Extra Crispy, No Parasites

Summary

Armstrong & Getty On Demand

Episode: "Extra Crispy, No Parasites"

Date: July 10, 2026
Host: iHeartPodcasts

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Armstrong & Getty tackle some of the day’s most gripping headlines with their trademark mix of skepticism, humor, and pointed commentary. The main themes include:

• The alleged Iranian plot to assassinate President Trump and the implications for US security and foreign relations
• The unsustainable trajectory of the US healthcare system with healthcare expert Craig Gotwells, including the political, economic, and personal effects on Americans
• A humorous take on the perks of aging, National French Fry Day, the best and worst french fries, and everyday urban life with homelessness and street safety

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Iranian Assassination Plot Against Trump (03:06 – 10:52)

• Revelation: New Wall Street Journal report details Israeli intelligence uncovering a fresh Iranian plot to kill the President. Trump has been vocal about threats against his life since the US killing of Qasem Soleimani in 2020.
• Historical Context: Jack notes, “We have had 45 different people serve as president. Four U.S. presidents have been assassinated in office, so that’s about 9%.” (03:35)
• Speculation: The hosts discuss global instability that could follow if a foreign nation successfully assassinated a sitting US president—acknowledging the unprecedented consequences.
• Chilling Imagery: Recent anti-US demonstrations in Iran featured a prominent “we will kill Trump” banner at the Ayatollah’s funeral.
• Security Measures: The Secret Service’s moving Trump to the old Air Force One mid-NATO summit—amid unconfirmed intelligence—highlights the seriousness of the threat.

Notable Quotes

• “If Iran flat out killed the sitting President of the United States, and we knew it, I can’t imagine what that would do to the world.” — Jack Armstrong (04:41)
• “‘We will kill Trump.’ Now that’s provocative. What kind of a ceasefire is that?” — Jack Armstrong (09:45)

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2. The State of US Healthcare — Interview with Craig Gotwells (25:52 – 39:00)

Crisis of Affordability & “Parasites” in the System

• Rising Costs: Jack expresses frustration at growing medical bills: “I now hesitate to go...I want to wait and make sure this doesn't fix itself...before I go and get a $380 bill for just dropping by.” (30:02)
• Systemic Issues: Craig Gotwells blames a bloated, parasitic “oligopoly” of insurers and middlemen, exacerbated by massive federal spending without structural reform since the 1960s and Obamacare’s passage.
  • “Healthcare...you’ve created an oligopoly where there’s very few large systems and large insurers...with a whole parasitic class of ticks...and it’s just killing us.” — Craig Gotwells (27:59)
• Lobbying Power: Healthcare is now both “the number one employer and the number one lobby” in the country (28:58).
• Taxpayer Burden: 70% of all healthcare is now taxpayer-funded, blurring party lines.

Medicare, Medicaid, and What’s Next

• The original intent of Medicaid: cover “the lowest 2% of earners” (1965). Now, “four out of every ten babies born in blue states like California are born onto a Medicaid plan” and one-third of US adults are on Medicaid (33:52).
• Medicaid’s efficacy is dismal for many: “For certain heart conditions and diabetes...you might be worse off on Medicaid than if you had no insurance at all.” — Craig Gotwells (34:12)

The Political Prognosis

• Likely Future: Gotwells expects politicians to sell “Medicare for All”—but believes America can only afford “Medicaid for All,” leading to lower-quality care and a two-tier system (those with cash go outside).
• “You’ll get a bifurcated system where those that have money will go out and just pay...cash prices...on their own, like they do in England.” — Gotwells (36:09)
• Permanent Change: Once implemented, “there's no going back...It'll just keep eroding our quality of life. Right. We'll have less cars, smaller houses, you know.” (37:40)

Notable Quotes

• “Healthcare is the number one employer in the country and the number one lobby in the country.” — Gotwells (28:58)
• “One third of all Americans are on a Medicaid plan.” — Gotwells (33:57)
• “The real sin with Medicare and Medicaid is they’ve looped in the prescription benefit managers, the drug companies, and the insurance companies...so there’s a whole parasite class that’s farming on it.” — Gotwells (36:41)
• “It’s depressing. This is not what you want.” — Jack Armstrong (39:00)

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3. National French Fry Day—Fry Talk and Humor (15:16 – 20:15)

• Jack and Michael debate the best fast-food fries: Red Robin, McDonald’s, Wendy’s, and In-N-Out (“extra crispy” hack revealed at 26:23).
• Health angle: Jack consults AI (Anthropic’s Claude) for advice: “Really hard to make the argument for french fries. Calorie dense, high in salt and oil...almost no nutrition.” (17:13)
• “I love french fries, though...thin, crispy, salty kind like you get at McDonald’s...But I also like...big, meaty, thick, potatoey kind.” — Jack Armstrong (17:24)
• “Order them extra crispy. If you haven't done that, you haven't lived.” — Craig Gotwells (26:28)

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4. Aging and “Old Man Privilege” (18:22 – 20:11)

• Jack jokes about the social advantages of being perceived as an “old man”—from extra help at hotels to mercy in grocery self-checkout lines.
• “I am now old enough that people want to help me...and I started to lean into it. Like, I can’t figure out something at the hotel and I ask him something at the desk... and they really take their time and walk me through the thing.” (18:22)

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5. Urban Life: Homelessness, Street Safety & Dark Humor (43:18 – 46:49)

• The hosts share stories and coping humor about the homeless population and urban rats around their radio station.
• Producer Hanson plays “Sleeping or Dead” (43:46) to guess the state of street people; another staffer plays “Let me pass by or lunge” with potentially unstable passersby.
• “If you're in a town over 5,000 people in California, you got lots of street people around. This is just a common thing. Thank you, Gavin Newsom and the blue voters and the lifestyle part of the deal. Let me pass or lunge. Sleeping or dead.” — Jack Armstrong (45:36)

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Notable Quotes and Moments (with Timestamps)

• “If Iran flat out killed the sitting President of the United States, and we knew it, I can't imagine what that would do to the world.” — Jack Armstrong (04:41)
• “There’s no reason to believe anything that anyone is saying out of the Secret Service or the White House...For them to tell us actually what’s going on would be insane.” — Jack Armstrong (07:20)
• “You’ve created an oligopoly...with a whole parasitic class of ticks that are under, that are middle manning the system’s death.” — Craig Gotwells (27:59)
• “Medicaid is the one where studies show you get worse results than if you didn’t have any healthcare.” — Jack Armstrong (34:02)
• “Order them extra crispy. If you haven't done that, you haven't lived.” — Craig Gotwells (26:28)
• “I am now old enough that people want to help me... Used to be when I was younger, if I was not understanding something...people got annoyed with me. But now...oh, that poor old guy, he’s lost or confused or whatever. And they helped me.” — Jack Armstrong (18:22)
• “Sleeping or dead, it’s a fun game to start your day.” — Jack Armstrong (46:40)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 03:06–10:52: Iranian plot against Trump – details, history, reactions
• 15:16–20:15: National French Fry Day jokes, debate, and “old man privilege”
• 25:52–39:00: In-depth healthcare interview with Craig Gotwells
• 43:18–46:49: Urban homelessness, “Sleeping or Dead,” and street safety games

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Episode Tone & Style

This episode embodies the Armstrong & Getty blend: sharply skeptical on politics and bureaucracy, darkly funny on urban life, and occasionally playful or self-deprecating. Their discussions range from dire (assassination plots, healthcare doom) to levity (french fry debates, aging jokes) with candid, conversational insight and regular pop-culture asides.

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Summary for Listeners

Didn’t get to tune in? You missed a provocative analysis of international threats, a “why healthcare is broken” explainer that peels back political spin, and enough fry talk and urban snark to keep things lively. Armstrong & Getty’s conversation with Craig Gotwells is a must-listen for anyone frustrated with the high price and low transparency of American healthcare. Their reflections on political reality, everyday annoyances, and survival tactics for city life offer both a relatable and enlightening hour of commentary.

Transcript

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[Radio Station Announcer]

Broadcasting live from the Abraham Lincoln Lincoln Radio studio at the George Washington Broadcast

[Jack Armstrong]

Center, Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty.

[Joe Getty]

Armstrong and Getty.

[Jack Armstrong]

And now here's Armstrong and Getty. This new reporting comes from the Wall Street Journal. It says Israeli intelligence uncovered what it called a fresh, fresh Iranian plot to assassinate the president. Now, look, those types of threats are nothing new, as Iran has openly vowed to retaliate against Trump for assassinating Iran's top general, Qasem Soleimani. Even going back to 2020, I'm number one on the kill list for Iran. I'm number one on the list for. For killing. Yeah. Trump had been talking about that a lot this week. It had come up several times. And that's probably because he got this information before it broke in the Wall Street Journal overnight of this fresh new assassination plot, we have had 45 different people serve as president. Four U.S. presidents have been assassinated in office, so that's about 9%. And Trump brought that percentage up the other day. When you look at it that way, that's relatively high. It's more dangerous, as he said, than being a race car driver or lots of other supposedly dangerous things. Being President of the United States. Now, we have not had a president assassinated by a foreign country. A lot of speculation around that, specifically with jfk, obviously, and the fact that Lee Harvey Oswald had been to Russia. And we're not going to rehash all that, but there's never been any proof that the Soviet Union was actually behind that. But if Iran flat out killed the sitting President of the United States, and we knew it, I can't imagine what that would do to the world. How would we react to that? I don't know. I actually do not know. I would assume that the gloves would be completely off and we would just destroy the country. But first of all, you got a lot of people who don't like Trump, and a lot of the country doesn't like Trump, and I don't know how the world would react to that. And a lot of innocent people would lose their lives who had nothing to do with wanting to assassinate Trump, but it would be crazy ugly. I'm looking at a TV right now. Charlie Dagata from CBS is there, and they were just showing the video of those hundreds of thousands of mourners because of the Ayatollah's funeral that was going on this week. And they unfurled that giant banner saying we will kill Trump, which is wild. Let's hear a little more of the reporting. This is from a special report on Fox.

[Radio Station Announcer]

Around this, hundreds of mourners dressed in black hold a giant red flag that reads we will kill Trump. Another group of women hold up puzzle pieces that read killing you is not enough for us. We want to uproot demons. And this man holds up a sign that simply reads revenge. That is the message Iran is sending tonight on this final day of Ayatollah Ali Khamenei's funeral.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah, it's not like they're hiding that. And I have to assume that in Iran, those protesters do not unfurl that banner without the approval of the IRGC or whoever is currently in charge of crazy Islamic nutjob crowds there in Iran, you don't get to do whatever you want. The government probably made the banner that they unfurled. The report goes on.

[Radio Station Announcer]

Renewed scrutiny tonight on his security. The New York Times reports it was the Secret Service that urged the president to leave the NATO summit in Turkey aboard the old Air Force One instead of the new Qatari donated plane he arrived in, raising questions about whether the plane was retrofitted with sufficient security measures. The White House pushing back, telling Fox the new Air Force One is a state of the art aircraft that has been fitted with high level security protocols that ensure the safety, safety of the president and his staff.

[Jack Armstrong]

There's no reason to believe anything that anyone is saying out of the Secret Service or the White House or leaking to whichever news organization about this story. For them to tell us actually what's going on would be insane. It's good cover for the Secret Service or whoever to leak that yeah, the, the new plane wasn't up to speed on anti missile technology. So that's why we switched planes. We don't have any idea and we shouldn't have any idea. To me, the key detail was that they hurried the president onto the old Air Force One plane and had everybody pull down their sheet blind or window blinds or whatever you call those things. Pull the close the windows there so no light could get in or out for whatever reason there what the heck was going on. So again, this is the Wall Street Journal with this exclusive today, Israel recently shared intelligence with the United States about a new Iran plot to assassinate President Trump. According to the report comes after years of threats from Iran to kill Trump as revenge specifically for the 2020 killing of their IRGC leader Kossam Soleimani by US forces. And that's now six years ago. When asked for comment, the White House referred the post to Trump's Wednesday remarks at the NATO summit when he said, they want to take out the US Leader. Me, I'm on whatever list I saw this morning, I'm on every single one of their lists. And so far, I guess I've been a bit lucky, but maybe that doesn't last very long. How about that comment from a sitting President of the United States? Maybe I've been lucky and that doesn't last very long. That's a pretty fatalist view of a country wanting to assassinate you and your country's ability to keep you protected. These are evil, sick people, Trump went on. And we have to root out that cancer. That cancer. You know what you do? You gotta cut out the cancer early. And that's the way I feel, said Trump. Now, Pete Hegseth, the Secretary of War who accompanied the president to the summit, was instructed not to travel to Israel, as was planned before Trump chose to switch planes in Turkey. So Hegseth was going to go to Israel and they told him not to. So that possibly probably had something to do with the assassination plot, whatever was going on there. The Wall Street Journal does not have details on the alleged assassination plot, and they shouldn't. We should not know what the plan was or how we figured out what it was. The Israelis tipped the United States off about the plot earlier this week. That's why Trump was talking about it all week long. The specific threat was not being tracked by US Officials before Israel's warning and has yet to be vetted, CNN reported. So it's something Israel got onto with their amazing intelligence abilities there in the region, better than ours. Something Israel got onto that we didn't know about, that they alerted us to. Again, banners vowing revenge against Trump were on full display in Tehran this week as Iranians prepared to bury the late Supreme Leader with their giant banner that they unfurled that read we will kill Trump in all caps. Now that's provocative. What kind of a ceasefire is that? What kind of a. These are good people. You know what's cool is that they now realize that being an enemy of the United States was a bad plan, said J.D.

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[Jack Armstrong]

A couple of weeks ago, the official ceremonies for the death of their leader included a banner that says we will kill the President of the United States. What the hell? I have no idea where this story is going and neither does anybody else. I want to talk about the advantages of being old at Least for me. Coming up soon. First, I want to tell you about Incogni, which is just a dang good idea. They got the law on their side. We do have laws out there that you can get your information off of data brokers, but you don't know how to do it. You don't have the time or expertise Incogni does. Every time you get a spam call, every scam text, every sketchy email with your name all starts the same way. Somebody knows your info. Somebody found you. And we all know our info sitting out there on data brokers because it gets sold, it gets stolen. It gets sold.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

Everything you sign up for, you have to give your information and then they sell it. And so every scam starts with one thing. Your personal info being available. And so you need to get it off of there. The way is to disappear. With the help of Incogni, they contact hundreds of data brokers and legally force them to remove your information. We're using Incogni to get our names and info away from the data brokers. They can't spam you if they can't find you. And right now you can get 60% off with an exclusive [e-mail] it's spelled I n c o g n I.com Armstrong take back your privacy. That's incog.com Armstrong I've noticed maybe this has been going on for a while, I just didn't pick up on it. But I've noticed the way I get treated as I've reached a become a man of a certain age and it's actually working to my benefit. I pointed this out to my son while we were on vacation and he started laughing. Once it. Once I pointed it out to him and it became obvious what was going on, he found it very amusing. So I've got that and a bunch of other actual news of the day on this national French Friday.

[Joe Getty]

Coming up, Armstrong and Gettysburg.

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[Bethenny Frankel]

This is Bethenny Frankel from Just Be with Bethenny Frankel. Let me be blunt. Most dog food is junk. It just is. And I'm not feeding junk to Biggie and Smalls. That is why they eat just food for dogs. It's real, 100% human grade food with ingredients I actually recognize, not mystery pellets pretending to be healthy. And once I switched, the difference was obviously better digestion, better skin, more energy. Dogs who actually feel good instead of just surviving dinner. Here's the thing. Do you care about quality? You make an intentional choice to be healthy. So why are you gambling with your dog's health? So let's think about our furry babies. Go to justfood for dogs.com right now and get 50% off your first box. No code. Just try it. Because once you see the difference, you're not going back.

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[Jack Armstrong]

Now, Michael, we have three jokes about the same topic. National French Friday. Why did you not present this as a. What do we call that? A late night joke off?

[Sports Announcer]

Yeah, I guess I could, but we

[Jack Armstrong]

don't have Joe here, the judge, he usually judges this whenever, when, whenever a bunch of the late night comedians take on one topic. Joe usually judges them and gives them letter grades. And whoever gets the lowest grade is banned from comedy, which, you know, is symbolic rather than it does. It's not a. It doesn't have the power of law, as they say. It's kind of like the. Whatever that act is where Congress can say, you're not allowed to prosecute this war. Mr. Trump doesn't have any teeth. They can vote all they want. They still can't stop him from doing. He wants to do. Did you know that? No, they never tell you that. Anyway, back to the jokes. It's National French Friday and several of the late night comics took on that topic. The frozen foods brand Orida released A limited edition line of skis designed to look like french fries. Now you and your health can both go downhill. America is reportedly on the verge of a french fry shortage. For real. Because of all the cold and wet weather this year, fewer potatoes are expected. This really tells you all you need to know about how we eat in this country. The two hardest foods in America to get are french fries and the Popeyes chicken sandwich. One of the biggest french fry factories in North America is closing because Americans are eating fewer french fries. People are eating fewer french fries than every Uber Eats. Driver was like, speak for yourself. Yeah, I asked, what do I use? I use Claude mostly. Oh, Elon with some nice things to say about Anthropic yesterday. I'll get to that later. Claude, he says. Claude is the best. Anthropic is the best current AI out there. Anyway, ask Claude if she should ever eat french fries from a nutrition angle. Really hard to make the argument for french fries. Calorie dense, high in salt and oil, and with lots of carbs and fat and almost no nutrition whatsoever.

[CarMax Announcer]

They just.

[Jack Armstrong]

They got. They got nothing good for you. It's like if you're eating really tasty Styrofoam or something, or rocks, like a really delicious rocks. Would you do that? I love french fries, though. I like all different kinds of french fries. I like the, like, thin, crispy, salty kind like you get at McDonald's. Those are really, really good. But I also like it when they're the big, meaty, thick, potatoey kind. Oh, those good? Like at Red Robin. Red Robin has really good french fries. Big, thick french fries. Like eating a potato and you slaughter those with ketchup. Damn, that's good. Who's got the best french fry? Michael.

[Sports Announcer]

I'd say red Robin and McDonald's, definitely.

[Jack Armstrong]

Come on, give me a new one. One I didn't mention. You got to like. You got to.

[Sports Announcer]

Well, I've had.

[Jack Armstrong]

When I'm so far away from the microphone, nobody can hear me. No, I like you just use two examples I've got. Give me a new example.

[Sports Announcer]

In and out as good fries.

[Jack Armstrong]

If you eat them right away, in my opinion. Yeah, as soon as they hand them to you, they're delicious. Like five minutes later, I don't like them.

[Joe Getty]

There's more.

[Sports Announcer]

I like Wendy's too.

[Jack Armstrong]

Good, good French fry right there. No nutritional value is that. Went to a restaurant yesterday with my son, and dang, I almost got pulled into the french fry vortex there, but I stayed healthy with some sort of rice and meat, which is a boring Lifestyle because I'm old. Speaking of being old, I've come to this realization. I am now old enough that people want to help me because they're kind of worried about me and feel bad for me. Used to be when I was younger, if I was not understanding something or having trouble with this or that, people got annoyed with me. But now I've reached the age where people see me as a, oh, that poor old guy, he's lost or confused or whatever. And they helped me and I pointed this, I became aware of it. Then I pointed it out to my son while we were on vacation and I started to lean into it. Like I can't figure out something at the hotel and I ask him something at the desk. Yeah, I can't figure out how to do this. Oh well, let me help you with that. Says the 28 year old woman or whatever it is. And they really take their time and walk me through the thing because they think that poor old guy is going to wander out into traffic or something. And I used it over and over again. It was really fantastic. That poor lost old man. If I can't figure out where something is or how to use something or the, the self checkout at the grocery store. Now anybody younger than me, oh, let me help you with that. They'll like take stuff out of my hands and start doing it for me. It's really kind of nice. I feel like my parents don't take advantage of this. I'm, I'm obviously a lot younger than my parents. I don't think they're taking advantage of this yet. In their 80s. I already, I just, I just became 60 recently and I already am leaning into the help this doddering old man figure out how to do this or that. It's kind of relaxing.

[Sports Announcer]

See I get the people think I'm lost and confused, but not old.

[Jack Armstrong]

Right. And, and it annoyed people when I was younger. When I was my 40s and 50s and I couldn't figure out how to use the self checkout or do something at the hotel or whatever it was, people were kind of angry with me, including the people behind me in line. Now somebody in line behind me will move. Oh, I'm sorry, I can help you with that again. That poor nice, kindly old man probably fought in World War II or I don't know how old they think I, they helped me out with things. So it's got its advantages. Came across this article just going through my notes from everything I read yesterday. 90% of US adults have this syndrome, but most have Never heard of it. New guidelines may soon make the disorder known as CKM syndrome, a common diagnosis. I wanted to bring this to your attention in case you hear about it. It's got to do with your blood, your heart, strokes, heart attack, all this different sort of stuff. The reason I'm not going to go into kind of a deep dive on this and explain it to you is if 90% of adults have something, is there any point to declare that you've got this? How about we all just assume we've all got it? That's almost all of us, right? It's like Joe was talking about the other day, at some point when what's the threshold for people having depression and anxiety and people are on drugs for depression and anxiety, or the same with the weight loss bills. At what point do you cross the line to where it's not a. It's not really even hardly a thing to comment on. It's just the human condition. Oh, so you're a human being too. Here's the pills you should take. Oh, you're a human being too. Here's the exercises you should do. Or you're a human being. Here's the things you should watch out for. Because so many of us have it. I don't know, but this. 90% of us have this thing. CKM syndrome. I should actually get tested. Would me great to be in the 10% that don't have to worry near as much about strokes and heart attacks. Elon Musk said this yesterday. Since I brought it up, he tweeted this out. This is one of the reasons I don't understand the hate for Elon Musk. I get flipped off practically daily in my cybertruck because people hate Elon so much. I was clearly wrong about Anthropic. Elon texted yesterday. There are obvious. They are obviously currently the leader in AI. No company has released a model as good as Mythos Fable and they will undoubtedly have Mythos 2 ready soon. That's the one I'm using on my phone now. And I would never cut them off in a way that hurt them badly. Even as a competitor, that's not my style. Tesla open sourced its patents and we made the Supercharger network available to all competitors. Even though we could have made it a walled garden. Yeah, I see people charging their various vehicles that compete with Teslas all the time at the Tesla Supercharger. And he didn't have to do that. In fact, I don't think most people would have done that. They would have used that as a competitive advantage, he said. SpaceX launches competing satellite systems with no increase in price or use of unfair terms of any kind. You want your satellite up there and you're a competitor? Fine, I'll launch it up there. And even my worst enemies can criticize me on this platform, which is Twitter. How are people so down on Elon? Who else would do the things that I just mentioned? He's the world's richest man. He doesn't have to Armstrong and Getty

[Orderly Meds Announcer]

Summer is here, which means we all want to look and feel our best. A GLP1 may be right for you. Visit orderlymeds.com to learn more about which GLP1 you could be eligible. Getting started is fast, easy and happens virtually through telemedicine from licensed professionals. Check it out for yourself. Go to orderlymeds.com podcast that's orderlymeds.com podcast taking care of yourself feels great. Compounded medications are not FDA approved. Eligibility required and determined by a licensed provider. Individual results may vary. See website for details.

[Sports Announcer]

The best skaters, BMX riders and moto athletes in the world don't compete in leagues until now. The X Games League Championship is live From New Orleans, July 24 through 26. Three days of elite action sports, plus performances from Metro Boomin, Jid Subtronics and Bunt Watch on ABC ESPN and ESPN 2. Stream on the ESPN app Roku Kick, Amazon and X Games YouTube. The inaugural champion gets crowned this July.

[Bethenny Frankel]

This is Bethenny Frankel from Just Be with Bethenny Frankel. Let me be blunt. Most dog food is junk. It just is. And I'm not feeding junk to Biggie and Smalls. That is why they eat just food for dogs. It's real, 100% human grade food with ingredients I actually recognize, not mystery pellets pretending to be healthy. And once I switched, the difference was obvious. Better digestion, better skin, more energy. Dogs who actually feel good instead of just surviving dinner. Here's the thing you care about quality. You make an intentional choice to be healthy. So why are you gambling with your dog's health? So let's think about our furry babies. Go to justfood4dogs.com right now and get 50% off your first box. No code. Just try it. Because once you see the difference, you're not going back.

[Glenn Washington]

I'm Glenn Washington, host of Snap Judgment, the award winning storytelling podcast from kqed. Every week Snap deals a new card like the girl whose sister was a monkey, the man who lived in the woods for 30 years, or the woman who snuck her lover out of prison in a dog crate. Pick a card, any card. Snap judgment from kqed. New episodes every Thursday. Wherever you get your podcast.

[Jack Armstrong]

We've been talking to Craig Gotwells for years for a variety of reasons. He is a healthcare expert. That's actually what he does for companies, is he helps them with their health care plans. So he's got to know exactly what's going on. And he warned us about the Affordable Care Act, Obamacare, long before it started, how it was going to turn out.

[Kyle McLaughlin]

And it.

[Jack Armstrong]

He has. He has been completely right. Craig got Wells. Welcome to the Armstrong and Getty Show.

[Joe Getty]

Thank you. Jack, how you doing?

[Jack Armstrong]

First of all, it's National French Friday. What's your favorite French fry?

[Joe Getty]

In and out, Extra crispy, hot out of the fryer.

[Jack Armstrong]

You can order them extra crispy, Jack.

[Joe Getty]

If you haven't done that, you haven't lived. Order them extra crispy. It's. It's like a whole new experience. I have totally different.

[Jack Armstrong]

I have never done that. And I will, I guarantee you. And you know I mean it. I will do that today. Awesome. Well, that's cool. There's so many hacks around in n out. I need to go onto a Reddit page or something and learn the hacks. Extra crispy, in and out. French fries. Sorry to those you around the country who do not have an in now. Anyway, Craig, so one of the reasons I wanted to bring this up with you is, first of all, I saw a graph on Twitter the other day with some sort of bulge in the middle that said the Affordable Care act is not so affordable anymore. And it reminded me just anecdotally, the bills I've been getting for every time I take my kids to the doctor for anything have gotten so much bigger than they used to be. I'm actually to the point now that if something happens to my kids, rather than going to urgent care or making an appointment, I wait and see how it's gonna turn out. Because the bills are so high. It's like, I don't want to go again. Am I. Is it just my imagination or is something happening?

[Joe Getty]

No, no, you're on target. I mean, we're headed toward a cliff of unsustainability here. I mean, we've been headed toward that cliff for quite some time. But you can't. Healthcare on a macroeconomic level, Jack. The breaking started in the 60s when we just dumped a ton of federal money into it with Medicare and Medicaid. And then in 2010, we dumped another ton of money into it with Obamacare. But we did nothing to structurally fix it. So we've got all this federal money sloshing around and you've got, you've created an oligopoly where there's very few large systems and large insurers that are providers with a whole parasitic class of ticks that are under, that are middle manning the system's death. And it's, it's, it's just, it's killing, it's killing us. Whether you have an employer plan or you have a, an Obamacare plan or whether you're paying out of pocket for care, it's just become completely unsustainable.

[Jack Armstrong]

So you use the word oligarchy around healthcare. How come the Bernie Sanders and the Elizabeth Warrens of the world aren't worried about this?

[Joe Getty]

Well, because this is exactly what socialized medicine looks like. This is how, this is, this is what they aspire to and how those folks in the ruling class get even richer. Healthcare is our number one employer in the country and it's the number one lobby in the country. So healthcare is greasing the skids everywhere along the path.

[Jack Armstrong]

Okay, let's start. Hold on. There's. Health care is the number one employer in the country and the number one lobby in the country.

[Joe Getty]

Wow.

[Jack Armstrong]

I don't think most people know that.

[Joe Getty]

No. And as we, we've mentioned before on your show, we're now at a point where it doesn't even matter whether you live in a blue state or a red state. 70% of all your health care is now paid for by taxpayer dollars. But instead of doing it in a, let's call it a quasi efficient method of Medicare, which it's not, but if you had. Medicare is more straightforward than what we have with Obamacare. You're looping in the pbm, the insurance companies, the brokers, and all these middlemen that are all parasitic and profit upon your illness. Their job is to maximize profit. And again, if it were a free market, Jack, you know I would be entirely for it when we come to big drug and to big insurance. And it's not, it's an oligopoly, not a free market. And they're paying off the politicians because that's what happens when you have broken markets.

[Jack Armstrong]

Well, like I said, I've noticed my bills have gotten so much bigger over the years that I now hesitate to go. I think, you know, I want to wait and make sure this doesn't fix itself on its own before I go and get a $380bill for just dropping by and saying, take a look at this, which didn't used to happen. Is there any reason to think it's going to not get worse?

[Joe Getty]

Realistically, it's almost certainly going to get worse before we have any kind of change to get better. The question will be when it does get this much worse, will the people opt for something easy like Medicare or like, I would say it's going to end up being Medicaid for all. Medicare is too expensive, it's got to be Medicaid, which is even worse. Or you just, you have to, you have to break the system so badly that you pull the federal government out of it and you have individuals go back to pure price transparency and buying their own healthcare. I don't see that as the most likely option. I mean, the only path where that happens is if it's all done at the employer level because employers still control about 30 to 40% of healthcare. And if employers self insure their plans and get out of the oligopoly as much as they can, that's where we can make some real change. But we're working with one third of the pie, you know, as far as the money goes, even less than one third of the piece.

[Jack Armstrong]

Does Rand Paul's argument work? He always uses, because he was an optimist, is an ophthalmologist, he always uses the example of Lasik because it's outside of the insurance thing. You know, you pay cash for that and so it was competitive and you have people, you know, there's a reason for me to keep my costs down to get more customers where that doesn't exist. If you go into the doctor for anything else, does that model work as an example of what could be.

[Joe Getty]

It absolutely does. So, and that's kind of what we're advocating for with what I do. And so how you would do that at the individual level, and I know this sounds counterintuitive to people, is we need to legalize because right now it's illegal to do it. Something like $25,000 or $50,000 deductible plans for individuals. And the only reason I say that is you really only want insurance for those catastrophic events that occur that you can't afford. And if you, if you for example, put every American on a plan that either had a 25,000 DOL or a $50,000 deductible, now if they're super low income, you put them into Medicaid, right? But those people that can, that can budget their own care, you would start seeing price transparency and negotiation for things like urgent care for Things like common over the counter drugs for things like your doctor visits. And it would all come down to a reasonable price because you would realize there's not just a federal slush fund that's, that's washing around that everybody's trying to feed at the trough of.

[Jack Armstrong]

I know you got these stats at the top of your head. What was back in the 60s when we came up with these socialized health plans? What was the original goal versus where we are now in terms of percentages of people covered?

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, I knew you loved this statistic. So when Medicaid was passed, Medicaid is for our low income, Medicare is for our seniors. And the difference is, at least in theory, the way the actuary set it up, we all pay into Medicare as we work. And then in theory, the way it was supposed to be set up, as we're paying for our own care when we then retire. It doesn't work that way. It's not, it's broken, it's not funding enough, just like Social Security. But if you just look at Medicaid, the idea with Medicaid was we're going to cover the lowest 2% of earners in 1965. That was the projection that they said, you know, by about 1990, we're going to cover the lowest 2% of earners in our country. And now four out of every 10 babies born in blue states like California are born onto a Medicaid plan.

[Radio Station Announcer]

Wow.

[Jack Armstrong]

From 2% to 4%. 40%.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

I mean, that's just stunning.

[Joe Getty]

And it's roughly one third across the country for adults too. One third of all Americans are on a Medicaid plan.

[Jack Armstrong]

And so Medicaid is the one where studies show you get worse results than if you didn't have any healthcare.

[Joe Getty]

There are reputable university backed studies that have shown that for certain heart conditions and diabetes care management and certain conditions, you actually might be worse off on Medicaid than if you had no insurance at all. Because you end up in such a long line to get care and it becomes such a headache and you end up with such, with a much smaller panel of doctors that it's actually worse than if you were able to scrape up enough cash to pay for these things on your own and be outside of that system.

[Jack Armstrong]

God, that's horrifying. And that could be all of us soon. So moving from the realm of your expertise, healthcare, into a realm. I know you know a lot about the politics of it, I just, I think it's going to be a pretty easy sell for Bernie Or Elizabeth Warren or whoever is, you know, running the campaign for this, or whoever's the nominee for president for Democrats to say, hey, look, the bills are too high, the paperwork's getting you down. Let's just go meta. You said we're gonna go meta. Care for all, probably, or Medicaid for all.

[Joe Getty]

They'll talk about, they'll say Medicare, they'll say Medicare. The difference is, and I have, I actually have these numbers right at my fingertip, the difference is the cost for one enrollee for one single person in Medicare is just about $12,000 per year per person, but the cost on Medicaid is only $8,000 per year per person. Because Medicaid is cheaper, because it has less doctors, because it's not as good. The country can't afford Medicare for all. I mean, we're talking 36, $40 trillion over a 10 year span. We can't afford it. So I think ultimately what they'll do is they'll pitch Medicare for all, but it'll end up looking a lot more like Medicaid for all, where we really have this horrific system that nobody wants to be in if they can avo. And then you'll get a bifurcated system where those that have money will go out and just pay, they'll pay cash prices, they'll negotiate deals directly with doctors and they'll do it on their own,

[Jack Armstrong]

like they do in England with nhs,

[Joe Getty]

like they do in England. But there are some countries, and I believe Canada is one of them, where that's illegal. Like, I don't think we'll go that far. Yeah, I don't think we'll go that far. But yeah, there are some of the socialized countries, Jack, where you can't pay cash for service. They don't let you buy a separate policy.

[Jack Armstrong]

And so my, that's crazy. So my concern is that people wouldn't know what it's costing. It'll just get rolled into just kind of general taxes which half the country doesn't pay. And so you won't have a concrete getting a bill understanding of what we're all paying for this.

[Joe Getty]

No. And what'll happen is it'll be like the scandals, and you spoke about them, I think it was maybe yesterday. But the scandals with the Medicare fraud we've seen in Minnesota and California, those will just get worse. Because, see, the real sin with Medicare and Medicaid is they've looped in the prescription benefit managers, the drug companies and the insurance companies are all part of it in the in the supplement space. And so there's a whole bunch of people getting rich. Rich and farming the federal taxpayer. Then you've got brokers that farm that as well. So you have this whole parasite class that's farming on it. Because again, because number one lobby in the United States, number one employer in the United States, they have the power, they have Congress's ear. And the taxpayer just gets steamrolled. But you're absolutely right. It'll. It'll be some of this Frankenstein hybrid, Medicare, Medicaid, and you'll. You'll have all those dollars just. We won't know what things really cost.

[Jack Armstrong]

And then there's no going back.

[Joe Getty]

Nope. And it'll. It'll just keep eroding our quality of life. Right. We'll have less cars, smaller houses, you know.

[Glenn Washington]

Right.

[Joe Getty]

Like we see in France or whatever.

[Jack Armstrong]

God, that's depressing.

[Sports Announcer]

Are you.

[Joe Getty]

I always do this to you, Jack.

[Jack Armstrong]

I know. But, you know, one of the hallmarks of conservatism, George Will taught me this. I heard him say this once. And I always remember recognizing what is, is one of the hallmarks of conservatives, whether it's good news or bad news, just recognizing what are the facts. And these are the facts. And I don't think there's any disputing it. Are you getting any fishing done?

[Joe Getty]

Very little. You know, I made a work transition a couple years ago and I've been working too darn much, but a little bit here and there and it's been all right. But not. Not like it was back in the old days when I was a sponsored bass fisherman and putting in 50 to 100 days on the water a year.

[Jack Armstrong]

Wow, 100 days a year fishing. That had to be awesome.

[Joe Getty]

It was. But that's a little bit of a cheat because I'd get out on Folsom Lake and fish until 9am and then be in the office by 10. So I would count that as a day on the water.

[Jack Armstrong]

Cool. If people want your expertise, how do they get ahold of you?

[Joe Getty]

Got walls.substack.com okay.

[Jack Armstrong]

And we will link that at our website. Can we do that? Hanson, really appreciate your time today. That was excellent, Craig.

[Joe Getty]

Of course, Jack. Thank you.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah, that, that. The whole healthcare thing is so depressing. And he started talking about this. We've been talking to Craig for years. And it was before Obamacare is when the national debate was going on about Obamacare. He was predicting on where this was headed. And he's been right about all of it. And, you know, lots of conservative pundits were saying the same thing. But Craig, because he's so detailed and in that industry on how it was going to be such an easy sell at some point politically for socialized medicine because it gets more expensive and more complicated and more annoying to where people just throw up their hands. They might as well just have socialized medicine. At which point, again, we don't have the slightest idea what it's costing because you never pay any actual bills. It's just kind of factored into the overall cost of America, which again, as he just pointed out, just kind of drags down the whole economy with smaller houses and smaller cars and just a more sluggish economy. And nobody will understand that there'll be no it's depressing. This is not what you want. Do you have it handy? Michael? We need it on a Friday. And then I'm gonna. I'll stop being depressing, at least on this topic, I promise, because it's just, it's. It's overwhelming to me. Armstrong and Getty. The most depressing radio show

[Glenn Washington]

ever.

[Jack Armstrong]

I don't want to be that. I don't want to be that. We have something fun. Next. Promise. Thank you, Armstrong and Getty.

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[Sports Announcer]

The best skaters, BMX riders and moto athletes in the world don't compete in leagues until now. The X Games League Championship is live From New Orleans, July 24 through 26. Three days of elite action sports, plus performances from metro Boomin, Jid Subtronics and Bunt Watch on ABC, ESPN and ESPN 2. Stream Stream on the ESPN app, Roku Kick, Amazon and X Games YouTube the inaugural champion gets crowned this July.

[Bethenny Frankel]

This is Bethenny Frankel from Just Be with Bethenny Frankel. Let me be blunt. Most dog food is junk. It just is. And I'm not feeding junk to Biggie and Smalls. That is why they eat just food for dogs. It's real, 100% human grade food with ingredients I actually recognize. Not mystery pellets pretending to be healthy. And once I switched, the difference was obvious. Better digestion, better skin, more energy. Dogs who actually feel good instead of just surviving dinner. Here's the thing. You care about quality. You make an intentional choice to be healthy. So why are you gambling with your dog's health? So let's think about our furry babies. Go to justfoodfordogs.com right now and get 50% off your first box. No code. Just try it. Because once you see the difference, you're not going back.

[Glenn Washington]

I'm Glenn Washington, host of Snap Judgment, the award winning storytelling podcast from kqed. Every week, Snap deals a new card. Like the girl whose sister was a monkey, the man who lived in the woods for 30 years, or the woman who snuck her lover out of prison in a dog crate. Pick a card, any card. Snap Judgment from kqed. New episodes every Thursday. Wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jack Armstrong]

Want to talk about the street people around the radio station here in a second, but before I get to that, just came across this story in the California Post. It's. It's a horrifying story. I mean, it's a. It's a. It's a murder. Couple of murders. This, this guy shot and killed his girlfriend and her lover. But this is an interesting wrinkle on this. So this dude in San Diego, him and his girlfriend, they're in their late 20s, at 27 and 28, they agreed to have an open relationship. Okay, you know, let your freak flag fly. I guess I've never quite understood that, but fine. They agreed to have an open relationship. She brings a homeless dude into their home as her lover. Yeah, so I'm thinking when he had agreed to an open relationship, he was picturing some, you know, you're gonna find some college guy or something like that and, you know, whatever. She brings a homeless dude into their house and then lets him live there. This homeless guy had been living in their house for a couple of weeks there in Ramona, San Diego area. And then the scumbag guy twists off and kills them both, which is obviously incredibly uncool. But, but, man, when you go for the open relationship, you don't think the other one's gonna go homeless lover. Speaking of the homeless, we got a lot of them right around the radio station here, specifically over by the Wells Fargo bank and the Cane's Chicken Hansen, our executive producer, he's really become enthralled with the rats, the number of rats that they have around there. And he likes watching them scurry around and run up and down the poles and everything like. But he told me he plays a game when he comes to work now when he's sitting at the stoplight, sleeping or dead, he sees somebody there on the street of the sidewalk and tries to determine whether they're sleeping or dead. And he had one today that he is really wondering, sleeping or dead? Because there were. The rats were within feet of the guy, and you wouldn't think the rats would get that close to a guy. And he tried to decide if he should call 911 or go over and nudge the guy or whatever, but he thought, you know, if he's dead, what good is it going to do? Somebody will figure this out. And if he's sleeping, of course, you know, the guy's got a full day of work ahead of him. You don't want to wake him up when he's trying to get his slumber before he, you know, gets to the office or whatever the guy does. Oh, my God, you're passed out. Methed up, passed out with rats around you. Nice lifestyle. And I mentioned that to Jensen, who we've had on the air many, many times over the years. She's out there in the newsroom. I mentioned that playing the game homeless or sleep, Sleeping or dead with the homeless guy. She says she plays Let me pass by or lunge is the game she plays. When they're standing up in the street, is this guy just gonna let me drive by or is he going to lunge in front of my car? What a great environment. Oh, my God. I know apartia parts of the country where some of you are listening, you can't even imagine that this goes on. If you're in a town, over 5,000 people in California, you got lots of street people around. This is just a common thing. Thank you, Gavin Newsom and the blue voters and the lifestyle part of the deal. Let me pass or lunge. Sleeping or dead, it's a fun game to start your day.

[Radio Station Announcer]

Armstrong and Gettysburg.

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[Sports Announcer]

The first ever X Games League championship is going down live and New Orleans has the call. Three days of elite action sports. A season's worth of competition coming down to one final weekend. Watch July 24th through 26th on ABC, ESPN and ESPN2, or stream on the ESPN app, X Games, YouTube, Kick, Roku sports channel and Amazon. The championship starts July 24th. Don't miss the moment it becomes history.

[Bethenny Frankel]

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[Kyle McLaughlin]

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