Podcast Summary: Ascend - The Great Books Podcast Episode: The Frogs by Aristophanes with Tish Oxenreider
Hosts: Deacon Harrison Garlick and Adam Minihan
Guest: Tish Oxenrider
Release Date: July 8, 2025

Introduction

In this engaging episode of Ascend - The Great Books Podcast, hosts Deacon Harrison Garlick and Adam Minihan delve into Aristophanes' comedic masterpiece, The Frogs. Joining them is Tish Oxenrider, an accomplished author, blogger, and podcaster, known for her works like Notes from a Blue and At Home in the Reflections. Together, they explore the intricate layers of The Frogs, examining its historical context, literary significance, and enduring relevance.

Meeting Tish Oxenrider

The conversation begins with Deacon introducing Tish Oxenrider, highlighting her diverse roles and previous collaboration on the A Drink with a Friend podcast. Tish shares her journey with the Great Books, emphasizing her early love for reading and how it evolved through teaching and homeschooling her children. She underscores the importance of classic literature in shaping understanding and intellectual growth.

Tish Oxenrider [05:55]: "I can't imagine being who I am or knowing God the way I do without, without these classics."

Aristophanes and The Frogs

Deacon provides a historical backdrop, noting that Aristophanes, born around 446 BC, is celebrated as the father of comedy. Despite writing over 40 plays, only 11 have survived, including The Frogs, first performed in Athens in 405 BC, which won first place in its inaugural performance. The play humorously narrates Dionysus' quest to rescue the great tragedian Euripides from Hades to restore moral integrity in Athens.

Tish admits that her appreciation for Aristophanes deepened through teaching, allowing her to connect classical themes to contemporary life.

Tish Oxenrider [08:40]: "I started writing again, which leads me to want to read more, which as we homeschool our kids, it led me to find what are the best available for my own kids..."

Themes and Insights from The Frogs

The hosts discuss the central premise of The Frogs: Dionysus' dissatisfaction with contemporary tragic poets leads him to seek Euripides' return. They explore how Aristophanes uses humor as a vehicle for moral and cultural critique, positioning poets as essential teachers of society.

Deacon reflects on his initial difficulty transitioning from tragedies to Aristophanes’ comedy, highlighting the play's dual role of entertainment and instruction.

Deacon Harrison Garlick [10:34]: "...the poets are teachers. And so Aristophanes is trying to teach us something."

Tish elaborates on the idea that comedians, like Aristophanes, serve as truth-tellers, using satire to address societal issues that might be too sensitive for direct discourse.

Tish Oxenrider [12:06]: "Comedians are the truth tellers of a culture... Aristophanes is pointing his finger at himself, too."

Literary Criticism and Translation

A significant portion of the discussion centers around the importance of translation in understanding The Frogs. Deacon expresses concern over sanitized translations that obscure the play’s original humor and vulgarities, which are integral to its comedic impact.

Deacon Harrison Garlick [21:04]: "Older translators, like the 1950s ones, intentionally muted a lot of Aristophanes vulgarities... I read like the kids version."

Tish agrees, noting that while some crude humor may seem out of place, it effectively serves the play's satirical purpose without detracting from its literary quality.

Humor and Human Nature

The hosts and Tish draw parallels between ancient Greek comedy and modern humor, citing examples like South Park and classic films such as the 1930s Robin Hood. They discuss how certain comedic tropes, though seemingly overused today, were innovative in Aristophanes' time and reveal enduring aspects of human nature.

Tish Oxenrider [29:50]: "Aristophanes is hitting on something here by reminding Athens of their own stories that they, they know backwards and forwards because this is part of their zeitgeist."

Dionysus: Teacher or Trickster?

A focal point of the conversation is the portrayal of Dionysus in The Frogs compared to Euripides’ depiction in The Bacchae. Deacon notes the stark contrast between the jovial Dionysus in Aristophanes' play and the more malevolent version in Euripides' tragedy, pondering the implications for understanding the god's role as a cultural influencer.

Deacon Harrison Garlick [40:17]: "...they make you realize that these plays are presenting two slightly different visions... Dionysus as a timid, goofy wine god versus the cruel figure in The Bacchae."

Tish highlights how Aristophanes uses Dionysus as a conduit for cultural renewal, emphasizing the transformative power of great poetry and traditional values.

Poets as Cultural Stewards

The discussion extends to the idea that poets like Aeschylus and Euripides are foundational to societal values, acting as custodians of truth, goodness, and beauty. Both hosts agree that revitalizing these great voices is essential for maintaining cultural and moral integrity.

Deacon Harrison Garlick [48:00]: "...the play is trying to point us towards going back and recovering the old ways."

Modern Relevance and Storytelling

Tish and Deacon explore the timeless nature of these ancient plays, suggesting that their themes and humor remain relevant. They advocate for reading and discussing these works multiple times to fully grasp their depth, drawing parallels to modern storytelling techniques and the enduring impact of narrative teaching.

Tish Oxenrider [67:50]: "Don't read commentary on the Greek plays, just read the Greek plays."

Conclusion

The episode concludes with a mutual appreciation for The Frogs as a work that balances humor with profound cultural commentary. Tish emphasizes the readability and performative potential of Aristophanes' plays, making them accessible and enjoyable for contemporary audiences. Deacon echoes the sentiment, encouraging listeners to engage directly with the texts to uncover their layered meanings.

Tish Oxenrider [66:55]: "Good stories can do that."

Deacon Harrison Garlick [67:34]: "...read them with a group, read them with people, have that fraternity and explore their perennial themes."

Where to Find Tish Oxenrider

Listeners interested in Tish's work can visit her website at tishoxenrider.com for more information on her books, podcasts, and other projects.

Ascend - The Great Books Podcast continues to foster meaningful discussions around pivotal texts that have shaped Western civilization, inviting listeners to join the "great conversation" and deepen their understanding of timeless ideas.