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Christina Quinn
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Christina Quinn
If you eat too many ultra processed foods, you could be starving your gut microbes and they'll get hangry. That's one of many things I learned after working on a new audio course about the gut microbiome. You can learn how to keep your gut happy by listening to Try this from the Washington Post. I'm Christina Quinn. I host Try this. Dig in with me on practical advice for life's common challenges. Follow Try this right now, wherever you're listening. Seriously, try it.
Joe Getty
Ah, come on.
Christina Quinn
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Jack Armstrong
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Broadcasting live from.
Justin Logan
The Abraham Lincoln Radio Studio at the George Washington Broadcast Center.
Unknown
Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty.
Ice Cube
Armstrong and Getty.
Justin Logan
And now here's Armstrong and Getty.
Joe Getty
Doesn't look like it's even going to work on paper, but imagine trying to force those huge movements of population or militaries in the real world in potentially a continuing battlefield zone. That's the reality of the idea of territorial swaps already flat out rejected here by Ukraine. A tough political ask, an impossible military ask, you might argue. And that really leaves people so anxious here that if the bedrock of these talks potentially is territorial swaps, and that is impractical and unsellable here, what possibly could Trump emerge from that meeting with.
Justin Logan
That CNN's reporting yesterday? I've heard a lot of different reporting and a lot of different angles, of course, because this came together really fast and we have no idea how it's going to go or really even what the topic matter is going to be.
Joe Getty
Let's discuss with Justin Logan, director of Defense and Foreign Policy Studies at the Cato Institute. Justin's take might differ somewhat from ours, but he has at least an idea from judging from his recent piece of how a settlement might look. The title of the piece is the Key to Success at Trump Putin Alaska Summit on Ukraine Low Expectations. Justin Logan joins us now. Justin, how are you, sir?
Unknown
Just fine. Good morning.
Joe Getty
Low expectations, I think is absolutely an appropriate stance as we don't see much overlap at all between Putin's goals for the territory of Ukraine and Ukraine's certainly.
Unknown
Yeah. I mean, the underlying and unhappy unfortunate act of the matter is that Russia is in a relatively stronger position on the battlefield than Ukraine is. And that makes Russia both more willing to continue the conflict and less willing to compromise diplomatically. So Trump has a very difficult task here, which is to see whether a piece can be produced that isn't disastrous from Ukraine's point of view and that as I said, the piece we should have low expectations, even incremental shifts would be welcome at this point.
Justin Logan
Yeah, that seems like one of the problems I've been saying for the last couple of days is Ukraine is horrified with the status quo. Putin's okay with the status quo. He'd be fine with continuing prosecuting the war the way he is. So a nothing burger would be good from his standpoint. How do you get around that?
Unknown
No, that's exactly right. And you know, the Ukrainians have said, you know, look, our Constitution commits us to pursue NATO membership, which isn't going to happen, and prohibits us from ceding any territory, including Crimea, which has already happened. So they're sort of using this sort of legalistic argumentation to dig in on a position that just isn't going to happen. So I don't fault them for that. It makes a lot of sense to me that they should look as unwilling to compromise as possible in the hopes of getting a compromise that, again, isn't a total disaster. But on paper, yeah, this thing isn't really going to go very far very fast if it goes anywhere.
Joe Getty
One question we've been bandying back and forth is whether Europe will, as I put it earlier, find at least one of its testicles and assert itself as a party that truly has a strong interest in stability or not. How do you see NATO slash Europe's involvement in this latest chapter?
Unknown
Yeah, I mean, they are also digging in and not showing much flexibility. But I think the question is, you know, Europe needs to, you know, to maybe I'll avoid your metaphor, but it needs to sort of, it needs to sort of back its diplomacy with force. Right. The ultimate ratio in international relations is military power. And Europe is short still to this day on military power, despite its declaration that it's going to spend three and a half percent of GDP on defense by 2035. It needs to spend more and it needs to spend better if it wants more voice. And I think that that's the sort of crucial disconnect that Trump has laid bare, which is that, you know, if Europe wants more, say it needs more power. And that is an enduring problem for both, particularly for the Europeans, but also, in my view, for the Americans. If the Americans want to hand over European security to Europe, which I think would be a good thing to do, Europe needs to get back together. And it's making noises about doing so, but not to my, not, not enough to my satisfaction.
Justin Logan
So you don't do a lot of testicle metaphors there at Cato, not on the radio. You know, this might end up being a lesson in real politic for a lot of us, this whole thing, because Lindsey Graham saying on the Sunday shows that, look, Ukraine isn't going to, you know, get back every bit of their land and Putin's not going to Kiev.
Unknown
But.
Justin Logan
Which I think those things are true. But, boy, I don't know where this goes.
Unknown
Yeah, I mean, Lindsey Graham grappling with reality is progress and international politics anyway. I mean, the bare facts of the matter is we're not going back to 2014, unfortunately. It would be great if Ukraine, you know, regained all territory the international community recognizes as being part of Ukraine. But international politics is a brutal business. Vladimir Putin is, you know, someone who reveals that every day he gets out of bed in the morning. And so we have to maximize what sort of the art of the possible, if you will, you know, what can we produce? And I think, look to, you know, reveal, you know, I thought that this was going to go way worse, way quicker for Ukraine. So they have been heroic. Right. They have defended their territory. Right. I think. And, you know, to talk about the realities that Vladimir Putin has to grapple with, he's not going to take all of Ukraine. He's not going to take most of Ukraine. Ukraine is going to come out of this as a sovereign, autonomous country. And, you know, so there's all these things that need to be haggled over. You know, Putin wants to put, I think, unreasonable limits on Ukraine's armed forces. It's not going to join NATO. So we're revealing truths through the course of this thing. And one hopes, you know, I hope I'm wrong. I hope that, you know, there's more progress made today than I suspect and we get closer to a settlement of this conflict that leaves a Ukraine that is a sovereign functioning country on Russia's border.
Joe Getty
We're talking to Justin Logan, Director of Defense and Foreign Policy Studies at the Cato Institute. Justin, if you were to advise Donald J. Or any other leader about negotiating with Putin, especially sitting down with Putin to negotiate, what would you tell him about Putin and his methods?
Unknown
Well, you know, if you read the newspaper, I mean, it's all sort of there in black and white, Right. It doesn't need any sort of Putin whisperer to say, this is a brutal guy who really means business and really cares deeply about Ukraine's international orientation. Certainly, he's revealed that he's willing to pay extremely high costs to influence the sort of future orientation of Ukraine. And, you know, one again, sort of brutal reality is you. We were all worried about escalation. We were all worried about the potential of nuclear escalation or escalation outside Ukraine's borders. And part of the reason that that hasn't come to the fore is the fact that Putin has been gradually, slowly, brutally winning the conflict. And so we need to internalize. He has revealed in the breach that he's willing to pay enormous costs to influence the settlement of this conflict. And we have revealed under President Joe Biden and under President Trump that we're not willing to go to the mattresses and fight r Russia in Ukraine over Ukraine. So that's got to be the sort of starting point of understanding what we should do. And, you know, to be honest, we've used a lot of economic leverage, a lot of sanctions, and it hasn't worked, if you define work as, you know, cause to change his mind and leave Ukraine. So, again, I hate to be the sort of dark cloud here, but it's, you know, playing the type, I guess we need to realize that we have limited leverage to produce maximally good outcome for Ukraine from this thing. So we're very much in the realm of third best, fourth best, or as I might put it, least worst outcomes.
Justin Logan
Well, first of all, if you're dealing with Putin, you don't stand next to any open windows. Secondly, I love dealing in reality. I mean, there's no advantage to ever not dealing in reality. So if the reality, Putin is going to end up being rewarded for having invaded a smaller country and getting to keep the land because the rest of the world's not willing to, you know, put up the fight to stop him. What, how do you deal with Taiwan and China? What's. How do you make that not send the message to China that here, now it's your turn?
Unknown
Yeah. I mean, you don't want to be a small country bordering a larger, more powerful country if you can avoid it. And unfortunately, neither Ukraine nor Taiwan can avoid that. So the question then becomes, what do you do optimally to make yourself look like. And this is a Taiwan metaphor that think tank Turks use all the time. Like a porcupine. Right. Porcupines don't get attacked because they're bristling with quills that are likely to get their hooks into you. And it hurts. It's not a pleasant experience. And so Taiwan, I think there are more things that Taiwan needs to do better for itself than there are things that the US Military needs to do on behalf of Taiwan, which is to say, if the balloon goes up, God forbid, in Taiwan, it will take the US Military in optimal scenarios, four, five, six days to really meaningfully get into the fight. And Taiwan has been so negligent with its own defense spending, about 2% of GDP on defense, not spending it well, that it may all be over but the crime by the time we were to get there. So I think that from a Taiwan point of view, Taiwan needs to engage in asymmetric defense. It needs to do. There's another hokey metaphor that we think tank Dorks use a small number of things at great scale. So it needs to prevent China from getting a lodgment that it could flow troops onto. And without getting too boringly into the weeds here, it hasn't been doing a great job of that. So I would love to see Taiwan focus its military less on big ticket items that China is likely to be able to pick off early in a conflict and do things that really, again, turn it into a porcupine that China can't swallow.
Joe Getty
Be a better porcupine. So a final question for Justin Logan. Justin, back to the Russia, Ukraine, US Thing. What are the chances that Putin comes to the table with a grand bargain in capitals that Ukraine is merely a part of to tempt Donald J. Trump into some sort of historical Arctic minerals arms control package?
Unknown
That's a good question. I hate to make predictions. It seems unlikely to me. Putin was sort of signaling yesterday that he might be willing to talk about arms control, which is a sort of weird non response to what the summit is supposed to be about. So I think it's possible that he brings things to the table that don't pertain to Ukraine because as we sort of established earlier in the call, he's kind of sort of okay with the status quo in Ukraine. And I think it's a real question of whether Trump and the people Trump brings with him are willing to bide on that or whether they bring things back around to finding some sort of diplomatic resolution to the war in Ukraine.
Joe Getty
Justin Logan of the Cato Institute. Fabulous conversation. Justin, we thank you. It's been far too long since we've talked. We will verbally abuse our staff for letting that happen. Thank you so much for the time.
Unknown
It's a great pleasure. Have a good weekend, Gus.
Joe Getty
Thank you. You too, man.
Justin Logan
That was a snap. Back to reality. It's so easy, speaking for myself, to let your wishes be your. The father of your thoughts with things.
Joe Getty
Right. Yeah.
Justin Logan
Trump has that land. Is anybody willing to push him off of it? No. Show of hands? No. Okay, well, then let's just concede that he gets that land. It's gonna happen, right?
Joe Getty
Yeah. Yeah, it's. I don't know when it was. It might have been about a decade ago that it occurred to me the term disillusioned ought to be a positive, not a negative. What good are your illusions doing you, especially in important stuff? I mean, if your illusion is that you're handsome and chicks dig ya, that's fine. Okay, me too. Right. Anyway, so a quick word from our friends at Simply Safe Home Security the illusion of safety get real Safety with a state of the art simply safe home security system with the active guard outdoor protection. It helps stop break ins before they happen.
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Justin Logan
We gotta go more on the way. Stay here Armstrong and Getty the reviews.
Ice Cube
And ratings are in and Ice Cube's Big three is the surprise hit of the summer. And to cap off the season, iHeart presents the Big Three basketball playoffs this Sunday at 3pm Eastern. The remaining four teams battle it out for the right to make the Big three championship in the most physical, fierce and competitive basketball league in the world. The action starts with the Big three Monster Energy celebrity game where your favorite stars compete in big three three on three basketball. Then the first of two semifinal games features Dwight Howard and the LA Riot taking on Montrez Harrell and Dr. J's first place Chicago triplets. The finale will see popular Miami 305 with stars MVP Michael Beasley and Lance will make you Dan Stevenson take on Nancy Lieberman's Dallas power who finished the season winning five straight weeks to capture second place. Can Glenn Rice, Greg Monroe and Paul Millsap stop Miami's physical assault? Or will Miami and Beasley put an end to Dallas winning ways? Who will make it to the Big Three championship? This no holds barred action starts Sunday at 3pm Eastern, 12 Pacific only on CBS.
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Christina Quinn
If you eat too many ultra processed foods, you could be starving your gut microbes and they'll get hangry. That's one of many things I learned after working on a new audio course about the gut microbiome. You can learn how to keep your gut happy by listening to Try this from the Washington Post I'm Christina Quinn. I host Try this Dig in with me on practical advice for life's common challenges. Follow Try this right now, wherever you're listening. Seriously, try it.
Joe Getty
Ugh.
Justin Logan
Come on.
Christina Quinn
Why is this taking so long? This thing is ancient.
Jack Armstrong
Still using yesterday's tech upgrade to the ThinkPad X1 carbon ultralight. Ultra powerful and built for serious productivity with Intel Core Ultra processors, blazing speed and AI powered performance that keeps up with your business, not the other way around.
Justin Logan
Whoa.
Christina Quinn
This thing moves.
Jack Armstrong
Stop hitting snooze on new tech. Win the tech search@lenovo.com Lenovo Lenovo unlock AI experiences with the ThinkPad X1 carbon powered by Intel Core Ultra processors so you can work, create and boost productivity all on one device.
Unknown
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Joe Getty
United Airlines has announced a new partnership with Apple TV plus for In Flight Entertainment. While Spirit is continuing its partnership with cup and Ball, Spirit Airlines is warning that it may soon cease operations within the next year, customers can expect no change in service.
Justin Logan
Cup and ball. That's funny.
Joe Getty
Wow. I have amused myself for seconds at a time. Cup and ball. At one point, I convinced my kids that I competed in the Olympics in the cup and ball competition. I got like three in a row and they're like, oh, my God, Dad. I said, listen, I don't like to brag, but good times, lying to my children. Speaking of children, I will, I will mention this very briefly. There is an alarming new study that we probably ought to go into deeply. Smartphones are ruining our brains at unprecedented speed, especially young people in, you know, the levels of conscientiousness, neuroticism, agreeableness, extroversion, et cetera. The numbers are unbelievable.
Justin Logan
Is it possible I've said this before, is it possible that walking around, staring at your phone becomes like, smoking is now? I mean, back when my dad was smoking, way back in the day, everybody did it. It was recommended by doctors, it calmed you down, it helped you lose weight. It was all kinds of buzz. And everybody did it. And now it's just. You see somebody smoking, you think, what are you doing?
Joe Getty
Do you think it could go that far?
Justin Logan
Or we just. Just too much.
Joe Getty
It's too appealing. It's too universally appealing.
Justin Logan
Cigarettes didn't have enough upside. There's too much upside. Well, upside, using my finger quotes.
Joe Getty
Yeah. So anyway, everybody's staring at their phones and miserable in a hundred different measures, or at least half a dozen. Uh, and in a related story, this is crazy. Adults are going to sleep away camp to make friends. And it actually seems to work overnight camps for single adults. It's not a dating thing, it's generally separated by sex. But where you go to like a summer camp for adults and make friends and you do, you know, tug of war, climbing, ropes courses, hiking, you know, canoeing, blah, blah, blah. And this is, this focuses almost entirely on women, this article. But this gal says when you're 20s, in your 20s and 30s, you don't make a ton of friends unless you're doing something that bonds you. And, and they found the camps have been great. They, they really hit it off with people. They stay in touch and become long term friends.
Justin Logan
I feel like this has got a real extrovert bias to it, that it would really work for extroverts and they would love it. And good for you. And good for you. That's fantastic.
Unknown
You're.
Justin Logan
I don't know what percentage of people are extroverts, but that'd be great. I just, Man, I heard that and I my immediate reaction was that sounds freaking awful.
Joe Getty
Oh, we need to start an introverts camp. I don't expect attendance to be great, at least not at first.
Justin Logan
We're all going to read alone in our tents, right?
Joe Getty
Exactly. And look, you want to wander out and talk about what you're reading? Totally. Volunteer. Totally. We're going to have a kayak thing tomorrow. Single kayaks. All right. Let me assure you, single it'll be cool. All right? We'll gently coax you into it.
Justin Logan
Everybody's got a different time to eat, so you can eat alone if you want.
Joe Getty
Right?
Unknown
Armstrong and Getty the reviews and ratings.
Ice Cube
Are in and Ice Cube's Big Three is the surprise hit of the summer. And to cap off the season, iHeart presents the Big Three basketball playoffs this Sunday at 3pm Eastern. The remaining four teams battle it out for the right to make the Big Three championship in the most physical, fierce and competitive basketball league in the world. The action starts with the Big 3 Monster Energy Celebrity Game where your favorite stars compete in Big 33 on 3 basketball. Then the first of two semifinal games features Dwight Howard and the LA Riot taking on Montrez Harrell and Dr. J's first place Chicago Triplets. The finale will see popular Miami 305 with stars MVP Michael Beasley and Lass will make you die. Dan Stevenson take on Nancy Lieberman's Dallas power who finished the season winning five straight weeks to capture second place. Can Glen Rice, Greg Monroe and Paul Millsap stop Miami's physical assault? Or will Miami and Beasley put an end to Dallas winning ways? Who will make it to the Big Three championship? This no holds barred action starts Sunday at 3pm Eastern, 12 Pacific only on CBS.
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Christina Quinn
If you eat too many ultra processed foods, you could be starving your gut microbes and they'll get hangry. That's one of many things I learned after working on a new audio course about the gut microbiome. You can learn how to keep your gut happy by listening to Try this from the Washington Post. I'm Christina Quinn. I host Try this. Dig in with me on practical advice for life's common challenges. Follow Try this right now, wherever you're listening. Seriously, try it.
Joe Getty
Ah, come on.
Christina Quinn
Why is this taking so long? This thing is ancient.
Jack Armstrong
Still using yesterday's tech Upgrade to the ThinkPad X1 Carbon Ultra Light, Ultra powerful and built for serious productivity with Intel Core Ultra processors, blazing speed and AI powered performance that keeps up with your business, not the other way around.
Christina Quinn
Whoa, this thing moves.
Jack Armstrong
Stop hitting snooze on new tech. Win the tech search@lenovo.com Unlock AI experiences with the ThinkPad X1 Carbon powered by Intel Core Ultra processors so you can work, create and boost productivity all on one device.
Unknown
Life moves fast. A new home, a new baby, a new chapter. But without an estate plan, your future's still vulnerable. With trust and will, you can name guardians, start a trust, create healthcare directives, and more. All online in about an hour. It's attorney designed, state specific and built to protect what you love. Plans start at just $199 and every plan is safe, secure and kept completely private. From families with young kids to adults caring for aging parents. Trust and will makes it simple to take control without a law office, paperwork, stress or court delays. Go to trustandwill.com and use code RADIO to save 20%. Start your plan today. Don't wait for life to force your hand. Estate planning is one of the smartest, most loving things you can do. Trust and Will is an online estate planning service. See website for details.
Justin Logan
So I didn't mention this Greg Gutfeld was on. Well first of all, Greg Gutfeld is a. What was he originally? Is did he come from a comedy background or a journalism background? Is he a comedian?
Joe Getty
I think comedy.
Justin Logan
Is he a comedian? Does anybody know he started as a stand up or something? Anyway, he's been on Fox for a long time commenting on stuff and then they gave him his own show when he runs it like late night talk shows. If you've never seen it and it's on Fox and it and it for quite a while now has Been getting bigger ratings than the Tonight show or Kimmel or Colbert. And Jimmy Fallon wisely had Gutfeld on the other night and had the highest ratings he had, I think I heard in five years, because. Not surprising. Well, because Gutfeld promoted it on his show. So all the Fox people watch. Oh, I want to see how he does, you know, on the mainstream shows. And he did well. He was funny. But so huge ratings.
Joe Getty
It's. It's funny. And I'm not quibbling with your, your verbiage because how to use the same words, but it's funny that the most popular show is not the quote unquote, mainstream show. He literally has the main part of the stream.
Justin Logan
Good point. Anyway, my parents watch it every night and they love it. I, I don't watch any of them, so we just play the clips in the morning. But anyway, here's a joke from last night.
Joe Getty
The UFC will host the first ever White house fight on July 4th. Yeah. It's the first violent beatdown to take place at the White House. Hillary discovered the blue dress. Meanwhile, the Democrats also want to participate. And so far they've already suggested these. Jasmine Crockett versus a book. Jerry Nadler versus soap. Rashida Tlaib versus a razor.
Justin Logan
Oh, my God.
Joe Getty
And J.B. pritzker versus a narrow hallway. Yes. All right. Are they branding Rashida Tlaib as Harry?
Justin Logan
I'm not comfortable with that one. But that was not me laughing. It was someone else in here.
Joe Getty
Yes, Katie, I'm comfortable with it. She has a mustache. Oh, a mustache. I see.
Justin Logan
Or as they say in some of my favorite old timey literature, mustaches.
Joe Getty
Right. Now we understand she's also an American hating, America hating Marxist.
Justin Logan
She has a mustache.
Joe Getty
Yes, thank you.
Justin Logan
Perfect, Perfect background for the joke. But those are some biting jokes there.
Joe Getty
Yeah.
Justin Logan
We all know the biggest story probably in the world today is Putin and Trump meeting together. It could, could be a history making meeting. I think there's a decent chance nothing comes out of it. For now. Anyway. First of all, this cnn and I wasn't listening to it, I was just watching it. Just did a retrospective of various US Leaders meeting with Putin over the years. And God, I forgot what he looked like when he was younger. He's always had that pimp walk, man. Like I am the biggest, biggest freaking deal in this room. And that smirk on his face, like, I could kill you. I could have sex with you. I could do both of those with you. I mean, that's just, it's just his personality. And sitting with every President Bush Clinton, Obama, Biden and all of them. He does that. Whole legs spread open, leaning back in his chair. What do you got? I'm kind of paying attention, but I don't really have to. I mean, he's got, his personality is just. I mean, he puts it on so over the top display. You can almost smell his cologne through the video.
Joe Getty
Yeah. Wow. Not an accident.
Justin Logan
And the embarrassing, among the most embarrassing because George W. Bush saying, I looked and he was, I saw his soul. He's a good person. I mean, that is embarrassing. Yes, but Hillary Clinton showing up there with the reset. Reset button. Oh, my God. What is it with all these. The Barack Obama administration, we're, we're different people. We can handle the world differently. People react differently to us.
Joe Getty
Give them the Nobel Prize.
Justin Logan
I mean, it's just, it's, it's. I, if I was Hill, Hillary Clinton, I'd be asking cnn, is there any way you could not show that ever again? It's embarrassing.
Joe Getty
All right, never mind that the reset button was the wrong word. I can't remember what it said, but.
Justin Logan
Right.
Joe Getty
Didn't even say reset.
Justin Logan
Like said vacuum cleaner in Russian or something.
Joe Getty
Yes, the equivalent. Yeah.
Justin Logan
But this from the Washington Post today. And they've got the picture, which I'll describe later, with the young Putin meeting with Angela Merkel, who was leader of Germany at the time. And Putin's got the legs spread open, leaning back, aren't I cool thing going. German Chancellor Angela Merkel experienced the darker side of Putin's tactics in 2007 when she met him in Sochi for a big one on one meeting. That's the Black Sea resort city. And he brought his giant black Labrador retriever to the meeting. Merkel later said in her memoirs that she believed it was a deliberate tactic to intimidate her because he knew she was so afraid of dogs. And they've got the picture here. And he's got this enormous black lab just walking around. They're sitting by the fireplace while she's sitting there looking frightened.
Joe Getty
Wow.
Justin Logan
How about that? Wow. And she didn't have the courage, leverage whatever she thought to say, hey, I don't really like dogs, let's get this out of here before we talk.
Joe Getty
That's some mobster shiznizzle.
Justin Logan
Yes, it is. I mean, yeah, that's like sending you a fish in the mail.
Joe Getty
I mean, that's right. It's as close to a threat as you can get without issuing a threat.
Justin Logan
But they go on to write in the Washington Post the fact the summit is taking place is a potential sign of Putin's own vulnerabilities. The only good news is that Putin does does feel like he needs to respond in some way to the US President to avoid worse things happening in terms of a return to full military assistance or partial assistance or potential sanctions. Another sign of Putin's potential weakness are the Kremlin's hurried preparations for the Alaska summit. Putin usually prepares himself immaculately. He reads a lot, gathers recommendations from experts. This time, the window's extremely short and they do not have a plan. A Kremlin insider told the Washington Post. Right now, there is a huge, frantic effort going on inside the Kremlin. So at least that opinion piece in the Washington Post, they're reading the fact that he's meeting it all and in such a short time frame as a sign of. He needs this.
Joe Getty
Yeah, how interesting. And from Putin's perspective, he's thinking.
Justin Logan
No.
Joe Getty
We don't have a plan. We don't know what to expect. But I want to go there personally. I will engage in the judo and see what comes out of it. It. We'll develop our plan from there. It's gotta be kind of exciting for the Pooter. I mean, it's like he's back in his KGB days. He's the agent. He's not the bureaucrat. He's the agent. Again, I don't know. As I said yesterday, and I have not changed my mind about this. If you gave me five different scenarios for how this plays out, or the five or so I've imagined, I would put them at 20% each. Just don't know.
Justin Logan
It's got to be something to sit down with somebody who has ordered the murders of his own people. Like, I'm thinking of the way he bombed that Chechen apartment building to make it look like a terrorist act by so he could invade Chechnya. He killed his own people, and he's done that lots of times. It's just gotta be something to sit there with somebody like that.
Joe Getty
Well, if someone is close, just cronies end up plunging out of windows if it's time for house cleaning.
Justin Logan
But most of us, when we're dealing with somebody we believe they've got, even if you don't trust them, you believe they've got some sort of moral limit as opposed to sitting down with somebody who has zero moral limits. Zero.
Joe Getty
Right, right.
Justin Logan
God, that hold, that picture of him with the dog and Angela Merkel is like the way he's. It looks exactly like. If you were going to. To portray that in the Sopranos, the way he's sitting there.
Unknown
Huh?
Justin Logan
How about this? What do you think of this?
Joe Getty
Yeah, well. And as we've said, I, I hope Trump is ready to deal with somebody who's a master manipulator. Utterly immoral. I just. Why does Trump keep saying I think he wants peace?
Justin Logan
I don't know.
Joe Getty
I mean, he doesn't. He, he only wants peace if it's piece. Because he's accomplished his goals. I mean, it's mildly inconvenient to his, you know, the fiscal health of his government. And, and Russia does not have a limitless time horizon to accomplish what they want to accomplish. They do have problems, but it's counting on him to just want peace because, oh, my God, there's been enough killing. That's, that's ridiculous.
Justin Logan
So we got a breaking clip here. So Trump is on the plane flying from Washington, D.C. to Anchorage. It's 3,400 miles, and he just came out and said something to reporters on Air Force One. Here it is.
Unknown
Thank you for coming back to take questions.
Christina Quinn
We saw that Russia continued its violence.
Unknown
Into Ukraine last night, launching even more drones.
Christina Quinn
What did you make of that?
Justin Logan
I think they're trying to negotiate. He's trying to set a stage. I mean, in his mind, that helps him make a better deal. It actually hurts him. But in his mind, that helps him make a better deal if they can continue the killing. Maybe it's a part of the world. Maybe it's just his fabric, his genes, his genetics, but he thinks that makes him, gives him strength in negotiating. I think it hurts him, but I'll be talking to him about it for discussion.
Joe Getty
This is so interesting.
Justin Logan
Has Trump finally reached the I understand who this guy is point? And like, you know, and even if that's true, it's like, how did it take you so long? But, I mean, Trump is, despite what they say on MSNBC and various places, he's no dummy. He's not, he's not a punk. I mean, he's a smart, ruthless businessman, and he's certainly, surely he can handle that sort of situation.
Unknown
Yeah.
Joe Getty
My only quibble with that is that I think any of us who've known a lot of different people, achievers and, and go getters and wheelers and dealers, is. There are some people who are very, very capable in certain areas, but they have blind spots. And, and there are times that I think Trump has blind spots.
Justin Logan
Yeah. But unknowingly, you think he has a blind spot with negotiations. He's been doing it his whole life.
Joe Getty
With megalomaniac Russian would be czars. Yes. Yeah.
Justin Logan
God, he's probably had to deal with lots of megalomaniacs building casinos. Yeah.
Joe Getty
But they're motivated by completely different things. They're all, and I think Trump has an oversimplified view of leverage.
Justin Logan
I, I, it's funny, I was thinking that yesterday. I've thought this for a long time. A lot of business people I know are like this. There's only one thing that matters. Profit or making more money. That's the only thing they can think about. And feelings or morality or all kinds of things go out the window. It's just what's going to make me the most money. And he can't imagine anything or nationalism or philosophy or he can't imagine anything mattering more than making more money. And like, wanting to institute Peter the Great's landmass. Doesn't make sense.
Joe Getty
Exactly. Or even just rational goals from Trump's point of view. Re establishing the Soviet empire. Why the hell would you want that? A lot of it is crappy.
Justin Logan
Yeah.
Joe Getty
You know, you're already too far flung. Your treasury is bare. Why don't you just concentrate and make good deals and make more money? You're, you're over expanding. That's dumb. He just doesn't understand irrational motivations. Getting back to the clip about Putin continuing the attacks and stuff like that. I did. Again, I don't know. Sometimes Trump postures just a posture, and he knows what he's doing. But yes, Putin thinks that continuing the attacks makes him gives him a stronger position in negotiating. Because you've made it clear over and over again you want peace, you want the killing to stop. Now, if he were to say, yeah, me too, how much would you have to give him to get the killing to stop?
Justin Logan
Very little.
Joe Getty
Because you've both expressed the desire to end the killing. You've come to the table saying, I want the killing to stop. And he's come to the table saying, you know what? I just killed more people today. And if you'll excuse me. Yeah, right now I just killed 500 more people. People you're going to have to give up a hell of a lot more at the table. I think he's so again, I don't. Trump surely understands it.
Justin Logan
I think he's going to have to say to Putin's face at some point, that's bull s, you're full of crap. Because Putin's going to say something like, these are military targets, they attacked us first. You know, all that sort of stuff. And Trump's Come on.
Joe Getty
Where's our Trump? Where's our bleeped Trump clip? Michael what's Trump going to say to put two syllables?
Justin Logan
I wasn't kidding when I said this yesterday. I want him to treat Putin like he treated Rand Paul or Chris Christie or any of those people. You know, Carly Fiorina, treat him like that.
Joe Getty
You got you. You had the perfect coaching. Every time you look at Putin, picture Rosie O' Donnell's head on his neck. Mr. President, that'll get you in the right fighting spirit.
Justin Logan
The exact There it is. He needs to say that to Putin's face. What are your thoughts on it? Here's the text line. 415295KFTC Armstrong and Getty the reviews and.
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If you eat too many ultra processed foods, you could be starving your gut microbes and they'll get hangry. That's one of many things I learned after working on a new audio course about the gut microbiome. You can learn how to keep your gut happy by listening to Try this from the Washington Post. I'm Christina Quinn. I host Try this. Dig in with me on practical advice for life's common challenges. Follow Try this right now, wherever you're listening. Seriously, try it.
Joe Getty
Ah, come on.
Christina Quinn
Why is this taking so long? This thing is ancient.
Jack Armstrong
Still using yesterday's tech upgrade to the ThinkPad X1 carbon ultralight. Ultra powerful and built for serious productivity with Intel Core Ultra processors, blazing speed and AI powered performance that keeps up with your business, not the other way around.
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Justin Logan
Last weekend before school starts for my kids, they're in a panic.
Joe Getty
They're in a panic. Oh boy, oh boy. Take a deep breath. Like jumping in a cold pool. You'll get used to it pretty soon, but I remember that feeling. So I was tempted to end the hour with a discussion of Russia's finances. Read a really good detailed analysis. They are in financial trouble.
Justin Logan
I hope.
Joe Getty
This war is enormously expensive and it can't last forever. But you know, we've talked about that a fair amount and it'll still be true on Monday, so maybe we'll get to it again then. So a couple of stories to bring to you very quickly. I found this very funny. Andrew Stiles of the Free Beacon the emerging democratic consensus for 2026 curse more, obey less, protect criminals and illegal immigrants at all costs. And evidently, yes, swearing is a big part of the strategy. Do we actually, do we have that Beto o' Rourke clip that we had the other day?
Justin Logan
Yeah, we do, don't we? Or we had it yesterday?
Joe Getty
Yeah, no, I think we did today. Again, I'm sorry. We should have got 11 play 11 it.
Justin Logan
We are in a basketball game right.
Ice Cube
Now, if you'll excuse the metaphor, where.
Justin Logan
The refs have left the arena and.
Joe Getty
The other side is just clobbering out.
Justin Logan
Of us, punching us in the face, kicking us in the nuts.
Joe Getty
And he mentioned that the Dems need to fight harder in defense of the illegal immigrant community. That quote makes this country so GD great.
Justin Logan
It's, it's interesting. I wonder whose decision that was that we need to curse more to show that we're fighting.
Joe Getty
Representative Jasmine Crockett, the potty mouthed diva who's a rising star thanks to Republic transom tantrums and phony accent, being a boarding school grad, but sounds ghetto when it's convenient. She's argued that illegal immigrant is not a crime, called Donald Trump a piece of ass, etc.
Justin Logan
Good luck with that.
Joe Getty
The Hill urged Democratic leaders to follow her lead. Crockett is the base. She is the movement.
Justin Logan
No, she's not.
Joe Getty
Whether you like her delivery or not, she's speaking a language people understand. And that's what exactly what this party needs.
Justin Logan
If, if she is the base of the Democratic Party, they ain't going to win any national elections for a long time.
Joe Getty
All right, how about this strategy instead? The Loudoun County, Virginia. It's a D.C. suburb. Loudoun County, Fairfax county woke America. They voted Tuesday to keep their transgender policies even after the Education Department warned the District that four and four others they could face legal punishment, lose federal funding for violating Title 9, the federal law that bans sex discrimination. Boys can keep going into the girls locker rooms and watch them change. Boys can keep whipping up on girls on the sports fields as long as they say I'm a girl. Today in Loudoun County, I wish you well. See you in court. I'm actually glad they're doing this. Why not? Let's have it out.
Justin Logan
Yep.
Joe Getty
And final story. Complete change of topic. This is about AI in entertainment, specifically animation. There are systems already being used by the studios that are improving like week by week that will reduce the time taken to render a sophisticated animation picture. Toy Story to animate a scene will go from weeks to minutes.
Justin Logan
Wow.
Joe Getty
Two seconds. We can provide tools for animators to animate a character in 10 seconds instead of a week. There's no turning back, says the founder.
Justin Logan
Well, it's interesting. I have things to say, but we're out of time. We're out of time for the week. For a lot of you. We do four hours every day. If you miss a segment an hour, get the Podcast Armstrong and Getty on Demand subscribe.
Unknown
Armstrong and Getty.
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If you eat too many ultra processed foods, you could be starving your gut microbes and they'll get hangry. That's one of many things I learned after working on a new audio course about the gut microbiome. You can learn how to keep your gut happy by listening to Try this from the Washington Post. I'm Christina Quinn. I host Try this. Dig in with Me on practical advice for life's common challenges. Follow Try this right now, wherever you're listening. Seriously, try it.
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Ah, come on.
Christina Quinn
Why is this taking so long? This thing is ancient.
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Podcast Summary: Armstrong & Getty On Demand – "The Cup & Ball Competition!"
Release Date: August 15, 2025
Host: Jack Armstrong & Joe Getty
Produced by: iHeartPodcasts
The episode titled "The Cup & Ball Competition!" delves deep into the pressing geopolitical tensions between the United States, Russia, and Ukraine, particularly focusing on the anticipated summit between former President Donald J. Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin. Hosted by Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty, the discussion is enriched by insights from Justin Logan, Director of Defense and Foreign Policy Studies at the Cato Institute.
Joe Getty opens the conversation by addressing the complexities surrounding the upcoming Trump-Putin summit. He articulates the skepticism surrounding potential territorial swaps, emphasizing Ukraine's staunch rejection of such proposals.
Joe Getty [03:07]: "That's a tough political ask, an impossible military ask, you might argue. And that really leaves people so anxious here that if the bedrock of these talks potentially is territorial swaps, and that is impractical and unsellable here, what possibly could Trump emerge from that meeting with."
Justin Logan adds to this by highlighting Ukraine's unwavering stance against compromising its territorial integrity, which, coupled with Russia's military strength, makes diplomatic resolutions challenging.
Justin Logan [04:27]: "Ukraine is horrified with the status quo. Putin's okay with the status quo. He'd be fine with continuing prosecuting the war the way he is."
The hosts and Logan discuss the broader implications of Russia's military dominance and Ukraine's constitutional commitments, making meaningful compromises virtually unattainable.
The conversation shifts to Europe's position in the conflict and its ability to assert itself as a stabilizing force. Justin Logan criticizes Europe's military expenditure and strategic preparedness, questioning its effectiveness in diminishing the reliance on American military support.
Justin Logan [06:42]: "Europe needs to sort of back its diplomacy with force. The ultimate ratio in international relations is military power."
Joe Getty underscores the necessity for Europe to enhance its military capabilities to gain a more substantial voice in international affairs.
Joe Getty [06:25]: "If Europe wants more, say it needs more power. And that is an enduring problem for both, particularly for the Europeans, but also, in my view, for the Americans."
A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the negotiation strategies with Putin. Justin Logan offers a critical analysis of Putin's relentless pursuit of territorial gains and his capacity for brutality, which complicates diplomatic engagements.
Justin Logan [10:15]: "If you read the newspaper, it's all sort of there in black and white, right. It doesn't need any sort of Putin whisperer to say, this is a brutal guy who really means business."
Logan emphasizes the limited leverage the U.S. possesses in swaying Putin's decisions, citing the ineffectiveness of economic sanctions and military aid in altering Russia's stance.
Justin Logan [10:15]: "We've used a lot of economic leverage, a lot of sanctions, and it hasn't worked, if you define work as, you know, cause to change his mind and leave Ukraine."
Drawing parallels to the Taiwan-China dynamic, Justin Logan discusses the vulnerabilities of smaller nations bordering larger, aggressive neighbors. He advocates for Taiwan to adopt asymmetric defense strategies to deter potential invasions by China.
Justin Logan [12:33]: "Taiwan needs to engage in asymmetric defense. It needs to do things that turn it into a porcupine that China can't swallow."
Logan criticizes Taiwan's current defense spending and strategies, suggesting that without significant improvements, Taiwan's security remains precarious.
The hosts and Logan explore various scenarios that could unfold from the impending summit. Justin Logan remains cautiously pessimistic, predicting that the summit may not yield substantial progress towards resolving the Ukraine conflict.
Justin Logan [14:40]: "That's a good question. I hate to make predictions. It seems unlikely to me."
He also touches upon the possibility of Putin introducing unrelated agenda items, such as Arctic mineral arms control, to divert attention from Ukraine during negotiations.
The dialogue progresses to assess Trump's negotiation acumen, especially in dealing with a counterpart as formidable as Putin. Joe Getty expresses concern over Trump's perceived oversights and potential blind spots in handling such a complex and morally charged negotiation.
Joe Getty [40:34]: "There are times that I think Trump has blind spots."
Conversely, Justin Logan remains optimistic about Trump's capabilities, citing his business acumen and ruthless negotiation tactics.
Justin Logan [40:39]: "He's a smart, ruthless businessman, and he's certainly, surely he can handle that sort of situation."
The hosts debate whether Trump's approach will effectively counter Putin's manipulative and aggressive strategies, with Logan advocating for a firm and realistic stance against Russian aggressions.
In the latter segments, the hosts briefly touch upon various topics, including the impact of smartphones on mental health, the rise of adult sleepaway camps for friendship-building, and the advancements in AI-driven animation technology. However, these segments are interspersed with advertisements and light-hearted banter, shifting away from the primary geopolitical focus.
The episode concludes with reflections on the Trump-Putin summit’s potential fallout, emphasizing the high stakes involved and the unpredictable nature of international diplomacy.
"The Cup & Ball Competition!" provides a thorough and insightful examination of the intricate and volatile dynamics of international relations involving the U.S., Russia, and Ukraine. Through the expertise of Joe Getty and the strategic perspectives of Justin Logan, listeners gain a comprehensive understanding of the challenges and potential outcomes of high-stakes diplomatic engagements. The episode underscores the complexity of negotiating with aggressive state actors and the imperative for realistic and robust strategies to ensure global stability.
For more in-depth analysis and engaging discussions, subscribe to Armstrong & Getty On Demand wherever you listen to podcasts.