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Episode: The Vision of Ephesians: What is “Sola Scriptura”?
Date: October 5, 2025
Host: Mike Bird
Guest: N.T. (Tom) Wright

Overview

This episode dives deep into Scripture’s authority and interpretation, tackling the doctrine of Sola Scriptura, issues of biblical reliability, tricky Bible passages, and the role of public professions of faith in salvation. Mike and Tom also discuss Tom’s forthcoming book on Ephesians, reflect on the Reformation's impact, and answer listener questions ranging from Helsinki to Georgia. Throughout, the tone is relaxed and intellectually stimulating, peppered with musical references and friendly banter.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Tom Wright’s New Book on Ephesians

[02:30-04:39]

• Tom introduces his upcoming book, The Vision of Ephesians, developed from recent lectures and an intensive course.
• Ephesians is described as "visionary," with Tom highlighting its central concept:

  “The Church as the small working model of new creation.” — Tom Wright [03:37]

• If Ephesians, rather than Galatians, had been the manifesto for the Reformation, church history and even the trajectory of Western Europe could have been different, possibly impacting issues like antisemitism.

2. The Impact of Ephesians & Protestant Theology

[03:16-05:22]

• Mike recalls FF Bruce’s description of Ephesians as the “quintessence of Paulinism.”
• Tom remarks the Reformation was overly shaped by Romans and Galatians, focusing on salvation as “how to go to heaven when you die,” a lens less applicable to Ephesians.
• Discussion of antisemitism’s roots in Reformation polemics:

  "Antisemitism is a horrible virus which can break out in all sorts of places for all sorts of reasons." — Tom Wright [04:59]

3. Listener Q&A: Sola Scriptura vs. Solo Scriptura

[07:05-12:56]
Question from Robin Fastnight (Helsinki):
Is “Sola Scriptura” workable in practice, or does it become “Solo Scriptura”? Would “Prima Scriptura” be better?

• Tom explains the Reformation’s intent: Scripture as supreme authority over church tradition, reacting against accumulated traditions overshadowing Scripture.

  “I, as an Anglican, have always grown up traveling in the other direction. Any question that comes up, we start off saying, what does it say in the Bible?” — Tom Wright [08:40]

• Critique of “Solo Scriptura”: when every preacher becomes their own interpreter, using verses as proof texts out of context.
• Tom urges that Sola Scriptura should immerse us “in the world of Jesus himself,” challenging later traditions that distort original meanings.
• The Westminster Confession’s use of Scripture as mere footnote, rather than as formative narrative, is critiqued.
• Key Insight: Sola Scriptura requires considering the entire biblical story, not isolated proof texts.

  “Sola scriptura means we need the whole thing.” — Tom Wright [11:58]

Mike’s Reflection:

• The Reformers didn't mean “naked Scripture,” but Scripture as supreme. Wisdom from tradition (church fathers, seasoned Christians) still matters.

  “Scripture is supreme, but it’s not the only source of theology.” — Mike Bird [13:07]

4. Listener Q&A: Can We Trust the Bible's Details? (Memory in Antiquity)

[13:30-20:09]
Question from Wayne Dumbleton (Hitchin):
How did biblical writers recall detailed episodes (e.g., Mary’s Song, private meetings between Jesus and Pilate)?

• Both hosts humorously cite their own and family feats of memorization (e.g., Les Mis lyrics, Hamilton rap), showing modern memory practices.
• Tom points out oral cultures were much more memory-dependent. In the ancient world, large works like Homer’s Iliad were memorized and performed; the same was true for narratives in villages or religious communities.

  “In the ancient world people expected to use their memories because it was much more an oral culture than what we've got. And reading and writing was more a sort of elite thing.” — Tom Wright [15:00]

• Refers to Kenneth Bailey, whose studies of Middle Eastern oral tradition demonstrate communal memory accuracy; mistakes were publicly corrected.
• Even “private” events weren't as private as modern minds assume; servants, attendants, and communal gossip spread information quickly.
• Tom gives a real-world contemporary example from Uganda, where an entire narrative about a secretive murder was public knowledge within a day, cemented by retelling.

5. Listener Q&A: The “Zombie” Apocalypse—Matthew 27’s Raised Saints

[20:24-25:59]
Question from Jeff Riddell (Winnipeg):
What’s really happening in Matthew 27:52–53? Were the saints actually raised? Is this apocalyptic imagery or literal history?

• Mike notes Michael Licona’s controversial interpretation: “apocalyptic special effects”—a non-literal reading for literary/theological effect.
• Tom is cautious: while skeptical critics use this passage to dismiss the resurrection altogether, he distinguishes between the unique nature of this event and Jesus’ resurrection.
• The passage’s sequencing is odd: tombs open at Jesus’ death, but saints only emerge after his resurrection.

  “It is a tricky one... I want to have my cake and eat it at this point and say, yeah, it's got all those wider resonances of this is the great turning point of history. But that doesn't mean nothing happened.” — Tom Wright [25:19]

• Tom admits the historical specifics are unclear and looks forward to “asking Matthew in person.”

6. Listener Q&A: Public Profession of Faith and Salvation

[28:03-37:45]
Question from Nicholas Spratlin (Kennesaw, Georgia):
How important are public professions of faith and baptism for personal salvation? What about loved ones who may not have made a public profession?

• Tom clarifies: in the NT, baptized, believing profession was the public marker of church membership, but the reality is “more complicated than that.”

  “As soon as we're talking about doing enough to get to heaven, we are talking about justification by works again... We get into a tangle when we insist on making the Bible answer late medieval or 16th century questions.” — Tom Wright [31:40]

• He stresses the distinction between norm and exception. Many make professions or are baptized without it reflecting their living faith; others, without public acts, genuinely belong.
• Classic example: the thief on the cross. Not baptized, but assured by Jesus of salvation.
• What matters is trusting in Christ and moving toward the “center," not fulfilling every outward step.

  “Firm at the center and then flexible at the edges… there are many variations. But please don't use the fact that there are many variations as a way of saying so it doesn't really matter, because it actually does.” — Tom Wright [36:50]

• Mike summarizes: professions are important but not an ultimate litmus test.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “The Church as the small working model of new creation.” — Tom Wright [03:37]
• “Antisemitism is a horrible virus which can break out in all sorts of places for all sorts of reasons.” — Tom Wright [04:59]
• “I, as an Anglican, have always grown up traveling in the other direction. Any question that comes up, we start off saying, what does it say in the Bible?” — Tom Wright [08:40]
• “Sola scriptura means we need the whole thing.” — Tom Wright [11:58]
• “In the ancient world people expected to use their memories because it was much more an oral culture than what we've got.” — Tom Wright [15:00]
• “I want to be very cautious about saying, okay, if you've had the water thing and you've had the profession of faith thing, then you're basically in.” — Tom Wright [32:43]
• “Firm at the center and then flexible at the edges.” — Tom Wright [36:50]
• Mike’s musical interludes: referencing Les Mis, Hamilton, and teasing gospel musical numbers throughout.

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Tom’s new book on Ephesians: 02:30–04:39
• Ephesians and Protestant Theology: 03:16–05:22
• Sola Scriptura Discussion: 07:05–12:56
• Scripture's Reliability (Memory): 13:30–20:09
• Zombie Apocalypse in Matthew 27: 20:24–25:59
• Public Profession of Faith & Salvation: 28:03–37:45

Tone & Atmosphere

• Warmth, humor, and mutual respect; Mike and Tom’s rapport includes self-deprecating jokes about private identity (citizenship, tax issues), and musical asides.
• Both hosts stay accessible, yet incisive, making complex theology feel practical and inviting.
• Listeners are encouraged to think historically, contextually, and pastorally rather than legalistically.

Conclusion

This episode offers a rich and relatable theological conversation about the authority of Scripture, communal memory, and the complexities of faith expression—anchored by both academic rigor and pastoral wisdom. Whether discussing Ephesians’ relevance, ancient memory practices, or the assurance of salvation, Tom and Mike equip listeners to grapple honestly with Scripture and tradition in today’s world.