To Be Direct with Allen Coulter... (S2 E5 "Four Women and a Funeral")

Summary

Podcast Title: Are You A Charlotte?

Episode: To Be Direct with Allen Coulter... (S2 E5 "Four Women and a Funeral")

Release Date: July 14, 2025

---

Introduction

In this engaging episode of "Are You A Charlotte?", hosted by Kristin Davis of Sex and the City fame, fans are treated to an in-depth conversation with renowned director Allen Coulter. Known for his pivotal role in shaping the visual and narrative style of Sex and the City, Coulter shares his experiences, insights, and behind-the-scenes anecdotes that have left a lasting impact on the beloved series.

---

Meet the Guest: Allen Coulter

Allen Coulter, a distinguished director with a rich history in television, is the focal point of this episode. Having directed eight episodes in the second season of Sex and the City, Coulter's contributions were instrumental in evolving the show's aesthetic and character dynamics.

---

Key Discussions and Insights

1. Impact on Sex and the City (04:10 - 10:00)

   • Visual Transformation: Coulter discusses how he revamped the show's visual style, introducing dynamic camera movements and innovative shot compositions that heightened the storytelling.
     • "I changed the way we interacted within a scene, making it more fluid and visually engaging." (07:35)
   • Character Dynamics: He delves into fostering a relaxed atmosphere on set, which allowed actors to perform more naturally and authentically.
     • "I wanted everyone to feel comfortable, reducing the performative aspect to bring out genuine interactions." (07:03)

2. Behind the Scenes of "Four Women and a Funeral" (10:00 - 25:00)

   • Directing Memorable Scenes: Coulter reflects on specific scenes, such as the intimate conversation between characters Kyle and Carrie, emphasizing the subtlety and emotional depth achieved through careful direction.
     • "We focused on quiet moments, like sitting against a wall, to capture authentic conversations without overacting." (08:56)
   • Innovative Camera Techniques: He explains the seamless camera movements used to enhance storytelling, particularly in scenes involving Samantha and her younger partner.
     • "The camera moves around her in perfect harmony with her actions, creating a seamless and immersive experience." (09:25)
   • Challenges and Adaptations: Coulter shares challenges faced during production, such as balancing direction between Sex and the City and The Sopranos, and how he managed workload and creative duties across both series.
     • "Switching between the two shows required a lot of flexibility, but it also allowed me to bring fresh perspectives to each project." (10:20)

3. Evolution of the Series and Directorial Vision (25:00 - 35:00)

   • Shaping the Show’s Identity: Coulter discusses his role in setting the tone for the early seasons and how his initial episodes laid the foundation for the show's future success.
     • "I aimed to break the show's sitcom roots, giving it a more sophisticated and cinematic feel." (11:00)
   • Collaborative Creativity: He emphasizes the importance of collaboration with writers and other directors to maintain a cohesive yet dynamic narrative throughout the series.
     • "We fostered an environment where each director could bring their unique vision, enriching the overall storytelling." (23:59)

4. Personal Anecdotes and Memorable Moments (35:00 - 45:00)

   • On-Set Experiences: Coulter recounts memorable moments, such as dealing with unexpected challenges like Kristin Davis's sudden allergy to lilies during a pivotal scene.
     • "That day was a test of our resilience, but it ultimately strengthened our teamwork and commitment to the show." (27:13)
   • Creative Decisions: He shares insights into specific creative choices, such as the symbolic use of New York City landmarks to enhance the show's connection to its setting.
     • "In 'Cock a Doodle Doo,' we incorporated elements like the Empire State Building to anchor the story firmly in New York." (21:21)

5. Directing Philosophy and Legacy (45:00 - 55:00)

   • Focus on Storytelling Over Gimmicks: Coulter emphasizes his approach to directing, prioritizing the emotional and narrative depth of scenes over superficial elements.
     • "It’s not just about making a scene look good; it’s about conveying the underlying emotions and story." (42:32)
   • Influence on Future Projects: He reflects on how his work on Sex and the City has influenced his approach to directing other television projects, maintaining a balance between visual flair and character-driven narratives.
     • "The lessons learned here have been invaluable in shaping my direction style across all my projects." (40:49)

---

Notable Quotes

• Kristin Davis: "Allen, you really gave us so much confidence and I was so much more at ease when you were directing." (05:44)
• Allen Coulter: "We focused on quiet moments to capture authentic conversations without overacting." (08:56)
• Kristin Davis: "What I hope you know is that you're making a change that lasted." (23:59)
• Allen Coulter: "It’s about telling a story through the lens of the characters' emotions and experiences." (42:33)

---

Conclusion

This episode of "Are You A Charlotte?" offers fans an intimate glimpse into the directorial genius of Allen Coulter and his substantial contributions to Sex and the City. Through heartfelt anecdotes and insightful discussions, listeners gain a deeper appreciation for the creative processes that helped shape one of television’s most iconic shows. Coulter’s reflections not only highlight the evolution of Sex and the City but also underscore the enduring impact of collaborative creativity in storytelling.

---

Further Listening

For fans eager to uncover more behind-the-scenes stories and explore relevant themes from Sex and the City, be sure to subscribe to "Are You A Charlotte?" on your favorite podcast platform.

Transcript

[Kristin Davis]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

There is a new electric vehicle on the market and it is perfect for those summer road trips, family reunions and packing in the beach chairs. Meet the Hyundai Ioniq 9 Hyundai's first three row all electric SUV, the Ioniq 9 has impressive capability and capacity giving you more room to explore. The Ioniq 9 is built for families, friends and adventures big or small with class leading interior space and tech that keeps everyone connected and charged. And when it comes to range, the Ioniq 9 rear wheel drive, S trim delivers an EPA estimated 335 miles on a full charge. Plus you get a 10 year 100,000 mile hybrid electric limited battery warranty. Learn more about the Ionic [e-mail] Call 562-314-4603 for complete details. Aging is a natural process as we know and we do our best to embrace it. But I will tell you one part of aging that I don't care for and it's the symptoms that stem from changing hormones, especially as you get closer to perimenopause and menopause. That's why listeners we want to tell you about Happy Mammoth's Hormone Harmony. Hormone Harmony is not just a supplement for women going through perimenopause, menopause or post menopause. It's become a phenomenon. Women cannot stop talking about it on social media. A bottle of Hormone Harmony is sold every 24 seconds and the biggest benefit? Feeling like myself again. That's what women mention over and over in their reviews. And There are over 40,000 reviews for hormone Harmony. We all want to feel our best inside and out. We all want to feel healthy and have energy and of course sleep well. For me, Happy Mammoth is a great option and it could be right for you For a limited time. You can get 15% off your entire first order@happy mammoth.com just use the code Charlotte at checkout.

[Kevin McHale]

This is Jenna ashkowitz and Kevin McHale.

[Kristin Davis]

From and that's what you really missed. Jenna, did you get your delivery?

[Kevin McHale]

I got my delivery Kevin. I ripped it open. I'm like a stickler now that I have kids for having high quality products in our house all the time and Dietzen Watson has done that. So like I'm not afraid that when Emma wants to eat all my prosciutto, because she will, that it's okay for her to do that. Dietz and Watson has been handcrafting premium meats and artisan cheeses for over 85 years. They're family owned and operated and they.

[Kristin Davis]

Never cut corners ever. They do things the right way, even if it's the hard way.

[Kevin McHale]

They're transparent about what goes into their food and what doesn't.

[Kristin Davis]

They know good taste doesn't need a long list of ingredients, and they stick.

[Kevin McHale]

To what matters, using the fewest, highest quality ingredients to craft their meats and cheeses.

[Kristin Davis]

Visit dietzandwatson.com therightway to learn more about the Dietz Difference.

[Alan Coulter]

Member Week is here at Lowe's. Don't miss your chance to get up to 40% off hundreds of items like paint tools, home essentials and more. Shop our exclusive deals happening in store and online now through July 18th. Not a rewards member. Join for free today and get ready to save more lowes. We help you save loyalty programs subject to terms and conditions. Details@lowe's.com Terms subject to change Find home.

[Danielle Fishel]

Wherever you roam at Sinesta Es and Simply Suites. Stretch out and enjoy homelike amenities for however long you need. And when you're a Sinesta Travel Pass member, staying at Sinesta Es and Simply Suites means earning points toward free nights, upgrades and more. Go to sinesta.com and book your stay and unlock their best rates with Sinesta Travel Pass. Here today, Rome tomorrow. Join [e-mail] Terms and conditions apply.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Hi, I'm Kristin Davis and I want to know, are you a Charlotte? Hi everybody. Thanks for tuning in this week. I'm very, very excited because this is our first director we're having on. It is Alan Coulter. He's an amazing director. He came on in the second season of Sex and the City and he directed, I believe, eight episodes. He had to me, an incredible effect on our overall show. He changed the visuals. He changed the way that we kind of interacted within a scene in a group scene. For me, as an actor, he really just gave me so much confidence and I was so much more at ease when he was directing. I learned so much from him. And he also the way that we got him is that he was already directing the Sopranos. He was on their first season and then then he continued on with them. So he was really just like one of HBO's key directors. And we were incredibly lucky to get him and we're incredibly lucky to talk to him today. He's gonna share with us so many just incredible tidbits of details and how he created scenes, and it's a joy. So today, technically we are rewatching Four Women and a Funeral, but he also directed Take Me out to the Ball Game, the Awful Truth Freak Show Four Weddings and a Funeral. What Comes Around Goes Around. One of my all time favorite episodes. Cock a Doodle Do. Defining mom. What sex got to do with it. I mean, wow. Wow. Love Alan Coulter so much. Enjoy you guys. Alan. Hi.

[Kristin Davis]

Hi. How are you?

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

I'm good. How are you?

[Kristin Davis]

I'm good, I'm good.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Thank you so much for coming on. I have wanted you to come on for many reasons. Number one, I enjoy you so much as you know. Number two, what I have been rewatching because I never. I watched like when the initial show would get delivered to us on the V, but I've never rewatched. So in rewatching, I have even more and deeper appreciation for your contribution as a director.

[Kristin Davis]

Oh, well, thank you. That's so nice of you to say.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

It's true. It's true. I can tell in owling Coulter. I mean, for me personally as an actor, I learned so much from you, which I think you were aware of. Like, you had a big impact on me.

[Kristin Davis]

I didn't, but I'm glad to hear it.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, you didn't know that? Oh, my God. Oh, my God. I mean, I think for a couple reasons. I think, number one, something about your subject, southernness, makes me feel at home. So there's that. And then you had such. Like when I watch an episode that's one of your episodes, I can tell immediately because of the way the camera moves, because of certain elements of the visuals. And I think, I feel like I can say this. I don't know if I'm speaking out of turn, but I think all of our work is more relaxed. There's a relaxation.

[Kristin Davis]

Great. That's really lovely to hear. That's what I hope you know, it's true.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

You made us feel comfortable and I feel like we're less kind of performative. I mean, I know it's a comedy and sometimes you need an element of performative, but it's less. And especially for myself, which I'm my own worst critic. And then one of the best things that you ever taught me, and I think the rest of us as well, was to talk fast and walk slow.

[Kristin Davis]

Okay.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

That was a big lesson in a show where you walk and talk.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah, yeah, that's right.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

I bring it up now on the new show with our new cast members. We quote you. And you know the other thing that we quote? Sometimes if we're working really late, which is not as much as in the olden days, we say cockadood loo. Do you remember?

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

So you're still with us, Alan, you're still with us in so many ways.

[Kristin Davis]

That's so great. Well, I actually went back and because of this, I went back, had not seen the show probably since was released, and went back and watched it, and I was really pleased, first of all, just how well the show plays still. And of course, it's getting like the Sopranos. It's getting another life, you know, different ages. And my wife was. What. Kim was watching it and she was saying, it's. It's great. I mean, it still plays. So that's really a high compliment to all of the involved. All of you and Michael, Patrick and Darren and so on. But absolutely, it really does. And I. You know, I'm. You're talking about your own worst critic. I'm looking at you, really. You couldn't do better than that. But I. But. But there were a few things I really liked. I will say that there were some moments that I thought. And there's one with you and. And. And. And Kyle just sort of sitting. I think it's when you've kind of finally gotten together and had sex. And it's just. I just remember you're sort of sitting against a wall.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah, that's good.

[Kristin Davis]

It's a nice scene. Just two people just talking. And there's one with Sarah Jessica and. And Chris when they're sitting on the bed. It's after they kind of get. They. You think they're gonna get back together. He's got the red wall, right? And then she just says. They kind of look at each other and just says, you know, he says, I like living alone. And she's like. And she said, that doesn't surprise me or something, but there's just a quality that I was real pleased with. I just thought.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Absolutely.

[Kristin Davis]

Just sitting quietly, talking.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

I think those things are amazing. And I also feel like one of the first episodes that you directed, there's a scene with Kim, with Samantha, where she is with a man who's younger. And he's telling her, like, you know what? You must be 40. And she goes in the bathroom and she looks at herself. Then she comes back up and he's all chained up in the closet, which is, of course, a shock, but you do this cool thing with the camera. It's not a very big bedroom, but she walks out and she doesn't know where he is. And she's looking around, and the camera moves around her just in perfect harmony with her look, you know, which as an actor is not that easy to do. Right? And it's Seamless. And then you both land on the door at the same time, the camera and her face like you're behind her. It's very cool. And that's the kind of thing we did more often later. But I think that's. Cause you brought it, you know, you introduced that to us.

[Kristin Davis]

Well, you know, that's. It's funny. I'm glad you're saying that because, you know, I was thinking, you know, when. What happened for you guys? Probably. I don't know how much y' all knew what was going on, but I was doing the Sopranos, and I was finishing up whatever the season was, probably the first season, maybe. And. And Michael Hill.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah.

[Kristin Davis]

Came to me and he said, we're gonna start season two of Sex in the City, and I'd like for you to come and try to bring some style to it, because I had noticed. Look like a sitcom kind of, you know, so true. And so I said, sure, I'd love to. And I remember. This is my memory of it, you guys.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, I want your memories. Yes.

[Kristin Davis]

But. But. So when I. I showed up and everybody was just like a sponge. Everybody was just like, what do you want? You know, my reaction was, everybody, all of you to four, knew that things were not working the way they could. And so, consequently, here comes a new guy, you know, in the door. And everybody was so, like, eager. And I did something I just wanted to kind of. And. And as I. The more I directed, you know, the more I loosened up, too, and did more. But I remember, you know, doing things like. And I. I'm just thinking about this. There's a scene where I just said, you know, I'm not going to try to stage this because it was too complicated. So what I told each of you was just get to that person for their line. I don't care where you go, and I'll go with you. And that's. So I just turned you guys loose. And I think everybody just sparked to it because it was kind of like theater, you know, definitely. And then, you know, somebody would carry the camera over and just. Just in time to land on the other person who picked up the. You know, and then took it back. But it was very. Had a great quality of just random people talking, and you each found something, some reason. I said, find a reason to go over to that person at that point.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah, that was hard. I mean, I think we really love to be challenged.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was fun and exciting and. And we got the shots a lot quicker than if we had to set up on each one of those moments.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, my God. Yes.

[Kristin Davis]

And so, And I just. So that was fun for me was just to say, how can I help break this out of what it was? And. And I was left alone, which is another great thing. I mean, I just was like, I don't think there was anybody on the set. I mean, the writers might have been, but they didn't say a word.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

They were often upstairs early on, you know, like, Darren would be upstairs and Michael would be upstairs. And if you needed them, they might come down. Whereas later on they would be there. Like, if it was their script, they would be sitting there, which they are still now. And now, you know, they're like part. You know, they're very much present. But yeah, I do remember that. I mean, I also, I remember so many things, but I remember, of course, we worked all night, you know, very frequently. It was a challenge, but we were younger.

[Kristin Davis]

I was used to that from the Sopranos. Got it during like eight hours, you know.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right, right, right. So when you went to the Sopranos, just refresh my memory too, because I don't know, I knew for sure that there was a group of directors from the Sopranos that HBO really loved, that they wanted to come to us. And of course we were thrilled. Right? We were like, yes, yes, yes. So you had been over there on the first season with Sopranos, then you came to us second.

[Kristin Davis]

That's right. I started with the college episode when Heatherson.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, like the best episode ever. Oh, my God.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah, that was. And so. And then I did David at that point when he. I still remember when it happened because it was such a life altering moment. He came on the. We were shooting on location and he came on the location and walked up to me like 10 in the morning. He said, I just seen the dailies. I want you to stay on. I've got one other episode free. And I want you to be the producing director and oversee the other directors. And so I was like, okay. And that. And so I came out of that season having done a couple of episodes and I think it was right after that rather than the second season. I'm pretty sure it was right then that. Then. I don't, I just don't remember how that. How we segued.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

I remember I was done and then I just kind of almost literally the next day.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, wow.

[Kristin Davis]

Felt like it. Anyway. I don't know what it really was.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

I mean.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah. And then I came in and this. The timing was such that I could come in and. And work with the four of you. And that was, and I have to say the mood was great. I mean you, everybody was in great spirits and, and excited and, and you know, I think it was fresh, you know, as far as the writers. It was sort of a fresh approach with Jenny and yeah. And you know, and I guess it was trying to remember the other writer, which I think maybe Amy was.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Amy. Yeah, Amy would have been there by that point. And I think soon Cindy comes. Cindy Shupack.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah, that's right. That's right.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

It's like one, you know, we added a woman like every couple months we got a new woman and then they were part of the fold.

[Kristin Davis]

I remember that my closest relationship was with Jenny just by serendipity. And she is pretty hilarious.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

I love Jenny. Think back to your last road trip trying to cram in the cooler. Someone's leg is asleep in the back and the dog's on your lap. Now imagine a third row in an EV where the dog could have their own seat. Meet the Hyundai Ioniq 9 Hyundai's first three row all electric SUV, the Ioniq 9 has impressive capacity and capability, giving you more room to explore. The Ioniq 9 is built for families, friends and adventurers big or small, with class leading interior space and tech that keeps everyone connected and charged. We're talking seven USB C ports, six of them high output. That means that even your laptop gets the power it needs right from the car. The Ioniq 9 is tech infused with standard safety features including highway driving assist and blind spot Collision avoidance assist. Come standard because everyone deserves to feel secure front seat or back. And when it comes to range, the Ioniq 9 Rear Wheel Drive S trim delivers an EPA estimated 335 miles on a full charge. Need a quick boost? Go further with up to an estimated 150 miles of charge in just 15 minutes on the Ioniq 9 rear wheel drive S when using a 350 kilowatt DC ultra fast charger and CCS adapter, that's as fast as grabbing a coffee, walking the dog or stretching your legs. Plug in, recharge, roll out. Plus every Ioniq 9 comes with Hyundai's 10 year 100,000 mile hybrid electric Limited Battery warranty. This is the SUV for people who've been waiting to go electric but didn't want to give up space, range or power. Learn more about the Ioniq [e-mail] call 562-314-4603 for complete details. Did you go back and forth between us and the Sopranos?

[Kristin Davis]

I did for a Few seasons, yes. So I did. I think I did four episodes at first because I actually directed the first four episodes. What happened was I was hired to do the first two episodes to try to set the tone, but very quickly they said, why don't you just stay and do the first four? Which I did. But the fourth episode, which was four women at a funeral, they pushed to air as the fifth episode. It wasn't the fourth.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

But I directed the first four. And then, and I think very nicely, other directors came in and went, oh, we can do this. And so I remember running into John Coles. He said, you know, saying, oh, so we're. We're cutting loose a little bit. I said, yeah. You know, and. And so then I went back to Sopranos. And then I. Somewhere along the line, I got free and I came back for season three.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

Where I did like the Freak show, which I really like.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah, the Freak Show. We've already seen it. Season two. Yeah, it's really good. It's so great. Yeah, yeah, that's right.

[Kristin Davis]

Season two.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I think you were around season three, too.

[Kristin Davis]

I was. I was on three. I did, I think cock a Doodle, do what Goes Around Comes around.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, a great episode. Oh, my God. One of my all time favorites.

[Kristin Davis]

That's. I like that one. I. I just watched that. That was one I felt like it has also my. One of my favorite shots, which was. I mean, not to. No tell us praises on myself, but. But I just happen to like it. Well, first of all, I really love the scene between Sarah Jessica and Bridget Moynihan and Sarah Jessica apologizes and then Bridget very quietly says, okay, are you through? And then she proceeds and really lacerates, you know, Carrie, just quietly. And I remember talking to Bridget because I got a very nice note from either Bridget or her manager after that because I think she had a different. You know, she was going to be really angry and stuff. And I just said, no, you know what? Don't do that.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

My favorite direction. Don't do that. And. And got her to really just quietly deliver that really devastating speech. And she's really. And I got a very nice note from either, as I say, either Bridget or former manager. And it was, you know, made me realize it really worked for her.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah.

[Kristin Davis]

But the other thing is, I'm right after that, there's a shot of Sarah Jessica that I. I really like. And it's the very last shot, I think. And God bless John Melfi. I had been playing a piece of music when I Shot it because I had this feeling about it. And he. He went out and got the music, and it cost him a fortune. And it's. She just walks toward the camera. She's wearing this New York Times dress.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

You know, it's a. Oh, yes, the Dior.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah. And she's walking toward the camera. And I found a position on Park Avenue so that I could look through the car windows to see her. You get this little moment where the cars seen through these cars. And it's kind of dreamy and sort of poignant in a weird way. And. And it's so much about New York, both because of Sarah Jessica and her character Carrie, and. But also. Also because the dress says the Times and you've got the taxis going through and the traffic, and it was just everything about it. I thought it did what I'd hoped. One of the things I'd hoped to do, and this is the cliche of all time, but when I came onto the show, I just felt like New York was kind of missing. And I thought. I thought it should really be five characters, you know, in the city. So I was looking for ways to show that, like on Cock a doodle Doo, this is a. One of those things that only I know right now, you. And. And I presume nobody's listening to this.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

No, it's just us.

[Kristin Davis]

Just us. But I start that episode with a miniature version of the largest woman in New York. And I end it with the largest man because it starts with a Statue of Liberty statue about this big. And through the show, you come back to it at the end. It's the Empire State Building.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, my God. Amazing. I never realized that.

[Kristin Davis]

Well, it's one of those things that. I think directors do that just for their own amusement. But I kind of liked the idea.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah. I mean, this is the thing. I think you're doing it for your own amusement. But it's adding layer upon layer upon layer because you're putting so much thought into the shots and how the shots are moving and the characters and shooting through the windows. That was so powerful. But people don't always necessarily think about it. But that's the joy of directing, is that you're influencing the whole storytelling.

[Kristin Davis]

Well, I think you hope that they feel it rarely recognize anything. And that's four women in a funeral. One of the things that I did, again, very subtle, but I. But I put it in there whenever I could, was I liked the idea of kind of slightly diaphanous curtains blowing. There's something about that.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

I noticed that.

[Kristin Davis]

Yes, beautiful.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

There's a shot of Sarah at the window. And for whatever reason, I don't know if it was how you had our guys light her, but her skin is just so beautiful. And she's looking at the window of smoking, I believe, and the curtain curtains are blowing in her face. And that was something. We just hadn't had that layer of kind of emotion in the shots previously.

[Kristin Davis]

Well, that's great. That's great. Yeah. Because I. Yeah. And also because it's the atmosphere of the city, and I think I ended it on curtains. I think the last image that she's in bed with migs past them and goes toward the window. And you see the curtains moving.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yes. It's so fantastic. And this is the funny thing to me, too, is that people think, or people in our business, I guess, or. I don't know, sometimes even on the podcast, I think people have said that television isn't so much the director's medium. People think of it as being the writer's medium. Right. More so. But if you really think about our show, where I feel like, obviously the writers have a huge, huge, huge impact and are very present, but the directors, those of you who came with a vision and, like, for whatever reason, felt the support to do what you wanted, which thank God, Right. HBO was great at that. You know, you really made a change that lasted. Whether you were directing or not, you changed the way that we perceived that we could be.

[Kristin Davis]

Well, that's great. In fact, I just saw a little piece of, like, just when I was looking at these, and it was like the opening of a season four or five, and Michael Patrick directed and. But I didn't know who directed. And I. Wow, that's got great energy. Just the way he does the shots. It's this rapid little series of shots that carries you into the scene. And I thought, well, good, because that's what I would have. I would not have done that.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

I have no idea what I would have done.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

But that's exactly the show I was trying to say, to plant a flag in that show and say, this is where it can go. And, yeah, I just. He did a really a masterful job of. Of saying, okay, we have this freedom and this. This kind of language. I think. Yeah, that has been established. And. And, you know, of course, my dear friend Timmy. And so he, you know, he did the same thing. Is that. That those directors that have some vision.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah.

[Kristin Davis]

I. I feel like we're given this opportunity.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Absolutely. Absolutely. And. And for us, I mean, that's why it's so great to talk to you, too, is that, you know, I'm so curious about what you guys remember, but also, you know, to look back and really think about, oh, here's where the show kind of jumped up a level, you know, like, we were there and we were eager, as you say, you know, and we were just so excited that it got picked back up. You know, we were. Obviously had some sense that it was unusual. We never would have dreamt that it, you know, lived the life that it has lived, obviously. But we were super excited, as, you know, we. But you need a vision and a leader and different perspectives to come in to bring life to it.

[Kristin Davis]

That's right. That's right. And. And, yeah, that's right. And I think that. And, you know, I was. I have to say, those first few seasons were really fun because there was a spirit to the show. I mean, I. I just. I think at a certain point, as what with the Sopranos, I just ceased to be able to. I just didn't have the room on the schedule because then I started doing other things and. And, you know, after you've done, in my case, four seasons and a little bit of the fifth season on Sopranos, and I think I did. I think I shot something in season four. I'm fairly sure I did on Sex and the City. And then I didn't have the bandwidth, of course, started doing pilots and stuff.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right, but we want that. We want you guys to succeed and do bigger and better and get paid more and whatnot.

[Kristin Davis]

Unfortunately, that happened. So. Yeah, but. But yeah, it was. And I was just thinking about. I will tell you this, though, actually, this is perfect because you have a part in. You have a. A definite part in an allergy that I have. And it started on four Women in a funeral. And what it was was because I didn't have this before. And then if you remember the scene where you show up with the lilies, little lilies, and we did a bunch of takes of that. I do remember that instant I became wildly allergic to. To lilies. And I can't be.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, my God.

[Kristin Davis]

I never thought I'd have an opportunity.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

To say, hey, but I remember that day so well. Like, you know, obviously we spent many a day on the set, right? And sometimes I don't remember anything. Like, I'll be rewatching and I'll think, like, I have no idea what I'm about to do because I don't remember this. But then some days I remember everything, and I remember that really well because I think we Were in Harlem at a graveyard. And it was raining and raining and raining, and it was cold, and I was not supposed to wear a coat. And I was like, I'm a Southern girl, and I like the heat. And I was begging Pat for a coat. But Pat didn't want to put a coat on me because she liked the dress. And it was. You know, she has her vision. I get it. But I was just, like, shivering, you know, and my feet were soaked. I ruined my Manolos. And those were the first pair of high shoes that she had got me in. They had to go to the cobbler and get, like, totally redone because I had to climb up a hill, like, I think. Yeah. To hit him, maybe. Or after.

[Kristin Davis]

You had to kind of charge up this incline to.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah, it was muddy. It was ick. When you watch it, you can't really tell. I mean, you can tell that it had rained, you know, in the magic of cinema. Right. But you can't tell that it. Literally, we were sitting there waiting for it to stop raining. And I remember the girls came after that to do the actual funeral where the hat blows off, which is so fun. And I hadn't really remembered all that. And I remember I turned to Sarah Jessica and I was like, I'm freezing and I've ruined my shoes. And I just, blah, blah, blah, vented. But I just felt that was one of those times where I was like, man, it's a challenging job.

[Kristin Davis]

Well, it was that day, that's for sure.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

It was. It was. It really was. But, you know, I look at it and I love it. You know what I mean? Like, I think one of the things as an actor you feel when it is like a physical challenge in the environment is that you're somehow not gonna be good. You know, that it's taking attention away from the actual work or whatever. But it's fine. It's good. It's great.

[Kristin Davis]

No, it's great. Well, you know, watching Cockle Doodle Doo last night, and I was watching and I watched as you get to the end of that, and there's the. The roof party and. Which was, you know, really. It's very sweet scene. You know, it's kind of always forgiven by the. As they're referred to in the show, the trannies. And it may not be appropriate nowadays, but.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right. No, it's definitely not.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, that's what the character's name.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Exactly. Right.

[Kristin Davis]

That's like the group is referred that way.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

But what's nice is it is a Very. It's a very sweet scene, and everybody seems to be having fun. And, you know, Sarah Jessica gets up and does a little thing I remember requested, you know, and. And then the camera leaves them and goes back up to the Empire State Building. Hints.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kristin Davis]

The moment. But when I was watching it, I found myself a little bit touched. And the reason was I thought, well, the scene is sweet, for sure, but it's also just because I remember that day. And I thought, oh, that was, you know, 20 plus years ago.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah.

[Kristin Davis]

Life was different then. I.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

So different.

[Kristin Davis]

The world was different. And. Yeah, and so it was. There was something about that, just seeing that scene that entered into the personal, where I was like, oh, yeah, that was.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

You know, it's true.

[Kristin Davis]

But. And then you guys did. I don't know who did this. Somebody in the art department. But there's a scene where you guys go. You're down in soho and I. And you. You're. I think you can go to a party, a fraternity party. I think maybe it's just him. And that might have been just Sarah Jessica and Kim, because when Sarah. Jess, it was where Kim, his character, gets. Samantha gets involved with a young college kid in Texas, supposedly. And. But I noticed that the dormitory. I mean, I didn't notice this until we were really shooting. And then I look and see it's called Coulter Hall. Like, who did this?

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

You know, I love it. That's adorable. We had some fun little inside jokes, didn't we?

[Kristin Davis]

We did. It was. It was a very sweet deal. And being there at Silver cup, and I mean. Yeah, it was just. I mean, it was. It was a great deal. You know, I mean, it really was.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

It was. I'm so happy that you were there. I mean, it's. It's also. That's part of the reason I wanted the podcast. There's a couple reasons. One is it does hold up well, as you said at the beginning. And there's this whole new group of people who's watching it on Netflix, and it's so exciting. And obviously they think some things are crazy, right? Because it is a different time. And then some things are a complete, you know, current conversation being had, you know, on social media or whatever. And then also, I just love to get everyone together and hear everybody's memories, because for me, it's incredible. Our entire history, you know, it's been so amazing. And back in the beginning, you know, we didn't talk about things kind of, you know, like, I think we felt like when you would do press. It was more presentational. It wasn't necessarily. We wouldn't tell so many stories about behind the scenes. I don't think people knew so much about production really, in a way. And so it's a way to kind of get everybody's like personal memories and weave them together into a quilt of like, what was it like to actually create the show, you know, by all the different people? I mean, that's what I'd like to do. At least that's my goal.

[Kristin Davis]

It's a great goal. I really thank you.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

It's fun, isn't it?

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah, it is. It's fun. I did the. What is it called? The Sopranos podcast. Yeah. Talking Sopranos with Michael Imperioli.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah. Love it.

[Kristin Davis]

And. And it was just the same thing, you know, just a blast. The different kind of funny memories and, and stuff like that.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Think back to your last road trip trying to cram in the cooler. Someone's leg is asleep in the back and the dog's on your lap. Now imagine a third row in an EV where the dog could have their own seat. Meet the Hyundai Ioniq 9 Hyundai's first three row all electric SUV, the Ioniq 9 has impressive capacity and capability, giving you more room to explore. The Ioniq 9 is built for families, friends and adventures big or small, with class leading interior space and tech that keeps everyone connected and charged. We're talking seven USB C ports, six of them high output. That means that even your laptop gets the power it needs right from the car. The Ioniq 9 is tech infused with standard safety features including Highway Driving Assist 2 and Blind Spot Collision avoidance assist comes standard because everyone deserves to feel secure front seat or back. And when it comes to range, the Ioniq 9 Rear Wheel Drive S trim delivers an EPA estimated 335 miles on a full charge. Need a quick boost? Go further with up to an estimated 150 miles of charge in just 15 minutes on the Ioniq Ioniq 9 rear wheel drive S when using a 350 kilowatt DC ultra fast charger and CCS adapter, that's as fast as grabbing a coffee, walking the dog or stretching your legs. Plug in, recharge, roll out. Plus, every Ioniq 9 comes with Hyundai's 10 year 100,000 mile hybrid electric Limited battery warranty. This is the SUV for people who've been waiting to go electric but didn't want to give up space, range or power. Learn more about the Ionic 9@Hyundai USA.com call 562-314-4603 for complete details. Okay, so as I said, this is what you. You brought up also. It's so beautiful. Sarah in the window. And I think. Cause we've had the voiceover, and then we used to have the talking to the camera, right. Which was, like, so awkward. And at this point, it's going. I don't know if it's totally gone. It shows up in weird moments. But it didn't show up in this one, thank God. Because as we know, Sarah Jessica did not really enjoy it. She wants to stay in the scene, which totally makes sense. But when we began this show, and the curtains are blowing and she's smoking, and you're hearing her interior thoughts about the funeral, like, it has such a depth. Depth, you know, to it. Because I had not remembered this at all. I had not remembered that the funeral. I hadn't remembered the way that the funeral tied into her relationship with Big that she literally thinks, am I really living life? What am I doing? And that's why she calls him back, which is, I think, so relatable in so many ways. You know, life is passing. People pass away. And you do think, like, oh, my God, am I actually living life? Like, it's a real valid question. And I had forgotten that I fall in love or whatever, lust. Whatever, like, with the widower, that all those things are tied together. Which I think is also kind of one of the things that the show's starting to do successfully, that it didn't really do first season.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah, I think that's. I mean, I watched very little of the first season because, honestly, it was like, well, this is not that interesting to me, because it had really didn't have a look to it. And it wasn't. Wasn't really as focused. I mean, it was finding itself. In fairness, definitely, if you see the early Simpsons, you go, it looks nothing like the show now.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

So, in fairness, it takes a while to find a show and find it.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

And I would say that the main thing of how the first season looks is dark. You can't even see us. You're like, where are they? In the nighttime. It's so interesting, you know, you're just like, well, are they there on the street? I'm not sure. I mean, there's a quaint, like a kind of nostalgic, you know, quality to it, because it's sometimes also, we're in the village, and it looks just nothing like the village looks now. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's empty. Yeah, it's fascinating. Yeah. But that's One of the things that I noticed in your episode, in this particular episode and also Freak Show, Freak Show Cynthia is lit so beautifully and you're so close on her face and all those scenes that she's doing about talking dirty and it's just so, there's something so vulnerable and young about it, you know, I don't know how to put it, but it's, it has a sweetness at the same time that we're talking about these kind of risque sexual things and whatever. There's just like a, a vulnerability of being like inside these women's lives.

[Kristin Davis]

I, I agree with you. In fact, Kristen, I was thinking that I had this thought last night. I thought, you know what, what's interesting about the show is it's extremely innocent with all of this sexual, you know, focus and some of it, none of it's graphic, but it's all pretty. You can't miss what's going on. Yeah, it's oddly innocent, I think.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

I think you're right.

[Kristin Davis]

There's something sort of sweet about it. It's, there's no, it's not really mean spirited at all.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

No.

[Kristin Davis]

And, and even when somebody is kind of a dupe, like Freak show, those guys. Yeah, yeah, they're funny. I mean, and we, you may remember that we, we lit them like, I mean, they and Michael Patrick, I'm sure must have done it. They bring in this kind of freak in this music that sounds like a carnival.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah.

[Kristin Davis]

You know, so that each one of those is lit to look like something in a carnival.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

And it's scary. Yeah. But sweet scary. I think some of that. And this is what I love. And it's a little bit sometimes hard to talk about it, but I do remember in the first season as actors, as actresses, we were unsure of the point of view of the show. Right. So, like we knew that we were these women and that we were going to talk about sexuality. But when it came to time to do a sex scene, you know, was it like from the male perspective, was it supposed to be titillating or was it supposed to be realistic? Or like, were we going to make our female viewers uncomfortable? There were questions that we had as actors because it was so different. You know, it wasn't like in film. There was a lot of sexuality, but it was very much from the male gaze in terms of like titillation and not necessarily realistic and all those things. And we were definitely changing that. But we didn't really know what we were doing in the beginning and what I see now by the time that you're really establishing your look is that. And I think this is a powerful thing, and it's kind of intangible. But the way that you film someone can be from a perspective of love, you know, of, like, interest, like curiosity, which is how. Like, especially the Cynthia in the Freak Show. You're so close to her, but she's so. She has no guard, you know, she's so brilliant, obviously, but she has no guard up. Like, her face is so open. But that's something that you can only create on a set with, like, a love and a trust that the actor can feel that way and that we trust the camera crew and that the director. You, in this case, is someone where we know that we're taken care of.

[Kristin Davis]

Well, that's. Yeah, that's good. It's interesting because I. I do try to. I mean, I've never worked with a. What do they call it? A. With a sex. The person.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

They now have intimacy coordinator.

[Kristin Davis]

I never worked with one, and I hope I never have to, frankly.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

You don't need to, Ellen. It's other people who need that. Okay.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah. Because, I mean, I've shot more sex scenes than probably any of those people will in their lifetime.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yes.

[Kristin Davis]

And. And, you know, it was always about finding exact. You know, just making sure that the actors are, you know, having. I would always talk to actors before that. I don't remember sex to say, but I'm sure it was no different. And, you know, just to say, look, this is what we're going to do. I wouldn't chase them away and just have a quiet conversation.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

Make sure there's no awkwardness or anybody was uncomfortable. And. But I. I will tell you what. It's a line that I've said many a time because I think it's really right. The. The. There's someone once said, and I don't know who said it, everything is about sex but sex. And so I kind of follow that guideline. In other words, when I shoot a sex scene, I'm always. And that was true for. For Sex and City, for sure. Which is, what is this scene really about? And how can I show that? So in that case, it was about Cynthia's innocence and her delight. Almost like a child discovering something that she could do that she didn't. Never occurred to her that she could do that and actually embrace it, so to speak. But it was about that. Not about the dirtiness of what she's saying or whatever, however one perceives that.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

And I. You made me think about, you know, and there's comical sex scenes. I mean, the one with. When Samantha has sex with this college kid and, you know, I sort of treated like a rodeo, you know, like he. You know, he kind of does some of these things that the guy would write up riding a buck and bronco. You know, what they would do. And so, you know, that was meant to be comical. A lot of them are comical.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

But one of the ones that I'm thinking of. The point I want to make is that when there's not a lot of serious sex scenes in that show, generally.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah.

[Kristin Davis]

But one of them. And when they are. I'm not interested in the sex. I'm interested in suggesting what the feeling is of that moment and what is it. And at the end of the. I guess I'm trying to remember if it's. It's one. Oh, yeah. Four. Four women at a funeral. It ends with Carrie in bed with big camera. Really just brushes across them. It doesn't really linger on. That all just. It has a very sensual look.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Oh, it's beautiful.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah. But there's nothing. It's just, you know, what's happening. But what the scene is about is this is a. A quiet, intimate moment, really intimate between the two of them in which the camera is just simply going on in its sort of sensual path past them to kind of. And the movement of the camera is meant to kind of emphasize or underscore maybe the sensuality of the moment as opposed to the sexuality that there is. That there. It's skin on skin in a very intimate and meaningful way. But it glides past them and toward the window where, once again, you see the curtain. Curtains blowing.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Right.

[Kristin Davis]

And it's also kind of going out and it's heading toward the New York night where others are making love at that same. You know.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yes. Beautiful. And it's so. You know, Sarah Jessica is obviously, rightly, so very always concerned with any kind of sexual scene or nudity question or anything. And she's not easy to trust. And I think that's wonderful. Especially because she's playing Carrie. And that is one of the few scenes where you really. She's very at ease and you get to see skin. It's not salacious in any way. It's sensual, as you say. And that's because she trusted you. Which is, you know, incredible because it adds so much when she does choose to show something. You know what I'm saying? It has more impact.

[Kristin Davis]

That's great. That's great. I loved her. I just was thinking one of the Things that I really enjoyed on Freak show was the thing when she becomes the freak drink.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yeah.

[Kristin Davis]

And I intentionally had her have the cigarette in her mouth the whole time.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yes. It's so good. It's so funny. It's so funny because now no one smokes. Right. Like, you're literally like a serial killer if you smoke. Now.

[Kristin Davis]

Takes it out of her mouth and she ends up. And I had her, I said, get up on the bed, you know, standing on the bed. So she's really not doing anything. Right at that moment, she's standing on this guy's bed. Break into his private collection of boy scout badges. Right, right. And. And with this cigarette. So she looks kind of like a. I don't know, like a. I don't. I don't even know how to say it. Like she's just some tough broad.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

Yes, she does. She doesn't look like herself at all. It's true. And that makes it all the better when he comes back in.

[Kristin Davis]

Yeah, exactly.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

So, Alan, obviously we have so much to talk about. We are going to come back. You guys hang in there with us. We're going to talk about four women and a funeral.

[Will Friedle]

Every business has an ambition. PayPal Open is the platform designed to help you grow into yours with business loans so you can expand and access to hundreds of millions of people customers worldwide. And your customers can pay all the ways they want with PayPal, Venmo pay later and all major cards so you can focus on scaling up when it's time to get growing. There's one platform for all business PayPal open grow today at paypalopen.com loans subject to approval in available locations.

[Danielle Fishel]

Find home wherever you roam at Sinesta Es and Simply Suites. Stretch out and enjoy homelike amenities for however long you need. And when you're a Sonesta Travel Pass member, staying at Sonesta Es and Simply Suites means earning points toward free nights, upgrades and more. Go to sonesta.com and book your stay and unlock their best rates with Sonesta Travel Pass. Here today, Rome tomorrow. Join [e-mail] Terms and conditions apply.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

This is Danielle Fishel, Will Friedle and.

[Ryder Strong]

Ryder Strong from Pod Meats World. Listen, I've eaten a lot of questionable meats in my day, but then I found Dietz and Watson.

[Kevin McHale]

With summer around the corner, it's time.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

To level up your grill game.

[Kevin McHale]

And I suggest you start with their signature Dietz dogs.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

All premium uncured beef with other delicious.

[Ryder Strong]

Options like jalapeno, cheddarwurst or smoked beef hot sausage. You can depend on Dietz and Watson and their 85 year history of making meats. They don't cut corners and they do things the right way, even if it's the hard way. Make your cookout legendary. Visit dietzandwatson.com the right way to learn more about the Dietz difference.

[Jenna Ushkowitz]

That's D I E T Z and Watson slash the right way.

[Ryder Strong]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and safeway now through July 15th. Stock up on all your favorite personal care brands and earn four times points to use on later purchases. For discounts on groceries or gas, shop in store or online for items like Pantene Shampoo, Old Spice, Total Body Deodorant, Tampax Pearl Venus Razors, Head and Shoulders Shampoo, Olay Body Wash and Pantene conditioner and earn 4 times points. Hurry before these deals are gone. Offer ends July 15th. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Ryan Seacrest]

With a detailed agent directory you won't find anywhere else. Homes.com is the only place to find the in depth info home shoppers want very in depth info. Looking for a listing agent's contact info? We've got it. The agent with the most sales in your price range. Easy specialized agents with all the up to date info on your dream neighborhood. We'll know them. A Pisces who enjoys long walks on the beach. You've got other sites for that. Homes.com We've done your homework.

[Kristin Davis]

This is an iHeart podcast.