You Can Indict A Ham Sandwich... For Deliciousness.

Summary

Armstrong & Getty On Demand

Episode: You Can Indict A Ham Sandwich... For Deliciousness.

Date: April 22, 2026
Hosts: Jack Armstrong & Joe Getty

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on two main themes:

• The Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) Indictment: Armstrong & Getty dive deep into the recent Department of Justice indictment against the SPLC, accusing the organization of financial fraud and propping up hate groups as part of its fundraising machine. The hosts, long critical of both the SPLC and its media coverage, scrutinize the details, media complicity, and broader implications.
• Global Political & Social Trends: The second half explores international politics—especially tensions with Iran and the U.S. military presence in the Middle East—and global demographic shifts, focusing on the unprecedented worldwide decline in birth rates.

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Detailed Breakdown & Key Discussion Points

1. SPLC Indictment: “A Beacon of Grift”

(Start: 02:47)

Media and Public Perception of SPLC

• Jack expresses long-standing frustration that media outlets uncritically relay SPLC’s reports and statistics, treating them as gospel without scrutiny.
  • Jack Armstrong (02:47):
    “Tucker Carlson back before he went crazy used to point out, this is Southern Poverty Law Center. They're not Southern. They don't deal with poverty. There's no law involved. There's not even really a center.”
• Joe critiques SPLC’s evolution:
  • Joe Getty (03:31):
    "The SPLC, born in the days of the civil rights movement, has like all causes, turned into a business and ended up as a grift, as they all do."

Outline of DOJ Charges

• DOJ has indicted SPLC for alleged fraud, including using donated funds not to eliminate hate groups but to pay informants—often the same hate group leaders they claimed to oppose.
  • Ryan Riley, NBC News (05:09):
    "They used the fraudulently raised money by lying to their donor network... to actually pay the leadership of these supposed violent extremist groups."
• Joe clarifies the indictment: SPLC allegedly kept hate groups afloat to justify its own fundraising.
  • Joe Getty (06:15):
    "You're the ones keeping them afloat. You have every interest in financing these so called hate groups..."

Debate and Moral Ambiguity

• Jack and Joe question the necessity and ethics of such arrangements. Is there a line between having informants and bankrolling hate groups to increase their perceived threat?
  • Jack Armstrong (07:08):
    “If he's doing bad stuff, I can't stomach giving him money.”
  • Joe Getty (08:35):
    "These people are employees of the SPLC. It's not like somebody who says, you know, I've come to realize this is disgusting. And here's what's happening inside..."

Key Quote/Title Origin

• Joe Getty (08:56):
  “...as they say, you can indict a ham sandwich for deliciousness.”
• Jack Armstrong (09:02):
  “I excuse ham sandwich of being yummy. I got nine yes votes.”

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2. Press Conference Drama & Media Skepticism

(09:14 – 14:50)

The Patel Subplot

• A press conference on the SPLC indictment devolves into mutual accusations between DOJ officials and NBC’s Ryan Riley regarding unrelated allegations of personal misconduct and access issues.
  • Ryan Riley (09:34):
    "I can say unequivocally that I never listen to the fake news mafia..."
  • Heated exchanges about supposed “battering rams” used to wake up an allegedly intoxicated FBI official (Kash Patel).
• Armstrong & Getty mock the spectacle:
  • Joe Getty (13:13):
    “Sometimes you need a battering ram to wake him up.”
  • Jack Armstrong (14:13):
    “I don't have the slightest idea where the cash Patel is a good guy or a bad guy...”

Wider Reflection: The Era of the “Too Online” Class

• Jack observes that “being too online” is rapidly becoming synonymous with reality itself, not just a subculture.
  • Jack Armstrong (15:10):
    “Soon online will be the real world and kind of a reflection back and forth of it…”

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3. SPLC Indictment: More Stunning Allegations

(19:53 – 22:36)

SPLC Allegedly Helped Organize Hate Events

• Jack recounts reporting that SPLC paid an individual $250,000 to help organize the infamous Charlottesville rally, including logistics and recruitment.
  • Jack Armstrong (20:31):
    "...they had paid one dude $250,000 to be involved in organizing that thing. Picking up people and driving them to the rally to make sure there was a good crowd..."
• SPLC is also accused of designing websites and even paying a neo-Nazi informant over $1 million across nine years, then using the information for their own anti-hate fundraising campaigns. Joe:
  • Joe Getty (21:55):
    "The SPLC paid another informant with a neo Nazi group more than a million dollars over the course of nine years..."
• Both hosts agree this goes far beyond monitoring; it amounts to sustaining the very hate groups SPLC claims to fight.

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4. Iran and U.S. Foreign Policy: “50,000 Troops and Counting"

(25:14 – 35:14)

Military Buildup and Geopolitical Chess

• Report on the significant U.S. military buildup in the Gulf: four carriers, thousands of Marines, aggressive positioning as the Iran crisis ebbs and flows.
  • Joe Getty (25:14):
    "The USS Abraham Lincoln... the USS Tripoli... USS Ford... George H.W. Bush carrier on the way..."

On Negotiations and Trump's Ceasefire

• Skepticism about the real motives behind temporary ceasefires and who actually benefits.
  • Joe Getty (27:08):
    “‘Yep, yep, still working on the unified proposal...’ I would just string them along and string them along.”
• The hosts consider whether international patience and economic strangulation (“starve them out”) may yield better results than direct conflict.

US Blockade and Iran’s Collapsing Economy

• Discussion of the blockade's economic toll ($435 million daily losses for Iran), and whether the pressure will catalyze collapse.
• Discussion of China’s role and interests, as their oil imports from the Gulf would be affected by ongoing chaos (33:53).

War’s Popularity and Public Apathy

• New polling shows two-thirds to three-quarters of Americans think the Iran war is a net negative, but it’s not a major concern for most.
  • Jack Armstrong (35:14):
    “It is incredibly unimportant. ...They're not thinking about it before somebody asked him and they're not thinking about it after somebody ask them.”

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5. Global Birth Rate Collapse: “Even Chile is Below Japan”

(41:49 – 45:22)

Shocking Demographic News

• Latin America—previously immune to “first world” birthrate trends—has seen a drastic drop, including Chile now having a lower fertility rate than Japan.
  • Jack Armstrong (42:14):
    “Latin America is now aging faster than any region in the world... Chile has a lower birth rate than even Japan...”
• The hosts express bewilderment at the collapse, noting it is not explained simply by affluence or modernity—it’s global and poorly understood.

Cultural Reactions and Progressive Self-Hatred

• Joe comments on the lack of concern from media and progressives, theorizing that antipathy toward humanity itself drives indifference.
  • Joe Getty (44:41):
    “...the fact that humans aren't reproducing anymore...they're like, well, that's good because we're trampling on the planet and using up the resources... Oh, you people. If you need a slappin...”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

“You can indict a ham sandwich for deliciousness.”
—Joe Getty (08:35)

“They had paid one dude $250,000 to be involved in organizing that thing... That seems like going pretty far to create the very event you're gonna then complain about.”
—Jack Armstrong (20:31)

“The SPLC’s business model is they declare anything to the right of Hillary Clinton as fascist and a hate group, including a hilarious list of groups that clearly are not.”
—Joe Getty (03:31)

“Soon online will be the real world and kind of a reflection back and forth of it. And when I read this piece, I thought, you know what? That sounds pretty right.”
—Jack Armstrong (15:10)

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Timestamps for Major Segments

| Time | Topic / Segment | |-----------|------------------------------------------| | 02:47 | SPLC in the media & DOJ’s grift charges | | 05:09 | DOJ accuses SPLC of bankrolling hate | | 06:45 | DOJ press Q&A on SPLC indictment | | 09:14 | DOJ press conference derail (Patel) | | 19:53 | SPLC paying hate group organizers | | 25:14 | U.S. military buildup in Middle East | | 27:54 | Iran ceasefire skepticism, Trump's moves | | 30:21 | Iran's economic collapse & China | | 35:14 | Polling: American apathy on the war | | 41:49 | Collapse of global birth rates |

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Tone and Style

The conversation maintains Armstrong & Getty’s trademark mix of skepticism, sarcasm, and biting humor. The hosts approach otherwise grave topics—fraud, war, civilization’s future—with a dry, irreverent tone, keeping the episode energetic and accessible.

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Summary

This episode is quintessential Armstrong & Getty: probing headlines, exposing hypocrisy, and lampooning both the left and right. Their coverage of the SPLC scandal is sharp and detailed, raising serious questions about media complicity and nonprofit accountability. The geopolitical discussion balances cynicism about politics with moments of thoughtfulness regarding the future of global conflict and civilization itself. Their signature blend of wit and world-weariness makes this episode an engaging, informative listen—especially for those who want to stay current without enduring partisan talking points or solemn punditry.

Transcript

[Jack Armstrong]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[Jack Armstrong]

So relax, let it take over.

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Broadcasting live from the Abraham Lincoln Radio Studio at the George Washington Broadcast Center, Jack Armstrong and Joe Getty.

[Joe Getty]

Armstrong and Getty. And now here's Armstrong and G.

[Jack Armstrong]

I've been highly annoyed for decades about this topic that regularly the mainstream news would have a headline like According to the Southern Poverty Law Center, Crimes against Pick your group. Asians, blacks, gays, whatever is increased five fold with white supremacy being the number one problem facing the nation and everybody would report whatever the Southern Poverty Law center had and their studies about racism and crime and all that sort of stuff as if there's some on high think tank that everyone respects. Tucker Carlson back before he Went crazy. Used to point out, this is Southern Poverty Law Center. They're not Southern. They don't deal with poverty. There's no law involved. There's not even really a center.

[Joe Getty]

Right, right. So the interim president CEO of the splc, responding to actions by the Justice Department, which we're about to describe, said we are outraged by the false allegations level against the SPLC, an organization that for 55 has stood as a beacon of hope, fighting white supremacy and various forms of injustice to create a multiracial democracy where we can all live and thrive. Blah, blah, blah. Violent, hate and extremist group, blah, blah, blah. The splc, born in the days of the civil rights movement, has like all causes, turned into a business and ended up as a grift, as they all do. The SPLC's business model is they declare anything to the right of Hillary Clinton as fascist and a hate group, including a hilarious list of groups that clearly are not. And then they constantly raise money from progressive people and organizations because they portray themselves as bravely doing what the guy just, blah, blah, blah.

[Jack Armstrong]

Well, they get to. They get to try to do that, and they've been successful at it. The problem I've always had is, and this is their real trick, and I should tip my hat. I'm actually wearing a hat. I should tip my hat to them for convincing the mainstream media that they were a serious, nonpartisan, fair organization because they got quoted all the time. Right?

[Joe Getty]

Here's your first sentence from the Washington Post story on this story. The Justice Department on Tuesday accused the Southern Poverty Law Center, a storied civil rights organization. Yeah, I know, they're a grift. They've been a grift for decades. Anyway, here's Cash Pathel to explain to you what's going on.

[Ryan Riley]

The Southern Poverty Law center, in a massive sweeping indictment, has been charged with allegations of fraud and using the banking system to perpetrate that fraud. The splc, the Southern Poverty Law center used the money they raised from their donor network to actually pay the leadership of these very groups. I just want to say that again, they used the fraudulently raised money by lying to their donor network, thousands of Americans, to go ahead and actually pay the leadership of these supposed violent extremist groups.

[Joe Getty]

So what the SPLC claims is, well, we had to have informants just for our own safety and to, you know, keep an eye on these. It's part of what we do, keep an eye on these organizations. What the Justice Department is saying is, and they go into a little detail in the next Clip will play for you. You raise money because these groups exist. You're the ones keeping them afloat. You have every interest in financing these so called hate groups that are clueless

[Jack Armstrong]

jackasses mostly so they would give money to like the KKK so the KKK would have more money and could do more stuff so that they could then and raise money on the threat of the kkk.

[Joe Getty]

If you have zero dandelions, how much are you going to donate to the association against Dandelions?

[Julian Edelman]

None.

[Joe Getty]

There's no reason to. Wow, that's the allegation. Play 29 for us. Michael. Is David Spunt with Todd Blanche, the second in command at the FBI these days? I think Interim director. Sorry.

[Jack Armstrong]

Alleging that the Southern Poverty Law center was paying the leaders of KKK and other groups to continue their operations, is that. I'm not alleging it. The grand jury returned an indictment that says that. And so what the investigation found, according to the indictment that was returned today is that they were paying. So Southern Poverty Law center is raising money, asking folks to give them money to dismantle racism. And over a very long period of time they were using some of the money they raised from donors to, to pay to. They call them field, you know, basically to informants to, for information, for access, to just pay them for certain, to do certain things. And so yes, that's exactly what the indictment charges.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, it's not quite as definitive as I'd like it to tell the truth. So they're saying these so called informants were really a way to pipe money into the organizations to keep them afloat. A lot of it was concealed with financial trickery and just out and out dishonesty in violation of the law.

[Jack Armstrong]

Boy, I don't know what I think of that.

[Joe Getty]

Everything I've said about the SPLC I will stand by.

[Jack Armstrong]

Oh yeah, there's Grift, their grift scumbag operation.

[Joe Getty]

Right, Exactly.

[Jack Armstrong]

They call everything white supremacy.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

I don't know if I was in it in that, if I could justify we're giving money to this, a guy in the kkk. And even if you were, even if you're, if he's an informant who's not doing bad stuff, maybe. But if he's doing bad stuff, I can't stomach giving him money.

[Joe Getty]

Well, and how much. As opposed to like an informant of conscience who is just a leaker.

[Jack Armstrong]

Right.

[Joe Getty]

I mean, because these people are employees of the splc. It's not like somebody who says, you know, I've come to realize this is disgusting. And here's what's happening inside the organization. No, the. These people are on the payroll of the splc. So where is that line? They got an indictment, but as they say, you can indict a ham sandwich for deliciousness. Yeah, I wish it were a little stronger case.

[Jack Armstrong]

I excuse ham sandwich of being yummy. I got nine yes votes. Okay, well, this will be an interesting case to watch when it finally goes to trial.

[Joe Getty]

Now, as kind of a side issue, a different ring in the three ring circus. the press conference when they went to answer questions, Aaron Katerski of ABC News in 27. Michael, he asked some kind of unrelated. Well, not kind of some unrelated questions. Patel is now suing for defamation and lashing out at reporters.

[Ryan Riley]

I can say unequivocally that I never listen to the fake news mafia. And as when they get louder, it just means I'm doing my job.

[Joe Getty]

The Atlantic article said members of his security detail had difficulty difficulty waking Patel because he was seemingly intoxicated. It also said a request for breaching equipment normally used by SWAT and hostage rescue teams to quickly gain entry into buildings was made last year because Patel had been unreachable behind locked doors.

[Jack Armstrong]

Wait, wait a second. Okay, so now this is based on that Atlantic piece that claims Patel is a drunk and everything, right?

[Joe Getty]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

So, but what's the. What was that last part?

[Joe Getty]

They had to get breaching equipment to, like, bust down his door when they needed him because he was hammered. Is that what, the same story?

[Jack Armstrong]

They had to use the battering rams to get into the FBI director's home because he was passed out? Is that what they're saying?

[Joe Getty]

Jaws of life or whatever? Yeah. Wow. Wow. Okay. Last time I saw him, he was

[Jack Armstrong]

chugging beer with a bunch of hockey players.

[Joe Getty]

Oh, my Lord. So a reporter is asking about, you know, the Atlantic article and similar issues, and I guess they got into it at the presser. Everybody grab your popcorn.

[Jack Armstrong]

Let's enjoy playing the computer login issue. Just explain the computer login issue. You were not able to log into. Your lawsuit contends that you were not able to log into the system.

[Ryan Riley]

What did you think after you were

[Jack Armstrong]

unable to log into the system?

[Ryan Riley]

Let's have a survey. How many of you people believe that's true? Hang on.

[Jack Armstrong]

Did you communicate?

[Ryan Riley]

You asked the question. Let me answer it.

[Jack Armstrong]

No, no. Did you communicate with anyone that you thought you were fired after you were unable to log into the problem with

[Ryan Riley]

you and your report. Don't cut me off. You asked a question, straightforward question. The problem with you and your baseless reporting is. That is an absolute lie. It was never said. It never happened. And I will serve in this administration as long as the President, the Attorney General want me to do so. And every time you guys report false lies, every time you guys raise baseless questions, when we are here to talk about the Southern Poverty Law Center's $3 million decade long scheme to fraudulently fleece Americans, you are off topic.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's a simple four straightforward question. If you talk to anybody about whether you think.

[Ryan Riley]

Simple answer to your question is you are lying. And every time you do so. I've answered your question. It's simply as follows. I was never locked out of my systems. Anybody who says the opposite. Your lawsuit, anyone that says the opposite is lying. Thank you.

[Jack Armstrong]

That you filed. Says that, correct? Stop. You're being extraordinarily rude and I know maybe that's part of your profession, but please just stop. If you ask a question, he can answer it. And then. Now you're interrupting me. Like just a little bit of respect, man. Just a tiny little bit. Try it sometime.

[Joe Getty]

Who is that?

[Jack Armstrong]

Who's that? That was Todd Blanche, I think. Attorney General.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah. Who's the reporter? I need a name. Name names.

[Jack Armstrong]

Well, you're the FBI arresting police.

[Commercial Announcer 3]

Wow.

[Joe Getty]

Oh my God. This is fascism, folks. Jack has gone to the dark side.

[Jack Armstrong]

Oh, you go full rubber hose on him.

[Joe Getty]

I'm dawning a pea hat. Marching in the no Kings rally. Next time.

[Jack Armstrong]

There is one. So the claim. I didn't read the Atlantic piece. I just saw the headlines. So there's a claim that he couldn't get into his website once and he thought he'd been fired. And so he told some people, I think I've been fired. They logged me out. My password doesn't work anymore, which I don't know what would be proof of. That just sounds like whether it was

[Joe Getty]

part of the lawsuit or not. Yeah, I don't. These insider accounts that the leaks and all, I don't know. They're true half the time, they're half true all the time.

[Jack Armstrong]

I mean, I like, I like the, the ingenuity, the get things doneness of FBI directors who can't get a hold of their boss who knows his way around and drink and they think, hey, we just bought those battering rams. Let's knock down the door and go and see if we can wake him up. I think that's a positive step. Hey, can we get some of those

[Joe Getty]

bad boys in the office? I mean, like for his assistance. You can't get the director on the line, bust down his door, maybe put an explosive charge outside of it and blow it off its hinges.

[Jack Armstrong]

Wow. I will.

[Joe Getty]

In fairness, I will tell you, Kash Patel has the feel to me of something that's going to. That's going to end badly.

[Jack Armstrong]

He's a little too wacky hot young

[Joe Getty]

girlfriend got that going for him.

[Jack Armstrong]

Boozes it up in public.

[Joe Getty]

Who am I to criticize? Hey, he's a deep sleeper. Sometimes you need a battering ram to wake him up.

[Jack Armstrong]

I don't have the slightest idea where the cash Patel is a good guy or a bad guy. But we had an FBI director that looked like a good guy all the way around. Extra tall. What's his name?

[Joe Getty]

Comey.

[Jack Armstrong]

Comey. I mean, he had. I mean, he was a buttoned up, straight as an arrow and a dick. So yes.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah. Speaking of dicks, that voice we heard, Jack, was NBC News reporter Ryan Riley. Let's keep our eye on that young firebrand, all right? Oh, boy. Our politics is stupid right now. Just so stupid. Discouraging.

[Jack Armstrong]

So I got a thing I'm going to get to later because it kind of fits in. One of the reasons our politics is so stupid is because all the onlineness and people who are too online. Well, I came across this piece yesterday who said you got to move past this whole people who are too online. We're on the verge of online being reality. The whole look, the. The Internet, Twitter is not the real world. We're all so online so much, and the younger crowd is on so much that soon online will be the real world and kind of a reflection back and forth of it. And when I read this piece, I thought, you know what? That sounds pretty right. I think that is going to be true.

[Joe Getty]

I will be in the woods if you need me.

[Jack Armstrong]

The Twitter's not real life. Maybe it is very soon because that's what we're all. That's. That's. That's the world we swim in. Anyway, I'll get to that a little bit later. Stay here.

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Armstrong and Getty.

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[Jack Armstrong]

Boom.

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[Joe Getty]

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[Jack Armstrong]

he was against it.

[Joe Getty]

Quote because I know how to do math. To which Americans responded. That sounds like a you problem. Now stuff me with shrimp, lobster boy.

[Jack Armstrong]

So I'm sorry, I wasn't listening to that. I was trying to find Something else. But wasn't that what we were told that's what caused Red Lobster to go into bankruptcy? Was the all you could eat shrimp.

[Joe Getty]

But that's false.

[Jack Armstrong]

It's not true.

[Joe Getty]

It's funny, but it's not true. No private equity group bought them out and then drained them of cash and took the cash and then left them a shell. It happens all the time. Great. Lobster related American institutions brought to its tentacles knees what lobsters have. Lobsters have knees. I don't know. Back to you.

[Jack Armstrong]

I had some really good stuff lined up for you. But because of a lot of way a lot of websites work, it went away when I clicked away from it and it can't be found again. I've got some of it in my head. So that topic we just about the Southern Poverty Law center and how they were paying informants and everything like that. The National Review had a lot of the details on a page that has now disappeared. But it went really, really far. For instance, that get together, remember the, the one where the guy drove the car through the crowd and, and, and killed somebody unfortunately. And Joe Biden saw the hate in their faces and that's why he ran for president. And then Trump said there were good people on both sides. You remember that whole event, they had paid one dude $250,000 to be involved in organizing that thing. Picking up people and driving them to the rally to make sure there was a good crowd, et cetera, et cetera. That seems like going pretty far to create the very event you're gonna then complain about. Right?

[Joe Getty]

You cannot raise zillions of dollars for to fight against something that is insignificant. And so they had to beef up the significance of these stupid ass hate groups. The Southern Poverty Law center financed them so they could raise money against them.

[Jack Armstrong]

And one other particular get together, I think it was for the kkk, the Southern Poverty Law splc. They did the like website work for them. Like you guys aren't good at this. Hey, we'll build the website and everything here to recruit people. If you're, if you're recruiting the bad guys and then having someone pick up bad guys and taking them to the parades so that you can have a good crowd there. And then going on to fundraise on all the white supremacy there is. There's a problem with that, right?

[Joe Getty]

That's way beyond. We have undercover people to keep an eye on them. No, you're financing.

[Jack Armstrong]

I can't wait until this actually goes to trial and we learn more about this scumbag organization and hopefully they're driven out of office or driven out of existence.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, I'm looking at the article I think you're looking for. And sure enough, the SPLC paid another informant with a neo Nazi group more than a million dollars over the course of nine years. In 2014, that informant stole 25 boxes documents from an unidentified violent extremist group that the SPLC later used to create a report about the group. Blah blah blah.

[Jack Armstrong]

If you're actually paying a dude to drive around and pick people up at their homes to go to the We Hate Jews parade, that's weird. So that you can then report on how many people showed up at the parade.

[Joe Getty]

Come on and raise scads of money. The SPLC is a grift.

[Jack Armstrong]

We'll have to check in on Iran where things are with the ceasefire. We didn't attack. I don't know if you noticed that

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Armstrong and Gettysburg the countdown is on for the 2026 NFL Draft, presented by Bud Light. Catch all seven rounds three days live from Pittsburgh, April 23rd through 25th. Watch every pick live on NFL Network, ESPN and ABC. NFL Network is also streaming with NFL Plus. It all starts Thursday at 8pm Eastern. Visit NFL.com draft for more information. Subscription required for NFL Plus. Visit Plus.NFL.com for terms if you're feeling

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off fatigue, mood changes, skin shifts, yet your labs say everything's normal. You're not alone. Meet Oestra from Inner Balance, the first all in one prescription strength bioidentical hormone cream that's natural and effective and only takes one drop, 10 seconds a day. Oester replaces five to six products women typically use to treat symptoms and is third party tested to ensure the highest quality. Visit innerbalance.com today to start feeling like yourself again. That's innerbalance.com get ready for the wildest

[Jack Armstrong]

sight your lawn has ever seen. Sunday, Sunday, Sunday this spring, unleash soil science like never before. Witness your custom lawn plan and the

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transformation to a soft, green paradise.

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[Julian Edelman]

this is Julian Edelman from Dudes on Dudes with Gronk and Jewels. One thing I've learned over the years, before you head out on any adventure, you gotta be ready to stay hydrated because dehydration ruins the fun faster than you can spell it. Pretty sure there's a Y in there somewhere. I was a slot receiver, not a spelling bee champ. Speaking of adventures, Liquid IV has been rolling with us for a while now. Total pros. Pro show up, does the job, makes everyone better. We're pumped to have them on the team and trust me, you'll be thankful to have them with you when dehydration tries to sneak up on you. No playbook required. All you got to do is tear, pour and enjoy. Go to liquid I've.com and use the code nuthouse for 20% off your first purchase. And check us out on YouTube or listen to dudes on dudes on the iHeart app or wherever you get your podcast.

[Joe Getty]

The USS Abraham Lincoln carrier patrolling the seas south of the Strait of Hormuz along with the USS Tripoli carrying thousands of Marines. The USS Ford, already on the longest carrier deployment since the Vietnam War, heading into the Red Sea and back into this fight. Squadrons of fighter jets that have already carried out waves of airstrikes against Iran for weeks now. Add the George H.W. bush carrier on the way here, expected to arrive by the end of this month. Not to mention the aerial refuelers and many more squadrons of fighter jets stationed across the region. Also, more Marines are on the way, adding to a force to of around 50,000 U.S. troops and counting. Yeah, 50,000.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah, we have quite the military buildup. But with, as Charlie Daggett said, the another aircraft carrier on the way,

[Joe Getty]

we

[Jack Armstrong]

doing all that just to bluff? I don't know. So if you're following this story, yesterday, middle of the day, turns out Iran wasn't going to send anybody to Pakistan. So JD Vance never left Washington, D.C. to go to Islamabad and get involved in negotiations. And then Pakistan said to apparently to President Trump, hey, you got no interlocutor on the other side here, so you might want to give them a little time. So Trump decided to let them get their act together. Like who? Who you sending? Who are you going to talk to? I'm extending the deadline now. The Trump haters in the crowd call that another taco. Maybe it's just reasonable in that like, well, there's no point to show up and negotiate with people that have no power. There also might not be any point than trying to bomb them back to the Stone Age, because I'm not sure what you're going to get out of that right now.

[Joe Getty]

Here's the part that bothers me. In a social media post, the president said he'd renewed the truce because Pakistan asked for it. They're trying to mediate an end of the war he said the ceasefire would remain in place until Iran's, quote, leaders and representatives can come up with a unified proposal. Well, if I'm in charge of the IRGC and I am frantically bolstering my defenses, producing drones, moving resources, consolidating support, I'd tell the President over and over again. Yep, yep, still working on the unified proposal. Just about done. Just having somebody proofread it for typos. Probably tomorrow. Yep. That unified proposal, any day now. I would just string them along and string them along. You can't, you can't let them declare what the deadline is.

[Jack Armstrong]

I get that.

[Joe Getty]

You know, that may not be what's actually happening because Trump shoots his mouth off on social media all the time, then either contradicts himself or does something different. But I didn't like that.

[Jack Armstrong]

But, but there's no upside to being, you know, going all hard ass on a floundering group with no spokesman.

[Joe Getty]

What, are you going to get beaten down the IRGC further? I mean, going back to kinetic action,

[Jack Armstrong]

I'm just not sure it's going to have any effect on them, I guess.

[Joe Getty]

What's the alternative, though?

[Jack Armstrong]

I don't know.

[Joe Getty]

Getting them to cooperate or compromise? I think that's fanciful.

[Jack Armstrong]

I don't know. So I was listening to this. I've heard him on a couple of different shows. We ought to get him on ourselves. This Fred Kagan, he's with the Institute for the Study of War, the AIE crowd and super smart guy in this stuff. And he said when people say that we've hit 10,000 targets or whatever and there are no targets left, that's complete bs. There's all kinds of targets which they have shown today, even by sending a couple of rockets at ships in the straight of Hormuz. They got lots of rockets and rocket launchers yet there's plenty of targets left for us to hit and we could resume that at any point. And then, yeah, I guess you punish them and hope that they submit at some point. I don't know. That's the Pentagon's job. You started this war, right?

[Joe Getty]

Well, then you've got the whole their economic situation is so dire there, a couple of weeks from collapse deal. I don't know exactly how to appraise how true that is, but it's got to be pretty true.

[Jack Armstrong]

That seems like the best bet to me. Just with the knowledge, with the information we have, and we have, I'm guessing a tiny percentage of all the information that exists around this whole thing. But if, if the, if they're about to collapse. That's a much better way to handle it than blowing up all their bridges and power plants and everything like that

[Joe Getty]

and you know, ramping up international condemnation and blah, blah, blah. Yeah, I could see the, you know, the patient approach. Starve them out. I'm not sure it'll work, but it's, it's not crazy.

[Jack Armstrong]

And Trump I think is uniquely positioned because he doesn't care what anybody thinks, to weather the storm of the criticism over however many weeks it would take for them to collapse. If we think that's going to happen.

[Joe Getty]

Hey, you have any problem with playing that? Benjamin Rad from UCLA describing the blockade and its economic effects. It's 54.

[Jack Armstrong]

Michael. It sounds like this U.S. blockade is

[Joe Getty]

giving the U.S. tremendous leverage. Right now.

[Jack Armstrong]

We're not hearing about this, but the economic damage to Iran is $435 million a day, according to a American researcher, Miyat Nadaki, who has written about this in Foreign Affairs. And this is something that we need to keep in mind. As much as Iran, Iran has leverage over the Strait. It is a self inflicted wound that is actually working against Iran's own interests. Just as a US citizen is hoping for something, I'm hoping that that's what is going on. They're missing out on a half a billion dollars a day. They're near financial ruin. Trump mentioned in one of his posts that cops aren't being paid, all kinds of government workers aren't getting paid there in Iran, that, that it's going to collapse and then, and then we deal with it that way. I'm hoping that's the plan and that's the direction it goes.

[Joe Getty]

Keeping in mind that China's got its sweet and sour pork stained hands all over a lot of them.

[Jack Armstrong]

Wow.

[Joe Getty]

Totally unnecessary, but I enjoyed it. Gratuitous, yes, but delicious. So Beijing, of course, well, you're familiar with the situation. Straits of Hormuz, you got, all the shipping is stopped. It's causing enormous expense, insurance problems, blah, blah, blah. And some great analyses here by a fellow by the name of Tom Tugenhach who points out that Beijing for decades has promoted itself as the non judgmental alternative to the US or Western democracies in general. We're everywhere, we're committed to nothing. We mind our own business, everybody makes money. China doesn't give a crap what you do. And in the Gulf that posture, that reputation is now collapsing among all the Gulf states. China, according to multiple reports, has provided Iran with satellite imagery, components and intelligence needed to attack infrastructure and shipping as well as the US targets in the Gulf countries and the Gulf countries are pissed. Each part of the logistics chain has helped Iran destroy refineries and docks and kill civilians. This has not gone unnoticed in Riyadh and other capitals that when combined, are far more important to China than Tehran. According to the U.S. energy Information Administration, a couple years ago, Russia supplied 20% of China's oil, more than any other country. Iran contributed 11%, largely through the shadow network of tankers we've talked about. But those figures speak to the importance of Persian oil to China's power. But they don't hold the tell the same story, the whole story rather. Okay, so you got 11% of Chinese oil comes from Iran. Saudi Arabia provides 14% of it, Iraq 10%, Oman 7% and the UAE 6%. So those four Gulf states account for about 37% of China's oil imports. And China's enabling a variety in aggression endangers suppliers that collectively matter more than three as much as the economy. That's a weird sentence, but anyway, so China, the more it backs Iran, is really screwing up its access to affordable oil, which it really needs, cuz they're a huge oil importer, they're not very energy independent at all. And so Beijing is, is under, this guy says more and more pressure to have Iran cut it out because the whole will sow the seeds of chaos in the region and everybody will back off and everybody will be fine, fine thing has not worked. And so he thinks Beijing's got to be at least close to panicking about this.

[Jack Armstrong]

I hope so.

[Joe Getty]

Self defeating.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah. So that's the best case scenario to me. Iran's going broke, they're on the verge of collapse and China's going to start pressuring them to, hey, you got to knock it off and then we don't have to try to wipe out a civilization or whatever Trump threatened.

[Joe Getty]

So as the war toggles between negotiations and open conflict, China's foreign policy apparatus has to deal with the repercussions of its support for Iran. Beijing's diplomatic energy will now turn to reassuring the Arab monarchies that the satellite data was misused. The components were never intended for offensive deployment. The IRGC went rogue and the relationship with the Gulf states remains one of mutual respect.

[Jack Armstrong]

But so why did the IRGC fire on the three boats this morning?

[Joe Getty]

They're still committed to the closing the Straits of Hormuz thing as leverage.

[Jack Armstrong]

So they don't think they're going broke or don't care if they go broker.

[Joe Getty]

I think they probably think this is Only the only card we have. So this is the card we're playing.

[Jack Armstrong]

Interesting.

[Joe Getty]

We're going to hold the Strait of Hormuz hostage and wait till the pressure builds on the US I think they are miscalculating badly.

[Jack Armstrong]

By the way, more polling came out yesterday showing how incredibly unpopular this war is. Somewhere between two thirds and three quarters of Americans think this has been a net negative for the United States. I don't know how you judge something like that before it's over. You can't. But I guess if you're asked, you come up with an answer.

[Joe Getty]

He is almost entirely biased and the administration's done a poor job of selling the justification.

[Jack Armstrong]

True. Although I heard Charl Kirk of National Review make this point yesterday.

[Joe Getty]

Charlie Kirk has passed, I'm afraid.

[Jack Armstrong]

Cook. That's right. Charlie Kirk's wife killed him because the Jews told her to.

[Joe Getty]

I. I don't think that's true.

[Jack Armstrong]

Then she danced around the leather pants. I saw Candace Owens videos.

[Joe Getty]

She's who would fall for that crap?

[Jack Armstrong]

Charlie?

[Joe Getty]

Guys, I know of the National Review

[Jack Armstrong]

said one thing to point out, and I thought this was perceptive. It is incredibly unimportant. But people don't care about about it. So it's an issue that if you stop people on the street and say, do you think it was a good idea? They'll say, mostly a bad idea. But they're not thinking about it. They weren't thinking about it before somebody asked him and they're not thinking about it after somebody ask them. It's not like it's a big top of mind topic. So there's not a. So even though it's unpopular, there's not a lot of political pressure on the president because people aren't paying any attention. I think that's probably true.

[Joe Getty]

Right, Right. It's like your stance on, I don't know, the NBA playoff system, I guess I don't really like it.

[Jack Armstrong]

It.

[Joe Getty]

You don't care.

[Jack Armstrong]

Right, Exactly. And to that point, also in the same polling from YouGov that came out yesterday, Trump's approval within the Republican Party is higher than it was at this point in his first term. He now has 73% approval among Republicans. He was 69 in the first term. Now, part of that is because so many people have abandoned the Republican Party and the Democratic Party. There's just that many more people that don't want their names attached to either party. So you're getting a smaller. Anytime you hear about polling among Republicans and Democrats, that that chunk of people just keeps getting smaller. And smaller. Biden's with Democrats at this point, by the way, and his term was 62%. So Trump is a full double digits more popular with his own party than Biden was.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah.

[Jack Armstrong]

So usually you get forced out of a war because your party turns against you. And, and his his party is not turned against him.

[Joe Getty]

Right. Speaking of support for the President, headline from the New York Times, Tucker Carlson says he is tormented by his past support for Trump. I want to say I'm sorry for misleading people, said the conservative commentator. Oh boy. Tuck, Tuck, what are you up to?

[Jack Armstrong]

So we'll keep our eye on that whole thing. I got an interesting different topic for you coming up. You know how people have started stopped having babies all over the world. Rich, poor, black, white, Western Civ, not Western Civ. You got a country in South America that now has a lower birth rate than Japan. What in the hell is going on?

[Joe Getty]

South America?

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah. Stay tuned with that and other stuff on the way.

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Armstrong and Getty

[Commercial Announcer 1]

the countdown is on for the 2026 NFL Draft. Presented by Bud Light. Catch all seven rounds three days live from Pittsburgh, April 23rd through 25th. Watch every pick live on NFL Network, ESPN and ABC. NFL Network is also streaming with NFL. It all starts Thursday at 8pm Eastern. Visit NFL.com draft for more information. Subscription required for NFL, visit plus.NFL.com for

[Commercial Announcer 2]

terms if you're feeling off fatigue, mood changes, skin shifts, yet your labs say everything's normal. You're not alone. Meet Oestra from Inner Balance, the first all in one Prescription Strength Bioidentical Hormone cream that's natural and effective and only takes one drop, 10 seconds a day. Oester replaces five to six products women typically use to treat symptoms and is third party tested to ensure the highest quality. Visit innerbalance.com today to start feeling like yourself again. That's innerbalance.com get ready for the wildest

[Jack Armstrong]

sight your lawn has ever seen. Sunday, Sunday, Sunday this spring, unleash soil science like never before. Witness your custom lawn plan and the

[Commercial Announcer 1]

transformation to a soft, green paradise.

[Commercial Announcer 3]

Sorry, just trying to get your attention. Sunday is a boringly simple way to get a green, healthy yard. No harsh stuff, no big trucks, no chaos. Order today and get your custom Sunday yard plant plan for the season ahead. Smarter Lawn care for less getsunday.com this

[Pandora Jewelry Announcer]

Mother's Day celebrate all the women who make life brighter with a gift from Pandora Jewelry. Choose jewelry that reflects what she means to you and the moments you share make it even more meaningful by personalizing your piece with an engraving in Your own handwriting, something no one else has, either a date, a name, or something unique to you. Because the best Mother's Day gift says more than I love you, you. It says, I appreciate you. It says, I see you. Find the perfect Mother's Day gift at your local Pandora store or [e-mail] I

[Jack Armstrong]

want to play this very brief news report just because Joe's annoyance with it, I think will be hilarious. What? Alan Osmond, the oldest member of the 70s Pop rock band the Osmonds, has passed away. Alan was a backup vocalist, guitarist, and producer for the family band. His brother, Donnie Tsang, he was our leader in every sense of the word. Alan Osborne stopped performing after being diagnosed with multiple sclerosis some 40 years ago, seen in this last photo posted on Instagram with his wife, Suzanne, who survives him, along with eight sons, 30 grandchildren. That's enough. Who is that?

[Joe Getty]

Son's 30 grandkids and five great gangs. He cut off the endearing part.

[Jack Armstrong]

Who is that for the not. You got to be a certain age to know. To the word Osmond mean anything to you at all? Yeah. Lesser Osmond passes.

[Joe Getty]

Sorry, I'm not really annoyed. It's just. It's.

[Jack Armstrong]

You got annoyed yesterday when Hanson wanted to do the breaking news. We had breaking news. One of the Osmonds has died.

[Joe Getty]

Well, yeah, that's annoying. Yeah. Okay.

[Jack Armstrong]

All right.

[Joe Getty]

He hasn't performed for 40 years. He was part of a brief teen idol thing a million years ago. Seems like a nice fella. God bless him the most. What's that?

[Jack Armstrong]

I was gonna say, you talk about a more innocent time when the Osmonds were a big deal.

[Joe Getty]

The most interesting part of that clip to me was that he retired 40 years ago from performing after his diagnosis with Ms. And he just passed.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah. Good for him.

[Joe Getty]

So good for him and his doctors and his family.

[Jack Armstrong]

Just so you know, Hansen is still

[Joe Getty]

depressed as of this morning.

[Jack Armstrong]

Yeah. I understand. There won't be any families like the Osmonds in the future because nobody's having kids anymore. That's my transition.

[Joe Getty]

The Osmonds will be one kid, the Osmond.

[Jack Armstrong]

So this chart came out yesterday. Even down in South America, Latin America, they've stopped having children. It's all over the world. I. I used to think it was a, you know, rich, successful, safe country. Stopped having kids. That was my theory. But it's everybody everywhere. For some.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah. Something serious is up, I'd say.

[Jack Armstrong]

Latin America is now aging faster than any region in the world. What? And they aren't all rich there. Chile has A lower birth rate than even Japan with the latest numbers that have come out, which is stunning. All of these countries are below replacement rate currently.

[Joe Getty]

Well, trample me with an alpaca.

[Jack Armstrong]

Peru, Mexico, Ecuador, El Salvador, Colombia, Brazil, Argentina, Cuba, Uruguay, Costa Rica, Chile are all below replacement rate. In other words, they'll disappear from the face of the earth within a couple of generations if they don't start having more kids. And nobody knows why. How is this not like the biggest topic on planet Earth? Elon Musk retweeted that that a story about Chile being below Japan. And Japan ain't having kids if you don't know the story. They've been held up as the standard of places that have decided not to have children. For a long time they kind of lived away. Korea, yeah, now everybody's doing it. But Elon Musk retweeted with, like, how is this not a bigger topic? I would agree.

[Joe Getty]

South America, I am fascinated by this, especially because the whole, well, it's a cost of living. You gotta. You can't afford to have kids. But we've never been more wealthy. And the whole, whole. I was reading about this the other day. The whole, we're not going to get married until we're financially really settled. No, you're doing it backward, right? You get together, life is much less

[Jack Armstrong]

expensive, you get your financial house and

[Joe Getty]

anyway, people don't know they had too much time on the damn Internet. But yes, the fact that it's South Korea and Chile.

[Jack Armstrong]

What the hell? Wow, you need to roll your L or something like that the way they do in TV news now. Whenever you talk about Chile.

[Ryan Riley]

Chile.

[Joe Getty]

I could have steered more into the Chile.

[Jack Armstrong]

They also have a low birth weight in Nicaragua. Nicaragua.

[Joe Getty]

You're more likely to own a llama than to be a mama in Chile. Too much. Trying too hard. I apologize.

[Jack Armstrong]

We've talked about this a lot and got no new theories. But it's pretty weird.

[Joe Getty]

Hormones in the water supply.

[Jack Armstrong]

And as Joe always points out, if it were whales or polar bears, there'd be great consternation and something to blame over the fact that they've stopped reproducing. But humans and well, we're better off without immunity.

[Joe Getty]

Yeah, the progressive tendency or desire to show off their self hatred when it's like national or within the United States, it's hatred of their own country, which is the beacon of liberty on earth and has brought health and prosperity to billions through our example. And yet they pretend to hate, or they actually hate it because they're so delusional. But on a global level, progressives have to hate humans in general to show how enlightened they are. So the fact that humans aren't reproducing anymore, which is just, biologically speaking, unthinkable for a beast, they're like, well, that's good because we're trampling on the planet and using up the resources. And you shouldn't bring a child into the world now anyway. Oh, you people. If you need a slappin if you

[Jack Armstrong]

miss the segment or an hour, get the podcast Armstrong and Getty on demand

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Armstrong and Getty

[Commercial Announcer 1]

the countdown is on for the 2026 NFL Draft, presented by Bud Light. Catch all seven rounds three days live from Pittsburgh, April 23rd through 25th. Watch every pick live on NFL Network, ESPN and ABC. NFL Network is also streaming with NFL. It all starts Thursday at 8pm Eastern. Visit NFL.com draft for more information. Subscription required for NFL, visit plus.NFL.com for

[Commercial Announcer 2]

terms if you're feeling off fatigue, mood changes, skin shifts, yet your labs say everything's normal. You're not alone. Meet Oestra from Inner Balance, the first all in one Prescription Strength Bioidentical hormone cream that's natural and effective and only takes one drop, 10 seconds a day. Oester replaces five to six products women typically use to treat symptoms and is third party tested to ensure the highest quality. Visit innerbalance.com today to start feeling like yourself again.

[Commercial Announcer 1]

That's innerbalance.com People, don't listen to radio ads while you're driving or making a sandwich. Your subconscious pays full attention, so relax.

[Joe Getty]

Let it take over.

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[Pandora Jewelry Announcer]

A smarter, healthier yard this Mother's Day celebrate all the women who make life brighter with a gift from Pandora Jewelry. Choose jewelry that reflects what she means to you and the moments you share. Make it even more meaningful by personalizing your piece with an engraving in your own handwriting, something no one else has, either a date, a name or something unique to you. Because the best Mother's Day gift says more than I love you. It says I appreciate you. It says, I see you. Find the perfect Mother's Day gift at your local Pandora store or [e-mail] this

[Ryan Riley]

is an iHeart podcast.

[Jack Armstrong]

Guaranteed human.