Shortcut: A victim’s perspective of the mental impairment defence *re-issue*

Summary

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Australian True Crime – Shortcut: A Victim’s Perspective of the Mental Impairment Defence (Re-issue)

Podcast: Australian True Crime
Host: Bravecasting
Episode Date: March 18, 2026
Guest: David Cammarata

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Episode Overview

This re-issued episode delves into the real-life impact of the mental impairment defence through the harrowing experiences of David Cammarata, survivor of a violent, seemingly random attack by his former best friend, Jonathan Dick. Following on from expert commentary by forensic psychiatrist Dr. Danny Sullivan in episode 216, host Meshel Laurie gives a platform to the victims and their families to articulate the ongoing fear, uncertainty, and trauma they endure after such violent events. The episode scrutinizes the forensic mental health system, exploring the outcomes for both victims and offenders when severe mental illness shapes criminal responsibility.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Thomas Embling Hospital and "Forensic Patients" ([00:12])

• Background:
  Thomas Embling Hospital is explained as Victoria’s secure forensic psychiatric facility. Patients are admitted either involuntarily under the Mental Health Act or as forensic patients via the Crimes (Mental Impairment and Unfitness to be Tried) Act.
• Noteworthy Cases:
  • Tony Abbott being punched by a patient, Sean Christian Price (who later committed a notorious murder).
  • Ross Konidaris’ case: from psychotically induced violent crime to repeat offenses while on release.
• Broader System:
  Dr. Sullivan (in a prior episode) made the case for the hospital's rehabilitative mission and successes but acknowledged public perceptions shaped by rare but severe recidivism.

David’s Relationship with Jonathan Dick—Before the Violence ([04:13])

• “He was a decent guy... very intelligent... heavy cannabis user.” – David
• Subtle Changes:
  Increasingly odd behavior raised concerns, including intense moods, withdrawal, and strange allegations due to paranoid delusions (“had some vision... of myself and his brother bashing him until his brain fell out... and all these angels came”).
• Quote:
  • “He was actually working at my house... noticing just the odd thing here and there that just didn’t... wasn’t like him exactly. Just a bit darker in tone.” ([04:13])

The Public Attack and Aftermath ([07:06]; [08:47])

• Shock and Media Coverage:
  David details hearing of the murder of Jonathan’s brother (David Dick), initially misreported and only slowly pieced together by David as the reality set in.
• Quote:
  • “Within a split second, I was like, well, they’ve got it wrong. That’s his brother who’s died. I thought it was Jono that had died... And then I was like, okay, shit, he’s killing people now.” ([07:06]-[07:21])
• Own Assault:
  Jonathan stalked and ambushed David with a hammer outside his house.
  • “He creeped out underneath from the stairs and then bang. I actually thought something had fallen off the roof and hit me in the head.” ([08:47])
  • “I wasn’t thinking straight... I mean, you could see right into my neck. A huge piece of skin flapped open.” ([09:53])
  • David describes the utter chaos and terror for his family in the aftermath.

Living in Fear — The Ongoing Trauma ([10:55] - [12:58])

• Displacement:
  The family was forced to repeatedly move, living with friends, relatives, and never feeling safe.
  • “We knew we couldn’t stay in our house... We lived with somebody for a week... friend had us, then my sister-in-law, three months... Move number three with three kids.” ([10:55])
• Constant Hypervigilance:
  • “My adrenaline must have been redlining... 24 hours a day, all day, every day. I’ve jumped at my own shadow. I’ve been swooped by birds and just about had a heart attack.” ([11:34]-[11:37])
• Stalking:
  Police were unable to find Jonathan for months; David describes the anxiety, especially after learning Jonathan had surveilled him for nine days undetected.
  • “He’d been stalking me, I think, for nine days... I had no idea.” ([12:00]-[12:02])

The Capture and Legal Outcome ([13:54])

• Capture:
  David eventually spotted and chased Jonathan with a colleague, leading to Jonathan’s arrest on the street where he had just been spying.
• Diagnosis & Court Findings:
  • Jonathan Dick was diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia and found not guilty by way of mental impairment.
  • Admitted as a forensic patient at Thomas Embling Hospital—after a period delayed by a lack of available beds.
• Quote:
  • “Justice Lex Lasry accepted that he was suffering the effects of a severe mental illness... and found Jonathan not guilty of murder, attempted murder and stalking by way of mental impairment.” ([13:54])

The Mental Impairment Defence—A Victim’s Perspective ([14:57])

• Enduring Uncertainty:
  • Unlike victims of “mainstream” offenders, there is no parole schedule or automatic notification. Even police receive only minimal notifications when the patient is allowed on leave.
  • “I was told by the homicide detective that even when he’s allowed out on day release, the police get notified, but not of what he has done... So they don’t even give me a phone call to say, Hey, we’re just gonna test him out down at Northland Shopping Centre or High Point Shopping Centre. Maybe steer clear of that place.” ([14:57]-[15:29])
• Persistent Impact:
  • David continues to struggle with complex PTSD, hypervigilance, and has to medicate to manage day-to-day anxiety:
  • “I these days have to take four different types of medication... it’s all those triggers... from opening doors to, I scold myself if I walk out of a door and I don’t look each way... I can’t handle if someone’s a few meters behind me.” ([15:29])
• Community Safety vs. Therapeutic Intent:
  • “If you allow him back out on the streets again, I get it that he may be better. But if you’ve gotten it wrong, which you clearly have in the past, it could cost me my life or somebody else. And I think that’s a big risk to take to the community.” ([16:58])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Sudden Violence:
  “He creeped out underneath from the stairs and then bang. I actually thought something had fallen off the roof and hit me in the head.” — David ([08:47])
• On Living in Fear:
  “I’ve jumped at my own shadow. I’ve been swooped by birds and just about had a heart attack. You name it, I’ve done it. But on the same token, all that stuff kept me alive.” — David ([11:34])
• On the Criminal Justice Gap:
  “You don’t know anything. We’re not allowed to know anything... The police get notified, but not of what he has done.” — David ([14:57])

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Key Timestamps

• [00:12] – Background: Thomas Embling Hospital and the forensic mental health system
• [04:13] – David recounts his and Jonathan’s childhood friendship and early warning signs
• [07:06] – Murder of Jonathan’s brother and David’s realisation of the attacker's identity
• [08:47] – Attempted murder: David describes the attack and immediate aftermath
• [10:55] – Life on the run: the family’s repeated moves for safety
• [11:34] – The psychological toll: hypervigilance and trauma
• [12:58] – Jonathan’s capture
• [13:54] – Legal process: mental impairment defence, hospital admission
• [14:57] – Lack of victim information and ongoing uncertainty
• [15:29] – Lasting impact and perspectives on community safety

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Tone & Language

The episode is candid, raw, and personal. David speaks plainly and emotionally about his trauma, while Meshel Laurie’s questions balance empathetic understanding with curiosity about systemic justice issues. There’s a persistent note of frustration and helplessness regarding the gaps in support and notification for victims in cases involving mental impairment.

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Summary

This episode provides a rare and unflinching look at the ongoing impact of the mental impairment defence, not just on individual victims but on their families and communities. Through David’s vivid recounting, listeners are brought face-to-face with the persistent anxiety and lack of closure that can follow such cases. The episode probes bigger questions about how the justice and mental health systems weigh therapeutic goals against victim safety and the needs for transparency and communication.

Transcript

[A]

With VRBoCare, help is always ready before,

[B]

during and after your stay. We've planned for the plot twists, so

[A]

support is always available because a great

[B]

trip starts with peace of mind. In episode 216 of Australian True Crime, we heard from Dr. Danny Sullivan, who's the Executive Director of Clinical Services at Thomas Embling Hospital in Melbourne. Thomas Embling is a secure psychiat facility. It's nestled in a leafy bend of the Yarra river on the same spot where the Yarra Bend Lunatic Asylum was established in 1848, when the area was still part of the colony of New South Wales. There are only two ways to be admitted to thomassembling either under the Mental Health act or under the Crimes Mental Impairment and Unfitness to be Tried Act. Under the Mental Health Act, a person with a severe mental illness who poses a threat to themselves or to others can be admitted for psychiatric treatment compulsorily at Thomas Embling. You'll find only the most challenging of people in that category, including those already in prison who develop severe mental illness or whose existing conditions escalate in that environment. But it's the people admitted under the crimes Mental Impairment and Unfitness to be Tried act, also known as the forensic patients for whom Thomas Embling receives most attention. These are the people who've been sent to the hospital by the court because it's decided they were either mentally impaired at the time they committed an offence or that they have a mental impairment. That means they can't stand trial for an offence. The offences in question are generally violent. Offenders aren't sentenced to set periods of incarceration under the Mental Health Act. They receive treatment under custodial supervision orders, ideally with the benefit of treatment and medication. Their conditions improve and they can apply for leave from the hospital. Some patients have jobs outside and return every night. An if and when staff are satisfied of a patient's recovery, they can be released back into the community. There have obviously been many, many patients who have re entered the community successfully and we've never heard about them again. Unfortunately, though, there have been some notable exceptions. In 2006, the then federal Health Minister Tony Abbott visited Thomas Embley and was punched in the face by a patient as he toured the acute care unit. The Sydney Morning Herald reported that the minister laughed off the attack, chuckling to journalists that some people probably thought his attacker had had a sane moment when he swung a punch at him. His attacker that day was a man by the name of Sean Christian Price, who was sent to Thomas Embling after a string of Violent rapes. Nine years after punching Tony Abbott Price murdered teenager Marcia Vukotic in a completely random attack. Ross Konidaris was suffering a psychotic break when he shot his grandparents in 2012 and then set their house on fire. The court found that his psych was induced by drug use, but that he had an underlying diagnosis of paranoid schizophrenia. And he was placed at the Thomas Emberling Hospital as a forensic patient. In 2019, while on day release, Kanadarris armed himself with a meat cleaver and scissors before attempting several home invasions. He later pleaded guilty to aggravated burglary, attempted armed robbery and assault. With all of that said, Dr. Sullivan definitely presents a compelling case in favour of the Thomas Embling Hospital and for the system it represents. But today we hear from David K. David's former best friend, the best man at his wedding is a man by the name of Jonathan Dick. Jonathan is now a forensic patient at the Thomas Embling Hospital. And David presents what I think is a pretty compelling case too. This is Australian true crime. We acknowledge the traditional owners of the land on which this podcast is created. The Wurundjeri Woi Wurrung People of the Kulin Nation and a warning. This episode of the podcast contains graphic descriptions of violence.

[A]

I don't know, we just sort of grew up in kind of in the country and we didn't have a lot to do. So, you know, there was, he was decent guy. I mean he's always quite jovial and. But he had a serious side to him and I mean he was quite intelligent as well, like very intelligent. And he was a heavy cannabis user. So I think that might have, you know, played a part somewhere along the lines I kind of went in a slightly different direction in a sense that I didn't get into any sort of party drugs or anything like that. You know, there was a sort of little bit of a separation there along the ways and then I sort of went with, you know, my wife and sort of started a life and he continued sort of on that. But he was a decent guy. I mean got into the footy and like to read comic books and stuff like that. So never had, we never really had any issues play basketball, just general, normal, suburban, fairly normal. Yeah. He was actually working at my house and I was picking him up and dropping him off cause he didn't have a license and I was noticing just saying just the odd thing here and there that just didn't. Wasn't like him exactly. So now just a bit darker in tone and he wasn't as Jovial. And I said, look, listen, just don't do the job anymore. Like, forget it, I'll pay you for the whole job and then I'll get someone. Because I thought that was making him upset.

[B]

How old was he at this stage?

[A]

Yeah, about 30ish. Rough, but yeah. So. And then the last thing that caused the fight was actually how it was publicized, a bit different. I got into a little bit of an argument over a pizza, just the size of the pizza. He was really specific about it, which was silly. But then I asked him to wait before I had to drive him home, which is quite a distance. I had a truck coming with some furniture and I said, can we wait another half an hour? And then that's where he started to carry on. And I had enough's enough and raised my voice. He raised his bit of swearing going on. So I paid him for the job and I said, don't, please don't come back. I begged him the night before not to come back to do the job. The contact had ceased. Right. So then it first started off with a few friends of mine ringing me, saying, oh, he's said X, Y or Z to them and asking them whether or not, you know, just different things that had never happened. And I knew that there was something going on. Apparently he'd had some vision of myself and his brother bashing him until his brain fell out. And then all these angels came. Put something along those lines. I was pretty full on. But obviously that didn't happen. I mean, and we didn't go to school together either. His brother went to school across town.

[B]

So do you remember when you heard that David had been murdered, they mentioned

[A]

his name on the radio. So I ran to the computer and I saw that vision in the shopping

[B]

centre, Doncaster shopping centre, waiting with a samurai sword and a knife for his brother David by the lifts.

[A]

And within a couple of. Literally within a split second, I was like, well, that's. They've got it wrong. That's his brother who's died. I thought it was Jono that had

[B]

died, because it's so clear, really so clear if you know the guy. Yeah, very clear that this him standing there in his tracky Dax, not even

[A]

like a question mark, it's just, bang, that's him. So I, I was like, started to get a bit stressed out, thinking, oh, my God, someone's killed him. I don't know what he's, you know, up to these days, but, you know, sad, sad regardless. And then I sort of got down a bit further and I was like, put two and two together going, okay, shit, he's killing people now.

[B]

So he was missing. He was on the run.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Police were looking for him.

[A]

Correct.

[B]

It's all over the media.

[A]

Yeah. And, I mean, everything started to get just odd after that, like thinking whether or not you could be next or. So you start living a different sort of life.

[B]

I read the story 100 times, but seeing that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

There's vision of it. We can clearly see you walking down your front steps, but there's another man waiting in your front yard. You can't see him as you're walking out your front door. Oh, it just made my stomach turn. It made me wanna cry, actually, to be honest. I just had the weirdest reaction to. It's the way you skip down the first few stairs.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You're so carefree.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, you're a bloke in the morning, skipping down those top. Yeah. Top few stairs of your beautiful house. But I can see someone's laying in wait for you. Someone's standing right there to ambush you. It's horrible.

[A]

Yeah. So he creeped out underneath and from the stairs and then bang. I actually thought something had fallen off the roof and hit me in the head.

[B]

I bet. And then he just keeps coming for you down the driveway.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You managed to fight him off that time. And then what, he just ran?

[A]

Yeah, he ran and I. There was a car and I thought, oh, awesome. Like, you know, because at the time, I. I mean, it hit me pretty hard. Right. And the. I was bleeding a lot, but I was also a bit dazed as well.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So I thought, I'll grab the car and then we can just, you know, follow him from behind, figure out where he goes and then, you know, can get it sorted out that way. But he. The car swerved around me and, you know, must have thought, you know, this crazy guy in the middle of the street. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So went, by the way, bleeding everywhere. And I was probably a bit amped up as well. And then I ran over and grabbed the. The hammer that he dropped and I thought, I'll chase him down. But at the time, my neighbors had come out and I actually stopped running, I think, and there's a lot of screaming. It was pretty crazy chaotic seeing the kids in that there.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So after that, I. I actually went in the house and my kids were crying and. And. Which was horrible. And I. I distinctly remember my middle child is saying, you know, you're okay. And I had a cloth on the back of my head, but I took it I thought it was a little scratch rugs. I wasn't thinking straight. So I took that off and I mean you could see right into my neck. And it's like, you know, the huge piece of skin that was flapped open. You could see it was, was brutal. He. Well, he sort of. Obviously he disappeared. Right. So then we, we end up. The worst part about this was the year that we, we went into after that was a year of, of I pretty much knew full well that he was. If he'd waited that long, he's going to come back again. Right. So we knew we couldn't stay in our house. So we, we packed up all three kids, some of our belongings, not even all of them. And then we went to live with somebody. So we lived with somebody for a week. Then we were living with a friend of ours and then we couldn't stay there forever. It was really kind of them to give us their space. Then we moved in with my sister in law. They've got two kids so you could imagine there's already five kids in a house. Plus they've got a life to live as well. So we lived there for three months and then we moved again. So that's, you know, move number three with three kids. Which is hard enough as it is.

[B]

At the same time jumping at shadows.

[A]

Yeah. As well as like trying to get, you know. And I was hell bent on not getting caught out again. And that causes problems down the track. Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's.

[B]

I mean your adrenaline must have been at redlining.

[A]

It was crazy 24 hours a day, all day, every day. And I'm not even embarrassed to say I've. I've jumped at my own shadow. I've been swooped by birds and just about had a heart attack. You name it, I've done it. But on the same token, all that stuff kept me alive. Right. So I can't complain. He'd been stalking me, I think for nine days or something previous to us captioning.

[B]

But you had no idea.

[A]

I had no idea.

[B]

You literally had not seen or heard from him in a year.

[A]

No. Yeah. Exactly.

[B]

Since that day in your driveway. Nobody had.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

He was the most wanted guy in Australia. I think at the time, like, you know, literally posters. It was everywhere. Victoria police trying everything to find this guy. Could not find him.

[A]

That's right. And we. I'd been. That he'd been stalking me and I hadn't seen him. I hadn't actually caught a glimpse of him. But I was aware of what was going on around me. So he'd been pretty good like that, but in his not being seen. But the very Monday I pulled into work and I caught a glimpse of him. But when I say I caught a glimpse of him, it was so slight and from such a distance away that I look back on it now and, like, I was so ready for what was going on. So I'd driven in, and luckily, thank God, I got a car park right on the ground level. And he was on Flinders street, just near Hosier Lane, just peeking out like someone sort of peeking around a corner. And I saw a hat pulled down, and it looked like a disguise. Right, and.

[B]

And he was looking at you?

[A]

Yeah, he was watching me. I chased him up Hosier Lane. I actually had my colleague with me, Dion, who is much bigger, much stronger than what I am, thank God, and he was with me. And I. I took off. Like, I didn't wait for him, and I was well in front of him, but when I saw him, I sort of was a bit like, I wasn't sure. I didn't want to just go and grab some, you know, some guy and, you know, start punching and kicking him because, you know, get in big trouble for doing that. So I date him a little bit, and then he took off and I slipped over, and then he ended up running. We actually caught up with him exactly in the same spot where he was spying on me. And then as soon as we. We caught up with him, he sort of. We subdued him.

[B]

In September 2020, after hearing evidence from two forensic psychiatrists that Jonathan Dick had been diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia, justice Lex Lasry accepted that he was suffering the effects of a severe mental illness when he killed his brother and attacked David Cammarata. He found Jonathan not guilty of murder, attempted murder, and stalking by way of mental impairment, and ruled that he be admitted as a forensic patient to the Thomas Embling Hospital. Unfortunately, as is often the case, there were no available beds. So Jonathon actually spent years in a psychiatric ward in prison. It strikes me that families who have the parole issue to deal with after a certain number of years, they know when that's gonna come back up. That comes up every three years, say. And so it's horrible, but every three years they have to get back out there in the media and they have to retell the story and relive it, but they know when it's coming. Yeah, you don't know that.

[A]

Don't know anything. We're not allowed to know anything. Even. Even I was told by the homicide detective that even when he's allowed out on day release, the police get notified, but not of what he has done. All those things, they just get told that if this person, they get sent some kind of message to say that this type of person is out, but not with specifics. So they don't even give me a phone call to say, hey, we're just gonna test him out down at Northland Shopping Centre or High Point Shopping Centre. Maybe steer clear of that place.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Again, I'm sure that they help people. Not a problem. And I'm not. Don't mean to completely demonize the place in that sense. Cause I understand people do have mental health issues and they need to be helped. However, I've got somebody and the loss of life for me personally, outside of David who passed away as well, which did affect me, my concern is with my own life, obviously. So them getting it wrong means that I potentially get stalked again. And if you've lived a good few years under the type of pressure and stress of having someone stalking you, it creates a lot of issues in every part of your life. I these days have to take four different types of medication and these aren't all conscious. The problem with me is it's. I've got all those triggers from day to day life and that's from opening doors to I scold myself if I walk out of a door and I don't look each way, I can't handle if someone's a few meters behind me, I've got an IDM and then I've got to move. Things like that won't go away. And I look at it and I think if you allow him back out on the streets again, I get it that he may be better. But if you've gotten it wrong, which you clearly have in the past, it could cost me my life or somebody else. And I think that that's a big risk to take to the community.

[B]

Thank you to our guest, David Camarata. We should note that the Victorian State Government has recently undertaken an upgrade of the Thomas Embling Hospital, which has seen an extra 80 beds added to the facility. There are now around 200 beds in total. If you need support after listening to this podcast, you can call Lifeline on 131114 or contact 1-800-Respect on 1-800-737-732 or 1-800-Respect. Org AU. Indigenous Australians can contact 13 Yarn on 139276 or 13yarn.org AU.

[A]

The producers of this potter recognise the traditional owners of the land on which it's recorded. They pay respect to the aboriginal elders, past, present and those emerging.