True Crime Tonight: To Catch a Predator

Summary

Australian True Crime – True Crime Tonight: To Catch a Predator
Host: Meshel Laurie
Producers: Matthew Tankard, Ruby Bartzis
Air Date: July 26, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode explores the darkness lurking within everyday Australian life and beyond, focusing on how crime reaches even the most seemingly mundane communities. Special attention is given to the phenomenon of relationships formed with prisoners, the controversial legacy of "To Catch a Predator" and its host Chris Hansen, and a detailed look at the sensational Murdoch murders in the United States.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Listener Interactions: Prison Relationships

[03:15 – 06:25]

• The trio reflects on a listener question about relationships started with people in jail, referencing their previous discussion with Belinda Bates and her partner Pete, who met while he was serving time for murder.
• Meshel Laurie recaps the unique nature of the relationship between Belinda (working in rehab at the jail) and Pete (mentor, not a patient), describing it as rare and perhaps not to be emulated:
  • Quote: “If I was your sister, you would go, what are you doing? … There’s no way in the world you are having a relationship with a bloke who’s been in jail for murder.” — Meshel Laurie [04:08]
• Matthew Tankard and Ruby Bartzis point out that most prison romances they've encountered or discussed have been disastrous, with the relationship often deteriorating post-release.
  • Quote: “Once you come out of the jail, they kind of fall back into the rut of being you’re actually quite a shit person?” — Ruby Bartzis [05:24]
• The hosts put out a call for listeners with non-glamorous experiences to share their stories:
  • Quote: “If this rings a bell ... I would love to do an episode of Australian True Crime with someone who has a different experience, shall we say, of marrying a prisoner.” — Meshel Laurie [06:02]

2. Documentary Deep Dive: "To Catch a Predator"

[07:25 – 12:14]

• Meshel introduces a discussion of the crime documentary Predators, focusing on the infamous TV series To Catch a Predator and its host Chris Hansen.
• Matthew Tankard, a self-declared Chris Hansen aficionado, details the show’s format: adults caught arranging meetings with minors (decoys) for illicit purposes, only to be confronted by Hansen and a television crew, often ending in police arrest.
  • Quote: “He would make this person sit down … and read out the most graphic text messages that the guy sent.” — Matthew Tankard [09:00]
  • Quote: “Then when they eventually run out of the house, police dressed in camouflage gear tackle them down to the ground and arrest them.” — Matthew Tankard [09:42]
• All agree the show is compelling yet raises tough questions about ethics and the boundary between journalism and vigilantism:
  • Quote: “Everyone would just reiterate that it is the worst idea. It makes for great watching … but it is also a very, very unethical [show].” — Matthew Tankard [10:06]
• The consequences, including one accused’s on-camera suicide, are discussed, and the pivot from journalism to “cowboy” amateur entrapment on streaming platforms is critiqued.
  • Quote: “Sometimes they just bash them or they just do really surreal things … eat out of a dog bowl. Like, it’s really crazy stuff.” — Matthew Tankard [11:53]
• Laurie suggests a more rehabilitative approach absent from the show:
  • Quote: “Imagine if … there were counselling services … to stop this behaviour.” — Meshel Laurie [12:14]

3. The Murdoch Murders (with Kayla Brantley, Journalist)

[12:57 – 19:26]

• Brantley introduces listeners to the convoluted case of Alex Murdoch, a South Carolina attorney whose life unraveled after the murder of his wife and son in 2021.
• The discussion covers:
  • The Murdoch family’s prestige and subsequent fall from grace.
  • Allegations of Alex’s multiyear financial crimes ($19 million stolen).
  • Multiple suspicious deaths tied to the family (maid, boating accident fatality).
  • His murder conviction (since overturned) and ongoing legal battles.
  • The involvement of the court clerk, Rebecca Hill, who allegedly influenced the jury and published a tell-all book.
    • Quote: “She basically was saying, you know, this guy is guilty, really pushing them to find him guilty.” — Kayla Brantley [17:32]
  • The thrown-out conviction means Murdoch faces a retrial and potentially the death penalty.
    • Quote: “He will never get out of prison. He has so many other cases and so many other financial crimes … no matter what.” — Kayla Brantley [15:56]
    • Quote: “That is on the table, and that is something that happens in South Carolina.” — Kayla Brantley [16:56]
• Brantley speculates about Murdoch’s psychology and the unimaginable horror the murders wrought on the family.
  • Quote: “You can just only imagine the horror of Paul, who would never expect that from his father … and then he turns the gun on her. It’s just unimaginable.” — Kayla Brantley [18:53]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On prison relationships:
  “It’s like they were workmates. Except Pete wasn’t allowed to go home at the end of the day. Or he was home.” — Meshel Laurie [03:56]
• On the TV legacy of To Catch a Predator:
  “It’s one of those shows that was parodied then on everything from South Park to, like, Workaholics …” — Meshel Laurie [08:13]
• On the documentary’s ethical dilemma:
  “How far does our lack of empathy for these guys go?” — Meshel Laurie [10:29]
• On Murdoch’s retrial:
  “That conviction was overturned and he will be granted a retrial thanks to the court clerk who was found to have influenced the jury.” — Kayla Brantley [14:49]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:15] Listener Call & Discussion: Prison Relationships
• [07:25] Review and Recap: “To Catch a Predator” & Chris Hansen
• [09:40] Format and Climax of To Catch a Predator
• [10:45] Unethical Aspects and Real-World Consequences
• [12:57] Kayla Brantley on the Murdoch Murders
• [14:49] Key Details: Murdoch’s Trial, Overturned Conviction, and Court Clerk’s Role
• [16:56] Implications: Death Penalty and Justice System Shortcomings

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Tone & Style

• The conversation is candid, insightful, and sometimes darkly humorous.
• The hosts balance reverence for victims and seriousness of crimes with a frank, occasionally irreverent Australian conversational style.
• Complex issues are unpacked thoughtfully without sensationalism.

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Summary

In this episode, Australian True Crime probes relationships formed behind bars, the vigilante spectacle of “To Catch a Predator,” and the labyrinthine Murdoch murders. The episode blends pop culture analysis, ethical debates, and deep dives into the realities behind headlines—showcasing both the fascination and the human cost of true crime.

Transcript

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[Ruby Bartzis]

Warning.

[Michelle Laurie]

This is a true crime segment and not suitable for children. It contains references to sexual violence and suicide, which some listeners may find distressing. If you need support, you are not alone. Contact Lifeline on 13, 11, 14 or visit lifeline.org au for 24 hour support. We interrupt shock. We don't know precisely. It's a voice that will send shivers down your spine.

[Matthew Tankard]

Standoff with police wanted fugitive step 19 times.

[Michelle Laurie]

The suspect lured the victim into the war. Biggest legal dramas in Hollywood.

[Listener]

Today is a major win to show

[Michelle Laurie]

what the system can do.

[Matthew Tankard]

This is true Crime tonight.

[Michelle Laurie]

This is true Crime tonight. I'm your host, Michelle Laurie and I'm here with my producers, Matthew Tankard. Hi, Michelle and Ruby Bartzis. Hello. Oh, good evening. Because it's Sunday night. That's why we're here. From six till seven every Sunday night, we bring you a true crime book club and we talk about documentaries. We chat with our listeners and we interview some really interesting true crime kind of people. Don't forget this true crime show. So it's not for kids. Okay, Coming up later this hour, we'll talk to Kayla Brantley, who is a journalist, an American journalist. She's based in New York City. So can you imagine?

[Matthew Tankard]

Could you imagine that? What else do you need to hear?

[Ruby Bartzis]

Oh, and I think she works for Daily Mail.

[Michelle Laurie]

I. I know she does. And I've said, yeah. And I've said, you're so Right, Ruby? Enough said. And she's talking about the Murdoch murders, which a lot of you will be going, oh, God, I know exactly all about this, and if you don't, you're gonna love it. But up next, we hear from a listener.

[Listener]

Hey, guys. Love the podcast. Last week's episode with Belinda Bates was so, so good. And I would love to hear a case about, you know, a relationship that's also been formed in a jail. But maybe it didn't work out. It was just so good last week, you know, hearing Belinda and how she met Pete while she was working at the jail. That would be awesome.

[Michelle Laurie]

I couldn't agree more.

[Ruby Bartzis]

I also couldn't agree more.

[Michelle Laurie]

Yeah, I thought. I felt almost guilty. I thought. I don't. For those of you who can't remember or, you know, maybe you haven't caught up yet, on the last couple of episodes, you've got lovely Pete Bates and lovely Belinda, gorgeous couple. And their focus is on talking to people about coercive control and patterns, you know, recognising patterns in relationships that can become dangerous and all those things. But where they met was in jail, because Pete was in jail, he was serving time for murder and Belinda was working in a drug rehab centre in the jail. And I should also say that Pete wasn't a patient, he was a mentor. He was sort of working.

[Matthew Tankard]

This is only his last few years in prison, I think, getting off drugs and.

[Michelle Laurie]

Yeah, sort of working in the program as well. So it's like they were workmates. Except Pete wasn't allowed to go home at the end of the day. Or he was home. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm jealous. I'm very jealous of their relationship. He seems like the best guy I've ever heard about in my life. And then I think. I know, right then I said to Belinda, but if you and I were friends, if I was your sister, you would go, what are you doing? It's not happening, mate. There's no way in the world you are having a relationship with a bloke who's been in jail for murder. I'm not having it.

[Ruby Bartzis]

Well, imagine going in your family and being like, I am dating this guy and he's in jail for the next four years. Was it?

[Kayla Brantley]

I think he had.

[Matthew Tankard]

Still in her family, her dad was a prison guard.

[Michelle Laurie]

Look, on paper, it's crazy, but it has worked out. But I did think, like our caller here to the True Crime Hotline. As we were, I was talking to both of them, I thought, oh, this is. I can't encourage people to Pursue relationships like this. Like, I feel like this is a miracle. One off. We did an episode. I spoke about it to both of them. I know the episode's called the Wags of True Crime. Meet the Wags. That's what I called it, thinking I was very funny at the time. Meet the Wags is the name of the episode of Australian True Crime, so you can dig that out. And it was with an author, a lady who'd written a book with a number of these women, women who had married guys in jail or guys who had just gotten out of jail. And I have to say, I think without exception, they'd all gone terribly wrong.

[Kayla Brantley]

Well, is it.

[Ruby Bartzis]

Don't they say, like, once you come out of the jail, they kind of fall back into the rut of being you're actually quite a shit person?

[Advertisement Announcer]

Yes.

[Michelle Laurie]

That was, you know, angry. Not as these poor women were. Like, everyone in their life was going, yeah, mate, like, what did you think was gonna happen? And the women were all saying, but you don't understand. When he was in jail, he was romantic and he had so much time on his hands. Right, okay. To fantasize, to write these beautiful letters and all that kind of stuff. And so, yes, I guess I'm gonna use this opportunity to put a call out and say, if this rings a bell to you, I would love to do an episode of Australian True Crime with someone who has a different experience, shall we say, of marrying a prisoner. Because I think it's only fair, Yeah, I think it's only fair to everybody if we talk about how it also can go if you marry a bloke who has done serious time for serious crimes. Please get in touch with us. You can find us on social media and how else.

[Matthew Tankard]

Matthew, that listener left us a voicemail through our True Crime hotline. You can find a link to that in any episode of the Australian True Crime podcast or on our Australian True Crime social media. And you know what? If we don't hear from anyone having a bad experience, and I'm just gonna go ahead and assume that it's a 100% success rate.

[Michelle Laurie]

I thought you were gonna vote.

[Matthew Tankard]

True Crime Tonight will recommend you go find.

[Michelle Laurie]

I thought you were gonna volunteer. I thought you were gonna say, if

[Matthew Tankard]

you can't find me, I'll go gonzo and I'll get in there.

[Michelle Laurie]

I'm gonna get in there and I'm gonna meet somebody and just. That'd be interesting. Day by day of a relationship. You're listening to True Crime Tonight. Coming up next, we have a Recommendation. It's. Look, it's a lot of things. It's all things to all people, this recommendation. There's an upcoming movie, there's a. And there's just something that Matthew has fallen head over heels in love with

[Matthew Tankard]

around Australia. This is True Crime Tonight with Michelle Laurie, Ruby Bartces and me, Matthew Tenkard. Coming up, we've got an interview with Kayla Brantley about the Murdoch case. But first, Michelle, over to you for a true crime documentary review.

[Michelle Laurie]

Well, it's actually kind of over to you, Matthew, because this is a pet subject of yours that you got me interested in. And I was flicking around just this weekend looking for something to watch and I found, I said, oh my God, that's that bloke Matthew's always on about lately. The documentary's called Predators and it's about the To Catch a Predator.

[Matthew Tankard]

Ah, yes, Chris Hansen.

[Michelle Laurie]

Chris Hansen. That series that was on TV years

[Matthew Tankard]

ago, I've become Chris Hansen. Sick. I've just been watching if you saw like my YouTube algorithm. It's just all of it's his old show and his new show. So To Catch a Predator. It aired in the early 2000s.

[Advertisement Announcer]

Oh, really?

[Michelle Laurie]

Could have sworn it was the 90s.

[Matthew Tankard]

Nah, early 2000s. Ruby, are you across? Chris Hampton.

[Ruby Bartzis]

I actually have no clue who he is.

[Matthew Tankard]

I wonder if you recognize him in pop culture because he became this like icon after this.

[Michelle Laurie]

It's one of those shows that was parodied then on, on everything from south park to like workaholics to, you know, comedy shows would have a To Catch a Predator moment.

[Matthew Tankard]

Yeah. So they would go into a chat room, pretend to be like a 14 year old girl, talk to some guy, tell him to come over, say, oh,

[Michelle Laurie]

my parents are away.

[Matthew Tankard]

Yeah. And then they would have a decoy in the house who would be an over 18 actor, but looked younger, put on like a baseball cap. The Predator would come inside, she would go, oh, I just gotta go get something for my bedroom. One sec. And then Chris Hanson walks out with a whole like, what do we call it? A whole like dossier.

[Michelle Laurie]

Yeah. So this man in a suit would suddenly appear from the hallway and with this wad of papers and he would just go, hi.

[Matthew Tankard]

What were you doing here tonight? Yeah, so he would, he would make this person sit down. He would sit right in front of them and read out the most graphic text messages that the guy sent. And then he'd go, what did you mean by that?

[Ruby Bartzis]

Oh, I love that.

[Michelle Laurie]

So often they bought alcohol and.

[Ruby Bartzis]

Oh, that's disgusting.

[Michelle Laurie]

Yeah, it is.

[Matthew Tankard]

Something weed.

[Ruby Bartzis]

So then after that, what did he do with those?

[Michelle Laurie]

Well, so they'd be. After that.

[Matthew Tankard]

Yeah, after that. So there's like three big moments in a. In a To Catch a Predator episode. It's the first moment when Chris Hansen walks out. The second moment is when he reveals to them that not only is he there and he's caught him, there's also a TV crew here and all the, you know, the boom mic guy comes out and puts a microphone right in his face.

[Michelle Laurie]

Cameraman.

[Matthew Tankard]

And then when they eventually run out of the house, police dressed in like camouflage gear tackle them down to the ground and arrest them.

[Michelle Laurie]

Screaming, screaming.

[Matthew Tankard]

It's incredible tv. And if you were to speak to any criminologist, anyone who. Everyone would just reiterate that it is the worst idea. It makes for great watching. And I know a lot of people just go, oh, who cares about these guys? Lock them up, whatever.

[Michelle Laurie]

Yes.

[Matthew Tankard]

But, you know, it is also a very, very unethical.

[Michelle Laurie]

Rather predictably.

[Matthew Tankard]

Rather predictably.

[Ruby Bartzis]

I'm into it.

[Michelle Laurie]

Yeah, you're into it.

[Advertisement Announcer]

Yeah.

[Michelle Laurie]

Look, I get it. This is it. There's no sympathy for these guys. Right. So.

[Matthew Tankard]

But is that what this doco is about? Does it talk about that side of things?

[Michelle Laurie]

Absolutely. Because the kind of the apex of the doco is the guy who takes his own life. And again, this is not a spoiler. I mean, a lot of people, it's very famous story that led to the show ending, but in the context of the show, it's like, that was inevitable. It was like, well, of course that was going to happen eventually. And again, how far does our lack of empathy for these guys go?

[Listener]

So.

[Michelle Laurie]

But the other thing is, don't forget Robert Pattinson. That was your gateway.

[Matthew Tankard]

Yeah. Robert Pattinson is gonna play Chris Hansen in a dramatized A24 movie about it, which is gonna be incredible. You know, there's just. So, as we were saying before, about how much of an icon Chris Hansen is and how much he's constantly refere. It's now a whole genre of, you know, content creators now online, like on YouTube and especially on like those. More Those streaming sites that don't have much regulation, where it's all like the manosphere stuff like kick, you know.

[Michelle Laurie]

Yeah, right.

[Matthew Tankard]

They will do the Chris Hansen method of. But, you know, I'm sure with it To Catch a Predator and everything else Chris Hansen's done, they do have somewhat. They have experts on there to make sure that they're not entrapping people.

[Michelle Laurie]

Oh, for sure.

[Matthew Tankard]

All that kind of stuff.

[Michelle Laurie]

And also, he was. And he is a very experienced journalist. I mean, what I learned from the doco was this all grew out of. He did a big report in Cambodia about child sex trafficking. So, you know, for Dateline, like, he was a massive journo of, like, 40 years experience.

[Matthew Tankard]

Yeah. Whereas now it's just like cowboys, and it's really like. And just brutal. Like, they meet up with people and then they just. They.

[Michelle Laurie]

Sometimes they just bash them.

[Matthew Tankard]

They bash them or they just do really surreal things. Like they make them, you know, eat out of, like, a dog bowl. Like, it's really crazy stuff. And, you know, obviously, again, everyone who. Someone. You'll always see the same thing. Someone will comment saying, like, this is messed up. And then all of these other people replying to that comment being like, oh, what do you do? Yeah, are you a predator? Are you a predator yourself? Like, why do you care about this guy?

[Michelle Laurie]

Imagine if it wasn't a TV show. And imagine if when this blew up, there was police there, there were counseling services, there were people to say, okay, we're popping you on a register, but we're also offering you this help to stop this behaviour.

[Matthew Tankard]

This is gonna be a way out.

[Michelle Laurie]

Yeah. Cause a lot of the guys did express that, didn't they? A lot of guys were sort of like, can you help me? Would be saying to Chris Hansen, those were the ones that broke my heart. Cause I thought, oh, mate, don't ask him for. He does not want to help me.

[Matthew Tankard]

Chris Hansen is not there to help you.

[Michelle Laurie]

No predators on Paramount. Plus, you're listening to True Crime Tonight. This is True Crime Tonight around Australia. And joining us to talk about the Murdoch murders is Kayla Brantley.

[Kayla Brantley]

So I host a weekly podcast called the Trial usa. This case has really gripped the nation. There have been documentaries on it since it's happened. And this just happened in 2021. So within five years, there's been multiple documentaries. There was even a TV show with Patricia Arquette playing Alex Murdoch's wife, Maggie,

[Michelle Laurie]

which I love, by the way. I love that show. Do you love it?

[Kayla Brantley]

Oh, yeah. Patricia Arquette, she's incredible. I love anything she's done.

[Ruby Bartzis]

Same.

[Michelle Laurie]

How would you describe it? Sort of. Because a lot of our listeners will be, like me and you, fascinated by it, have been following every moment, have watched all the TV shows. But some others may not be really sure what we're talking about. So it's so complicated. But how would you describe this story in a nutshell?

[Kayla Brantley]

Okay, I will try my best. But essentially, Alex Murdoch, he is a South Carolina attorney. He was born into this prominent legal family and he honestly appears appeared to have it all. He had a family, a booming business, you know, sons and a beautiful wife and very wealthy family. Then back on June 7, 2021, about, you know, a little over five years ago, everything just imploded when his wife Maggie and his 22 year old son Paul were shot dead at the dog kennels on the family's estate. That's their Moselle estate in South Carolina. This double murder, it then sparked a chain reaction that ultimately exposed and uncovered Alex Murdaugh's scandal plagued double life. Essentially after the murders, we find out that he allegedly orchestrates a bizarre botched murder for hire plot on himself. Then we uncover that there were all these mysterious deaths tied to the family that included a death of the family's maid and another teen girl who was killed in a boating accident. And then this all culminates when Alex Murdoch was convicted for the murders of his wife and son back in 2023. And just when we thought things were over back in May, that ruling was completely overturned. That conviction was overturned and he will be granted a retrial thanks to the court clerk who was found to have influenced the jury. So this is where we are at now.

[Michelle Laurie]

Unbelievable. Just where do you start? I suppose we can start with the other element which some people call a motive, which is that Alec Murdoch had been, apparently had stolen about $19 million from his clients. And of course that would come to light if a divorce case was brought against him, which apparently Maggie was seriously considering at the time of her death.

[Kayla Brantley]

Yeah. So the motive that the, the authorities have put forward was, was that he did this murder to try to cover up and distract from his mounting financial crimes that were about to be exposed. And that, you know, he is also, while he did get convicted of murder, that's now overturned, he will never get out of prison. He has so many other cases and so many other financial crimes and there's so much still mounted against him that no matter what, whether this conviction is overturned and then goes to trial, and if he's found to be not guilty, he will never get out of prison.

[Michelle Laurie]

Which brings us to why attempt to have his murder convictions overturned? Because doesn't he stand to get the death penalty if possibly, if they go to trial again and they have a different judge and a different jury and it comes out differently, he's never going to get out of jail, but he might end up with the death penalty. Is that true?

[Kayla Brantley]

Yes, yes, that is exactly right. That Alex Murdaugh does face the death penalty. That. That is on the table, and that is something that happens in South Carolina. And to get the death penalty, you have to be convicted of that and another crime along with the murder. So in this case, prosecutors have said that they would seek the death penalty.

[Michelle Laurie]

So why are we having a retrial? We have one woman in particular who is. Has been the focus of this part of the case, hasn't she? That is Collerton County Clerk of Court Mary Becky Hill. Tell us about Mary Becky.

[Kayla Brantley]

Rebecca Hill is a very interesting character. She was the court clerk, which meant that her responsibilities were to, you know, shuffle the jury in and out, to really just oversee them. But with those duties, you are not meant to speak about the case to the jury, influence them in any way. And she completely went against everything that she was meant to do. Her position as a court clerk was she was actually elected into that role. And the jury alleged that. She basically was saying, you know, this guy is guilty, really pushing them to find him guilty. And then once he was convicted, she published a book. She published a tell all that. What they allege, what prosecutors allege, is that she wanted a guilty verdict because

[Michelle Laurie]

that would sell books definitely benefit.

[Kayla Brantley]

And that book had. Yeah, I mean, it is a better storyline, but, you know, she has since pulled that book from the shelves. There have been many insights into, you know, who Alex Murdaugh was. You know, is he a narcissist? Is he mentally ill? Yes. He claims he was addicted to drugs. But to go that far, there truly has to be something off. And you can just only imagine the horror of Paul, who would never expect that from his father, Maggie, who, you know, according to evidence, had to witness her son get killed by his father, and then he turns the gun on her. It's just unimaginable. For now, Alex Murdaugh has a little less than a year to prepare with his team and for his sake, hopefully bring new evidence that will exonerate him.

[Michelle Laurie]

Thank you so much to our guest tonight, Kayla Brantley. And if you'd like to hear more about that, listen to the full conversation. You can do it by checking out our podcast, Australian True Crime. It's available on the iHeart app or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening to True Crime tonight. You can join us next Sunday and every Sunday from 6 till 7 around the country. We'll see you then.

[Ruby Bartzis]

Bye.