B (3:23)

Thank you so much.

A (3:24)

I have to tell you, I am so excited to have you here. I flew in specifically so that we could do this interview, and I've told you already, you were my top five guests. When I started this podcast, I wrote a list and I was like, I really want Oprah and I really want Michelle Obama. And you and David were both on that list. And I am beside myself that you're here today.

B (3:47)

No. So do you. Bet you say that to everyone. Emma, come on.

A (3:50)

I do not. I have filmed many, many podcasts. I really don't. I'm really honest about it. Listen, I'm waiting for Oprah. Like, let's tell you.

B (3:56)

And David Beckham, I'm so sorry. You just got me.

A (3:58)

I mean, tick tock. I mean, hello, David. No, I really don't say it to everybody, but I have been a fan for the longest time. You know, I grew up in London. I was born in the 80s, and the spice Girls in my childhood was, I cannot tell you, and I know you hear this all the time. So pivotal. And for many obvious reasons, everybody wanted to, you know, label me a scary spice. And I was like, babes, I'm. I'm Posh Bias. I am posh cause of the Gucci and the whole thing. And I am just beside myself. You have been just someone I have looked up to and admired for the longest time, specifically for your career post, your music career. And so I cannot wait.

B (4:37)

Well, thank you. So, honestly, that means so much. I have to say. I'm a huge fan. I mean, I listen to every single one of your podcasts. I really do. And honestly, I find you so inspiring. Everything that you have achieved is incredible. So I'm super excited to be here and chat with you.

A (4:55)

Honestly, the feeling is mutual. And listen, I've got so many questions, so I'm gonna jump Right in. Because you are coming off the back of a show and the reviews have been incredible. I feel like you are really in a moment right now. Post the documentary where. Thank you. You gave us such an insight into your work and how you approach your business. And I guess my first question for you is really to understand, like, where are you in your life right now as a businesswoman, as a founder, as an entrepreneur, and how do you know?

B (5:27)

I feel great. My business has been, gosh, it's been a rollercoaster ride. And I touch on that in the documentary, you know, I was in the Spice Girls. And by the way, you look just like Posh Spice. You're looking very posh today, Emma. I have to say, very posh.

A (5:43)

I mean, I just got this little, you know, Victoria Beckham thing that they say casual.

B (5:46)

Well, you look beautiful. I was in the Spice Girls for four years and I'm so appreciative of my time with the girls.

A (5:54)

Was it only four years?

B (5:55)

It was four years.

A (5:57)

Unbelievable to me because it feels like it could have been 14 years.

B (6:01)

Exactly. It was such a short amount of time and it was so great. And I love the girls. So thankful and appreciative of all of them and what we achieved and the fans. But I've been so defined by that four year period. And I've been in fashion for 20 years and the business has been through so much. It has been nothing short of a rollercoaster ride. So when you say to me, how do I feel now? I feel great now because, you know, I've been in the red for a long, long time. I'm in the black. We're profitable. I don't want to go back there.

A (6:38)

No fair.

B (6:39)

I don't. It's been a fun ride, but finally, as an independent brand, you know, to be able to say we are profitable and now I can start building the house that I've always dreamed of is very exciting.

A (6:52)

It really is exciting. And I love the honesty there because I feel like, certainly for this show, so many young founders and entrepreneurs listening. And what I really appreciated in the documentary was that level of honesty about how hard it is, seemingly even for somebody like you, which I know actually has no bearings on real success and real longevity. I wanted to ask you, though, before we dig into the business side of things, what actually drives you right now? Because despite it only being four years, you are literally one of the most famous women in the world. And I'm imagining you're not hard out for a bit of money. And so I really Want to know where's the ambition come from? And actually what is driving the level of dedication that we saw in that documentary to your business?

B (7:36)

I love empowering women through fashion and beauty. I love the industry. I've learned my craft, and I'm very, very ambitious. You know, you said, how do I feel now? I. I feel a level of contentment, but that doesn't mean I'm not dreaming bigger than I ever have done before. And so I'm excited that after all of the struggles, finally, you know, being in the position I'm in now, I can now really start building. And I see so much opportunity in both fashion and beauty. We know that appetite is there. And so now is the fun part.

A (8:15)

Oh, yeah, now is the fun part. What is it that you're building towards when you look into the future and you think about what you're capable of and what your brand is capable of? What are you aiming for at this point?

B (8:26)

You know, for me, this has never been a vanity project. This has always been a true passion. You know, it's about creating ultimately, the best in class. So ultimately, what I want to build is a legacy brand. It's always been about the why of everything I do. Not just the brands, but the product itself. You know, why am I doing this? No one needs more stuff for the sake of stuff. It's got to be good. It's gotta be ultimately what I desire, what I can't find, and it's gotta have a point of view.

A (9:01)

Do you remember a time when there was this perception shift? Because I think it certainly wasn't easy for you coming into fashion and being taken seriously, despite the insane and amazing outfits that we all loved, you starting a fashion brand was hotly questioned, contested, you know, in the media. What was the moment for you when everything fell into place and it was like, they're taking me seriously now.

B (9:25)

Do you know? I suppose I'm always going to be mindful of preconceptions because of my background. You know, I came from the music industry, married to a footballer, stepping into fair, you could say fair. And I was so aware of that. But I didn't listen to the noise. You know, I stayed focus. I knew what my purpose was. I knew what my dreams were. And, you know, the first collection that I showed, which was 10 dresses in 2008, I had a hotel suite in New York. I did it in a really, really humble way. I didn't know which way that was gonna go. I didn't know what people were gonna think. Like I said, I was so aware of the preconceptions. But right from the beginning, people were surprised at the, at the quality of what I was doing, you know, but it's. I will always feel that I have something to prove. I feel that I've earned my right to be where I am, but I have to work even harder now to maintain that.

A (10:27)

Do you have any idea what you'd be doing if you never became a Spice Girl and you weren't doing this?

B (10:32)

Oh, my goodness. I'd probably. Well, I'd be one of two things. I'd probably be a makeup artist because I've always been obsessed with makeup. Or probably something marketing, something like that.

A (10:46)

Yeah, but you'd be in the business.

B (10:47)

Yes, for sure.

A (10:49)

In your veins.

B (10:49)

For sure. You know, I'm a creative person. I've never been the most academic. You know, I've had to learn along the way, educate myself later on in life, as has David. You know, the Beckhams, we're like a little family of builders. Yeah, I think you're a builder too, right?

A (11:05)

I'm a builder. I love the idea of being like a family of builders. That feels so good.

B (11:09)

That's what we're creative.

A (11:11)

I was so interested when I watched the documentary, like just seeing like the level of involvement you in the businesses, but also you being a mom and this sort of relationship that you have with your husband that you're clearly like so invested in. And it's such a like family thing. Like the fact that your family are turning up and David is there cheering you on and helping you out when you needed him to be. But I think people still have a fascination with what it is that you actually do daily and day out. And I'd love you to just talk me through like, just like a typical Victoria Beckham day. Like, what does it even look like for you?

B (11:49)

Okay, well, I'm a creature of habit and I really like routines. So we get up every morning, we make Harper breakfast. David, if he's not traveling, does the school run. I go down to the gym and I do about 45 minutes workout.

A (12:04)

What kind of workout are you doing?

B (12:05)

I lift weights. I lift weights.

A (12:07)

You listened to what they're saying out there for the 40 year old women?

B (12:11)

Absolutely. So I lift weights for 45 minutes before David turns up. He then turns up and we do an hour together. So let's just say stop it.

A (12:19)

You are an hour and 45.

B (12:20)

Well, rather than focus on how much I do, let's look at David Beckham as the part timer in the gym. That's how I like to look at it. So then we work out together, and then I go to the office. My office is 10 minutes away from where I live. I have an incredible team of people. I have an atelier, and that's where I go five days a week.

A (12:40)

You go in five days a week?

B (12:41)

Yeah, I'm in the office five days a week. And I don't travel enormously. I spend quite a bit of time in New York because my beauty business is based in New York and my fashion business is between London and Paris. So. Yeah. And I'm in there every day. I have to be.

A (12:56)

Yeah, I do.

B (12:57)

I have to be, and I want to be. You know, I have incredible teams of people. It's so much more multifaceted, both businesses than I think most people would really recognize. And I'm so heavily involved with every single aspect of what both businesses do.

A (13:13)

So talk to me about how that shifted, because I think in the early days, when you have a tiny brand and people pay multiple roles, there's one role for you as the founder, and then as things scale a little bit, and of course, you've got both beauty and fashion and your family and your whole life. So what has the shift been in how you work today in the businesses versus what it looked like in the beginning?

B (13:36)

It's not about putting out fires every single day.

A (13:40)

Fair.

B (13:40)

You know, over the last 20 years, I've had many different CEOs, and you bring people on, you delegate, which is hard. As someone who is a control freak, I'm sure you find the same thing.

A (13:52)

Totally. But it's an imperative, right? To get stuff done.

B (13:54)

It's an imperative. You have to. You have to put trust in the person that you've put in that position. You know, when I first started, my fashion business was being run by. By an entertainment group. And, you know, I didn't know fashion either. I'll include myself in that. And these were people that didn't know anything about the fashion, the fashion industry. And I can honestly say that after a long, long time, I finally have an incredible team of people with an enormous amount of experience in the industry, phenomenal amounts of talent. And so for me, now it's fun because I'm very ambitious. And now I feel that I have the team of people around me that I need to really build something meaningful.

A (14:41)

It's well documented about, you know, the losses that you had and how difficult it was in the start. Do you, as a founder, sit with that responsibility for that, or, like, how do you feel about those early decisions.

B (14:53)

Look, I think there was a naivety when I first went into this and I think if I'd have known then about the industry what I know now, I probably would have been too scared to do it.

A (15:03)

Yeah.

B (15:04)

So I think that there was something very nice about that moment. But gosh, I mean, we've made so many, so many mistakes. But here's the thing. I've learned so much and I'm never gonna put the blame on anybody else. I'm the person in the room that says, hey, I could have done that differently and I should have done that differently. I was learning at the same time as well.

A (15:24)

Absolutely.

B (15:25)

But I'm just so lucky to such incredible talent now. And I know what I know, but I really know what I don't know. I don't pretend to know everything. And I think that that is key. So what I don't know, I surround myself with fantastic people that do.

A (15:41)

None of Us are born CEOs, right? Like out the gate, especially when you came from, I don't know if you were, I mean, maybe like, you know, a girl that had like high ambition. But it's like you have to learn and you have to make mistakes. And I think that so many people sit with ideas and they never out of the gate because of the fear. And I love what you're saying that, you know, it wasn't an ideal circumstance in the beginning that you learned much later, but you did it anyway. And I feel like so many of us are not as honest about our mistakes as we should be. And anyone who's doing stuff and actually making big and bold moves has like a whole history of mistakes and problems behind them. What have been your hardest lessons to learn, do you think?

B (16:22)

Oh my gosh, I mean, the financial losses, you know, and it's been so public and I love, you know, I love listening to, you know, I've heard you speak so much about mistakes that you've made as well. And it's good to reflect on that once you're out of it. But it's hard when you're in it and you've got to make sure that you stay focused and you keep your energy up. But I think that everything's been so public what my business has been through. And it's a double edged sword when you are a known person and your name's on the label. My business hasn't been through anything than probably any other fashion business has been through. It's just been more documented because it's me and I never complained about that. I just kept focused. I didn't listen to the noise. I knew what my purpose was and the why I was doing what I was doing. I never lost sight of that.

A (17:20)

I love that. It also didn't deter you from continuing, because I do think that, in a way, female founders, and you, more specifically, because of your high profile, are under such scrutiny. And when I look at what it looks like for men, you know, men go out and they start businesses and they fail in businesses and they lose loads of money and they start up the next day having been able to raise funds. And if a woman does the same thing, it's really frowned upon. It's like she doesn't know what she's doing. The reality is that we all come into business with a different kind of knowledge level, and actually losing money is part of building a business. Did you ever get to the point where you're like, this is actually not for me, like, I'm not supposed to be running a company and perhaps I should consider another path?

B (18:06)

Well, there were definitely days when I just didn't want to go into work. And, you know, there was no guarantee that I was going to be able to sustain what I had. But I think I had no choice, because if I wanted to save what I'd heavily invested in for all those years, I had to get out of the situation that I was in. And it got to a stage where I have incredible investors. I have a business partner, David Bellhousen, who has been just fantastic. And I found myself in a phase where I was in default. And so basically, that means that then I'm in a position where I don't have control over my own company.

A (18:55)

And he said, which is disastrous for you because your name's on the door.

B (18:58)

Absolutely. But, however, I trusted him and he said, to save this business, this is what we've got to do. The strategy has to change the structure of the company, has to change the design team, the atelier, the marketing. Everything had to change. And I didn't have a choice if I wanted to save the business. So at that point, I had a choice. I either listen and I go with this or I lose my business.

A (19:24)

There was a moment in the documentary where. Where David actually had to come in and help you financially. And, you know, because I go so far back in your history, I remember when the two of you got together and you were the big one. You were like the international pop star. I mean, David was not the David Beckham that we know now. He was like a really promising, amazing Footballer, but it was like you were the star. And I wonder what that was like, having to go to him and have him prop up what you were doing.

B (19:54)

Yeah. Do you know, it's interesting because I did an interview yesterday, and the woman that interviewed me said, you know, you and David share everything. We're both partners in each other's businesses, and financially, we have always shared everything. And I said, yeah. And she said, so why has everyone always said, david supported your business? She said, doesn't that mean that you both supported your business?

A (20:21)

Think about.

B (20:22)

Actually, yes.

A (20:23)

Wait a second. Good point.

B (20:25)

Yes. Because.

A (20:26)

Because you're partners.

B (20:27)

You're equal partners. We have been partners in everything that we've ever done, and we've always supported each other. And I believe in his big dreams and his ambition, and he's always done the same for me. But at the time when we were supporting my business, we weren't in the same financial position that we're in now.

A (20:44)

Fair.

B (20:44)

And it was difficult, but we'd already invested so much that to save what we'd invested to, we knew we had to keep on investing. And I just didn't know how to get out of this hole. I felt like I was sinking in quicksand. I just didn't know what to do.

A (21:02)

Yeah, no, that's. I mean, I know that feeling of having something that is not working and seemingly feels out of your control, but you already put too much in to walk away from it. And I feel like I've had times in my own business where, you know, I've had to downsize and, you know, fire a lot of people, walk away from something that feels really promising, and it is absolutely gutting. So it's amazing that you were able to make that shift. And obviously, it's kind of working out for you.

B (21:30)

So I used to think, if you've got a great product, it'll be successful. And that was such a naive thing to say, because ultimately, of course, it's about the product, but you've gotta have the right team around you to make that a success. And though the business was going through so much, you know, financially, no one was criticizing the creative.

A (21:54)

No, because that's true. People loved it. People were like, that's a good dress.

B (21:57)

People loved it. People desired what I was doing. It was just the business that wasn't in a good position.

A (22:04)

Fair enough. So how has your relationship to money changed? And I mean specifically within the business? Because, of course, it's very different when you've got money as a person and you're Making money as a pop star to when you're actually managing an entity and the flow through of money. So what does that feel like for you?

B (22:22)

You know, look, I'm not a CEO. I'm not a cfo. I'm very lucky and blessed that I have now finally great CEOs and great CFOs. By the way, I've had a lot of great people along the way. It's just not always been the right person at the right time. That is important that I say that. I want people to be honest around me all the time. And people have not always been honest.

A (22:45)

Can you take the honesty?

B (22:48)

That is the only way that I can be. You know, I don't want people around me that are sycophantic at all. I need people to be really, really honest. And I think in the past people haven't been honest because I am a known person. And you know, people thought that I always wanted the best, the best of everything. Well, we all want the best, but that's not always the right thing to do. And that's not right. That wasn't right for the business. I just didn't know at the time. So that is really key for me now that everybody's brutally honest. Whether that's good or bad. Just give me the truth. I'm such a positive, glass half full person and I'm all about energy. Harper says to me, how come do you wake up in the morning and you spring out of bed? She said to me the other day, we were in the kitchen and she said, we just watched inside out.

A (23:39)

Oh, so good.

B (23:41)

And she said, she was like, mommy, you know you're joy. And I was like, thank you, Harper. That's so sweet of you to say that. And she said, yeah, you know, you're always so happy. Even for me, first thing in the morning, you're always really positive. And David was making the breakfast and he said, well, who am I, Harper? And she looked at him now, you know that little square, red, angry guy.

A (24:01)

Stop it.

B (24:02)

Stop it.

A (24:03)

Don't say that to me about David Beckham, please.

B (24:07)

This is only first thing in the morning. He's just not a morning person. He's the most. He's such a happy, joyful person. But in the morning, he's a little bit more grumpy, fair. And he turned to me and he said, well, how comes your joy? I'm like, well, don't steal my joy.

A (24:20)

You're the lady. Don't dare steal my joy. But this means that you choose joy, right? Because there's plenty for you to be.

B (24:24)

Oh, my God.

A (24:25)

Worried about as a founder, as a mother, as a woman. Like, where we are in the kind of political climate right now, there's plenty for you to be miserable about. But that means that you wake up and you choose joy. That's what you do.

B (24:37)

When I go to work every day, you know, I'm very aware that my energy is so important to the whole company. I mean, people have come into my atelier and said, wow, we didn't know that a nice atmosphere with good energy was actually a thing in the fashion industry. And we laugh about it totally.

A (24:55)

No, but it's absolutely true.

B (24:56)

It's really important to me. So I like to be positive. But I am also very honest if someone's not doing something that is working as well, you know, I would never say something's great if I don't think it's great.

A (25:08)

How do you deal with that side of yourself when everybody is. I know. I'm sure that in your business, it's like you're still Victoria Beckham. So when you have to give critical feedback or when something displeases you, what does that look like? When you're less joyful, when you can't choose joy in the moment.

B (25:26)

I'm very lucky that the people I have around me are genuinely the best at what they do. So it's very rare that I actually have to tell someone that I'm not happy with what they're doing, because it's taken a long time to find such remarkable talent. But if I don't like something, if I don't like a skirt, I'd be like, hey, not really loving the skirt,

A (25:47)

but not the skirt.

B (25:48)

Yeah, let's change up the skirt. But, you know.

A (25:51)

But you don't have a problem giving feedback?

B (25:54)

Absolutely not. I mean, and I have to do that because for a long time, I wasn't outspoken enough because I was so in awe sometimes of the creative talent that I had. And I suppose I did listen to some of the noise, and I did have an element of. Of, you know, imposter syndrome, really. And so sometimes I wouldn't speak up because I thought, well, you know, what do I know? This person knows so much more than me because they have so much more experience. But then when I was put in that position by David, when Bellhouse, and when he said to me, okay, if we're going to take this business forward and try and get it out of the mess that it's in, we need to put Victoria back into Victoria Becker Fair.

A (26:38)

Do you believe that that's where some of the money challenges came from? Like you not being in the center of all the decision making?

B (26:45)

I didn't know any different. I mean, sometimes I was having an obscene amount of lining fabrics for outerwear, you know, for. Yeah, I know.

A (26:56)

I watched that on the documentary. Cause I was like, you know, there was something about, like, a $70,000 plant bill, which I absolutely, like, loved in a kind of posh way.

B (27:06)

I didn't even know you could spend that much on Speedy Rose.

A (27:09)

What kind of plants do you have a rainforest in there? But I get it. It's like, you know, you can have some beautiful plants and some beautiful flowers, and you can get carried away with the fact that that's there and they're being watered and so what now are you looking at to make sure that those things don't happen?

B (27:26)

Plastic plants? No, no, I'm actually joking, because I hate plastic plants.

A (27:30)

You can't have plastic plants. There's no way you have any plastic anymore. Anything at all.

B (27:34)

Well, I'm definitely not having those expensive plants anymore. You know, I just. I know to ask more questions.

A (27:39)

Yeah.

B (27:40)

And I have people around me now that recognize you should not be spending 70,000 on watering plants. I mean, I'm embarrassed to even say that, but I just didn't know any differently. You know, I've never run a business before. I've learned a lot along the way, but I'm more on the creative side of things and just did not know any better.

A (28:01)

I know that I've been in positions where I'm like, all of this is a business fundamental. But when you find something like that, of course you're like, okay, that's easy to cut. What else did you have to look at?

B (28:11)

Teams. I had too many people working, so I had to bring my numbers down.

A (28:16)

Yeah, that's really difficult.

B (28:19)

It is, because I'm a very loyal person, and I appreciate anyone that does anything for me, but I had no choice.

A (28:27)

And what do you think those financial pressures have led you to doing differently today?

B (28:33)

Trust. Really trust the people that have really proven to me that. That I. That I can trust them and that they know what they're doing. You know, I have two incredible female CEOs, both under the age of 45.

A (28:49)

You have two CEOs? Oh, in beauty, one in fashion, one

B (28:53)

in beauty, both under the age of 45. Both women. And they are. And I work very, very closely with the two of them, and I trust them.

A (29:09)

This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. One of the things I've learned is that the way you manage yourself determines everything. How you lead, how you show up for the people around you, how you make decisions under pressure. And therapy is one of the most underused tools for getting better at all of it. It's not just for crisis moments. It's a space to build self awareness, set boundaries, and develop the kind of habits that make you more effective in every area of your life. The people who are the most intentional about their growth are usually the ones who have someone helping them see what they can't see on their own. BetterHelp makes it easy to fit into a busy schedule. Everything is online, so you can do phone, video or messaging sessions. And they have over 30,000 credentialed therapists. If your match isn't the right fit, you can just switch at any time at no extra cost. Prioritize your well being with better help. Visit betterhelp.com aspire to get 10% off your first month. That's better. H E L P.com aspire. Victoria Talk to me about your move into beauty, because given all the learnings around fashion, I wonder a what made you just go, I'm going to start another entity. If there was like, trepidation around that and what just gave you the feeling that this was going to be different? Because it has been a really different story for you in beauty, right?

B (30:37)

Oh, yeah. I mean, beauty was profitable day one, which was great. Good for you. Thank you.

A (30:43)

Because beauty's a tough space, too. I mean, there can't be a more competitive space than beauty.

B (30:47)

Yeah. Well, what happened was Estee Lauder asked me to do a collaboration with them. I remember a few years ago, and that was so exciting for me because I collected makeup ever since I was little. And when I had my first meeting with them, I had little samples that I'd collected, colors that makeup artists had mixed up for me, products that had been discontinued. And I really knew if one day I had the opportunity to create a beauty line at the time, what did I want? What did I desire? What couldn't I find? And I'd learned so much, you know, from my time in the Spice Girl, seeing myself on stage with glittery eyeshadow on. Okay. If I ever get the chance to create an eyeshadow, note to self, make sure the particles aren't too big, fall on your face, and you feel like you've had a slap fair.

A (31:35)

You're like, note to self.

B (31:36)

Yes. I've learned so much from my own personal experiences, so I really knew what I wanted to do. And I think they were probably quite surprised at that when I first started working with their state order and. And it was so incredibly successful that I knew at that point that there was an appetite for Victoria Beckham beauty. But I knew that to do it in a really meaningful, honest, authentic way, I had to do that myself. I really wanted to focus on clean beauty, on being inclusive. And those two things we talk a lot about now. But people weren't really talking about that. I remember walking around. It was when Barney's was still around in New York. I remember walking around in the beauty department and going up to the counters. People that worked for the brands, what ingredients were in their formulas. You know, I've struggled a lot over my life with bad skin, bad acne, and I wanted to know what was in the formulas. And I realized it was a very gray area. No one really knew what the hell was in anything. And so I knew that that would be taking on a big challenge because that was really important to me, how to create something that is as clean as it can be and still effective. And I knew that I. To do that, I had to do it myself. And fashion wasn't in a great place at that time. So it was quite the risky. Probably the most riskiest thing I've ever done because fashion is struggling. And I.

A (33:01)

Here I go again.

B (33:02)

I want to start up something else. Here goes the builder in me now. Let's build a beauty brand.

A (33:06)

So there was nothing in you that was like, you know what? I've got this thing cooking over here. It's having a hard time. Let me just, like, do a partnership. Let me go to Lauder. Let me go to P and G. Let me go anywhere and just get this funded. Because at the end of the day, you're still Victoria. Like, you didn't need to start it yourself.

B (33:22)

Yeah, no, I just knew that to do it in the way that I wanted to do it, I had to do it myself. We started out direct to consumer.

A (33:30)

Did you go out and raise money first?

B (33:32)

The money was raised by my partners in fashion.

A (33:36)

So it was seemingly like one entity, but two separate brands, two separate funds

B (33:41)

run independently of each other, and then just very few of us straddling both is how I like to put it.

A (33:48)

So a little polite straddle there.

B (33:50)

Absolutely. And we cross pollinate. And so it was quite a risky thing to do. But for me, it was all about finding the perfect product. And when I look at my beauty brand now, you know, the first product I created was an eyeliner.

A (34:08)

It's the best eyeliner. I'm not just saying it because you're sitting here. It is the best eyeliner.

B (34:13)

You know what's really interesting about that eyeliner is we have so much choice. There are thousands and thousands and thousands of eyeliners, brown eyeliners. So why is my eyeliner and this is just one product out of a huge selection of makeup that we have and skincare and fragrance. Why does my eyeliner sell more than any other eyeliner out there? Because the attention to detail, Emma. It was making sure it wasn't just a brown eyeliner. It was the perfect, perfect shade of brown. It was the perfect formula. It did what I needed it to do. I have the right amount of what I call play time to create the look. Then once it's there, it's there to stay. And people love those eyeliners. And for me, that's been the case with everything that I do. You know, we just launched foundation. That has been a phenomenal launch. I mean, I've got 25,000 people just on wait list for the foundation. Because you're out of so many.

A (35:14)

Do you feel vindicated? Like, even as you sit there and say that, having everything that you've happened in fashion, like, do you sit there and go, I knew it. Well, not like that, but, like, I knew it.

B (35:29)

I feel like I know what my customer wants because I am her, and I think that she has so much choice in fashion and beauty, and it's not about putting anything out there until I truly believe it's best in class. Even if you was to buy a white T shirt for me, is it the perfect white T shirt?

A (35:47)

It's the perfect white T shirt with

B (35:47)

the right neckline and the perfect sleeve and the perfect jersey. So it's paying attention to all those details.

A (35:53)

You know, I am such a champion of women in business. And when you launch beauty, like, I always feel like the best businesses are when there's zero explanation to me, you in beauty, you sitting there showing us how to do a smokey eye in your beautiful robe that's monogrammed in your towel. It's like, that is exact. I could just sit and watch those videos. I'm just like, you know, just like this. And I feel like it makes so much sense, but I feel like there has to be a part of you, because, I mean, I'm reading some crazy stuff about this beauty brand. And I'm not asking you to say it, but I read, like, a $700 million valuation out there. Like, you're clearly having an incredible trajectory with this brand, and I feel like there must just be a little part of you that goes, that's really lovely.

B (36:38)

I just genuinely love what I do, and I'm just scratching the surface. You know, it was only up until quite recently that anybody even realized that those tutorials that I do are me on my own. I've only just invested in a tripod because up until recently, I was just holding the camera up, the phone up

A (36:57)

myself, like, give her a lighter tripod.

B (37:00)

And so many people would comment, what's wrong with the other side of your face? And I'm. For the love of God, I'm doing it. I'm talking it. I'm showing and I'm holding.

A (37:08)

I'm also not actually an influencer, but I can get a tripod.

B (37:12)

But people thought I had a whole production team behind me. It's just me in my bathroom. The reason I've got a towel on my head is so I don't have to even blow dry my hair. Damn right. And it's just me saying, look, I'm not clearly not a model. I'm not a makeup artist. This is the why. And if I can do it, anyone can do it.

A (37:29)

Yep.

B (37:30)

Right.

A (37:30)

Do you have an awareness of how humble you come across? Because I feel like, you know, maybe I've been in the US for too long. Maybe it just says more about me. But I would feel so braggadocious if I was you. I would feel so pleased with myself and I'd be like, yes, I've done this, like, insane business and built this insane brand. You're so, like. You're just, like. So, like. I just love what I do and I get that. But is that a little bit of, like, the protectionist in you? Because you know that the minute you go, like. Like, the press is coming to get you.

B (38:07)

I don't know about that. I just think I've been through so much and. Yeah, I think it's just that, to be honest with you, and there's no guarantee. I'm really excited now because I do see the potential.

A (38:21)

Yes.

B (38:22)

And now, you know, now we're looking at retail for both fashion and beauty. You know, we have one flagship store, Dover street in London, which is just doing so phenomenally well. We know that that is the next chapter for the brand.

A (38:36)

Yes. It's a beautiful concept.

B (38:38)

Thank you. Retail, you know, global retail expansion. We know that is the next phase, and I'm excited for that. So I'm not sitting here feeling all, you know, Cocksure of myself. But I'm sitting here feeling really excited because I've worked really hard, and I'm not afraid of hard work. And I know it's gonna be a lot more hard work. I also just can't stand listening to assholes.

A (39:00)

Fair enough.

B (39:01)

You hear so many people. I mean, I listen to so many podcasts, and you just think, oh, my gosh, it's like, I would never wanna come across that way. Cause I'd like to think I'm not that person, you know?

A (39:12)

Fair enough. No, I think that's really fair. What does the future look like for you when you. Because of course, you're. There has to be an awareness of all the opportunity that's in front. You do have this beautiful retail concept. And to me, it's very easy to see, you know, flagship stores on the best streets in the world. You have this unbelievable beauty brand. And beauty, there's such a feverishness around beauty. So when you look into the future, what does brand Victoria Beckham look like?

B (39:38)

I am a founder and creative director of Victoria Beckham, the fashion brand. But I own my beauty brand. I own my fragrance company. That is not a license. Again, nothing wrong with that business model. But that's where I see the potential and the excitement that, you know, being a living founder that still owns the beauty and the fragrance really does open up incredible opportunities.

A (40:06)

I mean, so many opportunities. Do you ever see a day I just watched the most beautiful collection. I thought, Heida Ackerman, who come in for Tom Ford. Do you ever see a day where you won't be the creative director of Victoria Beckham?

B (40:20)

I don't know. I mean, I look at Tom Ford and. And, you know, people say to me, who do you look up to? Who do you find inspiring? I mean, no one has done it like Tom Ford. I mean, when you look at what he's achieved with both fashion and beauty and then ultimately selling his companies, and,

A (40:39)

I mean, billions and billions and billions of dollars.

B (40:42)

So I don't know. Let's see.

A (40:44)

No, I feel like Tom Ford is a really great, like, personal sort of like. Like North Star and reference point for you. Because, you know, there is so many. Like, when you look at those kind of two businesses and the trajectory that you went on, which is why I mentioned Heida. Cause, I mean, I looked at that collection and I was like, I need to buy every single piece. But it's a different time. I think that Tom has very famously said that after a certain age, you can't be a creative director. Of a women's wear brand. And I wonder if there's anything in you that goes, there will be a time to pass the bat on.

B (41:16)

Well, I think that. But I'm not there just yet. I think. Look, Tom was in the industry for much longer than I was. I mean, I first became aware of Tom Ford, you know, in the late 90s, early 2000s, when I was taking up all the Spice Girls budget and I was buying Gucci when he was the creative director over at Gucci. So I think he's been in the industry so much longer than I have. But I'm not there. I'm not there just yet. Because as I do get older, of course there's gonna be certain garments that maybe I don't want to wear as I'm getting older, but that doesn't mean that I don't know who the Victoria Beckham woman is.

A (41:56)

Yeah, 100%. Do you envisage a time when you would actually want to sell your brand and, like, go into a big group? Because, again, when you're at this kind of sweet spot, and I feel like this is one of the things that I've seen kind of over and over again, you can get too big to sell. You can get to the point where you limit the opportunities for acquisition because you're just so bloody big. And so I wonder if there's that piece of it in your mind, like, is there, like, some grand plan to eventually, like, exit and move to the country and help David with the chickens or something?

B (42:29)

My goodness. Look, I think that you don't know what's around the corner. The idea of a huge cash injection and ultimately what I could then do with the company. I'm always saying, you know, I can get quite impatient. And I'm always saying, I want to put my foot on the gas, I want to do more, I want to get bigger. I'm ambitious. I wanna do this, I wanna do that. I mean, like I said, I really am just scratching the surface. So the thought of being able to do that is not something that sometimes does not feel attractive. However, I'm proud of the fact that currently being independent gives me the freedom to do what I want to do. But I'm always just sit back and see what comes my way, see what happens.

A (43:13)

I mean, listen, when you have success, you have a lot of options. So it's just. Just like, just keep doing what you're doing, right? That's gonna give you the ability to pick and choose from all of the things that you could do with this Beautiful brand. I wanna ask you as somebody who works with their husband and understanding like this beautiful dynamic that you have with your husband, what's been so interesting is that seemingly, and as you say, you guys work together but you haven't disappeared into one another's identity. It's like you will turn up in Miami and support him. He is there supporting you all the time. How have you balanced that as people with like big goals, big ambitions, big profiles, like how do you like go home and just have a cup of tea and you know, I just, I wonder what that looks like.

B (43:59)

You know, we just, we've grown together and that is what I'm so proud of with our, with our marriage. We have grown together. We have educated ourselves and each other along the way. You know, neither of us.

A (44:12)

That's a nice place.

B (44:13)

We're particularly academic. You know, we've just surrounded ourselves with really smart people along the way and we've had to learn on the job, so we have that in common. And I wanna make David the best version that he can be of himself and he wants to do that with me. We fully support each other's dreams and ambitions. You know, we don't get involved with each other's businesses on a day to day. I mean, look, I'll show up and watch a football game, but I'm not gonna get in the dressing room and tell him what to do. You know, I'll be there to support him. Every now, you know, just before a show, he'll come into my pre production space and he'll give his opinion, Emma, of the collection.

A (44:53)

Lovely.

B (44:54)

And you know how that goes.

A (44:55)

I mean he's a fashionista, like, but

B (44:57)

you know how that goes. You're like, that's great, dude.

A (45:00)

Not right now.

B (45:01)

That's great, David.

A (45:02)

Move on.

B (45:03)

He doesn't tell me what to put in the collection. I don't tell him, you know, anything about the football side of things. So I think we really support each other, but we don't get overly involved.

A (45:15)

Yeah, I understand that. I mean it's interesting because people always say to me like, how do you work with your husband? And I'm like, well, we do work together, but we do very different things. I can go days in the office without ever even seeing Jens because we are just not across. Like he does what he does and I do what I do and it's actually very, very separate. We very rarely are actually collaborating on something together. But I do think that when you have an understanding and an appreciation of somebody professionally, it's so Amazing for a relationship because when you are someone who pours your everything into your profession and your work, it's like you need someone who's gonna get it. You need someone who understands you don't have a regular 9 to 5. And also I think it's just very healthy for a relationship when you just have, you know, you're not like in each other's pockets constantly.

B (46:05)

Totally. I mean, I think the two things that people read, realize about David Beckham, number one, he's incredibly smart. He has built incredible businesses. And so I do turn to him and ask advice because I respect what he has built. And the other thing is he's incredibly funny. Those two things people don't realize, I love them. They know he's handsome. They know he's a good dad.

A (46:27)

We know. We know he's really funny.

B (46:30)

He is not as funny as me.

A (46:32)

I mean, clearly. Obviously not. I have to say, like, that's the word on the street is that you're the funniest. No one goes like, david Beckham's so funny. They go, victoria Beckham's really funny.

B (46:42)

Thanks, Emma.

A (46:42)

Just saying. That's just what I've heard. I'm just telling you what I know.

B (46:45)

Well, that's why we're getting along so well. Cause I've heard that about you too.

A (46:49)

I actually don't know if I believe that. I don't know if anyone thinks I'm funny. They think I'm just a bit, you know, a lot. Just a lot. The thing that separates a business that actually scales from one that doesn't is often invisible to the customer. It's the friction at checking, the trust signal, the split second where someone decides whether to complete the purchase or close the tab. That's the kind of detail Shopify has built the platform around. If you ever shopped online and seen the purple button at checkout, that's called Shop Pay. It's Shopify's one click solution for faster, more secure transactions and fewer abandoned carts. For us at Good American, that translates directly into more completed orders and happier customers. For shopping is the small but real reason you actually finish the purchase instead of giving up halfway through. What I appreciate about Shopify is that everything you need to run a store lives in one place. I can open the app and quickly see what's moving, what's trending and where customers are coming from. It's all designed to remove the friction between attention and action. If you have an idea that you can't stop thinking about or you're already running a serious business. Shopify is where you take it to the next level. Level go to shopify.com aspire to get started now if you've been paying attention to the GLP1 conversation over the last year, you know how confusing it can feel. Different medications, different access points, different price ranges. It's a lot to navigate. That's where hers stands out. They offer access to a range of FDA approved GLP1 medications, including the Wegovy Pill and the Wegovy Penn. They've built the experience around, making the process clear instead of overwhelming. Everything is 100% online. Through hers, you connect with a licensed provider who determines if treatment is right for you. If prescribed, you get a treatment plan built around your needs. Hers offers unlimited dosage adjustments 24. 7 access to your care team, and a lifestyle and nutrition guidance to support steady progress over time. It's all designed to actually fit into your life. Ready to reach your goals? Visit fourhers.com aspire to get personalized affordable. That gets you that's F O R H E-R-S.com aspire for hers.com aspire weight loss by hers is not available in all 50 states. WeGovy is the registered trademark of Novo Nordisk as to get started and learn more, including important safety information, WeGovy clinical study information, and restrictions, visit fourhers.com. I wonder how you guys deal with things differently because it's obviously clear that whatever the both of you are doing, you're getting a lot of opinion from the outside world. How do you guys deal with the scrutiny differently? Do you have different ways of actually handling all the pressure that comes your way?

B (49:45)

My days of being overly bothered about what people say, that just doesn't serve me. You know, I also don't want to be an idiot and not aware, but it doesn't serve me to look at, you know, anything negative or find myself on Instagram looking at anything negative. I know how that would affect me. So I just used to not look at it, you know.

A (50:08)

So what do you do? Like you don't pick up a newspaper or look at social. Like you just.

B (50:13)

I have people around me that deal with that. And look, I don't want to be an idiot and not aware, but if someone's written something horrible or said something horrible, I have zero interest in looking at it. Look, I'm not saying that's always been the case, but that's where I am right now. You know, I want to do the best that I can do when I'm at work. I want to be Focused. I don't want it to kill my energy. And at home I want to be the best mum that I can be as well.

A (50:41)

Yeah, there has to be an element of self preservation at some point because otherwise you're just looking for problems.

B (50:47)

Yeah, absolutely.

A (50:48)

Yeah. Damn right. How do you even decide what remains personal and what is going to kind of become part of the broader brand Beckham?

B (50:59)

Do you know, when myself and David first met, it was never the intention to start a brand. You know, people talk about brand Beckham and that has happened so organically. You know, when I first met David, I mean, he was a brill cream boy. He was playing for Manchester United.

A (51:17)

I actually remember that deal.

B (51:18)

Right.

A (51:19)

I 100% remember that endorsement. I mean, first of all, the whole country was obsessed with David's hair. So it was a genius deal. But that is what I remember. Adidas and Braille cream. Every boy in that, every school had brill cream as a result, by the way, it's a great, great investment for them.

B (51:34)

Absolutely, absolutely. And so, you know, David was, you know, Adidas and brill cream and Pepsi. You know, I was in the Spice Girls and that's where I learned so much about how to build a brand, you know, and marketing. So whilst he was doing brill cream and Adidas, the Spice Girls were doing Walker's Crisps, Pepsi, Chuba, Chubs, Lollies, Deodorant.

A (51:59)

I mean, we were raking it in over there.

B (52:02)

Do you know, true story. My mother still has the Spice Girls pizza in her freezer.

A (52:07)

No, she does not. First of all, that's her mom right there. No, she. How proud do you. How proud can you possibly be?

B (52:15)

And slightly, slightly disgusted. I mean, that pizza's been in the fridge for 30 odd years. It's not good for my dad if she decides.

A (52:22)

No, no, let's hope she never pulls it out for him.

B (52:25)

Yeah, yeah, but so, you know, when people talk about brand Beckham, you know, that was never something that we together ever even discussed. David did what he did, I did what I do. And you know, like I said, we're just, we're a couple of builders. That's what we do, it's what we enjoy. You know, when I look at Crews, my little son, you know, Cruz, who's a musician, he's actually on tour at the moment. I said to cruise. The most important thing is to learn your craft, take your time, learn your craft. And he has spent years learning to play five or six different instruments, writing his own songs, putting a band together. He's Gone on tour, touring small venues, doing it in a very, very humble way. And he's incredibly talented, but he's learned his craft, he's building his brand. You know, that's just, that's just what we do.

A (53:21)

I mean, it's pretty amazing to think about the idea that you weren't like really trying to conceive of a brand Beckham. Because when I think about the best, and I do think about it like this, like talent led brands, because that's very much the industry I'm in. Brand Beckham is, is like one of the best. Like, if not the best, it's just like you have such a, you know, if I was coming in and working with you, like, you have such clarity of what you stand for, who you guys are, what you would choose, what your intent. Like, you're so intentional about everything. So it's amazing to think that you weren't, like, thinking about crafting that a lot more.

B (53:59)

You know, we don't have any deals together. David does what David does, I do what I do. We don't have any deals. Nothing. Really? No, nothing. And that's the way it's always been.

A (54:10)

Oh, I never thought about that. Not that. I mean, I've come to you with many, many things. Trying to put you guys in a deal together back in my old, like, brand broker days, that of course you turn absolutely everything down. That's so interesting. I'd never really thought of it in that way.

B (54:24)

Well, we have very different interests, you know, very different, very different things that, you know, that we do. So I think it was the outside world that really talked a lot about Brown Beckham. That's never really how we saw it. We're just doing what we do.

A (54:38)

So let's talk about. Because you do have this, like, unbelievably beautiful family. And I always think about raising kids and I'm doing it in a very different. You guys have such a spotlight on you and so much attention. But when you raise children who have a very different upbringing to you, I wonder how you guys have thought about that. Because even as you say, like encouraging Cruz to like, you know, double down and get really good at his craft, like, have you taught your children? Considering that, you know, you've. You've got these unbelievable careers and now you've got these four kids who seemingly, you know, it's like they're yours and you're like, you know, in this world and they've got all the kind of choice and opportunity. What does that even look like in your family?

B (55:23)

Do you know, I think that our children have had a very different upbringing to myself and David, no doubt. And I think the world is also a very different place now as to what it was when they were younger, you know, and we've always tried to protect the children as much as we can. We've always been very close. Communication is really key. You know, six o' clock at night, every night at our house. So long as neither of us are traveling, we always eat dinner together. We're quite a traditional family, more than people would recognize. Without even saying it, you know, we're not on our phones and we're all just talking about what's happened that, you know, during the day. So being very close is really, really important to us and just ultimate, you know, we want the kids to be hardworking, kind. I think that I've always wanted to be the best mom that I could be and look after the kids, but I also feel that it's been part of my job to really help them fulfill their full potential and for them to recognize what their sense of purpose is, you know, and with Cruz, for example, it was his music, and anything that I could do to support him, to encourage and to help him, that's my job as his mom. It's never about being pushy or forcing. It's being there to support. And so for Cruise, you know, he could have released a record years and years and years ago, but he knew it was really important to learn his craft, start from the ground up.

A (56:56)

I wonder how the scrutiny that you constantly face has shaped the type of mother that you are.

B (57:03)

I think that it's very different parenting adult children to parenting smaller children. And, you know, I'm just trying to do the best the best that I can, you know, and they grow up so quickly, and I just want them. Like I said, you just want to. It's my job to make sure that my kids are the best versions of themselves and that they feel fulfilled. You know, I always encourage them to dream big and then dream even bigger. My kids manifest. My kids have crystals beside their beds. And they know that they do have a responsibility as well because of the profiles that they have and how they can use that to do good in the world. That's really important as well, and to be really good people. You know, the greatest compliment, as you know, is when someone will say, I met your kids and they were great kids.

A (57:54)

Do you think that responsibility to live up to everything that you just said is a lot of pressure for your children?

B (58:02)

I suppose it must be to Be honest. I mean, look, Cruise is in the music industry, but he's a very different artist than what I was. You know, his music is. He's in a band. You know, it's alternative music. And what does success look like at an early stage is very different to what success looked like for me with the Spice Girls.

A (58:22)

And seemingly kind of impossible to live up to. Right?

B (58:25)

Yeah. And you know what? We don't put any pressure on our kids. We just want them to do what they love and to work hard and to be happy.

A (58:34)

Victoria, everyone has their own opinion of you and your family, but what has it actually been like raising a family in this level of public scrutiny and attention?

B (58:45)

It's very different now to what it used to be. Like, media is very different to what it is now.

A (58:50)

In what way?

B (58:51)

It was much more intense. And I think that as much as social media, you know, there's a negative side to that. There's also a really positive side of that. I mean, let's be honest, everyone thought I was a miserable bitch. For many, we did kind of think

A (59:04)

that maybe in England a little.

B (59:06)

Okay. But, Emma, why was that?

A (59:08)

Well, because of the one photo that we got served up of you. We never saw you sitting there having a laugh like that. I totally get it. The image that was portrayed was, in fact, an image that was portrayed. It was not something that you were in control of. Your narrative was managed for you.

B (59:24)

Exactly. You know, the story was told, the narrative was being led by the media, and the pictures were taken by paparazzi. And I think that's the great thing about. There's lots of negatives, as I said. But the great thing is I can take back that ownership. And that's another reason why I decided to do the documentary, is it was the right time for me to tell the story from my side, for me to own that narrative.

A (59:49)

If you could change anything, would you change something? Whereas it pertains to, like, how much attention there has been on you, I

B (59:58)

don't think I change anything because it's been a hell of a journey. But me and David are stronger because of that. I never thought anything would be easy. I've never expected anything to be easy. I was bullied a lot when I was at school. I was never used to people being particularly nice. So I was used to it. And it's made me who I am now.

A (60:22)

No, 100%. I thought about you a lot when I was coming here, because my kids are so little. And when I leave, you know, I have a 12, a 9 a 4 and a 4 and it goes, as you say, like so, so quickly. And you know, I look at my 12 year old now and he's having an entirely different life. You know, the girls come round. It feels to me like they're like 15, these 12 year old girls. It's like unbelievable. And my little babies are just so precious and as soon as they get to that age of four, my brain is like, oh my goodness, like maybe do I need another baby? Like this is so, so insane. But I know. Oh, wow. Don't worry, I'm not gonna ask you that question. I was really thinking just about the changing dynamics as your kids get. How does that feel for you right now? Because of course you're in a different stage in your career, your family's in a different stage. And I just wonder like, what are the big shifts for you guys as a family?

B (61:14)

Do you know? I think I'm really enjoying the stages that they're at right now. You know, I mean, Harper is gonna be 15 pretty soon and I cannot believe, I mean, 15, yeah, it's like

A (61:28)

a woman at this, like this, she is.

B (61:30)

And I'm so proud of all of the children. But you know, Harper, she's, she's very ambitious, she's got big dreams and she's very appropriate. She's very appropriate. But I don't know what I expected, to be honest. I mean, she's been sitting on my lap taking part in beauty development meetings ever since she was little.

A (61:50)

Isn't that incredible? I mean, what an apprenticeship for her. How do you protect your kids? You know, like the private side of your family when stories are circulating, like how are you even able to protect.

B (62:01)

I think that we're just very close and we talk and we talk and you know, I think that's the most, that's the most important thing. That's all that you can do and that's the way that we've always been and protect them as much as you can.

A (62:16)

I talk all the time about trade offs and the things that I'm not there for or the things that I'm unable to do in both the business and in family. And I just wonder what that looks like for you because so many people will be listening to this and being like, bloody hell, how does she do it? So like, how do you do it?

B (62:33)

Do you know? Well, I mean, look the same as you. There are trade offs and you know, I can't be at everything. You know, Harper had a school play the other day and you know, I was outside you know, on, you know, working, you know, watching the school production through the window, because I had deadlines, there were things that I had to do, and I tried to do the best that I can. You know, between myself and David, we tag team, but. But I think that the key is to not feel guilty. Just do the best that you can. I remember Diane von Fostenberg saying to me years ago, I said to her, diane, you are so incredibly successful. I mean, she's such an icon, Legend, a legend. One of my favorite people, you know, and you've had two incredible children. You know, how did you do everything? Did you feel guilty? And she said, guilt is such a. A negative emotion. It is pointless. And then she said, and darling, it's very aging.

A (63:35)

Yeah.

B (63:36)

And you loved her.

A (63:37)

Not guilty.

B (63:37)

Suddenly I loved her for that. Because as women, we do feel guilty. We do feel guilty if we can't be at drop off or pick up or at a school play or if we have to travel for work. But that's what we do. And our children ultimately, I believe, will be inspired by that. You know, Harper showed me a project that she did at the last week. They'd been asked to write a piece on who inspires them, and that could be anyone. And she chose me.

A (64:06)

Oh, that's just so darling.

B (64:08)

It was the sweetest thing.

A (64:11)

When you see her, like, actually, like, write your name and say you do, you just die.

B (64:16)

I felt so proud because, like you just said, I have not been at everything, because that's just like you said, there are trade offs. But the fact that she looks at me and finds it inspiring and recognizes that we have a great relationship. I've been the best mom, but then I've also followed my dreams and passions, and that is now what she wants to do. You know, Harper is her own little, you know, she's a little entrepreneur herself. And I love the fact she looks up to what I do and, you know, she's finding her own sense of purpose and what she wants to do.

A (64:58)

I mean, it's amazing. I was gonna ask you about Harper because she is watching and she has a front row seat watching you build this fashion and beauty empire. And I wonder, specifically, as a daughter, like, what do you hope Harper takes away from seeing you do all of this?

B (65:12)

Well, you know, she came to me two or three years ago, and she was really struggling with her skin. She used to have beautiful skin, but then, like all young girls, she was enticed by certain beauty brands, and she was putting a lot of product on her face that was not suitable for her skin and consequently ended up going to see a dermatologist because her skin was really, really bad. And I went through that journey myself. You know, I suffered with child acne, teenage acne, adult acne. I mean, every acne under the sun. I've been there, so I could really relate to her. And she said, you know, I really want to. I want to create a brand because I know what I want, what I can't find, and I don't want other people to have to go through what I have been through. And she came to me with a little PowerPoint presentation, which was incredible. I mean, she had two PowerPoint presentations. One about this brand that she wanted to create because she was struggling with her skin, and the other one was a reason as to why I should let her have a perm.

A (66:19)

Please tell me you only greenlit one of those presentations.

B (66:24)

We put the perm conversation to one side and it was very sweet because she genuinely had a point of view.

A (66:34)

She really did.

B (66:35)

She didn't want other people to struggle because she saw what she had done with her skin. And ever since she was tiny, she sat on my lap. She loves products, she loves formulas. You know, she's even helped me select colors sometimes when I've been working on color palettes. Girl.

A (66:52)

And she, you have to tell me, like, the presentation, what did the presentation look like?

B (66:57)

It was products that she had collected, things that she. That she liked.

A (67:04)

She's seen you. She just, like, she knows how this goes.

B (67:07)

She does, but she really, she could not find what she wanted that would be kind for her skin that was acne prone and that just did not exist. And she said, so I want to create that. Look, at the same time, she's still at school, she's studying her gcses, but that is her passion. That is what she wants to do.

A (67:29)

What was the.

B (67:30)

I was so interested to hear her reason. Why. Why does she want to do this? And she'd been through such a journey herself with her skin, and I could really relate to that, you know, that's amazing.

A (67:42)

Is she going as she going to launch a brand?

B (67:45)

I think she probably will. And obviously this is what I do. This is what I love. I mean, product development is. That's my thing.

A (67:52)

Listen, it's. Yeah, that's your sweet spot. I mean, I bet you'd love to kind of get in and solve all, all of those, like, past acne problems for you and for everybody else in there.

B (68:01)

Yeah, exactly.

A (68:03)

I mean, I think it's so interesting because, like, it or not, I feel that. I mean, I was obsessed with cosmetic products when I was a kid. You know, I would go to Boots and you'd try all the things and, you know, we had two. You know, it was like Clearasil or, I don't know, like some other, like, thing that would, like, just strip your skin. And as a black girl, you know, you'd wash your face and you'd be gray and it would just, like, strip all the oils out of your skin. It would be literally. And I remember, like, dreaming of coming up with an idea. Sadly, I didn't have the type of mother that would give that two seconds of thought, nor could she. But I think it's kind of amazing that she would pitch that type of thing to you. And the idea that you could bring this brand to life is amazing.

B (68:48)

If I can support her dreams and her passions like I can the other kids, I want to do that. I think there's a difference between supporting as opposed to pushing.

A (68:59)

I said brand Beckham, not because I know you don't think about it in that way, but this feels like an extension to your world and to your brand. Like, to have your kids involved in what is like your family empire.

B (69:13)

I mean, we joke about it and I say, david, how strong are my genes? There's no footballers. We're singing, we're dancing, we're doing beauty. We're all creative, we're all singing and dancing.

A (69:23)

And so is there, like, are there imminent plans for this brand to come out or do I just have to, like, hold my breath and wait?

B (69:29)

We'll just have to wait. Wait and see.

A (69:36)

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B (70:36)

Let's be honest.

A (70:36)

Finding supplements you actually trust really can feel like a lot. There's so much out there and it's not always clear what you're really getting. That's why I try to be intentional about what I add into my routine. And Symbiotica is one I like because the focus is simple, clean, science backed ingredients that your body can actually absorb. One that stands out to me is their nad. It supports cellular energy and overall vitality, which for me just translates to feeling, feeling more steady day to day. I also like how easy it is to take. Everything comes in these single use pouches so that you can take it straight or mix it into whatever you're drinking. No pills, no extra steps. And that's really the point. It's not about adding more to your routine. It's about choosing things that actually support how you want to feel. Go to symbiotica.com aspire to get 20% off plus free shipping. That's cycling. Y-M B I O T I K A.com aspire for 20% off plus free shipping. Before we come to a finish, I want to talk to you just a little bit about legacy.

B (71:46)

Okay.

A (71:46)

Because you have built such an incredible business and an incredible family and I think that so many people look up to you. So when you think about legacy, what is, does that even, does it have any meaning to you? Do you give it a second thought?

B (72:01)

Well, for me, I want to build a brand that will outlive me. You know, it started with girl power and empowering young girls and boys in music, and now it's about empowering people through fashion and beauty. And I would definitely like that to outlive me. I want to make women feel, feel like the best, most empowered version of themselves, you know?

A (72:29)

And you're doing that.

B (72:30)

Thank you.

A (72:32)

Is there a part of you that goes, it's working like I'm doing exactly what I set out to do?

B (72:39)

Yes, I do feel that way. I feel so proud. I really do, because it hasn't, it hasn't been easy. If anybody can look at my journey as someone who has genuinely been the underdog and, and think, well, maybe I can do that. I would encourage anyone to dream big and then dream even bigger. And if I can do it. If you're not afraid to put in the hard work, then anyone can do it.

A (73:06)

Yeah, I feel like your whole life and career is testament to that. Following the documentary, do you feel like there was a perception shift that people think and look at you a little bit differently?

B (73:15)

There was something quite liberating about both documentaries because I say I went into the process a control freak and came out a reformed control freak because I did not have. I didn't have sign off. I didn't have control. And so that was quite daunting for me at the beginning. But I knew that was the way that it had to be so that it was honest, you know, it was not a vanity project. So I had to put myself in the hands of the people that I trusted. And it was actually the night of the premiere, someone said to me, are you nervous because I hadn't seen the show? And I said, you know what? I'm not. Because if I'm an then I deserve to come across as one. Let's be honest, is what it is at this point.

A (73:55)

I mean, you said it. I don't think that's what happened. But it's interesting to have that kind of like, you know, I've done it, I've put it out into the world and that's it. Yeah, I understand that. When you think about women sitting at home listening to this conversation with their own dreams and aspirations, some at the beginning of their career, some that are potentially thinking about reinvention, what do you want to say to people about the ability to, like, live an ideal life, about success, about living the life of their dreams? What have you learned over all these years?

B (74:26)

I have followed my dreams, and I'm so glad that I did and that I wasn't scared to do it. You know, I had my children and I was in a fortunate position to be able to go back to work. I appreciate that that is not always the case, but if you have the opportunity, don't feel guilty. There's nothing wr with, you know, with doing what you want to do and what feels right for you and following your dreams. And I'm so glad that I did that because I think if I hadn't have done, I'd be waking up at my age really regretting that. Really regretting that.

A (75:08)

I wonder what you're dreaming about now that might surprise people.

B (75:12)

Oh, a glass of wine.

A (75:13)

You and me both.

B (75:14)

Fave or tequila?

A (75:15)

I mean, I don't like tequila wine. What's your type of.

B (75:19)

Well, I will either have a tequila or a red wine. How about you? What do you.

A (75:22)

I am A tequila or a red wine, too.

B (75:24)

Oh, nice.

A (75:26)

I'm gonna move into rapid fire before tequila. It's like, I'm really shit at rapid fire, by the way, because I'm so long winded. Feel like, you know, do whatever you want. Okay, so rapid fire. What is one part of your business that you've had to get better at whether you like it or not? I mean, I had to get better at so many things. Do you know what I had to. To get better at? Not losing my shit? Like, that was my thing. And I say it quite openly. I had to learn to not be a hot head.

B (75:52)

Do you know, that's very true. Because that was some advice that someone gave me, actually, is that we have to be really mindful of how we deliver sometimes news that someone doesn't want to hear because it really affects people because they care what we think.

A (76:07)

It's really true and it stays with people.

B (76:09)

It does. There you go.

A (76:11)

We've learned. So this is funny. What is your most used phrase in a fit in or a product review?

B (76:17)

Oh, my gosh. I don't know. These are really difficult.

A (76:21)

No, I'm so sorry.

B (76:22)

Oh, my gosh. I can't think of that.

A (76:24)

What do you say all the time? Or just what do you say all the time in any situation?

B (76:29)

Oh, my God. I don't know. Just like.

A (76:30)

I know. Okay, can I just tell you what one like.

B (76:32)

Okay, well, do you feel like the

A (76:33)

word vibes is really overused? I'm like, that's a vibe. Good. Great vibe. Yeah, I'm feeling that vibe. I'm like, can you just never say that again? I'd like to erase that from my vocabulary.

B (76:42)

Okay. Okay. Now, what do I say most? I mean, I probably can't actually say it to.

A (76:48)

Fair enough.

B (76:48)

Fair enough.

A (76:49)

I'll take that as the answer. I'll take that as the answer. How does the control freak in you let loose and lose control?

B (76:57)

Oh, gosh. I mean, all of us Beckhams, we, you know, we really do. We love music. So music is on in the house first thing in the morning. And yeah, I mean, I really enjoy. Me and David really enjoy going out, having a drink or sometimes on a Friday night, if the weather permits, sitting, you know, in his vegetable patch, listening to music with a glass of wine. That's our favorite thing to do.

A (77:23)

Heaven. I mean, we saw it. We saw it firsthand. We were all obsessed. You were like, look at them two. Have a little moment. Have a little dance. And just, like, next to the carrot, you know, romantical. All right, what's one rule that you live by when it comes to money?

B (77:37)

I'm still very mindful of what things cost. I mean, don't ask me how much a pint of milk costs, cause I won't know the answer to that. But I am unmindful. You know, I will still walk out of a room and turn the lights off because that's how I was brought up, you know. So I am still mindful of what everything costs. And I'm not particularly wasteful.

A (77:57)

I really do know what the milk costs because I'm so cheap. But I love that you say that because that waste just really frustrates me. Is there a book that has changed your life?

B (78:07)

Oh my gosh. Do you know, I didn't read for so many years because I am self diagnosed dyslexic and dyscalculic.

A (78:15)

And I did not know that you were dyslexic. I'm dyslexic too.

B (78:18)

Oh, really?

A (78:19)

I mean, so many founders. But that's interesting that you're dyslexic.

B (78:23)

And I didn't know really up until, you know, obviously seeing what my children have been through through their academic journeys. And so for so long, I didn't read because I was scared of books. You know, I had a teacher at school who told me that I was sick because I couldn't read because, you know, when I was at school, dyslexia wasn't something that was recognized. So I was so scared of books for so many years. And you know, only the last few years have I really learned to enjoy books. And I. The secret.

A (78:53)

Oh, it's a good one. That's a very like manifesting creative visualization energy. Vibes. Vibes, yes.

B (79:03)

I love that. And it's true. Do you know? Funny little story. Not so funny at the time. I'm scared of lifts. I got stuck in a lift. I manifested it. Emma, what are you gonna do?

A (79:13)

Actual factual facts. You did. You did as I manifested you. So it works both ways. I mean, literally could be good, could be bad. I'm so happy that you say that you started reading books. Cause I feel like it's such a beautiful, joyful thing of life. And this is not in my rapid fire questions, but just because I'm obsessed with dyslexia. And actually how many successful people have dyslexia? Do you have an awareness of the superpowers that you've developed as a result of your dyslexia? Meaning that because you can't do certain things or you struggle with certain things that you found ways around it and they're actually like amazing.

B (79:46)

Probably not aware of them. I think that we just find the tools within ourselves to open, overcome the problems that we have. Right.

A (79:54)

I think that you probably have so many things that you're so amazingly good at because you struggled and you just didn't know. I was undiagnosed at school as well. And I just, I think it's fascinating that so many successful people are. All right, last question. My last question. What are you aspiring to in your life right now?

B (80:14)

Oh, gosh, I aspire to be the best mom, continue to be the best mom that I can be, the best wife, and to really now truly build the fashion and beauty house that I dreamt of. You know, a legacy brand, a brand that will outlive me, that will make other people feel like the most empowered, powerful, beautiful version of themselves.

A (80:40)

I think you're doing that.

B (80:41)

Thank you very much.

A (80:42)

Congratulations on all your success.

B (80:43)

Thank you. You too. Thank you so much.

A (80:50)

If you're loving this podcast, be sure to click follow on your favorite listening platform. While you're there, give us a review and a five star rating and share an episode you loved with a friend. We'll be so grateful. Aspire with Emma Greed is presented by Audacy. I'm your host, Emma Greed. Executive producer Ashley McShan, Derrick Brown and me. Our executive producers from Audacy, Leah Reese, Dennis, Asha Saluja, Lauren Legrosso Producer KK Sublime. Stephen Key is our senior producer. Sound design and engineering by Bill Schultz. Angela Peluso is our booker. Original music by Charles Black Video production by Evan Cox, Kirk Courtney, Andrew Steele and Carlos Delgado. Social media by Olivia Homan, Kathryn Bale Special thanks to Brittany Smith, Sydney Ford, my teams at the lead company and wma. Maura Curran, Josephina Francis, Hilary Schuff, Eric Donnelly, Kate Hutchinson, Rose, Tim Meekol, Sean Cherry and Lauren Vieira. If you have questions for me, you can DM me at Aspire with Emma Greed. Greed is spelled G R E D E. That's Aspire A S P I R E with Emma Greed. Or you can submit a question to me on my website. Emagreed me.

B (82:09)

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