Australian True Crime – Shortcut: Has Australia Become a Conspiracy Nation?

Date: August 3, 2025
Host: Meshel Laurie
Guests: Arielle Bogle (The Guardian), Cam Wilson (Crikey) – authors of Conspiracy Nation

Episode Overview

In this compelling episode, Meshel Laurie speaks with investigative journalists Arielle Bogle and Cam Wilson about their book Conspiracy Nation and Australia’s unique relationship with conspiracy theories. They explore how these beliefs are created, spread, and acted upon—sometimes with tragic consequences. The discussion zeroes in on infamous Australian conspiracy cases, why some citizens are susceptible to conspiratorial thinking, and the social consequences for individuals and communities.

Main Theme:
An exploration of how conspiracy theories have taken root in Australian society, the psychological and cultural drivers behind them, and their connection to real-world events—most notably the deadly 2022 shooting in Weeambilla, Queensland.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Australia? The Rise and Roots of Local Conspiracy Theories

• Conspiracy theories reflect national fears and values:

  • "The conspiracy theories that take off here, the ones that are created here, it's not an accident. They reflect the things that we are really scared of. They reflect the things that we think are really important."
    — Arielle Bogle [03:54]

• Longstanding Australian conspiracies:

  • Classic examples include odd tales like "Was Pharaoh poisoned by American gangsters?" or "Was Harold Holt stolen away in a Chinese submarine?" but also darker ones, such as the Port Arthur massacre being a government plot to take away guns, or fluoridated water as government mind-control.
    — Cam Wilson [04:21]

• Growing political influence:

  • While not accusing all Australians of conspiratorial thinking, the guests stress that these mindsets have risen to significant political and social influence in recent years.
    — Cam Wilson [04:21]

2. “Sovereign Citizens,” Pseudo-Law & Extreme Outcomes

• “Sovereign citizens” phenomenon:

  • Described as people who challenge government authority at trivial levels ("I'm traveling, not driving, thus you have no jurisdiction over me"). Viral videos of this behavior circulate widely on social media.
    — Cam Wilson [05:08]

• The Weeambilla shootings:

  • A notorious case in Queensland where two police officers and a neighbor were killed by brothers Gareth and Nathaniel Train and Stacey Train, who were influenced by sovereign citizen and broader anti-government conspiracies.
    — Host [06:03]; Cam Wilson [06:16]; Arielle Bogle [07:08]
  • The perpetrators held a combination of anti-government, anti-vaccine, and apocalyptic religious beliefs, and felt threatened by authorities even during a welfare check.
  • "They believed ultimately that the police were coming there to kill them."
    — Arielle Bogle [07:08]
  • Their beliefs were amplified by long-term isolation and deep engagement with online conspiracy communities.

3. The Paradoxical Response of the Conspiracy Community

• Self-sealing logic:
  • The broader conspiracy community did not see the Weeambilla shooters as “one of their own” despite sharing similar beliefs. Instead, new conspiracies about the event emerged—false flag claims, government land grabs, etc.
    — Arielle Bogle [10:51]
  • "There's this common thing that happens in conspiracy theory communities where they're called self-sealing, which means that every new piece of information, no matter what happens, somehow goes to prove their existing beliefs."
    — Arielle Bogle [10:51]
  • Despite evidence, others in the community immediately distanced themselves:
    • "There was no sense of community. It wasn't like, we've lost one of our own. As soon as it happened, the people in the rest of these communities immediately said, you know, these aren't one of us, they're someone else, and turn their story into yet more proof that they were on the right side."
      — Arielle Bogle [11:48]

4. The Mechanics of Conspiratorial Thinking

• The “false flag” concept:

  • The idea that tragic or shocking events are orchestrated by authorities to justify new laws or actions; e.g., Port Arthur massacre and US Sandy Hook shooting as supposed pretexts for gun control.
    — Host [14:48]; Arielle Bogle [15:20]
  • "The false flag is this idea that events aren't what they seem. ... Actually, this is more proof that there are schemes against us."
    — Arielle Bogle [15:20]

• Motivated reasoning:

  • People gravitate toward explanations that fit their feelings or worldviews rather than impartial fact.
    • "We mostly go through the world with sort of a vibe based approach. Maybe we have a feeling that something's not quite right...so we sort of pick at the evidence and choose the evidence that best suits our narrative."
      — Cam Wilson [17:15]
  • The appeal of being a “truth-seeker” or hero at the center of a grand narrative.
    — Cam Wilson [17:15]

5. Complexity, Mistrust, and Modern Life

• Information overload & trust issues:

  • Many conspiracy theories thrive because the world feels too complex for anyone to fully understand, creating space for alternative explanations:
    • “All the things that we kind of do and depend on are just so complex that it's really just hard for any individual to understand…. So, you know, the conditions for people to believe things that aren't real are there, and they're often the conditions that are the same for us to believe things that are real.”
      — Arielle Bogle [18:36]

• Empathy and relationships:

  • Breaking someone’s hold on conspiracies is rare, but possible when trusted people maintain a connection and listen:
    • “In the circumstances where people say, I changed my mind, it's often because someone lent, like, an ear…they just listened and they understood…”
      — Arielle Bogle [18:36]
    • “You never know, that thread might be the one that pulls them back.”
      — Cam Wilson [20:25]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "The conspiracy theories...reflect the things that we are really scared of."
  — Arielle Bogle [03:54]

• "You can call them anti-government activists, you call them sovereign citizens, they were anti-vaccine as well, that are all kinds of beliefs."
  — Arielle Bogle, on the Train family [07:08]

• "There's this common thing that happens in conspiracy theory communities where they're called self-sealing, which means that every new piece of information ... goes to prove their existing beliefs."
  — Arielle Bogle [10:51]

• "People don't remember what you say, they remember how you make them feel."
  — Arielle Bogle [18:36]

• "We mostly go through the world with sort of a vibe based approach.... We sort of pick at the evidence and choose the evidence that best suits our narrative."
  — Cam Wilson [17:15]

Important Segment Timestamps

• Australia-specific conspiracies introduced: [03:54]
• Sovereign citizen movement explained: [05:08]
• Weeambilla shooting case details: [06:03 – 10:08]
• How conspiracists respond to violence in their circles: [10:51 – 11:48]
• The “false flag” concept and Port Arthur example: [14:48 – 15:20]
• Psychology of belief and motivated reasoning: [17:15 – 18:36]
• Empathy, relationships, and escape from conspiracy worlds: [18:36 – 20:25]

Conclusion

This episode of Australian True Crime offers revealing insights into why Australia has become ripe ground for conspiracy thinking, the community dynamics that fuel such beliefs, and the devastating real-world impact conspiracies can have. The conversation is driven by empathy and curiosity rather than condemnation, providing both critical context and a nuanced view of a pressing social issue.