Do Not Get Upside Down On Big Macs

Summary

Armstrong & Getty On Demand: Episode Summary Episode Title: Do Not Get Upside Down On Big Macs
Release Date: March 25, 2025
Host/Author: iHeartPodcasts

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I. Introduction

In the March 25, 2025 episode of Armstrong & Getty On Demand, hosts Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty delve into a significant national security breach within the Trump administration. The episode explores the inadvertent inclusion of a journalist in a highly classified Signal app group chat discussing US military actions against Houthi rebels in Yemen. This inadvertent exposure has sparked discussions about the integrity of national security communications and the broader implications for US foreign policy.

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II. National Security Breach via Signal App

The episode opens with a startling revelation about a breach in national security involving the Trump administration's use of the Signal app for discussing sensitive military operations.

• Joe Getty highlights the issue:

  "A stunning breach in national security involving the ongoing, highly classified US attacks targeting Houthi rebels in Yemen... discussed openly over a group chat on the unauthorized Signal app" ([00:10]).

• Michael Waltz critiques the situation:

  "No one should have been included on that app, especially not a journalist" ([02:07]).

The breach occurred when Jeffrey Goldberg, the editor-in-chief of The Atlantic, was mistakenly added to the Signal group chat. This mishap led to the premature dissemination of sensitive information about the timing and execution of military strikes.

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III. Trump's Response and Internal Dynamics

Trump's reaction to the breach has been a focal point of the discussion. According to the transcript, Trump publicly denied any knowledge of the report detailing the breach.

• Michael Waltz imitates Trump’s initial denial:

  "I don't know anything about it. I'm not a big fan of the Atlantic" ([01:28]).

However, internal discussions reveal differing opinions within the national security team:

• J.D. Vance, a member of the group chat, voiced caution against the military strikes:

  "I think we're making a mistake here... There is a strong argument for delaying this" ([26:42]).

• Pete Hegseth, Secretary of Defense, advocated for immediate action:

  "I see it as two things. One, restoring freedom of navigation... and re-establishing established deterrence" ([15:03]).

These conflicting viewpoints illustrate a "team of rivals" dynamic, where differing perspectives coexist within the administration.

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IV. Implications for US Foreign Policy

The episode delves into the broader implications of the breach and internal disagreements on US foreign policy:

• Joe Getty observes:

  "There are a lot of interesting questions to be asked about who is using, for instance, Signal and in what way and how right and how wrong it was" ([06:14]).

• Michael Waltz discusses the dependency of the US on European security:

  "We provide their national defense... When they're more independent, they'll say, 'What's in it for me? That sounds like your problem'" ([31:24]).

The hosts express concern over the US’s heavy reliance on European allies for security, suggesting that as these allies become more independent, the US may face challenges in maintaining global cooperation.

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V. Related Discussions on Technology and AI

Beyond the main topic, Armstrong and Getty explore additional subjects, including technological advancements and AI:

• AI in Recruitment: Michael Waltz shares his experience with AI-generated resumes, highlighting the challenges in distinguishing between human and AI-produced content:

  "AI is writing it for you. Grammar and blah, blah, blah. Had this actually happened yesterday?" ([15:24]).

• Robot Blood Drawers: The hosts discuss the skepticism surrounding robots performing medical procedures:

  "Would you let a robot draw your blood? Northwestern among health systems trying new device" ([35:13]).

  Joe Getty humorously dismisses the idea:

  "Get that thing away from me" ([35:35]).

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VI. Conclusion

The episode wraps up by reaffirming the significance of the national security breach and its potential repercussions on US administration policies and international relations. Armstrong and Getty underscore the necessity for stringent security protocols to prevent such lapses in the future.

• Joe Getty concludes:

  "The big story today is the Trump national security team accidentally including a journalist on their super private string of how we're going to attack the Houthis and when and whether the actual conversation and the differing opinions and philosophies within the Trump team" ([17:56]).

The hosts pledge to continue monitoring the situation, promising further analysis as more details emerge.

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Notable Quotes

• Joe Getty on the breach:

  "Do not get upside down on Big Macs" ([15:02]).

• Michael Waltz on Trump's denial:

  "I don't know anything about it" ([01:28]).

• J.D. Vance on caution:

  "I think we're making a mistake here" ([26:42]).

• Pete Hegseth on restoring navigation:

  "Restoring freedom of navigation... and re-establishing established deterrence" ([15:03]).

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This episode provides a comprehensive examination of a critical national security lapse, enriched by insightful commentary on internal administration dynamics and the broader implications for US foreign policy. Additionally, the foray into technological advancements and AI underscores the multifaceted nature of contemporary security and operational challenges.

Transcript

[Joe Getty]

Broadcasting live from the Abraham Lincoln radio studio at the George Washington Broadcast Center.

[Jack Armstrong]

Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty.

[Joe Getty]

Armstrong and Getty. And now here's Armstrong and Getty. A stunning breach in national security involving the ongoing, highly classified US Attacks targeting Houthi rebels in Yemen. The Details report reportedly discussed openly over a group chat on the unauthorized Signal app among members of President Trump's national security team. The Atlantic now revealing its editor in chief, who was invited to join the group chat, says he was included on all the sensitive information. Hours before the military strikes began, President Trump pressed about the report, saying he didn't know anything about it.

[Michael Waltz]

Okay, so we'll play the Trump part here in just a second. The timing of all this. Well, nobody knows when Trump was alerted to this. You'd have to assume somebody told him. He acts like he didn't know here when he's asked about it by a reporter, but it was think four or five hours later. So he certainly somebody should have hipped him to it. Well, let's let a reporter ask the question and Trump respond.

[Joe Getty]

Mr. President, your reaction to the story.

[Michael Waltz]

The Atlantic, that said that some of your top officials and aides have been discussing very sensitive material through Signal and.

[Joe Getty]

Included an Atlantic reporter for that. What is your response? I don't know anything about it. I'm not a big fan of the Atlantic.

[Michael Waltz]

It's.

[Joe Getty]

To me, it's a magazine that's going out of business. I think it's not much of a magazine, but I know nothing about it.

[Michael Waltz]

You're saying that they had what they were using Signal to coordinate on sensitive materials and having to do with what? Having to do with what? What were they talking about with the Houthis.

[Jack Armstrong]

The Houthis?

[Michael Waltz]

You mean the attack on the Houthis? Well, it couldn't have been very effective because the attack was very effective, I can tell you that. I don't know anything about it. You're telling me about, for the first time, anybody else?

[Joe Getty]

I believe him.

[Michael Waltz]

Okay. I don't, but that's fine. I don't think he'd ever heard of Signal before yesterday. I'd be surprised if he had. Right?

[Joe Getty]

Yeah.

[Michael Waltz]

And then him saying on Signal and then saying about the Houthis. I think that was a great way to handle it through the day when they tried to go with. And the attack was successful. So what's the problem? Which is not a bad spin on the whole story.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah. Trump has subsequently done a quick interview with NBC News. Quote, michael Waltz has learned a lesson, and he's a good man.

[Michael Waltz]

Excuse me.

[Joe Getty]

All of a sudden I get tickle in my throat. Yeah, I believe so. Because it's believed that Waltz organized the Signal group that accidentally included Jeffrey Goldberg of the Atlantic, which is a hell of a mistake to make. I have my final analysis as I have been able Supreme Court like to take in all of the testimony and have come to a ruling. But I'll wait for that.

[Michael Waltz]

Yeah, well we'll let this unfold a little bit as it did yesterday. She had Trump asked about it and him saying he didn't know anything about it. And then Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth who was on the chat on Signal, which is a encrypted private messaging app. There's a whole bunch of them out there. I guess I'm finding out. I know of a couple of them. I didn't know of this one. And it's either used by everybody in D.C. all the time or it's a horrifying idea to use it. We'll get to that. A couple opinions on that coming up also. But here getting off plane tarmac Sec Def ask about it. You're talking about a deceitful and highly discredited so called journalist who's made a profession of pedaling hoaxes time and time again. Why were those details shared on Signal.

[Joe Getty]

And how did you learn that a journalist was privy to the targets, the types of weapons used?

[Michael Waltz]

I've heard, I've heard I was characterized. Nobody was texting war plans. And that's all I have to say about that.

[Joe Getty]

Is that a lawyerly denial? Because if you accept texting is messaging, MMS messaging, they weren't. They were going through an encrypted message.

[Michael Waltz]

Or define war plans.

[Joe Getty]

It's a lawyerly denial.

[Michael Waltz]

Okay. Because Brit Hume of fox after so SecDef Hegseth there said that a couple of hours after the administration said yeah, that happened, the group text happened with the journalist and all that sort of stuff actually happened. Brit Hume responded to that on Twitter. Oh for God's sake. The administration has already confirmed the authenticity of the message about Pete Hex. That's saying it's a hack journalist, blah blah blah.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, that's, that's kind of weak. I mean he just reported the truth. So. And I hope I share his dim view of Jeffrey Goldberg, but in this case.

[Michael Waltz]

Well, here's Goldberg responding to Hegseth's comment on cnn. The Goldsberg's the actual Goldberg is the actual journalist who was on the chat by accident.

[Joe Getty]

Nobody was texting war plans. Given you a privy to this group Chat? Is that how you saw it? No, that's a lie. He was texting war plans. He was texting attack plans when targets were going to be targeted, how they were going to be targeted, who was at the targets when the next sequence of attacks were happening. I didn't publish this and I continue not to publish it because it felt like it was too confidential, too technical. And I worry honestly that sharing that kind of information in public could endanger American military personnel. But no, they were, they were plans for the attack.

[Michael Waltz]

To his credit. He didn't run to, you know, Twitter or a microphone or whatever to start shouting about this the moment he found.

[Joe Getty]

Out about it or more likely published them in the Atlantic.

[Michael Waltz]

Yeah, so one other part of it before. What are you calling it? Your ultimate point, Joe's ultimate point, or Joe, Joe nailed something.

[Joe Getty]

Joe's final ruling.

[Michael Waltz]

So the idea of having the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of State, the Vice President of the United States, the CIA director, the dni, I mean the most powerful people in all of our government discussing war plans for an attack on this method, using this method of communication I.e. telegram or what is it called?

[Joe Getty]

Signal.

[Michael Waltz]

Signal. I can't remember which one we're talking about on Signal. It's either okay or horrible. So we'll start with Andrew McCabe, former FBI director, who like he got perverted.

[Joe Getty]

The FISA court and violated the Constitution. Yes, he had to step down.

[Michael Waltz]

He got convicted of something. I don't even understand how he's still a. But anyway, he's on CNN saying this.

[Joe Getty]

So convening a small group to discuss.

[Michael Waltz]

A military strike on a commercially available messaging app is outrageous. It's absolutely unthinkable.

[Joe Getty]

I can't even imagine a scenario in.

[Michael Waltz]

Which that would have happened or that.

[Joe Getty]

Anyone who was asked to engage in.

[Michael Waltz]

It would agree without very quickly objecting and saying, hey, this is content that we can't possibly expose on a non classified system. So I would say that I was watching Calperin's Emergency podcast last night and I trust his opinion on these things he said talking to people around D.C. everybody just is jaw dropped. They can't believe that this conversation was happening on this app. I mean, they just can't believe it. It's just like he said, outrageous. On the other hand, here you've got Lawrence Jones of Fox and Friends who has a lot of sources in, in the government saying it happens all the time as it relates to government officials using Signal. They all use it. They're not supposed to, but they use it.

[Joe Getty]

But not because it's secret stuff.

[Michael Waltz]

They use it. CIA, every single intelligence agency uses Signal. I know that for a fact. I talk to them on Signal. They're sources of mine. They all use Signal. It is the best way and the most secure way to get information out. And that's why a lot of journalists use it as well. But they don't want to. They're not supposed to do it, but they do it anyway.

[Joe Getty]

So that's interesting.

[Michael Waltz]

I know. So outside of whatever even happens with this little scandal, whether it's a big deal, we gotta nail down the whole. Are classified documents actually classified? Can you take em home or not? Or do you have to go into the skiff to read em? Or can you read em with your buddies, you know, sitting around watching a football game? Or can you have conversations on these private apps or not? Let's, let's nail all this down. So we don't constantly have these conversations.

[Joe Getty]

And you're leaving out a big one too. Are the very people in government who most need to preserve records ignoring the preservation of records laws.

[Michael Waltz]

I'm glad you brought that up because that was one of Mark Halpern's big point. He said, I doubt anybody was transcribing this as it happened. And this, one of the reasons you're supposed to use the official government channels is this is all supposed to be documented. These are for the archives for historians, for, for, you know, for US citizens to see how their government works and.

[Joe Getty]

Enforcement of the law. Yeah, absolutely. So you don't have rogue operators going outside the Constitution. Yeah, the whole thing's pretty troubling. Just one quick note, because I can't resist. Matt Taibbi has come as close as any human being has ever done to actually having his head explode over an issue. And that is because he is, if you read Matt, you know, this insane with, with wonder and anger that the Democratic side of America has embraced in, lionized all of the worst lying spooks in our recent history. Your Andrew McCabes, your John Brennan's. Who's the other guy who's always on that list? I can picture him, but I can't think of his name. All of the CIA and NSA guys and crooked FBI agents are now on CNN and MSNBC because they're anti Trump. But they're the very sort of thing the Democratic Party for everybody's whole lives has despised and called out. They're the unholy satanic love children of J. Edgar Hoover and Richard Nixon, these guys. And the left has embraced them anyway. That's just a quick aside. My final judgment is this. There are a lot of interesting questions to be asked about who is using, for instance, signal and in what way and how right and how wrong it was. This has shown some real sloppiness. How does Jeffrey Goldberg get in on the group? Because I guess on signal you use like aliases and initials and Waltz's screen name was Waltz. Rubio's was Mar, short for Marco. And so somebody just scanned it real quick and saw, I don't know what Goldberg's handle was, but just didn't notice it and so went ahead and was texting away. And that's the problem. Those not given access to the classified stuff can accidentally or nefariously be on these, these strings. It's sloppy, it's dumb. Is it like fatal? These people should lose their jobs. It's close.

[Michael Waltz]

Maybe I'm just naive about how things work, but I'm surprised they don't all get together in a room. With very few exceptions, when you're two hours from launching an attack on somebody, I would think that rises to the level of let's take our Saturday or Sunday or whatever day it was and go ahead and go into the office and sit there and discuss whether we're going to launch the biggest military attack of the Trump administration.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, let's go ahead and drive in from Arlington and Fairfax and if there's.

[Michael Waltz]

Somebody that, if there's somebody on the other side of the world, you get one of those super secret top level, you know, video connections and they talk to them there in the war room as they discuss it. The fact that they're all just going about their day like I don't know what they were doing. I'm at the grocery store and I'm at my kid's soccer match or whatever and we jump on this thing and have a conversation. It seemed a little loosey goosey to me, but maybe I'm naive. Maybe this happens all the time.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, one thing we haven't gotten to is what the conversations have revealed about the balance of power and philosophies, foreign policy wise, within the administration, which I found really, really interesting. Yeah, got the transition and encouraging. Honestly, I think it's all, you know, good news. Some of the folks opinions are, you know, a little troubling to me, but seems like a very healthy team of rivals type discussion.

[Michael Waltz]

Well, we only have this transcript because they accidentally invited a journalist, otherwise it would have been lost to history. It wouldn't have never, would have never existed. Isn't that Interesting. I don't know. What's your opinion on this text line? 415295KFTC Armstrong and Getty.

[Jack Armstrong]

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[Joe Getty]

Customers to pay for food deliveries in several installments.

[Michael Waltz]

Great news if you've ever dreamed of.

[Joe Getty]

One day owning a Big Mac. Wait a minute.

[Michael Waltz]

I have had that happen before.

[Joe Getty]

Break up the payments on a meal.

[Michael Waltz]

Yeah, I've had that happen before. So like I get, I get some stuff for the kids, you know, we order from Panda Express regularly and then it says would you like to break up into payments? And I always think that's hilarious. You know, it's $42. Yeah. Can I get it over 60 months? What's the interest rate?

[Joe Getty]

It's not the worst idea I've ever heard, but it's in the top three.

[Michael Waltz]

Oh boy. Do not get upside down on Big Macs. Will you be upside down immediately? Because you're gonna eat the.

[Joe Getty]

Well, yeah. And if you don't, the resale is. Well, it's not good.

[Michael Waltz]

I got a used Big Mac. Barely used.

[Joe Getty]

You know how when you drive a car off a lot you lose one third of its value? It's much worse for hamburgers, trust me.

[Michael Waltz]

Okay, so we were talking last hour about they're having trouble with AI AI writing resumes. And so it's not like the old days where you could say, oh my God, look at the spelling on this resume or whatever. This person can't Work here. AI is writing it for you. Grammar and blah, blah, blah. Had this actually happened yesterday? I'm trying to, I, I won't get distracted with what I was trying to get this person to do, but I was trying to basically hire someone to do something and was communicating with them through a chat place where they accidentally.

[Joe Getty]

Included Jeffrey Goldberg of the Atlantic.

[Michael Waltz]

Yes. So it was like a bulletin board thing. And his bulletin board post was really well written and it sounded great. So I reached out to him and then like the first thing was really good and I thought, okay, this person's gonna be good. I think this is somebody I can trust. But then when I got into questions like how about this? Or like individual questions, his answers, like the grammar fell apart. Like, I mean, it was like, are you, I thought, you can't be a native English speaker. I mean, it was just, it was almost nonsensical and it happened so fast after the initial posting. And then like the initial thing they said, which was kind of generic, it all completely fell apart. And I was wondering, I thought, what the heck went on there? I couldn't figure it out till today when you mentioned the AI resumes. That's almost guaranteed what it is. He's got the initial post. He runs through that. Or I suppose he could have his girlfriend write it for him or something like that. But anyway, somebody else wrote it and then the first generic response and then when he got into the question and answer, it made no sense whatsoever.

[Joe Getty]

What's your gut feeling? Is it just somebody covering up their inadequacies or a foreign scammer or what do you think?

[Michael Waltz]

I don't think it was foreign scammer. I think, I think it was a non native English speaker trying to hide that, that. Not that that automatically makes you unhirable or something like that. But I couldn't communicate with them and it was sketchy, so I moved on. But. Yeah, but that's gonna be hard to suss out in the future.

[Joe Getty]

Oh yeah. And I'm surprised he didn't like keep up the, the ruse by running that stuff through AI. I don't know how it all.

[Michael Waltz]

It would have been pretty hard because it was, we were down to the just back and forth communication, texting at that point.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah.

[Michael Waltz]

But yeah, I'm sure if you're really good with the technology, you could have AI doing that in real time and then you'll, you know, you'll meet the person mowing your lawn or fixing your roof or whatever the heck you're doing, you know, fishing guide Whatever you, you deal with, completely illiterate, right?

[Joe Getty]

Yeah. So the big story today is the Trump national security team accidentally including a journalist on their super private string of how we're going to attack the Houthis and when and whether the actual conversation and the differing opinions and philosophies within the Trump team. Super interesting. We'll take look at that in a moment.

[Jack Armstrong]

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[Michael Waltz]

Coincidentally with this mini scandal or maxi scandal depending on how it turns out, going on around intelligence. The big Senate hearing today where the all the intelligence heads come in and talk about the biggest threats around the world. I love this every year and we always end up talking about it because lots of interesting stuff comes out. But because he had this kind of scandal thing happen, which is about if you don't know what we're talking about, it's about to be laid out by Mark Warner, Democrat co chair of this committee. Democrats have something to talk about for the first time practically in the second Trump administration. And they're so excited about it. But here it goes. And according to reports, two of our witnesses here today were members of a group chat that discussed highly sensitive and likely classified information that supposedly even included weapons packages, targets and timing and included the name of an active CIA agent. There's plenty of declassified information that shows that our adversaries, China and Russia are trying to break in to encrypted systems like signal. I can just say this, if this was the case of a military officer. Oh boy. Or an intelligence officer. And they had this kind of behavior, they would be fired. Perfect. That is perfect for what I'm about to talk about here.

[Joe Getty]

Marshall Warner walked into that hearing. He downed two double espressos and took a Viagra. He was so excited about getting in there and laying it to the trumpet administration.

[Michael Waltz]

But somebody pointed this out on Twitter and it's absolutely true. You just gotta love the rich. Only in Washington. Irony of one. Republicans who tormented Hillary Clinton for her private email server scandal now trying to downplay what could be some sort of breach of sensitive info, while at the same time Democrats pouncing on this controversy after defending Clinton's email brouhaha for years. The Rs will argue these episodes are not equal. The Dems will argue these are not equal. And that's where we are. But him bringing up any regular. I've heard this before. Any regular man in uniform would be court martial for exactly the same thing we said on the other side.

[Joe Getty]

Right, right. Exactly. I had just seen that Hillary herself was commenting on Hillary. Do you even know what irony is? Can you please sit this one out? Just this one.

[Michael Waltz]

Wipe it like with a cloth.

[Joe Getty]

Oh my. It's all too much. So this is not a good deal. It's not a good look. It's certainly not security protocol to include Jeffrey freaking Goldberg in this stuff. I suspect the course will be corrected and this will not happen again. But we've talked about that a fair amount and there's more to develop, I suppose in the days to come. And we will cover it for you. But I found this just irresistibly interesting, the actual conversations and the poles of power and philosophy, if you will, within the Trump national security team. And it strikes me as a very team of rivalsy thing. And I'll describe some of the specifics before I babble on more about what I think about it.

[Michael Waltz]

But I, by the way, I've had a complete change of heart on this whole topic.

[Joe Getty]

Really?

[Michael Waltz]

Yes.

[Joe Getty]

You holding out on us or are you gonna hit us with that?

[Michael Waltz]

I've brushed up against it in the last couple of weeks, but I'm now it's one of the few major issues I've changed my mind on in adulthood, but this is one of them.

[Joe Getty]

Okay, fine. So anyway, the news, according to the comment here in the Wall Street Journal editorial board, was that the characters played to their public type, their public image. And I would agree National Security Advisor Mike Walz came out for US leadership said, no, this is Our role in the world, it's important that we do it, that we keep shipping free, for instance. And he was also very forceful in saying, look, this is the President's, that's his policy. Vice President J.D. vance was a voice for US retreat and, or extreme caution. And we'll get more to why he thought that in a second. It's not crazy. Um, even though Trump had said, no, we want to hit him, Vance was like, hey, I think we're making a mistake here. Stephen Miller, whose screen name was SM Said, as I heard it, the President was clear green light, paraphrasing now, why should Tehran's proxy get away with shooting at Navy ships, US Navy ships and aircraft and blocking critical waterways for everybody but Iran, Russia and China the way they did under Joe Biden? Stephen Miller was not having that, uh, Michael Waltz in the key Exchange on March, March 14, which was the day before the strikes on Yemen, wrote, quote, team, you should have a statement of conclusions with taskings per the President's guidance. But not all preferred to take the guidance, said J.D. well, a user who went by the screen name J.D. vance, who that is, historians will have to parse out. Anyway, this mysterious J.D. vance character says, I think we're making a mistake. 3% of US trade runs through the Suez, while 40% of European trade does. I am not sure the President is aware how inconsistent this is with his message on Europe right now. There's a further risk that we see a moderate to severe spike in oil prices. And he summarized, there is a strong argument for delaying this. A month doing the messaging work on why this matters and seeing where the economy is, et cetera.

[Michael Waltz]

And this is an interesting insight into his philosophy. And I mean, it's going to matter when he runs for president. I don't like his point of view. I think he's wrong. But he's pretty hardcore that direction, it would seem.

[Joe Getty]

And he will be heard from again in a moment. Let's see. This council of delay waiting for economic news that may never come was echoed by Joe Kent, whose name you might not know, but he's a noted isolationist pole, Bakaroor, whatever you want to call it, whom Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard has named in the chat as her point of contact. So he's her point man, and he's a bit of an isolationist. In reply, Pete Hegseth pointed out the risks of waiting and stressed Iran's role and made the case for the operation. Quote, I see it as two things. One, restoring freedom of navigation which is a core national interest. And 2 re establishing established deterrence, which Biden cratered. Trump later made similar points in public, reflecting their being on. On the same page, I think. Well, I'll. I'll. I'll save my analysis for a second. Uh, this reflects well on Mr. Hegseth, writes the editorial board of the Journal, though it's notable that he named Don Caldwell as his point of contact. And Caldwell comes from the isolationist Koch network, as in the Koch brothers, which Trump has been highly critical of, which is again, team of rivals. Waltz explained the damage to global trade and the limits of Europe's navies, Quote, Whether it's now or several weeks from now, it will have to be the United States that reopens these shipping lanes, he wrote.

[Michael Waltz]

Yeah, I thought that was an interesting point. You might think Europe should do it. They can't. They don't have the ability.

[Joe Getty]

And then Vance showing his reasonableness in the face of disagreement to me, and I disagree strongly with JD on several things, but he said he finally conceded to reality. Quote, I just hate bailing Europe out again. Hegseth agreed. I fully share your loathing of European freeloading. It's pathetic. That's probably not the sort of thing you want to leak, but Mike, meaning Mike Waltz, is correct about how we have to do that. Mr. Trump now is no. Now knows which of his deputies tried to block it and which tried to carry it out. I don't like that last bit of analysis.

[Michael Waltz]

That's not. That's not what you want at all.

[Joe Getty]

No, I. The last thing you want is groupthink.

[Michael Waltz]

Yeah.

[Joe Getty]

And I, you know, I see it as polls, as, like, magnetic polls in the group. You know, not to flog the team of rivals thing too much, but, I mean, if you're in an organization, maybe you're doing software or something like that, and you have a brain trust of people, and one of your people is always harping about innovation, how if we stay still, we're gonna get left behind. The business we're in is innovating. What's next? We've gotta improve this. And then you have people saying, look, this is the most popular X software in the world. We can't mess with it until we're 100%, we're ready, our customers are satisfied. You're right. But caution, you don't want to cut out innovation guy just because for now, you're leaving Salesforce or Microsoft Word or whatever the hell as it is for. You don't want to silence that voice. You don't Want to silence JD Vance saying, look, we've got to keep putting the screws to euro, the Euros or they will stay lazy and we will pay for. And he earlier said we at the least we ought to get some money out of them for doing this, reopening their freaking shipping lanes. I love J.D. vance's voice in that discussion. And I think they did the right thing in spite of it.

[Michael Waltz]

So I'm. This is a innocent question, not trying to push anything, any direction. How does the chain of command work on this whole thing? So it sounded like Trump had already signed off on the idea of we need to attack the Houthis then. So, like, could have. It got stymied in this conversation. And, like, was then, did somebody report back to him we're not doing it? Or how does that even work?

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, absolutely. I think probably Hegseth and. Or Waltz would have gone back to the president and said, hey, we've got some serious concerns about A and B. And then of course, the commander in chief would say, yeah, that's, that's nice. That's. That's sweet.

[Michael Waltz]

Do it anyway.

[Joe Getty]

Do it anyway. And it would have happened. It sounded like Waltz was just wanting another hearing with the President, but he was talked out of it. Okay, we go ahead.

[Michael Waltz]

On just that topic. I think I've become convinced that, that because I've been. I've been yelling about this for years. It goes way back to college. Gladys goes way back to college.

[Joe Getty]

Wow.

[Michael Waltz]

After I had my perm and was wearing parachute pants before. Before I graduated.

[Joe Getty]

Before the baldness. Yes.

[Michael Waltz]

Constantly hearing from college professors about how much greater it was in Europe, how many weeks of vacation they get, and they only have to work this many hours a week and how wonderful it is without pointing out to me a stupid college kid who didn't know any better. That's because we provide their. Their national defense. So of course, they got plenty of money while it lasts. And it's about to run out. It's all running right out. In France, for instance, or Greece, we provide their national offense. So of course, they don't have to be as productive. They can, you know, take nine months of vacation or retire at 50 or whatever the hell they do in all these countries. None of the college professors pointed that out, of course.

[Joe Getty]

Well, and it's as if Europe itself is a retiree. They have more time to do fun stuff. They spend more time on the golf course than I do because I'm still working. But they are heading toward, you know, decline and perhaps the tomb because we Spend. They're no longer young and dynamic and growing and achieving and. Right. They're just in that phase of their life. I don't want the US to be in that phase of life.

[Michael Waltz]

We spend $800 billion a year on defense. I think it's roughly that number. And, and that's so we can, you know, do what we want to do world. And it protects Europe, and then they don't have to hardly spend any money at all until recently.

[Joe Getty]

Well, at risk of flogging the metaphor to death, Europe is on Social Security and we pay. We're, we're current workers.

[Michael Waltz]

But my butt is. I felt that way for decades now. I've been come, become convinced, listening to a variety of different podcasts and thinkers and that sort of stuff. That is, we're much better off with the world that way. We, we. I have been living with this idea that, you know, France, Germany, England, all these countries, they basically line up with us and they'll continue to line up with us when we're not providing. That is probably not going to be the case when they actually are independent enough to provide their own security or work together in security. Next time we need to do anything or want things to be a certain way, they're going to say, yeah, good for you. Do it yourself, or whatever. But for the past many decades, we really need to do anything. They're on board because they kind of have to be because we provide all the security. And I think we're gonna miss Those days when a 911 comes along and immediately all those countries are on board. In the future, when they're more independent, they'll be like, yeah, what's in it for me? That sounds like a you problem.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, yeah, I, I see your point. I just, I think as the sands of history shift, new realities take hold and, and there's no use for the, the old stuff. Not that you are.

[Michael Waltz]

It's possible that we just flat can't afford it anymore. So it's not an option. It's not a, it's not a discussion. It's not a, a policy choice. It's just we can't afford it anymore.

[Joe Getty]

Right, Right. But I, Angela Merkel, crawling into Vladimir Putin's lap for a cuddle and some natural gas.

[Michael Waltz]

Right.

[Joe Getty]

Was a sign of the way it could go.

[Michael Waltz]

Yeah. For, for, who knows? For a lot of those countries, remember, France was getting around the, the sanctions on Iraq the whole time we were trying to pressure them and everything like that, so. And that's when they needed us. Wait till they don't need us. How are they going to act? Who are they going to cozy up the china in kind of ways we really, really don't like.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah. Well, with baseball season about to start, which has me very excited. We're a team that had an 11 game winning streak. Now it's back to reality. We've lost a couple and we're going to play the Yankees. It's. That's history.

[Michael Waltz]

We got a lot more on the way Different.

[Joe Getty]

Yes we do. By gully, this is a big scandal.

[Michael Waltz]

Or not that that's what I wonder. I guess we'll see how it unfolds throughout the day. Stay here.

[Joe Getty]

Armstrong and Getty.

[Jack Armstrong]

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[Joe Getty]

I read the 23andMe just filed for bankruptcy. The company says they were 50% sad, 37% disappointed and 13% Scottish. Yeah, it's the worst news to hit.

[Michael Waltz]

The DNA test testing business since Maury was canceled. So the obvious question. 23 me goes bankrupt. Where is my spit? Who has control of all of our spit?

[Joe Getty]

I demand my saliva back with interest. Wait a minute. Oh, so speaking of science, here is the headline. How do I put this? The headline most likely to make you cringe today. Would you let a robot draw your blood? Northwestern among health systems trying new device.

[Michael Waltz]

No way. That no possible way a robot can ever do that. Well, not possible.

[Joe Getty]

My response is six simple words. Get that thing away from me. Can you imagine?

[Michael Waltz]

No, I actually don't think AI could be capable of doing this.

[Joe Getty]

Several health systems are gearing up to try a new way of drawing blood using a robot.

[Michael Waltz]

Oh, my God.

[Joe Getty]

Who's.

[Michael Waltz]

Who are they going to practice on? Who's volunteering for that?

[Joe Getty]

I tell you what, you are brave. Since this chief commercial officer for the company making starts wheeling toward you.

[Michael Waltz]

You get that needle a little high, don't you? It's my head. What are you doing?

[Joe Getty]

Old stale. Human. Old stale. Says the guy who works for the company and probably also remains unj. This all ensures high accuracy and high reliability. No. And with such precision, it reduces any pain and discomfort associated with a normal blood drop.

[Michael Waltz]

Not a chance that's true. Not a freaking chance that's true.

[Joe Getty]

The patient. I don't even want to describe the process. I'll get lightheaded. So you sit in the chair. That's the regular part. The patient then presses a button. The tourniquet tightens around your arm, making the blood dry easier. Then Aletta. This is the name of this beast. Then uses infrared light to locate the veins. The device sprays the patient's alcohol, armed with alcohol to clean it. And an AI driven Doppler ultrasound probe on a robotic arm helps select a vein and determine needle placement. And then it does its dirty deed and collects the blood in the tube. Unless it malfunctions.

[Michael Waltz]

I just don't believe that's possible. Yes, Michael, we could rename your. What's it, Pong. He was the guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe Getty]

Your favorite phlebotomist.

[Michael Waltz]

Yeah. Who unfortunately quit to drive a truck because there's more money in it. But he was the best. Drawn blood. He absolutely made it painless. I just can't imagine that a machine would ever be able to do that.

[Joe Getty]

I was hoping to squeeze this in, but it might have to wait until a little bit later on. Can you imagine if the thing went. Hey, look, look. About 1 times out of 10, we got to recalibrate it and you'll be fine. Hold your arm in the air, the bleeding will stop.

[Michael Waltz]

Nothing counts so much as blood. Sorry, I couldn't hear you over my screaming.

[Joe Getty]

All right, a couple of disappointing stories. First of all, do you have kids in those high falutin traveling sports leagues? And you ever get the sense you're being ripped off? That's a good reason for that, because you are. And second, secondly, and discouragingly, but not shockingly, science believes we have passed peak intelligence as human beings and are, as a race, getting dumber.

[Michael Waltz]

I know I am. If you missed a segment, get the podcast. Armstrong and Getty on demand.

[Joe Getty]

Armstrong and Gettysburg.