Loading summary
Transcript53 lines
- [00:03]
A
This session was recorded live at the 2026 ASU GSV summit in San Diego.
- [00:14]
B
Well, good morning everybody. Thanks for joining us. The next 40 minutes we're going to do a deep dive on the topic of credentialing for 2030. In particular, we're going to discuss the skills students need to succeed in the workforce, how we recognize those skills for credit regardless of whether they were learned inside or outside the classroom. And we're going to talk about how those contribute towards credentials and economic mobility for students. This conversation is growing in importance as we look towards 2030 as workforce and education systems need to adapt to changing demographics of higher education. Just in California, we have over 6.8 million students who have a have a high school diploma but no credentials. And we need to prepare students to succeed in the workforce that is rapidly changing due to AI. This is raising the bar on what college needs to deliver to create real on ramps to education, to give students more portable skills more quickly and more affordably, and to prepare them for dynamic careers and better wages. We're lucky today to have panelists who are practitioners and who are experts across the education and workforce system in California who can talk to us about their large scale efforts to recognize learning wherever it's happening. I'm going to ask them to speak with candor about successes so far, about stumbling blocks and about what it's going to take to scale with that. Let's get started. Abby, I'm maybe going to start with you and we're going to pass down the row here for a rapid fire on what success looks like. Start with finishing this sentence by 2030. Credentialing should support working adults too, to
- [01:55]
C
understand the skills and credentials they need to get the jobs they want easily and to affordably attain the training and education they need to get those jobs.
- [02:09]
B
Chris, over to you.
- [02:12]
A
Usually I'll start with, well, if it's 2030, our strategic plan aligns with Vision 2030. But no, I think when it comes to credentials for us it's by 2030 we need to be able to enable our students in our community college system to convey the skills that they've learned, whether it's in our setting or an external setting to employers and get that economic mobility, get that better job and not just for themselves, but for the next generation. So it's always about a two generation cycle as well. We need to think about today and tomorrow.
- [02:44]
D
Yeah, I would just agree with those things and say that to enable that. I think the key is infrastructure and standardized infrastructure that allows those signals to be communicated across systems, across states, more nationally, et cetera, in order to enable that to happen.
- [03:01]
E
What I would add to that from an on ground practitioner perspective is to accelerate their progress towards a degree, a certificate or a credential, and to see college as navigable and relevant and to see a very material return on investment.
- [03:20]
B
Thank you. Lots of ambition for 2030. And Chris, you referenced Vision 2030, the community college's strategic plan. More access, more affordability. Tell us a little bit about how credit for prior learning and how portable skills play into that and where you are in the journey across the 116 community colleges.
- [03:40]
A
Yeah, absolutely. Let me start with. On average, our students are taking about 85 units to complete a 60 unit degree. So we know we have excess unit problems. We have a problem with helping students through their journey, we have a problem with taking too long, and we also have a problem with students just not completing as a result at a certain point. So for us, credit for prior learning, associate's degree, for transfer, transfer pathways, it's all about trying to make sure that that student understands what their journey is, understands that they will receive credit for the skills that they've learned, whether that's in our classroom or externally, and using the data sets that we have to inform our program. We know, for example, if we have a military veteran who does credit for prior learning and gets 29 units based on what they learned in the military, that that student is much more likely to complete their degree program timely and get economic mobility, a good job. So it really comes back to using the data sets, using what we know, building out those pathways. So with credit for prior learning, to us, it's establishing a credential registry. It's looking at how we understand and translate the terms that our employers are using so that students are using the same terms. And what do I mean by that? They're using AI filters right now to filter out those applications that we're submitting to any corporation. And if you don't use the right term, that filter is going to cut you out. So we need to be able to make sure we've got the right terms from industry, help our students convey those terms, ensure our programs are teaching to those terms and teaching those skills that are needed. And the other piece that I would add to this, and this has been a problem in our system, Dr. Thames can probably speak to it as well. It takes us way too long to change our courses and programs. It's one to two years to update a course and get it offered, get it on our schedules and get it out to a student. So as we think again about credit for prior learning, that's instantaneous, right? You come in, we do the translation, we align it with the skills that we know are there, and you have it almost immediately. That's not two years, that's maybe two days. So we're doing a lot in our system to focus on our students first and get them into a good position.
- [06:03]
B
Thanks for that. And Dr. Thames, maybe you want to build on that. Chris is kind of painting the vision for what all the levers are and what the work is ahead on the path to 2030. What have you seen in the context of El Camino and your college? What are the biggest friction points that are getting in the way for students of moving towards that vision?
- [06:22]
E
I think awareness is one of the biggest ones. Students don't know what it is. They don't know the that it exists, or they find out too late in their journey with us how to acquire the credit and then how to apply it. But recognition is also a problem, and Chris kind of touched on this. It does take a long time for curriculum to turn over in our system, and recognition in our curriculum processes, either through the regular curriculum process or through curriculum addendums, does take a little bit of time, but it also takes faculty capacity to do that. And so building that capacity for faculty to be able to do that application is another friction point that we're experiencing in making sure that students, again, understand how to apply it to a pathway, understanding how it shortens their. Their length of time with us and their length of time to a degree certificate or credential. But also the application in our own infrastructure about how counselors counsel those students and how to apply this credit and when to use it and what to use it for, whether it's for a prerequisite or to augment a gap in skills or learning outcomes that are identified in the curriculum and how to petition to close that gap. But also, we don't want students to go through long petition processes to get the credit. So part of the application on our end in our campus infrastructure, is figuring out how to make that as easy, easily facilitate that for students as possible. And then the portability, we've got to make sure that we're transcripting it correctly because it's no good for students to have something that then is not recognized or applicable out in industry or at a transfer institution or some other receiving entity. And the portability, again, to make sure that it's applied correctly to a degree pathway. So when students get to the end, there are no surprises for them. So those are some of the friction points that we're finding.
- [08:15]
B
Thanks for laying it out. And as you were talking about them, they all seem like kind of links in a chain that need to come together in order to sort of rapidly get through the process. Kevin, maybe you can build on that. I know that you're running a sort of large credentialing pilot across the U.S. i think there's 11 higher ed institutions and systems tell us a little bit about what is distinguishing credentialing systems that are doing well and moving up the curve and, and what kind of stands out.
- [08:44]
D
Yeah, I think just right now we've already highlighted just how complex this problem is. Right. And so I think that the places where there's been more success operates at the system level. So in our case, we're trying to build a community of practice across institutions, across states to try to get to a place where students can find their way from institution to institution in other states or other parts of the country. And it's already hard enough even within systems to navigate these situations for students, even within the California systems or CUNY systems in New York. So one of the it really comes down to three fundamental things that come up every time is this sort of strong data infrastructure. And when we talk about data infrastructure, eventually we need to get to something that's more like the interstate highway system. Not a end to end thing that goes all the way to providing the rest area and the food when you get off, but the actual interchange, the ability to take data from one student information system and make it translate to another one. So that kind of data infrastructure is going to be critical to enable different services to be able to provide this kind of normalization and standardization across the different systems, the different institutions. Then where there's success, there's usually clear and standardized policies. There has to be both a top down and bottom up approach to it. Where there's some enforcement, there's some requirement to move in a direction, because generally speaking, those steps are hard for people to take. And in that, when you have that sort of first layer of data infrastructure and then you have that kind of somewhat of a pressure or guidance or leadership to move it in a direction, then collaboration is really key and involvement of the faculty is really key. That's the thing that keeps coming up. The faculty have to be on board with wanting to accept these things. The accepting institutions are trying to defend quality as they should. And so there are ways that that can be a friction point as you Point out nothing's good enough from other places. I mean, everybody in this room, I'm sure, knows that feeling. So how do you create that sort of infrastructure, that impetus, and then create an environment where there's trust and there's collaboration to enable that to happen so that faculty are supportive because at the end of the day, the faculty are going to make these decisions about whether or not students have the skills, the capabilities to, to be recognized and validated as having the knowledge that that institution is providing.
- [11:13]
B
Absolutely, absolutely. Thanks, Kevin. Abby, maybe you can talk a little bit about the workforce perspective. We talked a lot about within the education system, what we're trying to unlock and prepare students for. But tell us a little bit about how we can think about student success and how their skills can be recognized in the labor market. Like what are the conditions that are needed for credentials to improve mobility for working adults?
- [11:36]
C
Well, for one thing or a few things, if we're focusing on working adults, we have to factor in the reality of their lives. Often people we want to succeed are working several jobs in a very high cost of living state like California, especially in the coastal areas, people are typically stringing a few part time jobs. Together they're supplementing with gig jobs. And now we have the threat with work requirements of the loss of critical benefits that they have relied on for food, for access to health care. And so changes in education access to credentials has to accommodate those realities and build in much greater flexibility in terms of scheduling, in terms of access, in terms of acceleration. Now we're really excited to work in partnership with the colleges on many projects, including credit for prior learning, and see that as a real game changer for people. Another tool we're working closely on developing that will help is a credentials registry. So think of a very large repository of credentials available to students. And then within that repository we, we're taking a very kind of research based, evidence based approach that is evaluating those credentials on a set of six criteria in terms of labor market demand, economic mobility, testing a few metrics to get their return on investment for people in terms of their earnings over prior earnings, job stability. We want people to come out of these certificate and credentials programs having one job, you know, and not having to supplement that. And we have to screen for the reliability of the provider. We're envisioning this repository, this registry, as a broad list that has multiple purposes. When we identify the credentials of value based on a subset of those six criteria, we want to use those as an possible initial screen. And this is all in process for Workforce Pell, you know, focusing. Thank you. Focusing on labor market demand, economic mobility and provider reliability. We are also envisioning and working on creating kind of a front door tool that would be consumer facing, certainly could be worker facing in a social service office as an early navigation tool. And we'll be doing some testing in the late summer and early fall. You know, just a simple 20 item questionnaire which helps people again, starting with people who will be subject to the new work requirements to develop some short term goals to reach longer term employment goals and will hook right into the registry that will be searchable by institution availability, local area, so that they can know which of those credentials can get them what they want in the time that they need. We're also working very closely together, Chris and a few others on building the career passport for the state, which was one of the centerpieces of the governor's master plan for education. And this will be a digital wallet and a tool that will aid, promote, accelerate skills based hiring so that employers will have a tool to verify the credentials that people earn. And employer research, which Chris's team is taking the lead on now, we're working very closely on that is really central to the development of the process. And working with employers has to be the starting point of any of this work and any of this tool to identify the pain points employers have on verifying credentials and to design a tool that will help meet those pain.
- [15:49]
B
I think that was a view of the full waterfront, Abby. So I appreciate the linkage between the policy that's coming often top down, that influences students and then that very bottoms up, like what are the supports and tools that we need to link those two together, maybe bringing it back to the sort of ground level. Dr. Thames, as you think about the maybe nearly 500 students in the last couple years who have gone through the credit for prior learning process at your community college campus. What are some of the things that it has taken to help students translate their experience into credits and what do you need to see going forward?
- [16:30]
E
A lot of it comes back to faculty and faculty leadership. That has been the most important thing because it is that critical faculty piece that makes sure that the quality is there, that it's high. But also faculty are critical in making sure that the resistance is low because this is not something that easily fits into the traditional academy, the way that we're set up and the way that many of my colleagues view our institutions and how we document learning and how we recognize and award degrees or certificates for that learning. So faculty leadership is One of the critical pieces, a couple of other things that we've learned is that it requires and there's that Abby, a lot of things that Abby just mentioned. That's another layer of mapping that faculty have to do. It's not just mapping what the students bringing to our curriculum and our learning outcomes, but it's mapping to those other expectations that are going to be out there to make sure that the credit that's awarded is recognized and portable in these large repertories or exchanges that students might be able to go to internally. It's also making sure that we have cross functional teams that are doing this. Faculty are not doing this in a void. It requires it, it requires admissions and records. We talked a little bit about the student services it requires because these are not, I mean, these are not our non traditional students. These are non traditional, non traditional students because they are working and they bring a whole host of other expectations that we are not necessarily set up to meet. A couple other things that we've learned are about policy, both our own internal policies and external policies. How many residency policies wait, how long do you have to be here before you can get credit and how long do you have to be in residence at an institution before you can transfer it out? But also how many credits can a student acquire through a process like credit for prior learning? And there are still some resistance among faculty about that. Can you award a whole degree based on credit for prior learning? Those are some robust pedagogical questions that we're wrestling with. But we're also learning from each other. I mean, there are some amazing work that's going on across our system. Palomar College developed a toolkit that many of us are using with some great resources in it. And so we're not doing this alone and avoid not only internally but amongst the operational units on the college. So it's not done in silos, but also across the system. We're working together.
- [19:04]
B
Appreciate that perspective. And you touching on what is one of the true tensions as we think about really scaling up credentialing is how do we support faculty and work together towards student success, recognizing their important role in shaping curriculum. Chris, I'm not sure if there's anything you would add at the system level on how we balance that tension.
- [19:29]
A
Yeah, I think there are a couple pieces that we have to balance the tension against. And the first is going to be a recognition that our faculty are being asked to do multiple things all at the same time, while also being told in many respects, you know, what you were doing. Might not be good enough. Right? And that's literally how the conversation is starting, is saying, well, we need to do something different because we need to do better. Which also then implies maybe we're not doing it very well right now. Which that's a hard message to have and a hard conversation. But what I would say for our faculty, they're amazing. I'll put our faculty groups against any, in any state, any country, any day of the week. And what sets them apart is passion. They care. We care about our communities. We care about the outcomes, and we'll do what it takes to get those outcomes. So as we think about traversing the systems and the colleges, it's making sure that we're recognizing the hard work. It's making sure that we're creating the right policy environment. It's ensuring that we can help with those partnerships across campuses and across systems. Because it's not just our system we need csu, we need uc. We need our independents to recognize those credits and agree that those are the right skill sets that we're recognizing. Everyone has to be on board. And facilitating those conversations is important, of course, given where we're at today. It's also, how do we help our teams understand what technology can and can't do to help with these efforts? It's different because all this technology that can help with mapping pathways, mapping credentials, mapping the outcomes, we learned in an environment where none of that was available, where that was not taught to us, where we didn't use those tools. So it's all a new environment, both at the system level and the campus level. But together we can get through that, and together we will get through that. I'll invoke the prior governor, Governor Brown, and he would say, and I think we see this as a system. It's all about Chipotle, right? It's about being orderly and understanding. You start with these options, then you move to the next set of options, then you move to the final options. And then. And then if you really want to get the best value, you ask for a side of lettuce, because then you can split your meal into two and you get two for one. But it goes back to that Chipotle model is guided pathways. So to Dr. Thames point, at the system level, it's making sure that we're bringing together our student services, our anr, our parking services, our transportation folks, everyone, to make sure that that journey is well supported, suited for the student recognizes all of the viewpoints on the campus, and that at a system level, we're Allowing for that to occur and not siloing the programs at our level either. I can tell you, in our budget, we have 71 different cat. It's actually much more than 71. I think it comes out to, like, 120 now, different specific programs that we fund. So we also message at a state level, do things independently and do things differently and keep them in their silos. So it's definitely about doing what we can to make it easier for staff and having the right policy environments.
- [22:45]
E
That's one of our biggest challenges is not the campus viewing this as another one off another project, but trying to make it part of institutionalizing it. It is part of the way that we do teaching learning and recognizing learning.
- [22:59]
B
Absolutely. A structural approach to how we're going to do this in the future.
- [23:02]
D
But it's so hard because all the things that have been set up over a very, very long period are built around an existing structure where students came in at a particular time, they did a bunch of things. They got their 120 credits, they then got a credential, they got a degree, and then people came and hired them. Now we're breaking down both sides. We're saying students are going to come in and they're going to actually have not only credits from somewhere else, but prior learning that doesn't fit what a course is. You breaking down the entry point, then you're breaking down the exit point, because you're saying, well, it's not just about the degree. It's about whether or not the credential is actually validated by employers. And you can't measure that until three, five years or something. Do people get a job? Is it a good job? Do they keep their job? Do they have the credentials? And then after that, it's a circle back that the students are coming from the workplace and coming in and saying, I want to do this. So you're breaking down structures that took a century to build, and you're saying, we need to provide all these support mechanisms to make a pathway from one end to the other. So, I mean, it's just an incredibly challenging thing to go after, and people have to recognize those pieces in order to develop a solution.
- [24:16]
B
Absolutely. And there's a big feedback loop there. And, Abby, maybe you'll build and respond to this. As we think about employers, I think they used to be very outside the process as the placement spot. Right. And now they're inside the process. If we're doing it well, in terms of how we define credentials, tell us a little bit about how you're thinking about that.
- [24:32]
C
Yeah. I mean, love what you're saying, Kevin. And we do need to focus on skills and credentials that are marketable, that are transferable, but we can't wait three years afterwards. For employers, in fact, one of the first things we have to do is join our systems, the workforce system, the community college system. We're working on that. I'll talk about that in a minute. And together to deepen partnerships with employers to really bring them into the process early, to identify the skills and credentials that they need now and to understand how they're thinking about one year, two year horizon, if they're thinking that long term at all. And we need to engage them in all phases of program design and program delivery, input on curriculum, classroom speakers, site visits, work based learning. We need to do so much more to bridge the gap between the classroom and the workplace. And we just have to work closely with employers in that way. We also, as I mentioned, want to deepen the partnerships and leverage the complementary core competencies between the community college system and the workforce system, Particularly building on the industry partners and industry and business intelligence that the workforce boards were set up to do and do pretty well. Variable around the state, but for the most part, pretty well. We will soon be announcing some funding decisions for WIOA, 15% dollars, really for the first time, that are creating very explicit partnerships between workforce boards and community colleges with very robust technical assistance offered, focusing exactly on this employer engagement piece. So we want to invest to really create and drive this kind of change.
- [26:31]
E
And we have some places like apprenticeships. Yeah. That is working beautifully and figuring out how to fold that into this process. And because that's not always a straight trajectory, students may come, do some class based learning. They get into an apprenticeship, then they do on site workforce development training and acquire some skills. They may come back to us to acquire some skills that are not available there at the work site. They come back and forth and scaffold.
- [26:59]
C
That's right. On ramps and off ramps. Somebody in a construction apprenticeship may learn. You know, I'm really interested in how this whole process works. And so maybe I want to go back and get my degree in construction management instead of moving forward and building trades in other ways.
- [27:15]
E
And there's an industry partner component to evaluating the skills.
- [27:18]
C
Exactly.
- [27:18]
E
That feeds into the awarding of credit that faculty haven't done that type of work with our industry partners before.
- [27:24]
C
Right. And for registered apprenticeships specifically, very robust partnerships with our union partners, which is important.
- [27:30]
B
Yeah, like tons of momentum. And what you can see is like engagement Back and forth through the process as students move through their journey, engage with employers, engage with work opportunities, engage with credit for prior learning. One of the challenges that Kevin, you raised, that you all have also touched on in the conversation is, is the challenge of tracking outcomes along the way. Chris, you started the conversation with we know students are overshooting what they need to get their degree. And we know that along the way, very often education outcomes are lagging, not leading indicators of what success looks like, what should we be tracking and what does success look like as we're monitoring whether credit for prior learning is sort of successful. Chris, maybe you want to start?
- [28:16]
A
Yeah, happy to start. I think we have so many different data sets and data points that we're looking at today. The first thing we need to do is really think about what are those core outcome data points we need to focus on. I'll tell you, from my perspective, it's pretty straightforward. It's how many students are completing their intended programs, whether it's credentials, certificate or degree, irrespective how many complete and how many are getting a good job, a living wage job. At the end of it. If we look at just those two core metrics that's going to tell us if our programs are working, if the students are able to complete them, if they're able to see the value, if there's some other incident occurring in their journey that's preventing them from getting to the end. And it's not always on the educational end, it may not be on the workforce end, it may be some personal issue that is preventing that. But we can find out and we can figure out using data to say how do we adjust, how do we figure out how to help that student overcome. So it's definitely looking at some of those very core points. The other thing that's now happening is, and we've looked at this as a state, is better aligning the outcome with your program of study, your educational and workforce outcomes with your program of study. We have salary surfer in California community colleges where we can tell you if you take this program, here's the average wage that you will get upon completion. What we can't tell you is if that wage was in a job related to what you studied. So you know, better alignment, better outcomes, better use of data, it's absolutely there. I think as a system, we're rapidly getting to use data analytics. We're using the tools that are out there to help and it's a recognition across the board. The last thing I would add, and it's outside of the credentialing sphere is the recognition that everyone's starting at a different point when they come into our system. So we need to be nimble and flexible and dynamic. We cannot be one size fits all. And we can't have models that are designed around. We assume every student starts out of high school or we assume every student is going to start with X, Y and Z skill. They might, they might not. It just depends. And we have to be dynamic as a result to meet that need, to meet their educational goal, to get them into a good position. And I'll tell you number one reason that we need that. We need it for our communities as a community college system, as a state university system, as a University of California system. Because if we're not successful with our students, it's our communities that pay the price. Right. It's you can't. We, we contribute to the affordability crisis, we, to members of our community needing to be on assistance programs, we contribute to some of the divisiveness in terms of seeing like a two tiered society, we contribute to that if we're not successful. So looking at some of those core data points is how we can start to backtrack to say, well, what can we do to help? What can we think of differently to help? And there's no right answer. There isn't. And there's no wrong answer either.
- [31:30]
D
Yeah, I think that's all the items sort of in the beginning and then through the process and then I think the other metrics are at the end of the process. Right. What are the kinds of employers that are pursuing students at your place or placement in the students in further education if they're coming out of community college. So how successful are they in getting those, how much are people coming to get those students? Right. So you want to be able to know how much your institution is in demand from employers and those types of things. The second thing that I'll say, and this is with my not my day job hat on, but I'm on the ETS board. And one of the things that's really, really obvious in the workplace environment is assessment is going to be so much larger and so much more important and not high stakes assessment like those big tests that ETS typically delivers, but much more lower stakes validation of skills and capabilities and credentials and in a kind of more disparate way because we're breaking down some of these larger measures. And so if employers need to know that students can have certain skills and capabilities, they need to be validated with having those and so I think assessment is going to be an increasingly important element in sort of broad based assessment is going to be an increasingly important element of these developments.
- [32:51]
A
Yeah, if I could build on that really quickly, our employers would not be offering the training programs, the certificates, the skill set validation badges, if we were doing that on their behalf. They're doing it because they don't think that our systems can move quickly enough, can be dynamic enough, can meet their needs quickly, and meet the needs just outright of what their particular program is. So that alignment is absolutely critical in terms of getting to those core outcomes that we see. We need to know what they need. We need to be able to predict into the future what those needs will be. We can't just assume their need today is what their need will be tomorrow. And it's not easy. It's a whole new world for us because our systems were all designed around taking the time to validate that what we were teaching was appropriate, was accurate, was aligned, ensuring all of the facts along that journey are aligned, are dynamic, are aligned to the outcomes that we're looking for, the learning objectives that we're looking for, so that we guard against the potential that there are inaccuracies in our program where we might be teaching something we shouldn't. I just throw that in just to
- [34:01]
C
build on what you're saying, Chris, you're describing a traditionally very incremental, methodical process. And the business world is changing at the speed of light. And I think a cautionary note in all of this is, is that there really aren't enough good jobs out there right now, and things are looking tighter rather than more open. And so on the supply side, I think we all have to move much faster to pick up market signals and adapt programs to meet those market signals. And my husband always corrects me on the hockey player who talked about it wasn't Bobby hall. It was the other one, not focusing on where the puck is now, but where it's going to be and just trying to stay ahead of that.
- [34:51]
E
So I'm going to push back just a little bit because we have some amazing, innovative faculty who are on cutting edge and work very closely with our industry partners, particularly in cte. Part of the problem, though, is, yes, we taught you that. It's just embedded in a whole tree of curriculum that we won't recognize that we taught you that until you get to the end and you've done it all. And so one of the things that we need to get better at is recognizing those achievements, accomplishments, the acquisition of those Skills and that learning along the process.
- [35:28]
C
Almost.
- [35:29]
E
Yes. And yes. The other thing I need to push back on is, you know, documenting that ROI and figuring out where our students go. That has been a thorn in my side as long as I've been doing this work, and we have not solved it yet. We know how to track student achievement. We know how to track student learning outcomes. We know how to track mastery of content. That's our wheelhouse. Tracking employment data. That's not us. And maybe at us saying, tell us where your students are going. Well, I don't know.
- [36:01]
C
And maybe it shouldn't be. Maybe the state should have better systems that would make that much easier for the colleges. Right.
- [36:08]
A
Well, I'll own that one and say that's on our state system to do on your behalf. That is not the colleges. That is the state that needs to figure that out to help. And we're working on it.
- [36:18]
C
But we're not there, not just the colleges in the state as a whole.
- [36:23]
B
And Chris, maybe go there, talk a little bit about what systems, what tools, what policy or infrastructure needs to be in place to make this possible to scale that we don't have today and can't be any individual college or employer's responsibility.
- [36:42]
A
Yeah. From that state perspective, what makes it difficult is there are multiple entities and multiple players in multiple different agencies with all different data sets and they're not linked. And we are making progress to link them, but they weren't linked for years. So we, we didn't have EDD data. We don't have linkages to franchise tax board data to our educational system outcomes. And then the kicker on all of it is, and for those limited situations where there might be that possibility, we draw correlations and conclusions without actually looking at what is this telling us. But at the state level, you know, we have labor and workforce development agency, but underneath them, they have multiple departments that house the different data sets within our educational systems. You know, we often operate in silos between K12 early learning, the community college system, UC, CSU, our independent partners, our workforce training partners. And because we were all structured independently and we all were given particular visions, we don't necessarily connect all of our data sets in the background. And then of course, there's data privacy. Right. All of our institutions are being told, protect your students data, protect your workforce data. There are illicit actors out there that want access to it and can do a lot with that information if we see it. Our system's currently dealing with fraud issues, bot student issues, students trying to access our system and they're using data sets that are out there. We can tell you that the data breach at the National Student Clearinghouse, they're clearly using the data that they obtain there to try and access our system. So it's balancing. How do you cut through those privacy aspects? How do you cut through each agency having a different vision, a different mission for what they're asked to do, and then doing it all in an environment where we're all under resourced, we all have staff that will tell us they're over taxed. Myself, our campuses, I have no doubt at labor and Workforce Development Agency, we all face those scarce resource constraints. We all do. And how do we transcend that? Usually it's just having the end. It's not. There's no formula or magic to it, but it's just having the right people at the right time in the right room at that moment, because everyone's motivated to do it. It's just when. When that moment occurs, are they all in the right room at the right time?
- [39:23]
D
I do think that the state level and the system level interaction is so critical because in addition to all the things you said, and we're just all highlighting how hard this is, these institutions are competitive a lot of the time, quasi competitive. You know, do you have a net inflow of transfer students? Have a net outflow of transfer students? That has an impact on your bottom line. So it really gets down to this, why we call about infrastructure like a highway, where something is supporting these capabilities that's happening at the state level, or between cooperation between the state institution and the Department of Labor, those types of things. It really has to happen at that level to coordinate across the institutions and the silos that exist.
- [40:02]
B
Absolutely, yeah.
- [40:03]
A
If I could just quickly relay this to our partners in the room here. It's also coming to our institutions and saying, how can we help? You know, listening to our faculty, listening to our administrators, saying, here are the challenges we face, and then saying, well, we can help you with that. Here's what we can do. Is there a partnership to be had? Is there a learning opportunity? Is there a collaboration that we can pull together? Because oftentimes we may not know what you can offer, you may not know how we're operating or what our particular staff member is an expert at. So having those conversations, just absolutely critical.
- [40:41]
B
Absolutely. Well, time has flown by. We're here, and I'm going to close on our last question. If you could make one concrete change to accelerate momentum for working adults by 2030, what would it be? Abby, do you Want to start?
- [40:55]
C
I'm going to stretch it to two expand credit for prior learning and the very creative ways that that the Chancellor's office is doing, including beyond military people participating in community based programs and non credit programs. And to really invest in expanding access and accelerating learning in some of the ways we talked about today and what we haven't really talked about yet is the integrated education and training model for English language learners and low literacy learners. Expanding supports, expanding work based learning and paying people for that work based learning and just really recognizing the importance of income supports. Sorry I couldn't limit it to one
- [41:43]
A
that's absolutely spot on, but I'm going to take it to the human side of the equation and say it's a thank you, It's a thank you to our staff, it's a thank you to our faculty, to our communities, and recognizing that we're doing what we can, all that we can constantly to meet the needs of our students, of our communities, of the nation around us. And recognizing that that's not easy and that's a lot of work and it's hard and it's difficult and it's stressful and just reminding the teams that we appreciate that effort, we recognize what you're going through to make that happen. And we can't say thank you enough for all that you do.
- [42:22]
D
Yeah, I think I would simplify a little bit all the complexity we've talked about today because I think even just having an institution recognize credit from another institution is something we're not to yet forget about the credit for prior learning. So for me, having infrastructure in place that there is a system that is a student centered system, transparent system that would allow a student to be able to tell from what they have, credits that they have in hand, what they need to be able to complete a degree at another institution anywhere in the country. Transparent to them and available to them that they can make their own decisions and get help from advisors and everything to be able to complete their degree. That would be a huge step forward on which we could build a foundation to these other issues around long term credits for prior learning and such round us out.
- [43:16]
E
Mine's more practical. It's building it into our apportionment model. Apportionment is one thing that everybody on my campus understands. We all talk apportionment, faculty, staff, students, the community. And if it's up front and center in our apportionment model, it makes everything a whole lot easier to talk about.
- [43:33]
A
There might be plans to do that in the works.
- [43:36]
B
All right. Thank you very much. Appreciate the conversation.