Demi Lovato on Healing, Marriage, & Life After Child Stardom

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Demi Lovato on Healing, Marriage, & Life After Child Stardom"

Podcast: Baby, This is Keke Palmer
Host: Keke Palmer
Guest: Demi Lovato
Release Date: March 3, 2026
Episode Theme: Healing, personal growth, relationships, and honesty in life after child stardom.

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Overview

This season premiere features a deep, honest, and frequently light-hearted conversation between Keke Palmer and Demi Lovato. The two former child stars dive into the realities of growing up in the entertainment industry, healing past wounds, the complexities of finding identity and happiness, and the joy of celebrating hard-earned personal and creative freedom. Topics range from the pressures of being child stars, mental health advocacy, public persona versus private self, marriage, music, and self-acceptance.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Opening Reflections & Current Joy (00:00-07:54)

• Keke sets the tone for a season focused on nuanced, meaningful conversations rather than "gotcha" moments.

• Demi shares her gratitude for her husband and their approaching one-year anniversary. (03:01)

• Emphasizes the importance of being able to laugh at oneself in relationships and life (03:14).

• Demi says she wishes she was asked more about mental health in interviews, emphasizing authentic check-ins like, "How’s your heart?" (04:03)

  “That question always resonates with me because it establishes, like a meaningful connection right then and there.” – Demi (04:03)

• Demi expresses her present happiness:

  “I’m at a level 10 out of happiness… I feel serene. I feel peaceful. I feel excited and… happy.” – Demi (07:23)

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2. Child Stardom: Barney to Disney Channel (08:23-19:22)

• Demi began her career on Barney at age 8, after an initial rejection when she was 5 because she couldn’t read yet (08:53–09:39).

• Discusses her transition to Disney Channel, first with "As The Bell Rings" and, after some disappointment, landing both "Camp Rock" and "Sonny with a Chance" (10:49–11:45).

• On being a young lead:

  “It’s hard to carry a show by yourself at 16 years old… I did struggle on that show.” – Demi (12:12)

• Keke and Demi share the pressure of being young family breadwinners and lacking the space to "just be kids." (13:10–13:35)

• Demi candidly discusses coping through partying and self-medication to process adult-level pressures as a young teen (13:36–14:04):

  “If you're going to work me like an adult, I'm gonna party like an adult… I got into some bad stuff at a young age, and that's when I started, like, self-medicating.” – Demi (13:26)

• Difficulties with older partners and exploitation become clear in hindsight:

  “Why was my boyfriend 30, girl?” – Demi (14:24) “When I turned 30, I was like, that’s not okay, girl.” – Demi (14:38)

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3. Industry Competition, Friendship and Role Modelling (15:21–19:37)

• Demi and Keke discuss friendships within a competitive industry that often pits young stars against one another (15:21–17:20).

• The importance of early friendship with Selena Gomez, whom she knew from Barney, providing a rare sense of safety.

  “There’s room for everyone… you have your own voice, your own lane.” – Demi on advice from her mom (16:23)

• Processing the pressure to be a “role model” and redefine it as a “real model”:

  “I don't look at myself as a role model because I have never made mistakes… I continue to work on myself daily. And that's my way of being a role model for others.” – Demi (18:35)

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4. Camp Rock & Stardom: The Turning Point (20:26–24:03)

• Realization of life-changing stardom came both from booking "Camp Rock" and hearing "This is Me" with Joe Jonas for the first time:

  “When I heard that song that my was gonna be different. And it was a moment I’ll never forget.” – Demi (23:28)

• Performing again with Jonas Brothers as adults was extremely nostalgic and emotional (24:03).

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5. Healing, Self-Reflection, and Compassion (26:19–33:16)

• Demi’s breakdown after the Camp Rock 2 tour led to reflection and making amends, especially through the Alcoholics Anonymous process (26:37–28:02).

• Both reflect on self-protective behaviors as child stars—Keke became overly cheerful, Demi became withdrawn or defensive (28:41–30:03).

• The need for self-forgiveness and not holding self-hatred for survival behaviors is highlighted:

  “We were just trying to do. To move forward, like whatever bad attitude or whatever you were doing that was making you difficult, it's like that's what you had to do to get through.” – Keke (28:17) “Sometimes the decisions that we're making are because we're hating ourselves for things we did to survive.” – Keke (28:17)

• Demi reflects on what she truly yearned for as a young person:

  “I wanted someone to see me… I wanted to be experienced as a human.” – Demi (31:10)

• Both discuss the difference between external validation/beauty and true self-worth:

  “What’s left is going to be my soul… I want to exude beauty from my heart and not just from my skin.” – Demi (33:16)

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6. Love, Marriage, and Support Systems (33:34–35:26)

• Demi describes feeling truly “seen” by close friends and her husband, embracing being loved “flaws and all” (33:51).
• Emphasis on cherished human connections over career:

  “No job is going to be waiting with you when you’re on your deathbed… It’s going to be the human connections.” – Demi (34:39)

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7. Business Mindset & Oversharing (35:26–38:53)

• Demi realized acting was a business as soon as she started getting paid on Barney—even kids teased her at school for it (35:26–36:19).

• Both reflect on the pros and cons of public vulnerability; Demi’s openness fosters a deeper fan connection:

  “I feel like I am… a champion at oversharing, period. But it's also created a space for my fans to share with me…” – Demi (36:51) “What are we healing tonight at this show? What are we healing together?” – Demi (37:54)

• Social media as double-edged sword for young stars—regretful posts and mistakes, but also a vehicle for authentic connection (38:53).

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8. Artistry, Albums, and Healing Through Music (39:28–53:21)

• Creation of “Sorry Not Sorry” as a pivotal moment; acknowledges healing and celebratory periods now surpass pain-centered creation (41:57–43:31).

• Rejects the myth that artists must always create from pain:

  “Sometimes you can just evolve, do the work, and then sit back and relax and enjoy the rest of the show.” – Demi (43:48)

• On "Dancing with the Devil…The Art of Starting Over" album:

  “I’ve gone through so many things that could have broken me… There is an art to picking up the pieces.” – Demi (45:02)

• Personal favorites from her catalog:

  • Most challenging: “Dancing with the Devil”, “Warrior”, “29” (45:44)
  • Most therapeutic: “Let You Go” (46:45)
  • Song that deserved more: “Let You Go” (47:24)
  • Dream collab: Lady Gaga (47:54)
  • Industry changes: Singles have a shorter shelf life, and going viral is unpredictable (48:42–50:38).
  • Artists should build their identity and not fixate on fleeting radio hits for validation (50:38–51:02).

• Current album “It’s Not That Deep” is light, fun, and love-inspired—her husband’s influence is central (51:05–53:21).

  “What really inspired this album, I would say, is my husband.” – Demi (51:18)

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9. Memes, Humor, and Internet Lore (54:12–56:26)

• Demi addresses the infamous “Poot Lovato” and “mug” memes with self-parody and humor:

  “I’m gonna take the power back and start having fun with some of the memes … it’s never too soon to laugh at yourself.” – Demi (54:46)

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10. Cookbook & Relationship with Food (56:42–60:07)

• Shares the emotional journey from disordered eating to writing her own cookbook “One Plate at a Time.”

  “I wanted to help other people find freedom with food, just like I did. And the joy of cooking… It's such a healing thing for me to do for myself…” – Demi (57:05)

• The cookbook is non-intimidating and aimed at those new to the kitchen or overcoming food challenges.

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11. Rapid Fire Disney Questions (60:07–61:51)

Fun lightning round on Disney favorites:

• Cheetah Girls over Wendy Wu
• Halloween Town over Twitches
• Camp Rock over Sonny with a Chance (Camp Rock reboot coming, Demi producing!)
• Xenon: Girl of the 21st Century over Smart House
• Lizzie McGuire Movie over Cowbells
• Jump In over Gotta Kick It Up

  “Keep your eyes peeled, though.” (on Camp Rock reboot, 61:23)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “If you're going to work me like an adult, I'm gonna party like an adult.” – Demi (13:26)
• “Why was my boyfriend 30, girl?” – Demi (14:24)
• “There’s room for everyone…you have your own voice, your own lane.” – Demi on industry competition (16:23)
• “I’m not a role model. I’m a real model.” – Keke, quoting Tupac (19:22)
• “What are we healing tonight at this show? What are we healing together? Because I know my fans, I’ve shared a lot of trauma, but my fans have shared a lot of trauma with me, and there’s a connection that we have that’s unbreakable.” – Demi (37:54)
• “Sometimes the decisions that we're making are because we're hating ourselves for things we did to survive.” – Keke (28:17)
• “I wanted to be experienced as a human.” – Demi (31:10)
• “What’s left is going to be my soul.” – Demi (33:16)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Introduction & Current Joy: 00:00–07:54
• Barney to Disney Journey: 08:23–19:22
• Industry Pressure & Friendship: 15:21–19:37
• Camp Rock & Stardom: 20:26–24:03
• Healing & Reflection: 26:19–33:16
• Being Seen/Love/Relationships: 33:34–35:26
• Business Mindset: 35:26–38:53
• Songwriting & Music Industry: 41:57–53:21
• Internet Memes: 54:12–56:26
• Cookbook & Food Relationship: 56:42–60:07
• Disney Lightning Round: 60:07–61:51

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Tone & Takeaway

The conversation is open, unguarded, and heartfelt, blending humor, nostalgia, and hard-won wisdom. Demi’s vulnerability and growth—embracing healing, joyful relationships, self-forgiveness, and creative evolution—anchor the episode. The episode is affirming for anyone who has ever struggled with identity, expression, or healing. Demi and Keke’s chemistry is palpable, making the insights hit even deeper.

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For Listeners:

Expect to walk away with newfound compassion for Demi’s journey, inspiration to embrace realness over perfection, and excitement for her new cookbook and celebratory pop era. The episode offers comfort to anyone healing from past wounds—and a reminder that it’s never too soon (or too late) to laugh at yourself.

Transcript

[Keke Palmer]

Hey, baby.

[Demi Lovato]

Welcome back.

[Keke Palmer]

This season feels different. Not because the conversations are louder, but because they're deeper. This show has never been about gotcha moments. It's not about headlines. It's not about proving a point. It's about perspective. It's about sitting with people. Not to agree, not to attack, but to understand. Pop culture moves fast, opinions move faster. But nuance, nuance takes time. And that's what we're making space for this season. We are choosing curiosity over certainty, context over chaos, conversation over combat. I'm not here to speak for my guests and I'm not here to speak over them either. I'm here to ask the questions that let you see for yourself. Because culture isn't a headline. It's a reflection. And this show, it's the mirror. So let's get into it. No matter what we doing in the car, just chilling, pop on Amazon music, sit back and listen. Life, love, sex, science, hovering it all, especially the bad. Cause money always evolved. No matter what it is, we gonna make it make sense. Nothing else to do but kick it with the homies and kings. So grab you a drink and a snack you enjoy and get into the vibe that only one you know it's your girl. This is Kiki. Baby, this is Kiki Palmer. Yeah. Hey, y'. All. Welcome to the season premiere of Baby, this is Keke Palmer. Our first guest is somebody who knows all too well what it means to grow up in the spotlight. She stepp into the industry as a child and evolved into a global superstar and best selling author right before our eyes. With nine studio albums, Grammy nominations and a brand new tour and cookbook coming out, her resume speaks for itself. Woo. We have a lot to get into and so please welcome the one and only Demi Lovato. Yes. Girl, you look so good.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you.

[Keke Palmer]

So do you. Absolutely loving this hair.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you.

[Keke Palmer]

When we were at the TikTok Fest together, oh my gosh, girl, the vocals were hydrated and fabulous.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you.

[Keke Palmer]

Your voice is just too damn good.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you so much.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes. That range, it gives me all the life I need. Now before we get into everything, I have to get into this pre show pull up question. So let me see what you were answering. Zodiac sign. I think I knew that you were a Leo.

[Demi Lovato]

I'm a Leo. I got a lion on my hand to prove it.

[Keke Palmer]

So this must mean you feel very Leo.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. Yes. Are you August? Yep.

[Demi Lovato]

August 20th.

[Keke Palmer]

August 20th. My best friend's August 9th. So I definitely love me a Leo. Awesome. Do you know your big three yes. So do you know your big three?

[Demi Lovato]

I don't know my big three, but I think my son is a Leo. I mean, I know I'm a double Leo somehow.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes, Double Leo on one of them. Okay, cool. Okay. Okay. I'm gonna have to get her birth time and where she was born to get into the video.

[Demi Lovato]

She's 25.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, so we can do it. I know it.

[Demi Lovato]

We can do it. I just. And I did it before, but I forgot.

[Keke Palmer]

Honestly, you have so many die hard fans. I'm sure they know it.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes, I'm sure.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes. Okay. What are you most grateful for today? My husband. Girl, congratulations. You guys are coming up on a year.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah, we're coming up on a year.

[Keke Palmer]

So insanely amazing to find your person. You know what I mean? It really, really is a relationship or friendship non negotiable for you has to be able to laugh at themselves.

[Demi Lovato]

Girl.

[Keke Palmer]

That's one of my biggest pet peeves. When people talk about what kind of guy you like, what kind of person you want to be with, I don't always know all the details, but I definitely could tell you they can't be like, super cool.

[Demi Lovato]

No. They can't take themselves too seriously. They have to be able to laugh.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes. I need that because I'm also goofy as hell. Like.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

If you're not able to laugh with me, then I'm just gonna look crazy. Okay. What's a question you wished you were asked more in interviews, the topic of mental health? Yeah.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

I'm always talking about mental health too. Good. And I feel like we. We really. I feel like we've gotten better. Like, think about when we were kids. I don't think we were ever talking about it.

[Demi Lovato]

No, absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

You know what I mean? In that generation. But I feel like now the conversation has come up a little bit more. But we need to get past the trigger words.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

And into, like, what it means to maybe even like, sustain good mental health before we start tipping into the dark.

[Demi Lovato]

And I think also just checking in with one another, like, how. How are you doing? Like, how's your heart? That question always resonates with me because it establishes, like a meaningful connection right then and there.

[Keke Palmer]

And that I'm present with you.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

Not just. Who is someone you've met that made you feel starstruck? Beyonce. What did y' all meet? When was this?

[Demi Lovato]

I met her at the. Maybe not inside. Maybe Elle. Women, something.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, one of the women things.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah, it was that. And I met her backstage and she was like. And first of All. I was so starstruck. But she was like, oh, my God. I'm such a fan of your music. And I was like, thank you so much. Like, you know who I am. I had, like, a moment where I just was. I totally fell apart. And. And it was. It was amazing.

[Keke Palmer]

One thing about Beyonce, she, like, a sanga, and she likes somebody that know that has talent. Oh, my God. So I'm not surprised by any of that because you, you know, incredible voice.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you.

[Keke Palmer]

I forget where I was with you when I had first heard you sing live, because obviously we all knew that you could sing. But it was one of these. Again, one of these events, and you didn't have nobody on stage. It was just. And you had this attitude, too, where it's like that don't come out here and sing. You know when somebody has that vibe where they just like, yes. La, la, la. And you held, like, some crazy long note. I mean, we all got started standing up and stuff.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you.

[Keke Palmer]

I forget what event it was, but it was everything. Okay. What's a mantra you live by and why? Family and friends first. It's never too soon to laugh at yourself. Yeah.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

You seem to have a good sense of humor.

[Demi Lovato]

I like to think so. Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

Like, to have fun and get into it. I'm the same way.

[Demi Lovato]

I love to have fun.

[Keke Palmer]

Well, I'm glad you're here. We're definitely gonna have some fun and get into it.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

And by the way, I mean, my girl is a brand mogul. Cause this is your water.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes. Cali water is. I have my own flavor. It's called. It's blood orange.

[Keke Palmer]

Ooh. Cheers.

[Demi Lovato]

Cheers. What?

[Keke Palmer]

I mean, cheers.

[Demi Lovato]

It's cactus water. Thank you. But it's super hydrating, rich in antioxidants, tons of electrolytes, and I personally just love this brand. I love the flavor.

[Keke Palmer]

It's got to stay.

[Demi Lovato]

I'm kidding.

[Keke Palmer]

Could you imagine? No. That would be crazy. It's really good, though, actually. Thank you.

[Demi Lovato]

I also brought you something else, which we'll get into in a second.

[Keke Palmer]

I need everybody to do this. By the way, take note from Demi.

[Demi Lovato]

I baked you some cookies today. They're chocolate chip cookies.

[Keke Palmer]

I don't know if you're evil or good because why would you do this?

[Demi Lovato]

I have my own cookbook girl, called one plate at a time, and it comes out very soon.

[Keke Palmer]

Babe, congratulations on the book.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you so much. So I brought you the book, too.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, you gosh. Cookies look so good.

[Demi Lovato]

But the cookies are.

[Keke Palmer]

I actually want to show you the cookies. Because they actually look like fake cookies. Like, that's how good they look. They don't just look like they taste like. They look like they taste good. Get into. Oh, my gosh. And they smell good, too. Can I keep the Tupperware?

[Demi Lovato]

Oh, yeah, you can keep it.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, my gosh. Thank you, sister. Of course. Establishment.

[Demi Lovato]

I wish I would have brought you, like, a cute, like, basket or something to put them in, but that's so authentic.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah.

[Demi Lovato]

I was like, what do I have in my kitchen? And you can keep it.

[Keke Palmer]

So I'm so happy. Thanks, baby. Of course. Yes.

[Demi Lovato]

Well. And here's the cookbook.

[Keke Palmer]

Thank you so much. Well, speaking of, how's your heart? How you feel? I want to ask you the question you'd like to be asked. How's the vibes feeling with you today?

[Demi Lovato]

The vibes. Okay, so I. I'm at a level 10 out of happiness. Like, that's the only way to describe it. I'm just. I am so fulfilled. My heart is so full. I'm so grateful for the relationships, the people in my life, my husband, what I. Getting to do this for a living. Like, I'm just so grateful. I'm excited. I've got so much coming up, but, like, my mental health. I feel serene. I feel peaceful. I feel excited and. And happy.

[Keke Palmer]

That is such a good feeling. And honestly, it's like. It's also one of those things where it's always ebbs and flows with life. So when we have these moments where everything is hitting on all cylinders, it's really important to hold on to and lean into, because we know it's going to be a tough day. We're going to have, you know, things going to happen. But, like, that overall just kind of like, balance vibe is so good. Like, I'm so happy to hear that because I feel similarly. Oh, good. Yeah, good. We gotta go back to the beginning because both of us started out as kids. Yeah, but you started out on Barney, girl.

[Demi Lovato]

I did.

[Keke Palmer]

Barney. I love Barney.

[Demi Lovato]

Dinosaur. I did, too, girl.

[Keke Palmer]

When I was little, my mom used to make me and my sister, like, whenever we would argue, we would sing the Barney's sister song, where it's like, sometimes we're real close friends, we stay up late and talk at night. Like, I was obsessed with Barney, so

[Demi Lovato]

I never saw that song. I never performed it.

[Keke Palmer]

It was like, oh, oh, oh. Cause, you know, it's. When we think about it, Barney, for

[Demi Lovato]

a long time, a long time, he

[Keke Palmer]

was like, yeah, iconic. Iconic. So what was that like for you? Working on that show and getting your

[Demi Lovato]

start in that way, it was so much fun. And I.

[Keke Palmer]

If you remember anything, because how old?

[Demi Lovato]

I do remember I was 8 years old when I filmed it. So I actually had auditioned when I was five and they didn't book me because I didn't know how to read yet. And they were like, how are you going to memorize your lines? My mom would. In the audition, she drew pictures next to each line so I could remember what the line was about. Anyways, it didn't work out when I was five, but I auditioned a few years later and ended up booking it. And it changed the course of my life. And I give Barney the credit for like, really starting my. My career in acting. It was my first film and television job, so.

[Keke Palmer]

And so where. Where was this at? Was this from where you're from? Where are you from?

[Demi Lovato]

I'm from Dallas.

[Keke Palmer]

You're from Dallas? Yeah. Did you do this in Dallas?

[Demi Lovato]

I did. They filmed it in Dallas and it was a dream come true. I loved Barney as well and had toys. Barney toys and everything growing up. And so to be on the show was. It was so sick.

[Keke Palmer]

I love that you mentioned being called an old soul at a very young age. How do you feel like that helped you in your era of Disney, where obviously, like, I don't know how soon after that that was. Maybe not like, what, four or five years. And how old were you when you started working with Disney?

[Demi Lovato]

Disney? I was 14. My first gig with Disney for a while. Yes. Yes. Well, I was auditioning for a while. I wasn't booking a lot of jobs. I would book commercials here and there and like a guest role on this show. But like, it was not consistent work after Barney to Disney Channel. And once I did end up working with Disney Channel, that's when my career really skyrocketed and just like took off for me and the rest is history.

[Keke Palmer]

And would you say that it was. Were you immediately auditioning for Sonny With a Chance or did you kind of work? Cause, you know, working with Disney, sometimes they have you doing other stuff and then slowly you get your own show. How did it happen for you?

[Demi Lovato]

I booked a show called as the Bell Rings, which was. Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, you know, it. As the Bell Rings.

[Demi Lovato]

Okay, well, I did as the Bell Rings, which for those who don't know, is a like 5 minute show that they would air on commercial breaks. And that was my shoe in with Disney Channel. And then they brought me in to audition for. They actually had me audition for Jonas. The TV show?

[Keke Palmer]

Yes. I Remember? That was quick, that show. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Demi Lovato]

And I didn't book it. I got down to the wire on it, and I was so devastated. And they were like, you know what? We want to pull you in to audition for two other projects. If you're like, come on in and audition. And I was like, you just told me no, like, I don't want to do this, but I'm going to give it another shot. So I went in and I was so defeated. But I put my all into these two auditions, and it ended up being Camp Rock and Sonny with a chance.

[Keke Palmer]

That's crazy.

[Demi Lovato]

And I booked them both.

[Keke Palmer]

That's crazy. I mean, I think back on it was this Garry. When Garry Marsh was up on this shout out to Garry Marsh. And it was also the other guy, too, with him that I cannot. Adam Burrell.

[Demi Lovato]

Oh, my God.

[Keke Palmer]

Adam Burrell. Garry Marsh. That was their whole era where Disney Channel. I feel like it was really at what we considered the Disney Channel height.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

So sunny with a chance. You had your own show. What was that like? Because having your own show, it's very fun and cool, but it's also a lot of pressure. I'm curious how it was for you.

[Demi Lovato]

I think for me, I had so much fun working on Disney Channel. I was thriving, but at the same time, it was coupled with a lot of struggles. I was struggling with my mental health at the time, so I really was kind of. I let the pressure get to me, and it was really challenging. It's hard to carry a show by yourself at 16 years old. And I ended up having a blast. I made incredible friends that, you know, I've stayed friends with, and it was a good experience, but it was a lot of pressure and I did struggle on that show.

[Keke Palmer]

What do you think was the hardest part for you? Cause I know for me growing up, like, I don't know what your background was in Dallas, but I came from a very, like, lower working class family. So getting into Disney, Nickelodeon, having my own show, I became the breadwinner of my family. Just by Chelsea. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's like. It's just what happened. They had to help with my career, and it was. We had. We're seeing money that we never had seen.

[Demi Lovato]

Oh, absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

That stress for me, especially not being able to process it, that was like a big triggering point. And then never wanting to, like, be sad or make anybody feel, like, bad about it because I don't want them to be stressed, like, you know, and then not having a lot of time to like, have fun and be a kid.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah. You know, for me, I actually was like, if you're gonna. I had this, like, mantra that was like, if you're gonna work me like an adult, I'm gonna party like an adult.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh.

[Demi Lovato]

And I got into some bad stuff at a young age, and that's when I started, like, self medicating. And I wish that, you know, I had stayed more focused. Obviously, I think the course of my life would have gone in a different direction. Meaning, like, I wouldn't have maybe struggled as much with substances later down the road. But, like, everything happens for a reason. And I'm sitting here in this state of mind today, like, grateful and for everything that I've been through.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah.

[Demi Lovato]

But, yeah, it was really challenging. There wasn't a lot of time for play, but when I did, I played pretty hard.

[Keke Palmer]

I mean, that's very. I know we didn't want any of the drama. I know we don't want any of the drama of it, but I feel like people don't understand, like, that that's what we was dealing with. I found myself dating a. I'm 15. Why is my boyfriend 20?

[Demi Lovato]

Why was my boyfriend 30, girl? You know what I'm saying?

[Keke Palmer]

Like, I'm not smiling at that, but that is real. We was trying to find outlets, though. Outlets. You know what I'm saying? And also a way to process this. And nobody our age, I mean, could understand.

[Demi Lovato]

Nobody our age could understand. But then you look back, in hindsight, when I turned 30, I was like, that's not okay, girl.

[Keke Palmer]

The moment when you realize, and you get the age that a lot of people that were around you and doing stuff, you though. It's almost a mental break that can happen because you realize, yeah, you were taking advantage of. Oh, I was being exploited.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, this was. That is. Was very difficult for me when I. Because at 15, I'm thinking, like, my boyfriend's older because I'm doing an older job and I'm doing a bunch of things, and this is the way that it is. And it seemed normal in my mind. But then I got.

[Demi Lovato]

Especially if you're an older soul, too. Especially if you're mature for your age.

[Keke Palmer]

I love the Hillary Duff song.

[Demi Lovato]

Oh, my God, me too.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. Because it's like, oh, we all had the same damn life.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

You know what I mean? Where we keep. People kept telling us, you're so much here for your age.

[Demi Lovato]

I also. I also wrote a song about that. It's called 29. And when you listen to it, you'll I think you'll be able to relate to it.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh my gosh. I was very excited to talk to you because I knew that we were going to be able to relate to so much of these things. But in speaking of that, like, you people might think, well, you're surrounded by other people. You know, there's Miley Cyrus and there's Selena Gomez and. But there's a lot of competition that the industry put in those times in space. When we were kids, I almost felt like a lot of times me being black, I was kind of left out of the conversation. Like, you know, people weren't really involved with me in it, you know, which, I mean, it was, it's kind of was positive. And I feel like in a lot of ways, because I felt like I would be watching on the outside a lot of those different mechanisms happening and I would be kind of like, okay, that's interesting. How was it for you trying to make friendships when you have these corporations, you know, using us all as products and then always pitting like, who's the number one girl? Like, that makes it hard to actually become friends with people that might relate to your experience.

[Demi Lovato]

Well, what was beautiful is Selena and I had a friendship prior to Disney Channel because we actually were on Barney together. And so I felt this safety when I came into the Disney Channel, having a built in friendship there already. And I'm so grateful for that, Will always be grateful for the friendship that I have and continue to have with her. But I, you know, it was, it was challenging when, you know, people are comparing you to one another and you naturally have insecurities at a young age, so you start comparing yourself to other people. But one thing my mom always instilled in me was like, there's room for everyone. It's not a competition. And even though there are, like, it can be competitive. And if you have that mindset, it definitely is competitive. My mom was just always like, there's room for everyone and you have your own voice, your own lane. And. And that's what I really stuck by. And that's what kind of got me through that period. So, like, I was always rooting for everybody.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's true. It is. It is true that everybody has their own lane. And it is difficult, though, sometimes in those spaces for that to be able to be made clear, you know, But I just think back and it's like, I often wonder, what if I did share a little bit more about what I was experiencing instead of being so insulated and afraid what more friendships I could have made or with my peers, because I'm not friends with a lot of people in our industry. Because I was always. For me as a kid, being on those sets and working and like I said, being, you know, considered marginalized in a lot of ways, I was kind of like, let me just go to work, do my job, you know. You know, whatever. But I think about it now, especially when so many of us have shared our stories or even the documentary you did where you were speaking to other people in our. In our career path, where it was like, damn, I wonder if we. You know, if we was able to really express ourselves more. How many more of us could have at least created a safe space with each other? So it's cool to be able to talk about it now.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah, definitely. Absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

You've been open about feeling like you've had to live up to this role model role, which, again, yes. Working with major corporations, especially ones like Disney or any of the kids stuff, that's kind of the whole vibe. It's very. It pushes that before you even know who you are. To be a model love.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

How have you handled over the years processing that, not feeling guilty about that and kind of becoming, you know, your own person outside of that?

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah. I don't look at myself as a role model because I have never made mistakes, and I have followed the rules and this and that. I really haven't followed the rules, and I've gotten into a lot of trouble, and. But I've learned from them, and I haven't let those mistakes break me or change who I am. Like, I think I'm a person that believes that we are here to evolve, and evolution is very important to me. And so I continue to work on myself daily. And that's my way of being a role model for others, is just being like, you know what? I'm gonna learn from my mistakes, and I'm gonna teach you all what I've learned from them so that you don't have to go through it.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, I feel that. I feel like that's what I remember Tupac Shakur used to say, I'm not a role model. I'm a real model. Meaning if I can be anything is real, you know, and be owning my truth, and if that can be of an inspiration of just for you to walk your own path, then cool, you know, but the whole, like, try to

[Demi Lovato]

be, like, perfect, it was never me, never me. Like, I could never. I couldn't even fake it. Like, seriously, I'm grateful for the way that my life has turned out, and I feel like I'm better for it, having learned from my mistakes.

[Keke Palmer]

And I do think that's why everybody has always rocked with you, you know, what you've represented in those spaces. Even when we was all kids and everybody was really trying to be even more perfect than the generation and culture we're in now, you was always like, look, I'm Demi, guys. Come on. You know what I mean? And people resonated with that. Let's talk about Camp Rock, though. I mean, like, obviously we know Sunny with a chance, but, like, Camp Rock, like, it was really just a cultural classic hit. Thank you. When you were doing that show, did y' all know? Did you. Was there a moment in time where you were like, oh, my life is gonna be changed forever. Like, you know what I mean? Or did. It wasn't unexpected.

[Demi Lovato]

There was a pivotal moment when I realized my life was gonna change, Baby.

[Keke Palmer]

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[Demi Lovato]

first off, it was when I got the phone call that I had booked the gig. It was the hottest job in town, and.

[Keke Palmer]

Come on.

[Demi Lovato]

And I got that coveted spot, and my life changed from one phone call. But then there was another moment, which was when I heard this is Me back for the first time with Joe's voice on it. And I was. And the Jonas Brothers were already making a name for themselves, already had a career. And I was like, holy. Like, this is gonna change my life.

[Keke Palmer]

And that was. This is me.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

This is exactly where I'm supposed to be.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah. And so I knew when I heard that song that my was gonna be different. And it was a moment I'll never forget.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, my God. And then you stepped back on the stage with the Jonas Brothers recently. What was. They did. What is that like when y'. All. Cause it's almost, like, surreal. It's like, we still up in this thing. Yeah, we've been over 20 years, y'.

[Demi Lovato]

All.

[Keke Palmer]

What's up? Like, what does that feel like, to have those moments you guys created? The moments that have really, like, symbolized at least the beginning of you building your brands and your career, and you're still here together.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah, Well, I was 15 the first time that we ever performed together, so to be 15. And then last year when I performed with them, it had been 17, 18 years since the first time we had stepped on stage together. And it was so nostalgic. I, like, almost cried when I heard the intro to the song, like, about to go on stage. I was like, this is so magical. And, you know, it was great seeing them, and it was really special.

[Keke Palmer]

It's very surreal. I remember when me and Nick did scream queens together, and it was just like, last time I seen you, we was doing a damn jingle jam tour. You limited jingle jam tour back in the day.

[Demi Lovato]

Oh, my God.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes. Like, girl, it was such a subculture. When we look back, like, it's like radio shows. All of them. Radio shows.

[Demi Lovato]

And you did the circuit. Yeah, you did them. You would say hi and meet new people, make friends. It was so fun.

[Keke Palmer]

It was so fun. And we was really little kids with jobs, which is just so funny to me. When you look back on that era, whether it's Sonny with a Chance or Camp Rock, like, what so stands out to you or what might be surprising to fans about what? You look back on that time and think, wow.

[Demi Lovato]

I mean, there's so many emotions that come to mind when I think about that period of time in my life. I have a lot of compassion for my younger self because we were held to such high standards at such a young age, that I really have compassion for myself and an understanding of what I was going through. I think I was so hard on myself at the time that I wish I'd had more grace for myself. And looking back, like, you know, I can have that grace and compassion for my inner child today, but I also have so much gratitude. I mean, those years. Those were the years that started it all for me. And I have very fond memories, some not so fond memories of the struggling that I had when filming those shows. You know, being. Having struggled with an eating disorder while on camera was really challenging. I struggled with my mental health, very much so. But ultimately, like, very fond memories, I made friends that I will have for the rest of my life.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, my gosh. I love that so much. When do you feel like this kind of zooming out started happening for you? Were you able to kind of separate from, you know, your childhood and see. See what you experienced with new set of eyes? When would you say that started happening for you?

[Demi Lovato]

You know, when I first. I had, like, this breakdown right after this Camp Rock 2 tour that I did. I had an incident where I basically had a breakdown. And it caused me to do a lot of reflection. And so a couple years after going through that and dealing and going through the program of Alcoholics Anonymous, there's a step in there. The ninth step is to make amends. So I had to make amends to a lot of people saying, like, I'm sorry. I was so challenging to work with at the time. I was so miserable in my own skin and dealing with what I was going through that I wasn't the nicest person to work with at the time. And I think that chapter of my life where I was being really reflective of everything and I wanted to make sure I wanted to write my. And so that was, like, a few years after Disney Channel and Then I. I've continued to reflect, and over the years, I've just gained more and more compassion, especially after shooting Child Star. You know, just getting to have conversations with people that were in the same position as I was was really impactful, and it made me really reflective on that as well. And. And so, yeah, I've just. I've continued to have grace and compassion for myself.

[Keke Palmer]

What I love so much that you said that I think is really important. I want to pull it out, because I think it applies to anyone, is that we get into these. We don't even know. Sometimes the decisions that we're making are because we're hating ourselves for things we did to survive.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes. Oh, my God.

[Keke Palmer]

You know what I mean? That's so important, what you just said, because a lot of times we don't know why we putting ourselves in these situations, but we're putting ourselves in situations that aren't really helping us. They're actually hurting us. And it's actually because we're mad at ourselves, and we're mad at ourselves about that. We were just trying to do. To move forward, like whatever bad attitude or whatever you were doing that was making you difficult, it's like that's what you had to do to get through. You know what I'm saying? But.

[Demi Lovato]

And I mean, I was 17. You know what I mean? 16, 17. Like, I don't know. I just wasn't always the nicest. Because what happened was, is when people would come on set and they'd say, good morning, Demi. How are you? In my head, I would literally think, you don't care about me. You're just right. You don't really care how I'm doing.

[Keke Palmer]

But it was true, though. You weren't wrong, you know, I mean, not to say that. It's not to say that, but it's. You were dealing with. That's actually valid.

[Demi Lovato]

And I just wanted so badly for someone to see that I was struggling. And when I ended up having my breakdown, like everyone did, and I was able to explain to people afterwards, like, it wasn't personal. Like, when I showed up and was bratty on set, like, that was not my intention. I was just doing, like, exactly what you said, doing what I had to do to survive.

[Keke Palmer]

And I know exactly what you mean when you talk about. So what I did was this weird thing that I'm now trying to get myself out of where because everybody wanted me to be great all the time. And I knew when they would ask that they really didn't think I was fine. I became like the satirical character that everybody knows me to be today, which is. Yes. Like, I became. I would go overboard because I'd be so mad. Like, I would be inside actually kind of angry. And so instead of. Instead, I would just be like, yes. It was my version of trying to, like, fight back against that same feeling that you're talking about where you know that the adults around you just want

[Demi Lovato]

you to do the job they just want you to do.

[Keke Palmer]

So they're saying everything and doing everything, but it's fake. And so that was me being, like, fake, bad.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

You know, so it's like, I really do relate to what you're saying because it can kind of drive you crazy. And it's like, there is no right or wrong way, even as an adult, to deal with that level of intensity. And so I just think it's great what you're saying, because whether people was child entertainers or whatever, like, we all have moments in our lives where we didn't give ourselves grace for what we were trying to do to move forward and to survive. And we can end up making choices in our lives because we forgot to forgive ourselves.

[Demi Lovato]

Oh, God.

[Keke Palmer]

And it's like, damn, that's so true and so powerful. But that's what you said. So I wanted to make sure that the folks heard it at home. You know, you said something before, too, that I really relate to, where you said, I wish somebody had told me I was beautiful. Because at the time, you didn't believe it when. If somebody did tell you that. Because I think when we hear beautiful, we just think, like, on the surface, but it's different. I imagine you mean something so much more deeper than just beautiful. But just like, I'm important beyond this or what I'm servicing.

[Demi Lovato]

Well, the reality was I had so many people telling me I was beautiful. I had millions of people online or in person, fans that I would meet, you're so beautiful, or whatever it was. But I guess what I was saying with that sentiment was, like, I wanted someone to see me, and I wanted someone to experience me. And I think, like, I wanted someone to see my soul, even though my soul was hurting. Like, I wanted. Yeah, I wanted to be experienced as a human. And also the fact of the matter was I was really struggling with my body image and my self worth. And to be told, you're beautiful. I wouldn't have even been able to hear it because I was struggling so deeply. But, yeah, what I wanted was to be seen on a spiritual level, like, on an emotional, human level.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. And I think that tracks. Like, that's why so many times we do, like, try to outsource our ideas of beauty or externalize it in a. Being a size 2 or being, you know, these perfect eyes or lips or whatever. Basically because we're trying to figure out how to be experienced and how to. How to reach that feeling that we're trying to get. But so much of the world constantly keeps telling us that it's outside of ourselves that we reach for some of these things that lead us in this weird path of just like, now I gotta buy this new outfit.

[Demi Lovato]

Or, you know, there's billion, billions of dollars in the beauty industry that constantly is telling us we need something new and something more to compete or to hold a candle to other people. And it's just like, if we fall victim to that, we're just constantly going to compare ourselves to other people for the rest of our lives. And it's. It's so. And. And I fall victim to it too. I, you know, buy the skincare, I buy the products. I get a little Botox or whatever it is, right? And like. But I do have to check myself sometimes and be like, all of this is gonna fade at some point, and I'm. What's left is going to be my soul.

[Keke Palmer]

How.

[Demi Lovato]

How I attract people is not going to come from the outside. It's going to come from within. And if I can start doing that now, like, that's. That's. I don't know. That's the type of person I want to be. I want to exude beauty from my heart and not just from my skin.

[Keke Palmer]

What is being seen and experienced. Because I really loved how you put that, because I really relate to it. What does it look like for you, for people to really. When people really are seeing you, the people in your life that get a chance to know you, what does it mean when you feel like they're seeing you and they're experiencing the real you?

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah, I think last night I sent a picture to one of my best friends in the world. Her name is Allie. I sent a picture with, like, my silk hair cap on, my retainer in and my glasses on right before bed and was like, you know, and it's like, she's seeing the real me. My husband sees the real me. Every time we go to bed and wake up in the morning, he sees the real me. And it's just like, it's flaws and all, and there's still acceptance. And what's important is there's love there. And that connection is the most important thing to me in my life, my career is so important to me. But it could all go away as long as I have my friends and my family and my husband. Like, that's what's so important to me.

[Keke Palmer]

I feel the same exact thing.

[Demi Lovato]

Because no job is going to be waiting with you when you're on your deathbed.

[Keke Palmer]

No.

[Demi Lovato]

No job is going to be there. It's going to be the human connections that you've made in this lifetime. And that's what I hold onto. That's what I cherish.

[Keke Palmer]

I love that. I also love the idea of whenever I can be in complete silence with somebody.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes, girl.

[Keke Palmer]

When I talk about nothing. But we feel so connected.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

That gives me life. Because.

[Demi Lovato]

Oh, my God. Yes, Come over. We'll watch a little tv. We'll sit in silence. We'll like, I just want to be with you.

[Keke Palmer]

When did. And maybe it was like this from the beginning for you, but when did it go from just like, this is what I love to do. I'm a kid and I'm having fun to, this is a business. This is my career, and I'm a businesswoman. When would you say that shift happened?

[Demi Lovato]

When I started making money, period.

[Keke Palmer]

So immediately I knew that.

[Demi Lovato]

Immediately. Exactly. Exactly. When I started getting the checks from Barney, which were not very much, I realized that this was a job and I had a responsibility, and it was to show up on set, memorize my lines, and do the work. And so that I could, granted the money that I was making, it did go back into the family, but it also went into molding the rest of my career, which was. It paid for voice lessons, it paid for guitar lessons, it paid for piano lessons, it paid for dance lessons and all of that. I worked really, really very hard to get to where I am today. But it did. You know, I realized that it was a job. The very first paycheck I got. And when the kids made fun of me at school for being on Barney, I would say, I'm laughing all the way to the bank.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes.

[Demi Lovato]

They had nothing to say to that.

[Keke Palmer]

Kids hating that young is crazy to me. Cause what kind of mom and daddy you got? Why you hating that daddy? I know it's crazy you speak so publicly. Y' all know I ain't lying. Like, I hate 8 year old. Like, come on, boo.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

You speak so publicly about everything you've gone through. You know, you know, you talk about identity, you've talked about medication, you talk about everything. Yeah. Does it ever feel. Do you ever be like, oh, Maybe I should have, you know, like, do you ever feel like I'm overexposed? You know what I'm saying? Like, that's how I feel sometimes when

[Demi Lovato]

I'm talking to you, I feel like I am. Like, I'm a champion at oversharing, period. But I feel like it's also created a space for my fans to share with me what they're going through or provide a sense of connection with them where they, you know, I have fans come up to me and tell me their deepest, darkest secrets because they have no one else in their lives to tell that to. And when I'm able to. When I'm able to take a step back and. And. And think, like, wow, this is so important to them, and they feel safe enough to tell me these things, like, that means so much to me to. I relate to my. The connection that I have with my fans is so special. Like, I feel like there's a lot of fan bases out there with their artists that don't have the connection that I have with my Lovatix because I've shared so much that they just feel. They feel safe enough to connect with me, and it's really, truly special. And that's why when I'm at my shows and they're crying in the front row, like, I don't just think, oh, they're excited to see me. It's like, what are we healing tonight at this show? What are we healing together? Because I know my fans, I've shared a lot of trauma, but my fans have shared a lot of trauma with me, and there's a connection that we have that's unbreakable and is so special and, like, I will be forever indebted to them for.

[Keke Palmer]

I think that's so key what you're saying too, because a lot of times people are looking on the outside looking in, meaning they don't understand the context of the relationship they're witnessing with someone in their fan base. You know what I'm saying? So they may see something like what they doing. And it's like, this is the A and B conversation. You got to see your way out of it. You know what I mean? As it becomes, like you said with your levotics, do. What do you think about, like, because we came up when the digital world started to really began and blow up, how much do you think that has lent itself to. Positively to you, you know, in this relationship and just the evolution of your career?

[Demi Lovato]

Well, it's positive and negative. Like, I've said things on the Internet That I regret. But like, because I was 15 when I started out on social media and I had this giant platform that I didn't know was I didn't understand the gravity of it or the responsibility of it. But there's been so many perks where like I've been able to, like I said, have that line of connection with my fans. And because I've shared so much, they just feel connected to me, I feel connected to them. And it's a beautiful thing.

[Keke Palmer]

I love that. Sorry. Not sorry. Felt like a big pivotal moment for you.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

You know what shifted for you during that era, baby, this is Iki Palma. Yeah. You know what I love when people show up with genuine intentions, especially when it comes to dating. My girls and I were just talking about how the best connections happen when someone puts in real effort from the jump. And Bumble is definitely onto something because they're making it easy to find people who really want to get to know and date the real you from the beginning. Through features like Bumble Compliments, someone can show genuine interest in something on your profile. Like your love of cooking or that cute hiking photo. I see you boo all before you even match. That kind of meaningful connection changes the whole vibe. That's why it's the dating app my girlfriends use and trust. And let's talk about safety, because that matters. Bumble has photo verification and ID verification built right in. You can be at ease knowing the person you're chatting with is actually who they say they are. That peace of mind, it's a non negotiable. Ready to connect with people who bring the same energy as you. Download Bumble now. Dear Diary, I have a problem. And the problem is my brain will not let me rest. Like last week I was supposed to be going to sleep and instead I spent two hours trying to figure out what why we cringe at our old photos. Like what is it with that? Is it psychological? Is it ego? I needed to know. So I've been using Claude, which is an AI that actually thinks through stuff with you. It's not giving you some little surface level answer and dipping. It asks questions back. It goes down the rabbit hole with you, which is dangerous for me personally, but I love it. And here's the thing. Anthropic, the company that makes Claude committed to keeping it ad free. So when you're in the middle of your 1am spiral, your conversation stays yours. No random sponsored ads, just you and your thoughts, which for me is a lot. If your brain never shuts up, Claude gets it. Try Clawd for free at Claude AI kikipalmer and see why problem solvers choose Claude as their thinking partner.

[Demi Lovato]

Sorry. Not sorry. Well, that day that I made that song, I knew. I knew it was gonna be a hit. And I was so.

[Keke Palmer]

I love a girl with an ear. Another one?

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah. I was like. I walked away from that studio session being like, oh, we made something really great. And I was so excited about it. I think in that time of my life, I was also. I was in the process of healing from a lot that I had gone through, but I was still damaged and still struggling to a certain degree. I think for the first time in my life, I can say now, and especially with this last album that I made, it's so celebratory because I'm no longer in a place of needing to trauma dump on people or, you know, do sing extremely emotional songs to heal parts of myself that. That I hadn't healed before. Now I feel like I'm not completely healed. We obviously all have work to still do on ourselves, but I'm at a place in my life where I can sit back and enjoy the fruits of my, you know, emotional and therapeutic labor, and I can just have fun. And, like, that's why I'm so excited to go on tour, is because every night I'm just gonna be having so much fun, and it's just gonna be like a giant dance party with my fans.

[Keke Palmer]

I love what you're saying with that, because I do think sometimes as artists, there's this idea that we gotta just. Not only do we have to bleed, but we gotta bleed on everybody.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

Like, we. You know, and you feel like it's not real and you're not doing it if you're not doing that. You know what I mean? But it actually is, like, that's not sustainable. And it's like your work can speak to your experiences. I think, in a way that doesn't mean that you have to keep reliving it.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes. I used to think I glamorized the struggling creative, you know, the. The artist that really struggled and was going through so much. I thought that I always had to be going through something in order to evolve. And it's like sometimes you can just evolve, do the work, and then sit back and relax and enjoy the rest of the show. You know, it's like, girl, yes. I feel like that was a. A growing point for me was in the last few years where I was like, wait, there's nothing that's causing me pain right now. And I'm Okay. Like, I don't have to make an album out of. From pain. Like, I can make an album out of, you know, celebrating the. The love that came into my life when I met my husband and embracing, you know, my sexuality and writing about that. And, you know, it's just. Yeah, it was very empowering, very fun for me, and I'm excited to go on tour.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes, I'm excited for you too. Now, one of your more recent past albums, Dancing with the. The Art of Starting over, it also felt very intentional.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

And, I mean, what makes starting over an art?

[Demi Lovato]

That's a good question. I think I've had to start over so many times that I feel like I became a pro at it, period. I've gone through so many things that could have broken me, and at times it did. But I picked up the pieces and was like, I'm a survivor. I'm gonna keep fighting. And I. There. There is an art to picking up the pieces. And so that's what. Why I wrote a song about it.

[Keke Palmer]

I love it. There is an art to picking up the pieces. And we all have to. We all have to. The tigger that we could learn. You know what I mean? That's what life is about.

[Demi Lovato]

You gotta keep going.

[Keke Palmer]

You're never gonna stay completely. You know, So I know your fans will love this. I wanna quick, rapid fire of your music.

[Demi Lovato]

Okay.

[Keke Palmer]

So song that was the hardest to

[Demi Lovato]

write, maybe Dancing with the Devil, or a song that I had from my catalog called Warrior. They were both about very emotional things that I've been through in my life. Warrior was about SA. And, you know, also 29 was another song that was really. I wanted. It was really powerful for me to write because it was healing for me. And like all of the songs that I just named, they were all healing for me. But because they were so healing, they were so important to me, I wanted to make sure that every lyric was perfect.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes.

[Demi Lovato]

And so I put. It was very, very intentional. And I think those were the most challenging songs to write. Imagine I said kiss, I kiss for fun.

[Keke Palmer]

I'm howling. Well, you know, sometimes simple is difficult. No. A song that feels like therapy.

[Demi Lovato]

A song that feels like therapy. I mean, all the ones I just named. But most recently, I would say Let yout Go. Let yout Go is a song off of my most recent album. It's not that deep. And I think that song, to me, I wrote, you know, from personal experience, and I had to get it out. It felt so cathartic for me to put, you know, Pen to paper and get these words out. And so many people have related, so I'm so glad I did. But I think that's the one that felt the most therapeutic in most recent times.

[Keke Palmer]

Which song in your catalog do you think deserved way more love than it got?

[Demi Lovato]

My last album. No, my last album got a lot of love. I'm really grateful for it, but, like, I feel like, you know, maybe let you go. Like, I'm really, really proud. I hit a really high note in that song that I'm really proud of. And I would love for it to, you know, have gotten a little bit more love than it did, but that's okay.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. Who's an artist you want to collab with but haven't yet?

[Demi Lovato]

I mean, I have to say Lady Gaga. Lady Gaga would be.

[Keke Palmer]

You guys would be great together, actually. I would love to see you. I'm actually surprised that that nev hasn't happened yet. That's gonna be around the corner.

[Demi Lovato]

That's a dream of mine. That's a big dream of mine.

[Keke Palmer]

Don't eat her up on the track now.

[Demi Lovato]

Don't let her eat me up on the track.

[Keke Palmer]

I'm scandalous for that. How do you choose?

[Demi Lovato]

No, she could eat me up. She could eat me up. I don't say that about a lot of people, but she could eat me up, period.

[Keke Palmer]

I'm howling. What would you say? What would you say lets you know that a song is good, that you could pick a good cause? I feel like you have a great ear.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you.

[Keke Palmer]

How do you. How did you train it? Like, when do you. What makes, you know, like, oh, this is a song I gotta do, or this is the one or the, you know.

[Demi Lovato]

Well, you know, I've, like, really started second guessing my ear over the years because it's been a minute since I've had a radio single and, like, I don't. We live in, like, such a different industry than we did 15 years ago where you could test things at radio and, and see what was going to work. And then. And now it's just like, you just put it out there and you just cross your fingers, pray to God and hope it does well. You know, there's no, like, rhyme or reason. Some songs go viral, some songs don't. And it's just like, it's. It's a totally different industry than with the world of streaming and, and, and tick tock and Instagram, like, all these things coming into play. It's just totally different. So I feel like it's. I have gut Feelings about songs that I do trust. But sometimes I. I second guess myself too, because I. I don't. Nobody knows what works today, you know?

[Keke Palmer]

No, they don't. And. And what means a radio hit and all that kind of stuff is so technical and.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

So I feel like it's. Well.

[Demi Lovato]

And you also have to have people that are willing to put things at radio.

[Keke Palmer]

You get what I'm saying?

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

So it's so. That it's so industry and institution, you know, so it's kind of like. It's very difficult with a lot of that. And I really hope that artists today understand that and don't take it to heart, you know what I'm saying? Because.

[Demi Lovato]

And it's so. By the way, when you do have a hit, they don't last like they used to, you know? Used to. You'd have a hit on the radio for, you know, several years. And it's like now it's so fast. Everyone's attention span is so cooked that, like, we're onto the next song so fast that, like, it's just. Don't get discouraged about that because you have so many opportunities now. If you just keep plugging away, you just keep going. You can give yourself so many more opportunities to try and try again. And one will take. And. And five might not, but, like, you know, you'll. Or maybe more. It doesn't. It doesn't matter. You just got to keep going.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. And building your brand. What is your identity? Because that's like, regardless of whether you're doing music or acting or dancing or all of the above, like, people are going to know that it's. You know what I'm saying? Your new album, it's not that deep. It's light, it's fun. I love the performance when we did the TikTok live fest. I mean, how are you feeling about this? I know we're just mentioning you going on tour, but what inspired the title in this chapter of your life?

[Demi Lovato]

The title came from a song called Kiss on the album.

[Keke Palmer]

Okay.

[Demi Lovato]

And it's a lyric in there. It's not that deep unless you want it to be. And it's like a sexy, fun lyric and a sexy, fun song. What really inspired this album, I would say, is my high husband.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes, husband. He getting a lot of love.

[Demi Lovato]

He's getting so much love. But, like, I just love him so much. And I would say, like, when I first started making this album, I was coming off of a rock album. My last album was before it's not that Deep was called Holy. It was a rock album, and. And it was a vibe. Like, I. I still love that album so much. And that's where I actually met my husband. He was. He was brought in as a songwriter on some of my songs, and. And I, like, immediately had a crush on him. It was. Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

So who asked out who first? Sorry.

[Demi Lovato]

It was kind of like a mutual thing. We first started off as friends, and we were just friends for a few months. I was going through a lot at the time, and he was there for me. Like, he was, in the beginning of our friendship, was really, truly there for me and was an ear for me to. To vent to about things that I was going through in my life. And then we started hanging out, and then eventually something just clicked and the rest was history. So, like, it was a dream. And basically coming off of that album, I thought I wanted to do another rock album.

[Keke Palmer]

Okay.

[Demi Lovato]

And so the difference was, is when I made Holy, I had so much healing to do still. I had recently come out of treatment, and I had so much healing that I wanted to do and topics that I wanted to talk about. I had a lot of anger, a lot of sadness that I needed to write about. So when I was like, I'm gonna write another rock album, I got into the studio and I was like, wait, I'm newly in love and so happy, and there's only so many, like, happy rock songs you can write. And I was like, I don't know where to find inspiration for this. So my. Sonically, my album changed, and it turned into what it is today. It's not that deep, and it's just a fun, celebratory pop album.

[Keke Palmer]

And, like, I love that.

[Demi Lovato]

And I have so much fun singing and performing it.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, I love that. I mean, we gotta have fun. There's enough stress. We rocking it out in the real world. Yeah, it's good to turn on an album to take me to another stratosphere.

[Demi Lovato]

Yeah, definitely.

[Keke Palmer]

You know what I'm saying? That's what I think is important for right now. You do Jiu Jitsu?

[Demi Lovato]

I do. I haven't done it in a while. I injured my back, and it kind of, like, scarred me. I didn't injure it during Jiu Jitsu, but I had. I got a herniated disc and was like, I need to stay away from Jiu Jitsu. So I took, like, a year and a half, two years of a break, but I am a purple belt.

[Keke Palmer]

Damn, girl. Well, would you ever do Pilates with me and teach me? Oh, my God.

[Demi Lovato]

Let's do Pilates. I love Pilates.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes.

[Demi Lovato]

Pilates is different than Jiu Jitsu, but we can do Pilates.

[Keke Palmer]

I would definitely go with you, girl. Yes, that would be.

[Demi Lovato]

I'm always looking for a Pilates body, too. Girl.

[Keke Palmer]

It just makes your life good to just know that you're in there and you've killed every series that they layered upon you.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes. Oh, my gosh.

[Keke Palmer]

Okay. We have to get into something that the world really wants to get into, which is the world of Demi Lovato memes. Oh, gosh. Our most favorite world to be up in. Girl. We've got to talk about Poot Lovato. Oh, my God.

[Demi Lovato]

Well, Poot's still in the basement, girl.

[Keke Palmer]

Poot is everything. And the fact that she made it a Halloween costume.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, my gosh.

[Demi Lovato]

That was so, so much fun.

[Keke Palmer]

Girl, what do you be thinking when the lore of the videos, like, when you seen your first. I mean, you're so memeable. What do you think of it? How do you feel about it?

[Demi Lovato]

So at first, I like, when poop first came about, I was like, oh, no. Someone got a really unflattering angle of me, and they put it on the Internet, and now it's a meme, and it's going viral, and everyone's laughing at me for my bad angle. And someone was like, no, it was Photoshopped. I was like, oh. And so I began to laugh at it, too. And then now I'm like, even if it is just a bad angle, it's not Photoshop. I'll laugh at it. Cause it's never too soon to laugh at yourself. And I just, like, in this era was just like, I'm gonna take the power back and start having fun with some of the memes that, you know,

[Keke Palmer]

the mug meme, girl. And by the way, it was a really good response. I personally like Bowles. Like, I don't. These people don't understand. We're in these interviews, and they're asking all this strange. Okay, what is you talking about?

[Demi Lovato]

Let me tell you the story about that, ma'. Am. I actually. I really was in on the joke. I had been asked so many questions that day. I was doing, like, a press tour. And, you know, you get bored doing press tours. You're like, I'm gonna start up the interviewers. And so I was like, I'm just gonna. Like, I know the answer to this question. She was like, what's your favorite dish? And I was like, a mug. And, like, I just ran with it. And in the Long extended video. You see me at my tour manager and, like, smirk like, did you catch that one?

[Keke Palmer]

That is true.

[Demi Lovato]

And then that went viral, and everyone thought I was serious. And I'm like, you know what? Believe it's serious. I don't care.

[Keke Palmer]

I thought that was so freaking hilarious, girl. It was so funny, because why did she say that? Just ask me what I like to eat. Talk about my favorite dish, girl. You feel like the Internet gets your sense of humor now? Now?

[Demi Lovato]

Yes. Yes, definitely. Yeah. But I also think if I were to repeat that question and no one had seen it, like, people would still probably think that I was being serious, right? So I don't know.

[Keke Palmer]

Hey, whatever works.

[Demi Lovato]

Whatever works.

[Keke Palmer]

Well, let's get into this cookbook. I want to take a moment with this one plate at a time. I mean, recipes for finding freedom with Food. This seems like probably a big turning point for you. Especially consider everything you were talking to me about earlier with, you know, how you looked at food and body and image. And so when it got to this point of you writing this book or even getting to this point of in relationship with food, like, I mean, this is. This is awesome.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you. Yeah, it's been quite the journey from the first time that I stepped foot into treatment. We had an outing one time, and it was. The outing was to go to the grocery store, buy ingredients for a recipe we were gonna make. And I remember stepping foot into the grocery store and just sobbing because I was so overwhelmed by so much food, I didn't know where to start and to cut forward to, you know, however many years later, I now have a cookbook. It was like, I'm so proud of myself, and I've come so far, and I wanted to share that with other people who may also be struggling with disordered eating in their past and are wanting to take the next step in the kitchen. But also, when I started making the book, I was like, wow, this book could be for anybody who's wanting to step foot into the kitchen for the first time. These are simple recipes. I'm not an expert in the kitchen. I'm not claiming to be, but I wanted. I've gotten better since, you know, the first time I cooked, but I basically, I wanted to help other people find freedom with food, just like I did. And the joy of cooking. It's such a healing thing for me to do for myself, and I wanted to provide this tool for other people that might be looking to start their journey in the kitchen.

[Keke Palmer]

Well, let me go ahead and try this damn cookie then.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

You done? Pull my arm. And

[Demi Lovato]

they might still be warm, too.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, my gosh. Let's get into the.

[Demi Lovato]

It's so good, girl.

[Keke Palmer]

The cookie is good. Yes. I'm gonna have to hit my little pen tonight and eat the whole box, girl. This is your penjemen, my little Benjamin. Okay. Fabulous cookie. Okay, thank you. Do you have a favorite thing you like to cook for yourself? So when I'm reading this, which one is your favorite?

[Demi Lovato]

I would say there's so many things that I love to cook for myself in this book. If you're talking breakfast, I love the chilaquiles. I love the avocado toast. You put a fried egg on it, it's delicious. There's like, I had a fillet this morning.

[Keke Palmer]

So good.

[Demi Lovato]

There's spaghetti bolognese in there that we call spag bowl. It's like an abbreviated version. There's chicken Milanese with arugula. There's honeymoon chicken, which is like a spin on the marry me chicken recipes. There's a chili that I cook for everybody. And it's like, cooking is kind of like my love language. You know, if my mom is around, like, I'll cook for her and my husband. I love cooking for him. I love cooking with friends. Dessert wise, you've got the chocolate chip cookies. You've got.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, my goodness. Well, me and my son are up tonight. Oh, good. These cookies are so good, babe.

[Demi Lovato]

Thank you. Seriously.

[Keke Palmer]

Okay, I know that you guys probably. I probably gotta get ready to go, but I have to play a game with you because I play the game with all my guests cast. We're gonna play Demi decides Disney Edition because, you know, that's what the kids want. Okay, I'm gonna give you two Disney options, and you have to lock in. And this is just first instinct only, you know? Don't overthink it. Just feel it.

[Demi Lovato]

Explanation or no explanation?

[Keke Palmer]

You can give me an explanation if you want. Yes.

[Demi Lovato]

Okay.

[Keke Palmer]

Cheetah Girls or Wendy Woo, homecoming warrior?

[Demi Lovato]

Cheetah Girls.

[Keke Palmer]

Come on.

[Demi Lovato]

Love the Cheetah Girls.

[Keke Palmer]

Iconic.

[Demi Lovato]

Raven.

[Keke Palmer]

Come on.

[Demi Lovato]

Iconic.

[Keke Palmer]

Hold on. Okay. Halloween. This one's mean. Halloween Town or Twitch. That's tough.

[Demi Lovato]

I love Halloween Town.

[Keke Palmer]

I mean, it's a. Anything from the early Disney days, it's gonna be. You know what I mean? It's just, you know. Okay. Camp Rock or Sonny with a Chance. Ooh.

[Demi Lovato]

I have love for both of them. I have so much love for both of them. But I do accredit so much of my career to Camp Rock.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah.

[Demi Lovato]

So I'd have to go with camp

[Keke Palmer]

Rock, by the way. Camp rock is coming back. You're executive producing?

[Demi Lovato]

I am.

[Keke Palmer]

Is our character coming back as well?

[Demi Lovato]

You'll just have to watch. And I think what I'm excited about is to usher in the new generation of actors.

[Keke Palmer]

And she's gonna be a camp counselor. You heard it here first. I'm just kidding. I don't know.

[Demi Lovato]

Keep your eyes peeled, though.

[Keke Palmer]

We'll be staying tuned. Girl of the 21st century or smart house.

[Demi Lovato]

No xenon. I love xenon.

[Keke Palmer]

Zoom, zoom, zoom. Make my heart go boom, boom? My supernova girl. Okay, last two. I'll do Lizzie McGuire movie or cowbells?

[Demi Lovato]

Lizzie McGuire movie.

[Keke Palmer]

Cause Lizzie McGuire every time.

[Demi Lovato]

Yes.

[Keke Palmer]

Last one. Gotta kick it up or jump in.

[Demi Lovato]

Jump in.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. Thank you so much, boo.

[Demi Lovato]

Of course.

[Keke Palmer]

I've had a blast hanging with you.

[Demi Lovato]

I've had so much fun with you.

[Keke Palmer]

I'm so glad you came. This was a great one. Demi, thank you so much for coming through and being honest, funny, all of it. I love watching a woman grow in real time and still choosing herself every single era. Y' all already know what to do. Go get her cookbook, stream the album, and catch my girl on this tour coming up in spring. And we'll see you next time on baby, this is Keke Palmer. Where are my cookies? Baby, this is. This is Kiki. Baby, this is Kiki Palmer. Yeah,