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- [00:00]
A
Hey Esti, have you ever posted or thought about posting anonymously on those other social media platforms because you're afraid of the backlash? Well then this community is for you. Join the HHP Collective where your opinion is appreciated and the education is elevated. Visit hhpcollective.com for more information and use code ASCP26 to browse your first month for free. And don't worry about writing it down because you can find the link in the show notes. If you're an esthetician, you know how frustrating it is when clients don't return consistently. Stop using software built for salons and start using Spa Sphere. Spa Sphere is built specifically for estheticians with simple tools like treatment plans and skin reports that get clients to come back. It helps you turn one time appointments into loyal regulars so your clients get better results and you make more from every session. ASCP members can try it for $1 for 90 days at Spa Sphere AI ASCP. Hello and welcome to ASCP and the Rogue Pharmacist with Benjamin Knifeooks. And in each episode we will explore how internal and external factors can impact the skin. I'm Maggie Stasik, ASTP's program director. And joining me is Ben Fuchs, skincare formulator and pharmacist. Hey, Ben.
- [01:33]
B
Hello, Maggie.
- [01:34]
A
Ben, I recently read about how scent can subtly change over time. And most of us can recognize that people have a natural individual signature smell that evolves across their lifespan. Can you explain to us how much of this is biology versus perception?
- [01:53]
B
Oh, it's biological. Yeah. As we age, our fats in the body's lipid compartment breaks down. Lipids are very unstable. Anyway, that's why, you know, we talk about seed oils and the problems with seed oils and fried oils and processed oils. Oils are very unstable. When they break down, they become rancid. And that smell that you're referring to is basically rancidity. But it's not inevitable. In other words, if you use certain nutrients and you stay away from certain foods, you can minimize or even eliminate that smell. The problem is we don't really understand nutrition as well as we should. Elderly people who, who may not have been taking care of themselves or may not understand the importance of supplement, dietary supplementation or, or a good diet, they're more susceptible to that smell. And there's one particular breakdown product of lipids called nonenolated. And if you've heard of that, that's the famous molecule that gives the characteristic smell that people smell in nursing homes sometimes where there's lots of elderly Folks. But the most important point is to recognize that it's not inevitable. And really, there's a lot of things about aging that we consider to be inevitable, like aches and pains and osteoporosis and weakness, frailty and such slow healing, particularly odors and smells that are not inevitable. They're not inevitable part of aging. And there's certain things that we can do, but we're not really told by our authorities, by our health authorities, by medical authorities, that there are these strategies that you can use to slow down the aging process. That smell that you're referring to is really part and parcel of the aging process, because we don't take care of ourselves. So if you don't want to have that, that aroma or, you know, that smell, make sure you're using lipid fat antioxidants. Vitamin E being the most important. Alpha lipoic acid, selenium, possibly vitamin A, glutathione, glutamine, vitamin C. All of these can help protect lipids or protect the. The antioxidant profile or support the antioxidant profile to protect the breakdown of fats and breakdown of lipids. So it's definitely biological, but it's not necessarily inevitable. Also, staying away from processed fats and staying away from processed oils, and that's so, so important. And ironically, the most important or the most fragile of the oils are the ones that we consider to be the most important. And then we find that in nutrition a lot, that there's a relationship between nutritional value and instability. A molecule is very, very valuable from a nutritional standpoint, is often very unstable. And in fact, its value is in proportion to its instability. The fact that it breaks down quickly is what it allows it to be valuable. But on the other hand, if he breaks down too much or you have too much too rapid a breakdown, it can cause problems. And that's really what that smell is. Now, there's other factors, too, by the way, that are associated with the smell that you're referring to. The microbiome on the skin contributes to that smell. And there's a relationship between fats in the skin and the microbiome. And by destabilizing the fats, you destabilize the microbiome, and that can also contribute to that smell. So if you. If you know somebody who has that smell or you don't, you're getting older and you don't want to have that smell. Make sure you're pounding the nutrition, the antioxidant nutrition. Pigments from, from vegetables and fruits have antioxidant properties and also stay away from fried and processed fats. I can't emphasize that enough. Such a big problem, especially considering the fact that we love fried fats and we love processed fats. So, you know, if you're going to ingest those kinds of fats, then it becomes extra important that you make sure that you're using your vitamin E and selenium and glutathione and all the, all the natural antioxidant support molecules to protect those fats.
- [05:29]
A
Do lipids or barrier changes play a role?
- [05:31]
B
Heck yes. Heck yes. Heck yes. Keratosis, xerosis, changes in the water barrier disruption and changes in the water balance in the skin can also have a deleterious negative effect on the fats. So yes, making sure the barrier is intact, supporting a healthy skin barrier, supporting healthy transit of keratinocytes upwards. As keratinocytes are rising upwards in healthy skin, lipids are being dumped out overboard and those lipids become lift, they become the fatty support the grout, if you will, for the mortar and brick and mortar model of the stratum corneum. So supporting transit, which tends to decline obviously with age, is also important. So things like exfoliation techniques can be helpful, even if it's just something like shaving for men or a loofah pad or a washcloth. Although I like alpha hydroxy acids best for exfoliating. So keeping, keeping the skin moving, keep improving turnover is also going to be important for eliminating those lipids. And actually because those lipids become rancid, essentially that's what we're talking about is rancidity on the surface of the skin. Exfoliation techniques can help eliminate some of those lipids. And bring up, if you're healthy, bring up fresh lipids and bring up fresh lipids. You can support fresh lipid production by using phospholipids. Phospholipids from eggs, for example, or lecithin supplements. Those can be helpful for phospholipids that support the barrier and support the the skin cell membranes. Essential fatty acids can be important and then all the aforementioned antioxidants also.
- [07:05]
A
So is this more a microbiome issue and we need to slough the surface, or is it more biology issue?
- [07:12]
B
Both, absolutely. They're related because the microbiome is only going to be as healthy as the biology and the biology is going to support the microbiome. Also, I should add that estrogen can play a role. Estrogen is, has oxidative properties and that can accelerate oxidation so that when Estrogen levels fluctuate, that can have an effect. And also when estrogen levels fluctuate during menopause, sometimes people, sometimes women sweat, and that can have an effect as well. So between sweating and changes in, in estrogen production, and then also in rancidity due to breakdown of fats, I hate calling it rancidity, but that's what it is. Due to lack of antioxidants or excess ingestion of these processed fats, you have really have a perfect storm of biochemical phenomena that can lead to this kind of rancid smell that people associate with getting older.
- [08:01]
A
And is there a reason why there's a familiar scent that is specific to each individual?
- [08:09]
B
Yeah, everybody has their own fat profile, their own fat signature, if you will, just so much. You know, we're talking about fats. There's dozens of different kinds of fats that live in the skin of different kinds of chain lengths, different carbon lengths, et cetera. And everybody has their own particular fat profile, lipid profile in the skin and throughout the body. So, yes, everybody's going to have their own particular smell based on their own particular profile and, and their own particular tendency to rancidity or tendency to oxidation based on their fatty acid profile, in addition to their ingestion of, of processed fats. And on the, on the positive side, ingestion of antioxidants.
- [08:45]
A
You, you mentioned about, like, processed foods and fried foods and that this can increase the aging that maybe leads to this rancidity.
- [08:54]
B
Yeah, exactly. And the point I was trying to make is that things that we consider inevitable are only inevitable because of our lifestyle. And we never make that connection. We just assume, oh, this is just part of getting older. And we don't realize that maybe it has to do with the fact that I'm eating a lot of french fries or a lot of pizza or a lot of processed fats. And it really. Processed fats need to be respected. It's no accident that the incidence of heart disease and cancer and inflammatory, chronic degenerative illnesses increased dramatically when we figured out how to process fats at the turn of the 20th century. Processed fats are incredibly aging and incredibly damaging to cells, to the, the natural lipids in the skin and in the body. So it really cannot be said too much. It's. We should not underestimate the importance of these processed fats when it comes to. Or processed foods in general, really, but especially processed fats when it comes to aging, accelerated aging. And some of the signs of accelerated aging, like the smells that are associated with the aging process.
- [09:53]
A
We'll say, would you say that omegas are gonna help counteract that too?
- [10:00]
B
Essential fatty acids can definitely help counteract that. But the most important thing is your lipid antioxidants, your fatty antioxidants. Those are gonna be the most important ways to protect yourself from just breaking down. In general, you can use topical antioxidants too, and that may also help, especially topical vitamin E, even though topical vitamin E doesn't necessarily have any cellular benefits and it might help protect the protect your skin from the breakdown of fats. One last thing also is the sun can also accelerate the breakdown of fat. So making sure that you're using some kind of sun protection can help too.
- [10:35]
A
That concludes our show for today and we thank you for listening. But if you just can't get enough of Ben Fuchs, the ASCP's rogue pharmacist, you can find him@truthtreatments.com for more information on this episode or for ways to connect with Ben Fuchs or to learn more about ascp, check out the show notes.