Billy Crudup

Summary

Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard

Guest: Billy Crudup

Release Date: November 17, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this rich, engaging episode, Dax Shepard and Monica Padman sit down with Tony and Emmy award-winning actor Billy Crudup. The conversation spans the arc of Crudup’s personal history, his quirky and complex family background, lessons learned from his risk-taking father, navigating privilege and legacy, his celebrated acting career, deep dives into craft, and the mindset behind his selective approach to fame. There’s plenty of signature Armchair humor, vulnerability, and insightful stories — from Hollywood tales to philosophy on American identity.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Pumpkin Spice and Playful Banter

• Timestamp: 02:26–03:20
  The episode opens with casual banter about pumpkin spice lattes, their authenticity, and vocal exercises. This quickly segues into introductions and sets a relaxed, intimate tone.

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2. Family Background: The Colorful Life of Billy's Father

• Timestamp: 03:21–28:49

• Billy shares vivid stories about his father, Tommy, a charming, unreliable “hustler” who dabbled in textiles, worked as a bookie and loan shark, and frequently tried new (often questionable) businesses.
• The family moved often, leading Billy to attend nine schools before graduation.
• Billy’s grandfather, “Pops,” was a cantankerous WWII vet, tough on both Billy’s father and Billy, while his grandmother, “Dee,” was an angelic presence.
• Billy reflects on emotional inheritance:
  • “My dad… was a huge dreamer. There was no obstacle that couldn’t be overcome. But also, I think, he was divorced from reality.” (15:24–16:06)
• On his father’s perpetual optimism:
  • “He always thought that he was going to hit a home run… He was constantly asking if I wanted to be a part of a business. …I would send him checks from time to time… But I was like, dad, I’m not a business guy…” (21:32–22:03)
• The family dynamic included periods of financial instability, moving between New York, Florida, North Carolina, and Texas, shaped Billy’s adaptability and forged a tight bond among him and his siblings.
  • “The three of us, we were posse and you just look at each other and you’re like, all right, this is batshit crazy, right?” (25:09–25:19)

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3. Adapting, Siblings, and Sentimentality

• Timestamp: 28:50–31:17

• Billy discusses his strong relationship with his brothers. Having siblings was “everything” during transitions.
• Attachment to sentimental objects is rooted in craving consistency, such as keeping his grandfather’s glass-blown lamps.
  • “Sometimes it kind of sneaks up on me in the ways that I’m sentimental…” (29:07–30:49)

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4. Childhood Instability and Building Resilience

• Timestamp: 34:58–37:43

• The constant moving turned Billy into a “class clown” as a means to integrate (“trying to fit in and class clown was my angle,” 35:05–35:18).
• He preserved early friendships, and saw adversity as a net benefit for life adaptability.

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5. Legacy, Privilege, and Guilt

• Timestamp: 09:53–14:18

• Billy did PBS’s “Finding Your Roots,” discovering lineage back to Charlemagne.
• Honest discussion on being part of a “legacy group” at UNC, feeling he didn’t “earn it,” and the discomfort it brought:
  • “I did not like that at all. I felt like a fraud when it started to really, really dawn on me.” (38:28–38:40)
• Reflection on privilege in American society and grappling with inherited shame and pride.

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6. Falling in Love with Acting (and Not Fame)

• Timestamp: 35:02–47:00

• Billy recounts how constant moving led him to theater, finding acceptance and a sense of belonging.
• Focused on craft, not stardom:
  • “I wasn’t hell bent on being a professional actor… until the first day of acting school… They rung a bell in me.” (43:59–44:52)
• Graduate of NYU’s Tisch (grad acting), studied Alexander Technique (“You’re not breathing into people’s mouths, man…” 40:55–41:10).
• Early Broadway break came quickly: “Six months after I graduated school, I landed a part in a Tom Stoppard play, Arcadia…” (46:37–46:46).

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7. Stage vs. Screen, “Almost Famous”, and Avoiding the Spotlight

• Timestamp: 46:31–59:51

• After early breaks on Broadway, Billy transitioned into films (Sleepers, Almost Famous), working with De Niro, Pitt, Hoffman, and others.
  • “How do we compute that? Like, first play’s a Tom Stoppard and then our first movie is like De Niro and Hoffman.” (51:22–51:28)
• Candid on discomfort with fame and magazine covers:
  • “I realized I didn’t want to be a model. I didn’t want to wear somebody else’s clothes. I was just interested in acting. I definitely didn’t want to talk about myself.” (58:17–58:59)
• On resisting the “It Guy” hype of the ‘90s, focusing on “earning” each role by merit, not celebrity.

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8. Voice of MasterCard, Financial Freedom, and Artistic Choices

• Timestamp: 70:49–77:21

• Billy was the voice of MasterCard's "Priceless" campaign for over a decade:
  • “I realized, this is the gift of a lifetime. …I had an enormous safety net… if you can bank on 20 grand, 50 grand, whatever it is a year, your life opens up creatively.” (75:03–75:21)
• This allowed him to keep picking challenging, meaningful projects—especially in theater.

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9. Recent & Current Work: “The Morning Show,” “J. Kelly,” and Noah Baumbach

• Timestamp: 77:27–86:29

• On landing the role of Corey Ellison in "The Morning Show": “Another blessing… just great, good luck.” (77:36–77:44)
• Billy explains his role in Noah Baumbach’s film “J. Kelly,” acting opposite George Clooney and Adam Sandler, and how the film examines fame, legacy, and the American identity:
  • “It’s a beautiful script about a movie star, George Clooney… looking back… was it worth it? …You miss the life you’re having.” (78:47–86:16)

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10. Thoughts on Craft: Working with Tom Cruise on Mission Impossible

• Timestamp: 86:29–92:28

• Billy gives behind-the-scenes insight on working with Tom Cruise:
  • “You ever work with Q cards? …We’re working with Q cards today. [He] had someone write up the whole monologue… but he’s giving me everything…” (90:00–91:00)
• On Cruise’s charisma and kindness:
  • “You haven’t been consoled until you’ve been consoled by Tom Cruise.” (92:08–92:18)

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11. Philosophy: American Pluralism and the Theater

• Timestamp: 69:18–70:49

• Billy sees value in using his skills to serve community and pluralism:
  • “This kind of goes back to civics. If you have a skill… if you can be really good at it, you can be really useful.” (69:18–70:14)
  • “…That’s one reason why the theater in particular… that’s where I’ve had some of the best parts.” (70:27–70:49)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On His Father’s “Jackpot” Mindset:
  "You just don't hit the jackpot. You have to grind out a life. And occasionally a door opens, you get a ray of sunshine, then it closes."
  — Billy Crudup (16:42–16:49)

• On Feeling Like a Legacy Admission:
  "I did not like that at all. I felt like a fraud when it started to really, really dawn on me."
  — Billy Crudup (38:28–38:40)

• On Resisting Fame:
  "I realized I didn’t want to be a model. I didn’t want to wear somebody else’s clothes. I was just interested in acting. I definitely didn’t want to talk about myself."
  — Billy Crudup (58:17–58:59)

• On Acting Philosophy:
  "I don't try to manifest emotion. If emotion comes in the playing of a scene, I'm not afraid of it. But the aim is to accomplish the story..."
  — Billy Crudup (80:23–80:52)

• On Financial Freedom from MasterCard:
  "By year 10, I could walk in, do 20 spots in about 20 minutes… I had an enormous safety net… your life opens up creatively."
  — Billy Crudup (75:03–75:21)

• On Tom Cruise’s Consolation:
  "You haven't been consoled until you've been consoled by Tom Cruise."
  — Billy Crudup (92:08–92:18)

• On American Discontent:
  "If you are busy looking forward to your future, you miss the life that you're having. And so I think it's a great metaphor for some kind of American discontent."
  — Billy Crudup (86:16–86:29)

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Favorite Funny & Human Moments

• The recurring “Pumpkin Spice” debate and open confusion about its ingredients (02:26–03:20 and again in the fact-check at 123:11–124:25).
• Dax’s embarrassment about missing his wife’s Hollywood Walk of Fame ceremony because of a workout (04:12–04:48).
• The “Tonka”/MasterCard cold-read bit, and Monica’s incredulity at the line (71:14–75:03).
• Monica and Billy reminiscing about neutral mask exercises in acting school, and the confusion about “breathing into mouths” (40:48–42:16).

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 02:26 – First moments with Billy; pumpkin spice debate
• 09:53 – Billy on his family’s roots, legacy, and "Finding Your Roots"
• 14:27 – Lunches with his tough grandfather, family dynamic
• 21:29 – Father’s failed enterprises, and Billy’s need for independence
• 25:09 – Sibling support during chaotic childhood
• 38:04 – Legacy admission and feeling like a fraud
• 43:59 – Discovery of acting as a career path at NYU
• 46:37 – Early break with Tom Stoppard’s “Arcadia”
• 51:07 – First film: "Sleepers" with De Niro and Hoffman
• 58:17 – Aversion to fame and magazine covers
• 70:49 – MasterCard campaign and financial freedom
• 77:27 – “Morning Show” and the new film “J. Kelly”
• 80:23 – Acting philosophy and describing work with Noah Baumbach
• 90:00 – Tom Cruise, cue cards, and acting in “Mission Impossible”
• 92:08 – On being consoled by Tom Cruise

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Closing Thoughts

This episode showcases not only Billy Crudup’s humor, candor, and formidable storytelling talent, but also his nuanced view of family, legacy, and success. Dax and Monica provide their signature warmth and curiosity, making this a masterclass in both acting craft and the journey toward personal authenticity.

Fans of theater, film, or deeply human stories will find much to love — whether it’s tales from Broadway or candid admissions about insecurity, privilege, and the pursuit of real fulfillment amid Hollywood’s tempting “jackpots.”

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Listen to Billy Crudup’s episode for more on:

• The craft, heartaches, and joys of acting (and not being an “It Guy”)
• Juicy stories about Tom Cruise, George Clooney, and the MasterCard years
• Funny, philosophical explorations of what it means to carve out a meaningful life — on stage and off

Transcript

[Dax Shepard]

Wondry plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad free right now. Join Wondry plus in the Wondry app or on Apple Podcasts or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts.

[Monica Padman]

Vocal exercises.

[Dax Shepard]

Welcome, welcome, welcome.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, no, it's a mess.

[Dax Shepard]

Armchair Expert. I'm Dax Shepard and I'm joined by Monica Padman.

[Monica Padman]

Hi. Hi.

[Dax Shepard]

I was giggling because I tried to do it quietly.

[Monica Padman]

They're gonna hear it. I'm gonna leave that in.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, you're gonna leave that in. Okay. Today's episode is someone I idolize as an actor. His name is Billy Crudup. He is a Tony and Emmy award winning actor. He's very sparkly and magicy. He's very.

[Monica Padman]

He really is.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, he's very special. Almost Famous Watchmen. Big fish sleepers, of course. The morning show new season is currently out now on Apple TV. And he is in a new movie in theaters November 4th. Now in theaters now and on Netflix on December 5th. J. Kelly. And it's got the Clune doctor in it.

[Monica Padman]

It sure does. And Adam Sandler. It's a big movie.

[Dax Shepard]

It's a big old movie. Noah Baumbach.

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

Incredible. Please enjoy. Billy Crudup. Armchair Expert is proud to have Alexa as our presenting sponsor. The all new Alexa plus is your smart, proactive AI assistant. Just chat naturally about anything and watch your to do list disappear. It learns your style and anticipates what's next across Echo, Fire TV and more. Learn [e-mail] New Alexa. We are supported by Allstate. You know what's smart? Checking Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds on car insurance. You know what's not smart? Not checking your phone's volume before blasting your morning pump up playlist in the office break room. Or not checking that your laptop camera's off before joining the meeting in your robe or something. I'm a little too familiar with not checking your grocery list before heading to the store and realizing you bought everything except what you needed. Yeah, checking first is smart. So check Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds. You're in good hands with Allstate. Potential savings vary subject to terms, condition and availability. Allstate North American Insurance Company and Affiliates, Northbrook, Illinois.

[Billy Crudup]

He's an Upchurch. Fantastic. I got you guys a pumpkin spice latte if you want one. No, I don't know what that is. How charming are they? I've never had one. This smell really puts me off.

[Dax Shepard]

That's not a real taste.

[Billy Crudup]

Distilled Pumpkin spice?

[Monica Padman]

No, there's pumpkin spice. That's real. All spice is real. These are real spices, you guys.

[Billy Crudup]

But how do you make pumpkin spice? From the peel. Like, you try out the peel, the seeds.

[Dax Shepard]

Grind up the seeds, mix with a little paprika. No, I don't think it's. I don't think that's how it works.

[Monica Padman]

Good thing we do a fact check.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, there you go. That's a good place to start.

[Dax Shepard]

Billy, where are you staying?

[Billy Crudup]

At a little boutique hotel called the Chateau Marmont.

[Dax Shepard]

I would have guessed. I would have guessed. All of you boys do Chateau.

[Billy Crudup]

Well, this one Naomi set up.

[Dax Shepard]

Is she also in town?

[Billy Crudup]

She is in town. She's got a premiere for a show she did. And a couple of days ago, she got a star on the Walk of Fame.

[Monica Padman]

Oh.

[Billy Crudup]

So we had a ceremony for that.

[Dax Shepard]

Were you in attendance?

[Billy Crudup]

I certainly was.

[Dax Shepard]

I didn't go to my wife.

[Monica Padman]

I know. That was embarrassing.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

You were working out.

[Dax Shepard]

I guess I was busy lifting.

[Billy Crudup]

Sure.

[Dax Shepard]

I was in the middle of a.

[Billy Crudup]

Well, dude, then that's the total bro excuse.

[Dax Shepard]

What are we going to do?

[Billy Crudup]

I mean, I could lift that stone.

[Dax Shepard]

I could say goodbye to these gains. But they're temporary and that star is permanent. I'll get to it.

[Monica Padman]

I went to hers.

[Billy Crudup]

You were there. That's generous.

[Dax Shepard]

And then there were protesters there. The anti vax community hates us, so they were in full force screaming at her. What a day to remember. I'm sad I missed it.

[Billy Crudup]

Holy cow. Okay, that. Is that different sort of space.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Not what I think a young actor envisions when they think of getting a.

[Billy Crudup]

Star on the Hollywood movie. Could you guys just for a second, quiet down? Just give me one second.

[Dax Shepard]

You can berate me afterwards.

[Billy Crudup]

Total agreement. But I just need a second with my star.

[Monica Padman]

It also is funny because, you know, in the pictures, you're always sitting by the star, but you're sitting in the middle of Hollywood Boulevard and it's disgusting.

[Billy Crudup]

That is not for the faint of heart. No, but neither is this business. No, you're right. The cesspool of this business.

[Dax Shepard]

They did a number on Trump star. Seen that?

[Billy Crudup]

I have not.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, people have gone. Have you seen it?

[Billy Crudup]

They gone to town on it.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, I. It's got to be hundreds of people. There's no way one person could be responsible for the amount of damage. It looks like there's been acid involved. Pickaxes. And I mean, it is. It's a mess.

[Billy Crudup]

I guess I'm not terribly surprised.

[Dax Shepard]

I think I just saw an article that the city was finally like, we're going to have to remove it. It's a big hole in the ground now. Oh, boy.

[Billy Crudup]

Now.

[Dax Shepard]

Well.

[Billy Crudup]

We'Re doing voices.

[Dax Shepard]

I just heard my voice there. Which doesn't always happen. Do you have people who do impressions of you?

[Billy Crudup]

Negative. Actually, there is one young comedian who does impressions. Very good impressions.

[Dax Shepard]

Matt friend, insanely tall.

[Monica Padman]

We just had him on.

[Dax Shepard]

We just had him on.

[Billy Crudup]

I think he lives in Soho or around. Naomi and I are downtown in New York. And he came up to and said, hey. Hey, nice to meet you. I'm like, hey, nice to meet you, too. And he said, I do impressions. And it turns out he did one before, and I think it was Kimmel or somebody else had forwarded it to me, and I gave him a critique back on it.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Because it was him doing you.

[Billy Crudup]

It was him doing my character on the morning show, Corey Ellison.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

So him doing Corey, played by you.

[Billy Crudup]

Exactly. Because there is no Billy here. I know that. I transform.

[Monica Padman]

No, we're here for Billy. Billy only.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah. Billy's boring.

[Dax Shepard]

Boring Billy. Oh, boring Billy. You had disco. Disco as a kid.

[Billy Crudup]

That's correct.

[Dax Shepard]

That was from my boy, Boring Billy, I guess.

[Billy Crudup]

And boring Billy as an adult, actually. That's a good way to be an adult, I think.

[Dax Shepard]

All right, so now, as you arrived here today, did you have any fear that I would tell this story that I always tell about you? You must.

[Billy Crudup]

I did not. It didn't even cross your mind. Why would you do that? Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

It's so inappropriate. He would never do that.

[Monica Padman]

No, but he's gonna.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm not gonna. Because I know you don't want me to.

[Billy Crudup]

What does 500 million streams mean? It means a lot of people are.

[Monica Padman]

Gonna listen to this story.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. That's the amount of tributaries that feed the Amazon.

[Billy Crudup]

That's it.

[Dax Shepard]

500 million streams.

[Billy Crudup]

Because this is a green. I see. Okay, good.

[Dax Shepard]

We're off grid. I one time had the rare honor of hearing Billy make love.

[Billy Crudup]

Whoa.

[Dax Shepard]

I want to keep it as clean and not offensive to Billy as possible. But I've never, ever, ever heard someone receive that much pleasure in my life. I felt very inept and insecure.

[Billy Crudup]

I thought about it. I've been talking to other people in the house. That was not coming to my vicinity.

[Dax Shepard]

The calls of pleasure. I just was like, when's this going to end? But anyways, when I saw Billy, I just had to tell him, you know, I think about that often. And that was 20 years ago.

[Billy Crudup]

Yep, it was about 20 years ago.

[Monica Padman]

That's why he's been in the gym ever since. He's trying to compete.

[Dax Shepard]

Still. Still. Kristen's never made noises like I heard some 20 years ago. You.

[Monica Padman]

You're allowed to take that?

[Billy Crudup]

Actually, they weren't complaints. No.

[Dax Shepard]

I was like, I should bring them water. I worry about everyone hydrated.

[Billy Crudup]

Hydration.

[Monica Padman]

Exciting for that person.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, let's talk about Mansetta. New York. Is that what it's called?

[Billy Crudup]

Very close. Manhasset.

[Dax Shepard]

Wow. When you pronounce it, I now realize it sounds like a bunk version of Manhattan. Oh, you guys did Manhattan. We're gonna do Manhasset.

[Billy Crudup]

My suspicion is they're all drawn from Native American tribes in the area.

[Dax Shepard]

Stolen.

[Billy Crudup]

It hadn't occurred to me before, but there are quite a few places in this country. The names originated before we got here.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

And I suspect Manhattan. Manhasset.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

Maybe not.

[Dax Shepard]

Where is it?

[Billy Crudup]

On the north shore of long Island. Exit 36, I think, or so about 30 minutes outside of the city. My dad was selling textiles in the late 60s, early 70s in Manhattan. So he would take the train, and.

[Dax Shepard]

When you say textiles, big bolts of fabric.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah. My dad was from North Carolina. The town that he grew up was called Henderson, North Carolina. 30, 40 minutes north of Durham. My grandfather was vice president of marketing for Harriet Henderson. And so my dad wanted to go out on his own, so he went with a competing firm, Burlington.

[Dax Shepard]

Any relation to the Burlington Coat Factory?

[Billy Crudup]

I believe there is a relation. You'll have to look. I don't know the precise one, but there was quite a bit of yarn coming out of North Carolina. And so my dad would sell the cotton to the garment district in Manhattan.

[Dax Shepard]

Now, Grandpa, was he charmed by that? Did he say, oh, my son has pluck?

[Billy Crudup]

There was almost nothing my grandfather was charmed by.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Billy Crudup]

He was a fascinating guy. He was extremely cantankerous. We called him Pops. My grandmother, Dee, who died the day I graduated high school, was an absolute angel. She was the greatest. Priscilla was her name.

[Monica Padman]

Ooh. Where'd Dee come from?

[Billy Crudup]

Well, I'm not sure. It's a great question. It was Dee and Pops.

[Dax Shepard]

Aw.

[Billy Crudup]

But I don't know why. Both of my parents were only children, so they didn't have grandchildren before us. They were the names that they went with. But it's a good question. I'll ask my mom. But when my grandmother died, my grandfather was a widower, and I was going to school now, 45 minutes away from.

[Dax Shepard]

Him at UNC Chapel Hill grade School.

[Billy Crudup]

I love grade school. Great campus.

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

Tar Heels.

[Billy Crudup]

Tar Heels, yes.

[Dax Shepard]

Well done, Dax.

[Billy Crudup]

Yes. Now we're getting somewhere. Unfortunately, two years or a year before I got there, so we did not have the Jordan era teams. And then after I left, we won the championship, I think a year later or two years later.

[Dax Shepard]

So you were kind of a rebuild period.

[Billy Crudup]

We were a rebuild period.

[Monica Padman]

You got Jordan there.

[Dax Shepard]

He followed Jordan. Right. Jordan came before you.

[Monica Padman]

That's kind of what I wanted.

[Billy Crudup]

Jordan did come before.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, he kind of followed Jordan.

[Billy Crudup]

That reminds me of another story, but I'll save that one. So my grandfather took it upon himself to say, we're going to have lunch every week at the same restaurant, Top of the Hill. It was not Top of the Hill. It was the Rat Skeller, which is sort of underground and was a restaurant when he was at Chapel hill in the 40s and was a restaurant when my dad was at Chapel hill in the 60s.

[Dax Shepard]

And your dad's a third?

[Billy Crudup]

My dad's the third. My brother's the fourth.

[Dax Shepard]

So a lot of tradition happening here.

[Billy Crudup]

There certainly was for a while, actually. I did. Finding your roots with Skip. Have you done that?

[Dax Shepard]

I did it.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah. It's pretty incredible. I mean, it's a very unique experience. I confess the way that I processed it. When he showed me the family tree, which dated back to Charlemagne in 700, something, whatever, France, Gaul, which means, essentially, I come from a long line of bureaucrats because they all filled out the paperwork. Marriage certificates, death certificates, birth certificates. That's how he can trace all that stuff.

[Dax Shepard]

You're right.

[Billy Crudup]

So I didn't feel any particular pride.

[Dax Shepard]

Did he say that's the farthest back he's been able to get someone?

[Billy Crudup]

No. And it turns out most people are a descendant of Charlemagne.

[Dax Shepard]

Like Genghis Khan.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah. I felt great about it until I looked it up. It's like, oh, you're one of 600 million. The tree of Europeans coming from Charlemagne. But because both of my parents were only children, didn't have aunts and uncles and cousins stuff, there wasn't much history.

[Dax Shepard]

You were curious.

[Billy Crudup]

I was very curious. So I also thought it would be just a wonderful opportunity for my family to have. And trust me, it was replete with bad stories. They're Americans through and through. The first people that got here, late 17th century, early 18th century, there were slave owners, there were Congress people, there were people who fought on both sides of the Civil War, people who were in POW camps. He showed me a picture of one of the POW camps. Confederate people who were held in the Union. Confederate Camps. I'm thinking this is why I inherited it. But my parents and grandparents seem to insist that civics was a part of your responsibility as an American.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

I was on the student council and that kind of stuff as a boy Scout. Not a great one.

[Dax Shepard]

Sure.

[Monica Padman]

A couple badges.

[Billy Crudup]

More than a couple badges. I particularly like knot tying.

[Dax Shepard]

Do you have the knife?

[Billy Crudup]

I had all the gear. I'm sure it's in a box somewhere. I would love to find it.

[Dax Shepard]

Give would like to get his hands on that stuff. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Mail it on over.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't know about that.

[Billy Crudup]

I'm not convinced of it.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't want to do too long on it. But here's the other thing. So it's like you're going to go in there and you're going to find out you're related to someone historically famous.

[Billy Crudup]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

To which I'm like, I don't feel any ownership over. I'm not proud. And then they hit you with your family owned slaves.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And then conversely, I don't feel guilty about that. I don't know what to do with that info. I didn't own slaves.

[Billy Crudup]

You didn't?

[Dax Shepard]

No.

[Billy Crudup]

No. But it's put on you as if.

[Dax Shepard]

You got to now process like, fuck. I come from people who own slaves.

[Billy Crudup]

I think of it similarly, but not the same. Which is if you want to understand a bit of what this strange experiment of America is called, which is so different than most other countries.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

There's not a pluralistic democracy that has a GDP like we do. A very interesting strange thing that has all sorts of consequen that we're seeing right now. And a lot of it is about trying to understand, well, what is it people were trying to do maybe collectively or separately, why were they fighting about it? Why did we have to come together about it? Why did we have wars about it? And my son and I were talking about it quite a bit during the lockdown and it was a way to sort of study what this country in general writ large is trying to do by focusing on your lineage.

[Monica Padman]

So I like that.

[Billy Crudup]

I didn't feel a responsibility to any of the great stuff. I did feel attendant to being an American for whatever reason. I think that's important.

[Dax Shepard]

I wish I had talked to you before I did it because your pitch of it just now is so succinct. It's like you wrote it a month ago.

[Billy Crudup]

That's my thing is I write stuff, I memorize them, I put on other people's clothes and I pretend it's Myself.

[Dax Shepard]

But now back to Grandpa taking you to the restaurant.

[Billy Crudup]

He was angry. He was a pretty impressive amateur athlete in high school in North Carolina. He set records in track and field, in football, and in boxing. Records that stood for 30 or 40 years.

[Dax Shepard]

Wow.

[Billy Crudup]

He was a tough guy. And then he went to World War II and the bombers. He was the radio guy. And the thing blew up in his ear and made him deaf.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh.

[Billy Crudup]

And I'm not sure if his just general vibe was anger. He was tough on my dad. My dad was an only child, so he did not take kindly. Back to your question before about my dad working for a competitor.

[Dax Shepard]

Would they get into it at, like, Christmas?

[Billy Crudup]

They got into it all the time. It was a lot of passive aggressive kind of stuff. When I was at school, going to lunch with him. Then I was in the middle because my dad, he wasn't terribly reliable financially. He's a fascinating guy. Totally charming.

[Monica Padman]

Is he with us?

[Billy Crudup]

He's not with us. He died in 2005. The same age as my grandmother. Died at 63. They both smoked and, you know, my dad liked palm oils.

[Dax Shepard]

My dad, 62 Vantage Menthol 100.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah. So his whole body went cancer. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He didn't want to mention the lung cancer part of it because then that would mean he had some responsibility in it. So he would always talk about the blood and the brain and the bone and all the other ones, but it was also lung cancer. He was really a lovely person. I liked being around him. A huge dreamer. There was no obstacle that couldn't be overcome. Frame things a little differently. But that also meant he was kind of divorced from reality. It also, I think, stemmed from his father being punitive towards him. Growing up, my dad felt like he had hit the jackpot in order to be a success. Because my grandfather's way of loving was to toughen you up. Every lunch with me started with, all right, what are you screwing up now?

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow. Yeah. Luckily the list was long.

[Billy Crudup]

It didn't help, by the way, that my first semester I had a 1.7 GPA. I had to learn a few things about college. If you don't go to a class, you should probably drop it rather than taking the zero. Yeah. You know, you do that a couple of times. Doesn't matter if you make A's in the other ones. The average works out. But my grandfather did that to my father growing up. It planted the seed that my dad was never good enough. So my dad had the inclination to pay him back with major success. I think that was internally what was going on with my dad. But that never happens to people.

[Dax Shepard]

Right?

[Billy Crudup]

You just don't hit the jackpot. You have to grind out of life. And occasionally a door opens, you get a ray of sunshine, then it closes.

[Dax Shepard]

Jackpots happen, but with the odds of the lottery precisely. You're looking at, lyrically speaking.

[Billy Crudup]

Yes. You go, all right, I've got about 20 more million tries and then I'm.

[Dax Shepard]

Going to hit it.

[Billy Crudup]

Right, right. My dad, each time he pulled in, he's like, here we go.

[Dax Shepard]

This is the one.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah, I know it. Anybody else here have coins? You know, and so his whole thing. Anybody else here have coins? That is how we grew. So the lights would go out and in the dark you'd hear, oh, damn it. My mom would go, tommy. And he would go, ah, the mail, his postal system. I sent that dang check. Very difficult for him to take responsibility. So consequently, when my grandfather and I were having lunch, often my dad hadn't paid the bills. I'm going to place part of the blame of this on my father. My 1.7 GPA. When he told me he had paid the tuition, so I was preregistered. That was in fact not true. So when I went to pre registration in order to get the classes that you might, might attend as a freshman, like anything after nine, they were all gone. So I ended up with a slate of 8am tough classes. That happens twice a year. And there were lots of other bills to pay. My dad was constantly saying he had paid them. My grandfather was extremely reliable and he was there for lunch laying on the horn.

[Dax Shepard]

This is the exact same dynamic, by the way. My papa Bob worked at Wonder Bread Bakery 45 years. Saved everything.

[Billy Crudup]

How was your grandfather?

[Dax Shepard]

My grandfather, my dad's dad played by the rules, plodded along and was safe. And my dad was a car salesman. He started many, many businesses. He went bankrupt many times. Yes, he owed my grandpa money. Is. But then my dad would make a ton of money and start buying a lot of stuff and he would never pay anything back.

[Billy Crudup]

My dad never made any money. That would be the difference.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, you never made any.

[Billy Crudup]

He was a hustler, so he knew how to survive enough because he was.

[Dax Shepard]

A salesman of fabric, but also he was a bookie.

[Billy Crudup]

Here's what happened. And again, this is conjecture on my. Because I didn't get to ask my dad this, but my younger brother was very close with my dad. I think my dad was making up for lost time with my younger brother and they became very close when my Younger brother was in college in Austin and they would have lunch every week. He intimated at a certain point about correspondence to organized crime at a certain point in our lives. That being said, when you were in the garment district in New York in the late 60s, early 70s, it was replete with mob guys. And my dad thought they were awesome.

[Monica Padman]

Sure.

[Billy Crudup]

So he liked to dress like them, he liked to gamble, he was a bookie, was a loan shark. He carried a gun, you know. Yeah, great. This is my mom to the funeral of one of the mob bosses. And my mom, who was like a debutante from South Florida.

[Monica Padman]

That's what I was going to ask.

[Billy Crudup]

Was like, tommy, what are we doing here?

[Dax Shepard]

Whose funeral is this?

[Billy Crudup]

And I was like, ah, this is great. We got Junior over there. Bingo. Slim Jims over there.

[Dax Shepard]

Uhhuh.

[Billy Crudup]

He was a wise guy. Funeral.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

And so that started my dad's relationship with this sort of alternate economic system.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, what reminded me is you have a story about him taking you to something, but he's got to stop and collect.

[Billy Crudup]

Yes. Someone owes him money. That's right.

[Dax Shepard]

But he's got to also pick up his dude.

[Billy Crudup]

That's right. His heavy. Mr. O. Mr. O. Yeah. After the second time, my parents got divorced because they were divorced, then remarried to each other, then divorced again.

[Dax Shepard]

How long was the gap?

[Billy Crudup]

They were divorced when I was six and then they remarried each other when I was nine.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Billy Crudup]

Divorced again when I was 12.

[Dax Shepard]

What a ride.

[Billy Crudup]

My mom and dad adored each other. My dad could not not keep it together.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

And he was divorced for the second time now and had a singles apartment in Dallas, Texas, because really quick, you.

[Dax Shepard]

Live in New York till 8 and then in 8 you moved it.

[Billy Crudup]

We moved down to south Florida at 6 because my mom was from there after they got divorced the first time. So we were in Miami. I went to three different schools there. First, second and third grade. Not because I was kicked out of them, because of my grades. I could feel the judgment. Just need a different school for each of those grades. And then we moved to Dallas where the new business opportunities were. He was opening a company. I think this one was Coffee Elite. It was a coffee additive that they would sell to like prisons. To turn one pound of coffee into ten pounds of coffee.

[Dax Shepard]

That was like cutting Coke. It was the baby last year was a coffee exactly 10% accident.

[Billy Crudup]

Coffee Elite was not so elite. It was just a front for his booking operation.

[Dax Shepard]

And when he get you excited, like he was too. Cuz like when my dad had new business, we'd Be the first person he pitched. I'd be like, we're going to be rich.

[Billy Crudup]

The inflatable ice chest, the Brockabrella.

[Dax Shepard]

Good products.

[Billy Crudup]

He did have an interest in marketing. So he would try to buy the patents for products that had underperformed in the marketplace and try to remarket them in a different way. He was just never successful from a financial perspective.

[Dax Shepard]

Sure. Evaluating it by how much money quantifiably.

[Billy Crudup]

Whether or not you can pay your bills or she would say, make or not. He did not.

[Dax Shepard]

He did make his nut often, but.

[Billy Crudup]

He always thought that he was going to hit a home run. He got cancer when he was about 61, went into remission, and at that point he realized that I was having some success in my career. So he was always wanting to partner on a new business venture. And, you know, I would send him checks from time to time just if he needed to make ends meet. But I was like, dad, I'm not a business guy. Not saying. And if I was, I would not be in business with you.

[Dax Shepard]

Even with my minimal acumen in business. I know not.

[Billy Crudup]

I'm thinking of the red and the black. It feels like you're mostly in the red stop sign for business. He was often asking if I wanted to be a part of a business. And by this point, after he had gone into remission, to his way of thinking or the way that he would tell the story, he had somebody at the Vatican who had endorsed. Do you remember those old box sets.

[Dax Shepard]

Of cassettes, like self help ones?

[Billy Crudup]

It could be self help where you would buy a set of 40 cassettes and they would be in like a briefcase. And so his was the Bible, Old Testament and New Testament in Spanish that he was going to sell to Central and South American countries because it was endorsed by the Vatican. And so I was like, so you're taking advantage of people's faith. I don't think that's something I am going to partner with. But since you've never paid me back for any of the money I've given before, how about I structure a loan for you? I structured a loan. He set the terms. The first payment came due, he defaulted on the loan, declared bankruptcy, listed me as one of the creditors, and died six months later. And when I got the letter, he was like, that doesn't mean a thing.

[Dax Shepard]

It speaks to his optimism that he's taking the time to file bankruptcy with six months left. Like, just let it rip. You're going to die. Who gives a shit about the collector?

[Billy Crudup]

Well, even when he was in hospice, I remember he was withered. You could barely hear a whisper. But if you could make it out, he was saying, I'm going to beat it. And you're like, oh, man, buddy. I mean, it's just whatever he needed.

[Dax Shepard]

To hold on to.

[Monica Padman]

Of course you're laughing now, but were you laughing then or were you so angry about it?

[Billy Crudup]

It's a great question because I was angry when I got to be an adult. But when I was younger, the times that were scary were the drunk driving times. My brother at 13 or 14 had to take over the wheel. Those things were not fun. But the guns and all and the colorful people and the new ventures, I mean, we went to flea market after flea market. We were always finding these new products. There was constant optimism. And occasionally he would be on the right side of the line as a bookie. It was not a very good bookie, which is really bonkers because it seems like that's a lock to play the house in those. In any case, I think it's probably he's gambling on the side.

[Dax Shepard]

Just make sure the bets are equal.

[Billy Crudup]

Back to the jackpot thing. I made ten grand this year. I'll put it on red. Why not turn it into 20? Yeah, or lose it all. He had a riot shotgun next to his bed and his instructions were, all right, don't go near that.

[Monica Padman]

Right, right.

[Billy Crudup]

So it didn't feel totally dangerous. But as I got older, obviously, and was in a relationship myself, I began to see how his lack of self reflection and his inability to take responsibility was not a virtue in a mentor.

[Dax Shepard]

But also you are paying the ultimate price, which is like you're moving non stop.

[Billy Crudup]

It sounds like I went to nine different schools by the time I finished high school.

[Dax Shepard]

Right, so you were probably buffeted by having two brothers. You're in the middle. If you're an only child in this scenario, you're probably pretty fucked up.

[Billy Crudup]

And the three of us, we were posse and you just look at each.

[Dax Shepard]

Other and you're like, all right, this is batshit crazy. Right? And as long as they both, both agree this is batshit crazy, somehow we're good now.

[Billy Crudup]

It definitely helped. And, you know, we all had our different way of developing our understanding of our father later, but when we were younger, we just revered him. I found a journal, like 1981. I must have been, I guess, 12 in it. And I'm talking about how my dad's a winner, how being a winner is the most important thing in the world. And I'm so proud of my dad because he is the ultimate winner. You know, he just had that energy about it.

[Monica Padman]

I do think there's a moment though, that people hit, which you obviously hit at some point. I hit it recently with someone in my life who was sort of a mentor when I was younger and it was like, oh my God, this person's so great. And then you hit adulthood and you realize the reason they were so great is because they were your age mentally. And then once you pass them, you can start seeing.

[Billy Crudup]

What a great observation.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, actually that's just very immature. That's very childlike.

[Billy Crudup]

Right.

[Monica Padman]

And then that's very disappointing to feel.

[Billy Crudup]

It is. That's perfectly said. I totally agree. Also too, when you get to be the age they were when they were parenting you and you realize, oh, I don't think I would have done that. That's a really risky thing to do. Obviously, it was a different period of time. They were smoking in the car, no seat belts, cooler in the back seat, feeding in Miller High life while the windows are up. My poor older brother, he never smoked, but boy, was he exposed to a lot of second hand smoke. Because I smoked when I first started acting out of nerves and because I guess my parents smoked and my younger brother smoked too. But my older brother, he was just around it all the time.

[Monica Padman]

He might as well have just started smoking 100.

[Billy Crudup]

Why not think that considering how young they were when they were making these mistakes, you have both a kind of appreciation and empathy for them. And also it's exasperating.

[Dax Shepard]

How were you dealing with the starting new schools? Nonstop.

[Billy Crudup]

It was extremely helpful that my older brother Tommy, we were a year apart in school. He was a year and a half older, but he was a junior when I was a sophomore and he always set the table.

[Dax Shepard]

Was he a stud?

[Billy Crudup]

He entered St. Thomas. Well, we both entered St. Thomas Aquinas in 1984. So he entered the school as a junior and was the senior class president.

[Dax Shepard]

As a senior so he could find his footing.

[Billy Crudup]

And so when I walked into the classroom was always like, oh, you're Tommy's brother.

[Dax Shepard]

Was he handsome and tough?

[Billy Crudup]

Yes, both of those.

[Dax Shepard]

Both of those.

[Billy Crudup]

Catcher on the baseball team.

[Dax Shepard]

You had it made.

[Billy Crudup]

When my career started to have some success, he was working as a publicist at mgm. He had been tending bar on the Upper east side. Mad Hatter, it's the name of the place. I waited tables there in the summer. A woman who was regular there said, you're not working here anymore. You're going to come to MGM and be my assistant. As just by the force of his own personality, you know. And so he starts as a publicist. And when I would go to these premieres or I'd have some event, Tommy would be there bulldozing the crowd. He's like, I'm taking care of Billy here. You know, you want to talk to that person, don't talk to that person.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, fun.

[Billy Crudup]

And he's just that kind of guy. So that was one thing that really helped. The other thing was because it started very early in our lives, adaptability and this sort of carnival life felt very familiar.

[Dax Shepard]

What it sounds like is you either adjust and you can do it or it destroys you.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah. And I think your point about having siblings, the three of us were aligned, really looked after each other. And certainly my mom as the consistent one who had to make the money and go to PTA meetings and be involved. Back to the civics thing. She was involved in the community. She did the lion's share of mentoring and responsibility.

[Dax Shepard]

I grew up very similarly. And then I lived in this first apartment I had for 10 or 11 years. And I lived in the next house for 16 years and never wanted to leave.

[Billy Crudup]

The apartment that I've had in New York I've had for 20 years.

[Dax Shepard]

Right. Were you a freak? Like, I was a freak about my bedroom. My bedroom had to be the same.

[Billy Crudup]

I did not renovate until I was in a relationship with Naomi. Occasionally I would do things like build bunk beds for my son or try to fix all of the problems myself or install the appliances myself. And I did not want things changing. And I think at a certain point, Naomi realized that there was a slight indentation in the couch where I watched my baseball games for long enough to put an indentation in the couch. When she would walk into my apartment, it was like her eyes would bleed. You know, she's really interested in design. And frankly, my son and I were the occupants of that apartment. It was for us, you know, the reason we had a couch like that is because we like watching movies together. It all seemed incredibly comfortable. And a lot of the stuff I had this thing somewhat sentimental. And sometimes it kind of sneaks up on me in the ways that I'm sentimental. Like I said, I had a very close relationship with my grandfather. And when he passed away, nobody really had room for a lot of this stuff except for me. I took the sheriff and put some of it in storage and then kept some of it in my apartment. They had these beautiful glass blown lamps. They reminded me of my grandparents house and of him and they were just kind of romantic looking but they were sitting in my closet it in my new apartment 20 years ago and at a certain point I said I think I should hang these on the wall.

[Dax Shepard]

Sure.

[Billy Crudup]

And so I got some.

[Monica Padman]

But they're not a sconce.

[Dax Shepard]

They weren't plugged in the decoration.

[Billy Crudup]

And I realized if you looked at it a certain angle that you could imagine those lamps in a two story house. That one might be in the den downstairs and that one might be back up in the bedroom. So I think I was trying to bring in some of to everybody else they were like what in the fuck are those lamps doing on the wal? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

What are they doing up there?

[Billy Crudup]

No, not the actor, he's the lamps guy.

[Dax Shepard]

Do you find that you read up on the wall there and you need a lamp right there?

[Billy Crudup]

I did have this idea of getting an electrician to put in plugs so that I can put them in, but I never got around to that. So to your point, I wanted for my son to have some stability and consistency. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

[Dax Shepard]

We are supported by Alexa. All right, let me tell you about something I'm genuinely excited to talk about the all new Alexa Plus. Look, we're all juggling a million things these days and this thing is designed to actually make your life easier. It's like having a conversation with someone who really gets what you need. Picture this. You're planning a night out and Instead of opening 12 different apps, you just have one conversation with Alexa. And it handles everything. Dinner reservations, entertainment, the works. It learns your style and puts thousands of services at your fingertips. What I love about this concept is how natural it feels. You're not barking commands, you're just talking. And it works across your compatible devices. Echo, Fire TV and more. It's your all new smart, proactive AI assistant. And honestly, the idea of having AI that actually anticipates what you need, that sounds pretty amazing to me. Check it [e-mail] new Alexa this message is brought to you by Apple Card. It's a great time to apply for an Apple Card. You'll love earning up to 3% unlimited daily cash back on every purchase and no fees period. Through this special referral offer. When you get a new Apple Card, you can earn bonus daily cash. To qualify, you must apply at Apple Co getdailycash Apple Card issued by Goldman.

[Billy Crudup]

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[Dax Shepard]

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[Billy Crudup]

Terms and limitations apply.

[Dax Shepard]

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[Monica Padman]

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[Dax Shepard]

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[Monica Padman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

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[Billy Crudup]

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[Dax Shepard]

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[Billy Crudup]

I'm sure I wanted it for myself too, you know.

[Dax Shepard]

Did you pay any price for all that moving?

[Billy Crudup]

I would say I benefited.

[Dax Shepard]

When do you start acting in high school?

[Billy Crudup]

Even before that actually at camp, anytime time somebody said does anybody in this class want to put on a costume? I'd be like, yep, I'll do that. That's not a problem. That was for the new guy. I was the new guy trying to fit in and class clown was my angle.

[Dax Shepard]

Nice.

[Billy Crudup]

And so anytime I got a part in anything, I was happy to humiliate myself for it.

[Dax Shepard]

Did it do anything, though, as far as preventing you from creating deep friendships.

[Billy Crudup]

I have some lasting friendships from the time I was born to my oldest, best friend, ray Phil Benrod, 4th grade, Dallas, Texas. We're still extremely tight. Had dinner with him two weeks ago. And still have fantastic friends from high school and college.

[Dax Shepard]

Because back then you moved ultimately to Fort Lauderdale. You can't call your buddies in Texas because it's too much money to make sure. Like, I don't think young people realize that, like, you couldn't talk on the phone.

[Billy Crudup]

I became possessive of those friendships. I realized that people around me had been friends since first grade. And when I started to see that, I would reach out to Rafe when we reconnected in high school, and then when I was in college and subsequently thereafter. You'd have periods of time where, you know, you build different friendships. But it was really important to me to return to those friendships. So in a way, it did build a skill of attending to your friendships in whatever way you can, you know.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, that's.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, it was going to require effort if it was going to be maintained, and you did.

[Billy Crudup]

And it also gave me an incredible opportunity to live different kinds of ways in America. There were times when things were great and we were living in a nice house somewhere, and there were times when things were not so great and it was a little precarious between Texas and Florida and North Carolina and New York. I've lived in a lot of different ways in this country, and I think it's a beautiful country in that way. And to get to experience the different kinds of people in that way, albeit not always great for a child growing up, it definitely had its virtues. So I think that's another reason I have incredible affection for this place and the people in it.

[Dax Shepard]

How do you pick North Carolina? Just because of Grandpa and Dad?

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah, exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

Because if I had left New York and then I was in Texas and then Fort Lauderdale, I feel like I would be like, I need to get back to New York.

[Billy Crudup]

Well, interesting. We left New York when I was six and we were on Long Island. So I only have kind of frosty memories. I didn't feel in possession of New York. We weren't in Manhattan. It was like another kind of place. And if you go to Carolina, you're gonna have all sorts of Carolina swag up in your house. And so my grandfather and my dad had signs, you know, indoctrinating you. The propaganda.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

If God wasn't a Tar Heel, then why is the sky Carolina blue? You know, that kind of stuff.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, good point too.

[Billy Crudup]

Is it by the way?

[Monica Padman]

Great point.

[Dax Shepard]

Hard to beat that.

[Billy Crudup]

So there was a kind of mystique surrounding that university and my brother ended up going to Texas Tech. And so it was sort of left to me to carry that tradition. Truthfully, I did not get in on my own merits. I was a part of a legacy group. I know full well how this country works, frankly. On the legacy.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Billy Crudup]

I am a benefactor of it. And it really started to haunt me at school because 85% of the student body was instinct state. And so getting in from out of state was really difficult. And I was a good student and I was very active in sports. I was on the student council. I did all the things that you're a good do. I was a well rounded student, but still definitely not good enough.

[Monica Padman]

So hard to get into that school.

[Billy Crudup]

So hard to get in. And because my dad and granddad went there and because my dad knew somebody at the admissions, I'm certain the reason that I got in, I did not like that at all. I felt like a fraud when it started to really, really dawn on me.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, really?

[Billy Crudup]

And I think that was a part of me branching out and saying, I'm going to cut my own pat an actor. And that's why I got my masters. I paid for it.

[Dax Shepard]

This is fascinating. You weren't floundering there though, right?

[Billy Crudup]

No, I was thriving, actually. I mean, I loved it.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, that's an interesting thing you focused in on. I would feel that way if I got there and then I was an embarrassment and I wasn't rising to the level everyone else was on.

[Billy Crudup]

But if I was thriving, I was grateful for it. But I realized as well that there was another candidate out there that was probably more qualified that didn't get it. Yeah, I saw it up close and personal. So when I decided to go and get my Masters, I was mostly hedging my bets because I realized that there was nobody in my family that was in the entertainment business. I have any reason to think that you could actually have a career. And most of the mentors in my life were teachers. And so I thought I would really love a life as a teacher. I really love performing, so I would love a life as a teacher of acting. Oh, interesting.

[Dax Shepard]

So when you went and got your Masters, you were mostly thinking, well, I'll teach acting.

[Billy Crudup]

I was, I was hedging my bets. I would like to act professionally, but since nobody does, again, you're rebelling now.

[Dax Shepard]

Against your dad, which is like, I'm.

[Billy Crudup]

Going to be ult Realistic, correctly. I'm going to be responsible. I wanted to pay for my applications, you know, $50 fee here, $100 fee there. I wanted to drive to the auditions. I wanted to get in on my own merits if I got in anywhere. When I got into school at nyu, that felt like an enormous accomplishment in the way that Carolina did not feel like an enormous accomplishment, even though I still had to survive at school and do as well as I could. So that was a big part of me establishing my own sense of self.

[Dax Shepard]

You were in the Tish school?

[Billy Crudup]

Yes. It's called the grad acting program because the undergraduate is the Tisch School and they're all a part of Tisch, but the undergraduate has three or four separate acting components. And the graduate program is a conservatory style program where there's 20 people in each class and you have three years and. And you just spend day and night studying voice, speech, text, movement.

[Dax Shepard]

Kristen went to Tisch undergrad.

[Billy Crudup]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

And she did Alexander technique breathing into people's mouths. And the young men are wearing sweatpants. And people have.

[Billy Crudup]

You're not breathing into people's mouths, man. I don't know where you got that.

[Monica Padman]

She says it every day and it drives me nuts. That is not true.

[Billy Crudup]

That is not what you do with the Alexander technique. It's just a way to find a neutral spot so you can process air through your lungs and create a good, good reliable sound with your voice.

[Dax Shepard]

A nice consistent voice.

[Monica Padman]

It's one of the best Alexander techniques really worked out.

[Billy Crudup]

Breathe into each other's mouths. I know the sweatpants is dead, right. And we had this incredible Alexander teacher whose name will come to me in a second, but he had like four acolytes. Is that the right word? The people who followed underneath him. And so you would typically not get with the grand master of Alexander. You spend most of your time with the other person. But occasionally you'd get a session with him. Sometimes he'll do table work where he'll try to help you align to your spine. You're trying to figure out how you naturally hold your body so you can find a more neutral place of starting and then build a character from there. And so he'll be like doing some work on you. And you're lying there trying to readjust yourself and breathing, and he'll listen to your breath. He put his head on my chest at one point.

[Dax Shepard]

Now we're getting somewhere.

[Monica Padman]

No.

[Billy Crudup]

And then I hear, oh, no. And I start laughing.

[Dax Shepard]

He felt asleep.

[Billy Crudup]

The laugh fink, welcome up. And he goes and take A breath in.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, that's what's even worse, Monica, than I said. It's calling to sleep on each other while you're breathing each other's mouths is like sleeping with each other.

[Billy Crudup]

We didn't breathe into each other's mouth.

[Monica Padman]

There's no breathing into each other's mouths. I also study theater, so I take some umbrage with this because I did not breathe into anyone's mouth. This is funny. My Rafe. That's his name, right?

[Dax Shepard]

Y.

[Billy Crudup]

You got it right.

[Monica Padman]

My Rafe is Cali, and she actually is in marketing at Netflix, and she did the J. Kelly trailer. This all circles.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, you're kidding.

[Monica Padman]

Yes. But she brought up the other day that in one of my acting classes, I have no memory of this, but I had to wear a mask. Like a blanket.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, yeah, sure, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Mask work, sure.

[Dax Shepard]

That's mask work 101.

[Billy Crudup]

Neutral mask, we call that.

[Monica Padman]

That's right. We had to wear it around campus. We had to be.

[Billy Crudup]

Wait, where was this?

[Monica Padman]

University of Georgia.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow.

[Billy Crudup]

So you're a bulldog.

[Monica Padman]

Yep.

[Dax Shepard]

But her mask. Her mask liked Alabama.

[Billy Crudup]

No roll time.

[Monica Padman]

The mask is neutral. That's a killed at Georgia. If you walk around with us. She was like, no. We would try to find you on campus while you were walking around in.

[Dax Shepard]

Your mask at you.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, and they wanted to, like, distract me, but I had to not pay attention and be neutral.

[Dax Shepard]

Could you not remember walking around campus with a mask? I know.

[Billy Crudup]

No, that's. I mean, that's like hazing stuff.

[Monica Padman]

It is.

[Billy Crudup]

Acting is already so humiliating.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, it's so embarrassing.

[Billy Crudup]

It's not a bad idea in general to get you used to the idea of rejection, which was a common denominator for your life. For the rest of your life.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Anyway, I was pretty impressed with myself because I was like, man, I was committed.

[Billy Crudup]

You don't even remember.

[Dax Shepard]

You were so in character. You weren't even imprinting memories. Yeah, Monica's brain was offline.

[Billy Crudup]

Man, I do remember neutral mask work. Okay, so it's good stuff.

[Dax Shepard]

This is really great and a bit informative to my broader questions about your path. But you're not hell bent on being a professional actor.

[Billy Crudup]

I wasn't until the first day of acting. School. School, when you have something called showings where the incoming class does the monologues that they did to get into school. And this is the first year, second year and third year. The second year does seam work and the third year does whatever they end up doing, whether it's a personal piece or seam work. When I Saw a collection of 60 other young people who were actually invested and interested in a craft. And I saw the shit that they were doing. I thought, oh no, that's exactly what doing I'm to do. I just needed to be around people who were taking it seriously. Now, at the time I was targeted to get my masters, etc, but there was no question that they rung a bell in me.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, now it wasn't a pipe dream. It was a reality that was observable in all these other people. Maybe it didn't seem so clear that was it.

[Billy Crudup]

And you know, at Carolina, I wasn't a theater major, even though I did theater because I knew my dad and my grandfather would not accept that. So I was a speech communications major. What the hell did that mean? You know, it meant you took class in broadcasting and marketing and rhetoric. But they also, they had a performance studies concentration. So I could take classes like oral interpretation of prose and poetry. My dad thinks I'm doing marketing, but meanwhile I'm figuring out how to do like a James Joyce short story as a performance. I'm having a ball. You're doing monologues, I'm doing monologues and getting A's. Most importantly to make up for that not so stellar 1.7 GPA. Yeah. Then we started to write the shit ship. So I did a lot of performing and I also did work in the theater department there, where there were two teachers there, Susanna Reinhardt and Dede Corvinus. I took Introduction to Acting with them and they were like, you can sign up for whatever class you want. You have such an interest in this and you have so much energy. I took the whole slew of classes in the acting department and I did performances there. So I was around a lot of people. But we were undergraduates and you're in North Carolina. In North Carolina, it was, you know, Playmakers has a great repertory theater and they produce really good work. But it wasn't the same kind of thing as seeing these hyper ambitious, focused, obviously professionally talented people. Robin Weigert, who's a fantastic actor, she did this monologue that she wrote that was an imagined discussion between. I hope I'm getting it right. But I think it was Gertrude Stein and Pablo Picasso and she was like Meryl Streep and she was in my class. Yeah, I just never seen anything like that. It was incredible.

[Dax Shepard]

So you graduated in 94 and then you get your first big Broadway plays. 96.

[Billy Crudup]

94. Actually, it was about six months after I graduated school. I landed a part in a Tom Stoppard play Arcadia. Arcadia, Yep. That was at Lincoln Center.

[Dax Shepard]

Were you shocked to have success that quickly after graduating?

[Billy Crudup]

Definitely. And my friends and colleagues made sure to make me feel like I should be shocked. Yeah, everybody was extremely happy for me.

[Dax Shepard]

Now I'm a philistine, but I understand Tom Stoppard is what everyone has a boner for. Like all my friends that are super into acting, he's the dude. You've done a couple?

[Billy Crudup]

I have. His writing is just unusual. He's got a fascinating mind and English is his second language, or maybe his third or fourth. I'm not sure. I think he was born in Czechoslovakia. His attendance to language is just unusual. He thinks on different levels at the same time. And he was actually there for rehearsals. Trevor N. Was directing it. I used to watch these tapes called Acting Shakespeare. They were like VHS tapes that had the Rural Shakespeare Company. And Trevor Nunn was the youngest at that time, I think. Artistic director of the Royal Shakespeare Company, talking about monologues. And it was like Ian McKellen and Patrick Stewart, Anthony Hopkins, Bob Hoskins, Helen Mirren, just badasses. And so all of a sudden, this guy that I was watching in high school talk about about text and language and how to lift it and perform it and celebrate it was directing me in this Tom Stopper play and Tom Stoppard's there. So Tom Stoppard, back to the point about his use of language. I tried to say very little because I did not want to get fired. And I was like, sorry, Tom, is that a double entendre there? And you go, perhaps. Or maybe a triple. Could be quadruple if you take the time.

[Dax Shepard]

What do I do with that?

[Billy Crudup]

It's incredible. I'm like, is that playable? He's like, no, definitely not. What if you were asking, oh my God. I mean, just a brilliant, brilliant mind. And that character in particular, he's like this tutor to this 13 year old math prodigy. He wants to be Byron. He thinks of himself, he's like, ah, I'm a tutor. And so like he's got to make all of his jokes to himself, but the audience gets to share in that. So he's a great conduit for the audience and he's a romantic figure. And then he dies saving her. That's like winning the lottery, that part. You come out of school into the professional life as this hero, this incredibly articulate, beautifully dressed Byronic hero.

[Dax Shepard]

Dangerous.

[Billy Crudup]

First hit, definitely nowhere to go but down from there.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, that'll get you hooked.

[Billy Crudup]

We Had a cast. Robert Shawn Leonard, Victor Garber, Paul Giamatti, Jenny Dundas. Fantastic actors up and down the line. So there was a great support system in it.

[Dax Shepard]

Now when you're doing that and it's working, it's heaven. Are you content or are you like, I want to do movies. Where are we at and where we think is next?

[Billy Crudup]

I wasn't thinking about that. No. The sort of training that I had implicitly or explicitly was suggesting that it might be a good idea to take as many different kinds of parts as possible so that you will build some level of versatility to combat the periods of time where you are uncastable, which just happens. So. So I was interested in the parts and it didn't matter to me whether or not they were in film or on the stage. I discovered pretty quickly though that television scared me because I had auditioned for. It was a new show, it was a pilot. They wanted me to do a screen test. And I was in New York and I was standing on the corner think 57th and 6th on the pay phone with my new agent, Philip Carlson. And he was telling me that I had to sign a deal. And I was like, cool, what does that mean? And he goes, well, this deal is a seven year deal. And I'm like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Seven year deal for what? He's like, the show. I'm like, but I don't have the part. And I'm right. They don't want to fly you out unless you're going to do it if they cast you. And I'm like, do what? I read one scene. How will I know what it is that I'm going to do?

[Dax Shepard]

You're going to do this scene for the next.

[Billy Crudup]

I'm going to do this scene for the next seven years. That's not going to be great for the whole versatility game. That scared the shit out of me. And I kind of stopped. I was lucky enough to make enough money to cover my expenses.

[Dax Shepard]

You're nut.

[Billy Crudup]

My nut, as my dad would say. I was ready to do that. Not to make money, but I was lucky enough to make enough money.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, so when you get in sleepers because the play's 94, Sleepers is 96. And just to remind everyone who's in sleepers, because you might have forgotten, it's Brad Pitt, it's Kevin Bacon, it's Robert.

[Billy Crudup]

Dairo, Dustin Hoffman, Jason Patrick, Minnie Driver.

[Monica Padman]

What?

[Billy Crudup]

Directed by Barry Levinson, who made some the of of my favorite films. Oh, the Baltimore trilogy, Avalon. Phenomenal.

[Dax Shepard]

What could Be more exciting.

[Billy Crudup]

Nothing. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

How do we compute that? Like, first plays a Tom Stopper and then our first movie is like De Niro and Hoffman.

[Billy Crudup]

I was hitting myself.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Were you intimidated?

[Billy Crudup]

It was Jason Patrick, Brad Pitt, Ron El Dard and myself who were supposed to be four buddies. And then we got sent to juvie and not treated with. Well, Ron, El Dard and myself. Our characters did not turn out well. We became a part of the Westies. We were all molested and beaten. So Brad Pitt was able to get out of it in some way. Jason Patrick was able to get out of it in some way, but Ron and I got caught up in it. In any case, we were paired up for most of the scenes. He had a very similar approach to acting that I did. We were really acting nerds. That was a safety net for me. We talked shop a lot, sat there, marveled over De Niro on the stand playing a scene. You know, we could barely hear him and watching him work.

[Dax Shepard]

Did you have the type of personality? Did you try to talk to these folks between takes?

[Billy Crudup]

No, I mean, Dustin Hoffman, he played our lawyer, so he would talk to us. And he was extremely entertaining. Often trying to steal our lines, I might add. Justin, not his first roadie, but he was incredibly charming. And my mom came to set one day and he made this big thing of like jumping over the. You call them benches or what's in the courtroom where the people sit. I know I want to say PE but it sounds kind of churchy.

[Dax Shepard]

It is.

[Billy Crudup]

Well, he leap frogged over them and it was like. What's her name? George Geor. My mom was out of her skull. She still has the picture of me and Dustin and her from that day.

[Monica Padman]

So what a moment.

[Billy Crudup]

That was an amazing moment. There were lots of aspects of that that were novel in a way that you can't describe and you're trying not to fuck it up. I don't know anything about.

[Dax Shepard]

Your dad must have been going berserk.

[Billy Crudup]

My dad started to go berserk when I did Without Limits. And it was about an athlete, Steve Prefontaine. My dad started to get on board because Without Limits was the first time I was starring in something. He actually had this hilarious habit where he was terribly interested in words. It's somebody who tries to use big words but always gets it wrong. Yeah. And my dad was kind of like that. But he had a word, a day calendar, and on his answering machine he would always leave. He said, well, you miss me? This time, however, I am going to give you A gift. Today, the word of the day is superfluous. Superfluous.

[Monica Padman]

And he would change it every day.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah. Regularly. If it was every day. Probably not.

[Dax Shepard]

But regularly in me teaching you this word is in fact the definition of the word. You don't need to know this.

[Billy Crudup]

He might say something like, hey, Bill, you were super superfluous in that.

[Dax Shepard]

You got the super part.

[Billy Crudup]

Sure.

[Monica Padman]

Maybe going for superb.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, so without limits. Prefontaine. You're already a runner. That helps. People love to play prefontaine. This is not. This has happened a few times.

[Billy Crudup]

Well, you know, what happened actually is they were part of the same creative team, the producers, writers, directors. Tom Cruise was going to do it first. Then there was some disagreement about how to proceed. Proceed.

[Dax Shepard]

Of course he wanted to. He's the best on screen runner we've ever had.

[Billy Crudup]

A hundred percent.

[Dax Shepard]

Nobody runs as fast. It's terrifying how fast he runs.

[Billy Crudup]

During the period of time that they were fighting about how to make it happen, he felt like he aged out of the part. Okay, so he became a producer. But what happened was, I can't remember who it was, the producers or the writers, but one group got enough money to start making the movie, at which point the other guy group was like, we have to make the movie first. So they were literally in a race. And I had no idea I had been cast. I moved up to Eugene, Oregon, where we shot a bunch of it. I went to the field where he ran, and somebody said, which of the movies are you with? And I was like, which of the what? And that was when I learned that there was a competing movie happening at the same time.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, that was the Jared Leto version.

[Billy Crudup]

That was the Jared Leto version. Ours was called Pre first, and because theirs came out first and it was called Prefontaine, they had to change the title and it became Without Limits.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, okay. This is like Wyatt Earp and Tombstone.

[Billy Crudup]

Exactly the same. Speaking of which, I'm about to go to London to do a stage adaptation of High Noon. So I've been watching westerns, and Patrick Wilson turned me on to a whole bunch. I didn't really know the western genre so well. My Darling Clementine, if you like the white herb story, Henry Fox Fonda plays it. It's awesome.

[Dax Shepard]

My Darling Clementine. Okay. I like those movies. I like a western.

[Billy Crudup]

They're very applicable to right now. And what you discover is a lot of the writers. The guy who wrote High Noon, the movie was blacklisted. If you re watch High Noon under these circumstances, you see it's really not about that kind of heroism. It's about cowardice in the face of violence, threat and how people kind of turtle up even for somebody who they have lionized before if they feel like it's not in their best interest.

[Dax Shepard]

McCarthyism, the Big Red scare was people.

[Billy Crudup]

Giving up names, people being blacklisted, companies not wanting to put out anything that might be perceived as left leaning. So yeah, that culture, you watch those movies that were made in the 50s, and it's essentially, how do you make a civil society out of a lawless community? So without laws and the rule of law and consistency with the rule of law and its application, what you have is a bit of chaos. And can you have a civil society in a chaotically structured environment?

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So I become very aware of you, of course, like a lot of people my age, almost famous. I watched a little clip of you and Sam Jones today, which was kind of funny.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, he's awesome.

[Dax Shepard]

He's the greatest. And I loved his show off camera. It was so great. But he's talking, talking about he actually was the one who had to photograph you for the COVID of Esquire by just coincidence.

[Monica Padman]

He's a great photographer.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, he's a fantastic photographer.

[Dax Shepard]

We still. All of our artwork is shit. He took of me nine years ago.

[Billy Crudup]

He's a phenomenal photographer. But I was. This can't be a nice story.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, no, it's not nice or not nice. It's that it was not for you.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah, it was not.

[Dax Shepard]

I think that's my big curiosity from looking at you from afar.

[Monica Padman]

What wasn't for you?

[Dax Shepard]

Being famous, Being on the COVID of a magazine.

[Monica Padman]

Magazines got it.

[Dax Shepard]

It didn't feel right.

[Billy Crudup]

I'll tell you what happened was in the 90s, there was this big rush by entertainment, glossy magazines, and there were a lot of them to discover the next big thing. So there was something called the it guy or the it girl. I'm sure they still have it. I sound like I'm 104. We had things called the IT guy.

[Dax Shepard]

It used to be more in your face.

[Monica Padman]

It was different.

[Billy Crudup]

It was intense.

[Dax Shepard]

Cram some people down your throat and you reject it.

[Billy Crudup]

Most people down here, I want to.

[Dax Shepard]

Say someone's name, but I don't want to say their name.

[Billy Crudup]

I was aware of those kinds of things. They were happening before people actually produced anything. I was not feeling terribly confident. I feel like I did good professional jobs in movies, but I didn't think I was giving like, memorable performances. But they thought I photographed well. So they Wanted me for their magazines. And I realized I didn't want to be a model. I didn't want to wear somebody else's clothes. Clothes. I was just interested in acting. I definitely didn't want to talk about myself or talk about my personal experience, because how am I going to be able to convince people that I'm somebody else if they know all this shit about me? And I'm also not that good? So, you know, that was a conscious strategy on my part, much to the chagrin of many people I worked with.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, so this is kind of common. We've interviewed a bunch of people. They're hesitant to be interviewed because they have this old architecture of you don't want people to know the real you so that you can convincingly play these other people.

[Monica Padman]

Neutral mask, if you will.

[Billy Crudup]

Neutral mask, if you will.

[Dax Shepard]

Breathing in one another's mouth, damping on each other's chests. No, I think a lot of actors said, well, I don't want everyone to know me because then they won't be able to believe me in this. That's the logic they've employed. But I do think simmering under that are some fears.

[Billy Crudup]

I'll tell you this. I was not unambitious in my work. I went after some shit. People would say sometimes, oh, you don't want to be a star. I was like, did you see Watchmen? You think I was not trying with Dr. Manhattan? I mean, I wasn't hearing Almost Famous wasn't meant to be a niche drama. It's just that it didn't work. You know, Almost Famous lost money.

[Dax Shepard]

It did.

[Billy Crudup]

That's saying this is so people think about it. And I was number one on the call sheet. And since I wouldn't do press either, it wasn't like my rate was going up. So I wasn't getting a lot of the opportunities. You know, I had to audition. I had to put myself all on tape with dummy sides for Alien Covenant. At this point, when that came at 47 or something, I've been in a lot of things. I wasn't demurring from that. But I wanted to do it on the merits of my work.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes.

[Billy Crudup]

Not on a magazine's interest in exploiting my cheekbones, which, by the way, is cartilage from my hip. So I don't walk so well now, but I've got these great cheekbones.

[Dax Shepard]

You had them put in from your hips?

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah, from when I was young. My parents. Parents did that.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, good for them.

[Billy Crudup]

They wanted to set me up for success.

[Dax Shepard]

They made the right call. They're Gorgeous.

[Billy Crudup]

I remember sharing a story about going to a couple of different schools. And the way that the writer rendered it was that he had a very difficult upbringing. And that was one of the first articles that I think came out. My mom was in tears. So I think there was also a part of me that was protective of. Of my parents and the people around me.

[Monica Padman]

But also it's kind of sounds like it's the UNC thing all over again. Like you really are only comfortable if you feel like you really earned something.

[Billy Crudup]

Probably.

[Dax Shepard]

There we go. Monica, you kind of serve.

[Billy Crudup]

I think that's a good observation. It's hard for me to be comfortable in general because I think I realize how much luck there is in life. I walked into. Even though, you know, we talked about some of the difficulties of childhood, I walked into a fastball in my life. I got really lucky in a lot of different ways.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm going to go one step further. I on that. So I think you were feeling like your dad. If you were to jump in the spotlight and do all these things, that would have been a very dad move.

[Billy Crudup]

Definitely Live fast, Die Hard. That is not a long career. 100%.

[Dax Shepard]

So that's what I mean is there might also have been in the mix a little bit of. I'm still defining myself as not being like my dad.

[Billy Crudup]

I am absolutely sure. I think that's in so many aspects of my young adulthood.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

Is trying to figure out out the ways I'm the same, the ways I'm different. How can I embrace the things that I loved about him that are in me without accepting the things that were difficult?

[Monica Padman]

And often they're the same thing. That's what's so hard.

[Billy Crudup]

That's true.

[Dax Shepard]

Irony is if you're me, then you just wake up and you look in the mirror, you're like, oh, I'm him. I tried to be the opposite, and I just really became him.

[Billy Crudup]

I did this show called hello Tomorrow.

[Dax Shepard]

Which I love, by the way.

[Billy Crudup]

I appreciate that. It's a sort of Death of a salesman sort of story.

[Dax Shepard]

They're selling plots on the moon.

[Billy Crudup]

Selling plots on the moon, Exactly. He's a traveling salesman in a retro American future. So he's selling time shares on the moon. Except there are no time shares on the moon yet. But he believes that. Well, it was totally coincidental. We shot in Manhasset, the street. Like in the opening sequence.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

That's in Manhasset. On every call sheet, they list a hospital. And the hospital is North Shore Hospital. The hospital that I was born in.

[Dax Shepard]

Whoa. And you're playing your dad.

[Billy Crudup]

I'm playing my dad.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes, you are. And yeah. Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

When I look at pictures. Pictures from that and some of pictures of my dad, I mean, it's like spitting image.

[Dax Shepard]

You're so good. When you sit down in the diner with the guy who wants nothing to do with you, the way you turn that whole scenario.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, thanks.

[Dax Shepard]

Was so skillful, you can't really act your way into it. There has to be some kind of cellular salesman in you, you know, my.

[Billy Crudup]

Dad, there was a kind of curiosity even in the word thing. He was curious about things.

[Dax Shepard]

He loved.

[Billy Crudup]

Loved people much more than I do. Terribly interested. You know, he'd get into a cab and, hey, how you doing up there? Give me your name. I see it. And I don't exactly know how to pronounce it, and I'd like to be correct. And the guy's name, he's like, it's John. Wonderful to meet you, John. I'm Tommy Crudup. You can call me tc, Big T, Top dog, whatever you like.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God.

[Billy Crudup]

This is my son Billy. I call him Disco. You can call him whatever you like to. He's an actor, John. Now tell us about you. And then he would lean into the conversation and then typically, by the end of it, trying to get John to be a business partner with him in something.

[Dax Shepard]

You ever thought about selling Spanish bibles out of the trunk of this thing?

[Billy Crudup]

What are your thoughts on the inflatable ice chest, John?

[Dax Shepard]

Go great in this cab. Unique from the outside, what I have observed in the kind of theories I've come up with about you, and it's substantiated by people I run into who know you, which is like, you're an actor's actor. Every actor has a boner for you. It's a fact. Even the actoriest actors, there's a ton of reverence there. And a lot of the guys that I know that are really fucking good, they all admire you in a very similar way.

[Monica Padman]

And Jennifer Aniston. We just had Jennifer Aniston on, and she said the exact same thing.

[Dax Shepard]

I feel the same gushing, but I was like, oh, this is one of these unicorns. Who was not pulled towards a ton of money like I was and loves the stage and just prioritize that. And that seems almost impossible for someone to make that decision if you're like me and you're a greedy little pig and you want security. So I've just always been curious from afar of like, wow, this guy has some kind of integrity that I really can't imagine having.

[Billy Crudup]

Is this broadcast, because I'd like to put this out all over the place.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Billy Crudup]

I really appreciate that. Set up there, Dax. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Stay tuned for more Armchair Extra Expert, if you dare. We are supported by Hill's Pet Nutrition. Something we celebrate here on Armchair Expert is that we all have juggles, struggles, faults and flaws because we're human. Those of us with pets know this all too well. We are their whole world. And that can be a lot of pressure. Things are just going to go wrong sometimes, and we can only plan for so much pet. Parent guilt is unavoidable, avoidable.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, like when you left one of your dogs when you went traveling, you probably had guilt.

[Dax Shepard]

I did. Whiskey wasn't fit to make the trip, but I was relieved that he's having such a great time with Peggy at home. But yeah, because you're only human. There's Hills. Science does more. Find the right [e-mail] Dax we are supported by Audible. You know, I spent a lot of time listening. It's literally my job. But when I'm not recording the show, I'm constantly consuming audio content. And honestly, I can get pretty overwhelmed by all the choices out there. That's why I love when Audible drops their Best of the Year collection. Audible's most anticipated collection, the best of 2025, is here. And let me tell you, these editors know what they're doing. They've spent countless hours listening, having heated debates, probably way more heated than Monica and I get, although that's hard to imagine. And they have handpicked this year's must listens. What I really appreciate is that they don't just go for the obvious pick. They found hidden gems alongside the buzziest new releases. Whether you're into true crime like Monica, historical biographies like me, or something completely different, this collection has your back. I've already started diving into their selection, and honestly, it's like having a really smart friend curate your entire listening experience. Want to finish the year with a sure thing? Check out Audible's Best of 2025 and discover why there's more to imagine when you listen. Listen now. Go to audible.com bestofthen the year we are supported by Walden University. You know, a lot of people hit this point where they're doing well at work, but there's this nagging thought about taking that next step, maybe going after something they're really passionate about or finding ways to make a bigger impact. Walden University has been helping working adults figure that out. For over 50 years. They help people get what they call the W those wins that actually move you forward and create real change in your life, career and community. What's cool about their approach is tempo learning. You're in control of your timeline. No weekly deadlines breathing down your neck. Just the flexibility to progress at whatever pace works for your life. And their faculty aren't just academics, they're people who've actually done the work. They teach practical skills through real scenarios. So you're learning how to make a genuine impact. If you've been waiting for the right moment, this is it. Head to waldenu. Edu and take that first step. Walden University set a course for change. Certified to operate by certified Chev. We are supported by Cradelio Cuatro Every dog deserves to enjoy the outdoors and be protected from dog parasites. Cridelio quatro offers the broadest parasite protection of its kind by covering six types of parasites in one monthly flavored chewable tablet, fighting ticks, fleas, heartworm disease, roundworms, hookworms, and tapeworms. Woof. Other products say they're all in one, but Cradelio cuatro is the only monthly chewable tablet of its kind that covers three species of tapeworms. And it's flavored, which means your dog might actually like it. Whether you're going on a hike or just in the backyard, you can help protect your best buddy. Talk to your vet if your dog has a history of seizures or neurological disorders. Visit quattrodog.com for more info. Ask your vet about credelio quatro. That's quatrodog.com to learn more. For full safety information, side effects and warnings, Visit credelio cuatro labeled.com consult your vet or call 1-888-545-5973.

[Billy Crudup]

My interest was in trying to exploit the best of my potential. This kind of goes back to civics because you should contribute to your community. And if you have a skill, skill set that's applicable in some way that can contribute to your community. Even if it's stupid storytelling, if you can be really good at it, you can be really useful in a certain sector of somebody's life. You know, this part of their life, they need a half hour break. Like that guy in hello Tomorrow. That character feels really useful when he can light that guy up with a little bit of hope. And I feel useful when I can tell a good story and I can collaborate with people with disparate upbringings and ways of seeing and create something that none of us imagined individually. One of the reasons why I love New York, why I've been there, it is pluralism. Right. Smashed in your face. You know, it is just compressed, distilled.

[Dax Shepard]

And so the audience, Jew, sit next to a cowboy.

[Billy Crudup]

And on your way to work on the train, you're going to sit next to all of those people and one of them is going to tell you to off once a day. So you're not going to be able to get a big head about it, but you're going to be a part of the community.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

And so I suppose that's one reason why the theater in particular. I think the biggest reason is because that's where I've had some of the best parts. You know, how do I turn down some of parts? I studied this kind of work so I could apply it in this way. So if somebody's going to give me an opportunity, I should get off my ass and do it and keep my cost of living low. That's another big thing.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, one thing I happen to know about you is you did have a safety net from 1998 to 2007, I want to say.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, more than that.

[Dax Shepard]

More than that.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Hold on.

[Billy Crudup]

Let me just.

[Dax Shepard]

Don't say the what?

[Billy Crudup]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

1998 to 2005, a big safety net. And I've printed something up for you. And I hope you'll cold read this for me.

[Billy Crudup]

I certainly will.

[Dax Shepard]

Because Monica probably doesn't know this, and this is great.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Get in position. This is a treat for you.

[Billy Crudup]

Prada sunglasses, $548. Striped blouse from the Row, $1600. Hermes Birkin bag, $38,500. Realizing halfway home from Santa Monica that despite how cute you look, you're gonna Tonka in the car.

[Monica Padman]

No, no, no, no. Stop it.

[Billy Crudup]

Priceless. There are some things money can't buy. For everything else, there's faster cart. I don't even know what Tonka means. Does that mean yourself?

[Monica Padman]

Yes, it is.

[Billy Crudup]

That is that. That's capitalized. I can do another. I can do a better take.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, let's go get those to warm up the part. This is like that thing I wrote.

[Billy Crudup]

Realizing halfway home from Santa Monica that despite how cute you look, it's too hard. Hold on, hold on. I'm a professional, you know. If you pay me a little money, I'll take it very seriously.

[Dax Shepard]

This is the only way we're getting the campaign back real.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, I think I deserve some money for this.

[Billy Crudup]

I can guarantee in the 13 years I did it, I never had to say $38,500.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, right.

[Billy Crudup]

Realizing halfway home from Santa Monica that despite how cute you look, you're gonna. I can't do it.

[Monica Padman]

Is it possible? Oh, my God.

[Dax Shepard]

It's incredible.

[Billy Crudup]

That's great writing, I gotta tell you.

[Dax Shepard]

That is.

[Billy Crudup]

Well, Tony's writing the Chimpanzee.

[Dax Shepard]

Did you watch this great doc we watched? It was about these people.

[Monica Padman]

I mean.

[Dax Shepard]

No, that's the good one, where they fight chimp crazy.

[Monica Padman]

I think that what is called.

[Billy Crudup]

I don't know it.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh. All these people who try to own these chimps, they up getting their faces eaten off, right? But one of the chimps was Tonka. And Tonka would wipe his duty on the glass. And they had Tonka, and they had to make Tonka clean as. So when Monica had an accident, she's been referring to it as Tonka.

[Monica Padman]

I said. I said I felt like I was Tonka. Like I was just an animal with, like, no control.

[Billy Crudup]

We have a friend, Naomi and I, who is desperate to write a book called Shit Happens about all of those kinds of stories.

[Dax Shepard]

Our favorite tons on Earth are. We call it unauthorized evacuation. We have a prompt on Fridays and people tell us stories of their unauthorized evacuations.

[Billy Crudup]

There was another one that I really liked where somebody thinks they're gonna pass wind. And something else where it's I gambled and lost.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, that's right.

[Dax Shepard]

People say I trusted a fart.

[Billy Crudup]

I haven't heard that one yet.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, I trusted a fart. But I'm gonna try it. I'm gonna try it. Okay, let's see. This is you. Prada sunglasses, $548 Striped blouse from the Row 1600. Birkin bag, 38,500. Realizing halfway home from Santa Monica that despite how cute you look, you're gonna Tonka in the car. Priceless. There are some things money can't buy. For everything else, there's Masters car.

[Billy Crudup]

I mean, there's a professional. Thank God he was not around in 1997 when I was auditioning for that.

[Dax Shepard]

But that's a gift of all gifts, right?

[Billy Crudup]

For sure.

[Dax Shepard]

That gives you the freedom to have the exact career you wanted.

[Billy Crudup]

I was just texting last night with one of the producers. Producers of the MasterCard campaign. Greg Lotus is his name.

[Dax Shepard]

You're so good with names. It's kind of maddening.

[Billy Crudup]

Joyce Thomas, she started the whole thing. Joyce King Thomas, by the way, what if they're all made up and I'm.

[Dax Shepard]

Getting them all wrong? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

You're selling it, though.

[Dax Shepard]

Do you know Timothy Oliphant Yes.

[Billy Crudup]

So he, I mean, I don't know.

[Dax Shepard]

Him, I don't know what you're saying, but he really does it. He says, deborah, so and so. And then that's not who it was. And he started saying names when we interviewed him. I go, stop. You know, these aren't the real names. They're close.

[Billy Crudup]

It's important to you credit though, because Greg wrote to me last night and Joyce is at the point where she could be in the advertising hall of fame or something. And he was like, would you write something? And I wrote exactly that. She worked for an advertising agency and they were often trying to get an account to win an account. So they would do a temp version of what they were doing or do a real version of it and try to give it to the company. In this case MasterCard. But I did one for Champion Athletic Wear and MasterCard. And I was just doing it for the session fee and getting some experience doing vlog voiceover. She called my agent and said they won the account and they just wanted to use the voice that they used in the track. And I gotta say, the first year or so, even though I was making some money, I didn't understand what I really had. And I was kind of like, oh, this is a pain in the ass. I gotta go up to 20th street again and go record. It was about two years into it where I realized, this is the gift of a lifetime. So you're right, I had an enormous safety net. I mean, when you're starting out, if you can bank on 20 grand, 50 grand, whatever it is a year, your life opens up creatively. You don't have to take those jobs, you don't have to do seven year contracts or the marketing. You just work your six months at a time, try to keep yourself employed, stay in the game, take the good parts that you can. But I'm telling you, by year 10, I could walk in through 20 spots in about 20 minutes.

[Monica Padman]

And it's iconic. It's a cool thing to be able to.

[Dax Shepard]

It's actually one of the greatest. It became a cultural phenom.

[Billy Crudup]

I occasionally would be invited to these charity events, be like, like a golf event. Because I played golf when I was growing up and I like competing at anything. So I would show up at these charity events and I'd walk up to the foursome and I'd say, hi, I'm Billy Crudup, I'm your celebrity, fifth man on the team. And inevitably I'd get, no, you're not. And I'd Say, well, I think this is group number 40. He's like, I just paid 10 grand for goose Gossage. Who the fuck are you? And I was like, nah, I'd have the MasterCard in my bag. So I just wait until like, the third or fourth hole. After I'd had a birdie or something and helped the team, I'd go, so you guys don't like theater? You don't get to see a lot of theater. Well, there are some things money can't buy. And they go, oh, get the out of here. Yes. Yeah. Chi Rodriguez, or whoever I wanted to play with.

[Dax Shepard]

Look at Arnett Ornette. Like, he's been GMC trucks for like 25 years.

[Billy Crudup]

That's incredible.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, I'm so jealous. Okay, we've arrived at J. Kelly. Let's talk about J. Kelly.

[Billy Crudup]

Amazing.

[Monica Padman]

Also, we've had Rhys and Jennifer. You're the third morning.

[Dax Shepard]

I can almost not do any more morning show. We just. Yeah, we've had almost the whole cast in the last.

[Billy Crudup]

By the way, another blessing getting that part. I mean, that was just great. Good luck. Fun season this season. So hope you're tuning in to the morning show.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. So everyone, check that out. That's still airing on Apple plus right now. I don't think we've reached the end of the season. You're stellar on that, of course.

[Billy Crudup]

Thank you. Jay Kelly.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm just reading them. Hermes bag. I looked up those. I wanted it to be real. That's what a fucking bag cost.

[Billy Crudup]

385, 38,000.

[Monica Padman]

Not all of them. I mean, I don't have one.

[Dax Shepard]

The one I looked up.

[Monica Padman]

That's tough.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, let's talk about J. Kelly. So J. Kelly, Noah Baumbach. Yeah, we love Noah Baumbach. Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

Terrific director.

[Dax Shepard]

Splitting the whales. The first thing I saw him in the movie, Amazing.

[Billy Crudup]

Kicking and screaming back in the day. He's made so many good movies and has been such a consistent filmmaker and such an interesting filmmaker for a long period of time. Very hard to do. I think if you make one good movie, as a director, like a good movie, you're probably a really, really good director. If you make two good movies, you're probably one of the better directors of your generation. If you make three good movies, you're fricking great.

[Dax Shepard]

You're in for the history books.

[Billy Crudup]

They're really hard.

[Dax Shepard]

They're really hard.

[Billy Crudup]

People underestimate herding cats, especially if it's something that you have written and then you've got your own guts in there on the paper. And that's a hard thing to sustain. And Noah has done that for a long period of time. And there's a beautiful script about a movie star, George Clooney. Yes, George Clooney, perfectly cast in the sort of twilight of his career. Looking back, back to your early question, saying, was it worth it? Or what did I do wrong or what did I do right? And he's got two grown own children.

[Dax Shepard]

The lass is leaving.

[Billy Crudup]

Exactly. And he starts to have a bit of existential crisis. And immediately, narratively, in the film, his mentor dies. So he ends up at a memorial for his mentor, and all of a sudden, his North Star is gone, and his children are sort of out of the picture. And one of his former acting school friends and roommate is at the memorial. Memorial as well. And they haven't seen each other in a long time. And so, J. Kelly, George is feeling, like, nostalgic. He's like, hey, man, you want to go get a beer? And so the character I play is his acting school buddy. And we go get a beer. We start to bond about, oh, who's still working? And basically nobody is working still. One of them does voiceovers from that class. Jay's the one who took off and just kept flying. But it turns out the character I play is holding on to some things. George's character, Noah, built into it a little bit of a narrative trick where George's character says to my character, oh, you were always the one we looked up to. You were the great actor in the class. I mean, I could watch you do anything. I watch you read the menu. And so then that's what the character has to do in a way that is impactful. Yeah. And so the way that Noah had written it, he was describing a kind of, like, method acting that. That is not the way that I work. And the way that I work is, like I was saying before storytelling, I just want to try to tell the story that the writer has written and that the director is trying to compose in a way that makes the audience become involved. I don't try to manifest emotion. If emotion comes in the playing of a scene, I'm not afraid of it. But the aim is to accomplish the story, the event of the scene. Why is the scene in the movie? Why is the scene in the play? All right, let's make sure that the three of us as actors collude to make sure that event happens. And then whatever happens in between, you're listening to each other, and then you have something that is creatively novel because you're all Trying to be witness to it at the same time. And this one is saying, no, this event has to happen. I kept telling, no, I'm not sure that I know how to do that. So I told him, I'll tell you the way that I work. And I think it could work in the same way. And I describe it exactly the way that I did now, which is kind of long. This is one scene in the movie, you know, and he's listening very patiently to me. I was actually in London doing a play at the time and they were shooting part of it in London. So on the day off I was going to go and do this scene and I kept writing to him saying, you know, what if it's kind of like this? And he'd listen and say, oh, that's an interesting idea. And then I'd come in for rehearsal, me and George and Noah rehearsed and George is like, yeah, I hear you're going to try some new things out. And I was like, yeah. And you know, we wouldn't quite get to them. And I was noticing that the script wasn't changing. And like two weeks before I was like, geez, I better figure out some method. So I did a quick and deep dive into whatever I could in their repertoire. And during the day's work I said to Noah and George, I got no idea how this is going to go. So I've got a lot of backup plans. But just bear with me if you could.

[Dax Shepard]

Is that easy or hard for you to say out loud?

[Billy Crudup]

It's okay to say now because I know that I want to be helpful. That's my baseline.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, it's not ego.

[Billy Crudup]

I don't want to be destructive to it. It doesn't mean I'm not passionate. Passionate about. I'll have these discussions with the writers, great writers on Morning Show Carrier in the first two seasons, then Charlotte Stout the second two seasons and their whole team. And if something doesn't sound right to me or I feel like it's going down a way that I don't understand. We have big creative discussions. I don't have any problem having that kind of discussion if I don't understand the story. This one was more about accommodating my ability to tell it in a way.

[Dax Shepard]

Like what no one probably wanted to say is like, I understand you work that way, but the character you're playing doesn't work that way.

[Billy Crudup]

Correct. And I'm like, but no, I. I'm a 57 year old actor. I've been for sure that you do.

[Dax Shepard]

That the character that I wrote that you're going to come play does it different.

[Billy Crudup]

Precisely.

[Monica Padman]

Kind of life imitates art a little bit.

[Dax Shepard]

It was.

[Billy Crudup]

It was really great. And to be asked to do something that you don't know how to do, that's a big gift. But the reason why I'm saying all of this is because that's the pretext for George's character to go on a journey of discovery. So if I don't make that work.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

Him going away dramaturgically doesn't make a whole lot.

[Dax Shepard]

Failure to launch.

[Billy Crudup]

It's a failure to launch. It was a really great experience, and I had known George and wanted to work with George. But moreover, the stories about George and Adam Sandler and their partnership.

[Dax Shepard]

Does Adam play his agent or something?

[Billy Crudup]

Plays his agent, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. They didn't give us the movie. Normally, I would have watched. Yeah, I could only watch the trailer. So I'm piecing together who Sandler is.

[Billy Crudup]

Sandler is his longtime agent, and Laura Dern is his publicist. I mean, there is a murderer's row in that cast of great actors. And Noah, the way that he described that he was feeling somewhat disenchanted with movie making after he made a film called White Noise, and it wasn't received in the way that he imagined it would be received, or the story didn't land in the way that he had hoped it land and felt kind of cynical about it. And this is sort of a beautiful, not necessarily love letter, but description of the carnival life that we lead. It's gilded with the George Clooney charm and, like. And also a beautiful, heartfelt performance and every part of it. You know, I only worked for, like, three or four days, but I'm at every press thing. I love being a part of this group. Oh, you guys want me to show up in Venice? Short, I'll buy my own ticket.

[Dax Shepard]

You know, like whatever cover of Esquire magazine. You got it for it now.

[Billy Crudup]

Now I'll do. Oh, that magazine folded, damn it. I'll do the online version. I'm riding their coattails as far as I can. It was a beautiful thing for me to be a part of and a really gorgeous film.

[Monica Padman]

I talked to Netflix and also some personal publicists, and I was like, guys, if there is a movie that the army cherries would want to see, because our listeners, we call them armchairs, we talk so much about this, about looking back on your life, and the things that seem like they're going to be so great aren't necessarily so Great. I mean, it's so us. Cali. My Cali, she obviously saw it a long time ago and was like, it's so good. And it's about this. And I was like, that's our audience. So I really encourage the armchair.

[Billy Crudup]

I mean, I would expand on that by way of saying, I do think that's an American phenomenon, in particular this notion, and we talked about it a bit with our father, fathers too, that my great life is about to begin. Because it's the land of opportunity and abundance. You're sure that you're Gilded life. And what better way to describe that than a movie star who we think somehow as a completely protected, gorgeous life, free from any kind of malady.

[Dax Shepard]

Royalty.

[Billy Crudup]

Well protected from the mundane realities of living. And if you are busy looking forward to your future, you miss the life that you're having.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

And so I think it's a great metaphor for some kind of American discontent, too.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

I'm taking more of a sociological kind of take on the movie itself is just lovely.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, I had one question. What is it like to work with Tom Cruise? We went on this summer, my family did. We called it Tom Cruise's Cruises. And we watched almost the entire canon.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, my gosh.

[Dax Shepard]

So we watched all eight Mission Impossibles. Wow, you're in the third one. You're fucking great.

[Billy Crudup]

Thank you.

[Dax Shepard]

And I got so obsessed with him. And this is not my observation. This is Adam Scott's observation. And he, too, is a huge Tom Cruise fan. And I was like, I go, after doing this summer thing where we watch all of his movies, you really forget how insanely good he is in Rain Man. He's, like, playing someone that's completely not Tom Cruise.

[Billy Crudup]

I don't forget. He was incredible in that movie. That is a phenomenal performance.

[Dax Shepard]

So I said to Adam Scott, I'm like, this is gonna be a dumb sentence, but I think Tom Cruise might be the most underrated actor alive.

[Billy Crudup]

That's hilarious. Yeah. Because obviously Taps.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes.

[Billy Crudup]

Always had this rabid intensity. That is unusual. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

But what Adam said, and I think it's really astute, he said, I think Tom Cruise's gift as an actor is he is acting. Acting solely for the audience sitting in the seat, watching the screen and his understanding of what their experience is going to be with that lens on, with me at this distance doing this with my eyes, that. That's his genius. And I was like, I think you're right. I think he has a better idea than anyone's ever had about what this thing I'm doing right now will be experienced as in one year on that size screen.

[Billy Crudup]

I completely believe that.

[Dax Shepard]

When you're acting with him, what kind of things are you observing? Because you must be equally fascinated. Fascinated. Just to get to work with him.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah, you have to catch yourself a little bit because he's a star. I grew up loving movie stars, and he's one of them. Risky Business smacked me, right? During high school, Tom Cruise was the man because he was a producer on Without Limits. I had some superficial interactions. He was always incredibly supportive, like, Billy, what do you need? We're gonna make that happen. Well, let me tell you about that experience. And in the way that I think of it, this is what's going on there. Like a team player. There were two moments that I'm thinking of now. One was because J.J. abrams made that movie. J.J. is a brilliant man. In the movie, I play somebody with duplicitous motivation. There is one scene in particular where I reveal to Tom Cruise the extent of my duplicity. And it comes in the form of a monologue while he's tied up and been beaten up. I only do well with text. If I have time with it. I can memorize. Memorize things, but not well. I mean, anymore. I think everybody who's an actor probably got into the business because they could internalize text. That was the way their brain worked. Otherwise, it's just too intimidating. So as you get older, it starts to atrophy a little bit. What was once the special skill is sort of gone. In any case, I had this monologue that I realized too, like, the J. Kelly thing was pretty important for the plot of the movie. And JJ when he sat down, sent it to me. He said, don't memorize it yet because we're working right now. And as we're working on the script. And they were shooting also while they were working. And about two weeks out, I said, jj, that monologue's about a page long, and I want to kill it for you. So I want to start memorizing now. So I'm just going to go with what I've got and writes me back. Definitely don't.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, boy.

[Billy Crudup]

Because the names are changing and the order, it's in flux right now. A week out, I go, dude, this is DEFCON 1. I'm in triage mode here. I have to start. And he's like, it's coming today. Three days before Billy. I can promise you it's the morning.

[Dax Shepard]

We're shooting it in the make him trailer.

[Billy Crudup]

In the trailer, I get the Pages. No, this is how I'm recalling it. It may have been the day before, but I believe it was in the trailer. Cut to Tom tied up me off camera reading the text.

[Dax Shepard]

Thank God they're shooting his sight first.

[Billy Crudup]

At least his some practice. Giving some practice. Turn around to me. Total panic attack. Melting under pressure, can't remember anything. This is what Tom Cruise Cruz does. Billy, you ever work with Q cards? And I was like, no, Tom, I have not ever worked. We're working with Q cards today. Has somebody write up the whole monologue. And this is holding the Q card, like right here, so he can still have an eye on. Still giving you. So he's giving me everything here where he's got the card over here. And I'm doing everything I can to not play the scene. Like, you really should go after the Rabbit's Foot. When you would go to the Central America. That's a bad idea. You know, But JJ and Tom are so good that they made it work.

[Dax Shepard]

But, Billy, when you go home at night and you lay in your.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, man. Well, you said you needed it.

[Billy Crudup]

I told him I needed it.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

And JJ was like, no, it was totally fine. We'll make it work.

[Dax Shepard]

It's great.

[Billy Crudup]

But I could have done so much better, Dax.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, so that one's a little bit of the girl who got Away.

[Billy Crudup]

That was.

[Dax Shepard]

You want a second chance?

[Billy Crudup]

Tom saved me on that. And the second second was my father died because I had about maybe two weeks work on that movie. But it was spread out over several months. And during that, my father passed away after he had cancer. And we had a memorial for him. Then I had to fly to Los Angeles on Monday to work on Monday. And Tom, as he did every day that I was there, came bounding into the makeup trailer. How we doing today? You know? Yeah, yeah, we're looking good here. We're on fire. Ready to go.

[Dax Shepard]

Let's go.

[Billy Crudup]

Good attitude. Good to see you all wonderful people here. So he goes, me, how you doing? And in my head, like, I start doing all this social calculus. I'm like, oh, which way do I do this? And I said, well, actually, Tom, my father passed away. So I was at a memorial over the weekend. You haven't been consoled until you've been consoled by Tom Cruise.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, tell me what happened.

[Billy Crudup]

That is right there. Like, he came in to the point where I was like, no, it's totally fine. I mean, everybody has a dad. They all come and go, yeah, what are you gonna do, Tom?

[Dax Shepard]

Terrific. He's built for us. He', fearless, right, Bill?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

He's like, this is awkward for most people, but I'm going.

[Billy Crudup]

I'm coming right in here.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow.

[Monica Padman]

That's sweet.

[Billy Crudup]

I thought it was.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Well, Billy, this has been so much fun.

[Billy Crudup]

It's been my pleasure.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm smitten with you. As I told you, we got to spend time this year over the summer. We did a lot of dancing. Yes, we did. We did a good two hours of dancing together.

[Billy Crudup]

Your family are some dancing fiends. A great time.

[Dax Shepard]

Naomi's got major moves.

[Billy Crudup]

I hope she slows down at a certain point, because I try to keep up and I'm like.

[Dax Shepard]

Is it the.

[Billy Crudup]

Right arm or the left arm? Which one should I be looking out for?

[Dax Shepard]

You were not signaling that at all.

[Billy Crudup]

I like to keep up.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, it was great. I adore you. I think you're magic. I'm so glad you came in. Everyone see J. Kelly November 11th in theaters. If you don't make it, but you should, it'll be best consumed.

[Billy Crudup]

There should.

[Dax Shepard]

December 5th.

[Billy Crudup]

I'll tell you why it should be seen in the theater. Because there's a tribute to J. Kelly in the movie. J. Kelly is attending a tribute to. To himself. And in that, they use George Clooney footage.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, fine.

[Dax Shepard]

Real footage.

[Billy Crudup]

Spoiler alert. But it is worth staying to the bitter in. In the theater, if nothing else. I mean, you're going to have a great time in the movie, wherever you see the movie, whenever you see the movie. But in the theater, it's pretty awesome.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, awesome. I hope everyone checks it out. And please come back.

[Billy Crudup]

Absolutely.

[Dax Shepard]

Will.

[Billy Crudup]

Thank you guys for having me. This has been a pleasure.

[Dax Shepard]

I sure hope there weren't any mistakes in that episode, but we'll find out when my mom, Mrs. Monica, comes in and tells us what was wrong. He wears short shorts. If you dare wear short shorts, Nair wear short shorts.

[Monica Padman]

I don't get that if I'm being honest, because Nair doesn't wear short shorts.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, in this case, Nair does wear short shorts. No, in the commercial.

[Monica Padman]

I know, but. Doesn't make sense.

[Dax Shepard]

I know. Nair can't wear shorts.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Is there, like a little pair of tiny shorts on the Nair bottle?

[Dax Shepard]

Let's think about this. If you dare wear short, short shorts, Nair. Maybe they're using wear like a verb.

[Billy Crudup]

Or.

[Dax Shepard]

Or not a verb, like never. No, like Nairwear. Like, that's a new term. That's like you. Nair weared it. Which is. Which is no hair.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Nairwear means no hair on your.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, why Am I wearing headphones?

[Monica Padman]

Oh, yeah. You just wanted to. Well, we were just doing safer.

[Dax Shepard]

We were doing Armchair Anonymous.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And then I got used to it, so that's craz.

[Monica Padman]

You still can if you want.

[Dax Shepard]

I was like, what? You sound really loud in this fact check. I was like. Because I'm no longer hearing you in my ears the way I used to.

[Billy Crudup]

Exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

We have this dista. Between us. You're at the distal. Really nice conversation.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

First things first. I have a huge question to ask you.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, my God, I love huge questions.

[Monica Padman]

Do you eat the skin of the baked potato?

[Dax Shepard]

You know, I didn't when I was a kid, and now I love it, especially if it's a little crispy.

[Monica Padman]

So you eat it. Like, cut the whole baked potato. You eat that have skin.

[Dax Shepard]

I usually eat the organ meat out of it.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. You eat the inside.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. And then I cut up the remaining skin again if it's crispy. I. I prefer that. You know what I'm saying? Sometimes it's damp.

[Monica Padman]

Yep.

[Dax Shepard]

And then it's just like. You're eating, like, damp bark.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. You're eating a brown paper bag that.

[Dax Shepard]

Was sitting in dirt. You're eating dirt. That's why it's that color. I think they're white on their. You scrub them. They're white.

[Monica Padman]

Maybe certain ones.

[Dax Shepard]

Not russet.

[Monica Padman]

I don't think russet. They're brown.

[Dax Shepard]

What made you think of this? Did you have a baked potato last night?

[Monica Padman]

Not last night.

[Dax Shepard]

And do you call it a baked potato or a baked potato?

[Monica Padman]

I call it a baked potato.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, you're. You're betraying your southern roots. I know I'm treading very carefully.

[Monica Padman]

Why?

[Dax Shepard]

Because you hate when I claim southernness appropriately.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, well, you don't have southern roots to betray.

[Dax Shepard]

I am a southerner.

[Monica Padman]

You have a house.

[Dax Shepard]

I live in the South.

[Monica Padman]

I will say you have a house in the South.

[Dax Shepard]

A house in the South.

[Monica Padman]

Listen, I was at a restaurant and a baked potato was bought by Jess. It was a twice baked.

[Dax Shepard]

So I don't know if that guarantees crispiness. Right.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. Yeah. So I see him cut this pen potato and eat it like a. A steak.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And I was sh. I was, like, mortified. What are you doing?

[Dax Shepard]

Right. Like he was a psychopath.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Like you are not supposed. That's not what baked potatoes are. It's to eat the. That's just the vessel for the inside.

[Dax Shepard]

It's the wrapper.

[Monica Padman]

It's the wrapper. Exactly. It's like if you ate an orange by cutting it and Taking bites. It's like, no, no, no, you're not supposed to eat that peel.

[Dax Shepard]

I mean, that's a little more harsh, but because there's no version of an orange peel tasting good. And there certainly is a version of a potato skin.

[Monica Padman]

So this is why I wanted to ask you. Because he, he was like, you don't eat that. And he was like, you don't eat potato skins. And then that was an interesting point because I was like, oh, I mean, I, I have eaten potato skins, but not like this. Not.

[Dax Shepard]

I love potato skins. I haven't had them in so long. I would go like this. Slice, slice, slice, slice, slice, slice.

[Monica Padman]

You would take that. That nice is okay. So like, oh, my stick in.

[Dax Shepard]

Really cool would have been it.

[Monica Padman]

You're acting willy nilly. Listen, so I wanted to put this out there. I was like, I got to ask Dax's opinion on this. And there's a high chance that he too.

[Dax Shepard]

But I don't do it like him. And I think that's cool. He does it like that. He's mixing texture. It's like full bodied. For him. It's soup to nuts.

[Monica Padman]

It is.

[Dax Shepard]

He's.

[Monica Padman]

He said he mentioned the crispiness a lot. Like you have now mentioned crispiness.

[Dax Shepard]

It's imperative.

[Monica Padman]

I just, I'm just shocked. I never, I would never been exposed to anyone eating the outside of the baked.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, really?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Ever?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. That's why, like, I think when we.

[Dax Shepard]

Were at Brick Tops, I want to say I took down a baked potato and then I did eat the skin. You did? Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

I think I thought that was the way you ate it.

[Dax Shepard]

I think it is. The majority of people eat it that way, but I don't think. I think that's 70, 30, Rob.

[Billy Crudup]

I don't eat the skin, but it wouldn't freak me out if I saw someone eat it.

[Monica Padman]

It wouldn't.

[Dax Shepard]

So somewhere in the middle of us, which is generally his chosen safe path through these minefields.

[Monica Padman]

I. I just didn't even know it was an option. Well, are you open to trying Blown open.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, are you open to trying it? Yeah, they're good. I mean, again, potato. He had a great counter. Potato skins are fantastic.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, I guess I'm open to trying it, but I too have this idea that it's a paper bag.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Now, do you eat at Lil Dom's ever?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. So we, we almost never eat there because I'm always freaked out that there's a line.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, sure.

[Dax Shepard]

But we happen to be in the mood to Go out to eat. Two ago we were in a rush and it was 5:30. So that's a great time to hit a restaurant. Side note, there were three birthdays in a row and the whole restaurant sang for all three. It was so fun. I felt like it was in Italy.

[Monica Padman]

I was there on Friday, two nights ago. Tuesday.

[Dax Shepard]

Tuesday night. So you've eaten there. They do a whole baby potato and they're smashed and cooked. Those are incredible. And those have the skin on them.

[Monica Padman]

They do. So I said, I said it's not that I'm against, against eating the skin on a potato.

[Dax Shepard]

I've had a red potato.

[Monica Padman]

You'd always eat the skin. I've had plenty of skins on potatoes. It's specifically the baked potato.

[Dax Shepard]

But how about a. When you eat a, eat a bread bowl.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

A soup, do you eat the bread? So because I think that's the best comp.

[Monica Padman]

I eat the, a lot of the bread inside the bowl because I the.

[Dax Shepard]

You leave the husk.

[Monica Padman]

I do. Every now and then I'll peel off like a little bite and stick it in. But no, I'm not.

[Dax Shepard]

I miss a bread bowl like crazy.

[Monica Padman]

We can get you a gluten free one.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't think so. Gluten free bread in general is pretty. It's tough now what's so interesting is like Kristen has now taken a stab at gluten free sourdough bread. God bless her. She's worked very, very hard. There's been like nine or 10 batches. They're never really comparable in any way to sourdough bread.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Yet she makes gluten free waffles that are kind of sourdough with the starter. Yeah, those are dynamite.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Those might be the best gluten free, you know, alternative in the bread space. They've also really nailed pizza. Yeah, they have figured out pizza.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Sometimes I even choose gluten free crust at Lucifers.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, I keep the coal line loose. If it's been a long time.

[Monica Padman]

Can we hear about your day yesterday? Are we allowed to hear about it?

[Dax Shepard]

Sure, sure. My first filming day in I think five and a half years. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

How was it?

[Dax Shepard]

Well, it was great in that I accomplished my goal.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Which is in the morning when I meditated. I really was really thoughtful and mindful. I was like, I just want to go today and not have any power struggles. I want to be a joy to be around and I want to service the dream director and in this case the star. Yeah. And the project. And I did that.

[Monica Padman]

Good.

[Dax Shepard]

And I felt really good about it.

[Monica Padman]

Great.

[Dax Shepard]

Cause I filmed my cockles coming up. It was like 6:30. I gotta be on set at 6:30. I was like, that feels early. And I look at the call time. It was like eight. Why am I there an hour and eight? And I was like, and shut the fuck up and show up at 6:30. And then I went into the wardrobe fitting and the costume wear was an armchairy which made me so happy. Right away was lovely. And then I had a. I forget how fun it is to order breakfast on set.

[Monica Padman]

That is fun, what you order.

[Dax Shepard]

I said do they have gluten free bread? Ding ding ding.

[Monica Padman]

Waffles.

[Dax Shepard]

No, I said do you have gluten free waffles with a sourdough starter that my wife makes? And they did. And then so I had a fried egg sandwich with bacon and cheese and mayonnaise and it was fucking outrageous. And I ended up going with my gold tooth. You know, I had two different options. A grill. A grill and gold tooth. I went with the gold tooth. People liked that. That was great.

[Monica Padman]

Great. So you're not wearing it right now.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm not. Well now then. I've. Now I'm in a tricky sitch.

[Monica Padman]

Oh.

[Dax Shepard]

Which is now that tooth is for that. So now I don't want to be all around town and on the show and stuff. And you see it non stop. And then when you see that it's not like a. Oh, that's a thing. So I kind of. I fucked that up until the whole project's over.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Which is a long time from now. Like I think March.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, interesting. So I do want to say that I did notice in a recent edit, this edit actually, you were touching it a lot.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, I did not touch it at all in my scene.

[Monica Padman]

No, I know that. I'm just saying I think like maybe subconsciously.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh yeah, of course.

[Monica Padman]

Because there's something weird in your mouth.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, you're just like checking it. It always feels like it could be popped in just a tiny I hair more.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

This is. And if you watch Parenthood, it's a mess like you. Oh no, not Parenthood. Little bit there and then. Bless this mess. Since I've never worn a wedding ring in real life, when I have a wedding ring on, I just touch it non stop. I can't not because it's this foreign thing. It's so clear. I'm not used to having a ring.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

That's why I'm a bad actor. You'll see some of my bad acting when I do that.

[Monica Padman]

When you have rings.

[Dax Shepard]

But in my defense, I do see some guys playing with their wedding ring a lot. It is a thing. It's a fidget spinner.

[Monica Padman]

I do think when they first get it, there's a lot of that. I do think over time it becomes second skin.

[Dax Shepard]

You know what's great about Aaron, he's pretty clever, but he gets 10 packs. His wedding ring is these like rubber rings.

[Monica Padman]

Oh.

[Dax Shepard]

And he like knows he's gonna lose them and he plays with them and just, he has a bunch of. He has a ton of wedding rings.

[Monica Padman]

That doesn't sound like a wedding ring. That just sounds like a regular ring.

[Billy Crudup]

Stay tuned for more army chair expert if you dare.

[Dax Shepard]

We are supported by Quint. When the weather starts to turn and the holidays are coming up, I just want getting dressed to be easy. Stuff that feels good, looks sharp and actually lasts. That's why I've been into Quint's and the bonus Quint's pieces make great gifts too.

[Monica Padman]

They really do. They've got the sweaters, but they also have homeware. You can get all of your holiday shopping done just on quints.

[Dax Shepard]

Home, bath, kitchen, you name it, you can get it. It is a great place for gifts.

[Monica Padman]

I ordered some sheets, some really, really amazing sheets. They're also so cute. They, they're striped. I love quints and I feel like it's a hack, honestly. It's like the quality is so good and it's so reasonable.

[Dax Shepard]

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[Monica Padman]

Oh, okay.

[Dax Shepard]

If it goes sideways.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

I guess by the time this comes out, will know.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

So I very much want Christmas lights down in Nashville.

[Monica Padman]

Oh yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

I want it to be like a spectacle.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And I got a bid and it was, it was Insane. It was offensive.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

It was off. I can't help but be offended. I cannot imagine that was the price that non actors would receive.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. You think it's personal.

[Dax Shepard]

I do. I do. I do. I'm like, what is this place going to be like, the North Pole for this place?

[Monica Padman]

Maybe that's what you want.

[Dax Shepard]

Let's just put it this way. I said, well, I'm sure for three grand, Aaron would be happy to go down there for a week and string lights up.

[Monica Padman]

So it was three grand?

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, no. It was 30. 17,000 to put. I was like, are you kidding? It's offensive.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. I. I don't know that in my mind.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm going to overpay. Aaron. Three grand to do it. Like, let's just put it this way. I said to Aaron, hey, you want to go decorate the house for three grand? He's like, fuck, yes. I'd have to draw, drive Uber for, you know, two weeks or three weeks or whatever. Hold on. Let's not.

[Monica Padman]

I just. I'm serious.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, man. You keep doing. This is what happened on race of 270, and it cost me four times what I said, the prize.

[Monica Padman]

But people deserve what they deserve.

[Billy Crudup]

Well, there's two.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. There's a lot of issues. You're saying five because the bid was 17.

[Monica Padman]

I'm not actually. I'm not.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

I think that's actually a hard job. I think that's a. I don't think so.

[Dax Shepard]

I've strung Christmas lights on my houses for the last. I'll, you know, do it here.

[Monica Padman]

I know, but you get, like. Or about it.

[Dax Shepard]

It's a day at best. It's a day. So anyone in America is making three grand for the day. I think that's a damn good wage.

[Monica Padman]

We are making way more than.

[Dax Shepard]

Don't talk about what I make. We're talking about that.

[Monica Padman]

This is a. I'm just saying, if we're going to use that as, like, a daily.

[Dax Shepard]

I can't believe I'm getting shamed into five grand for a day of hanging lights. Also, he's going to be hanging in Nashville, driving my shit around, having a blast. It's a fun time.

[Monica Padman]

I need you to separate.

[Dax Shepard]

He's very excited.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, I'm. I guess I'll pay him the extra two now.

[Billy Crudup]

I did.

[Dax Shepard]

I am so. I. I was like, hey, do you want to. Do you want to go down to Nashville and do this for three grand? He was like, absolutely. You know, let me find it. Couple days and all, so. And then flight. I Had to buy plane tickets.

[Monica Padman]

Listen, that's not part of it. That's not part of it. It's his. It's his work.

[Dax Shepard]

You're going to have me up to like 18 grand all in. I should just hired the professional company there. Exactly. Look a lot better.

[Monica Padman]

Well, that's the thing.

[Dax Shepard]

Is it going to look, I have very low expectations. I want to be colorful. If he over delivers, great. But I'm not expecting him to do a great job.

[Monica Padman]

He has to get on ladders and stuff.

[Dax Shepard]

Like there we're at.

[Billy Crudup]

There we are.

[Dax Shepard]

You're at the heart of the issue.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Now let's go. Go back in time. Aaron was a roofer for 15 years.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

He lived on a 30 foot ladder. Yeah. So if there's any guy for the job in that department, it is Aaron. He's lived on a ladder. But hold on.

[Monica Padman]

Poke a hole in that in a minute.

[Dax Shepard]

You're. I'm gonna get you there. I'm gonna poke the same.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, great.

[Dax Shepard]

So I'm just like. He said, yes, I've said great. I've bought a plane ticket and a couple days go by and I'm just like if he falls, if he.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

We had such a laugh about this. I called him, I FaceTimed him. I'm like, I'm starting to get a little worried that you're gon off a ladder and die while you're putting. I don't want Christmas lights that bad. So please, like if you got to rent a bucket or whatever. He's like, I think I, you know, like the little machine you drive and it's got an arm on it. You sit in the bucket and it's got a remote control. He's like, I'm way more afraid to be driving a bucket around through your yard and tipping the thing over on the sidewalk or some. And I'm like, that's kind of a good point. But we were saying, we had such a laugh. We were saying that at the ulg I I would be giving the ulog. That's okay. This is our sense of humor.

[Monica Padman]

I know, but I don't want.

[Dax Shepard]

I said at the eulogy, I would say some people have suggested that I may have saved Aaron's life by sending them to treatment. I don't know about that. But what I know for sure is that I have killed Aaron Weekley, killed my best friend because I wanted Christmas lights. So listen, we had a long talk and I'm like, look, if it looks dicey, I don't give a fuck. They don't have to be up that high. And then we were joking. What if he just put them all on the floor first ever. We just go there and they're all laying around the bottom of the. Like the pants fell down on the deck. But we had a long talk and we had. We have some safety measures in. In place.

[Monica Padman]

I don't want him to go.

[Dax Shepard]

I want him to wear a life alert midi alert bracelet so if he does fall off the letter, he can hit a button.

[Monica Padman]

I don't like it.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh my God. He can handle decorating a house. He's very competent.

[Monica Padman]

He's extremely competent. But looks.

[Dax Shepard]

Don't you think I could go decorate the house? Would you be worried about me?

[Monica Padman]

I don't like that either. I don't. I wish. I would like you to farm this out to a professional because that house is big and there are a lot of houses.

[Dax Shepard]

Very modest.

[Monica Padman]

It's huge. I'm not doing that. It's a huge house and it has, it has high areas.

[Dax Shepard]

One high area also.

[Monica Padman]

Is it going to be on the boat area? What's that called? Dog.

[Dax Shepard]

The dog.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

No, I'm not going to have him decorate the dog.

[Monica Padman]

Well, that's cute. I bet the other people would do that.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, another side note to this is I don't want him to have to go get all of the. The lights.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

So I have been ordering lights ahead of time that are getting delivered there.

[Monica Padman]

Sure.

[Dax Shepard]

So I ordered a ton of lights.

[Monica Padman]

So is this is the original bid that thing? Did that come with the lights?

[Dax Shepard]

I should hope so, right?

[Monica Padman]

I assume it does.

[Dax Shepard]

I would hope so. But again I went for broke. You can't spend $1,000 on lights your whole place. They're. They're so cheap. Right. So anyways, I ordered like 11 strands probably, probably like 1200ft of this one kind.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

That Kristen liked. Cuz you can make. You can change the colors. And then I was like, I want those kind that like rain down you like icicles. Yeah. And they're not. Because there are icicles that are like hard plastic. These are like little ropey, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think you're right. Aaron calls them that too. Yeah, that wasn't the name on Amazon. But anyways I had already ordered all these ones and then I changed, changed my mind.

[Monica Padman]

Oh.

[Dax Shepard]

And I'm like, well, he's got to decorate trees and too. If he, if he wants. He's going for a week. It's like a. Okay. So I then ordered like 1300. I ordered a quarter mile of the kind that I like.

[Monica Padman]

The icicles.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes, the icicles. Okay. There are so many. When he arrives, there's gonna be. So I bet it'll take him one day to unwind. Although, 1.

[Monica Padman]

You're more to my point. This. This job has gotten enormous.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, I'll give him five grand.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Also, should have never brought this up. A $2,000 mistake.

[Monica Padman]

Listen.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Just because he was a roofer.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Doesn't mean he's still capable in the same way, because. Listen, I just went to play mahjong at Anthony and Allison's house, and they have a young daughter. She was excited to show me.

[Dax Shepard]

She.

[Monica Padman]

She's been working on splits, and she wanted to do a split contest.

[Dax Shepard]

And that's part of mahjan?

[Monica Padman]

No, the daughter.

[Dax Shepard]

No. But what Splits.

[Monica Padman]

Splits.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh. Do the physical splits.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm just like, we're hanging out with the kids before we play mahjan.

[Dax Shepard]

You're just bouncing around from topic to top is like, mahjan.

[Monica Padman]

Was it clear? Rob N. I mean, yes, it was. God, he can't. Okay, so, you know, I. I. She's like, yay, Monica's here. And then. And I made that part up. But, like, in her head, she was, oh, my God.

[Dax Shepard]

My. All my dreams have come true. Monica's here.

[Monica Padman]

They do get excited when friends are.

[Dax Shepard]

Over that wish on that falling star word.

[Monica Padman]

So Elson told her daughter, you know, Monica is going to really love seeing your splits because she used to do splits all the time, and she was a cheerleader. She was really bragging about me, you.

[Dax Shepard]

Know, building you up.

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

You're a legend now.

[Monica Padman]

And they were all very impressed by this.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And I. And. And she was like, can I see? And I was like, well, first of all, I'm not in the right attire. And second of all, I can't do them anymore. Not even close.

[Dax Shepard]

Right. You got to maintain that.

[Monica Padman]

Just because I was once a huge professional doesn't mean I can still perform in the same way.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Counterpoint. Are you ready for it?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

When Aaron. Aaron was a roofer, he had two bundles on his shoulders all the time. He was a drunk. He was smoking cigarettes while he climbed the ladder. He was hungover or even drunk, and he was heavier. So in many ways, you'd be more safe to assume he'll be much better on the ladder now than he's ever been.

[Monica Padman]

No, but he's not in the routine of doing it.

[Dax Shepard]

I had him run drills. He's been climbing the ladder all week.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, you have?

[Dax Shepard]

I leave that up to him. Look, here's. Here's what? At the end of the day, I would trust myself to put the lights up, and I have the same faith in him that I have in myself.

[Monica Padman]

Can he wear a helmet?

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, my God. Please.

[Monica Padman]

Please. Can he wear.

[Dax Shepard]

I was thinking. I wish there was a way for him to tie in.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Climbing gear.

[Monica Padman]

I know. I'll give him $500 extra if he wears a helmet.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, tax.

[Monica Padman]

Tell him that, or I'll. Yeah, I'll text him. I need. I need. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

This is getting crazy. Well, if he goes, I'm just not coming. This is. You guys have now scared me. He's like, I was just gonna go hang lights, which I do have my. He already did his own house this year.

[Billy Crudup]

I'll give him $50 for football pads.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. They'll sponsor. But he's like. He looks like he's a goalie for a hockey team, and he just falls off the ladder because he's got too much on, say, safety glasses and gloves.

[Monica Padman]

I mean, the number's really getting up there. I think it's. I'm happy.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. So that's what's. That's what's brewing.

[Monica Padman]

Are you gonna do this? House.

[Dax Shepard]

It's done, isn't it? Underwhelming.

[Monica Padman]

Aren't doing it.

[Dax Shepard]

No. Kristen did hire someone.

[Monica Padman]

Exactly. You didn't put lights up here, so we don't know if you're still capable this year. This year. That's what I mean. This year, you're both 50. Things change.

[Dax Shepard]

We're both in better shape than we.

[Monica Padman]

It's nothing to do with that. It's equilibrium.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, mine's great because I do so many. You know, I do my bicycling.

[Monica Padman]

Aaron doesn't.

[Dax Shepard]

He plays pickle ball all day long.

[Monica Padman]

That's not.

[Dax Shepard]

He's as agile. And. And. And his. His. His balance is.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. I'm going to give you $3,000 to not have Aaron.

[Dax Shepard]

This is getting very complex. We're going to have to bring an accountant in. If someone's already. Already mad at me, rightly so. Someone's already in their car going, you're gonna spend three grand on your Christmas lights.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

Like, I. That's what I make in a month, so already.

[Monica Padman]

I know. And that's understandable. Yes, that's understandable.

[Dax Shepard]

Absolutely.

[Monica Padman]

That made me excited for Christmas. I love that. Now, I have another question for you real quick.

[Dax Shepard]

Yep.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. You know how I had two. Twice I've had these pierced ear infections that had turned rancid.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Both.

[Monica Padman]

Both times.

[Dax Shepard]

Yep.

[Monica Padman]

Do you think I could try it on the other ear? Because they were both on this ear. And maybe this ear just has a sensitivity.

[Dax Shepard]

You're gonna hate this answer. But if you do it and your ear falls off, I'm simply not gonna feel bad for you.

[Monica Padman]

Hey.

[Dax Shepard]

Because you have been taught this lesson twice. Painfully. And if you. You have to learn it a third time.

[Monica Padman]

How many rock bottoms did you have?

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. But no one was in support of it. No one was, like, encouraging me to hit another bottom.

[Monica Padman]

But we're compassionate.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

So you.

[Dax Shepard]

If you. If you have one ear.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

You better thank God it'll be the right side that you're not getting shot on.

[Monica Padman]

No, this one, it would be. It falling off.

[Dax Shepard]

Right.

[Monica Padman]

And you're.

[Dax Shepard]

The camera's here.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, oh, oh, sure.

[Dax Shepard]

If you're picking an ear to lose, that is the correct ear to.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Billy Crudup]

You can shave that side of your head too.

[Monica Padman]

Oh. And then it's just smooth. The whole thing's so smooth.

[Dax Shepard]

Ear hole. And a shave sides in an ear hole.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, so you think. No, I think.

[Dax Shepard]

No, I think. I think you learned your. I think your ears said to you, hey, Monica, we don't want these up there. I know, but you're so. You think it's going to change the whole game?

[Monica Padman]

I do.

[Dax Shepard]

Can't you do, like, clampy ones?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. So this is the problem. So I have a cuff.

[Dax Shepard]

Cuff. We call it.

[Monica Padman]

We call it a cuff. But all the. I keep buying cuffs.

[Dax Shepard]

If you dare wear ear cuffs. Cuffs where Ear hairs.

[Monica Padman]

I keep buying cuffs.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

And they're all my ears small, so they're always a little too big. And so they're not sitting where they need to sit on.

[Dax Shepard]

Why don't you pinch them?

[Monica Padman]

I try. They're nice cuffs. Like, you.

[Dax Shepard]

Can't you use pliers?

[Monica Padman]

Pliers?

[Dax Shepard]

Monica, here's what you do. You get pliers, but before you. You get to pinching.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Put some duct tape on the inside of both the pliers so that they don't leave creases or marks on your earrings. So just put tape around the pliers and then just give them a pinch.

[Monica Padman]

I don't know how to do that.

[Dax Shepard]

You don't know how to operate pliers? I'm not doing a little activity. Hey, Aaron. Three grand.

[Monica Padman]

He'll come and I will. I will. I'll trust him to do that.

[Dax Shepard]

Aaron's gonna be so rich at the end of this.

[Monica Padman]

I know. So. No, I have. Have tried and like, some of them do squeeze, but then it still opens up and then it slides and I'm pissed. And yeah, you know, I'm. I'm meant to have some in there permanently for my look. You know, my look is meant for it.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

But my ears are saying no.

[Dax Shepard]

What if you put a little. Little piece of two sided tape on.

[Monica Padman]

The inside of the cuff so that it sticks? Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Sounds cumbersome.

[Monica Padman]

It sounds. Sounds uncomfort.

[Dax Shepard]

Could get irritated as well.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. And I do think like, okay, so I have two. I have, you know, two piercings here and I have two ears currently. And I have had two piercings for a long time. And then I have a third piercing and the other day I put three earrings on one side and I could not get the earring into the third hole on my right side. It would.

[Dax Shepard]

You didn't try hard. No, I did because Lincoln puts the earring in my ear and that hole was closed for 25 years.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. But I don't know what to tell you.

[Dax Shepard]

Want her to put it in? Sure. I only a grand for her because she's a minor.

[Monica Padman]

You can try it. No, I can tell. Like on this side, I was basically re. I was re piercing it and it. Whatever. That was fine. And then I was trying so hard to re pierce on this side, but I think because the hole's a little close to the edge, it was not working.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And that's fine. You know, whatever. And then that night I took out all the piercings and other than just my original piercing, everything was so inflamed.

[Dax Shepard]

Imani, it's not an option for you. You have a lot of gifts and of course you're gonna have some not gifts. And in this case it's that you don't have that freedom.

[Monica Padman]

I'm not willing to live a life where I can't have two.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, then you're just gonna be impost and inflamed and in. In.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

I'm just telling you, like, you're just warning me. Yeah. That if you see some goo, I'm choosing that.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, but you're saying no to the piercings. Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, that's just my vote. I mean, you have watch him pick the middle am.

[Monica Padman]

You better not.

[Dax Shepard]

You should do it.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Billy Crudup]

Natalie has ear issues with her piercings too, so.

[Dax Shepard]

And you. You enjoy dealing with those. I know not to talk about.

[Billy Crudup]

Talk about it.

[Dax Shepard]

Wiser than me. He's more like a 70 year old grandpa. He learned to shut the up better than me.

[Monica Padman]

But you also to be fair, have had to cut the earrings out.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Which I like.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. You enjoy that. So I'm kind of surprised.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm actually working against my own self interest here because it denies me the chance to be a hero.

[Monica Padman]

You love performing surgery and mean a hero. A big hero.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Do you need me to Nair anything?

[Monica Padman]

No, I'm good.

[Dax Shepard]

Your arms or anything?

[Monica Padman]

Oh, I do. Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

You want me to narrow your nar?

[Monica Padman]

But I am going to do a laser hair.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. On that removal.

[Monica Padman]

Lighter hair removal. All right, well, I guess let's do some facts. I have other things to say, but we'll be back.

[Dax Shepard]

We'll be back.

[Monica Padman]

All right, now we start the episode off by talking about pumpkin spice.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, sure.

[Monica Padman]

I'm here to tell you what's in pumpkin spice.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Perfume.

[Monica Padman]

Nope.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Typically includes cinnamon, nutmeg, ginger, allspice, and cloves. Delicious.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. But mani. Don't you think that's the taste that you're tasting? I don't think pumpkin is real. I don't think it's in the mix. I think what you're tasting is like that combination of those very unique flavors we've labeled pumpkin flavor. I don't think that's real.

[Monica Padman]

The name can be misleading as it does not contain pumpkin itself.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow. I didn't even.

[Monica Padman]

That was commonly used to flavor pumpkin based desserts and drinks.

[Dax Shepard]

I think that's what everyone thinks pumpkin tastes like.

[Monica Padman]

If you just take the inside of a pumpkin, you add that those spices.

[Dax Shepard]

In what you're tasting, and what you come back for is that the pumpkin is just like a vehicle. And I'd argue a poor one for delivering this incredible, incredible alchemy of tastes.

[Monica Padman]

Wow.

[Dax Shepard]

And perfumes.

[Monica Padman]

But, you know, it's a little like.

[Dax Shepard]

Rest assured, there's no pumpkin in your pumpkin spice latte.

[Monica Padman]

There's pumpkin spice, but that's not.

[Dax Shepard]

There's no pumpkin in it.

[Monica Padman]

You're right.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

That was a cute mashup.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Punk kid.

[Monica Padman]

There was a punk kin. A little baby.

[Dax Shepard]

A CC Little baby.

[Monica Padman]

She looks so cute.

[Dax Shepard]

She had a radical mohawk. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Because her dad's a hair stylist, so he did her hairstylist, and it. Oh, my God. Was she cute.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh. Was outrageous.

[Monica Padman]

G. Okay, okay. So when you buy pumpkin spice, the little container that says pumpkin spice, this is what you're getting.

[Dax Shepard]

You're. Yeah. You're not getting any pumpkin. And you could have called it carbuncle spice.

[Monica Padman]

No. You know what they should call it? And actually, this is appropriation. I'm going to say it.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh. Oh. Oh. What's in there?

[Monica Padman]

I'm sort of scab.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh.

[Monica Padman]

From your hair top, maybe? Let's hope.

[Dax Shepard]

Too damp. Too much moisture. I just pictured your room at night. Tropical. When you're wearing your hair.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my towel.

[Dax Shepard]

Cause, like, it just keeps all that moisture in your hair and somehow makes the whole room tropical.

[Monica Padman]

I don't sleep in it.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, you don't? What do you do? You just dry your hair with it?

[Monica Padman]

No. After the shower, I tie it up, put it in its towel, and I like, you know, bop around for a while.

[Dax Shepard]

Hours.

[Monica Padman]

Like an hour.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

And then sometimes only 15 minutes.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

And then I take it out, and then I sleep on a silk pillowcase that. That night.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, Only that night?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Because why.

[Monica Padman]

If I. If it's wet hair, I sleep with the silk pillowcase because I. Because silk pillowcases are notoriously better for your hair. I don't really necessarily think that might.

[Dax Shepard]

Be a pumpkin spice latte thing.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. It might be misleading, but I buy in when I'm trying to have that hair the next day.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

You might as well do it.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

It's not gonna make it worse. Exactly. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. Appropriation. Because these are all the things in Chai. Aha.

[Dax Shepard]

Huh.

[Monica Padman]

So I feel a little like just different doses. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Dosages of those things.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. It's a grievance, I'll tell you.

[Dax Shepard]

I guess if you're. If you're talking about appropriation to chai, then, yes, I think you have a. An argument. If you're saying appropriating the pumpkin because there's really no pumpkin. But they're coasting on people's.

[Monica Padman]

I'm saying pumpkin spice is appropriating.

[Dax Shepard]

I got you. I got you. Because I was gonna say, then. Well, they're kind of lifting the image of the pumpkin.

[Monica Padman]

Sure. The pumpkin is winning.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. The pumpkin's a big, dumb, ugly.

[Monica Padman]

No, it's a. I love them, but.

[Dax Shepard]

You gotta acknowledge them. They're not uniform. They're always dented. They always look like they have a tumor somewhere on them. Yeah, that.

[Monica Padman]

Not the ones I picked.

[Dax Shepard]

They're an ugly offering, and they're enormous. They have elephantitis.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yuck.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. How many tributaries flow into the Amazon?

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, God, there's got to be thousands.

[Monica Padman]

1100 tributaries. With 17 of them being longer than 1500 kilometers. 930 miles.

[Dax Shepard]

Whoa.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. Is Manhasset the name of a Native American tri. That was his guess, right?

[Dax Shepard]

Or that it was a Native American word. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And he's right. Manhasset is named after the Native American word manhanet, which means island neighborhood. This name comes from a tribe of Native Americans who lived in the area before European settlement and used the nearby bay for fishing and shellfishing.

[Dax Shepard]

So then he was right in that Manhattan is also.

[Monica Padman]

I think you added Manhattan in there. Maybe. And it all sounds right.

[Dax Shepard]

He's SM than me.

[Monica Padman]

He was smart.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, he was very smart. Is Manhasset exit 36 off Long Island? No, he's not smart.

[Dax Shepard]

Thank God.

[Monica Padman]

Exit 36 on the long Island Expressway is for Singerton Road. Manhasset is served by nearby exits, such as exit 32 for little neck Parkway, which is west of Manhasset and further east, exits that lead into the area.

[Dax Shepard]

The lie. Isn't that what people say?

[Monica Padman]

Probably. Okay, how many people are descendants of Charlemagne?

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. It's estimated that nearly everyone in Europe is descended from Charlemagne.

[Dax Shepard]

What?

[Monica Padman]

And therefore related to him and each other. This is because Charlemagne had at least 20 children who established royal lines. And due to the large number of people in Europe, genealogies fold in on themselves, making it statistically certain that nearly all Europeans share common ancestors like Charlemagne.

[Dax Shepard]

Whoa, whoa. It's not that he fucked as much as Genghis Khan.

[Monica Padman]

Doesn't seem like that. Because now I looked up Genghis Khan.

[Dax Shepard]

He had thousands of children.

[Monica Padman]

An estimated 16 million people are direct male line descendants of Genghis Khan.

[Dax Shepard]

Direct.

[Monica Padman]

Which is about 0.5% of the world's males population.

[Dax Shepard]

Wow.

[Monica Padman]

This figure is based on studies of the Y chromosome, which is passed from father to son. Millions of other people are likely descended from him through female ancestors, but this cannot be traced genetically using the same method.

[Dax Shepard]

So it's double. It's not like he had only had male offspring. I'm sure he had. Fitty. Fitty.

[Monica Padman]

It's insane.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Do you think I am a descendant of him?

[Dax Shepard]

No, I don't.

[Monica Padman]

Do you think I'm a descendant of Charlemagne?

[Dax Shepard]

Nope. I think you're a descendant of Sid Arthur.

[Monica Padman]

I'm more likely a descendant of Genghis Khan than Charlemagne. If we had to pick on its.

[Dax Shepard]

What do they say? Prima facie.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, Perma. Prima Dubner said that multiple times.

[Dax Shepard]

Prima facia.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

On the surface, yes, that makes sense. But they both had empires, and I don't know which one spread closer to India or not. Even though I did read the Genghis Khan book, which was great.

[Monica Padman]

Maybe I'm a descendant of both Charlemagne and Genghis Khan.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, double whammy.

[Monica Padman]

Secondhand Smoke rates. I looked that up for fun. Nothing related to the episode.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, I'm just kidding.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, I'm kidding. It came up. According to the CDC, secondhand smoke is responsible for an estimated 41,000 deaths per year in the United States. This includes 7,300 deaths from lung cancer, 33,900 deaths from heart disease, and 400 deaths from sudden infant death syndrome. Yeah, no one likes that last one.

[Dax Shepard]

That's from living people who live with a smoker, I guess.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

You shouldn't have to do the time if you don't do the crime.

[Monica Padman]

I know, it's sad.

[Dax Shepard]

I was inundated with secondhand smoke in my childhood. I know because my father smoked in the car with the windows up. Then my grandparents smoked and I was with them a ton. They both smoked.

[Monica Padman]

How long did your dad smoke? Till the end of his life.

[Dax Shepard]

Quit smoking. I want to say 10 years before he died.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. So mostly.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And really voluminous levels of. He would go through these phases. Like I remember my mom telling me this time when they were newly married and he had started this company selling door to door mini bikes. And he was like, it was all in.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And then the company collapsed and they couldn't deliver orders and like he was done. He didn't know what he was gonna do. And she said that he sat in a la Z boy for like two months straight, all day long every day and just chain smoked cigarettes. Smoked like five packs a day. And then one day woke up and took a shower and put a suit on and went and got a job somewhere else. But he'd have these. Yeah. Even when he was healthy and sober, he still smoked like two and a half packs or more a day.

[Monica Padman]

That's a lot. As you know, my dad stopped smoking for me.

[Dax Shepard]

How. How long did he smoke?

[Monica Padman]

Smoked a long time. Because in India they smoke a lot.

[Dax Shepard]

Four years old, you smoke? Yeah. He smiled.

[Monica Padman]

Started as a baby boy and then.

[Dax Shepard]

They do in Papua New Guinea. Probably not anymore, but as recently as like 15 years ago, kids, they wean children from breastfeeding with cigarettes.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Yeah. Wow. And no lung cancer.

[Monica Padman]

Really?

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Well, on the ethnographies where they did chest X rays, there was no lung cancer.

[Monica Padman]

That's strange.

[Dax Shepard]

That's what all these people build their theory on that like it's really the chemicals that are in the American cigarettes. But I. I don't agree with. Do that.

[Monica Padman]

But that's where it comes from, huh? But yeah, yeah, he smoked a lot. And then He. He had to quit for his little girl. No pit stop.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, no pit stops.

[Monica Padman]

But it took him a couple. A couple tries.

[Dax Shepard]

Does he desire it ever? Does he, like, see it in a movie? I kind of want to bang a dart with a joke.

[Monica Padman]

No.

[Dax Shepard]

Come on. When he's 18, he's not good.

[Monica Padman]

He doesn't want to anymore. There is no pit stop.

[Dax Shepard]

Him and I sitting out on the porch of either his southern home or my southern home, banging some Camel lights, just reminiscing.

[Monica Padman]

I think he has, like, what you have with drinking. Like, there's nothing about it that doesn't.

[Dax Shepard]

Even think about it.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, he switched to.

[Dax Shepard]

To.

[Monica Padman]

To get off of it. He switched to a pipe.

[Dax Shepard]

That's silly.

[Monica Padman]

And then he had to get back on. He missed it. He had to get back on it. Yeah, no, but I think he got back on the pipe or something and then. Then he was done.

[Dax Shepard]

And you know when we say on the pipe generally in the 80s, we're talking about the crack cocaine.

[Monica Padman]

No, his wasn't like that.

[Dax Shepard]

It's just weird for you to say my dad got back on the pipe.

[Monica Padman]

He talks. He sometimes talks about his pipe. Okay. Now, unc, speaking of southern homes, UNC is an incredibly hard school to get in out of state.

[Dax Shepard]

Is it?

[Monica Padman]

Yes. And one of my best friends went there and it was like a big deal.

[Dax Shepard]

Sure.

[Monica Padman]

Out of state students make up no more than 18% of the first year undergraduate class at UNC Chapel Hill due to its uncle system policy. And then I thought, this is interesting. I wanted to look up hardest. Okay. United States public colleges ranked by lowest acceptance rate. But I wanted public colleges.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. I like this. I like this a lot. Fingers crossed.

[Monica Padman]

What do you.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, I feel like Berkeley is going to be very high on that list.

[Monica Padman]

And that's what you want?

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, I want all the UCs to be high on the list. Yeah. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Well, congratulations. UCLA is number one.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow. I did not see this coming. This. This is a big. I'm proud of you for read. If I were you, I would have saw that. Be like. I didn't even see that. I'm gonna keep going.

[Monica Padman]

I. I am a woman of integrity.

[Dax Shepard]

Number one in the whole country.

[Monica Padman]

9%, Bo. And. But we're out of.

[Dax Shepard]

Also they've passed Berkeley. Because when I went there, it was Berkeley, then ucla.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Out of state. It's not really fucking hard.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Number two is the Naval Academy.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

I'm kind of surprised they count that, but sure.

[Dax Shepard]

All right, let's throw that out. That's Bad.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. I don't count that. Berkeley. Number two. Next.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, number two.

[Monica Padman]

Then we got Air Force Academy. I also don't know.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, so what's number three?

[Monica Padman]

Then we got military academy. No.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Although we want to say to our men and women in the service, obviously, this is very important, and we're. And we're grateful.

[Monica Padman]

That's so hard to get what we're meaning.

[Dax Shepard]

No, we want state colleges now in the civilian world.

[Monica Padman]

So we got. We got ucla.

[Dax Shepard]

So far, all we got is ucla, Berkeley. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And guess what number three is.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, you're smiling so big as if it's uga, but I couldn't possibly be. I. I would say it's U of.

[Monica Padman]

M. No, it's not. No, it's Georgia Tech.

[Dax Shepard]

Georgia Tech. Okay, so you're feeling some pride.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, because my dad went to Georgia Tech.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay, then just to remind people, you. You went to uga, right?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Oh, my God. This weekend I got the cutest vintage Georgia Bulldog shirt.

[Billy Crudup]

Oh, you did?

[Monica Padman]

So cute. I love it. I can't wait to wear it. Okay, then we got uva, University of Virginia.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Then we got University of Michigan.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, boy. So number one, five or six once we dump all those military academies.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, if we're not counting military, we have ucla.

[Dax Shepard]

Let's just remember the list. Ucla, Berkeley, Georgia Tech, uva, U of.

[Monica Padman]

M, Michigan, number five.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

And then UNC Chapel Hill.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Well, this is a. This is a good day for me.

[Monica Padman]

I also don't necessarily trust this because I am absolutely not on board with the next few.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, really quick, what's the percentage at U of m? And number five, if UCLA was nine?

[Monica Padman]

18.

[Dax Shepard]

18. So does twice as hard.

[Monica Padman]

We got some more UCs a little further.

[Dax Shepard]

You know, this would. This would guide my decision on what college I wanted to work at in the admissions department. I would not want to work at ucla. So it means you have to sift through, oh, tens of thousands of applications to get down to your 9%. That's too much work. I want to go to a place with, like, a 78% acceptance rate.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

So that I'm only reading an extra 30. Some percent.

[Monica Padman]

How did you even get into that school? If this is the way you think?

[Dax Shepard]

I know a corner cutter, a shortcutter.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, yeah. UGA is on this list. It's on the second page.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. What number is.

[Monica Padman]

It's not. It's not.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, we didn't get a number. We didn't. Okay.

[Monica Padman]

We also threw out some other numbers.

[Dax Shepard]

Did they Just list all the state.

[Monica Padman]

No.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

There's a lot more. There's five pages.

[Dax Shepard]

Is. Is Penn not a public.

[Monica Padman]

Penn is private, I think.

[Dax Shepard]

University of Pennsylvania now. Private. That's private.

[Monica Padman]

Why? It's so expensive and like Wharton.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Wharton.

[Monica Padman]

Anyway, that was interesting.

[Billy Crudup]

Wow.

[Dax Shepard]

I feel really good now. That was really good.

[Monica Padman]

I'm like. I just really resist. I want to be.

[Dax Shepard]

Be.

[Monica Padman]

I. You're making it so hard. Get it so hard. Because you are. You were a California resident.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, I was. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Just want to.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

I just want to say that.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah. And you were a Georgia resident.

[Monica Padman]

I regret, you know, only because of this. I deeply regret not applying. Applying to some other schools.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

I only did the one.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Like, the joy you'd feel right now if you go, like. Well, I turned down UCLA out of state.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't know, though, if that would have been.

[Monica Padman]

How dare you.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, Monica, Monica, Monica, Monica.

[Monica Padman]

We have the exact same iq.

[Dax Shepard]

To the point. Oh, okay. Okay, okay. I'm gonna let that one just go away. You want to get into that one? I don't know that I have a higher or lower IQ than you, but what I maintain is that that wasn't an IQ test. That. That's just. Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Our. On our cognitive test.

[Dax Shepard]

On our cognitive test.

[Monica Padman]

The.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes.

[Monica Padman]

To the point.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes.

[Monica Padman]

Tenth of a point.

[Billy Crudup]

You.

[Dax Shepard]

You can be smarter than me.

[Monica Padman]

I'm not saying I am.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm just saying that was an IQ test. Okay, then what was the other thing I was upset about? You made a lot of inflammatory statements.

[Monica Padman]

Really get into ucla.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, I do know.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, let's hear it.

[Dax Shepard]

It only. And it only got worse. Okay, we would. I can answer if you would get in or not, because I know what the starting GPA was for freshmen at ucla.

[Monica Padman]

You mean entering freshman.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. Okay, I recall that you did have a 4.0. Right.

[Monica Padman]

I graduated from Georgia with a.

[Dax Shepard]

Not geor. Your high school.

[Monica Padman]

I didn't have a 4.

[Dax Shepard]

0. You didn't have a 4. 0?

[Monica Padman]

No.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, great. And so in order to. I. Yeah, but the starting average grade point for A freshman was 4.08.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

The average person had gotten all A's and did some AP classes and got a.

[Monica Padman]

Actually, I would. I need to go back. I. I need to know what my GPA was, because I did get. I was in a lot of AP classes, so I got a lot of bonus.

[Dax Shepard]

Sure.

[Monica Padman]

So I don't really remember, but let's just say.

[Dax Shepard]

Let's call. Let's That's a bit. A big thing to assume. That's. That means you never ever got a B.

[Monica Padman]

No, I got. I got beat.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

I did not. So I do well in physics.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Or chemistry.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

I mean. And when I say did not do well, that means B. I never got below a B in anything.

[Dax Shepard]

Right. And Jim, how'd you do? Enjoy.

[Monica Padman]

I did great, you guys. I am a great athlete.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Okay.

[Monica Padman]

I did like 45 pull ups.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow.

[Monica Padman]

I was so light back then.

[Dax Shepard]

Sure, sure, sure.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. I think those were the B's. Physics and chemistry.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Which is incredible. But I do things. Would've ruled you out for admission.

[Monica Padman]

I don't know about that.

[Dax Shepard]

Because you're not ready to admit that.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. It was probably the average entrance. So some people got in under that.

[Dax Shepard]

And conversely, many people had four people point twos.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, but some people had 3.8s.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. If they had a 2000 on their SAT or whatever the hell.

[Monica Padman]

No such thing. See?

[Dax Shepard]

1800.

[Monica Padman]

1600.

[Dax Shepard]

1600. Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Which I also did not have.

[Dax Shepard]

Right. Okay. Okay. So you know what?

[Monica Padman]

I think my essay would have really been compelling.

[Dax Shepard]

I tell myself that my essay is what got me in.

[Monica Padman]

And. And I would have a diversity bump.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Now we're talking. You got a little.

[Monica Padman]

Little diversity bump, both as an Indian person and as a Southern girl.

[Dax Shepard]

No, you don't get that.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, you get that.

[Dax Shepard]

No, they're not trying to.

[Monica Padman]

They want that.

[Dax Shepard]

Make sure the people from the South.

[Monica Padman]

I think they want that. Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Maybe Southern Indian like Carol, but not Southern.

[Monica Padman]

I'm working on with 2, 3.

[Dax Shepard]

You think you have.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, Now, Alexander technique. He talked about teacher, like a very prominent Alexander technique teacher at uc. Excuse me, at nyu. Not on the list, because that is a private school.

[Dax Shepard]

You can get in with like a 2.3. I think 400 on your SAT.

[Monica Padman]

And I. I think it might be most Stiles because she taught the Alexander technique for decades before her passing in 2020 at the Graduate Acting Program at NYU. I do think he said he, so.

[Dax Shepard]

You know, I feel like he said he as well.

[Monica Padman]

He did. It might be. It might be. We don't need to know. Might be. We don't need to do that.

[Dax Shepard]

We don't deal in hypotheticals here.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Tom Stoppard is Czechoslovak Bach in. He got that right.

[Dax Shepard]

And I guess I should read a Tom Stoppard play.

[Monica Padman]

Great place. I wonder when you. When you come over to my new house, if you'll be impressed by how smart I am, because I have, like, so many plays.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

That I read and studied. And you can flip through them and you can see my notes.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. They'll be on display in your new house.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Right now they're like, behind the couch, they're hard to see. But in my house, you're going to be able to see them better. And I think you're going to have a whole new opinion on whether or not I could get into ucla.

[Dax Shepard]

All right. Tbd. Okay. Well, I can't believe UCLA was number one. That really went my way. That's like a real blessing you went to that school.

[Billy Crudup]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And as an in state resident.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh. I mean, even worse, you want to keep piling on as a transfer student, which is also.

[Monica Padman]

I decided not to say that.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. You felt like that was picking. Punching down.

[Monica Padman]

I felt like that was a little too much.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, that's punching down.

[Monica Padman]

Well, that's it.

[Dax Shepard]

All right. Well, that was lovely.

[Monica Padman]

Uncle Baby Billy. Not Uncle Baby Billy, but, you know, Billy Crudup.

[Dax Shepard]

Uncle Baby Billy Crudup. Our right. Love you.

[Monica Padman]

Love you.

[Dax Shepard]

Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondry app, Amazon Music or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to every episode of Armchair Expert early and ad free right now by joining Wondry plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short [e-mail] survey.

[Billy Crudup]

Mom and dad, mom and mom, dad and dad. Whatever parents.

[Dax Shepard]

Are you about to spend five hours.

[Billy Crudup]

In the car with your beloved kids this holiday season driving old granny's house? I'm setting the scene. I'm picturing screaming, fighting back to back hours of the K Pop Demon Hunter soundtrack on repeat. Well, when your ears start to bleed.

[Dax Shepard]

I have the perfect thing to keep.

[Billy Crudup]

You from rolling out of that moving vehicle.

[Dax Shepard]

Something for the whole family.

[Billy Crudup]

He's filled with laughs.

[Dax Shepard]

He's filled with rage. The OG Green Grump.

[Billy Crudup]

Give it up for me, James Austin Johnson as the Grinch. And like any insufferable influencer these days, I'm bringing my crew of lesser talented friends along for the ride with a list guests like Gronk, Mark Hamill and the Jonas Brothers, whoever they are, there's.

[Dax Shepard]

A little bit of something for everyone.

[Billy Crudup]

Listen to Tis the Grinch Holiday Podcast, wherever you get your podcasts.