You Give Love a Bad Name with Nicole Ari Parker... (S2 E13 "Games People Play")

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Are You A Charlotte?" S2 E13 – "You Give Love a Bad Name" with Nicole Ari Parker (Games People Play)
Host: Kristin Davis | Guest: Nicole Ari Parker | Date: September 11, 2025
[Episode Runtime: ~44 min. Content starts at 03:49]

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Kristin Davis (Charlotte York on Sex and the City) and friend/guest Nicole Ari Parker revisit Season 2, Episode 13 ("Games People Play"), a classic featuring Jon Bon Jovi’s memorable guest appearance. The conversation weaves nostalgic behind-the-scenes stories with honest insights about love, dating, self-sabotage, motherhood, and modern relationships—both on the show and in real life. The themes of therapy, friendship, and emotional games in dating are explored, with plenty of laughter and candid advice.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Revisiting "Games People Play" (S2E13)

• Nostalgia & 1999 Setting
  • Kristin and Nicole recall what life was like in 1999 ([04:10]): Nicole didn’t have cable and only watched Sex and the City later via friends.
• Jon Bon Jovi as a Guest Star
  • Both gush about Jon Bon Jovi’s charisma and unexpected acting prowess ([05:12]):
    • “Why didn’t that man have an acting career?” – Kristin Davis (05:13)
• Thematic Depth and Comedy
  • The episode’s playful critique of Carrie’s break-up wallowing and the overt discussion of therapy:
    • “When people complain about Carrie being narcissistic... it’s so over the top, it’s almost like they somehow knew that this complaint was gonna be coming, you know, 15 years later.” – Kristin Davis (08:16)
    • "Miranda says, ‘maybe you should go to therapy,’ which is hysterical. I don't remember any of this." – Kristin Davis (08:46)
  • Charlotte’s rare mention of her parents and generational attitudes toward therapy and tennis ([10:17]):
    • "My family doesn’t believe in shrinks. We believe everything can be solved by physical exercise, and that’s why they're all very good at tennis." – Kristin Davis (11:17)
• Stanford & Therapy
  • Stanford’s humor about multiple therapists, including one he only sees because he’s attractive ([10:52]).

2. Meta Commentary on Friendship and Self-Awareness

• Therapy vs. Friendship
  • The hosts reflect on the episode’s message that friendship is about “blindly stumbling through life together” rather than always being one another’s therapists ([10:14]).
• Unpacking Carrie’s Patterns & Self-Reflection
  • Dr. Greenfield tells Carrie, “Maybe the problem is you, you’re the through line in all these bad relationships.” – Recapped by Nicole (11:31)
  • Nicole and Kristin dissect how the show’s therapy advice stands up today, and how it translates personally to single life and dating apps ([12:05]-[14:07]).

3. Dating in the Modern Era: Apps, Kids, and Setting Boundaries

• Kristin on Dating Apps
  • Kristin expresses her discomfort with apps like Raya, sharing Candace Bushnell’s warnings that it “draws a not good picture for women” ([13:11]).
  • Conversation about authenticity and courage in online dating ([13:21]–[14:50]).
• Motherhood & Time Constraints
  • Kristin worries about trading precious “kid time” for uncertain dates, and Nicole offers practical suggestions for short, daytime dates—like breakfast after school drop-off ([16:11]–[18:54]).
  • “How about for a little pre-New Year's resolution… have a little tea, have a little croissant… only interested in quick dates.” – Nicole (18:39-19:05)
• Nicole’s Vintage Dating Values
  • Shares a story about Boris waiting in her living room before their first date—a nod to old-fashioned boundaries ([20:50]).

4. Behind-the-Scenes and Apartment Lore

• Directorial and Writing Team
  • Shout-outs to writer Jenny Bix and Michael Spiller's directorial debut ([06:09]).
• On-Set Memories and Carrie’s Apartment
  • Kristin’s fierce nostalgia and defense of apartment details—her affection for “Carrie’s apartment as it was,” and the historical accuracy of the Gramercy Park kitchen, with a gentle jab at “blueprint complainers” ([29:00]-[30:46]).
• Scenes & Specifics
  • Miranda’s window-flashing scene, the infamous Twister game (with “Sarah Jessica’s yellow shorts”), and Samantha’s sports-obsessed date ([28:23], [28:49], [32:17]).

5. Honesty in Relationships & Essential Questions

• Jon Bon Jovi’s Character’s Honesty
  • His confession: “I’m really f-ed up with women. I lose interest right after I sleep with them.” – as a sign of rare early candor in dating ([33:02]).
  • Kristin and Nicole agree honesty is better than ghosting ([33:06]-[33:27]).
• Nicole’s Advice for New Dates
  • Proposes Kristin should ask potential dates:
    1. “What issues have you had with women?”
    2. “What are the top 3 things that aren't healed in you?”
    3. “How do you feel about your own future?”
    • “Nicole wants me to go to the depth over a croissant.” – Kristin Davis (34:29)
  • On balancing vulnerability: “You can’t leave a person broken and exposed.” – Nicole (35:12)

6. Aging, Self-Acceptance, and Growth

• “I’m grown.”
  • Nicole’s viewpoint on getting older: “I say I’m grown... That means I don’t have time for nonsense.” ([38:16]-[38:18])
• Life Phases and Living Fully
  • Kristin opens up about embracing life as a mom, businesswoman, and podcaster, and redefining what being older means ([36:26]-[37:08]).

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Notable Quotes & Moments with Timestamps

• “[Jon Bon Jovi] was so good, right? Why didn’t that man have an acting career?”
  – Kristin Davis (05:13)

• “Miranda says, ‘maybe you should go to therapy,’ which is hysterical. …Some of these episodes I look back on, I remember nothing.”
  – Kristin Davis (08:46)

• “Samantha’s very funny—she says, ‘Honey, we’re all just as messed up as you are. It’s like the blind leading the blind.’”
  – Kristin Davis (10:14)

• “My family doesn’t believe in shrinks. We believe everything can be solved by physical exercise and that’s why they’re all very good at tennis.”
  – Kristin Davis as Charlotte (11:17)

• “Maybe the problem is you. You’re the through line in all these bad relationships.”
  – Dr. Greenfield’s advice summarized by Nicole (11:31)

• “Kristin, you’re very sincere. You’re very transparent. You know where you stand on things.”
  – Nicole (14:10)

• “Do you think they’re nice?”
  – Kristin, on men on the apps (14:23)

• “I’m really f-ed up with women. I lose interest right after I sleep with them.”
  – Jon Bon Jovi’s character in the episode (33:02)

• “You can’t leave a person broken and exposed.”
  – Nicole (35:12)

• “I say I’m grown… That means I don’t have time for nonsense.”
  – Nicole (38:17)

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Fun Throwbacks and Easter Eggs

• The same grocery store was used in Miranda’s and Nicole’s scenes, years apart—a “secret throwback” ([31:36]-[32:06]).
• Kristin’s “eight-thirty breakfasts” and potential practice date with Nicole as the stand-in guy ([39:01]-[39:14]).

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"Are You a Charlotte?" Quiz Outtake

• Nicole: “I’m a Charlotte’s bestie.”
• Forced to pick:
  • “I am Charlotte on the inside and Carrie on the outside.” ([39:43]-[39:51])

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Episode Takeaways

• The themes of emotional honesty, self-awareness, and the complexities of dating—whether in 1999 or 2025—are timeless.
• Friendship, humor, and genuine self-reflection help both on screen (for SATC’s characters) and off screen, as Kristin and Nicole navigate work, dating, and motherhood.
• Kristin’s vulnerability about modern dating, motherhood, and self-worth is both honest and relatable.
• Nicole’s advice underscores the importance of boundaries, balanced vulnerability, and asking deep questions—even over a croissant.

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For anyone who hasn’t listened: This episode provides a warm, funny, and insightful mix of nostalgia, real-life vulnerability, and practical wisdom about love, friendship, and self-growth, relevant far beyond the world of Sex and the City.

Transcript

[Kristen Davis]

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[Kristen Davis]

Hi, I'm Kristen Davis, and I want to know, are you a Charlotte? Welcome back, everybody, to Are you a Charlotte? Part 2. Thanks for joining us. Here we go. You know what we're going to talk about? We're going to talk about.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

So also, you went to the archive for this one.

[Kristen Davis]

I know, I know. Well. Cause I'm so. I'm watching from the beginning. Right.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Okay, great.

[Kristen Davis]

And we're only in the second season. So this is episode 213. Yes. So it's literally 1999. Wow. Take yourself back to 1999. Would you have seen this show in 1999 or was there some delay in terms of when you were watching Sex and the city?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I was 28 and I think still broke, so I didn't have cable.

[Kristen Davis]

Got it.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I was living on 108th street in a little sixth floor walk up. So I hadn't seen it.

[Kristen Davis]

Wow.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No, I didn't see it until later.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay. Okay, cool.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I finished later.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Or if I was at a friend's house when in my 20s, I would go over their house. Of course. Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

Got it. So this particular episode is called Games people Play.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

And it is memorable for so many reasons and really enjoyable for so many reasons. And for me, because I haven't. I know, right? Jon Bon Jovi. Oh, my God. I mean, I remember when this was happening only because it was so bizarre, like the meeting of world.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

He was so good.

[Kristen Davis]

He's so good, right? Why didn't that man have an acting career? No.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I mean, it was so good.

[Kristen Davis]

And he's so simple.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I know, but fascinating.

[Kristen Davis]

And when we get to the end of his story. Cutting leg. Right.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I can feel the 1999 collective side.

[Kristen Davis]

So could I. Like, it really took me back. I mean, it really did. But yet he's so honest about it. That part wasn't. Didn't ring a bell. I didn't have any men in my life who I think were honest in 1999 about themselves and their shortcomings. Right. But, like, he's so just like, lays it, I guess. Cause he's in therapy, which we'll get to in a minute. But I mean, it's so good. Anyway, the thing that is adorable about this episode, so many things. But it's written by Jenny Bix, who came later to be our executive producer and is incredible and make her own shows. And we love her very much. And it's directed by Michael Spiller, who had been our dp.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Wow.

[Kristen Davis]

And I think this is his first episode directing. And he always wanted to direct. And he had. He was one of those DPs where he was really involved in a lot. You know what I'm saying? Like, had a lot of thoughts about blocking and whatever. You know, he was very involved, but he was very excited about directing. And I think he did a great job. Like, it was.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

It was so good. And the window, watching in Miranda's Window, I didn't see it coming. Right.

[Kristen Davis]

Really?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Like, you don't remember that?

[Kristen Davis]

It's funny, right? It's funny.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

It's so good.

[Kristen Davis]

It's really interesting. I couldn't. I didn't remember what happened either. I remember that she had to flash because anytime where Cynthia has been naked, I always had a lot of anxiety because I knew she didn't care about anything. She has no fear. Right. And I knew no one was protecting her on set. So I would always try to be like, should I come? Should I tell someone? You know? But it was all fine. Dirty, mean. But I had anxiety based on previous themes she'd done where people would put her in, like, positions I didn't think were, like, the best or whatever. Do you know what I mean? And I was like, why didn't someone protect Cynthia? You know? But she. Because she didn't care. She has no fear or ego whatsoever. Which, of course, is amazing.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

You are so caring. I remember one time we were shooting and you were like, nicole hasn't eaten. Okay. She got here at 4:30 in the morning and we've pushed lunch. I think someone can get her some grapes.

[Kristen Davis]

I know. I mean, honestly, sometimes they would push lunch for so long.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I know.

[Kristen Davis]

And we're trying to remember our lines. And it gets very hard. Very hard. I'm glad I spoke up for you. Yes.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Many times.

[Kristen Davis]

I'm so glad, baby. I'm so glad. Okay, so we have the incredible Jon Bon Jovi in this episode. Which is just even weird to say. I mean, I grew up on Bon Jovi. Like, they were inescapable and fundamental to, like, the 80s. It's crazy that Jon Bun Jo, he was on our show. Oh, my God. I'm still like, oh, my God. Anyway, so the thing that I also find really funny and amazing about this particular episode. So this is when Big and Carrie have broken up in the season, the episode before. And it begins with this really funny montage of Carrie just basically complaining about her and Big to all of us separately and then together and talking about how now she can play her music and na, na, na, all these different things. But also, it's kind of over the top. And when people complain about. About Carrie being narcissistic, which I don't believe at all, but it's so over the top that it's almost like they somehow knew that this complaint was gonna be coming, you know, 15 years later or whatever it is. Do you know what I mean? And also the funny thing is that people also say, like, that we never told her the truth. We totally tell her the truth in this episode.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes, yes.

[Kristen Davis]

She just doesn't listen to it, which is how we all are with our friends, right? It's so funny. So this, to me, this is the episode that I'm gonna get out and remind people of. The next time people wanna complain about.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Carrie, go to episode 213.

[Kristen Davis]

Exactly.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Call me later.

[Kristen Davis]

People play. Because, man, it's all here. It's all here. So it's a really funny scene where she's just like, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I just kept trying and trying, trying. And then we're all just looking at her like, oh, God. And then finally Miranda says, you know, maybe you should go to therapy. Which is hysterical. I don't remember any of this. Some of these episodes I look back on, I remember nothing. Which is weird. But, you know, it's like the middle of the night and everything hadn't slept. I don't know. And also in this one, I think Charlotte doesn't have the storyline. Cause back in the olden days, when we were 22 minutes, there'd be a, B, C, D storyline and D is very little.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Right.

[Kristen Davis]

And so different ways.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

The last two and a half minutes, maybe?

[Kristen Davis]

Exactly. Or just peppered through.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Peppered through. Yeah.

[Kristen Davis]

Group scenes or whatever. Whatever. I'll take that any day. You know what I'm saying? But anyway, side note, I digress. So it's a funny scene to me. And then this is also really funny because Charlotte mentions her parents, which we almost never hear about. Right. As you know, it's like this kind of, you know, thing where we never really dealt with our families. So everyone's talking about how they feel about therapy. Miranda's trying to get Carrie to go. Carrie's like, I don't believe in therapy. And then Samantha's very funny, says, honey, we're all just as up as you are. It's like the blind leading the blind. Which I think is hysterical and so true.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

But.

[Kristen Davis]

But isn't that what friends are for?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Right, Right.

[Kristen Davis]

To blindly be stumbling through life and life's challenges together? That's the point of friendship, I think. Not to be like a therapist helping each other. You know what I mean? Then I say, Charlotte says that she doesn't believe in shrinks and that her family doesn't believe in shrinks. That we believe everything can be solved by physical exercise and that's why they're all very good at tennis. Isn't that funny? That's so funny. And then you and I play tennis together many, many years later. That's right. That was fun times.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

That was fun.

[Kristen Davis]

Really fun. Then we have adorable Stanford, who basically says to Carrie that he has three therapists and that one of them he just has because he's a really beautiful man that he wants to look at, which is really funny. So that's so adorable. And then. Oh, my God. Then we say that Stanford wants to send Carrie to Dr. Greenfield, who is like a very desirable psychiatrist because Gwyneth Paltrow sees her because she suffers from high self esteem.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Oh, my goodness. Suffers from high self esteem.

[Kristen Davis]

I think it's so funny.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

But I love the advice she gives Carrie.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, it's good.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

She says, maybe the problem is you. I know, because you're the through line in all these bad relationships. And I didn't take it as a dig so much as more like, you're. And she explained it. You're picking these guys.

[Kristen Davis]

It's true. But you can see Carrie's very confused. She's like, these guys are playing games.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

With me, but they're all kind of playing the same game. It's true. So maybe, you know, Makes you think, am I attracted to this kind of. If you like dramatic drama, am I pulling this drama in? Am I getting neglected in a way that I constantly need it?

[Kristen Davis]

I know.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Or am I, you know, do I like jerks?

[Kristen Davis]

I know, right? I hate these questions so much. Being a single woman.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

We gotta set these questions.

[Kristen Davis]

Do you, Nicole? I don't know. I don't know. You know, I really like. Since I've been doing this show, obviously it gets discussed a fair amount and people talk to me about the apps and everything. I just can't do it. I mean, you might have been there. When Sarah Jessica threatened to put me on the Raya, were you there?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No.

[Kristen Davis]

I was like, you should. Why? Because, first of all, I'm terrified.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I'm gonna open a riot.

[Kristen Davis]

No, no.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And I'm gonna answer as you.

[Kristen Davis]

No, no, no, no.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah, I think I'm gonna.

[Kristen Davis]

Please don't. Please don't. I seasons in. Please don't, Please don't. Please, no, no, no. Please, no.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

That's 30 episodes.

[Kristen Davis]

No, please, no.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Plus two extra.

[Kristen Davis]

I'm really glad it was 30 episodes. And that's a nice round number. I hadn't counted up. It's not enough, but at least it's a nice round number. The reason I don't want to be on Raya is two things. Number one, Candace Bushnell came on the podcast, and we got a lot of info about Raya from Candace, and she's very active on there. It's not a good picture that she drew for us.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Really?

[Kristen Davis]

Yeah. No, it's good for some people, meaning the men folk. Not possibly so great for the women, from what I can gather.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

What you know about you, though, is that a lot of people are covering their real personality. You don't cover your personality.

[Kristen Davis]

That's true.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Very authentic. And if you put yourself on that site, I feel like men would respond to what you really are.

[Kristen Davis]

Can I ask you a question, though, that relates to this episode that I did think about what you're saying while I watched this. So this is called Games People Play. And in the episode, there is discussion about the games that men and women play with each other about dating and about once they're in a relationship. Right. And I, Kristen, suck at the games. Like, I have no game. You know, when people are like, she got game, he got game. Whatever.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Right?

[Kristen Davis]

No game. Okay. No game. Not even.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

That's what I think. You're very sincere. You're very transparent. You know where you stand on things.

[Kristen Davis]

That's why I cannot go on the App. Okay, I'm scared. I'm scared. No, scared.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No, don't be scared.

[Kristen Davis]

But they're like, I don't. I don't know that they're nice. Do you know what I'm saying?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah.

[Kristen Davis]

Do you think they're nice?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Well, yeah. I mean, I think that men that would click. I don't even know how it works, but you have to like them or like them. I just think with you, the guy that has the courage to reach out to you is already like 75% right.

[Kristen Davis]

You think?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And then in the other 25, you'll find out right away. But I think that you're not gonna get scragglers.

[Kristen Davis]

You don't think?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No, you're not gonna get scragglers.

[Kristen Davis]

Well, you're giving me a little bit of hope, so praise be to Nicole.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

You're the kind of person that someone's like, that's the one.

[Kristen Davis]

But then my question would be, well, are you thinking that I'm Charlotte?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No, no, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that when you listen to you speak, when you, you know, a five minute clip of you would tell people who you are, like, how kind you are and funny you are, and smart you are, hot you are. And, you know, I think someone would know what they're getting into.

[Kristen Davis]

You think?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah.

[Kristen Davis]

All right.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Maybe one day you're really, really famous. So he has to come out the gate kind of confident. You're not gonna get shocked.

[Kristen Davis]

Sheldon, you're so funny. Thank you. That's so nice. Can I tell you my other concern, which I know you will relate to as your mom self? Since I've been doing this and different people have been talking to me about this, right. I've really contemplated it, like, why am I not doing this? What is holding me back from doing this? And one of the things is I just don't really have time to date. Like, dating takes time. You have to leave the house, leave the children. Do you know what I mean? Spend time at a dinner with a person that you don't know.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

It's two hours max. But like, if you, your kids are at home watching something that they don't watch when you're around, the nanny is letting them watch squid game.

[Kristen Davis]

Stop that. No, they're not. But let me ask you this. And I know it's really hard to imagine because you have Boris, Thank God. But like, you know, my kids are 7 and 14, right? They still really need me. I mean, especially the seven year old. Like, would you have been like, yeah, I'm going to go out and date.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I'm sure there's two hours where.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, I'm gonna answer that question, you guys, would you have?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Well, I mean, I've been married for 20 years, so I was like, you know, mommy and daddy are going out.

[Kristen Davis]

Yeah.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And maybe one time, the first time it's like. But where?

[Kristen Davis]

Right.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And after that they were like, bye.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

You know, but you have to also show your children that.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, don't even start. I know what you're gonna say. Don't, don't, don't.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

That you're a full person and model for them. That being social is safe and doing grown up things is safe. Listen, if you keep playing this game of mommy doesn't leave the house, your kids are never leaving the house. You're gonna have 27 year olds living at your house.

[Kristen Davis]

First of all, I'd be fine with that. Me too. Secretly I love my children so much.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah. But I like that I have adventurous souls. I mean Sophie is the partier, you know, but she likes to have the party at home.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, nice.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah, she like brings the people over.

[Kristen Davis]

That's nice. I think you probably have a really fun house.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No, I like to be like my house is my sanctuary. But I have social kids, which is good, but it's good for me, right? Yes, right, for sure.

[Kristen Davis]

I mean, you know, mine are young. Right. And I mean I don't want to talk too much about them because of their privacy. But like, you know, they're pretty social. They're pretty social. It's going pretty well. They're probably more social than myself when I was young or now I'm just.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

How about this? How about for a little pre New Year's resolution? You don't have to go to a long dinner from 7 to 9.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay. Okay. Because then I would miss bedtime.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

You would miss bedtime. How about breakfast?

[Kristen Davis]

How am I gonna do that?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Well, the kids are in school.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, you mean after they're in school.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Okay, you drop them off.

[Kristen Davis]

You don't mean when I wake up at six?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No, don't have a full meal.

[Kristen Davis]

That's good.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Have a little tea. Little tea. I know you have a little croissant.

[Kristen Davis]

Love it.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Take the kids to school and have like an 8:30 breakfast.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay, I like that. I like that. You know what? I like that there's some parameters there.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

During the day and you put that in the thing. Only interested in quus.

[Kristen Davis]

That's gonna get a really interesting group of people who are gonna respond to that. That's really interesting. All right, I'm gonna mull that over. I'm gonna take it to heart. I like your advice. I honor the fact that you are in a really successful, incredible partnership with an incredible person. So I take your advice to heart. Thank you. Nicole and I really have been mulling it all over, partly because I think, also for me, because of work. Right. My time away from the kids was for work because obviously we film in New York. My kids live in la. So either they were with me in the summer or I was separated from them and trying to fly back and forth. As you know, we were both in this mix for a while, so there wasn't an extra amount of time that I would go like, oh, now I'm gonna be away from them to date, you know what I'm saying? But now I theoretically don't have that. Theoretically, they tell me, right. So I should potentially come up with something else to do with my time, I guess. Is this making any sense? Do you like my little thinking plan?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I just think it's more self protection and that I am here to encourage you, as your friend off screen, to let yourself live a little.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay. Okay. I'm gonna try to let myself live, you guys.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I mean, I had a few old fashioned things too, believe it or not. And when I met Boris, we were on a show and we were working together, so it was very professional, of course. And when we finally admitted that we liked each other and he wanted to ask me out on a real date, I had very real concerns about being on the show, being at work.

[Kristen Davis]

Yeah.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And so. But I also, when I was a kid, my mom, if a boy asked me out, he would wait on the sofa, she would talk to him.

[Kristen Davis]

Adorable.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And then I would come downstairs and we would go out.

[Kristen Davis]

Love it.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I wasn't even thinking. But he drags me for this moment. He'd asked me out on a date on our day off. It was clear that this was a date, that there was interest. And I rented a little apartment, but it was on the ground floor in a house. So he knocked on the door and I opened the door and said, I'll be right out. You can have a seat.

[Kristen Davis]

I had a little.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Because it was just this weird response of property. And I didn't know it was weird until he was like, excuse me. I was like, I'll be out in a second.

[Kristen Davis]

I think it's great.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And so you're a lady. I was a lady for five minutes, but I was a lady. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. No, we got to know each other. But I'm just saying you can respect your boundaries and still live a little.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay, I think that's good. That's good. That's very balanced. Very balanced advice. Thank you Nicole. I appreciate it.

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[Kristen Davis]

As someone who's played a gallerist and spent years walking through the art world in Heels, AG's new fall collection From Canvas to Cloth honestly feels like something Charlotte York would live in. It's inspired by artists and their studios think rich textures, beautiful craftsmanship, and pieces that feel both refined and expressive. Very Gallery opening in Chelsea meets weekend in the Hamptons. The new Boyfriend Fit jeans are my absolute favorite. They're slouchy in just the right way, flattering but relaxed and go with everything. And the collection includes soft corduroys, my favorite suede, and luxury knits that feel so timeless. AG also leads the way in lower impact denim production, which makes me feel even better about investing in these pieces because style and sustainability should go hand in hand. The From Canvas to Cloth collection is out [e-mail] use code KRISTIN15 to take an exclusive 15% off your next order, even if you've already purchased from the site before. You guys, this means I can use my own code and I'm also wearing the Boyfriend jeans right now. Love them so much. This fall, let your home smell as good as it looks. PURA's App Control Diffusers bring you premium scents from brands like Nest New York, Capri Blue and Anthropologie. From spiced pumpkin to white woods, your fall favorites are just a tap away. It's home fragrance that feels as elevated as it smells, and right now it's the perfect time to stock up. Visit pura.com and bring home the best scents of the season.

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[Kristen Davis]

You can make a difference in someone's life, including your own with a job in home care. These jobs offer flexible schedules, health care, retirement options and free training. They also provide paid time off and opportunities for overtime. Visit oregonhomecarejobs.com to learn more and apply. That's oregonhomecarejobs.com come let's go back to the episode. Yes, games people play. Games people play. Yes, games people play. Carrie goes to therapy.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

Can you believe it? I need. I mean, once in the whole 30 years she went to therapy. And the guy, the. Sorry. She meets Jon Ben Jovi in the waiting room. Which of course then takes precedence to what this therapist is saying to her, which as you said, is very appropriate advice, which is maybe she is the through line of all these seen problems in the other person and that maybe she should look at herself, which is incredibly good advice, generally speaking. Right. In all things. And then she tells us that she has been told that she's picking the wrong man, that she's a game player. And then I say, Charlotte says you have to be a game player to deal with men. And then Miranda says it's delusional to play games. And then Carrie says it's the wrong guy's picking her. So we do some mental gymnastics there.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

You're representing all the voices.

[Kristen Davis]

We are representing all the voices.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

All the voices. And I don't even know what to think. Then we go to this crazy sports bar, which I don't really remember at all. This is one of those ones where I'm like, I guess I was there. I don't remember this. We go to this sports bar because Samantha thinks we're gonna meet the men's there. The men's. The men's there. And we do, we meet some men. Of course, Samantha meets a man where everything is dependent. The sex life is dependent on whether the Knicks win, which is kind of hysterical. And that was the time when the Knicks were not winning. So then she gets very fed up because then he moves on to baseball. And she's like, no, I can't deal with this. I am often struck when I look back at these early episodes with what Samantha puts up with. I know, right? Cause Samantha's supposed to be, like, the most powerful one of us, right. Yet she puts up with a lot. A lot. Like, very sweetly. And then she doesn't. She gets to get through it.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah.

[Kristen Davis]

And then there's no gray area. Right. Like, whereas the rest of us might be trying to struggle through. Trying to struggle through. She's like, no, I'm done. Which I really appreciate. So then we're back. Jon Bon Jovi walks out of the door at the therapist. And I really thought for a second that he was playing himself. Because we've already said that Gwyneth goes to this therapist, right? And then I was like, wait, does he? I couldn't even remember. No, he's playing another character, but he's still himself. It's really distracting and strange. You know what I mean?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

But he was so good.

[Kristen Davis]

So good. And then once they go to have dinner together, I'm like, oh, yeah, he's not Jon Bon Jovi. He's great.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I wanted them to work.

[Kristen Davis]

Me, too. And they look so good together.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Jesus, that twister game.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, my God, the twister game is just beyond. And Sarah Jessica's got those yellow shorts on. It's excellent. I remember all of this in a vague way of, like, me being, like, so curious but not wanting to go to the set because I would be, like, a Looky Lou fan. Do you know what I mean? But I did meet him. He was lovely. Just so real, you know? He's such like, a regular guy, you know?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

What was that like for you to be on those. To see those sets of those early years? Like, you know, Carrie's apartment has moved on. And, like, that Twister game, for example, was in that apartment.

[Kristen Davis]

To me, Carrie's apartment was always Carrie's apartment. I mean, we did redo it in, I guess, the second film. And I was like, this wallpaper's whacked. Like, I want it to be its regular old dingy self. Do you know what I mean? Like, I never wanted any changes. Like, in my mind, Carrie's apartment is still this Aww. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't even care that Lisette lives there or whatever. Doesn't matter. Like, Carrie's apartment is still this in My mind with that weird, you know, loungey thing with that kind of crazy fabric on it that looks like it's from the 80s, you know what I'm saying? And the sheets, I love that they have some beautiful shots of Sarah Jessica at nighttime, I think. Cause our de. And her leg is out and her sheets. And it had, like, kind of dark swirls on the sheets. And, you know, we spent so much time in that apartment that. That apartment, to me, is just that apartment. And it lives on in my mind unchanged, you know, doesn't matter where she moves. And I did think, this is a crazy thought, because, as we all know, the Gramercy park was a beautiful apartment. Side note, I just want to say that the small kitchen is historically accurate. To everyone complaining about that. That is historically accurate. And probably the true kitchen of the house would have been on the bottom floor.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Right.

[Kristen Davis]

But that building has been separated, so there's. You know, the kitchens didn't always get to live on that were in the bottom floor. Unless you had someone restore the whole.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

House and gut and do all those things and add walls.

[Kristen Davis]

Right. So that is 100% accurate. And I'm so annoyed with everyone talking about the blueprint of our apartments.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

They live in other states.

[Kristen Davis]

It's true.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

They don't know.

[Kristen Davis]

It just takes a Google.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

New Yorkers know it.

[Kristen Davis]

Totally.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay, great. I got that off my. Off my mind. Thank you. So I just wanted to talk in my mind. Okay, we've got Miranda. She sees a really cute guy across the way who's. Who's. Who's slightly undressed. She thinks he's looking at her.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I thought he was looking at her.

[Kristen Davis]

I thought he was looking at her, too. She eventually flashes her breast. God love her. And then she sees him in the grocery store and she plays hide and seek with him, which is the games people play. I do love the thematic, you know, continuation through this episode. And then he doesn't know who she is. And she's like, I live across the airship from you. And then he goes, oh, yeah, you live underneath the guy I'm flirting with or whatever. Flashing. I know. She's mortified and runs away.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I was mortified listening to it.

[Kristen Davis]

I was like, me too. I was also shocked. I didn't remember that part at all.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Do you know what's a funny detail about that scene in the grocery store? It's the same grocery store that I call that. Ltw calls that you call me Charlotte. And says, oh, my God. Oh, my God, help me with this guy.

[Kristen Davis]

Did you know when you were filming that scene that. It was the same.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No. And the counter space is set up the same way. Right. Where I have the conversation with you is the same grocery store.

[Kristen Davis]

That's so funny. I wonder if our locations people knew this.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes, I'm sure.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, I love it so much.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Little secret throwback.

[Kristen Davis]

I love it so much. Okay, so then we get. We're playing the Twister. The Twister is a dream of two incredibly attractive people.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I played Twister as a kid. I was like, I don't remember.

[Kristen Davis]

Me too. No, me neither. No, it took some.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I was like, hey, Boris, did you ever play Twister?

[Kristen Davis]

Did he?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No.

[Kristen Davis]

Not in Germany. Huh?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

No.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, sad. I'm gonna get Germany. Yeah. Oh, we played Twister a lot. Twister was like a high. High.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

So sexy.

[Kristen Davis]

Very sexy. Because they're very sexy and very charming. But when they have sex and then it's afterwards and they're laying in the sheets and Carrie says, hey, why are you in therapy? And he very simply says, I'm really f. Ed up with women. I lose interest right after I sleep with them. The gut punch.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

The gut punch heard around the world.

[Kristen Davis]

I mean.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

But I loved a man being that honest, though, because they never are. Even if it's like a knife wound. At least you're knowing it early.

[Kristen Davis]

Absolutely. And you're not home wondering why they're not calling you, which is a really evil thing to do. I want to say yeah to anyone listening.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I've got mommy issues.

[Kristen Davis]

Yeah. Ghost is not good.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Just talking on the phone.

[Kristen Davis]

Confess. Yeah, confess your issue.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

It's much better from jump. Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

Right?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

Right. I mean, it wasn't exactly from jump because they've already slept together. Yeah. It was a little girl. There's a little girl?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Well, she didn't ask him until after they said.

[Kristen Davis]

That's so true.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I would have asked them right away.

[Kristen Davis]

I know. I was surprised, but I think she doesn't want him to ask her. Oh, right. Because if you ask, then they're gonna ask you, and you're gonna have to say. She doesn't want to say I picked the wrong men, you know? Which is what she says to him before she goes.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

But this is why when you have your coffee and croissant date after the drop off.

[Kristen Davis]

Yes. After.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Before I call you, you can just have a couple of questions.

[Kristen Davis]

And know what should the questions be? Nicole.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

What issues have you had with women?

[Kristen Davis]

Really?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, my God.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

What are the top three things that aren't healed in you?

[Kristen Davis]

What?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Small or big?

[Kristen Davis]

You guys Nicole wants me to go to the depth over a croissant.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yeah.

[Kristen Davis]

Wow.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Gotta get back home and make sure you're home for the kids.

[Kristen Davis]

You're so right.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Let me know.

[Kristen Davis]

Now, what else?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And how do you feel about your own future?

[Kristen Davis]

Ooh, that's a good one. I think I would start with that one. I feel like that one's better, easier.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Well, I think you would give him the cupcake at the end about your future, because the first two are. Feel like he's gonna feel judged, but you gotta get the information.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And the third one is more about. I'm actually interested in you.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay. Do I wanna reserve the third question for whatever the answers might be? Meaning I might wanna hear the answers to the first two before I give the cupcake of the potential future.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Well, I think you can't leave a person broken and exposed.

[Kristen Davis]

This is the best advice, you guys. Oh, my God.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

If he tells you about what his.

[Kristen Davis]

If he tells you what I feel like is an honest answer.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes. And it's both of you are a little shocked that it's coming out this soon over coffee at 8:30 in the morning. You also want to make sure that you are interested in the joy people want for themselves.

[Kristen Davis]

Yes.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Because say you have. You're attracted to someone. He's like, I want to just surf in Bermuda. Then you know that that gives him happiness. But you're not an ocean person. You know what I mean? But you're interested in what brings that person, Jo. Not what, just breaks them for sure. And I think you leave a person happy that they're honest, but also that you've reconnected them to find. To joy.

[Kristen Davis]

To joy.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

To joy.

[Kristen Davis]

To joy. To their own joy.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

That's so nice.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Nicole, I'm here for you.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, my gosh. You should be a matchmaker. I just watched that movie last night, Dakota Johnson. Did you see the Materialist?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

This is so good. So good, so good.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, my God. Anyway, sorry, I digress. So, I mean, look, we just covered the episode.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

It's very exciting because to me, they're timeless.

[Kristen Davis]

I know, so timeless and so completely still relevant. All the questions.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And you know what? You're like a blossoming mom, businesswoman, podcaster. And everyone, remember in Paris, everyone was like, self, how does it feel to be a woman in your 50s? So how does it feel? And this is now a new iteration of the show about being older. And I'm like, you're like 20 on the inside. Like, I don't even know what I'm gonna Say on a date, like, that's season one.

[Kristen Davis]

That's so true. Do you remember that time we were in the limo with all of your fake children and all of my fake children for quite some time, and one of the children, I'm not gonna say, who, decided to try to explain to you how to take a selfie. Do you remember this? And I was like, do not tell Nicole how to take a selfie. She knows. She knows how to take a selfie. And they were like, put the camera down low. Do you remember this? No. Oh my God, you're so funny. And I was like, listen, ladies, you do not put the camera down low, okay? I am old. And you're like, don't say that. Do you remember that? You would always say to me, don't say. Yeah. Yes. And I was like, no, But Nicole, I am owning it. I'm just saying to these children because they are young, right? Fake children, especially. This might have been first season.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

They were very young. And like, to me saying I'm old, I feel like, well, I'm owning my life experience. I have had a lot of it. Right. But I now see it's also like your brain is also hearing you say that. And is that the best way to put it?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Right?

[Kristen Davis]

Right.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

You know how I say it?

[Kristen Davis]

Tell me.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I say I'm grown.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, that's nice.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I'm grown.

[Kristen Davis]

That's good. That's good. That's good. That means I don't have time for nonsense.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And the seed has broken and the.

[Kristen Davis]

Flower has blossomed, and we're not gonna mess around with nonsense. No, that's good.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

But I will still wear high heels.

[Kristen Davis]

With me any day. You bring out the cursing in me. It's so interesting. Freedom. I feel freedom when I'm with Nicole. You beautiful thing.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

You gorgeous thing.

[Kristen Davis]

I'm so happy I got to see you.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I know.

[Kristen Davis]

I was so scared you wouldn't want to come on, that it would be too fresh. But I really appreciate it.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

It's fresh. But seeing you heals the wound.

[Kristen Davis]

I know. It feels better, doesn't it, being together?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

It does.

[Kristen Davis]

I know. We need to plan something for the five of us. Yeah, wouldn't that be nice?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And when I'm LA. Yeah. I'll have 8:30 breakfast with you.

[Kristen Davis]

Oh, great. Amazing.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

You can rehearse.

[Kristen Davis]

Let's do it. Oh, my God.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I can practice. Practice. I'll be the guy. I'll wear like guy clothes.

[Kristen Davis]

You could do it.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

Okay, great.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I'll like.

[Kristen Davis]

Or you could be a very, very attractive woman I'm trying to hit on.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And with that, we'll see you next time.

[Kristen Davis]

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Are you a Charlotte?

[Kristen Davis]

Nicole, are you a Charlotte?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I'm a Charlotte's bestie.

[Kristen Davis]

You of all people get to say that. Okay, but if you didn't have that option and you had to say one of the original four, what would you say?

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

I am Charlotte on the inside.

[Kristen Davis]

Yes.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

And Carrie on the outside.

[Kristen Davis]

Love it. Yes, I think that's true. I mean, I feel very charlotty from you, you know, in terms of, like, your day. Your day is about your children and arranging things for them, making everything wonderful for them and for Boris. Like, you're so committed, you know, to your family and making their lives wonderful, which is so Charlotte.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Right.

[Kristen Davis]

And your dogs, you know, like, you have a lot of Charlotte life. Like, your life looks like hers in a lot of ways, but you're also like a career woman. You know, you've got it all. Right. But then I also think just your presentation is kind of, like, thoughtful and Carrie esque in terms of, like, questions and listening to people and, you know.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes. Pondering life.

[Kristen Davis]

Pondering life.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes. With your beautiful eyes and wearing purple shoes.

[Kristen Davis]

Totally.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Yes.

[Kristen Davis]

Yes. Thank you so much.

[Nicole (Kristen Davis's friend)]

Thank you, honey. I love you.

[Kristen Davis]

You're a wonderful guest. AG's new Fall 2025 collection, from Canvas to Cloth, is inspired by artists and their studios. As someone who plays a character deeply rooted in the art world, it truly feels like something Charlotte would love. The collection blends creativity with wearability, from soft knits and suedes to new denim silhouettes like the Boyfriend Fit for women. It's relaxed, effortless, and so chic. And it's not just for women. AG has great pieces for men, too, perfect for dressing the whole family. The Fall 2025 collection is available now at aggenes.com and use code Kristin. 15 for 15 off your next order. I'm going to be using my own discount. You guys, I'm so excited.

[Annabe Sofas Advertiser]

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[Fox One Advertiser]

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[Shell Giving Pump Advertiser]

Can small acts make a real impact in the world? Sometimes a small thing has the power to become more something big and meaningful. And when it comes to helping children, no act is too small. When you fill up at the Purple Giving Pump at Shell, a portion of your purchase will be donated to support charities in your community. The Giving Pump Easy to Stop, Easy to donate from 9125-1031 25 participating Shell stations will donate a minimum of $0.01 per gallon of the fuel pump from the Giving pump or a minimum donation of 300.

[PayPal Advertiser]

This is an I Heart Podcast.