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- [00:00]
Kristin Davis
This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Before all the algorithm fed blah and the endless sea of dupes, shopping used to feel more fun. But here's a confession. Are you a Charlotte listeners? You can find that fun feeling again on ebay. It's not mindless scrolling, it's a fashion pursuit. I went on ebay to find a vintage Mugler jacket for the end of one of the seasons of and just like that where Charlotte had to look fantastic at the gallery and I found the most fantastic jacket there. So there's always more to discover. Ebay has millions of pre loved finds from hundreds of brands backed by ebay. Authenticity guarantee. Ebay Things people love. Ever feel like SUVs are starting to all feel the same? Yeah, this one doesn't. The all new Hyundai Palisade hybrid is turning heads with class leading interior space. An available Bose 14 speaker audio system and available front and second row relaxation seats that make long drives feel like first class. It's got an impressive 2.5T hybrid engine with up to 600 plus miles of range. Available H track, all wheel drive and tech like a classic. Exclusive blind spot view monitor and dash cam. This isn't just another SUV. Learn more at Hyundai USA.com call 562-314-4603 for complete details.
- [01:43]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
In the middle of the night, Saskia awoke in a haze. Her husband Mike was on his laptop. What was on his screen would change Saskia's life forever.
- [01:54]
Character Confronting Michael Levengood
I said, I need you to tell me exactly what you're doing. And immediately the mask came off.
- [02:02]
Character Warning About Safety
You're supposed to be safe. That's your home. That's your husband.
- [02:07]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
Listen to Betrayal Season 5 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [02:13]
Ryder Strong
This is Ryder Strong and I have a new podcast called the red weather. In 1995, my neighbor Anna Trainor disappeared from a commune. It was nature, trees and praying and drugs.
- [02:24]
Kristin Davis
So no, I am not your guru.
- [02:28]
Ryder Strong
Back then I lied to everybody.
- [02:30]
Kristin Davis
They have had this case for 30 years.
- [02:33]
Ryder Strong
I'm going back to my hometown to uncover the truth. Listen to the Red weather on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [02:45]
Kristin Davis
Hi, I'm Kristen Davis and I want to know, are you a Charlotte? All right, everybody. Hello. Hel. Hello. Hi. Hi. We are here. We are gonna just do a little bit more recapping. We just talked to the lovely and intelligent Clark Gregg who is really, really fun. He's in this episode. This episode is called Don't Ask, Don't Tell it aired in 2000, the year 2000. And it is such a massive, massive episode. Written by Cindy Shupak, Directed by Dan Algrant. So we're just gonna recap a little bit more because so many things happen and I just didn't want to skip over any of them. So first of all, let's talk Charlotte and Trey. So as I'm rewatching this episode, I did not remember it in the. So many things that I did not remember. Like, what I remember most is the wedding itself. You know, it was such a long, long day and everyone fell asleep but me. And I was so happy and running around, and Kyle was so adorable. And I remember being so incredibly stre about how I had to tell Carrie that he couldn't get it up, that Trey couldn't get it up. Because that was kind of like this big, you know, moment where we had been, you know, wondering and waiting. I also completely forgot that I get drunk in. In like, the night before. It's also weird because I thought we went out and I wore like a. Like a tiara, like, bridesmaid thing or whatever. Like a. What do you call it? Like a veil. Like how women do when they're going to get married. I thought that we had, like. I have so many different ideas in my head than what we actually did. I thought that we all go out for, like, the night before, like a bachelorette party or whatever, but we don't. It's interesting. I do. Charlotte does manage somehow to get drunk, which is interesting also, but no one else really seems drunk. And it looks like we're just at, like, a restaurant or a coffee shop. I don't understand what happened in this plot. Meaning why doesn't Charlotte have a bachelorette party? And in my mind, I did, but clearly it was only in my mind because it's not in the episode. And I'm wearing this really adorable sparkly sweater, which I. I think I still own, which is also weird. I don't know why I'm wearing that. I mean, I love it, but it's just funny that I'm wearing my own sweater and I'm drinking and no one else is, and then. And then. And I'm, you know, kind of obviously tipsy and talking about how I'm going to finally get to have sex with my, you know, hot fiance slash, you know, soon to be husband, and they're all just kind of, you know, giggling at me or whatever. And in that scene, I don't remember any of it, right? Not one little bit. Oh, and I didn't also remember the rehearsal dinner. And it's cute because they're all over there at that other table. Like, why did I seat them so far away from me? It's so interesting. There's so many interesting things going on. And they talk about how happy I am. And I think, yes, Charlotte is very, very happy. But then we go to the. To the Vera Wang where we're trying on the bridesmaids dresses. And I really felt the tension. I did not remember that I'm gonna end up fighting with Samantha. But I felt the tension. And I was like, wow, it's so tense. And then we get into this little argument and it's kind of scary. I felt worried watching it because she wants to make her dress shorter. Which I also think is relating to this whole thing about this whole debate we'd had about whether Charlotte's bridesmaids should actually be wearing bridesmaids type dresses or more Sex and the City type dresses and be kind of individually expressing themselves. So that was actually going on behind the scenes. So it's kind of funny that Samantha says that she wants to make her dress shorter. And then Charlotte says, well, this whole week is supposed to be about me. And Miranda really kind of cuttingly says, it's a day. You get a day. I mean, all of it is so interesting to me. And I think really rings true. Because I think when people get married, everyone does kind of lose their mind a little bit. And people can get really focused on kind of small details and feel very, very stressed about it. So that kind of reminded me of just like, the reality of weddings or whatever. But I also felt really nervous because I didn't remember any of these scenes. So I thought, what's gonna happen? What's gonna happen then? So we're out at this bazaar last night, out as single ladies. And I'm drinking apparent, you know, by myself. I tell everybody that I haven't had sex with Trey yet. Which is also funny that they somehow didn't know. I thought that I was more open about this wacky plan that Charlotte had had. But I guess I wasn't. And they're really shocked. And Samantha very smartly says, honey, before you drive the car, you take it for a test drive. I mean, yeah, like, it's a bit. It's a bit kind of, I guess, like, naive and just hoping for the best. But also I kind of understand because obviously they've been making out and doing other things. Because I think we see a previous episode where he tells me that he loves me, and I believe. I pull him into my apartment and something happens in the sexual universe. So it's not like. It's not like she hasn't, you know, done anything with him. But yes, it is a little bit. It's kind of a perfect Charlotte thing where she just has this ideal. And she's gonna try to live up to the ideal, even though it's not very practical. Right? So they're all shocked, of course. And then I get drunk and I'm all excited that I get to finally sleep with, you know, Trey. Cause he's obviously incredibly sexy and, you know, handsome and charming and all the things that Kyle is. So, you know, I get it. I get it. So then we cut to. In the Charlotte universe. We cut to. I'm at the church. I'm waiting, Carrie's late. Which, of course, is really stressing Charlotte. Charlotte looks really stressed. This is what I think of myself when I'm watching. I'm wondering. I think it's a. It's a kind of a tight wire act that Charlotte's doing. Between the focus on the wedding, the, you know, the ceremony, the dress, everything being beautiful and perfect. And then, like, what she knows underneath. And there's times where I see it, and I. And I was pleased with that. Like when I'm waiting for Carrie and I'm really nervous and I look like I might cry, which I think makes perfect sense. And then I look like I want to talk to her. But then it kind of cuts away for a second, and I look kind of okay. And I'm wondering if maybe I didn't remember in that moment or if it's just Charlotte's like. Like, doesn't know. Like, am I just fine? Am I gonna be fine? Because I think that's what Charlotte would like to do, is just be like, I'm fine. I'm. I'm fine. Nothing's bothering me. And then, like, as an actor, like, am I holding all the things at every moment that I should be holding as an actor? Right? So that's what I think of when I watch myself. I don't know if that's interesting or not, but that's what I think. But then the other thing that really cracked me up is that apparently that's my dad walking me down, down the aisle. Apparently, Charlotte has. But we don't ever get to meet him. And I do not remember him one little bit. You guys. I feel really bad. The actor looks just lovely and, like, just exactly how I think Charlotte's dad should look. But what I remember was the incredible stress I had about this moment where I tell Carrie where I had to. I had to, like, pull my veil off my face, which seemed really hard to do because it was very long. And I had to do it kind of in a hurry because she's already trying to walk down the aisle at this incredibly beautiful church we were at that was up, up, up north, like, right on the edge of Harlem. So gorgeous. So gorgeously designed. Our set deck. People just. I mean, it's so perfect and beautiful and exactly, you know, what Charlotte would want. And I think what. What Trey would want. Slash, you know, Scottish vibe. And I remember the stress. I was super stressed about how to pull that moment off of, you know, basically pulling her off. You know, she's walking down the aisle and pulling her back and telling her, like, he can't get it up. Trey can't get it up. I was very, very worried about that. And at the time that it happened, we had an ad. I'm not gonna say her name. She was a woman first ad. And she was sitting on a ladder right behind us. And she laughed out loud on my closeup the first time I did it. And we had to cut. It wasn't usable. And I was so mad because I had been so stressed about it. And her laugh had ruined that take. And it had been a really good take. So then I had to do it again. And I guess it's fine. I guess it's fine. I don't know. I think in my head, I didn't know if it was supposed to be funny or if it was supposed to be really upsetting. Obviously, Charlotte's upset, but I couldn't tell if that was, like, a laugh line or if it wanted to be a laugh line or if the writers thought it was gonna be a laugh line. I remember that was what I was mostly worried about, was really delivering it the way that it should be delivered and trying to fulfill all the boxes, you know, of what everybody else wanted me to do. And I remember Sarah Jessica has this really funny thing that she has to do where she's trying to figure out what to say to me. And I think she does a great job. You know, Carrie Carri. And Sarah plays it so beautifully. Cause she knows she's supposed to be walking down the aisle and that everybody's still looking, right? Like, where did she go? Where's Carrie? And she's trying to tell me, like, hey, you know what? Maybe he jerked off before you came. I had totally forgotten all this, right? It was pretty funny. It was pretty funny, but also like sad funny, like not laugh out loud funny. And that's one of those things where I think our show did that really well. And it's hard as an actor to do that because you don't know exactly what if you should be going with your kind of more comedic impulses or going into the emotion of it. And really what you have to do is do both. And I think Sarah does it beautifully. I'm not really sure if I did it perfectly or not still to this day. When I watched it, I wasn't sure. But I think she does it incredibly well because she's in this, you know, this stressful moment of needing. She knows that we need to go ahead. Charlotte is just kind of stuck in this panic moment, which I also think is very, very Charlotte. And Carrie's trying to move it along and make Charlotte okay because as she says in the voiceover, she's in a $14,000 Vera Wang, which is completely true. That's how much that dress cost. And I just think the scene is really good in a way that I hadn't remembered because I hadn't remembered what she did. Before all the algorithm fed blah and the endless sea of dupes. Shopping used to feel more fun. But here's a confession. Are you a Charlotte listeners? You can find that fun feeling again on ebay. Because on ebay it's not just shopping. It's a full on fashion pursuit. And when you find the thing that adrenaline hit is real. I went on to ebay to look for a super special vintage jacket for Charlotte to wear to the gallery. And I found the most amazing Mugler jacket. And the costume department loved it and it felt so good. And I still have it at home. Like when you score that rare Adidas collab that's lived on your mood board or the Dior saddle bag that you ripped right out of a magazine in 2007 and never got over. Yeah, those. It's about the thrill and the pursuit of finding those pieces that feel like you, you. There's always more to discover. Ebay has millions of pre loved finds from hundreds of brands backed by ebay. Authenticity guarantee. Ebay, things people love make every day feel epic in the all new Hyundai Palisade Hybrid. The Palisade Hybrid is packed full of features, cutting edge tech up to an EPA estimated 619 miles of range on select trims and class leading interior space. The new Palisade Hybrid is redefining what it means to drive an suv. For starters, let's Talk about interior space. It's class leading, which is just a fancy way of saying that the whole crew and everyone's going to be comfy. You've got seating for seven or eight passengers and yes, that available third row power seating that reclines. Game changer. There are available front and second row relaxation seats, basically a spa day on wheels. And an available class exclusive blind spot view monitor that shows you a video feed of your blind spot right in the dash. How smart is that? There's even an available class exclusive built in dash cam. So whether it's a scenic drive or someone cuts you off and pretends like it didn't happen, you've got the receipts. And if you're all about the sound experience like me, the available Bose 14 speaker audio system is going to blow you away. I also love the tech forward touches like standard 100 watt USB C ports because fast charging is non negotiable these days and the standard passenger talk intercom that lets you chat with people in the back without yelling. Ah moms, you know what I'm talking about. Ready to upgrade your ride? Learn more about the Hyundai Palisade@HyundaiUSA.com Call 562-314-4603 for complete details.
- [17:08]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
In the middle of the night, Saskia awoke in a haze. Her husband Mike was on his laptop. What was on his screen would change Saskia's life forever.
- [17:21]
Character Confronting Michael Levengood
I said, I need you to tell me exactly what you're doing. And immediately the mask came off.
- [17:31]
Character Warning About Safety
You're supposed to be safe. That's your home. That's your husband.
- [17:36]
Kristin Davis
To keep this secret for so many years. He's like a seasoned pro.
- [17:44]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
This is a story about the end of a marriage. But it's also the story of one woman who was done living in the dark.
- [17:52]
Character Confronting Michael Levengood
You're a dangerous person who preys on vulnerable and trusting people. You're a predator. Michael Levengood.
- [17:59]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
Listen to Betrayal Season 5 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [18:06]
Ryder Strong
This is Ryder Strong and I have a new podcast called the Red Weather.
- [18:10]
Kristin Davis
It was many and many a year ago in a kingdom by the sea.
- [18:15]
Ryder Strong
In 1995, my neighbor Anna Traynor disappeared from a commune. It was hard to wrap your head around. It was nature and trees and praying and drugs.
- [18:24]
Kristin Davis
So no, I am not your guru.
- [18:28]
Ryder Strong
And back then I lied to my parents, I lied to police, I lied to everybody.
- [18:33]
Kristin Davis
There were years, Ryder, where I could not say your name.
- [18:36]
Ryder Strong
I've decided to go back to my hometown in Northern California Interview my friends, family, talk to police, journalists, whomever I can to try to find out what actually happened.
- [18:45]
Kristin Davis
Isn't it a little bit weird that they obsess over hippies in the woods and not the obvious boyfriend? They have had this case for 30 years. I'll teach you sons of come around here.
- [18:54]
Ryder Strong
And my wife.
- [18:55]
Kristin Davis
Boom, boom.
- [18:57]
Ryder Strong
This is the red weather. Listen to the red Weather on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [19:12]
Kristin Davis
I was also very surprised and did not remember the scene where Charlotte goes off to have sex with. With Trey. And, you know, she's all drunk and, you know, very, like, about as openly sexy as you will see Charlotte being at this point in time in the show. And then they just cut. They cut away, and then they cut back. And they have that really interesting over the bed shot. And we're laying there with the sheet over us, and Trey says, well, that was unfortunate. And Charlotte looks kind of, you know, surprised and obviously not thrilled. And then we learn, you know, he says many, many interesting things there. He says things. Charlotte says, you know, has this happened to you before? And Trey says, on occasion. And then he says something about, I can lift the sails, but I can't take it into the harbor. Something like this, which is just also very interesting. And I was just curious. I mean, I know that Charlotte's all shocked and everything, but, like, I wonder. Like, I'm gonna find out, I guess. But, like, do we try Viagra? Like, are there other things? You know, what do we do? Like, there's things you can do, right? But then it does kind of become clear that this has something to do with his relationship with his mom, it seems to be. And then later on, we know that he tells her, like, once we started talking about getting married, that's when I lost my, you know, whatever. Freedom, I guess. His freedom to be freely sexual, I suppose. And I don't think that's so shocking. I do think that, you know, people getting married is a big, big amount of pressure. But it's all very interesting. And I feel. I feel. I hope that we do it justice. You know what I'm saying? In terms of. I can't really remember everything that's gonna happen. I guess we're gonna find out together. And I'm sure all of you guys listening know more than I know. Cause I don't remember all of it. And my other issue is that, like, for me, it's Kyle there, right, who's playing Trey. And also, we have the chemistry that we have So I think it's hard for me to. I think in the same way that it's hard for Charlotte, right, to really believe that this is a problem. Like, it's kind of a shock, right? And I think that's the whole thing with Charlotte is like, everything's so great and there's so many great things about him. And then there's this one, you know, thorn in the side, right? And that's why she goes ahead with it. Which I think is great that she goes ahead with it. But, like, do we go to therapy, you guys? I don't know. I hope we do, but I kind of don't think we do. But we should. We should do things. We should try everything. I don't know if we do. I'm worried now. I'm really worried. So that's what I was thinking when I was watching us. But it's also really enjoyable to watch. And then we look so happy when we leave. And then also. So it's so sad that this whole Aiden storyline is happening. And Charlotte's just kind of oblivious and so sweet that Carrie, very much unlike a narcissist, does not tell Charlotte that she confessed her cheating to Aiden and that Aiden has left. And somehow Charlotte doesn't notice that Aiden's not there, I think. Cause I'm in my own little world. But it's so sweet of her as a friend not to tell. Tell me. Because in the Vera Wang thing, I say something like, don't tell him because I don't want you guys fighting at my wedding. Which I of course understand. But there's just a lot going on in this episode. A lot, a lot, a lot. Now, let's talk about Samantha for a second before I get to Carrie. Samantha and I have this fight in the Vera Wang, which I don't remember at all. And somehow, thank goodness, we make up and she comes. Because, you know, when you leave us in the verung and she goes in the. In the dressing room to take her dress off, you kind of get the feeling that she's not gonna be a bridesmaid. So I wonder if a scene got cut. I feel like a scene, at least one scene, if not two scenes got cut from this episode. Because I do think that there was some kind of a scene where I'm wearing like a veil on my head. And we go to some kind of a bar where I drink Charlotte, I mean, and I have some kind of a conversation or Samantha says she's still going to be a bridesmaid. So I feel like, something's cut. Anyway, that's. That's just me. Maybe I'm wrong, but I do love this. This. This guy who plays the Scottish. Is it a cousin? Excuse me? Is it a cousin of Trey's? I think he's a cousin. He's a McDougal. I love him so much. And I thought that there had been more with him and Samantha, and I also feel like maybe there was. And it got cut. I think that we had such a stacked. Oh, my God.
- [23:55]
Katie Couric
Yes.
- [23:56]
Kristin Davis
I'm wearing that sweater. And I. So, you guys, there is a photographic proof that I am correct. And there is a scene cut from this episode, at least one where I go. The girls take me out to some kind of bar. It was like some kind of a. Like, maybe almost coyote ugly bar that has, like, sawdust on the floor. You know, I. It was probably coyote ugly because what other bar in Manhattan would have sawdust on the floor? This is what I remember. And I'm wearing the veil on my head like you're supposed to do for your, you know, bachelorette type whatever party. But I guess it didn't make it into the final edit. Oh, my goodness. And I think sometime there, I talked to Samantha, and she says she still wants to be a bridesmaid, which is, of course, wonderful. Cause it would have been really, really sad if we hadn't all been together in that. And we wouldn't have had the incredible ending moment where the voiceover says, you know, it's basically. Carrie says, it's wonderful to have people who love you for who you really are. And I was lucky to have found three of them. And we're all there together. It's a really great moment. It's a really great ending to a really great episode. I have to say, this episode is like a film. It's like a mini film in and of itself, mostly because, I mean, we've got a really good, you know, Trey storyline, obviously, but the Carrie storyline. Oh, my goodness me. So basically the gist of this. First of all, both Sarah Jessica and Corbett are incredible in this episode. And I remember the scene that they have outside the church at the wedding. And I remember being just worried about that for her because the wedding took so long. And we were like, they all fell asleep on the pews of the church. I have pictures somewhere. I'll try to find it. Put it on the Instagram for you guys. But people fell asleep. It was probably 18, 20 hour day. But in the middle of all that, she had to do the break with Aiden. But Also, we needed daylight. Cause it was an exterior. So I think we got that done. I feel like it. Also, the wedding might've been more than one day because so much happens, but they had to do that to have the daylight. Because he says, I've been walking around for an hour. And then he comes and, you know, he's so sad. Corbett is just so good, so incredibly good. And so much doesn't react from an ego place, which I do think is a really incredibly smart choice on his part. And also, the writers, you know, the way that they wrote it, I think it just brings home the sadness that you feel in a relationship where you've really messed up. You know, you really feel from Carrie how incredibly sorry she is and how stupid she feels that she did this thing to this incredibly great person. Because at this point in time, Aiden has just been nothing but great to her. Like, he is so sweet. And he's making this piece of furniture for Trey and Charlotte of two pieces of wood that come together. And it has a fault in it. And that's, you know, because no one's perfect. He says to her, the other thing that I really love about this episode and I hadn't remembered is when. So basically, after the night before the wedding, you know, girls night out, Carrie goes to Aiden's, and he says, you know, she says, oh, it's not easy to surprise you. And he says, well, it's pretty hard to surprise a guy with a dog, which was really funny. It made me laugh. And, you know, he's there working on the furniture. And they have this incredibly sexy scene about talking about the furniture, which is interesting. And I didn't remember it. And I don't know if that was what was on the page or if that's just what they decided to do in the moment. But they're so connected. And it's very sexy. Very, very sexy. And it's like all the wonderful things about Aiden are very much obvious and at play. And, oh, I forgot about when she's smoking, too. This was so good. So you remember when Aiden comes and he says straight out to her in the beginning, like, I cannot date a smoker. So she tries to pretend that she's not a smoker. She's like, oh, I'll just put it away. And then she tries not to smoke for their whole first dinner date. But she's got the jitters, and she's really stressing, and she's, you know, trying to be who he wants her to be, right? Which on the one hand, you feel like maybe that's not the healthiest, but then on the other hand, is smoking the healthiest? Not really. Right. Before all the algorithm fed blah and the endless sea of dupes, shopping used to feel more fun. But here's a confession. Are you a Charlotte listeners? You can find that fun feeling again on ebay. Because on ebay it's not just shopping, it's a full on fashion pursuit. And when you find the thing, that adrenaline hit is real. I went on to ebay to look for a super special vintage jacket for Charlotte to wear to the gallery and I found the most amazing Mugler jacket and the costume department loved it and it felt so good and I still have it at home. Like when you score that rare Adidas collab that's lived on your mood board or the Dior saddle bag that you ripped right out of a magazine in 2007 and never got over. Yeah, those. It's about the thrill and the pursuit of finding those pieces that feel like you. There's always more to discover. Ebay has millions of pre loved finds from hundreds of brands backed by ebay. Authenticity guarantee. Ebay. Things people love make every day feel epic in the all new Hyundai Palisade Hybrid. The Palisade Hybrid is packed with full of features, cutting edge tech, up to an EPA estimated 619 miles of range on select trims and class leading interior space. The new Palisade Hybrid is redefining what it means to drive an suv. For starters, let's talk about interior space. It's class leading, which is just a fancy way of saying that the whole crew and everyone's going to be comfy. You've got seating for seven or eight passengers and yes, that available third row power seating that reclines. Game changer. There are available front and second row relaxation seats, basically a spa day on wheels. And an available class exclusive blind spot view monitor that shows you a video feed of your blind spot right in the dash. How smart is that? There's even an available class exclusive built in dash cam. So whether it's a scenic drive or someone cuts you off and pretends like it didn't happen, you've got the receipts. And if you're all about the sound experience like me, the available Bose 14 speaker audio system is going to blow you away. I also love the tech forward touches like standard 100 watt USB C ports because fast charging is non negotiable. These and the standard passenger talk intercom that lets you chat with people in the back without yelling. Ah moms. You know what I'm talking about ready to upgrade your ride. Learn more about the Hyundai palisade@hyundai USA.com Call 562-314-4603 for complete detail.
- [31:35]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
In the middle of the night, Saskia awoke in a haze. Her husband Mike was on his laptop. What was on his screen would change Saskia's life forever.
- [31:48]
Character Confronting Michael Levengood
I said, I need you to tell me exactly what you're doing. And immediately the mask came off.
- [31:58]
Character Warning About Safety
You're supposed to be safe. That's your home. That's your husband.
- [32:03]
Kristin Davis
To keep this secret for so many years, he's like a seasoned pro.
- [32:11]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
This is a story about the end of a marriage, but it's also the story of one woman who was done living in the dark.
- [32:19]
Character Confronting Michael Levengood
You're a dangerous person who preys on vulnerable and trusting people. You're a creditor. Michael Levengood.
- [32:26]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
Listen to Betrayal Season 5 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [32:33]
Ryder Strong
This is Ryder Strong, and I have a new podcast called the Red Weather.
- [32:37]
Kristin Davis
It was many and many a year ago in a kingdom by the sea.
- [32:42]
Ryder Strong
In 1995, my neighbor Anna Trainor disappeared from a commune. It was hard to wrap your head around. It was nature and trees and praying and drugs.
- [32:51]
Kristin Davis
So, no, I am not your guru.
- [32:55]
Ryder Strong
And back then, I lied to my parents, I lied to police, I lied to everybody.
- [33:00]
Kristin Davis
There were years, Ryder, where I could not say your name.
- [33:03]
Ryder Strong
I've decided to go back to my hometown in Northern California, interview my friends, family, talk to police, journalists, whomever I can to try to find out what actually happened.
- [33:12]
Kristin Davis
Isn't it a little bit weird that they obsess over hippies in the woods and not the obvious boyfriend? They have had this case for 30 years. I'll teach you. Sons of come around here.
- [33:21]
Ryder Strong
And my wife, boom, boom. This is the red weather. Listen to the red Weather on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [33:39]
Kristin Davis
So they have this sexy scene, and then she gets up in the middle of the night, and she goes onto his stoop to smoke, and he comes out and finds her, and she goes, oh, you said you couldn't date a smoker. And he says something like, well, that's not all of who you are. And then he says, I'm not perfect. And of course, this whole time, all she can think about is, should I tell him? Should I not tell him? Should I tell him, Should I not tell him? Which, you know, we've all been there in some form or another, and so she almost tells him. And then she says something so sweet. She says, I was just afraid that he would never look at me. Like the way that he's looking at me now. And he is really just gazing at her in the most adorable way. So I totally understand that she doesn't tell him. So she leaves. She says, oh, I've gotta. I've gotta, you know, get ready for the wedding. But really what it is is she's. She's running away from their closeness because she feels like she needs to confess. And then she's not sure that she should confess. But this is why I think she does have to confess. Because she can't even really be with him because all she can think about is that she did this bad thing. And she. So when it takes you over in that way, I don't think you really have a choice. It might not be a smart thing to do. But on the other hand, if you can't even, like, function with the person that you're with because you have the secret, then I feel like you have to tell him. So I kind of get why she tells him. But I do think, as Clark, Greg and I discussed, that maybe she doesn't express it very well when she tells him. She kind of. She can't really look at him when she tells him, which I think is also very, very real, because I think she can't. It's hard for her to be with this side of herself that did this cheating, you know? And so she can't really look at him, which is kind of sad. But she also just says, like, I did this thing, you know, which is not a great way to phrase it when you're gonna tell somebody that you cheated on them. And then he also really smartly says, are you saying that it happened once? And then she says, no, like, three weeks or whatever she says. Which is also just horrible. Horrible. I don't know how she expects him to just be like, oh, okay, I can live with. I don't know how anybody could. I would not be. I would not be. I would not be thinking that that was fine. And I don't think she thinks that he's gonna think it's fine. But I also don't think that she expects him to literally look like if you just ran over his dog, which I think is what he looks like. Like, he just looks so sad, and it's crushing. It's just so crushing. And he's so good. I mean, my goodness. And she's so good. So then, of course, she tells him Right before the wedding, which, you know, maybe not the best timing, but whatever. He comes to pick her up for the wedding wearing a kind of a really large suit that I do want to talk to Molly Rogers about. Like, why is he wearing this really large untailored suit? It's interesting. But henna's brown. You know, it's a big brown floppy suit. It's interesting. I do guess it was kind of the times. It's kind of 90sish. Right? Anyway, we're going to talk to Molly about that, but. But he comes to pick her up in the big brown suit and she confesses. And then he says that he's gotta go and that she should give us the gift, which is kind of sad. And then she has to go, you know, she's late, obviously, to the wedding. Because we're all standing there ready to walk down the aisle. So she doesn't even have time to tell anybody. But. Oh, wait, no, she doesn't tell. She doesn't tell anybody until he shows up outside the gate. And they have their really sad scene where she cries into his. Into his chest. And he cries into her hair. And I was very worried about her bun. I was like, corbitt's gonna mess that bun up and someone's gonna have to fix it. But they make it through. That's cause he's so tall. But it's really sad. It's really, really sad. He says, I just wish I didn't know about this. I just know myself. This isn't the kind of thing I can get over. I just need to be on my own for a while. And then he kind of mutters again, like, be on my own. I really loved you. Oh, it's so painful. It's so painful. And of course she just feels horrible. Horrible. Like we don't really see Carrie cry that often. We'll see her get emotional and look like she might cry. But she doesn't actually cry. Like how she cries here very often at all. Like in the whole. Until the movies, basically. I could be wrong, though. We're gonna see as we watch the show. But she doesn't do it very often. And I thought it was really, really so sad. And she did it so beautifully. And then she goes up to take the pictures with all of us. She tells Miranda. Cause Miranda can see that she's upset. And they come, the two of them join Samantha and I to take the picture. And I'm of course, oblivious. And she kind of like hides her face while she's collecting her tears. And Then her voiceover says that it's amazing to be loved for who you really are. And I was so lucky that I had found three people who loved me like that. And it's us, which is a beautiful, beautiful ending to such a great episode. Let's talk just a little bit more about Miranda, too, because this episode, this, this storyline, I really, really loved. And I didn't remember one single bit of it. I do remember the time in New York that people would do this crazy speed dating thing. And I remember thinking it was fully insane. And I do think that our writers did it and that I don't know if they did it for research or if they just had already done it for regular life, but it was a real thing. You'd go and you'd sit down and there was a little timer and you would talk to some guy for whatever it was, five minutes, seven minutes, and then they would move and then you talk to the next one. It just seems so insane. But when you actually think about what the apps are, they're very similar. They're just not face to face. Right. Like it was a precursor to the apps, which we're all living in now, of course. So the fact that Miranda can tell by the look on all these guys faces that she needs to lie and say she's not a lawyer. Oh, my God, it's just still so true. I mean, I do think there are really successful guys out there who, if you said I. I was, went to Harvard and I'm a partner in my law firm, I think they'd be totally into it. I mean, I'm gonna hope that that's true. I. I'm pretty sure it is. I don't know if it's every guy though. Right. And I think it would depend on what that guy was doing in life and what that guy pictured for his life. Right. Like, does he picture a powerful wife where they're going to be like a. Like a power couple, you know, like share their. The powerfulness, the success, the intense work life, or is it somebody who doesn't want that? Right. And so Miranda pretty much decides that the group of guys who's at the speed dating thing, they don't want that. And I think that that's still really true. There's a whole bunch of guys who do not want that. So she really smartly decides to lie to this adorable guy, Harris, who says that he's an ER doctor. So she tells him that she's a stewardess, which is hysterical. And then when they go out, she wears this whole outfit. And she wears this scarf around her neck and her hair is poofy. And then when they get home and they have sex, she's got, like, a flowery bra on. I don't think we have ever seen Miranda in a flowery bra. It's really funny. It's like she came over to Charlotte's and she borrowed some stuff to pretend that she was a stewardess. So she also has many funny things she says to try to, you know, make her part believable. You know, she says at one point that she's in charge of the inflatable slide, but that in reality, if a real emergency happened, it's every man for themselves or something. She's very funny. Very, very funny. And Clark is so funny as this guy who's saying he's an ER doctor. But then in the morning, she actually asks him to my wedding, which I was so excited when I was watching. I was like, oh, Clark Reagan, come to my wedding. How great. I don't remember him there. Well, that's because he didn't make it. Because the morning of the wedding, she's cutting a bagel. And you can tell that this is going to happen because they do a close up of her just recklessly sawing at this bagel with this knife. And of course, she cuts herself. And she, you know, goes to the man she thinks is an ER doctor who happens to be in her kitchen. And she's like, oh, it's really bad. And he's like, ah, don't put it in my face. And she says, what do you mean you're an ER doctor? And he has to confess that, no, in fact, he is not an ER doctor. He is an assistant manager at the. The Athlete's Foot, which is just painful. Okay, I'm sorry. That's pretty bad. And then I thought she was really gonna confess back and that they could have had, like, a shared experience of lying about what they did for a living. But she doubles down. She doubles down and she says something like, really cutting. Like she hopes he's never on her flight. And then he says, well, it probably wouldn't be in first class. He looks really sad, like a little doggy that you've been mean to. And she says, yeah, you wouldn't be in first class. And she's very haughty about it, like in her pretense Druidus manner. And then the good news is she takes Stanford to my wedding, which is great, because I do remember Willy being there, which is wonderful because he's always really funny. And he got us through the long day of Charlotte's wedding. Long day or days. Anyway. I just love Clark Gregg and I really feel like. I feel like it would have been great if they could have both confessed that they were both lying. But I also think it would have been great if she'd run into him again on the street or something in the future and they could have somehow gotten over it because he has such a great. I think he has such an intelligent presence and also funny. He's got a little twinkle in his eye all the time. Clark. Greg, as an actor where you're just like, what's he up to? What's he up to? I like that about him. He was great. He was a great casting. We have so many great guys, obviously, but he's great, Great, great casting. And I wish we'd had him for more episodes. All right, so that's it for our recap of Don't Ask, Don't Tell, which is a great episode. Thanks you guys for being with me for both parts. Let me know your thoughts. Come over to our Instagram. I love to see you guys. Comments. Are you a Charlotte podcast? That's us on Instagram and you guys can comment there. Tell me your thoughts about this episode. I do know that I think Cynthia has always said this is one of her favorite episodes and I really was like, wow. Yeah, this is one of our best episodes. I think this is when one of the first episodes where we really have almost more drama than humor in one particular episode. And I think it's because we're getting more confident in our long term story arcs and where we've gone with, you know, the Aiden Carrie big situation and also kind of playing out Charlotte's storyline more than like one, one date episode. So it's having like the payoff of investment is really happening now, which I love to see. It's great. It's great. And it's great to see that we have enough confidence to go there as actors, you know. Anyway, I love this episode. Thanks for joining me. Bye.
- [44:52]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
In the middle of the night, Saskia awoke in a haze. Her husband Mike was on his laptop, but was on his screen. Would change Saskia's life forever.
- [45:03]
Character Confronting Michael Levengood
I said, I need you to tell me exactly what you're doing. And immediately the mask came off.
- [45:11]
Character Warning About Safety
You're supposed to be safe. That's your home. That's your husband.
- [45:16]
Narrator of Betrayal Podcast
Listen to Betrayal Season 5 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [45:22]
Ryder Strong
This is Ryder Strong and I have a new podcast called the red weather. In 1995, my neighbor Anna to tried disappeared from a commune. It was nature, trees and praying and drugs.
- [45:34]
Kristin Davis
So no, I am not your guru.
- [45:37]
Ryder Strong
And back then I lied to everybody.
- [45:40]
Kristin Davis
They have had this case for 30 years.
- [45:42]
Ryder Strong
I'm going back to my hometown to uncover the truth. Listen to the Red weather on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [45:53]
Katie Couric
If you only listen to one thing to make sense of the news this year, make it this the final episode of this season of Next Question pulls together the most important conversations of the year. You'll hear David Graham on Project 2025, Liz Oyer on the plethora of presidential pardons, Tina Brown on the year's biggest scandals here at home and across the pond, plus much, much more. It's a crash course in the last 12 months, how we made it through the years, and a look at what might be coming in 2026. Listen to next Question with me, Katie Couric on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [46:36]
Michelle Williams
You know, we always say new Year, new me, but real change starts on the inside. It starts with giving your mind and your spirit the same attention you give your goals. Hey everybody, it's Michelle Williams, host of Checking in on the Black Effect Podcast Network. And on my podcast we talk mental health, healing, growth and everything you need to step into your next season whole and empowered. New Year. Real you listen to Checking in with Michelle Williams from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [47:12]
Kristin Davis
This is an iHeart podcast, Guaranteed Human.