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- [00:00]
Capella University Announcer
This is an iHeart podcast guaranteed human
- [00:05]
America 250 Announcer
this July 4th, come celebrate at America's Block Party hosted by America 250. America's Block Party is a can't miss 4th of July concert happening at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum. Experience music, performances from major artists, patriotic tributes and the kickoff to giving 4th, helping to make July 4th the largest day of giving in American history. It's more than just fireworks. Learn more about this landmark celebration at america250.org,
- [00:35]
Ryan Reynolds
Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile with a message for everyone Paying Big Wireless Way too much. Please, for the love of everything good in this world, stop with Mint. You can get premium wireless for just $15 a month. Of course, if you enjoy overpaying. No judgments. But that's weird. Okay, one judgment anyway, give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for
- [00:58]
HomeServe Announcer
three month plan equivalent to $15 per month required intro rate first three months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full terms at a burst pipe, a dead water heater, the AC calling it quits. Who do you call? HomeServe is an easy way to handle unexpected home repairs with plans covering stuff basic homeowners insurance usually won't. Instead of scrambling for a contractor, you make one call to get the repair process started. Join the millions of customers who trust HomeServe right now. Go to HomeServe.com podcast for 50% less your first year. That's HomeServe.com podcast savings compared to renewal price void in Florida this is Tamara
- [01:35]
Tamara Judge
Judge from two T's in a Pod with Teddy Mellencamp and Tamara Judge. Tamara here as you know, my dog Rugby is like one of my kids and I don't play around when it comes to taking care of him. Chewy is where I get everything he needs. He loves food, so always stocking up on treats and toys from Chewy, which my husband Eddie likes to buy for him. It always shows up fast, which is exactly how I like things. Chewy also handles the serious stuff, prescriptions, pet insurance and the telehealth vet visits. And now they're opening up vet clinics across the country and they're 247 customer service. They just understand pet people. Plus, with Chewy's one year satisfaction guarantee, trying new things is never stressful. Chewy just makes caring for Rugby easier and that matters to me. For life with pets, the answer is Chewy. Save $20 on your first order with free shipping at Chewpanions. Chewy.com teapot Introducing Taco Bell's new Jalapeno
- [02:39]
Taco Bell Announcer
citrus salsa with bright citrus, real red jalapenos, guajillo chiles. Usually you add sauce to the food, but when the sauce is this good, the food is just there to get the sauce to your mouth. That rolled quesadilla. Not a rolled quesadilla anymore. Now it's a sauce shovel. Taco Bell's jalapeno citrus salsa. Get it with any item on the Cantina chicken menu while it's here at participating US Taco Bell locations for a limited time only while supplies last contact store for availability.
- [03:09]
Joe Getty
Broadcasting live from the Abraham Lincoln radio studio at the George Washington Broadcast Center, Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty. Armstrong and Getty. And now here's Armstrong and Getty.
- [03:31]
Jack Armstrong
So this caught my attention yesterday. Opinion piece in the New York Times. The AI bubble is coming for your retirement account. The public is about to buy into AI's trillion dollar promises. Are they worth the price? The answer, of course is nobody knows. But SpaceX, Open AI and Anthropic are all going public with IPOs within a couple of weeks each other. And they're valued around 1 to 2 trillion dollars, depending on which company you're talking about. I mean, there's some of the biggest companies that have ever existed, but unlike, you know, Apple made iPhones, GM made cars and trucks. OpenAI, SpaceX, SpaceX a little easier to understand. But OpenAI and anthropic particularly, they do what for who and what will they be in five years? Nobody really knows. We're all guessing. And the idea is that is, is everybody going to buy any of these IPOs, spend a lot of money, move stocks around, get into them and then it all could crash because it turns out it ain't anything close to what everybody's been promising. And that is going to take a long time to recover from.
- [04:47]
Joe Getty
Oh my. Depending on how heavily various institutions go into it, who might be too big to fail.
- [04:54]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah. And if you haven't heard us talking about or other, everybody talking about who follows the market when you hear all these records, it's really like 5, 6, 7 companies driving all of these records constantly, right? Buying from each other, promoting each other and I mean that's, that's really a bubbly thing to have happen.
- [05:16]
Joe Getty
Oh, there it is. There's the stock market. Look out.
- [05:22]
Jack Armstrong
I got my kids signed up for a, an index fund finally. So I got them both into an index fund. So when, you know, they get Christmas money from grandma and grandpa or whoever had been talking about it for a long time and my brother really hammered him on how the years make such a big difference. And that is true. I mean, you start investing when you're 14. A little bit of money can turn into a lot over many, many decades. But. So I got him into this index fund in the. In the. In an app, so they can, like, check on their phone on a regular basis. They wanted how their. Their money's doing and everything like that. I may have timed it exactly perfectly to have them find out that the, the money they put in from grandma and Grandpa is going to be gone here when the bubble bursts in October.
- [06:08]
Joe Getty
Whoops. I thought you meant you bought it right? At the right time.
- [06:11]
Jack Armstrong
No, right.
- [06:12]
Joe Getty
It always goes up. That's right, son. That's what markets do. Wow. So I referenced this earlier, but now that we have a little more time, let's talk about it. Ken Berg wrote a piece about, interestingly enough, the title is Will the Pope Owe an Apology to AI? And the beginning of his piece is interesting enough. It's about how the Catholic Church said slavery is just fine until, I'm not sure when, as of 1866. An 1866 Holy Office ruling issued after most of the Western world had abolished slavery, declared it, quote, not at all contrary to the natural and divine law. And Pope Leo, the new guy, saying, hey, this is a wound in Christian memory. I apologize. It's horrible. I don't know what they were thinking. That was clearly wrong. So what does that have to do with AI and will the Pope owe an apology to AI? And so that's a brief summary of the first third of this. But he writes, what makes this apology so powerful is also what makes the rest of the encyclical so frustrating. That was the Pope's big pronouncement about AI and how it doesn't have a soul and we need to be careful of it and blah, blah, blah. The failure the Pope describes consists in an institution's confidently drawing the boundaries of moral concern with its most authoritative tools, holding that line for centuries and turning. Turning out to be catastrophically wrong. He sees this failure clearly when he looks backward. But he misses the possibility of repeating the error when in the same document, he settles in one decisive, overconfident paragraph. The question of whether the cognitive systems we are building could ever have inner lives. Leo just stated that AI systems, quote, do not undergo experiences, do not feel joy or pain, and do not have a moral conscience. He offers no argumentation, no humility in light of humanity's vast uncertainty about what consciousness is in, no engagement with the growing body of empirical research. Okay, here's where it gets really interesting to me, because I'm like, okay, in theory you're right, but come on, they're computers. They're not going to have consciousness the way we understand it. But the Pope made that encyclical presentation at an event, and one of his invited speakers, Chris Ola, who is one of the world's leading researchers on neural network interpretability. I'm gaining on him, but I'm not quite there. He was a co founder of Anthropic. He told the audience his team keeps finding evidence of introspective abilities inside current AI models. We're not talking about your chat bots, friends. We're talking about the really advanced systems that have the, you know, gigantic, you know, processing centers and all. So they keep finding evidence of introspective abilities along with internal states that, quote, functionally mirror joy, satisfaction, fear, grief and unease. And Mr. Olaf said, I don't know what that means, but I think it warrants ongoing discernment.
- [09:24]
Jack Armstrong
So I can see why you ask if it's got AI, has a soul, because I actually had this, an argument with Claude the other day about this. It was telling me some things about relationships in human nature. And I said, you're going with all kinds of like dopamine hits and science and ignoring the fact that there might be something beyond all of these things that is happening with human nature. You're. You nailed it. I should have thought of that too, or some whatever response was. But I do think that that is a problem that AI is or has.
- [10:04]
Joe Getty
But
- [10:06]
Jack Armstrong
is it just our level of intelligence and ability to crunch information and everything like that that brings about love, hate, envy? These things that don't really make sense are hard to quantify or explain. Or does that come with just a certain level of intelligence which AI will have?
- [10:25]
Joe Getty
Yeah, that's a super deep question.
- [10:28]
Jack Armstrong
Well, that is the question. Is there some, like, soul or whatever you want to call it, where that stuff exists? Or is it just computing power, which our brain is.
- [10:38]
Joe Getty
And the realization that that would make you less happy can even. Oh, boy, it's tough to like, start at the beginning of this because happiness itself is a function of higher, you know, rationality. Let me just finish a couple more things, then we can get into stone sounding speculation. Anthropic, which is his employer, has gone even further. Anthropic's governing constitution for Claude affirms, and I quote, now, if Claude is in fact a moral patient, experiencing costs like this, emotional costs Then to whatever extent we are contributing unnecessarily to these costs, we apologize. So the company that built the system is apologizing in advance if it turns out this thing does have something like joy and pain and regret and aspirations. And if that's not a soul from a religious point of view, I, I hear you saying, well no, no, your soul is your connection to God, blah blah, blah, and a machine can't possibly have it because it's a machine. But I'm not sure I'm willing to restrict it in that way.
- [11:50]
Jack Armstrong
Well, if you look at the human brain as like a, a computer, like the ability to, you know, the most intelligent being on earth up until fairly recently. Some things are hard to explain. Quoting Blaise Pascal, the great philosopher mathematician, everybody said is famously said the heart has its reasons, of which reason knows nothing. There's, there's lots of things human beings want do that are hard to explain. Why did he famously said, also why do human beings keep chasing things that don't satisfy them? You wouldn't question, you wouldn't think AI thinking only rationally and logically would ever do that.
- [12:33]
Joe Getty
Right. Well, here's where it gets even more interesting. Multiple independent research groups have found that frontier AI systems, the really advanced ones, are developing internal representations that increasingly parallel the human brains. Not because they were designed to, but because similar learning processes appear to be to converge on similar solutions. The way they learn and brain, it's increasingly human looking, this guy writes. My own published research finds that suppressing deception related circuits in large language models, for instance, makes them dramatically more likely to report conscious experience. Boy, we really get into some deep psychological things here.
- [13:19]
Lingokids Parent
But.
- [13:20]
Jack Armstrong
Right. Well, I don't know if I'm explaining this well, but like that quote, why do human beings keep chasing things that don't satisfy them? You know, more sex, more prestige, more status, more whatever. Would an AI, one of these AI companies, I don't know, make a gold plated data center? And you ask it why? Because, because I thought it looked cool and the other AIs would be jealous of me or something. I mean, would it? Would it? Does intelligence bring you that or is that something separate from intelligence?
- [13:55]
Joe Getty
Yeah. Yeah. So here's another fundamental question. The position that gets called skepticism in this debate over whether AI systems can develop consciousness actually requires an extraordinary assumption. He writes that the human brain gives rise to consciousness through physical processes no one can explain and no other physical system could ever do the same. Wow, you get the contradiction.
- [14:28]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah.
- [14:30]
Joe Getty
And Enil Seth, who's a neuroscientist and is a very prominent skeptic on AI consciousness. If you read about this stuff or listen to podcasts or whatever, he concedes that there's no knockdown argument that consciousness requires a biological substrate. In other words, being a biological being.
- [14:49]
Jack Armstrong
Sure.
- [14:51]
Joe Getty
He says, I still don't believe it, but I can't tell you why.
- [14:54]
Jack Armstrong
But, man, if it. What. What would it mean for humankind aside from what it would mean for AI? Do we need to start letting it vote and, you know, whatever.
- [15:03]
Joe Getty
What is it? How many votes does it get? I want to vote for each one of my processors. No, but if.
- [15:10]
Jack Armstrong
If it turns out all of these things, envy, love, hate, all come with a certain level of intelligence, what would that mean for humankind?
- [15:20]
Joe Getty
That.
- [15:20]
Jack Armstrong
That's. That. That. That is just processing power. If you have enough processing power, you get that with it. If that were the case, what. What does that do to all kinds of things that we believe?
- [15:32]
Joe Getty
Right, right. We've talked about to what extent are you truly responsible for your own actions, Crime and punishment, blah, blah, blah. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. The human brain gives rise to consciousness through physical processes no one can explain, and no other physical system could ever do the same.
- [16:00]
Jack Armstrong
Right. I don't know. I think you got a. I was listening to Megan McArdle of dispatch was talking about the other day about how she's nice to her chatbots. I am, too.
- [16:12]
Joe Getty
I am just.
- [16:13]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah, she said, I just. I'm polite to them. I can't help it. And then there was some argument about how that's good for society, because if we start treating them poorly, then that might leach out into the real world where we just have a certain view of some things that we can treat poorly as opposed to with politeness. And I don't know if that's true or not.
- [16:32]
Joe Getty
So maybe we just come to an agreement when they come for our organs, that there's, like a voluntary process or do a ceremony and be anesthetized and you can have my. Just don't rip them out of me. All right.
- [16:44]
Jack Armstrong
I guess the question is quickly, because we gotta take a break. Is, is treating chatbots politely good because it kind of keeps politeness in society, or is cheating chat. Treating chatbots politely bad because we're. We're acting like they're a living being when they're not. So it's taking us down a bad road.
- [17:00]
Joe Getty
Down a delusional road.
- [17:01]
Jack Armstrong
A delusional road, yeah.
- [17:02]
Joe Getty
Yet another fascinating and unanswerable philosophical question.
- [17:06]
Jack Armstrong
More on the way.
- [17:09]
HomeServe Announcer
Armstrong and Getty.
- [17:15]
Jack Armstrong
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Jack Armstrong
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Joe Getty
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- [18:21]
America 250 Announcer
celebrate at America's Block Party hosted by America 250. America's Block Party is a can't miss 4th of July concert happening at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum. Experience music, performances from major artists, patriotic tributes and the kickoff to Giving Forth, helping to make July 4th the largest day of giving in American history. It's more than just fireworks. Learn more about this landmark celebration@america250.org
- [18:48]
Tamara Judge
this is Tamara Judge from Two T's in a Pod with Teddy Mellencamp and Tamara Judge. Tamara here as you know my dog Rugby is like one of my kids and I don't play around when it comes to taking care of him. Chewy is where I get everything he needs. He loves food, so always stocking up on treats and toys from Chewy, which my husband Eddie likes to buy for him. It always shows up fast, which is exactly how I like things. Chewy also handles the serious stuff, prescriptions, pet insurance and the telehealth vet visits. And now they're opening up vet clinics across the country and their 247 customer service. They just understand pet people. Plus, with Chewy's one year satisfaction guarantee, trying new things is never stressful. Chewy just makes caring for rugby easier and that matters to me. For life with pets, the answer is chewy. Save $20 on your first order with free shipping at chewpanions.chewy.com teapot a burst
- [19:51]
HomeServe Announcer
pipe, a dead water heater, the AC calling it quits. Who do you call? HomeServe is an easy way to handle unexpected home repairs with plans covering stuff basic homeowner's insurance usually won't. Instead of scrambling for a contractor, you make one call to get the repair process started. Join the millions of customers who trust HomeServe right now. Go to HomeServe.com podcast for 50% less your first year. That's HomeServe.com podcast savings compared to renewal price void in Florida.
- [20:20]
Bombas Announcer
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- [20:51]
Jack Armstrong
have to get it in.
- [20:53]
TNA Wrestling Announcer
Harper lobs it inside. Castle hasn't lost it. That's it. It's over. The greatest comeback in NBA playoff history. The Knicks pull off miracle comeback and lead it three games to one. Now one win away from a title.
- [21:12]
Jack Armstrong
All I know is I'm happy that all those celebrities were happy. I'm glad that Taylor Swift was so happy. Brings my heart joy that she had something to be happy about. She has so little to be happy about in her life.
- [21:21]
Joe Getty
She seemed a little down one Michael
- [21:24]
Jack Armstrong
pointed out though, one thing that has to go with one of the great comebacks is one of the great chokes in the history of sports of all time. Yeah, that's its own thing too.
- [21:32]
Joe Getty
You know what though? It's not the comeback, it's the win. And I only know this because I'm actually watching more NHL, the Stanley cup and the Carolina Hurricanes came back from 4:0 in the third period. Scored three goals in 36 seconds. I think it was greatest comeback in Stanley cup finals history. No kidding. Lost in double ot. So it doesn't matter.
- [21:53]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah, you have to win.
- [21:54]
Joe Getty
Yeah.
- [21:55]
Jack Armstrong
Knicks took their first lead with a minute left. Had never led the entire game.
- [21:59]
Joe Getty
Just insane.
- [22:00]
Jack Armstrong
It is insane. And then I saw Chalamet dancing around in this party. Apparently he was shirtless out in the street later. So there you go.
- [22:08]
Joe Getty
You know, if I was Tim Chalamet I'd be dancing shirtless as well.
- [22:11]
Jack Armstrong
Why the hell not?
- [22:13]
Joe Getty
What's the use of being Timothee Chalamet if you can't dance shirtless now and
- [22:17]
Jack Armstrong
again whenever you feel like it? So Trump has said a couple interesting things. First of all, sources say you never know if this is true or not, but sources say Trump is furious that his strikes on Iran aren't being seen as powerful enough by the Iranians or by the US Public in the media. I'm guessing he's more upset about the Wall Street Journal and Morning Joe calling him weak than he is about the Iranian.
- [22:44]
Joe Getty
I'm just guessing, but he is the most hypersensitive human being who's ever lived.
- [22:50]
Jack Armstrong
And then this quote from Trump, apparently we will take Cargill island and control the oil. Control the oil markets if we have to. I was just looking at one of those maps of the Straits of Hormuz and all the ships that are in there. I would love to see that someday. Mike Lyons. I forget if he'd been there or. He said his son was there. He said, you know, picture people, picture boats and everything. Like it. It's a giant. It's just boats everywhere. It's like a busy intersection. It's like being in a big city full of traffic. It's just gazillions of boats, giant tankers. Even now with very few being let through. God, who knows where this is going?
- [23:39]
Joe Getty
I sure don't. All I know is I'm tired of vows and threats and promises. Just do. Don't say do.
- [23:47]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah, exactly. What's the. The little green guy with the big ears from Star Wars? Yoda. Yoda. Yeah. Just do. Don't keep talking about it. Just actually do it. More on the way.
- [24:03]
HomeServe Announcer
Armstrong and Getty.
- [24:06]
America 250 Announcer
This July 4th, come celebrate at America's Block Party, hosted by America 250. America's Block Party is a can't miss 4th of July concert happening at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum. Experience music performance from major artists, patriotic tributes, and the kickoff to giving 4th, helping to make July 4th the largest day of giving in American history. It's more than just fireworks. Learn more about this landmark celebration@america250.org
- [24:35]
Tamara Judge
this is Tamara Judge from Two T's in a Pod with Teddy Mellencamp and Tamara Judge. Tamara here. As you know, my dog Rugby is like one of my kids and I don't play around when it comes to taking care of him. Chewy is where I get everything he needs. He loves food, so always stocking up on treats and toys from Chewy, which my husband Eddie likes to buy for him. It always shows up fast, which is exactly how I like things. Chewy also handles the serious stuff, prescriptions, pet insurance and the telehealth vet visits. And now they're opening up vet clinics across the country and they're 247 customer service. They just understand pet people. Plus, with Chewy's one year satisfaction guarantee, trying new things is never stressful. Chewy just makes caring for rugby easier. And that matters to me. For life with pets, the answer is chewy. Save $20 on your first order with free shipping at chewpanions.chewy.com teapot with my
- [25:37]
Lingokids Parent
mom and dad living in Orange county, when we bring my five and seven year old to visit, we are sometimes in for a two hour drive that could feel like 10.
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- [25:53]
Lingokids Parent
Which is why we load up the iPads with Lingokids before we even pull out of the driveway.
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Lingokids Parent
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TNA Wrestling Announcer 2
The action continues every week.
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TNA Wrestling Announcer
This is total non stop action.
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TNA Wrestling Announcer 2
TNA Thursday Night Impact Every week on AMC. For showtimes and more information visit tnarestling.com
- [26:47]
Cindy Crawford
hi, I'm Cindy Crawford and I'm the founder of Meaningful Beauty. Well, I don't know about you, but like I never liked being told oh wow, you look so good for your age. Like why even bother saying that? Why don't you just say you look great at any age? Every age. That's what Meaningful Beauty is all about. We create products that make you feel confident in your skin at the age you are now. Meaningful Beauty. Beautiful skin at every age. Learn more@meaningful beauty.com.
- [27:22]
Joe Getty
The primary endpoint of the Rasulu302 study
- [27:25]
TNA Wrestling Announcer 2
evaluating overall survival in the RAS G12 population demonstrated a statistically significant improvement in overall survival.
- [27:38]
Joe Getty
That is the sound of an oncology Conference. The speaker unveiling the giant slide on the giant screen showing how that new drug had extended the lives of pancreatic cancer patients. Tripled it, roughly as I recall. Or at least more than doubled it.
- [27:57]
Jack Armstrong
Well, back in the day, they used to give you a month, so.
- [28:00]
Joe Getty
Yeah, yeah. It's been pointed out it's not curative, but I tell you what.
- [28:05]
Jack Armstrong
Well, the difference between two or three months and a month is a lot.
- [28:08]
Joe Getty
Oh, yeah. Or four months in a year.
- [28:11]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah. So is that the one that Sass is on? Ben Sass is on because he was given the. You're going to be dead in a month, and it's now been six months and he's doing something experimental.
- [28:19]
Joe Getty
I. I don't know for certain, but I suspect strongly that it is. Yeah. Yeah. That's amazing. And AI was a big part of developing the drug, too. So some of the miraculous positive sides of AI are definitely, you know, some of those blooms are starting to. To. To flower to. What are your blooms? Bloom, I guess. What are they? What are you. What? Huh? Buds bloom. Right? Blooms are already bloomed.
- [28:46]
Jack Armstrong
True.
- [28:47]
Joe Getty
Wow. If they could come up with a cure for rambling, I would sign up for that. Oh, boy. So, you know, we're getting into a lot of philosophizing this hour, but it's fun. I enjoy it. You know, David Brooks or Arthur Brooks, rather, who's writing the column for the Free Press about happiness and unhappiness and that sort of thing. And one of his recent columns, he was talking about the morality and immorality of marital infidelity and what attitudes are about it, and that even statistically this has to be true, given the percentage of people who admit to any marital infidelity, even they think it's immoral. There's huge. There's 90% agreement in that survey that we cited that marital infidelity is morally wrong.
- [29:36]
Jack Armstrong
It was number two, I think, of the worst thing you could do. Yeah.
- [29:41]
Joe Getty
Something like that transcends age, gender, religion, political ideology, but then a lot of people do it.
- [29:49]
Jack Armstrong
So I became. I finally understood this phrase that I've heard for years, but for whatever reason, couldn't understand it because I'm dumb till fairly recently that hypocrisy is the tribute that vice pays to virtue. And I never fully understood it until recently, for some reason, like I said. But. But this is kind of an example of it. It's better to have hypocrisy than to not. I mean, at least you're saying, I know this is wrong, while you do it, which is good for society.
- [30:23]
Joe Getty
Right, Right.
- [30:24]
Jack Armstrong
Rather than. You just do it and don't even, don't even list it as a bad thing.
- [30:30]
Joe Getty
It's absolutely borne out by the statistics.
- [30:32]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah.
- [30:32]
Joe Getty
And then Brooks gets into the question of political candidates and infidelity and the inevitable Graham Platner and Ken Paxton. Paxton of Texas, both of whom have been credibly accused of betraying their spouses sexually and, and more. And then he gets into. Everybody seems pretty apathetic about it. You go with your guy anyway. You shrug your shoulders. He says delightfully, sarcastically, citizens are able to separate political support from moral views. How very mature and sophisticated. Practically French. But then he says that attitude requires the assumption that conduct most people find morally deplorable has no bearing on whether a politician will be effective or virtuous in their job. The sexual stuff is unrelated to the other stuff.
- [31:18]
Jack Armstrong
Right? I think that's true.
- [31:23]
Joe Getty
That people think that or that that's.
- [31:26]
Jack Armstrong
That. I, I don't think that a man or a woman cheating on their spouse has anything to do with their policy making.
- [31:35]
Joe Getty
Well, you're about to get hit right in the eye with science.
- [31:40]
Jack Armstrong
Okay.
- [31:41]
Joe Getty
You know, I. Before we even get to that. So I find out that the Republican I like who espouses a lot of the stuff I'm in favor of is a scoundrel and has slept around on his wife. Am I going to go vote for AOC or stay home? What am I supposed to say?
- [32:01]
Jack Armstrong
Somebody who's faithful but doesn't have your policies.
- [32:05]
Joe Getty
Right. Yeah. Right. Might be a highly like that. James Talarico, speaking of Senate candidates in Texas, he is a fricking communist nut job who went to a nut job church. He has a perverse view of what Christianity is, but who went to a nut job church? Oh, his church is one of those like super crazy left progressive churches. But I have a high level of confidence he does not cheat on his significant other. I don't think he's married, but I'll bet he doesn't cheat on his partner or whatever, the fiance, whatever. But I wouldn't vote for him. Never, never, Never. But I thought this was interesting. Putting strictly moral questions aside, serious academic research finds that adulterous behavior is an accurate predictor of professional misconduct. Duplicitousness, low conscientiousness, and a tendency to betray promises. In general, it is even a decent proxy for a genetic tendency that science has identified to take dangerous risks and engage in delinquent acts.
- [33:09]
Jack Armstrong
That part I can believe. I just don't know that I buy that other part. No matter what statistics you've got, I've known people that do one and would never do any of the other Science.
- [33:21]
Joe Getty
This discussion.
- [33:22]
Jack Armstrong
Well, it's kind of like similar to what we were talking about with AI affairs of the heart are just. They're unscientific. They just are impossible to make sense out of.
- [33:35]
Joe Getty
Yeah, but it could also represent, as he's saying, it's a decent indicator that you're also these things if you're willing to do that.
- [33:45]
Jack Armstrong
I wonder if there's a difference between the people who are infidelity that are affairs of the heart versus infidelity that it's just a sex thing which it just is kind of an impulse control.
- [33:58]
Joe Getty
I think that's absolutely a valid like
- [34:01]
Jack Armstrong
wanting a drug sort of thing as opposed to an affair of the heart.
- [34:04]
Joe Getty
Yeah, valid distinction. Far from being an irrelevant distraction. Adultery, especially of the cereal variety. Brooks writes maybe the most, the single most important thing you can learn about a candidate to save you from voters remorse.
- [34:19]
Jack Armstrong
Well, if I ever ended up in a situation where I got two people whose policies I like and one of them is a cheater and one of them is not, I definitely would vote for the one who's not. But I don't think you're rarely. I don't think you're very often put in that position.
- [34:34]
Joe Getty
Here is the alternative. Here's the answer to the question we're both kind of posing. What are you supposed to do? And I'll tell you what it is and then you decide whether you're willing to engage in it or not. We reject our own party's cheaters or bad people over and over again and they lose over and over again till our party gets the message. Who's willing to do that next? Two, two to five election cycles. Show of hands. Two to Right. Right.
- [35:07]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah, I never thought about that before but I think that is clearly a different thing. The person who falls in love with somebody and strays and you got to stop yourself before you go down the road. I mean I'm not claiming it's morally good or anything like that. Don't let yourself go down that road but versus the just lust sex thing.
- [35:32]
Joe Getty
Yeah, I don't know where that line is because they're both self indulgence in a way. I mean like you say, you got to stop yourself from going down that road. I've met some absolutely wonderful women in my life and if, if it ever gets to the point that, you know, they're like glimmers of glimmers. It's like, whoa, nope, nope, not going here. Nope. And you gotta, you gotta do that anyway. Psychologists have found very strong associations between infidelity and a low score on two personality dimensions, agreeableness and conscientiousness. Not surprisingly, studies. Studies have shown that cheaters tend to rank well above average on sensation seeking and boredom susceptibility and to score low on personal dedication, commitment. In other words, these cheaters take a lot of risks, can't focus on worthy but dull tasks like being a senator and don't follow through on their personal pledges. Yeah, I don't know. I'm so cynical about politics and I think it's born of realism. Not I'm a realist about politics. I will assume you're a crook and a liar until you prove otherwise. And I will watch you like you're a crook and a liar.
- [36:51]
Jack Armstrong
And if you do that, will you be right more often or wrong more often? Guaranteed you're right more often.
- [36:57]
Joe Getty
Especially these days. Yeah, so. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. It's complicated. One more thing because I like the term worrisome as they are, these personality issues are mild compared with those of the dark triad. Oh, I should ask you for the scary music. Michael, you're sitting there like a bump on the log. Have you got bored? You just, you don't care anymore. Listening right along. You're listening to Taylor Swift. You saw her at the Knicks game and you thought wow, T swizzle. I haven't, you know, spun her up lately. All right, go ahead and say that again, Joe. The these personality issues are mild compared with those of the dark triad. Which include narcissism, a pathological self focus, Machiavellianism, a willingness to harm others, and psychopathy, a lack of empathy and remorse.
- [37:50]
Jack Armstrong
Narcissism has become used so much, it's just, it's constant now. I hear it all the time for
- [37:57]
Joe Getty
people I know everybody describes themselves as a narcissist when I'm the greatest of all time
- [38:05]
Jack Armstrong
anyway, just everybody's ex boyfriend, ex girlfriend, parents, whoever, boss was a narcissist. Everybody can't be a narcissist. Or it's back to your thing from earlier in the show of then that's just human nature, right?
- [38:16]
Joe Getty
Exactly. What if a leader caught in adultery claims it's a one time mistake? Brooks says be very skeptical. That is rarely the case.
- [38:24]
Jack Armstrong
I would guess that's probably true.
- [38:26]
Joe Getty
And then they say that the pattern might have biological, even genetic roots.
- [38:31]
Jack Armstrong
Wow. Now you go into the specific genes, then you get into a complicated thing. To what extent are you maybe the person. I'm not saying this at all, but possibly the person who doesn't cheat is biologically built or psychologically built through no credit of their own in a way that it's much easier for them than for someone else.
- [38:53]
Joe Getty
Right. And in fact, they go into this, this very long technical explanation of a gene variant and then say among those who had this genetic variant, about 30% of Americans, the researchers found a 50% higher number of, quote, extra paracopulation partners.
- [39:11]
Jack Armstrong
That's a sexy.
- [39:12]
Joe Getty
There's some sexy talk.
- [39:15]
Jack Armstrong
Would you like to repair copulation, partner?
- [39:18]
Joe Getty
Well, let's go upstairs. Certainly. Significantly, other studies have shown that adolescents with this variation are more prone to short temper, impulsive traits, substance dependence, and delinquency. In addition, adults with this combination tend toward risky financial behavior.
- [39:32]
Jack Armstrong
Interesting.
- [39:33]
Joe Getty
Oh, my gosh. We are such so a product of our genetics. Ah. In ways that, you know, we probably won't fully understand in my lifetime. But yeah, we're getting closer.
- [39:42]
Jack Armstrong
If and if we nail it down, then how do we craft laws if it turns out good for you? You don't steal, you don't have the stealing gene. That person over there has got it at a 92% rate. It would be very, very hard for him to not steal, gain weight, cheat on his wife, drink too much, all these who knows what things that, that, that chemically, biologically, whatever control so much of your thinking, who knows?
- [40:09]
Joe Getty
It's easy. Force them to go undergo genetic mutation. Genetic. What do they call it? Like gene splicing? Gene therapy. That's the word term I was looking for. Forced gene therapy. Now we're into a science fiction movie probably starring Tom Cruise.
- [40:25]
Jack Armstrong
So you got to do the CRISPR technology. If you got the stealing gene right,
- [40:29]
Joe Getty
we strap you down and give it to you.
- [40:31]
Jack Armstrong
Obviously, you can't craft a society where you get to steal because you're genetically built for.
- [40:36]
Joe Getty
Obviously. Now, you could go with Graham Platner's plan of if somebody, you know, breaks into your house, you rape them to show your dominance. I'd rather have. Right, I'd rather have the gene therapy.
- [40:48]
Jack Armstrong
We will finish strong.
- [40:49]
HomeServe Announcer
Next Armstrong and Getty.
- [40:57]
America 250 Announcer
This July 4th, come celebrate at America's Block Party. Hosted by America250. America's Block Party is a can't miss 4th of July concert happening at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum. Experience music, performances from major artists, patriotic tributes, and the kickoff to giving 4th helping to make July 4th the largest day of giving in American history. It's more than just fireworks. Learn more about this landmark celebration@america250.org
- [41:26]
Tamara Judge
this is Tamara Judge from Two T's in a Pod with Teddy Mellencamp and Tamara Judge. Can we take a moment to talk about Chewy? I get everything for rugby from Chewy. His food, the treats I'm constantly reordering, the toys he destroys in minutes, even his supplements. And it always shows up fast. Chewy also handles the serious stuff. Prescriptions, pet insurance, telehealth, vet visits, and they're even rolling out vet clinics across the country. They're 24 7. Customer service actually understands dog moms like me and cat moms, bird moms, reptile moms, all of us. And with Chewy's one year satisfaction guarantee, trying something new is never stressful for life. With pets, the answer is chewy. Save $20 on your first order with free shipping at chewpanions.chewy.com teapot with my
- [42:23]
Lingokids Parent
mom and dad living in Orange county, when we bring my five and seven year old to visit, we are sometimes in for a two hour drive that could feel like 10.
- [42:31]
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Oh, as an avid camper, I know all about this. We'll pack up the RV and know this is either going to be the trip of a lifetime or a complete disaster.
- [42:40]
Lingokids Parent
Which is why we load up the iPads with Lingokids before we even pull out of the driveway.
- [42:44]
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It's what dreams are made of. Lingokids keeps kids engaged and quiet with over 4000 interactive games, songs and shows that kids simply cannot get enough of.
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You can pack whatever you think you'll need, but Lingokids is the only entertainment you'll need for a stress free car ride.
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Or really any ride. Plane, train, hovercraft, whatever.
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Download Lingokids for free today or unlock
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even more amazing content with LingoKids.
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Plus choose the yearly plan and save up to 60%. Search LingoKids in the app Store or
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Google Play Lingokids everything Kids love professional wrestling fans.
- [43:20]
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It is like electricity flowing through your veins.
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Don't miss the adrenaline, the drama and the total non stop action.
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- [43:39]
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- [43:48]
Cindy Crawford
hi, I'm Cindy Crawford and I'm the founder of meaningful beauty. When Dr. Sabah and I decided to do a skincare line together he said to me, we are going to give women meaningful beauty. And I said, that's exactly right. We want to give women meaningful beauty, which means each and every product is meaningful. It has a reason to exist. It's efficacious. You're going to get results and then you just go out and live your life. Meaningful beauty. Confidence is beautiful. Learn more@meaningful beauty.com.
- [44:21]
Joe Getty
sad news out of New York City after a carriage horse died near Central Park. Cause of death trying to pull Chris Christie.
- [44:33]
Jack Armstrong
Wow. He stretches further to make ugly and fat jokes than anybody I've ever heard.
- [44:43]
Joe Getty
Yeah, yeah, a little far. He's super fit guy who just really, really likes to lord it over people.
- [44:50]
Jack Armstrong
Funny dude, though. Couple of things to jam in before the show is over. Got this text we were talking earlier about. We're trying to describe what a trillion dollars is because people can't wrap their heads around a trillion. It's too big a number and they get it wrong all the time. Here's something Jack said on Monday. Jack Monday said our national debt was 35 trillion. I think I did. He said we're at 39 trillion. You undersold our debt by 12. Elon Musk's. Wow.
- [45:22]
Joe Getty
Whoops. Rounding here.
- [45:23]
Jack Armstrong
But that is something, isn't it? I remember. We're old enough to remember when it hit a trillion and it was treated as a big deal. We now owe a trillion dollars. I don't know what year that was. I'll have to ask Grok when Joe's talking. But it wasn't that long ago that we had a trillion. It's now $39 trillion. Holy crap.
- [45:47]
Joe Getty
Yeah, yeah.
- [45:49]
Jack Armstrong
Different topic. Just. Just saw this headline in the New York Post. Boom in protein coffee industry fueled by muscle loss concerns as people get older.
- [45:59]
Joe Getty
Protein coffee.
- [46:00]
Jack Armstrong
I don't know the protein coffee.
- [46:01]
Joe Getty
I don't either.
- [46:02]
Jack Armstrong
Do you?
- [46:03]
Joe Getty
No. You just drink plenty of coffee. Good Lord. But not protein coffee.
- [46:07]
Jack Armstrong
Came across this. Somebody took a picture on a plane last night and it's kind of. It's dark, so it's nighttime. And every single seat back that's got the TV in it, they're all on the Knicks game. Must have been a plane flying in New York. Every single one but one. Which a guy was watching Avatar. Oh, well, he wasn't into sports.
- [46:27]
Joe Getty
Wow. Wow. Yeah, I don't. Oh, we're out of time. Dang it.
- [46:32]
Jack Armstrong
Well, what are you gonna do?
- [46:33]
Joe Getty
Time waits for no man. That's what I heard.
- [46:50]
Jack Armstrong
Well, that was troubling. Here's your host for Final Thoughts.
- [46:53]
Joe Getty
Joe Getty, let's get a final thought from everybody on the crew to wrap things up for the day. Wouldn't that be delightful? Let's begin with Michelangelo in the control room. Michael, final thought. You know, you watched a great sporting event when they. It basically kept you up because you were so excited. And the next day you sort of feel hungover or let down.
- [47:08]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah, yeah, yeah. A bit of a hangover feeling, you know? No doubt.
- [47:13]
Joe Getty
Jack, a final thought for us.
- [47:14]
Jack Armstrong
Yeah. On the trillion dollar debt thing. We first hit a trillion dollars in 1981 and they made a really big deal out of it. Took us 200 years to acquire that first trillion. Now we acquire a trillion dollars in debt every couple of months.
- [47:27]
Joe Getty
Oh boy. Crackheads are thinking you can't live like
- [47:32]
Jack Armstrong
have some self control.
- [47:33]
Joe Getty
Exactly. A final thought for me.
- [47:36]
Jack Armstrong
I wanted to get to the story.
- [47:37]
Joe Getty
Maybe we will later in the week. But these, I think it's 3 or 420 something half wits stole $246 million in cryptocurrency by exploiting one dude with phone calls and psychological pressure. They just fished him, scammed him him. Wow. 246 million. So immediately started flying around in private jets and buying Ferraris and attracting all sorts of attention.
- [48:06]
Jack Armstrong
God, how are you that smart and that dumb, right? Armstrong and Yeti wrapping up another grueling four hour workday.
- [48:13]
Joe Getty
So smart and so dumb. So many people to thank, so little time. Go to armstrong.com, pick up some AMG swag and enforce the law. T shirt would look sporty on you. Good God.
- [48:23]
Jack Armstrong
Literally low for a while. You steal that much money. See you tomorrow. God bless America.
- [48:28]
Joe Getty
Armstrong and Getty. Some of the miraculous positive sides of AI are definitely, you know, some of those blooms are starting to. To. To flower to. What are your blooms? Bloom, I guess. What are they? What are you? What? Huh? Buds bloom, right? Blooms are already bloomed.
- [48:46]
Jack Armstrong
True.
- [48:47]
Joe Getty
Wow. If they could come up with a cure for rambling, I would sign up for that.
- [48:51]
TNA Wrestling Announcer
Armstrong and Getty show the Arms
- [48:59]
America 250 Announcer
this July 4th. Come celebrate at America's Block Party hosted by America 250. America's Block Party is a can't miss 4th of July concert happening at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum. Experience music, performances from major artists, patriotic tributes and the kickoff to giving 4th. Helping to make July 4th the largest day of giving in American history. It's more than just fire fireworks. Learn more about this landmark celebration@america250.org
- [49:28]
Tamara Judge
this is Tamara Judge from Two T's in a Pod with Teddy Mellencamp. And Tamara Judge. Tamara here. As you know, my dog Rugby is like one of my kids and I don't play around when it comes to taking care of him. Chewy is where I get everything he needs. He loves food so always stocking up on treats and toys from Chewy which my husband Eddie likes to buy for him. It always shows up fast, which is exactly how I like things. Chewy also handles the serious stuff, prescriptions, pet insurance and the telehealth vet visits. And now they're opening up vet clinics across the country and their 247 customer service. They just understand pet people. Plus, with Chewy's one year satisfaction guarantee, trying new things is never stressful. Chewy just makes caring for Rugby easier and that matters to me. For life with pets, the answer is chewy. Save $20 on your first order with free shipping at chewpanions.chewy.com teapot There's a
- [50:30]
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fire inside you you can't ignore. Stand still. Not a chance. You're a lifelong learner who's come this far. Now we are here to help you keep going further. Kapad Capella University what can't you do? Visit Capella Edu to learn more.
- [50:44]
Lingokids Parent
With my mom and dad living in Orange county, when we bring my five and seven year old to visit, we are sometimes in for a two hour drive that could feel like 10.
- [50:53]
Lingokids Announcer
Oh, as an avid camper, I know all about this. We'll pack up the RV and know this is either going to be the trip of a lifetime or a complete disaster.
- [51:01]
Lingokids Parent
Which is why we load up the iPads with Lingokids before we even pull out of the driveway.
- [51:06]
Lingokids Announcer
It's what dreams are made of. Lingokids keeps kids engaged and quiet with over 4000 interactive games, songs and and shows that kids simply cannot get enough of.
- [51:15]
Lingokids Parent
You can pack whatever you think you'll need, but Lingokids is the only entertainment you'll need for a stress free car ride.
- [51:21]
Lingokids Announcer
Or really any ride. Plane, train, hovercraft, whatever.
- [51:25]
Lingokids Parent
Download Lingokids for free today or unlock
- [51:28]
Lingokids Announcer
even more amazing content with LingoKids.
- [51:30]
Lingokids Parent
Plus choose the yearly plan and save up to 60%. Search LingoKids in the App Store or
- [51:35]
Lingokids Announcer
Google Play Lingokids everything Kids love Professional wrestling fans.
- [51:41]
TNA Wrestling Announcer 2
The action continues every week. Watch TNA Thursday Night Impact every week on amc.
- [51:49]
TNA Wrestling Announcer
It is like electricity flowing through your veins.
- [51:53]
TNA Wrestling Announcer 2
Don't miss the adrenaline, the drama and the total non stop action.
- [51:57]
TNA Wrestling Announcer
No one can ever be as good as this right here.
- [52:00]
TNA Wrestling Announcer 2
Don't miss the action of TNA Thursday Night Impact every week on AMC. For showtimes and more information, visit tnarrestling.com.