Podcast Summary: Ask Haviv Anything – Episode 48: Two Years to October 7
Host: Haviv Rettig Gur
Release Date: October 6, 2025
Main Theme & Purpose
This especially somber episode of "Ask Haviv Anything" marks two years since the October 7, 2023 massacre. Set against the backdrop of the joyous Jewish festival of Sukkot, Haviv reflects on the dichotomy between enforced joy and enduring trauma. He explores the deeper implications of Jewish suffering, antisemitism's resurgence post-October 7, and how the Jewish tradition confronts overwhelming grief while maintaining the imperative for happiness and gratitude. Through Jewish texts, personal reflection, and historical reference, Haviv seeks to answer how Jews can celebrate joyfully during a time of great mourning.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
The Crash of Holiday and Tragedy (00:04 – 05:15)
- Two-Year Anniversary: The episode is recorded on Sukkot, with Simchat Torah—the Hebrew calendar anniversary of the attack—approaching (00:04).
- Dissonance of Celebration: Jews are “pretty much commanded to be happy,” yet they are “agonizing” amid trauma and grief.
- Central Question: How can Jews reconcile moments of enforced joy (festivals) with horrific, ongoing realities?
"It's the anniversary of the massacre and of everything that has flowed from the massacre. The agonizing and terrible war in Gaza. Yes, obviously terrible for Gazans. Most of all, as we've discussed, ad infinitum. And needs to be understood that war requires a great rebuilding." (00:52)
Uniqueness and Scale of the Trauma (05:16 – 09:40)
- Beyond the Massacre: The fallout is broader, including awakened "latent structural bigotries" in the West and Muslim world.
- Global Response to Gaza vs. Other Conflicts: Haviv notes that the outpouring of protest and antisemitic rhetoric in the West, post-October 7, has no parallel in response to conflicts like Sudan or Rwanda.
- Ideological Roots: The resurgence of antisemitism is attributed to ideologies that position Jews as symbols of 'Westernism'—vilified by both progressive and certain Muslim world ideologies.
- Comparisons to the Past: While Jews have always been primed as scapegoats, the current wave is worrying for its pervasiveness, not just its presence.
"It has to do with ideology. And the Jews' place in ideologies, in the academic, progressive ideology, the Jews as totems of Westernism. That has to be hated because Westernism itself is a bad thing." (03:21)
"Nowhere has the world ever awakened like this." (05:53)
Existential Impact and Historic Precedents (09:41 – 14:44)
- Persistent Threat: Haviv reflects on the possibility of "never-ending trauma" if hostages don’t return and if antisemitic ideologies continue to spread.
- Historical Reaction: In previous eras, some Jews assimilated or abandoned Jewishness; others stayed. He ponders: What should those who stay do now?
- Faith and Hope: Hints at hope for the hostages' return and a “rebuilding” phase, but tempers this with realism.
"What if that's what's going on and the trauma is not going to end anytime soon and Jews will live in fear for a long time..." (09:45)
The Challenge of Joy Amid Pain: Talmudic Wisdom (14:45 – 24:30)
- How to Celebrate? Addressing the psychological struggle of celebrating festivals while in mourning or under existential threat.
- Talmudic Case Study—Rabbi Yeshua (17:21):
- After the Temple's destruction, some Jews stopped eating meat/drinking wine—acts once connected to Temple sacrifice—as signs of mourning.
- Rabbi Yeshua challenges the logic: taken far enough, asceticism leaves nothing permissible; "not to mourn at all is impossible, but to mourn too much is also impossible."
- Solution: The Talmud prescribes incorporating a visible sign of loss into celebration—leave part of the house unplastered (never fully complete), a tradition kept "front and center."
- At Weddings: Symbolized by breaking a glass to remember the destroyed Temple.
"The Talmud gives us specific instructions. A person may plaster his house with plaster, but must leave a small area without plaster to remember the destruction of the temple... Put it front and center. Anybody who's ever met the parent of a child who died, ... it's reality. It's right there, front and center." (19:37–21:10)
Modern Application: Pain, Joy, and Gratitude (24:31 – 37:10)
- The Role of Presence: When interacting with those who've lost, it's not about reminding them of the tragedy ("they know, they live with it"), but about presence and companionship.
- Permission for Joy: By acknowledging grief openly, space is made for genuine moments of happiness, not forced or inauthentic.
- Gratitude as a Core Jewish Value:
- Recalls Avot de-Rabbi Natan, where Rabbi Yochanan ben Zakai’s students try to comfort him after his son's death by comparing his suffering to biblical figures—which only increases his pain.
- Only one student, Rabbi Elazar ben Azariah, succeeds, suggesting that the pain is a reflection of the greatness of the gift lost.
- Maimonides' Insight: Suffering is the gap between expectation and reality. Healing comes not from lowering expectations, but from deepening gratitude for what was actually received.
"Comfort, real, permanent resilience and overcoming is in the immensity of what we have lost... Great pain is a function of great love." (32:40)
"We incorporate our loss into our happiness in this additional way... the pain itself is a sign of how great and beautiful the world is." (33:13)
Synthesis and Concluding Insights (37:11 – end)
- Isaiah's Teaching: "Rejoice with her joy, all you who mourn for her."—Mourning and joy are intertwined; mourning exists because of love.
- Living with Complexity: Jews do not "stop dancing and ... celebrating Sukkot," nor do they surrender to despair; joy is retained because of an awareness of the value of all that can be lost.
- Final Message: All life is gratitude, even amid loss. The episode ends with Sukkot and Simchat Torah greetings—a call to embrace both happiness and pain.
"We are happy, not despite our great loss, but because we know how much we have to lose. Only people who lose know what they have. Every last bit is a gift. And all life is Thanksgiving. Happy Sukkot. Happy Simchato Continental." (end)
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
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On Global Antisemitism:
"Nowhere has the world ever awakened like this." (05:53)
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On the Talmud’s Answer to Trauma:
"My children, Rabbi Yeshua says, come not to mourn at all is impossible, but to mourn too much is also impossible." (20:07)
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On Grief and Gratitude:
"Great pain is a function of great love." (32:40)
Timestamps for Major Segments
- Opening & Anniversary Reflections: 00:04–05:15
- Global Response & Antisemitism: 05:16–09:40
- Historical Perspective & Current Trauma: 09:41–14:44
- Talmudic Discussion on Joy in Mourning: 14:45–24:30
- Jewish Psychology of Grief & Gratitude: 24:31–37:10
- Final Thoughts and Blessings: 37:11–end
This episode weaves personal, historical, and religious perspectives into a meditative exploration of how the Jewish people have historically and must now continue to live with pain and joy intertwined—anchored by the enduring practices of remembrance, gratitude, and resilience. Whether marking Sukkot in celebration or October 7th in sorrow, life’s gifts and losses are inextricably linked in the Jewish story.