Can It Be Fixed?

Summary

Podcast Summary: Armstrong & Getty On Demand – "Can It Be Fixed?"

Date: September 11, 2025
Hosts: Jack Armstrong & Joe Getty
Main Theme:
The aftermath and significance of Charlie Kirk’s assassination—a reflection on political violence, free speech, internet-fueled polarization, and whether America’s current trajectory can be fixed.

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on the shocking assassination of conservative activist Charlie Kirk at a Utah college campus. Armstrong & Getty explore what Kirk’s murder reveals about the state of American political discourse, the toxic effects of social media, the erosion of civil debate—especially on college campuses—and the rising specter of political violence. The discussion is sober, occasionally heated, but aims to grapple earnestly with the deeper questions: Can American society recover from this kind of polarization? Is it already too late?

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Charlie Kirk’s Legacy and the Tragedy of His Death

• [03:29–04:08] The hosts name Kirk as their “general manager” of the day, emphasizing his push for open but civil debate on campuses.
  • “It's hard to imagine a more American thing than going around to college campuses and saying, who disagrees with me? Move to the front, and then you have a reasonable discussion about things.” (Jack Armstrong, 04:08)
  • Charlie Kirk was known for encouraging direct, peaceful engagement with ideological opponents.
• His assassination is framed as an assault not only on an individual but on the principle of free, peaceful exchange of ideas.

2. Polarization & Failure of Discourse on College Campuses

• [04:35–05:59] The inability to host opposing viewpoints on campuses is discussed as a “basic” breakdown of democracy.
  • “If we can't do that, then I guess people can't govern themselves and you have to have a king or a dictator because we're just incapable of holding it together.” (Jack Armstrong, 04:37)
• The contrast between event promotions and activist resistance is illustrated (Turning Point USA’s “join the discussion” vs. Change.org’s claim his presence is an “outrage”).

3. Pessimism About Fixing Political Violence

• [05:59–07:11] Both hosts express deep pessimism about turning things around, citing social media’s role in fomenting hatred.
  • “No, we're not going to stop claiming that the other side is out to jail us, throw in prison or kill us…I'm not sure it can be fixed.” (Jack Armstrong, 05:59)
  • They note that political leaders only call out violence from the “other side,” never their own—a big part of the problem.

4. The Internet’s Role in Radicalization

• [07:11–09:42] The hosts highlight how the web enables isolated, unhinged individuals to form reinforcing communities.
  • “If you get on the Internet, that same ratio…is a community of 800,000 worldwide who then enforce each other's stupid, vicious, sick ideas. How we get beyond that, I don't have any idea.” (Co-host, 07:11)
• The hosts liken the internet’s effect to fentanyl: “wonderful and horribly dangerous” (08:25).

5. Media & Gatekeeping in Tragedy Response

• [09:03–09:42] Armstrong praises major news outlets and political leaders for unified, respectful statements after the assassination, but laments that their influence is waning.
  • “All living presidents, all your big time leaders, Nancy Pelosi, whoever, everybody, they said the right things…but they just don't have the influence they used to have.” (Jack Armstrong, 09:03)

6. Speculation About the Assassin & Impact on Discourse

• [09:49–12:16] The hosts debate whether the mystery around the assassin’s identity might—temporarily—focus attention more on the wider climate of violence rather than the individual’s motives or affiliations.
  • They acknowledge both the possibility of a lone lunatic and something more organized, but stress that toxic rhetoric radicalizes the unhinged.

7. The Loss of Optimism About Politics

• [12:16–13:21] Armstrong admits he’s “always long term optimistic about myself…but not about the state of our politics. Not long term optimistic."
  • “For whatever reason, I am not about the state of our politics at all. Long term optimistic.” (Jack Armstrong, 12:16)

8. Family Impact and the Search for the Shooter

• [13:21–14:23] The hosts share the horror that Kirk’s family—wife and children—witnessed the murder.
  • “They were at the event. Oh, that's horrible.” (Jack Armstrong, 13:41)
  • Hope expressed that authorities will quickly apprehend the killer, noting the security and evidence at the college campus.

9. Charlie Kirk’s Own Words and Mission

• [15:23–15:55, 26:11–27:29] Clips of Kirk emphasize his commitment to open debate:
  • “I go around universities and have challenging conversations because…when people stop talking, that's when violence happens.” (Charlie Kirk, 26:53)
  • “There's more people that agree with me than some people would actually believe…so that we put [the debates] on the Internet so people can see these ideas collide.” (Charlie Kirk, 27:11)

10. Governor Spencer Cox’s Eloquent Statements

• [27:29–32:35] Extensive clips from Utah Governor Cox call Kirk’s killing a “political assassination” and warn about the threat to fundamental rights:
  • “When someone takes the life of a person because of their ideas or their ideals, then that very constitutional foundation is threatened.” (Gov. Cox, 31:34)
  • “If anyone in the sound of my voice celebrated even a little bit at the news of this shooting, I would beg you to look in the mirror and to see if you can find a better angel in there somewhere.” (Gov. Cox, 32:14)

11. Widespread—But Not Universal—Condemnation

• [33:38–34:44] The hosts stress that, despite some fringe celebrations of Kirk’s murder, the response was “a much better universal outcry of this is awful than…in a long time.”
  • Armstrong tries to imagine if his reaction would be any different if the victim were on the opposite side, and concludes it would not.

12. The Modern Spread of Violent Ideas

• [29:28–30:10; 36:06–39:34] Discussion on how new mechanisms of idea spread, especially viral posts, make marginal views more potent. The bulk’s ability to suppress the fringes is diminished.
• The rise in polling numbers accepting political violence is cited as deeply worrying.
  • “A truly shocking number of Americans…thought that, you know, it is occasionally justified to kill your opponent in politics.” (Co-host, 37:10)

13. Media, Social Response, and Difficult Conversations

• [44:23–48:22] Conversation about how graphic video of the assassination went viral among kids before parents could discuss the event.
• Readings of listener emails show grief, anger, dismay—some heartbreaking, such as kids at a high school cheering Kirk’s murder.
  • “Those kids who erupted in cheers or laughter at that, they didn't raise themselves…They heard somebody from the other side just got shot to death in front of his wife and little kids and said yay. That is the worst thing I’ve heard…” (Jack Armstrong, 47:57)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On America’s Founding Principles

  • “That is as basic to the structure of people being able to govern themselves as you can possibly get.”
    —Jack Armstrong [04:37]

• On Social Media as a Radicalization Engine

  • “The Internet is that—it’s wonderful and horribly dangerous. I don’t think people are cognizant to that.”
    —Co-host [08:25]

• On the New Reality of Public Discourse

  • “The mechanisms by which ideas are traded and spread have changed completely…It’s a different machine now.”
    —Co-host [29:28]

• On the Consequence of Political Violence

  • “If you start down the road of political violence, it’s over. There’s no winning that race to the bottom. It’s the end of the experiment.”
    —Jack Armstrong [29:52]

• On a Glimmer of Hope

  • “I was happy to see that…your old school gatekeepers…treated this 100% like the tragedy it was.”
    —Jack Armstrong [09:03]

• On the Limits of Eloquence

  • “Unfortunately, the most eloquent words we could generate…just—I don’t think that those who would carry out such a horrific act can be reached, which is a horrifying notion.”
    —Co-host [28:15]

• On the Loss of Optimism

  • “For whatever reason, I am not about the state of our politics at all. Long term optimistic.”
    —Jack Armstrong [12:16]

• On Exposure to Graphic Violence

  • “Executive producer Hansen and I both had the same experience of picking our kids up from school, wanting to explain to them what happened…they’d already seen the most graphic of videos multiple times before we even got to them at school.”
    —Jack Armstrong [44:23]

• On Young People Cheering the Murder

  • “Those kids who erupted in cheers…didn’t raise themselves. They heard somebody from the other side just got shot to death in front of his wife and little kids and said yay.”
    —Jack Armstrong [47:57]

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Key Timestamps

• 03:29–04:08: Charlie Kirk’s role as a standard-bearer for civil campus debate.
• 04:37–05:12: If open debate collapses, democracy can't survive.
• 06:37–07:11: The tribes only call out violence on the other side—not their own.
• 07:11–08:25: The internet’s role in radicalizing isolated individuals.
• 09:03–09:42: Mainstream institutions treat the assassination soberly, but their influence is diminished.
• 12:16–13:21: Hosts discuss their own lack of long-term optimism for politics.
• 15:23–15:55: Charlie Kirk’s own mission in his words.
• 26:11–27:29: More from Charlie Kirk on why he risked college tours.
• 27:29–32:35: Gov. Spencer Cox: Free speech, condemnation of violence, warning for the nation.
• 33:38–34:44: Reactions from both sides, reflection on empathy for political opponents.
• 37:10–37:48: Citing polling on Americans’ rising acceptance of political violence.
• 44:23–45:54: Spread of video among youth before parental explanation.

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Conclusion

Tone & Closing Thoughts:
The mood throughout is one of deep concern, even despair, about the prospects for healing American civic life in the wake of political assassination. Armstrong & Getty try repeatedly to draw listeners’ focus to the real enemy—not the “other side” but the descent into violence and the abandonment of civil argument.

They express hope that Kirk’s death, as tragic as it is, could serve as a warning wake-up call—but the episode closes with more uncertainty than hope.

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For Listeners Who Haven’t Tuned In

This episode is a sobering but honest reckoning with America’s political divide, the dangers of new media, and the unparalleled threat posed when violence supplants debate. Armstrong & Getty don’t offer easy answers, but insist that any healing must start with genuine self-examination—including challenging our own “side.” The episode is essential listening for anyone worried about the future of free speech and democratic norms in America.

Transcript

[Jack Armstrong]

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Learn more at TiVo.com America is changing and so is the world.

[Jack Armstrong]

But what's happening in America isn't just.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

The cause of global upheaval.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere.

[Joe Getty]

I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, DC.

[Jack Armstrong]

I'm Tristan Redman in London and this.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Is the Global Story.

[Joe Getty]

Every weekday we'll bring you a story from this intersection where the world and America meet.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jack Armstrong]

A new NFL season means a fresh start and fresh styles. At NFLShop.com, you'll find the latest jerseys, hats and sideline gear to rep your team all season long. From rookies making their debut to legends, NFLShop.com has it all. Score exclusive styles you won't find anywhere else and show up ready for every kickoff and big play Fan like a pro and shop [e-mail] broadcasting live from the Abraham Lincoln radio studio at the.

[Joe Getty]

George Washington Broadcast Center, Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Armstrong and Jetty. And now here's Armstrong and Getty live.

[Jack Armstrong]

From Studio C in a dimly lit.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Room deep within the bowels of the.

[Jack Armstrong]

Armstrong Getty Communications compound. And today, y' all were under the tutelage of our general manager, Charlie Kirk.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Of course, and his message, which I pray will carry on or perhaps even be amplified.

[Jack Armstrong]

And what message was that?

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

That we need to talk to each other civilly and trade ideas out in the open. He was also a fierce advocate for conservative notions and against the woke crowd. But his methods were entirely enthusiastically peaceful and friendly. Yeah, for that, he was murdered.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's hard to imagine a. A more American thing than going around to college campuses and saying, who disagrees with me? Move to the front, and then you have a reasonable discussion about things. I mean, if we can't do that, we are 100% doomed.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, I would, I would say so.

[Jack Armstrong]

I mean, that is as basic to the structure of people being able to govern themselves as you can possibly get. And if, if, if we no longer can do that. And I question whether we can. I mean, one political view has not been welcome on college campuses for a very long time. And if we can't do that, then I guess people can't govern themselves and you have to have a king or a dictator because we're just incapable of holding it together.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

So it would seem. So a little contrast here. Turning Point USA's announcement about Charlie's visit that ended in his assassination joined Charlie Kirk on campus for a lively discussion of freedom in America. Don't agree with Charlie. Great. Go to the front of the line. See you there. Meanwhile, change.org, the progressive organization, put out a statement. Kirk's presence and the message he delivers. Let's just stop there. Kirk's presence stands in contrast to the values of understanding, acceptance, and progress that many of us hold dear. His very right to. And acceptance of the invitation to speak is an outrage to those people.

[Jack Armstrong]

Well, that's one of the reasons I'm very down about this. I am not optimistic at all that we can turn this around, maybe at all. Certainly not short term. No, we're not going to stop claiming that the other side is out to jail us, throw in prison or kill us. We're not going to stop doing that. I don't think because of the function of social media and our culture combined with social media, with modern communication. I just, I'M not sure it can be fixed.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right, right. As I've said many times. Oh, just a quick observation that, yeah, I share your pessimism because some prominent politicians, like the most prominent one on the Republican side, said we've got to stop the violence, for instance, and they called out only left wing violence. Right. And then many, many Democrats rolled out and said, we've got to stop the violence and called out only right wing.

[Jack Armstrong]

Violence, as we have said before. And people are saying now when people start calling out their own side, then we have a chance. But I don't know when that's going to occur.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right, right. Well, and back to your Internet point. And this is, this is one of the firmest beliefs I have about the modern world. And some of you have heard me say this before, so I'll give you the short version. But for all of human history, if you had an awful, unhinged idea, everyone around you, your world would tell you that's an awful, unhinged idea. Because there's only one jackass, you know, for 500 square miles who thinks something is stupid and unhinged as you. Right. But if you get on the Internet, that same ratio of one stupid sick person every 500 miles is a community of 800,000 worldwide who then enforce each other's stupid, vicious, sick ideas. How we get beyond that, I don't have any idea.

[Jack Armstrong]

Oh, and it gets better if you lean that political direction. The algorithm of whatever site you go to on a regular basis feeds you that stuff as if that's the only thing that's out there and feeds you the worst of the other side to amplify your disgust with them.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, I don't know the right metaphor, but I think healthy people, sane people, need to start looking at the Internet like, I don't, and again, I don't know what the right metaphor is, but something like, like fentanyl for instance, which is an extremely useful surgical drug and incredibly horribly dangerous. Couldn't be more dangerous. The Internet is that it's wonderful and horribly dangerous. I don't think people are cognizant to that.

[Jack Armstrong]

I, like a lot of people thought when the Internet came along that.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

You.

[Jack Armstrong]

Know, the democratization of information and doing away with the gatekeepers of information was such a good thing. It clearly was not. And, and, and is not. And I don't know if there's any coming back. I was happy to see that almost entirely your old school gatekeepers yesterday treated this like the tragedy. It was like I watched the ABC evening news. They treated this 100% like the tragedy it was from the beginning. I thought that was great. All living presidents, all your big time leaders, Nancy Pelosi, whoever, everybody, they said the right things, the gatekeepers, but they just don't have the influence they used to have.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right. Yeah. And so certainly not over the sort of people who would engage in this sort of horror. Right.

[Jack Armstrong]

Do you think I was thinking about this on the drive in. They're discussing on Fox how this is the first time that anybody can remember when there's been an amajor, a major assassination or a major assassination attempt where you don't have the person very quickly, like practically immediately.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

So does that help the discussion or hurt the discussion that we don't have any idea who it is? I almost think it helps us frame the discussion around our political discourse that it's out of control and something needs to be done because once you get the individual and you start looking into the things they think and say and then it waters everything down and it's.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Well, then you're prosecuting them and their beliefs as opposed to just violence in general. Yeah, right. Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

And, and it's possible the guy's a complete loon. It's, it's possible that it's a well thought out, coordinated with some group or country they were talking about on fox. Hadn't even thought about that. Charlie Kirk was a big enough deal that there could have been countries that were, would have been willing to take him out. But anyway he could.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Or he was a dedicated Zionist. So it could be a transnational movement of a certain religion. Yeah. Not that I have any information that's true.

[Jack Armstrong]

It just could be, could be something big like that. Or he could be a complete loon. The guy that's on trial right now for the second Trump assassination attempt is a complete lunatic.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

But obviously the current state of rhetoric in this country gets through to the lunatics and tips them off that hey, now's the time. This is do or die time. You do you want to be a patriot, take out whoever.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Well, right. And the, the, the spectrum of how grounded in reality you are ranges from, you know, perfectly sane to completely psychotic. And it's fairly rare you see an assassination who's an assassin, rather, who's fully sane. They're usually unhinged at one level or another. But again, given the reinforcement of the ideas of the unhinged, I mean, without even dabbling into the world of AI, which I was just reading about how it aided and abetted a young man committing suicide. Right. In a way that is just unthinkable. There are enough people like that that the sane among us have to think hard and long about what, if anything can be done about it.

[Jack Armstrong]

One of your network crime and justice reporters said officials believe this was a very well thoroughly planned out assassination, as it almost had to be to, you know, know, know where he was going to be, know where you should be to get the line of sight, have an escape plan. Usually these people don't have any plan for getting out. This person got out of there. I mean it's so it's. Who knows? Yeah. I hope it wasn't coordinated by some other country or transnational group. It's not good. No matter what. I don't know. I am not. It's funny, a friend of mine the other day I was talking about something and was talking about how I am always so long term optimistic and I am about myself and my own little world I can control. I'm always long term optimistic. For whatever reason, I am not about the state of our politics at all. Long term optimistic.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

No, I would agree. I would agree completely. Getting back to the. The murderer, the horrifying destroyer of not only a young man's life and young children's dad, young woman's husband.

[Jack Armstrong]

I just heard that when the kids were there, I didn't know that they were there.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Oh, is that right?

[Jack Armstrong]

They were at the event. Oh, that's horrible.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah. But so a monster who is willing to do that sort of damage to the fabric of the United States and its people, not just the family. I certainly hope he is caught. I presume it's a male as quickly as possible. Let's hope that because there was a vehicle involved almost certainly in the approach in the getaway and college campuses are reasonably secure, that the authorities have the evidence that they need to track this guy down eventually. What a nightmarish scenario it would be if he were to disappear into the the woods and never be apprehended.

[Jack Armstrong]

I can't imagine that that's possible.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

It seems unlikely since the full weight of the federal government is going to be brought to bear here. I'm sure Trump, not to mention the Utah authorities, who are quite suitably sickened and rather enthusiastic about tracking this guy down.

[Jack Armstrong]

I'm sure Trump said to cash Patel whatever expense. This is priority number one.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right. Right.

[Jack Armstrong]

We should start the show officially. There's so much to say about it and we want to hear from you. And we've got the reactions of a lot of pundits and writings and that sort of stuff to pass along today. I'm Jack Armstrong. He's Joe Getty on this. It is Thursday, September 11th, the year 2025. We're Armstrong and Getty and we approve of this program.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah. I just want to mention very briefly that we also have a fair amount of audio of Charlie himself doing the most American thing you can imagine, engaging on issues in the open and discussing the things that matter in America. So let's begin now, according to FCC rules, regs at. Mark, if you could be associated with.

[Jack Armstrong]

One thing, how would you want to be remembered?

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

I want to be. I want to be remembered for.

[Jack Armstrong]

For courage, for my faith. That would be the most important thing.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Most important thing is my faith in my life.

[Jack Armstrong]

Community college dropout Charlie Kirk. What a brain did that guy have? I was listening to some of his getting into arguments with people. One of the reasons he was so confident in arguing with people is he has like all the facts and figures that exist.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

In his brain. Ready to go.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah. I've once in a while heard people use college dropout in a disparaging way. No, he thought this is a waste of time, moving too slow.

[Jack Armstrong]

It would have been a waste of time to go to any college for him. Yes, obviously. But anyway, got a lot more good stuff. I got the headlines on the way. I hope you can stay here. By the way, weigh in text line 415295 KFTC Armstrong and Getty.

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[Joe Getty]

America is changing and so is the world.

[Jack Armstrong]

But what's happening in America isn't just.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

The cause of global upheaval.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere.

[Joe Getty]

I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. i'm.

[Jack Armstrong]

Tristan Redman in London and this is the Global Story.

[Joe Getty]

Every weekday we'll bring you a story from this intersection where the world and America meet.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jack Armstrong]

Some major development and they've got a press conference going on right now in Utah. They just announced that the, they believe the weapon that was used to assassinate Charlie Kirk has been found in a wooded area nearby. So that is interesting. So if it's a super high level planned operation, then it was some sort of untraceable clean gun that the smart thing to do was to immediately discard it and go on and they won't get much out of it or you know, they're gonna be able to trace immediately where it was purchased and who it belonged to and all that sort of stuff. So we'll find out very quickly, I would imagine.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

All right, let's see what else happened in the news. Who's reporting what. It's the lead story with Jensen. Rader Jensen.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah.

[Joe Getty]

A lot of the news news is being dominated right now about the Kirk shooting and investigation going on. Fox News was leading with Governor Spencer Cox declaring Charlie Kirk killing a political assassination at Utah's campus.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, that reminds me. Yeah. We're going to have Governor Cox's speech. His comments yesterday, which I found incredibly eloquent. Boy, was he good and well done.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah, that was really very impressive. Oh, by the other way, the other piece of information, they just. So the high powered bolt action rifle is what they recovered and they've got a good video. They think of the guy. So that helps.

[Joe Getty]

Out of Fox 10 in Phoenix, Turning Point USA headquarters is becoming a memorial for Charlie Kirk.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's in Phoenix. Yes. Okay.

[Joe Getty]

And then the New York Times social media falls into, into well worn grooves after Charlie Kurt's death.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, that's, that's a fair enough assessment. Although again, social media, the Internet in general, such a, a gathering place for or for scumbags.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't agree with that. I saw that headline. I didn't agree with the headline. It fell into well worn groups. I felt it was a much better universal outcry of this is awful than I have seen in a long time.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah. Except at the outer edges. But that's, that's not going to change. Those people are scumbags. No. And, or Russian bots.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yes.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

The number of Twitter accounts I saw that said he got what he deserved. Karma, blah blah blah. I click on the identities and they had 14 followers following 240 people. The classic bot. I did this profile.

[Jack Armstrong]

I did this in the middle of the night last night. I was reading through the fringe weirdos and thinking this is so disgusting. And I thought, wait a second, you're being jerked around by Chinese bots.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Don't read this. Russians.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, this out of Newsweek. MSNBC fires Matthew Dowd after Charlie Kirk assassination comments, for instance.

[Jack Armstrong]

I don't think that's a well worn groove that MSNBC American immediately fired somebody who said something out of, out of the, out of line with the feelings of the day.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, we'll play that for you probably next segment. But he said essentially, well, you know, guys who say what he said kind of are asking for. It was horrific. This guy was a pretty prominent politician too.

[Joe Getty]

And then in slightly different news, Washington Post alleged Trump golf course gunman to give our opening argument in his own trial.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah. Today. Yeah. And that gets to what I was talking about earlier. The guy came close enough to assassinating Trump was completely nuts. So who knows who this person is, Right?

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right. I hope we find out quickly.

[Joe Getty]

To wrap up with the Babylon be tough on Crime Democrats propose 100 strikes and you're outlaw.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah, no kidding. Yeah, More on that story later.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

What did various people say? What did Charlie Kirk himself say throughout the years? If you don't know his act, Lots on the way today. Hope you can stay with us.

[Commercial Announcer]

Armstrong and Getty Stop settling for weak sound. It's time to level up your game and bring the boom. Hit the town with the ultra durable LG X Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound sound wherever you go. Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it. The future of sound is now with LG x boom and for a limited time save 25% at LG.com with code fall25. Bring the boom xboom.

[Joe Getty]

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[Commercial Announcer]

Over 300 channels, zero bills. That's TiVo. Plus curated movies, new series and sports highlights. No credit card, no logins, just TV that gets straight to the good stuff. Grab the remote, press play and start watching TiVo. Plus free binge worthy always on.

[Jack Armstrong]

Check us [e-mail] America is changing and.

[Joe Getty]

So is the world.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

But what's happening in America isn't just the cause of global upheaval.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere.

[Joe Getty]

I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. i'm.

[Jack Armstrong]

Tristan Redman in London, and this is the Global story.

[Joe Getty]

Every weekday we'll bring you a story from this intersection where the world and America meet.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jack Armstrong]

A new NFL season means a fresh start and fresh styles. At NFLShop.com, you'll find the latest jerseys, hats and sideline gear to rep your team all season long. From rookies making their debut to legends, NFLShop.com has it all. Score exclusive styles you won't find anywhere else and show up ready for every kickoff. And big play fan like a pro and shop [e-mail] I go around universities and have challenging conversations because that's what is so important. Important to our country is to find our disagreements respectfully. Because when people stop talking, that's when violence happens.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

I've never seen someone do this.

[Jack Armstrong]

Well, it's a growing trend because people like me are facing violence, assault. The left. Yes, the campus antifa. I've been stormed out of restaurants. I've been assaulted publicly. Multiple death threats.

[Commercial Announcer]

Okay, so what's your goal?

[Jack Armstrong]

There's more people that agree with me than some people would actually believe. And they come out of the woodwork. When I do stuff like this. We record all of it so that we put on the Internet so people can see these ideas collide.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

When people stop talking, that's when you get violence.

[Jack Armstrong]

That's when civil war happens because you start to think the other side is so evil and they lose their humanity.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

This is a dark day for our state. It's a tragic day for our nation. I want to be very clear that this is a political assassination.

[Jack Armstrong]

That was the governor of Utah there at the end.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, the first voice, obviously, Charlie Kirk, answering questions from a gal about why he does what he does and Then Governor Spencer Cox of Utah, part of his very eloquent words, Governor Gavin Newsom.

[Jack Armstrong]

Of California called it a vile and disgusting. Charlie Kirk was the first guest Gavin Newsom had when he launched his podcast. It is vile and disgusting. I wish I were more optimistic that we could turn around our attitudes on this sort of thing.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, yeah. Unfortunately, the most eloquent words we could generate or the governor could generate, or anybody else who's talking about it today, even Gavin Newsom. I just. I don't think that those who would. Who would carry out such a horrific act can be reached, which is a pretty horrifying notion. Now, we have had some emails, for instance, I may have saved one for Mailbag, saying that, hey, there were other periods where there were way too many assassinations. And just as a society, we all became so horrified. It was, you know, similar to drunk driving, which used to be commonplace and kind of winked at, and that there may be a societal trend away from it. I don't know if that's possible in the days of the Internet.

[Jack Armstrong]

I just don't. I agree. Yeah, I agree. Yeah. It's just. It's such a different structure than society used to be, where the bulk of opinion could drag along the fringes or obscure the fringes. Now it's almost the other way around.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah. The mechanisms by which ideas are traded and spread have changed completely, or at least so significantly that it's just. It's. It's a different machine now. The idea of an idea going viral or becoming, you know, popular or. Or practically universally adopted, it's just. It's a completely different machine and nobody's quite sure how it works.

[Jack Armstrong]

I would assume. I mean, we haven't said this yet. Does it even need to be said? I would assume pretty much everybody listening to this show realizes if you start down the road of political violence, it's over. There's no winning that race to the bottom. It's the end of the experiment.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Unless it's settled by enormous bloodletting in the way of the Civil War. For instance, Governor Spencer Cox, as we said, very eloquent yesterday. Let's hear a little more of what he had to say, as this is the key. Well, one of the key horrors of this was the nature of Charlie's approach and beliefs. As he himself said, we've got to be able to talk to each other, otherwise you get horror and violence. So I'm going to go out and talk to people. And for that, he was murdered. This is Governor Cox. Charlie believed in the power of Free speech and debate to shape ideas and to persuade people. Historically, our university campuses in this nation, here in the state of Utah, have been the place where truth and ideas are formulated and debated. And that's what he does. He comes on college campuses and he debates. That is foundational to the formation of our country, to our most basic constitutional rights. And when someone takes the life of a person because of their ideas or their ideals, then that very constitutional foundation is threatened. Roll on, Michael. Now we have a person of interest in custody. Investigation is ongoing. But I want to make it crystal clear right now to whoever did this, we will find you, we will try you, and we will hold you accountable to the furthest extent of the law. And I just want to remind people that we still have the death penalty here in the state of Utah. And then the last clip, if you don't mind. Thanks. If anyone in the sound of my voice celebrated even a little bit at the news of this shooting, I would beg you to look in the mirror and to see if you can find a better angel in there somewhere. I don't care what his politics are. I care that he was an American.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah, glad to hear that. Glad to hear things like this from Ezra Klein of the New York Times, writing today on Charlie Kirk. You can dislike much of what Kirk believed, and the following statement is still true. Kirk was practicing politics in exactly the right way. He was showing up to campuses and talking with anyone who talked to him. He was one of the era's most effective practitioners of persuasion. When the left thought its hold on the hearts and minds of college students was nearly absolute. Kirk showed up and again and again to break it, he was central in laying the groundwork for it. I do not know Kirk, and I am not the right person to eulogize him, but I envied what he built and he was doing politics exactly the right way in this country. Yeah, that's what's so disturbing. It would be bad if it was one of the bomb chuckers on either side. It would still be bad because we can't. We can't. Like I said, we can't go down this road or it's all over. But he wasn't one of the bomb chuckers. He was one of the let's have a reasonable conversation people. And he got killed.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right, Right.

[Jack Armstrong]

I was trying to think and put in my mind, can you come up with anybody close to the equivalent on the left? I don't know who it would be, or I was just. I was kind of doing a thought experiment for Myself, because I saw some of the fringe voices who were somewhat celebrating this yesterday, and it was fringe. Um, I think that needs to be stated over and over again. There. There was more of a universal condemnation of this than practically anything I've seen in a very long time in terms of both sides coming together and mainstream media. But I was trying to think of as a thought experiment for my own emotions. Somebody who I really can't stand on the left. And I don't. I don't know who would be a good example. Joy Reid or I don't know who. But I'm positive that if I heard they were shot, I wouldn't think, yay, I'm positive of that. Right. I would think, oh my God, that's horrible. We can't go down this road. I'd have the same feelings.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, there were a shocking number of multicolored haired, angry young women in particular on the Internet celebrating. But I mean, just if 3% of the population are angry, soulless idiots, that's a hell of a lot of people.

[Jack Armstrong]

Right?

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

I try not to worry too much about those people. As disgusting as it is.

[Jack Armstrong]

The details leaking out on. So the FBI says they have solid footage of who they believe was the shooter. They found the weapon, college age, male. So it'll be interesting to find out what's going on here. Like I said earlier, though, it's almost better we don't know while we're having some of this discussion because. Does it make any difference? Does it really make any difference? I'm not sure makes any difference. It would make a difference if he was, you know, funded by Iran or something. That would obviously make a difference. But if he's completely insane or, you know, thoroughly sane and thought this out, I'm not sure it makes any difference on how we need to react as a country or what we need to do going forward. We need to quit with the apocalyptic view of our politics.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

That would help. Yeah, yeah. Although that is a. That's a great discussion and a difficult line to draw. If, for instance, you believe, as I do, that the far left progressive activists, for instance, on college campuses actually want the downfall of the United States, United States and Western civilization in general. They're avowed Marxists. I will call them avowed Marxists because I have to take them at their word and by their actions. On the other hand, I'm not in favor of killing Marxists either. I'm in favor of making so many people aware of how terrible their ideas are that they reject them.

[Jack Armstrong]

True. But we can win that battle, and it's, you know, a multi year battle. I'm speaking mostly of the. I forget what the percentages were, but it was well into the majority on both sides of the political aisle thought if the other side wins this election, the presidential election, this is the last election we'll have in this country.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right. Both sides thought that.

[Commercial Announcer]

That's crazy.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, I would agree. And speaking of troubling, there's a poll that came out recently that indicated that a truly shocking number of Americans on both sides of the aisle thought that, you know, it is occasionally justified to kill your opponent in politics.

[Jack Armstrong]

Right, right. I remember that. That polling coming out about the shockingly high number of people are okay with political violence. That's very troubling. Now whether that was a performative reaction to the poll, I hope a lot of it was, but just even the willingness to say it to a pollster is horrifying. Then you got a chunk of people who absolutely believe it.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right. So on a lighter note, if you.

[Jack Armstrong]

But yes, I was about to say in their defense, I can't say in their defense about people who agree with political violence. But you're being led in some cases by representatives who just told you the country will end if that person wins.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Right.

[Jack Armstrong]

If that doesn't justify political violence in some people's minds, I don't know what would.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Well, as. And also as we've discussed more than once, if someone is actually seriously convinced that a would be political leader is akin to Adolf Hitler, then that person should be eliminated. We tried to assassinate Hitler every chance we got. His opponents inside Germany did. And nobody's saying whoa, whoa, whoa, political violence is wrong because he was that dangerous a character. So yeah, to use rhetoric like that is to invite violence. Absolutely. 100%. On a lighter note, football revved up full force. Exciting play. D'oh. My gosh. There were some great games last weekend. Are going to be more this weekend and prize picks is a great fun way to get involved. It's daily fantasy sports without the dang responsibility of running a team. You just pick more or less on at least two player stat projections. Go from there.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's easy on commanders packers tonight packers are one of the best teams in the league anyway. That's what I love about the NFL. Every game matters. Unlike your other sports. Anywho, you have strong opinions on this. Put your money where your mouth is. Download the prize picks app today and if you use the Code Armstrong, you can get $50 in lineups after you play your first five dollar lineup. That's the code ARMSTRONG get $50 in lineups after YOU play your first $5 lineup.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

And every week they make one pick like a no brainer. They call it their max discount. Super fun. Download the prize picks, use the Code Armstrong prize picks. It's good to be right.

[Jack Armstrong]

Anyway, we do have kind of an odd thing going on. Like the President and Melania are at a 911 memorial thing in New York. You have to do that sort of thing. Obviously it is worth remembering and all that, but in terms of a threat to this country today, top of mind threat is our own internal political violence, not Muslim extremists knocking down buildings.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

So right. Yeah. Some of the reactions on the right and left coming up next hour. I promised you the Matthew Dowd stuff from MSNBC that got him fired and we'll pay that off next hour. I think it's significant that he's not just some dip ass talking head on msnbc, but he's a pretty significant politician in I think it was Tennessee for a long time.

[Jack Armstrong]

Well, he's been a pundit forever. He's one of those Republicans. He used to run campaigns and then turned against his own party and then MSNBC just loved him. And he's been on all the talk shows forever. Shot off his mouth yesterday. What I'm happy to see is that a network said no, no, no, no, too far. You can't, we can't do this. That's good news. That's a little ray of light in the whole thing. Anyway, we got Mailbag next bunch of stuff.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Armstrong and Getty.

[Commercial Announcer]

Stop settling for weak sound. It's time to level up your game and bring the boom. Hit the town with the ultra durable LG X Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go. Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it. The future of sound is now with LG X Boom. And for a limited time, save [e-mail] with code Fall25 Bring the boom X Boom.

[Joe Getty]

Life's messy. We're talking spills, stains, pets and kids. But with Anabe, you never have to stress about Messes again. @washablesofas.com Discover Anabe Sofas, the only fully machine washable sofas inside and out starting at just $699. Made with liquid and stain resistant fabrics, that means fewer stains and more peace of mind. Designed for real life, our sofas feature changeable fabric covers allowing you to refresh your style anytime. Need flexibility? Our modular design lets you rearrange your sofa effortlessly. Perfect for cozy apartments or spacious homes. Plus, they're earth friendly and built to last. That's why over 200,000 happy customers have made the switch. Upgrade your space today. Visit washablesofas.com now and bring home a sofa made for life. That's washablesofas.com offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Commercial Announcer]

Over 300 channels, zero bills. That's TiVo plus curated movies, new series and sports highlights. No credit card, no logins, just TV that gets straight to the good stuff. Grab the remote, press play and start watching TiVo plus free binge worthy always on.

[Jack Armstrong]

Check us [e-mail] America is changing and.

[Joe Getty]

So is the world.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

But what's happening in America isn't just the cause of global upheaval.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere.

[Joe Getty]

I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. i'm.

[Jack Armstrong]

Tristan Redman in London and this is the Global story.

[Joe Getty]

Every weekday we'll bring you a story from this intersection where the world and America meet.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jack Armstrong]

A new NFL season means a fresh start and fresh styles. At NFLShop.com, you'll find the latest, latest jerseys, hats and sideline gear to rep your team all season long. From rookies making their debut to legends, NFLShop.com has it all. Score exclusive styles you won't find anywhere else and show up ready for every kickoff. And big play fan like a pro. And shop [e-mail] Trey Gowdy, who I'm a big fan of, was just on Fox saying every American needs to watch the video, the close up video with the blood and everything. I think he's completely wrong, wrong about that. But I do want to discuss the video and the way it traveled around. And executive producer Hansen and I both having the same experience of picking our kids up from school, wanting to explain to them what happened today and finding out they'd already seen the most graphic of videos multiple times before we even got to them at school.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, that's horrible.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yes, it is. That's a, that's a, that's a modern media, the way we disseminate information story. But yeah, I want to talk about that later.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, I do too. And actually I have a different opinion than you do on that topic. So I'm, I'm interested to exchange views. You know, the long story short of mine is it varies very much person to person, but here's your freedom loving quote of the day from Abraham Lincoln his famous Lyceum address 19 I'm sorry 1838 if destruction be our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of free men, we must live through all time or die by suicide. And that has been paraphrased many times that if we falter and lose our freedoms it will because be because we destroyed ourselves. And I would agree prescient old Abe mailbag, you can write us anytime. Mailbagmstrongygetti.com z email address lots and lots and lots of really good, eloquent, interesting emails about the assassination of young Charlie Kirk. Pete Kirk would have sat and talked to his murderer to discuss their differences. Sad to think that the murderer had such fear of facing truth that they would slaughter a young man instead. The coward that killed Kirk just made him Obi Wan Kenobi Turning Point USA is going to be a bigger player in the future than it was yesterday. Certainly hope that's true.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah, I don't know about that. He was a singular talent. I mean, if you want to just do brass knuckles politics, the killer took out an irreplaceable talent for a certain segment of society.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Marina from San Diego My heart is so heavy. Charlie Kirk was a national treasure. I liken his assassination to MLK's. Charlie had a dream to teach young people to love God and country, to restore dialogue and debate to college campuses, to bring a revolution of love and respect for one another through open and respectful conversations. He quotes. She quotes Greg Gutfeld as hoping that Charlie's movement will be emboldened and not silence. Thousands of satellite groups in high schools and colleges around the country. Let's see. Anonymous I have not loved Charlie Kirk, but I hate political violence. My 15 year old daughter said she saw the video immediately which broke my heart, and that the Alphabet crowd at her Roseville, California high school was cheering and laughing when the news about Charlie's death arrived.

[Jack Armstrong]

Oh my God.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Fortunately my daughter was saddened by it. Our soft children do not understand what they are cheering. This is not the way.

[Jack Armstrong]

Oh my God. That is horrifying. That's the worst thing I've heard since the shooting.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Yeah, I know.

[Jack Armstrong]

Wow.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Aaron writes. Charlie Kirk was one of our own in the best of us. The crack of gunfire and his head rearing back as his jugular erupted is forever burned into our minds along with a gorgeous young girl who had enough time to look up at her murderer in shock before burying her head in her hands and bleeding out trans shooters. Christian killers, assassinations, rampant crime, child mutilation, all of it under the rainbow flag of progress. This is the lasting legacy of the left. The tough reality is that we cannot coexist with the radical left. So what now? I might need to talk to someone. I haven't been this angry, et cetera. Reading emails did not necessarily indicate a full endorsement of their ideas. I just want to give you an idea of some of the range of thoughts we're getting.

[Jack Armstrong]

Going back to that last email, those kids who erupted in cheers or laughter at that, they didn't raise themselves.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

How they have been successfully indoctrinated.

[Jack Armstrong]

That's unbelievable. So they heard somebody from the other side just got shot to death in front of his wife and little kids and said yay. That is the worst thing I've heard in the last 24 hours.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

That's a great example of why I'm so adamant about the indoctrination taking place in government schools at second wow. Armstrong and Getty.

[Commercial Announcer]

Stop settling for weak sound. It's time to level up your game and bring the boom. Hit the town with the ultra durable LG X Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go. Elevate your listening experience to new heights because, let's be real, your music deserves it. The future of sound is now with LG XBoom and for a limited time save 25% at LG.com with code Fall25.

[Joe Getty]

Bring the Boom XBoom time for a sofa upgrade. Visit washablesofas.com and discover Annabe where designer style meets budget friendly prices. With sofas starting at $699, Anabe brings you the ultimate in furniture innovation with a modular design that allows you to rearrange your space effortlessly. Perfect for both small and large spaces, Anabe is the only machine washable sofa inside and out. Say goodbye to stains and messes with liquid and stain resistant fabrics that make cleaning easy. Liquid simply slides right off. Designed for custom comfort, our high resilience foam lets you choose between a sink and feel or a supportive memory foam blend. Plus our pet friendly stain resistant fabrics ensure your sofa stays beautiful for years. Don't compromise quality for price. Visit washablesofas.com to upgrade your living space today with no risk returns and a 30 day money back guarantee. Get up to 60% off plus free shipping and free returns. Shop now at washablesofas.com Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply.

[Commercial Announcer]

TiVo plus gives you 300 plus channels of movies, shows, sports, even kids favorites. All free and no, we don't want your credit card. Watch live, watch on demand. Watching your PJs eating pizza. It's all right there on your TiVo home screen. With so much variety, from comedy and action to live news and family programming, you'll never run out of options. TiVo plus free binge worthy and always on.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Check us [e-mail] America is changing and.

[Joe Getty]

So is the world.

[Jack Armstrong]

But what's happening in America isn't just.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

A cause of global upheaval.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere.

[Joe Getty]

I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. i'm.

[Jack Armstrong]

Tristan Redman in London, and this is the Global story.

[Joe Getty]

Every weekday we'll bring you a story from the this intersection where the world and America meet.

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jack Armstrong]

A new NFL season means a fresh start and fresh styles. @nflshop.com you'll find the latest jerseys, hats and sideline gear to rep your team all season long. From rookies making their debut to legends, NFLShop.com has it all. Score exclusive styles you won't find anywhere else and show up ready for every kickoff and big play fan like a pro and shop [e-mail].

[Co-host / Guest Commentator]

This is an iHeart podcast.