War with Iran, and Award Shows in This Political Moment

Summary

Assembly Required with Stacey Abrams

Episode 74: War with Iran, and Award Shows in This Political Moment

Date: March 3, 2026
Guests: Sam Sanders (host of the Sam Sanders Show), Hunter Harris (Let Me Say This podcast, Substack "Hung Up")

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Main Theme

This episode explores the intersection of politics, war, and culture amid the backdrop of the U.S. and Israel’s war with Iran and the upcoming Oscars. Stacey Abrams leads a conversation about how political events—especially authoritarian actions and war—impact not only democratic norms but also the narratives presented in art and media. Abrams, Sanders, and Harris discuss how films, award shows, and the entertainment industry reflect, resist, or reinforce the political currents of our time.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Opening: The War With Iran and America's Drift Toward Autocracy

(03:00 – 15:45)

• Stacey Abrams sets the tone by acknowledging the gravity of the U.S. and Israeli attack on Iran, including the murder of Iran’s Ayatollah, and the lack of congressional or public accountability.
• She draws parallels between past wars (especially Iraq in 2003) and the current dynamic, arguing that autocrats count on public outrage followed by apathy:

  "One of the ways authoritarians destroy democracy at home is by flouting it where consequences are more remote, by fomenting foreign wars and ignoring domestic obligations." – Stacey Abrams (08:40)

• Abrams underscores the interconnectedness of culture and politics, stating that narratives—whether in film or foreign policy—shape and mirror who we are and who has power.

2. Transition: Why Discuss the Oscars Now?

(15:45 – 16:25)

• Abrams defends the episode’s pivot to Oscars talk, stating:

  "The continuum of politics and culture means that we have to understand all of it for it to affect any of it." – Stacey Abrams (15:49)

3. The Oscars: Ideology, Ownership, and Political Narrative

(16:25 – 38:11)

Hollywood’s Political Roots & Trump Era Dynamics

• Sam Sanders opens by affirming the show's premise that culture and politics are deeply linked—highlighting Trump’s origins in reality TV and entertainment:

  "Trump is a creature and a creation of reality TV and Hollywood...so much of his playbook is a reality TV playbook." – Sam Sanders (16:53)

• Hunter Harris and Sanders examine how this Oscar season features more films with explicit political undertones—including issues of race, creative ownership, and anti-authoritarianism.
• Notable films discussed:
  • Sinners (Black ownership and resistance against cultural imperialism)
  • One Battle After Another (Black revolutionaries, anti-white-supremacist themes)
  • Just an Accident (Iranian refugees)
  • The Secret Agent (Brazilian dictatorship)
• Panelists recall the electrifying SAG Awards moment when “Sinners” won Best Cast:

  "There was such a feel good moment when Delroy Lindo was on the stage...and said, 'This moment is anointed. This film is anointed. This cast is anointed.'" – Hunter Harris (20:55)

Hollywood Ownership & Systemic Change

• The groundbreaking Ryan Coogler deal for Sinners: after 25 years, all rights revert to Coogler (27:11).

  "When that was made public, Hollywood gatekeepers scoffed, questioned it... Ryan securing his ownership seems like a no brainer and a template for creatives going forward." – Sam Sanders (27:34)

• Both panelists discuss Hollywood’s power structures:
  • Mergers and buyouts threaten independent voices and politically engaged storytelling in favor of recycled IP and business-safe content (30:12–31:28).
  • The resurgence of "bad men" (e.g., Brett Ratner) signals a Hollywood culture reverting to regressive norms under right-wing political pressure (31:15).

Award Shows and Political Discourse

• Both guests voice disappointment that more celebrities didn't address political issues (Iran, ICE, authoritarianism) at the SAG Awards, but acknowledge the symbolic significance when politically bold films succeed.
• Abrams links this directly to her work on the "Ten Steps to Autocracy" campaign, noting that controlling narratives—both news and cultural stories—is key to authoritarian strategy (32:02).

International Films & Broadened Narratives

(38:13 – 47:19)

• Abrams highlights a wave of international films gaining recognition (e.g., Cutting Through Rocks [Iran], The Voice of Hain Rajab [Palestine]) and how culture can disrupt authoritarian narratives.
• Harris points out how the Academy’s expanded international membership—now 1 in 5 voters—is broadening what’s seen as possible in mainstream American culture (42:59).

  "A lot of American pop culture that we think is just American has quietly and loudly become increasingly international." – Hunter Harris (42:59)

Politics, Media Fragmentation & the Lasting Power of Touchstones

• Panelists discuss the loss of "monoculture" and the role of award shows and events like the Super Bowl as rare unifying cultural touchpoints in a fragmented media landscape (48:56–51:37).
• Sanders reflects on Trump’s dominance of the "monoculture," and why the Oscars’ moments of shared attention can serve as needed counterweight:

  "He wants to seem bigger than he really is...which is why I think it’s important to find other monoculture moments that you can glom onto...just to offer a rebuke." – Sam Sanders (54:57)

The Oscars: Merit, Myth, and Counter-Monoculture

• Sanders is skeptical about the Oscars as an institution (origin as anti-union), yet argues they still deliver critical cultural moments and set industry precedent (54:57–59:47).

  "When Hollywood and the Oscars industrial complex are firing on all cylinders, it gives you the most feel good you can possibly see on a TV screen." – Sam Sanders (54:57)

• The panel connects film narratives with societal change—citing Brokeback Mountain and how art can drive national policy conversations, regardless of whether it wins (59:47–60:16).

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• On autocracy and distraction:

  "But our obligation as Americans is to set a standard that is hard to meet, not one that is simple and morally flexible." – Stacey Abrams (11:05)

• On Trump & Hollywood:

  "He is a 1980s TV star who by, you know, by any true metric should be like a Bravo housewife by now. Instead, he's in the White House. So his idea of what culture is, is a lot more old fashioned than I think you would think." – Sam Sanders (45:54)

• On cultural ownership:

  "Hollywood in this moment, under this rightward energy from Trump and his friends...are resuscitating the careers of bad men who were MeToo’d." – Hunter Harris (31:28)

• Oscars as counter-monoculture:

  "Celebrities still give us something. Movies still give us something. And in this moment of nonstop Donald Trump monoculture, we kind of need that." – Sam Sanders (54:57)

• Hunter Harris advice:

  "Stop expecting other people to make choices for you. Make your own choices." – Hunter Harris (64:05)

• Sam Sanders advice:

  "Don’t wait for a yes. Just decide to do it yourself." – Sam Sanders (60:58)

• On art, activism, and authoritarianism:

  "To the extent that movies and TV and entertainment media can prompt conversations that then change policy, that is still true." – Hunter Harris (59:01)

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Actionable Takeaways & Listener “Homework”

(Summary of final segment, 59:47–end)

• Be curious: Check out Sam Sanders’s and Hunter Harris’s independent journalism and storytelling.
• Support independent media: Seek out and uplift independent filmmakers and diverse voices. Specific organizations: Chicken & Egg Films, NAACP, GLAAD.
• Do good: Support humanitarian organizations addressing war casualties in Iran/Middle East: Doctors Without Borders, UNICEF.
• Embrace agency: Create and amplify underrepresented art, and make personal career and creative choices rather than waiting on gatekeepers.

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Conclusion

This episode articulates how politics and culture perpetually intertwine, especially in moments of crisis. The conversation examines films as more than entertainment—they are battlegrounds for narrative, belonging, resistance, and mythmaking. The current political climate, award show controversies, and the struggle for creative ownership all reflect deeper fights over who controls the story of America and its future. Through it all, Abrams and her panelists issue a call: consume critically, create independently, and refuse to yield the culture to authoritarian forces.

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Top Moments Quick Reference:

• War with Iran, autocracy in the U.S. (03:00–15:45)
• Why politics + Oscars must be discussed together (15:49)
• Hollywood mirrors/current events – the Trump factor (16:53)
• Oscars and political film nominees (19:34–22:57)
• "Sinners" and the question of ownership (27:11–29:32)
• Hollywood, mergers, MeToo regression (30:12–31:28)
• Rising international influence in the Oscars (42:59–44:43)
• Media fragmentation & monoculture (48:56–51:37)
• Oscars as an imperfect but vital touchstone (54:57–59:01)
• Advice for reclaiming culture and personal agency (60:58–64:05)

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If you missed this episode, you missed an urgent, nuanced look at how our wars—on the battlefield and on the screen—shape what America is and might become.

Transcript

[Sam Sanders]

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[Stacey Abrams]

Select homes only day or night. VRBoCare is here 24. 7 to help make every part of your stay seamless. If anything comes up or you simply need a little guidance, support is ready whenever you reach out from the moment you book to the moment you head home. We're here to help things run smoothly because a great trip starts with the right support. And hey, a good playlist doesn't hurt either. Welcome to Assembly Required with Stacey Abrams from Crooked Media. I'm your host, Stacey Abrams. Culture creates politics. Who we think we are dangerous dictates what we value, and it often predicts who we put in charge, who we punish, and what we celebrate. Once a year, we enter into a season where our culture is judged by the products it puts on screen. And that's why today's episode is a deep dive into the Oscars. We'll be talking about the nominations, what got platformed, what was ignored, and why this year's ceremony was moves unmistakably political undertones into stereo. From vampires to battlefields to antiheroes taking center stage, the oscars recap a 2025 no one has fully processed, and it gives us hints about what's to come. Guiding us today are our panelists Sam Sanders, host of the Sam Sanders show on kcrw, and Hunter Harris from the Let me say this podcast and the substack column hung up. They are cultural experts and proud movie buffs who will help us understand how the Oscars reflect and project our times, even from Shakespearean England and what we may have missed in the background. But first, we cannot enter this week of cinematic and cultural analysis without understanding the theater of war playing out half a world away. The decision by American and Israeli leaders to attack Iran will have reverberations for decades and across multiple nations. The killing of the Ayatollah, the religious and political leader of Iran's theocracy, has been confirmed, but not much else about why we attacked or what comes next is actually known. Now, I am not a pundit or a commentator, but I am an American citizen active in the political life of her country. For the past 30 years, I have been focused on democracy. At one point, a good friend challenged me to better understand the international dimensions of that topic. To know what is happening abroad could help my work here at home. So, being a nerd, I structured an intentional study of foreign policy comprised of fellowships, scholarships and policy visits. Eventually, as one of Georgia's highest ranking Democrats when I was minority leader. As a grad student, I co authored a study on the sociopolitical infrastructure of Brazil. And as a young lawyer, I participated in fellowships to understand Russia before Putin was put his autocracy into practice. I studied the international implications of youth civic engagement in Colombia and Liberia, and I was an East Asian Studies Fellow looking at diplomacy during the rise of China. Over the intervening years, I visited more than 20 countries, trying to expand how my domestic focus on democracy could be enhanced by visiting countries as diverse as Australia, Italy, Nigeria, Rwanda, Korea, and Taiwan. As a member of several bodies that focus on international affairs, I am deeply committed to a robust and thoughtful understanding of foreign policy. And it is why America's recent decisions to end USAID and strip vital funding from allies has been of the deepest concern to me. But it was my visit to the Middle east in the early 2000s that has me most worried. Today, members of Congress will debate the decision by this Republican authoritarian regime to declare war on Iran without authorization. Economists will evaluate the implications of the closure of the Strait of Hormuz, which accounts for one fifth of of all oil exports. Foreign policy experts will predict the fallout of a call for regime change without the careful building of a democratic opposition poised to take power. And especially given this administration's decision to gut our diplomatic core and our nation building apparatus, what happens next is a mystery. And over the next few months we will all find ways to discuss the above. But three days into war, I want to train our attention on hypocrisy and distraction. You see, one of the ways authoritarians destroy democracy at home is by flouting it where the consequences are more remote by fomenting foreign wars and ignoring domestic obligations. But let's think back to 2003. You see, when current events gave seemingly plausible justification for war, then President George W. Bush still sought authorization before embarking on the war on Iraq. Yes, the evidence was flimsy and fell apart. And yes, the early declarations of victory turned into a protracted fight that continues to reverberate across that region. But at least he asked. Donald Trump, Marco Rubio, Stephen Miller, and Pete Hegseth have appointed themselves a quartet impervious to accountability it started with the earlier bombing of Iran, then the kidnapping of Maduro from Venezuela and the embargo that is choking off resources to Cuba. Arguments will be made about the native good of America's military adventurism, that Maduro was a repressive thug who stole elections and the Ayatollah did oversee the back half of 50 years of brutal oppression. That these are despicable men, unworthy of their power is absolutely true. And yet it is easy to justify these violations of our laws because the ends seem to warrant the betrayal of our values. But our obligation as Americans is to set a standard that is hard to meet, not one that is simple and morally flexible. We have a Congress for a reason, in order to hash out arguments of fact and intention, using the representative voices to speak for the myriad of concerns raised by Americans who don't have the platform. You see, I remember the debate about declaring war in Iraq, and I personally vehemently disagreed from my platform as a citizen in Atlanta, and I recall heated fights with dear friends about why I thought it was ill fated and wrong. But when Congress voted, the majority there spoke for the majority of Americans. And when President Obama won in 2008, in part due to his strident opposition to the war, the majority spoke again. But in the current Trump Republican regime, Americans don't get a say. We're told to shut up and accept that autocracy knows best. Indeed, beyond bypassing Congress, our government hasn't even offered the public a clear and credible explanation for why it is risking American lives and treasure to depose leaders overseas. Today we have unaccountable leaders who believe they can wage war on their own but are not to be questioned. They can kill with impunity and rampage without consequence in our name, but there are consequences. Already multiple reports confirm that at least 150 children have been killed, including at a girls elementary school. The UN agency dedicated to education put out a statement that should chill us all. The killing of pupils in a place dedicated to learning constitutes a grave violation of the protection afforded to schools under international humanitarian law. Wars cost lives, and no one should be allowed to wage war in our names without our consent. No one should be permitted to ignore atrocities at home like the incarceration of children at Dilley or hiding Epstein pedophile perpetrators while promising liberation in a foreign land. No one should be able to force leadership change in a sovereign nation while attempting to seize elections at home. And yet, that's exactly what is unfolding as more news comes at us about the war in Iran. Trump and his fellow Republicans expect us to do what we've done since January 2025 engage in immediate outrage and then settle back into uneasy ambivalence. Be unhappy but inert, concerned but paralyzed. That's what authoritarians count on. And the 10 steps to overthrowing democracy, the unchecked expansion of executive authority, and the weakening of Congress go hand in hand. Yes, at the midterms we will have a chance to tilt the balance of power, but what happens in between will absolutely set the scene. As we transition into a conversation about films and narratives, I wanted to take this moment to remind us that war is a question of culture too. How do we see ourselves, and what will we do to tell our story? Now is the time to start getting it right. When we come back, my conversation with Sam Sanders and Hunter Harris. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. March is Women's History Month and that includes International Women's Day opportunities to recognize women's strength and progress. I celebrate the brilliant women in my family, my mother, sisters, nieces and aunts who lead remarkable lives dedicated to service to others and are a constant source of inspiration and support. But being the bedrock of our families and our communities and can often take a toll. And not everyone has the time to take care of themselves in the way they deserve. Therapy can help by teaching us to create balance, set healthy boundaries and support overall well being for everyone. That's where BetterHelp comes in. The first step is finding a therapist who's the right fit. BetterHelp does the initial matching work for you so you can focus on your therapy goals and a short questionnaire helps identify your needs and preferences and their 12 plus years of experience and industry leading. Match fulfillment rate means they typically get it right the first time. 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[Sam Sanders]

Thank you.

[Hunter Harris]

It's so good to be here.

[Sam Sanders]

I'm so excited.

[Stacey Abrams]

Well, I'm delighted to have you both here. I want to preface this by saying in my opening I acknowledge that America and Israel have launched a war against Iran. And some might think that the topic of our show today is frivolous by comparison. But I want to argue that the continuum of politics and culture means that we have to understand all of it for it to affect any of it. And so with that as a preface, let's talk about the Oscars.

[Hunter Harris]

Yes.

[Sam Sanders]

Okay.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah.

[Stacey Abrams]

So the most famous film award show in the world will happen in a week's time and a lot of the films nominated have political undertones, or I would argue they make outright ideological statements. And so, Sam, I want to start with you and then go to Hunter. How are you thinking about the ceremony this year in the context of what's happening in the world and given this particular state of the case and the slate of nominees that we have?

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah, yeah. Well, first, to echo your first statement, it is critical to understand Trump and what he's doing right now, especially by knowing that he is a creature and a creation of reality TV and Hollywood. Right. This is a guy who learned all of his tricks from performing for cameras. And so I always think it is helpful to have a conversation about media, culture and entertainment intersect with talking about politics and Trump, because that's where he came from. So much of his playbook is a reality TV playbook. This dude would have left us all alone if he had just gotten a job to produce a Broadway show a few decades ago. To understand him and what he's doing, you need to understand the entertainment industry. So I think you're spot on to say it's connected. After that, I will say that I am very, very, very interested, intrigued and pleased in the way in which this Oscar season has become a direct conversation about politics, race, and creative ownership. You know, one battle after another is about activism. You're never quite sure what kind, but it is right. And Sinners is a film all about who gets to own black art, how powerful is black art, and what does it mean to be a creative who owns what you have and if a big picture out of that. So much of what Trump is trying to do right now is centered around who gets to own what does he get to own Venezuela and their oil? Does he get to own Iran? Does he get to own so many other parts of the world? Sinners is asking questions of ownership that I think can be extrapolated to global politics right now. I've rambled now, but all this to say I've been happy with this Oscars season. I think it has been a moment in which people on the trail and in the lead up to the Oscars have talked directly about race and politics. Especially if you watched the Sags last night, you know, one of the opening sketches where the cast of Abbott elementary was referencing each of the nominees, you had one of the characters, James, directly referencing white movies and black movies and race and like, yeah, it's there. We're talking about it. And that feels good. That feels good.

[Stacey Abrams]

Well, Hunter, you talked about the SAG Awards before we went on air, and you referenced your reaction to it. So can you talk a bit about how you see and saw the SAG Awards and now the upcoming Oscars in this intersection between award shows and the political climate.

[Sam Sanders]

Yeah, I mean, I think we've all been sort of wondering how celebrities on the red carpet or at award shows and in their speeches maybe could react to this political moment. Especially when, I mean, I think most of the nominated films in every category are in some way dealing with, like, a political moment that feels very fraught. I mean, of course, one battle after another is as much about, like, black revolutionaries as it is about, like, white supremacists with the. What are they called? The Christmas defenders in that movie. And then on the other side, it's like, you know, the Jafar Panahi movie is, like, about Iranian refugees. The secret agent is about, like, Brazil's military dictatorship. So on all sides, I think we're thinking about politics both in the US and globally with the nominated movies this year. But I was curious at the SAG Awards both how few people spoke out or how few people really met any political moment other than just wearing ice out pins. But then at the same time, it does feel like a really huge accomplishment that a movie like Sinner's that is made by and for and about black creatives, as Sam said, does win a pretty major precursor to the Oscars.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah. And it was so wild to see, you know, Sinners getting best cast. Sure. Yes, do it. Michael B. Jordan getting best actor.

[Sam Sanders]

Yeah.

[Hunter Harris]

That says a lot about how much Hollywood, I think, wants to support this film. They want to support this film. There was such a feel good moment when Delroy Lindo was on the stage with that whole cast as they won best cast and said, this moment is anointed. This film is anointed. This cast is anointed. And I knew that something had shifted in the Oscars race when Kristen Bell came back on stage after his speech and said, ooh, I still feel the electricity. The room liked the electricity. And Oscars voters, they vote for movies, but they also vote for moments. I think a lot of Oscars voters are like, oh, I would love to recreate that moment on stage at the Oscars. Why not?

[Stacey Abrams]

I mean, look, I felt that moment, you know, as a family that grew up in Mississippi. My parents and, you know, four of my brothers and sisters and I with all of my nieces and nephews, we went to see the Sinners as a family. And I will tell you that every beat from the duality of smoke and stack to the interpolation of music and race and politics were spot on. I know a lot of Folks in the audience sort of reacted to the Chinese family. And I thought about the fact that I grew up with a Vietnamese community because we grew up on the coast. And that intersection of race, that complexity of race in Mississippi has always been a part of who we are. And so for me, you know, the movie is this allegory not just for white supremacy and cultural imperialism, but it's also a reminder of just how complex and how constant what's happening in Mississippi is as a reflection of this larger conversation we're having. And, you know, it's kind of eerily familiar today as we're watching this president and his cabinet and this Republican regime play out. So I'd love for both of you to talk about what else resonated for you and what caught you off guard about the movie.

[Sam Sanders]

Well, can I start? Because, Sam, I want to go back to something that you said about how much Centers is about black ownership and how in this moment, where it feels like America's trying to take ownership of Iran and Venezuela. But I think it extends in some way, you know, culturally, that Trump is trying to, you know, specify and sort of, in some ways, you know, draw walls around what it means to be an American, what it means to be a citizen, obviously, and what his idea of culture is and how, you know, that we should all subscribe to that. And at the same time, I think Sinners really rejects that, that whatever you think is American, Southern, you know, musically, culturally, that that belongs to all of us and that we all can take pride in an idea of America that maybe is not reflected back to us by the White House at this moment, which I think is really powerful.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah. Yeah. I am obsessed with the ways in which Centers complicates most Americans idea of what the south was during that time. Yes. So many movies about black people in that part of the country during that decade. It's just about black suffering and pain. And it's actually more about the white people who inflict the pain than it is about the black people. And what Sinners refuses to do is make itself black trauma porn. Even when the vampires are, like, killing them, it doesn't happen till the very end. And it's kind of short, you know. And this movie also complicates most people's understandings of race during that time. You know, we think of race up until, like, I don't know, until Dr. King had a dream. It's just, like, binary and static. White people, black people. White people hurt. Black people. Black people get hurt. They march, freedom. But there was Always a diversity in the south that Ryan Coogler's movie spoke to. There were Irish people in the South, There were Chinese people in the South. There were all kinds of people in the South. And to see Ryan speak to that in a historically accurate way, I found that particularly compelling. You know, I have questions about this film. I think with all of Ryan Coogler's projects, and I am a big fan of his. Sometimes he veers eerily close to After School Special energy when he's, like, making the point plain. And I'm not sure that Sinners is fully a horror movie. I think it's more of an action film. But that's fine. I think that for all of the positives of that film, I really see no flaws. I think that it is very interesting to think about the ownership conversation in context of Hollywood and Trump right now. Everything happening in this Oscar season is happening in the backdrop of potentially big mergers, takeovers, bigger buys and sells of major Hollywood studios and media companies. All of that deal making has been complicated by Donald Trump trying to put his finger on the scale. And even with the SAG Awards last night, they're now owned by Netflix. And because of that deal, they can't call themselves the SAGS anymore. They're called the Actors Awards. Right. So all of this Oscars race is happening in the context of these bigger questions about who owns what. And so to see a movie like Sinners, which is kind of in a really. In a really bold and yet subtle way, saying to these Hollywood execs, y' all might be the vampires, to see a movie saying that still win big, I think that's pretty significant. It's pretty significant.

[Stacey Abrams]

Well, I wanna stay there for a second. Cause part of the ownership that has surrounded Centers was Ryan Coogler's very, very unique deal and what he was able to extract in order to make this movie, I would love for you to talk about it, Sam, starting with you and then Hunter. What did Ryan do differently, particularly in light of this ownership conversation that put Hollywood on edge?

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah, I mean, for as long as Hollywood has been Hollywooding, usually most of the time, studios own these movies, and they own the IP of the movies, and they own the rights to the movies. And even if you wrote the thing yourself, pitched the thing yourself, shot the thing yourself, if a studio helped you distribute it, they probably owned it. A handful of tier one directors and producers were able to secure rights to their films. I think Quentin Tarantino, maybe for one or two or a few, but for the most part, you don't own it. What Ryan Coogler did with this movie is he, after 25 years of the film's release, the rights of the film and all of its IP go back to him. That is wild, crazy, a big deal. And what's crazy is when you say that to people who aren't in Hollywood, they say, oh yeah, makes sense. Shouldn't he own it? When that deal was announced, when that was made public, Hollywood gatekeepers scoffed, questioned it, were almost kind of mad about it. You know, like Ryan securing his ownership seems like a no brainer and a template for creatives going forward. But at every step of the way, the Hollywood elite and establishment was like, oh, we don't know. And I think part of that has to do with the race of Ryan Coogler and the racial politics of this film. But yeah, it's hard to overstate how big of a deal this is. It's a very big deal.

[Sam Sanders]

Well, yes, and also, we can't forget that, like when the deal was made, it was not news. It was only when the movie became a success that, like this black director, you know, the rights reverting back to him became a bigger story. But I do think that there is something, you know, in the larger scheme of what's gonna happen with Warner Brothers and what's happening with paramount, that the two executives who are white Mike DeLuca and Pamela Abdy, they were the two people who greenlit Both Sinners. And One Battle After Another, which are that in addition to being both, you know, best picture frontrunners at this moment, really deal with politics and culture and race in a very forward, you know, that is the top note of both movies. And I think that's really incredible because, I mean, I think their jobs were on the line for making these two movies because these are, I mean, granted, yeah, One Battle After Another is based on a book, but it's not like anyone's running to see not a book

[Hunter Harris]

that we all read.

[Sam Sanders]

Yeah, it's not, it's not like it's the Great Gats. Okay, but, but these are movies that are, you know, mostly diverse casts really based on, on, you know, not on ip, not on a comic book character or, you know, a TV show or anything. And those were really big swings. And I, I wonder, you know, if the Ellisons take over, if the, you know, Paramount takes over Warner Brothers, how many more chances will black directors get? And then how many chances will black movies get or any movie that's on about, you know, selling a sort of vision of culture that Feels sort of sanitized and politicized in a, you know, in a different way, in a more. In a neutered way.

[Hunter Harris]

Oh, yeah. I mean, I feel like I've heard some chatter in this town leading up to the Oscars, where people are kind of saying, all right, you're seeing one battle. You're seeing sinners do so well as new ip. Diverse cast, political storytelling, executives taking a chance on these kind of weird stories and making it work. And folks are saying, that's the last hurrah for that. Enjoy it. Have fun. Because everything coming. Once these mergers are approved and these buys and sells occur, you're going to have more and more executives who aren't making emotional choices to support art that they love. They're making business decisions to support the most reliable bets for box office success. And that's always recycled ip.

[Sam Sanders]

But I'm gonna say I'm not even, you know, the safest bets for a return on their investment. I mean, we're seeing, like, Brett Ratner, a director who was accused of sexual harassment by many women, including a list woman, Olivia Munn. He directed the Melania documentary, and now he's. I think they're greenlighting a new Rush Hour because he wanted it.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah.

[Sam Sanders]

I mean, it's not even like. You can't even say that this is about a return on investment, because it's not. It's simply about showing a version of culture and of America that is approved by. By the president.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah. And approved increasingly by a top tier of leadership and ownership in Hollywood. That is a good old boys club. It is a good old boys club. And you're seeing Hollywood in this moment, under this rightward energy from Trump and his friends. They are resuscitating the careers of bad men who were me too'd.

[Sam Sanders]

Mm.

[Stacey Abrams]

Yeah.

[Hunter Harris]

It's happening in more than the Brett Ratnon situation, you know, of course.

[Sam Sanders]

No, of course. That was just one example. And I think the real irony is that both Sinners and one battle after another really deal with that very plainly in both movies.

[Stacey Abrams]

And I would argue that in addition to what one battle after another and Sinners do in the context of race and agency, we have also seen in the rise of authoritarianism with this administration. You've got the Secret Agent, which is described as a film that fills you in on what it's like to live under a dictatorship. And Hunter, you mentioned it was just an accident, which takes place in Tehran and touches on similar themes. I've been working on this campaign called the Ten Steps to Autocracy and authoritarianism. It's technically the Ten Steps campaign. And we talk about how autocracy and authoritarianism take hold and then what it takes to fight back. And in the Ten Steps campaign, I break down how a once democratic nation like the US can slide into dictatorship faster than people think. And one of the steps is that you change the culture by attacking the truth. You reshift and reshape what people see and know to be part of who we are. So you see the consolidation of Paramount, you see the threats that Netflix faced when they were trying to take Warner Brothers. You see the attacks on Stephen Colbert, and you see the firing of Karenatia for mentioning that black people may have been harmed by the words of Charlie Kirk. Over and over again, we have seen this attack on the truth. And while it's typically seen as a news issue, I think it's also very much a culture shaping issue. And I would love for the two of you. And I'll start with you, Hunter, if you wanna know, have you seen either of these films and if so, how much of the that resonated with you and what feels like an authoritarian shift happening here in the U.S. hmm.

[Sam Sanders]

Yes, I've seen both of them. It was Just an Accident and the Secret Agent. And I mean, both are excellent. Let me say that first. And both really move kind of deftly between genres in a way that in some moments it feels very oppressive, very tense. And then in some moments it's just like they're both sort of out and out thrillers and it was just an accident. More than anything, it does have moments of comedy that are like pure hilarious satire in a way that I think is really, really impressive. But I think to your point, yes, these do. I mean, when I watch those movies, I think about like the Alan Pakula movies from like the Watergate era, movies that feel like, you know, you can feel the tension that comes from not knowing if you can trust someone, not knowing if someone is working for the other side. And you know how hard it is to find moments of levity and joy in such an oppressive political climate, climate and culture. And I don't think it's an accident. I mean, I don't think that it's. I think it's very intentional that that is kind of in the ether globally right now because it's not just the rise of fascism and authoritarianism in the US but it's all over the world.

[Stacey Abrams]

Exactly.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah. Yeah. I think it's really important to understand that in many ways the entertainment industry and Hollywood and how a regime like Trump treats that is almost the canary in the coal mine for what else he will do. Right. If Donald Trump wants to control as much as possible, he and his friends, they start testing the waters. And before he started testing the waters about how many people he could detain illegally, he began by testing the waters, seeing how far he could push the media, silence the media, control the media. And so everything that we are seeing Trump do in domestic policy, in foreign policy, you can kind of almost see the blueprint for how he does it through how he has treated the creative class and the creative industries. He says they're bad, he says they don't like him, he says they're un American. And then he tries to silence them and maybe sue them and put his friends in those places to run it. Right. This is what he is doing in America and now possibly Venezuela and Iran. So I really think it's important to see how his playbook manifests, particularly in the entertainment industry, to see how he's doing it elsewhere. A lot of people will say, well, we should be talking about politics and it's not about art, but they're connected. And anyone who's saying that they just wanna make art, that's not. They're also not acknowledging that they're only able to make the kind of art that they make and have the breadth of options to make the art that they make because people have fought politically to ensure those freedoms of the press and of the media. The fact that you get to make art, period, is a political.

[Stacey Abrams]

Exactly.

[Hunter Harris]

Decision, a political point, a political place. Right. And yeah, now I'm just circling back to, of this top line thought, but like, it's all effing connected. It's all connected. It is.

[Sam Sanders]

And can I add one more thing too? I mean, of course I would love to see more celebrities and, you know, decision makers speaking out on red carpets and on, in award shows about, like, you know, this moment with ice, this moment with Iran and Venezuela, of course, I would love that. But I do think in some ways it is sort of, I think, optim. I feel optimistic a little bit that like the Oscars in this moment, in the last few years more than ever have been like increasingly international, both in its, you know, in the Academy, but also in the movies that they're selecting. Of course, it's a disgrace that Green Book won Best Picture. That should not make sense in any reality, even just like on a filmmaking reality. But at the same time, I mean, look at, look at the, the actors, Wagner, Mora, Sellen, Skarsgrd who are not Americans who are nominated in this very American award show. I don't think that's something that would have happened even 20 years ago. And so that's not explicitly a rebuke of Trump, but I think culturally we are interested in having a conversation that he is not. And I think that's a good thing.

[Hunter Harris]

Yes.

[Stacey Abrams]

More from my conversation with Hunter and Sam after the break. Assembly Required with Stacey Abrams is brought to you by Helix. It may not feel like it, but spring is just around the corner and it's a great time to freshen up your home and and maybe get rid of that old mattress when it's time to get a new one. Helix can help. Now that I've switched to Helix, I'm getting a better night's sleep and having better mornings. I even got one for my guest room and my visitors are always raving about how comfortable they are. In fact, a study Helix ran found that 82% of those involved saw an increase in their deep sleep cycle while sleeping on a Helix mattress. Buying a Helix mattress couldn't be easier. The Helix Sleep Quiz matches you with the perfect mattress based on your personal preferences and sleep needs so you can find the perfect fit. Not only that, Helix has free shipping in the US and seamless delivery right to your door. Helix is the most awarded mattress, brand, tested and reviewed by experts like Forbes and Wired, and you can rest easy with seamless returns and exchanges. Helix has a 120 night sleep trial and a limited lifetime warranty. The Happy with Helix guarantee offers a risk free customer first experience designed to ensure you're completely satisfied with your new Mattress. Go to helixsleep.com assembly for 27% off site wide exclusive for listeners of assembly required that's helixsleep.com assembly for27% off sitewide exclusive for listeners of Assembly Required make sure you enter our show name after checkout so they know we sent you. That's helixsleep.com assembly a strong democracy doesn't happen by accident. It's built deliberately through laws that protect everyone's freedoms, not just those with power. One of those protections is the separation of church and state. The First Amendment ensures that government serves all people equally, regardless of faith, background or belief, and that no one is forced to live under someone else's theology. Today, that principle is under threat from movements that want to blur the line between religion and government, narrowing who truly belongs in our democracy. The Freedom From Religion foundation works to defend that boundary in schools, courts and public institutions. So Freedom of Conscience remains a right, not a privilege. This is about fairness, it's about inclusion, and it's about building a democracy that works for everyone. Visit FFRF US newyear or text my first name, S T A c e y to 511-511 and support the work of protecting our shared freedoms. To learn more, go to FFRF US newyear or text my first name, Stacy to 511511 and help protect a country that belongs to all of us. Message and data rates. There are 10 steps to authoritarianism and autocracy. There are 10 steps to freedom and power. And in those 10 steps that we talk about for how we push back, joy is part of it, engagement is part of it, and part of it's telling a different story. It's disrupting the narrative you're told to hold. And there has been this wave of international and documentary films that have gotten real attention this year, and especially stories that we didn't think could be told. You know, there's the voice of Hain Rajab, which tells the true story of a Palestinian Red Crescent society dispatcher who stays on the phone with a six year old girl who's trapped in a car in Gaza before she is shot and killed by Israeli forces. And then there's Cutting Through Rocks, which is about the first female counselor in her Iranian village who challenges tradition by teaching girls how to ride motorcycles. And, you know, these are categories that are usually overlooked by award shows. And I think to the point both of you are making, I'm gonna let you lean back in. These are things that in the international space often get ignored by America, but they've always carried some of the deepest political weight. And in this moment, I think audiences are giving permission to be told stories that are harder, but that can also reset how we think about our role and our place in fighting back. So we'd love for you guys to respond.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah, yeah. It's hard to overstate how much a lot of American pop culture that we think is just American has quietly and loudly become increasingly international over the last 10 to 20 years. The Academy, at this point, one in five of Academy voters are international. We think back to the OscarsSoWhite campaign, and I think a lot of folks are like, just put some more black folks in there. They did more than that. You know, they diversified within America and internationally. And that's part of why you see all these actors go to all these film festivals all across the world, because they're speaking to voters who are increasingly global. And so the rise of Brazil as an Oscars powerhouse these last few years. That is because of that. Right. And we are seeing these institutions that we thought were exclusively American say to themselves, oh, it's about the whole world. And I like that. I think you saw the same thing happen with the Super Bowl. You know, there was all of this worry about what the Fox News set might think. A bad bunny at the halftime show, baby. The NFL was trying to talk to all of the world. They want to expand. They want what FIFA has. You know, FIFA has the World cup. And they're a truly global brand. The NFL would love that. And so these multinational corporations, these, you know, cultural institutions, they are seeing that the pop culture landscape is big, bigger than just America and American fans. And there are direct parallels to the way that our politics, whether we like it or not, is becoming more global. And America is having to grapple with the reality in which they aren't the only or the biggest voice in the room. Which is also strange to say in the week that Donald Trump has just bombed Iran. But you get what I'm saying.

[Sam Sanders]

Yeah. No, and I think that in some ways as much as, like, culturally, the gatekeepers or the deciders are able to see that it actually is to your benefit to sort of broaden your scope and broaden your horizon and seek different audiences, but that voters themselves are seeing not just like the. As sort of like, what am I saying? A checking a box of like, oh, we have this movie and this movie, have one of these movies and one of those movies. But that tastes across categories are inclusive of actors and creators and culture makers from different societies, from different cultures from different countries. And I think that's a really, a really something that we've never seen before to this scale.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah, well, and it's like, you know, these institutions, these multinational corporations, they have caught on to something that Trump hasn't yet. I think Trump has this vision of America and of global politics that is still stuck in post World War II American supremacy and dominance. I mean, of course, increasingly changing. Yeah, go ahead.

[Sam Sanders]

He is a 1980s TV star who by, you know, by any true metric should be like a Bravo housewife by now. Instead, he's in the White House. So his idea of what culture is a lot more old fashioned than I think you would think. And that really is kind of the, the thing that about him that's, I think, the most out of touch.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah. And that's why he's so mad when the things he tries to do to control the culture just don't work. Yeah, he's tried to take over the Kennedy Center. One, everyone's like, sorry, that's not the center of the pop culture universe. And two, we just won't go to those shows anymore.

[Sam Sanders]

Yeah, everyone will go to those shows.

[Hunter Harris]

You know, that's exactly right. Yeah.

[Sam Sanders]

If his finger is really on the pulse, he would be trying to take over TikTok. Like, that is what is actually gonna shift culture.

[Stacey Abrams]

Well, that's what he did with the Ellisons. I mean, he's given the Ellisons permission to take over Paramount, TikTok, now Warner Brothers, with, I think, this very clear intention that if he can't bend us to his will, he will break our ability to get to anything else.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah.

[Stacey Abrams]

And I think that goes to both of your points about ownership at the very beginning, which is, how do we then shift the narrative? And what do these award shows tell us about the willingness of artists, if not the industry that promotes them, to shift the narrative and to try to own the content?

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah, I think it's saying everything about the Oscars this year seems to be saying to me, support independence. Support Independent Media Centers is a studio movie, but. But it came to be very independently. Ryan Coogler wrote this film with his wife based on an idea he had from admiring his uncle who likes to play the blues. It is an original story made by real people, not focus grouped by some committee or corporation. All of these international films that we've talked about, they are coming from independent artists who are seeking to speak truth to power. When I think about that and how it parallels with news media consumption and news media ownership in America right now, you know, you got these rich billionaires owning most of conventional media at this point. You've got these rich billionaires owning TikTok. You've got, you know, tech bros like Mark Zuckerberg owning meta. And so much of how we communicate the message that the Oscars are sending to us in this moment, the message that these really great films are sending to us in this moment is like, in the midst of all that, seek out independent media. Independent news, Independent storytelling. Like Donald Trump and his billionaire friends know that if they can control the message and control the mediums, it makes it so much easier to do whatever the hell they want. So the note from this awards season is, you see all that independence over there? You gotta be looking for that in the way that you consume news as well. Cause they're not gonna tell you the truth. You gotta find it yourself.

[Stacey Abrams]

Well, Hunter sticking with that, you know, year after year, our media consumption gets more and More fragmented. We are seeing the proliferation of independent journalists in lieu of more traditional journalism, especially with Bari Weiss at the helm of CBS and with the decimation of public media. And, you know, we've also seen this start to happen just in terms of how we connect. I mean, the Bad Bunny show was so important because it brought tens of millions of people together, but there are fewer and fewer cultural touchstones that everyone actually shares. So I'd love to hear you talk about what the impact of this is on our society and what are we missing? What are those potential cultural touchstones that we should be looking for?

[Hunter Harris]

Hmm.

[Sam Sanders]

Well, I mean, I wish I knew. Honestly, I don't think there is a monoculture culturally in the same way that there really is. It seems like a political monoculture where we're all reacting and responding, you know, really by the seat of our pants to the same political moments again and again. And I really do think, as Sam said, you know, I think really concisely at the beginning of this segment, that it is because Trump is an entertainer at heart, and he really is more skilled at creating, you know, moments of chaos that a reality TV producer would than he is at, you know, engineering anything politically that is not harmful.

[Hunter Harris]

But.

[Sam Sanders]

But I don't know. I mean, I think the moments are fewer and farther between because we really are all so, you know. Yes, like, the idea media is more fragmented now. All of, like, all of our cultural influences and appetites are so specific that you can go on, you know, your TikTok or even your YouTube or whatever and find a feed that is directly engineered to get you to keep scrolling is a good thing for tech companies, and I think a bad thing for the way that we all relate to one another, let alone the way that we consume culture. And, you know, the Oscars are important to me because I like entertainment. And just like the super bowl is important to, you know, people I know because they like football. I guess, as you can tell, I'm not one of those people. But I think that the more moments we can find, moments of connection where it's not just us talking in an echo chamber about this or that little moment that I think it's moments like Beyonce, like Taylor Swift, like, even sort of an HBO show like the Pit or Game of Thrones or something like that. Those really feel like moments of connection that are more than just like, we're all watching the same show at the same time. We're all sitting at, you know, 6 o' clock to, like, watch the news together.

[Stacey Abrams]

Yeah, okay. Much more when we come back from the break. Assembly required with Stacey Abrams is brought to you by Factor. I love to cook, but with my schedule, I don't always have time to pull together a delicious and healthy meal. After a day of endless meetings or after a long week of travel, it's a gift to not have to figure out dinner. We all want to eat better, but it can be hard when you don't have the time or energy to make it happen. You're not failing at healthy eating, you're failing at having extra hours every night. But that's what Factor is for. Factor is already made by chefs, designed by dietitians and delivered to your door. You heat it for two minutes and then eat what's inside. Lean proteins, colorful vegetables, whole food ingredients, healthy fats, the stuff you'd make if you had the time. Factor foods have no refined sugars, no artificial sweeteners, and the meals are designed to fit into your life with 100 rotating meals every week. Whether you're looking for high protein meals, calorie smart options, the Mediterranean diet, or ready to eat salads, Factor has you covered. They even have a new MusclePro collection for strength and recovery. You pick what fits your goals. Healthier eating, calorie management, more protein, whatever you're actually trying to do, the meals are always fresh, never frozen, and they're ready in two minutes. No prep, no cleanup, no mental load. It's not just motivation to eat better, it gets rid of all the reasons you don't. Now when I have a day of back to back meetings, I can just pop one of Factor's meals into the microwave and and eat during a quick break. Head to FactorMeals.com Assembly50OFF and use the code Assembly50OFF to get 50% off your first factor box. Plus free breakfast for a year offer only valid for new Factor customers with code and qualifying auto renewing subscription purchase. Make healthier eating easier with Factor

[Hunter Harris]

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[Sam Sanders]

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[Stacey Abrams]

Sam Hunter just made the argument that perhaps the Oscars should serve as at least her cultural touchstone. But last year on the Sam Sanders show, you raised the question of whether the Oscars should actually even exist anymore.

[Hunter Harris]

Calling me out.

[Stacey Abrams]

So, I mean, look, look, I do my. You've known me since Georgia. I do my research.

[Sam Sanders]

Oh, my gosh.

[Stacey Abrams]

So talk about whether or not you think the Oscar should be our opportunity to create a new cultural touchstone, or at least to reaffirm one. Or should we be moving away and looking for something else?

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah, First, I think Hunter is spot on about the only monoculture left being mostly Donald Trump. That is a weird and maybe bad place to be in. That is what Donald Trump wants. And it makes it easier for him to seem really powerful because if everyone is always talking about him all the time, he's giving wizard of Oz vibes, when in actuality, you pull the curtain back, it's Jeff Goldblum. But that's what he wants, right? He wants to seem bigger than he really is. And so him being in the monoculture gives him that. Which is why I think it's important to find other monoculture moments that you can glom onto and live in and celebrate with your friends just to offer a rebuke of the 257 Donald Trump monoculture news cycle. So that's first and then two. I do think the Oscars can offer a good moment of counter monoculture, even though, as I've argued before, maybe they shouldn't exist. And as I've said in other shows, I think it's the most fun scam I've ever been a part of. Like, it's a scam. When you go back to the origin of the Oscars themselves and the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, it was created by Louis B. Mayer. After he saw, below the line, Hollywood employees starting to unionize. He said, I don't want the actors and directors to also do that. Let me make this academy and give them membership and then give them awards to hopefully keep them from organizing and unionizing. So the genesis of the Oscars themselves, it was to prevent collective action. So know that. Just like know that. And we know that the Oscars from their very have had some really big problems with race and gender, to the point that many women who have won acting awards at the Oscars have said on record, it's hurt my career. Right. In spite of this, I think when Hollywood and the Oscars industrial complex functions on all cylinders, it gives you the most feel good you can possibly see on a TV screen. I remember watching Denzel win his Oscar for Training Day. I remember Halle Berry winning her Oscar for Monsters Ball. I ain't gonna talk about monst, but you go Halle. There are these moments in which when Hollywood gets it right, you get cultural moments that make you feel good about being here, good about being part of the moment now, and good about just being part of this thing that's bigger than yourself. I think we need that right now, and I think it is why there was such an electric reaction to Delroy Lindo on that SAG stage last night. Celebrities still give us something. Movies still give us something. And in this moment of nonstop Donald Trump monoculture, we kind of need that. We kind of need that.

[Sam Sanders]

Yeah. And not to get too inside baseball about it, but I think that internally in Hollywood, if we can point to a movie like Sinners and say, this is what we as an industry value. This is what we as an industry choose to reward. You know, who knows what has been made possible for the next director, for the next writer, for the next actor who is, you know, saying, look at this movie. This is my comp. If they did that, maybe I can do something a little bit similar or at least reach the same scale and cultural saturation as that movie did. And I think that importantly is also a benefit of the Academy Awards, because maybe, you know, will my family watch the Oscars live? Maybe, maybe not. But anyone you know of a certain age is like, oh, well, that movie won an Oscar. Okay, let me check that out. Like that. I'm gonna add that to my list. O. You know, the way that your quote as an actor can go up once you've won an Oscar is significant. And that, I mean, for anyone, I think.

[Hunter Harris]

And with all of these movies, even though it could hurt when you have

[Sam Sanders]

these message films, your price does go up. I think that's a good thing.

[Hunter Harris]

Even if they don't win the Oscar, they change a national conversation and help lead to change. I think about everything that happened in the run up to gay marriage being legalized. You know, Will and Grace was a big part of that, but so was Brokeback Mountain. Brokeback Mountain famously did not win Best Picture at the Oscars. Crash did. What were we doing? But that whole year around, the press cycle and Academy Awards cycle for Brokeback Mountain made a lot of people who hadn't talked about queerness before talk about it. And so to the extent that movies and TV and entertainment media can prompt conversations that then change policy. That is still true. That is still true.

[Stacey Abrams]

So to two of you, I, at the end of every episode of Assembly Required. Give my listeners homework. And I wanna delve into two things that you have done. Sam, you went from legacy media and started your own project, the Sam Sanders Show. Hunter, you went from something you once called your dream job, and you now have. Let me say this. And your substack hung up.

[Hunter Harris]

And her podcast about the pit, the recap podcast. Check it out. She's doing the work.

[Stacey Abrams]

There you go. So what is advice that you would give our listeners? We just talked about how we reclaim our culture from a culture vulture, how we reset these touchstones so that we are more connected. So, each of you, what is some advice you would give our listeners? One thing they can do, either from the position they have in their careers or this dream job or passion that they've never let themselves give voice to. What's the thing you want them to do? And because you nod at first, Hunter, you go first.

[Sam Sanders]

Okay, well, I think the first thing is, you know, don't wait for a yes. Just decide to do it yourself. If I cannot tell you the number of friends I have who are still in corporate and, you know, they can pitch anything that feels, like, inclusive or relevant or urgent in some way, and for whatever reason, they're told no. And it's like, now is, you know, more. We have more tools at our disposal than ever to just make something ourselves. And in general, in my life, I think I'm so much more of, like, an ask for forgiveness, not permission, and just see what happens. That's the first thing. I think the second thing is, like, if you love a movie or an album or a TV show, especially if it's, like, made by or about someone from an underrepresented group, you should be shouting it from the rooftop. You should be making sure every single person you know is talking about it, is watching it, is thinking about it the same way you are. Because I think that is sort of like the passion that I think has driven my career. But I think the more we can bring other people into our passions is like, that's how we start. Start kind of building. Not clawing away at, you know, Trump as monoculture, as Sam said, because that really does, I think, at least make him seem sort of omnipotent. The more that we can say, actually look at this show or that movie or this song. I mean, that's kind of same.

[Stacey Abrams]

What you got for us?

[Hunter Harris]

I think the biggest advice I would give to anyone thinking about ownership and creativity and existing in this world where you kind of have to more than ever before, you know, be a one man band and represent yourself and speak for yourself and own your own work. The biggest kind of aha moment I had after I left Legacy Media and began to kind of just like run my own ship was learning how to be comfortable making my own decisions for myself. I think that all of us who have grown up revering these institutions that we grow up in, you're kind of told from the start, you're very talented, you're very good at this. We'll make the best decisions for you. Just do a good job and we will make the best decisions for you. And you believe that. You believe that. But I've learned over the last few years, just because you think someone is more senior than you and more experienced than you, it doesn't mean that they won't also make bad decisions for you. They might make bad decisions for you. And we're afraid to make our own decisions for ourselves because we think we don't know how and we'll make bad decisions decisions. But even if you let someone more senior or experienced make choices for you, they will sometimes make bad choices for you as well. And so the work for me has been as I've become more of an independent journalist. How do I learn how to make decisions for myself and learn how to make good ones? Because even if I make a bad decision, if I learn from it, it's worth it. But if I had let every, if I let every choice that I make be made by someone else, I don't learn anything. I don't learn anything. So I would advise people to lean into the potential for learning that comes when you steer your own ship. It's life changing. Stop expecting other people to make choices for you. Make your own choices.

[Stacey Abrams]

Hunter Harris, Sam Sanders, two of the most cinematic names in the business. Thank you both for being with us on Assembly Required.

[Hunter Harris]

This was so delightful.

[Sam Sanders]

Thank you so much.

[Stacey Abrams]

Assembly Required is here to help us understand what's happening and then take action where we are. Because every decision to resist adds up. So first, be curious, check out Sam Sanders show on kcrw and subscribe to Hunter Harris podcast. Let me say this. And her substack hung up. Number two, solve problems. Support organizations that uplift independent filmmakers and diverse voices in the industry. Chicken and egg [e-mail] is a nonprofit that champions women and gender expansive documentary filmmakers around the globe. The NAACP has several entertainment initiatives dedicated to building an inclusive industry that you can learn [e-mail] and GLAAD. GLAAD.org works to increase LGBTQ representation in entertainment and gaming. Check out these organizations and seek out others that help bring missing perspectives to the industries that shape our culture. And third, it's time for us to do some more good. There have already been many civilian casualties of the war, not just in Iran, but across the Middle East. Please donate to Doctors without [e-mail] to support their efforts to bring medical attention to those who've been wounded by the recent bombings. UNICEF promotes the well being of children globally, including in Iran and the surrounding areas. So please visit unicef.org to donate and support their efforts to meet the children's needs for health, nutrition, education, water, sanitation and more. Assembly Required is available across platforms and our message is reaching across audiences. We start with issues and give you context, actions and hope. Someone you know needs all of the above, so help us reach them. Share an episode with a friend and add us to your feed. Make sure you actually subscribe on all of your favorite platforms, not just one, and leave us a comment about what's working and what can help us improve. You can find us on YouTube, Spotify, Apple, or wherever you get your podcast. Also, starting soon, we'll be taking a deeper dive on the 10 steps to freedom and Power. On my substack Assembly Notes, we'll share Action items and Victory Labs and we want to see you there. Thank you to the thousands of you who've signed up for the 10 Steps campaign. At 10StepsCampaign.org we offer information in English and Spanish to help you recognize what's happening, activate around solutions and build a better America. Well, that wraps up this episode of Assembly Required with Stacey Abrams. Do good out there and I'll meet you here next week. Assembly Required is a crooked Media production. Our lead show producer is Lacey Roberts and our associate producer is Farah so. Kiril Palaviv is our video producer. This episode was recorded and mixed by Charlotte Landis. Our theme song is by Vasilis Fotopoulos. Thank you to Matt De Groat, Kyle Seglin, Tyler Boozer, Ben Hethcote and Priyanka Muntha for production support. Our executive producers are Katie Long and me, Stacey Abra.