeholder. A placeholder. The pictures, once the pictures are done, the photograph log, the numbers on the photograph log and the description have to be the same as the photograph and the. In the, in what's. In the. You know, it has to be an accurate description.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And so what we were talking about before we started was it's hard. It. It's. It's not hard. Let me back. It's not hard. It's a process, but it's a process that must be followed.

[B]

I can't stress that enough. If you're going to do this job,

[C]

it must, it must be followed and.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Because if you don't. We were talking about being at three in the morning. Yes. With a room full of evidence.

[B]

I've been there.

[C]

It's not an option.

[B]

No.

[C]

You don't get to take a knee. You don't get to go home.

[B]

No.

[D]

You don't get to go take a nap.

[C]

You don't get to go take a nap.

[B]

Now you've got your team and y' all have to stay there till finished. How many hours? Absolutely.

[C]

You know, hey, Sparky, make another pot of coffee and run down to Duncan because we need some sugar. And so, you know, those are not difficult things. And I think, I think a lot of times we, we look for the easy button. Right. It's like this is not a big deal. I'll store it. I'll do a temporary storage. I'll be right back at 8 in the morning. Okay, when you say I'll be right back at 8 in the morning, what happens if you have a car wreck going home?

[D]

Right.

[C]

Nobody knows where you put the evidence that you hid right in your office. In your office or wherever, or in the trunk of your car. Now you had a, now you had to overturn. Now you had a wreck going home in your, in your do car you overturned in a swamp. Now all the papers you had are completely destroyed.

[B]

Sure.

[D]

Or you've got a breed of cocaine in your trunk because you didn't want to go.

[C]

So I mean, we've all, you know, I think we've all, unfortunately, we've all experienced that either personally or in our, the, the urban legend within our units of this happening. And it never, it never ended well for the detectives that did that or for the officers that did that.

[A]

Right.

[C]

And it certainly doesn't end well for victims.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

And it doesn't end well for suspects.

[B]

No.

[C]

So if we don't, if we don't take care of evidence, then there's no, there's no way to, to make sure that, that, that, that's safe for the, for the investigation and for the prosecution. Right. Because that chain of custody, it matters. I mean, so if it's three in the morning and you and I are doing this, we get our stuff, we double check it, we check each other's work, the team leader checks it, we put it in the tote, we drag it down to the evidence room and we're stuffing lockers. Well, the evidence custodian comes in the next morning, okay? They do what they do. It goes on a shelf, it gets locked, logged into evidence. Now it's part of the system. Now, that relieves you as the detective for being responsible for the custody and the safekeeping and the integrity of that evidence. Because what happens, I'm going to put this on the, on the, on the desk. Well, at some point I'm like, I'll just leave it here. But then maybe I want to do touch DNA or I want to do fingerprint analysis. Well, and I may want to do something else, but you know as well as I do, when you, when it goes to the crime lab, if you have one piece, a piece of evidence and you want multiple different types of examinations, then the crime lab has a priority on which one they do first.

[D]

Right?

[C]

But if weeds don't store that properly, then, and with that Crime lab submission. You're also. So now the evidence custodian at the. Off. At the, at the office knows that. Oh, well, these are the types. So I need to make sure that this is safe so we don't taint this. Right, right. Because a lot, for a lot of times, like the sexual assault evidence kits, they were being placed in a refrigerator. You do not refrigerate those anymore. Anymore.

[D]

When I started.

[B]

Right.

[D]

They did.

[C]

Yes, we did.

[D]

They did. Because we did. We collected vials. They collected vials of blood that had a special top, but they still had to go in the refrigerator. And then they changed that collection process so it no longer had to go in the refrigerator. So if you, if you think about it and have a broader perspective, and I talk about this in training. Right. Because the crime lab is in Little Rock. I think they just put somewhere they're

[C]

actually going to be putting it. It's, it's. The expanded crime lab is going to be at Camp Robinson.

[D]

But there's another one. There is another built in another area of the state.

[C]

Well, they're actually Harding University has a forensic lab now.

[B]

I don't know this.

[C]

Yeah. For. They have a forensic digital lab there.

[D]

But when you're, when you get your. If you were storing something in the refrigerator in Fayetteville, then you take it out and you're driving it to Little Rock.

[B]

Right.

[D]

What's going on there? And then someone said they had a refrigerator that had a leak and so everything had molded. I mean, there's all kinds of things that can happen with people not having accurate information. And I had, you know, had lots of. I used to also train the sexual assault nurse examiners. And you know, I'd say, well, what happens to the, the rape kit, the sexual assault examination kid is what they're calling it now. What happens to that after, after you collect the evidence? They didn't know. And so when I explained it to them, then they understood, oh, well, we don't need to put that in the refrigerator because that kind of disrupts the evidence.

[C]

So all that being said, it goes back to. You have to have, you have to have policies that reflect industry best practices for evidence handling, collection, preservation and evaluation. Right. But regardless of what's in your policy manual, if you don't have oversight from supervisory personnel who are trained.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And then the expectation from the top all the way down through the organization that those will, those are, those are non negotiables that that must be done, then it doesn't matter what your policy says.

[B]

Right. So it all falls back to training.

[C]

That's right.

[B]

You know, everybody has to be trained the same. That's right. No. And know their policies.

[C]

Right?

[B]

Absolutely.

[D]

Yeah. And Larry mentioned before about policy and that was something else that I also did in addition to all of those cases at North Lat. So I wrote the policy for domestic violence, patrol response and sexual assault and missing children slash AMBER Alert. Yeah. They sent me to a training for the missing kids and I just thought it was going to be a good time. And then when I got back, they said, oh, by the way, you're going to write this policy now because you just went down to this training. So. So that's something that I'm. I've already done.

[B]

Okay, well, how would you implement this training in Lonoke County?

[C]

So right now, the issues. There are. There are several issues. Right. Because you know as well as I do, in order to train nine one one's still happening, you still have to have people on the street.

[B]

Of course.

[C]

Right. And so when you look at, you have to be very innovative when you're setting up in service training, the smaller your agency, the less, the fewer assets that you have. You have to be more agile and you have to be more innovative on this training. You have to accept that you're probably, I'm going to say with almost 100% certainty it's not going to be like what A lot of times we had the option at a larger agency where you're just like, hey, Dave, you're assigned to the training division or to the academy this week you're going to 40 hours of in service.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Okay. Bet I'm not getting any new cases this week. Right. Or whatever. And so you go to 40 hours training. We don't have that luxury because we don't have the people.

[B]

Correct.

[C]

And so what I envision is a lot like what we did at North Little Rock in some of the training. We have to do multiple training sessions for the same content, smaller groups over a broader time frame. That way you can address those staffing issues while still man in the street and still conducting those investigations that are. A lot of them are on a timeline because you have speedy trial issues, you got to worry about and getting all that done. Right. So it's not just, hey, we're just going to stop operations and everybody's going to go to training. So we know that. So we're going to have to have multiple shorter duration trainings, which actually after going to the four Science Center's method of instruction class down in Dallas, that's actually more. You can actually retain and transfer knowledge better if you do it a shorter duration class over a longer term, over a longer time because you're not trying to stuff all that sausage into a wrapper.

[B]

Right, Right.

[C]

So it, you, you can digest smaller pieces and then as an agency, you can what we call scaffold and prime those, those follow on classes with vignettes like little scenarios within. And it's like, hey, we talked about this. So next month we're going to talk about, we're going to continue talking about this. But hey, here's a situation and you just present that. And it's five or ten minutes. That's supervisor to supervisor to, you know, to troop.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And you just run through it and then that, that becomes part of their training file.

[B]

Why? Sure.

[C]

Because it's squad training and it's a

[B]

lot easier to retain too.

[C]

That's right. And so you're retaining more over time. It's easier, but it is critical. So one of the issues right now is a lot of personnel are leaving the sheriff's office.

[B]

Yep.

[C]

Like there is a huge exodus.

[B]

Right.

[C]

I worked at a sheriff's office, Pulaski County. I understand the, the, what would we say, the concern during, during a, an election year because unlike we had, there is no civil service. Right.

[B]

So.

[C]

So you serve at the, at the pleasure of the sheriff. So a lot of people are like, you know, I don't, I can't wait. Because they've got families, they've got mortgages. Right. So they don't. They cannot wait until November 3rd to find out because then it's too late. Then they're going to be, you know, in a bad way with their family. So I understand it, but it's not for me to agree or disagree with. That's their decision. It's their life. Sure. But it does present a challenge.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Huge challenge. Yeah.

[C]

And so I think we talked about,

[B]

regardless, you have to man the streets.

[C]

Yeah. And so I think something we talked about before the primary when I was in here the first time is, you know, there are a lot of former and retired law enforcement officers in this county.

[B]

Absolutely.

[C]

What I know about cops is they want to help, but you got to ask them.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Every morning you go to Cheryl's Diner, you go to anywhere, anywhere in the county, you've got cops or sitting on their front porch. That institutional knowledge and all that wisdom, it's just withering away. It's not being utilized. And so we need to reach out to those. And that's what I'VE been doing, reaching out. Soon, some guys and gals who have that knowledge set, who have lived this life. Right. Who have seen what works and what doesn't. Now, what worked for me in 1990, whatever, it may not work now. Right. Because things change. But what doesn't change is human nature. What doesn't change is the ability to communicate with people one on one. Right. Those are really important issues because all across our nation, I think we see the biggest problem we have is we can't talk to each other.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[C]

You know, Exactly. We cannot talk to each other. We are listening. We are listening to social media or other media sources and someone we've never met, we don't know anything about. We don't even know if they're a real person. It could be a chatbot farm.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

They're putting out information for all various motivations. And now I'm supposed to hate my neighbor because my neighbor thinks something else. I've lived next door to my neighbor for 20 years. Yeah, that's a. That says something about the way our country is. Right. And so I think we need to leverage. I would really like to leverage more former and retired police officers, troopers, investigators, what have you.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Bring them in. Not necessarily to go get in the uniform and go get in a marked car and go chase people through a bean field. Right. Because a lot of us have, you know, a lot of guys are like, I've run my course. Right, Exactly. It's like, I'm not.

[D]

If I'm chasing you, I'm chasing you in a car.

[C]

Right. I'm like second Timothy four through seven. Right. It's like, I've. What, I've run my race. I've finished my course. I've kept the faith. That's what a lot of it. That's what a lot of guys think. And, and they've earned that. Right. But. But what are the lessons. What are the lessons that they can bring into the organization? Maybe coming in once or twice a week, an hour or two here and there, and saying, hey, Dave, I got a coffee pot over here. You're welcome to some coffee. Let me meet, Let me, let me, Let me invite you and let me introduce you to some guys and gals in the office, and you build that rapport.

[B]

Right?

[C]

That's all we did for our entire careers is building rapport. Because if you can't build rapport, you can't get information. You cannot work. Right. You're not in this job long if you cannot talk to people.

[B]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. No, you're not. You have very short career

[C]

or you make it through, but you stay in Iowa a lot.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I've seen that happen.

[C]

So you know, I think, I think utilizing, utilizing reserves to augment, offset and then give that coaching, that training and mentoring on a just an individual basis as we go through that is huge. Because unless you invest in your personnel, you're never going to move the needle.

[D]

Right.

[C]

Percy, the people wearing the badge are your most important asset in the organization. It's not the cars, it's not the cameras, it's not the tasers, it's not the guns. All those are equipment that we have that we need and they make the job more effective. And a lot of that is expected by the public and rightfully so. Because when I started started with a revolve revolver, two speed loaders, a radio and a short billy club and a pair of handcuffs, if you couldn't get it done with that, you just threw hands.

[B]

That's all you had left. Exactly.

[C]

And so I know when Julie went to Rookie School in 94, she was the first class that got pepper spray.

[D]

Woohoo.

[C]

And it was like back then, no use of force report. No. No supplemental report. No. No supervisor letter.

[B]

Right.

[C]

It was like. And verbal non compliance. Turn around, put your hands behind your back.

[B]

I don't. Right, right.

[D]

And I also weighed 98 pounds.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So.

[C]

So she's, she was X40. Right. She's the Pepper Queen of Little Rock. I was first 18 months.

[D]

It was time for me to, to become a detective. I think the other thing with the, with the training is also utilizing what's already available like through the Criminal Justice Institute. A lot of those classes can be taken online when, when the deputies at home with some free time. We're not saying give up their time.

[C]

Right.

[D]

At North Little Rock, if we did online courses, we would be reimbursed with comp time or overtime.

[B]

Right.

[D]

So yeah.

[C]

And you know, and not every class, every training class requires physical presence. That's what we did at North Little Rock were leveraging those required training hours in. We made our own training videos. We did our own training stuff in the, in the division. We did our own. We very rarely used the state stuff. But those you have to do training like you have to do firearms training.

[B]

Oh yeah.

[C]

You have to do response to active shooter and active attack. You have to do tactical emergency casualty care, especially in a county like ours. In Little Rock, you know, back in the day, North Little Rock, Pulaski county, there was no expectation that we got down and got bloody and stopped somebody from bleeding to death. Right, right. Because then it was frowned upon.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Because the only way the ambulance knew how bad the situation was is how fast you flash the flashlight at them to get down the street. I remember that. And then they, if it was really fast, then they brought out the mass trousers and the thumper and then they went to uams. Right, right. But, and so those things require presence, they require physical skills, putting hands on people. We, we know we have to do firearms training, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

We have to do driver's training. Those are liability errors that you cannot defend not doing them. That's negligent training. Right, sure. But how many times do we shoot people versus how many times do we put hands on people?

[B]

You put hands on people all the time.

[C]

All the time.

[B]

All the time.

[C]

And so when's the most dangerous time? When you touch them.

[B]

Yeah, oh yeah.

[C]

That fights on.

[B]

Exactly.

[C]

So if you don't understand that, and I'll say this, those training scenarios are not one size fits all because I'm a smaller stature guy. I've learned a long time ago they tried to teach me this stuff. I had to seek my own training because what, what the academy wanted me to do is not going to work. I am not going to do that to someone who's 64275.

[B]

Correct.

[D]

The same with me.

[B]

I was going to say, look at

[D]

you, I'm 98 pound person over here.

[C]

But here's the deal. You know as well as I do that case law, Graham v Connor.

[A]

Right?

[D]

Right.

[C]

The three prong test. Right. Objective, reasonable, officer standard that you're supposed to be judged on also takes into account the totality of circumstances.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Officer subject factors. Right. Was the person intoxicated, were they on pcp? Because we used to deal with that all the time. You know, officer size, officer's age, officer's experience level.

[A]

Right.

[C]

Was the officer incapacitated? So all these things are taken into account. But that has to be trained and that stuff has to be trained at the supervisory level. Because when you use force now you have to have a proper force review by supervisor and it has to go up because we, the days are over where you can just use force, throw them in the drunk tank and drive off. No, we can't do that and we're not going to do that. And we, we haven't done it in professional law enforcement for a long time.

[B]

Right.

[C]

So keyword there is professional law enforcement. And so. Yeah, and so I would say, Yeah, I'll probably, I'll probably think I, I lost my train of thought because I kind of saw a squirrel and I went down a rabbit hole.

[D]

But yeah, you were talking about hands on training versus we can do a lot of training online.

[C]

Sure. But you know those hands on training, they, they have to take priority for. Because nothing was worse if you're on the midnight shift and then you've got to go to 40 hours in service. And so they said, okay, well you're going to be working day shift because you couldn't bother the training unit to come out at the night shift. Right. I wasn't gonna.

[B]

Kidding me.

[C]

That's what I implemented at North Little Rock is the training division. When I was running the training division, right, I was like, here's what's going to happen. We've got this training that we produce this training. We have to deliver this training to X, to all patrol, to everybody. So here's your patrol shift. We're going to do this over the next six weeks. All right? I've got X amount of officers assigned here. So I'll put a calendar just like you have on the wall. I put a calendar up and I'd mark the nights that we were going to work and I'd say you guys were going to split in half. Half of us are going to work 10 hours in the day, half. I was going to 10 hours at night. And so we would go in so the guys would sign up to work the night shift.

[D]

So

[C]

we still worked in patrol, three eight hour shifts. So what we did is I'd bring them in at like 8 o', clock. So work 8 to 4.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

So you know, like I do, there's peak times, right. So but you had those cars coming in and so you could start bringing people in, rotating them through. Right. And so you had early cars and late cars. So you have an overlap. You could do that training. And then there was a break, another peak time. So instead of doing training, we would just, we all wore our uniforms, we would just grab our squad and we would go out and in shag calls for patrol. And so it's about, it's about credibility, right? Because if you don't have credibility as a trainer, you're not training 100.

[A]

Right.

[C]

And so what happened was historically not just on our department, but probably Little Rock too, at some point. We work 8 to 4. We don't do that. Right. And so you're always in polo shirt and whatever. But we're like, no, we wore uniforms. We wore uniforms and if a call went out, we were at lunch, we Took the call. And my direct, you know, my, my instructions to the guys was everybody wants to go to the ag. Robbery in progress. Everybody wants to go to the shooting. Right, Right. Everybody wants to go to the high, the high stress Code three, priority one. I was like, how about we do this? I said that let patrol do that. Those calls are not even in Little Rock. North Little Rock. You get those, a lot of those calls. But you know, that's not the majority calls. You know, they can 1040 for it.

[A]

Right.

[C]

I mean, it's like. Yeah, crickets. Right. I mean, you know, so I'm like, we're going to concentrate on the calls that are terrible. The rush hour calls at the worst intersection for an injury accident because that builds credibility fast when you pipe up for that call. Yeah.

[B]

When you're taking the, the big wrecks,

[C]

the big rex and you know, you've got a diagram like where's my blue blitz template? And all the. If you're young, if you're a young cop listening to this, I'm sorry that you don't know what a blue bits, blue blitz template is. But you, because you use E crash with, you know, you guys are using E crash with, with to draw the cars.

[B]

Right? Right.

[C]

You're not using a, you know, trying to do a pencil drawing everything in pencil in and tracing it with, with pen.

[B]

We had the Charlie Simon template. You remember that pocket one?

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[D]

Wow.

[C]

So anyway, exactly.

[B]

Hey, what about. I was looking, doing a little research. What's the Agriculture crimes investigator font?

[C]

So thanks for asking about that. So. So, you know, one of the things, and again, what I'm looking at is, you know, you would like to do a lot of things, but what is realistic based on your assets right now? So right now when I, when I started talking about ag crimes investigator, that was based on a full organization.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Right. But you know, your organization is never all. It's not full all the time. Right, Right.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But we're starting to get critical mass. We're starting to get critical mass on, on loss. And so point blank, the priority's got to be patrol because if you cannot responsively and efficiently effectively answer a call for service, then you can't do anything else.

[B]

Correct.

[C]

So nothing you do downstream of that matters. And so we'll talk about the ag crimes in the context of having a full organization.

[B]

Right.

[C]

So when we look at Lonoke county, you know, right now there are three districts that divide patrol. So you have a north, a central and a south. So the south district is Everything south of Highway 70.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

The Central District is Highway 70 to Mount Tabor Road with lines drawn east to west across the county line.

[B]

Gotcha.

[C]

North district is everything north of Mount Tabor. So for the folks in Lonoke county listening to this, you can understand that the majority. I. I don't have the exact numbers, but I'm going to say it's probably almost 2/3 of the population live in the northern district.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Right.

[B]

Because that entails Cabot.

[C]

Right. Cabot, Austin, Ward.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Butlerville, Sylvania, all that Woodlawn. All those places. 16th section. So the issue becomes with ag crimes. Right. You know, with a, with a, with a population concentration, those your, your calls for service are generally going to be located where the population is.

[B]

Of course.

[C]

So here we go. So now our deputies are migrating to the north end of the county. Well, here's the rub. 75 to 80% of the annual revenue for Lonoke county comes from farming and ranching.

[B]

Correct.

[C]

From the east and the south side of the county.

[B]

Right.

[C]

So when we look at it from what is in. And everybody that pays taxes deserves responsive service. Oh, 100 and so ag crimes, things like criminal mischief, you know, vandalism.

[B]

Yep.

[C]

Theft of. Theft of farm equipment. You know, you steal a combine, that's a million dollars easily. And so it's not like you steal a combine and put it on Facebook. Make marketplace. There is a niche for that. Right. It's just like. It's just like the dope gang. It's just like the trafficking game there. There are conduits. Right. There are markets for these commodities.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Whatever the, Whatever the criminal activity is. So first of all, we need to understand that it's not just us, but like there's an agriculture department that has a law enforcement division in Arkansas. They have, they only have six investigators for the entire state, but they do all the wildland fire investigations. So they're all. They're all arson investigators. They do all of the cattle theft. They do processing, like the processing houses. So they do everything to do with agriculture.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

So they do a lot of cattle theft recovery. And a lot of that stuff is on the west side of the, of the, of the state. Right. Because Oklahoma, Texas, Arkansas is really in some into southern Missouri, but there's a real. There's a circuit, especially out of Oklahoma and Texas, that hit those guys in Waldron and Mena and Fort Smith. Yeah. And so they're really adept at that. But those guys, that's like, when. That's like using regional crime or the Like Haida. Right, for dope.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Or rocic, Regional Organized Crime Information center out of Nashville. They have a regional collaborative agreement in third in 14 southern states, southeastern states. That includes Oklahoma and Texas for ag crimes. So it's like you have your own. It's like you have your own information network, an investigative network like field interview information sharing. That's just for agriculture. I'll be darn. So if that combine is stolen in the middle of the night, probably headed to Mississippi.

[B]

Gotcha.

[C]

You know?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Because there's just not a lot of. There's just not a lot of law enforcement presence in the Delta, right?

[B]

Oh, yeah, no soft farmland.

[A]

Right.

[C]

And so those investigators. And you know how it is, people tend to specialize.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And so when you were in. When you were in sid, right?

[B]

Yep.

[C]

When you were in sid, y' all specialize in certain things. Little Rock may be a big city, but you knew. You knew the people that were in the games.

[B]

Sure, Yeah, I knew the people that were doing what I watched over.

[C]

Right. And same thing with Julie. I mean, she would. She would see certain MOs and certain things just like we talked about with the. With the guy that she connected same way with on the street. You know, these folks, you got the info, so they know that game. And so for me, I think it's critical that we work with the farmers to establish a farm watch program. Same way back in the day, Little Rock, back in the late 80s, early 90s, had that program called Heat Help End Auto theft. And.

[B]

Okay, that's before my time.

[C]

So helping auto theft, you got. You were a vehicle owner. You got a sticker, you put it in your lower left hand corner of your rear window. Of your. Yeah, the rear window. You signed a form, a consent form, that after certain hours, between the hours of this and that, you gave consent to be stopped.

[B]

No kidding.

[C]

Because everybody was stealing cars.

[B]

Right. And. Yeah, I get it.

[C]

And so back then, you know, they cracked the column. Soon as they cracked the column, the headlights come on bright. You couldn't dim the lights. So then you knew.

[A]

Right.

[C]

No driving College Station. Dim, bright headlights in a. In a Monte Carlo.

[D]

Stolen.

[C]

Stolen every time.

[D]

Time.

[C]

Here we go.

[B]

Oh, that was before my time.

[C]

Here we go. Down, down. Roosevelt, folks. Throwing guns out the window. But so it's about. It's about. It's about relationship building. It's about, you know, those ad crimes. Detectives are not. Or investigators are not necessarily a detective. I think they're much more valuable to be on patrol.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Oh, yeah, right. And. And so you Use that on the ground. Yeah. And they're making relationships a lot like the old cop. But the thing is sheriffin, I learned this at Pulaski County Sheriffin being a deputy sheriff, that's the original cop, that's the original community oriented policing. Never thought of it because one of the things, when I worked in north Pulaski and out in West Pulaski, I carried things in my car that nobody working College Station carried, right? I carried the lead rope, I carried fencing pliers, I carried a bucket of staples, I carried high tensile wire and I carried a metal feed bucket.

[B]

I bet it come in handy because

[C]

you don't, you don't chase livestock. Because if you chase livestock, they run, right? You throw some rocks in the bucket, you shake it and you walk back into the pasture and they follow you because they think you're going to feed

[B]

them, you're going to get fed, right?

[C]

And then you wire it up and then you don't. You're not trying to call the owner to come out at 2 in the morning to fix fence. You just leave a note on his. Because you have this watch, it's, now you have it on your computer. It's at comm center. They can pull that up and say, this parcel, this address belongs to Mr. So and so. His residence is somewhere. Go to his residence, leave a note on his, on his door or on his truck. Hey, here's the GPS coordinates or the, the, the pin where I fixed your fence last night. Might want to go check your, check your livestock, get a head count. I think we got everything in.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

That's responsive service. And what else are you doing at three in the morning, right?

[B]

Trolling around. Looking for.

[C]

Trolling around. So, yeah. And so also you've got these, you've got well pumps, you've got generators out there. You know how it is.

[B]

Oh yeah.

[C]

And I, I talked to the, I talked to the guys at the, in April at the Farm Bureau meeting. I'm like, you know, unfortunately right now you're the best thing you can do for your business. The most, the, the most business savvy thing you can do is just go ahead and leave a note on your mailbox and say there's a $5 bill in here, please take it every day because somebody's going to go tear up all the, all the wiring out of a well pumpkin or a generator for 75 cents in copper, right? And then they've got to call elder well service or another well service and spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars to get that back in service. Of course, now they're paying for it. This time of year, crops don't get watered for a couple of days. Crops done.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Crop's done. Now if the crop's done, that means it's subsidized. They're losing money. Also, their insurance rate's going to go up. We're all paying higher insurance rates. So everything is tied in.

[B]

Yes. Oh, 100.

[C]

That's why I think. That's why I think it's important to at least give a nod to agricultural crimes as being important, very important. And when a. And not just saying they're the only ones doing it. If a deputy goes and there can be a nexus drawn, a connection to some type of agricultural crime, then that report should get routed to their supervisor. Right. For review like any other ones. But that supervisor. Once it's reviewed, that supervisor then needs to route that directly to the agriculture deputy so he has a picture because he knows stuff, because he's talking to farmers and co op workers and people that are out there working. But now he's got a report and he can tie all this stuff in here. Like we used to do the. The FI cards. Field interview cards.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[C]

But the problem is they didn't work until somebody actually looked at them. So most of the time they went in a file cabinet with a Polaroid and nobody ever looked at them again. So what are we doing these for? Right, right. We did the information, but it was not retrievable.

[B]

Yeah, well, that was because we were in the day of paper.

[C]

That's right.

[B]

You know, you don't do paper anymore. You just upload it and everybody has access.

[C]

Or you. Or you had a situation where supervisor said, you guys aren't doing enough FI cards. I want three FI cards every night. And so you went down to the guy at 17th and MLK or, you know, or. Or, you know, 2900 Broadway.

[D]

Right.

[C]

The guy that's always sitting in front of the. Of the Dodge store and you get an FI card and you threw it in the back. Well, there's one. And then you're like, oh, well, there's two, there's three. Okay, I'm done. You know those ridiculous.

[D]

Oh, yeah.

[C]

Requirements. They don't mean anything.

[B]

Exactly. Well, I tell you guys, we're about to wrap this up. Yes, sir. How can people find you on social media as far as your candidacy goes?

[C]

Yeah. So Larry Binky, that's L, A, R, R, Y. Spelling is B, E, H, N, K E in the profile picture will say it'll be green and yellow logo. It'll say elect Larry Binky. I also have you go there. I have Larry Binky for Lonoke County Sheriff. A Facebook group. They can go there and follow me there. I have Larry Binky for Lonoke County Sheriff on YouTube. I have Larry Binky for Lonoke County Sheriff on Instagram. And I have Larry Binky for Loan up County Sheriff on Tick Tock.

[B]

So you're covering all the platforms?

[C]

I'm trying to. Because I feel it's critical to reach all of our demographics.

[B]

Oh, 100%. So now let me ask.

[C]

Oh, and I'm sorry. And also have. Also have a website. So Ben key four the number four sheriff.com Ben key four sheriff.

[B]

For sheriff the number four.

[C]

So it's Binky four sheriff. And that's. That's hyperlinked on all the other platforms. So.

[B]

Sure. Okay. Now, I've seen your social media get a lot better as this goes along. I'm trying.

[C]

Well, I'm, I'm my only. I'm my guy.

[A]

Right.

[C]

I am the campaign with a shoestring budget.

[D]

It is us.

[B]

Hey, social media is the only way to do it.

[C]

That's right.

[B]

That's how you reach most people these days.

[C]

And foot traffic and talking to people.

[B]

Oh, yeah, yeah. Now you got to get out there and talk to. Absolutely.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

But to reach the masses. Yeah, absolutely. Right now. Yeah, I do. I watch things all over the world on social media. What is that? Sheriff down in Florida, Grady Judd. Have you ever thought about doing a morning coffee?

[D]

He absolutely has.

[C]

So let me tell you, you know, and I'll. And I'll tell you why I love me some Grady Judd. Yes. He's awesome. I. I would do some things different because you don't want to. It's kind of like.

[B]

I love that guy.

[C]

I love the guy. But it's kind of like using another man's barbecue recipe.

[B]

Oh, I get it.

[C]

It's got to be your own, right? She. She tried to get me to use her brother's barbecue recipe one night. I had to tell her, you cannot use another man's barbecue. Yeah. And so.

[B]

So it's like getting on another man's motorcycle.

[C]

That's right.

[D]

Or.

[C]

Or picking up his guitar without. Yeah. You want to fight. And so. Yeah. So, yeah. Grady Judd. Awesome stuff. And. And yeah, we're at a pos. And we're at a point that a lot that we didn't have when we started this job. Because when we started the job, we didn't have Social media, right?

[B]

Correct.

[C]

So if you went out, if a couple of guards went down to a neighborhood and you got into something and then you started, you got into a disagreement and the communication wasn't where it's supposed to be. Now you're beefing. Now there's a beef in the neighborhood or with that family, you could leave and maybe a couple days later you see them on the street, you could patch that up.

[B]

Oh yeah.

[C]

Either they would come to you, you could talk to them and say, hey, look, man, hey, the other night we got off on the wrong foot. You know, I got a job to do. But you know, I was a little out of line.

[A]

Right.

[C]

And I got it. You could patch that up.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

You can't do that anymore because now the interactions happen so fast. So now if, if I'm the, if I'm an officer that goes to a house and I have that interaction, that's not good. Soon as I leave, bam. Agency gets a one star Google review and it gets posted Little Rock Hood news. You're on the Little Rock hood News or whatever it is today. And all of a sudden that probably com. Legitimate complaint, all right, that one legitimate complaint that was posted on social media many times happened because that agency did not have a meaningful workable process for them to complain about that service.

[B]

Right, Exactly.

[C]

So they, they cannot get satisfaction through the agency. So now the frustration builds, right? I'm a taxpayer, I'm help, I need you to help me. You treat me terribly and don't help me and I still have to pay you, and I have. And I can't call for somebody else. That frustration builds. Social media. The problem becomes within 10 seconds, that thing is at the speed of light.

[B]

Oh yeah.

[C]

At every corner of the country. And now everybody who has no dog in the fight has, Knows nothing about the original issue is amplifying that. Of course, it's not because they care. It's not because they care about what happens in your neighborhood. It's because they want a dopamine hit. Why, sure, it's a dopamine hit. Because they get responses and it doesn't matter if they're positive or they're negative. They're getting a response. And so we just got to face it. The genie, that genie is out of the bottle.

[A]

Right.

[C]

The toothpaste is out of the tooth. It's not going back in. So what do we do as leaders in that situation? To be radically transparent up front.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And I got to tell you, I've been doing this a long time. Just like Y', all, some of that's uncomfortable because we never had to do it before, but I've had to do it in the latter part of my career. I had to do it at North Little Rock.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

With the BLM riots and some of the videos that came out that were completely. They were not accurate depictions of what happened. And I was fighting not only the street, but as a watch commander, I was fighting a, an administration that was out of touch because they hadn't been on the street for a long time and they didn't understand technology and the role that social media has in the, in the law enforcement interaction in our community.

[B]

Quite sure.

[C]

So it can be frustrating. Right. You can try to do the right thing, but you're, you're, you're fighting this, this brick wall a lot of times in your own organization because they don't, they will not accept it.

[B]

Right.

[D]

And you said the. Sometimes the administration is out of touch, and I just want people to understand that. Just because you decided to take a promotional exam and take a position of sergeant and then take a position of lieutenant, what that looked like. Because I think you have a unique experience of what that looks like. You were not going in and drinking coffee and looking at reports to a son out and.

[C]

Right.

[D]

You were still.

[C]

Yeah. So when I'm called. Yeah. So when I made lieutenant, they, When I made lieutenant, I went. They said, do you want Street Crimes unit back? It was similar to vcat. Right.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Well, I had established this, this, this unit in 2014 as a sergeant, and we were very effective at reducing the overall violent crime rate.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

But like all good things, crime rate goes down. Administration says, oh, we don't need you anymore. So you're poof, you're disappeared within six months. Oh, my gosh. Crime rates gotta control. People are getting shot left and right. What do we do? I'm like, maybe we put the crime scene, the, the, the street crimes unit back together.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And. And so. And we did. And so it, There was never continuity, but when I made lieutenant, they said, we're going to put a lieutenant over street crimes. I was like, absolutely. I love it.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

You're going, those who fight, who flee, who shoot at you.

[A]

Right.

[C]

The. The worst of the worst.

[B]

Absolutely.

[C]

First thing I learned is they put me as a lieutenant, they took the sergeant out. So now I'm a lieutenant working like a sergeant, having to do all the files, but I'm in more pursuits than they are. Right. And so my, my experience as supervisor in, in patrol and those special units were Working supervisors, there's no sitting at the substation. Right. So, yeah, I mean, and there's, it's not just me. There's a, there were a lot of, a lot of supervisors that were like that. So, yeah, you can't. From agency to agency, there's differences. But I think what we forget and a lot of people don't understand is all officers are not created equal. And just because you're a sergeant or you're a lieutenant or you're a captain, a chief, a sheriff, does not mean the next guy. It can. That the next guy with experience is going to be like you or is going to be worse. Right, Right. It's truly individualized experience. What, what can, what do you bring to the table? Do you have a record of consistent growth in building teams and building capabilities and investing in your people? That's what I consider experience.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Well, you're 100% the most qualified and experienced. There's no doubt about it. I mean that to me, it's just, it's just not even questionable.

[C]

Well, I will tell you this, that we none of us know everything.

[B]

Right. But no, I'm not saying, you know everything I'm saying in this race.

[C]

Sure.

[B]

You're the most qualified experience.

[C]

I will say that, you know, one of the things that does concern me, regardless of, you know, whatever my experience is, it's going to be a challenge.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

Even with a 30 year head start.

[B]

Correct.

[C]

And a, you know, over 3,000, almost 3,100 hour or over 3,100 hours of training.

[B]

Right.

[C]

This is going to be a challenge because I've never been a sheriff.

[B]

Right.

[C]

I've worked sheriff's, sheriff's department, I've been a unit commander. I've worked budgets. But there are constitutional and legal requirements and obligations that a sheriff must fulfill.

[B]

Correct.

[C]

Nobody in this race has ever been that sheriff. So I've got a 30 year head start.

[B]

Sure.

[C]

But I recognize it's gonna be a challenge. That's why September 14th through the 18th, I'm already enrolled through, through Alita to go to the jail administrators court course. Oh, wow. As a retiree, sure. So as a retiree, I've averaged 40 hours of training every year after I retired. You're only required to do 24 hours.

[B]

Right.

[C]

As an active officer. So training is critical. Maintaining currency is critical, right?

[B]

Absolutely.

[C]

So.

[B]

Absolutely. Well, we're going to wrap this up. I appreciate you guys coming on the show. Thank you very much. Julie, is there anything you'd like to add?

[D]

You're shaking your Head.

[C]

No, because I know you, dear.

[D]

You know, for us. And like I said before, right. We're on a shoestring budget. It's the two of us. We really. If anybody has seen my reel that I put out, I'm starting to do some little education training videos.

[B]

Right?

[D]

Right. There's. There's three reasons that people become police officers, and it's the three Bs.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

You haven't seen it yet. You're giving me the eyeball, so I'm trying to figure out where you're going.

[C]

Cliff notes, version 3B's.

[D]

I am. I'm going to make it shorter because if you want to see it, you can see Julie Eckert, E, C, K, E, R, t. But the three Bs. So the first one is the person that we all want responding to our calls, and those are the people that got on the police department for the betterment of society.

[B]

Gotcha.

[D]

They wanted to make a difference in a positive way. They wanted to be able to intervene in crises and help people. Right. They had. They had the right heart. They got into it for the right reason. Right. Second B. Second B is what I call the just becauseers.

[B]

So there's a lot of those.

[D]

They went to college, and then they got out of college. Like I said, I went to college. Not knocking that. They went to college, got out of college, maybe for something completely unrelated to criminal justice. They never gave a second thought about being a police officer. And their buddy called them and said, hey, the North Little Rock Police Department Department's hiring. You want to. They got good insurance.

[B]

Right?

[D]

Right.

[B]

Right.

[D]

Or.

[B]

Or Little Rock gives you $10,000.

[D]

Right. You can get a bonus.

[B]

Exactly.

[D]

Those are the. Just because there's. They're gonna leave work on time. They're not staying a minute late. They're going to figure out what they are not getting.

[C]

10, 40 for a call.

[B]

You're gonna be lucky if they take a call, right?

[D]

Yes. You're gonna be lucky if they take a call. Right. So those are the just becauseers. They're not going to go out of their way for anybody. Right. And then there's the third B, the bullies. They got picked on in junior high school, and they're trying to figure out, how am I going to show my authority to people? And if anybody's in police work, y' all know exactly who I'm talking about, and y' all know who they are. And when I do my trainings, I. I tell the recruits that, and they all start laughing because they're Already at departments, they already know who they are.

[C]

Every time we talk to folks, we all have those mental.

[B]

Yeah, they're popping up in your.

[C]

Just like all the new policies. Right. They've all got a picture. They should have a picture like, oh, that's the Larry policy or the Julie policy or the Dave policy.

[D]

That pepper spray policy. That might be mine. I'm just saying that's in the 90s, but yeah, so they're the three Bs. Larry and I, we have the right heart. We. He is in this to better Lonoke county for the betterment of the citizens of Lonoke County. That's his heart.

[B]

Absolutely. That's awesome.

[C]

Yeah. I mean, we've. We've had our careers.

[B]

Right?

[C]

You know what I'm saying?

[B]

Yeah. Everybody's sitting here.

[C]

Yes, we, we've had our careers. This is obviously stepping back into the arena. Law enforcement arena, bless your soul. Right. But I look at it this way. It is not about a career. Right, Right. Because in this, this job is not about. This position of sheriff, is not about bettering my career.

[B]

Correct.

[C]

Right. I look at it as my experience throughout my career, both, you know, in law enforcement, in the 22 years I spent in the, in the army and the National Guard. All of that is coloring and giving me the opportunity or the ability to affect that position. So the position is not better in my career.

[B]

Right.

[C]

My experience is going to be used to better that position and the agency and the service we get in the county.

[B]

There you go. I love it. All right, guys. Well, I can't tell you enough how much I appreciate y' all coming on the show.

[C]

You know, someday we'll do this maybe a third time and we may get it under an hour. I don't know. Mr. Producer is probably going to be like, right.

[B]

These guys, he's going to want to split this into two shows. Oh, yeah, yeah, exactly.

[C]

That's why he's Mr. Producer.

[D]

Right.

[B]

All right, well, guys, hey, I do want to invite you back one more time before the big election.

[C]

Cool.

[B]

When's that?

[C]

November 3.

[B]

November 3.

[D]

November 3.

[B]

Let's do it one more time before the big election.

[C]

We'll be out early voting will start. We'll be out at all. We've got, we've got some volunteers to be out at all the polling places just getting those, those last minute face to faces.

[D]

Folks that want to volunteer, just shoot us an email.

[B]

Yeah, right.

[C]

Whatever. Just. Yeah, there's plenty of things. You go to my website, there's a phone number on there. There's an email on there. I answer it. I will answer it. I'm the only one that answers.

[D]

So get new signs in new T shirts.

[C]

New signs coming a week.

[D]

Gonna be some good shirts coming in. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Surprise. It's a surprise.

[B]

All right. All right, guys. Well, I appreciate it. We are wrapping this up. Hey, I appreciate everybody listening to the show. Thank you very much. And if you feel like it, jump on over there and give us a five star review. If you don't have five star review, give us an email and tell us what we can do better. I appreciate it, guys. And Mr. Producer, we are sending this back to you, sir. Thank you.

[A]

That's a wrap for this episode of the Arnet podcast. We're grateful to have you as a part of our community. If you enjoyed today's show, share it with a friend or leave us a review. It really helps us keep telling these important stories. And don't forget to check out the podcast description for more on our guest and topics. Thanks again for listening and make sure to follow the show so you'll never miss an episode of the Arnet podcast. This has been a Mallard island Media and Mr. Producer Production.