Cindy Part 2: The Ben & Ashley Drama and Who Has Their Eyes on ‘Golden Hour’

Summary

Bachelor Happy Hour: "Cindy Part 2: The Ben & Ashley Drama and Who Has Their Eyes on ‘Golden Hour’"

Date: February 13, 2026
Hosts: Charity Lawson & Rachel Recchia (with featured panel: Kathy, Susan, Cindy)
Podcast: iHeartPodcasts, Warner Bros.

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Episode Overview

This episode is the second part of the “Cindy” series, diving into the ongoing interpersonal drama within Bachelor Nation, especially centered around Golden Bachelor contestants. The focus is on the fallout from recent events, behind-the-scenes relationships, and the controversy surrounding interactions with Ben & Ashley (from "Almost Famous" podcast) as well as speculation about motives within the cast. Listeners get privileged insight into what life is like for the “Goldens,” the standards they aim to uphold, and why recent tensions have left several cast members feeling hurt or defensive.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Podcast Takeover Rumors and Social Dynamics

• Peg and Terri’s Alleged Podcast Ambitions:
  There’s playful tension and mild aggravation over rumors that Peg and Terri want to “take over” Susan and Kathy’s podcast.

  • Kathy: “…someone said that Peg and Terri want to take over Susan's and my podcast. Have you heard that?” (03:48)
  • Susan, humorously: “That ain’t happening, baby. I’ll have you on my podcast, but not happening.” (04:25)

• Instagram Lives & Generational Representation:

  • Cindy notes that Peg and Terri are active on Instagram Live, perhaps seeking their own spotlight:
    “It’s clear those two have aspirations…We are goldens. We should have a separate standard for who we are.” (04:07, 04:33)

2. The "Golden Standard" and Disappointment in Recent Behavior

• Leading by Example:
  The group expresses frustration with recent public feuding among Golden castmates, wanting instead to “lead by example” for their generation.

  • Cindy: “We want to exemplify...lead by example. And I feel like all this ripping on people…” (05:17–05:33)
  • Susan: “What we’re seeing…this behavior right now is worse than the younger version. And it's embarrassing.” (05:08, 05:17)

• Media Backlash:
  Kathy and Cindy criticize how certain contestants handle press, name-dropping Ben and Ashley as neutral, fair interviewers unfairly dragged into the fray.

  • Cindy: “…to throw accusations towards them…Ben and Ashley have done nothing, and they are class act.” (07:42–08:06)

3. Handling Criticism & Social Media Drama

• False Accusations & Responses:

  • Cindy raises the issue of false statements on “She’s All Bach,” asking Susan how she’d react to accusations.
    Susan: “My reaction, as long as I don't react, I’m better off. But…the better person would just laugh and say, it's a shame because you’re making a fool out of yourself.” (06:18–06:34)
  • Cindy (tongue-in-cheek): “Bless their little hearts.” (06:34)

• "Blocking" on Social Media:

  • The group is bemused, somewhat wounded, by apparently being blocked by Mel and Peg.
  • Kathy: “Let’s just say I don’t have a clue why I was blocked…I’ve only wished them well.” (30:51–31:11)

4. The Ben & Ashley Controversy

• Podcasting Ethics & The “Right Reasons”
  • Tensions rose when comments were made about Ben & Ashley not understanding marriage or getting divorced.
  • Kathy appreciates Ben’s response:
    “I love that Ben said in his rebuttal…‘I am happily married. I love my wife. We are built on solid rock.’” (08:06)
  • The group underscores their support for Ben & Ashley, seeing them as “amazing interviewers” and “class acts.” (08:06, 08:29)

5. Motives on the Show: Engagements vs. "Living Free"

• Debate over Intent:
  Cindy: “If you’re going to agree to being the lead or a contestant, you should go in with an open heart…ready and healed to take the next step… Commitment is worth it.” (18:13–18:55)
  • The group discusses whether participants should expect engagement (“the whole show”) vs. the “wild and free” dynamic Peg & Mel have embraced.
  • Susan: “This show is about falling in love. Now, if you can’t find anyone, I know that does happen...To me, this show is about falling in love.” (34:53, 35:04)

6. Sensitive Teasing and Double Standards

• Promise Rings, Glasses, & Joking Gone Awry:
  • Cindy recounts misunderstandings where playful jokes (promise rings, etc.) were met with surprising sensitivities and offense.
  • “We can poke fun at them, but we don’t know what their sensitivities are…they can’t have it both ways either.” (10:05–10:37)

7. Hurt Feelings and Moving On

• Bitterness, Blocking, and Closure:
  • Speculation that Mel may still harbor resentment over Cindy leaving.
  • Kathy: “The only thing that makes sense to me is that Mel wanted to pick Cindy and he’s bitter that she left and he was left with Peg.” (22:22)
  • Susan: “His fear of that commitment. And she was just a fun, let’s go party kind of girl…just leave it at that. Everybody wishes you well.” (22:32–22:44)
  • Cindy’s conclusion: “I went on the Bachelor to meet a bachelor who was ready to make a commitment…and I’m glad I walked. I’m glad he found someone…It’s time to move on.” (23:43–24:06)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “That ain’t happening, baby.” – Susan on the podcast takeover rumor (04:25)
• “We are goldens. We should have a separate standard for who we are.” – Cindy (04:33)
• “This behavior right now is worse than the younger version. And it’s embarrassing as Golden…” – Cindy (05:08)
• “My reaction, as long as I don’t react, I’m better off.” – Susan, on handling online rumors (06:18)
• “Bless their little hearts.” – Cindy, with Southern shade (06:34)
• “Ben and Ashley have done nothing, and they are class act.” – Cindy (08:06)
• “If you aren’t perfect, Cindy, I’m not either, Susan. But I truly don’t understand the need for anyone to cast aspersions” – Kathy (06:53)
• “I don’t think that’s the example I want to set for future generations…” – Cindy, on commitment vs. ‘wild and free’ (17:03–18:55)
• “We lead by example. That’s not what we want to lead by…” – Susan (36:02)
• “How many times have I said, this life is short…pay attention to the life you have, because once it’s taken from you, it can never go back.” – Kathy (41:18)

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Important Segment Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |------------|-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 03:07 | Show begins; Peg & Terri podcast rumors, Golden identity discussed | | 04:33 | "We are goldens" and upholding higher standards | | 05:08 | Criticism of embarrassing behavior among Goldens | | 06:18 | Handling accusations and reactions on social media | | 07:42 | Ben and Ashley drama discussed; defense of the hosts | | 10:05 | “Promise ring” teasing, sensitivities, and double standards | | 17:03 | Is the point of the show to get engaged? Debate on intentions and expectations | | 22:22 | Speculation about Mel’s motives and lingering resentment | | 23:43 | Cindy’s closing thoughts on why she left and moving forward | | 30:33 | Post-interview Kathy & Susan recap; reactions to being blocked, Goldens’ standards | | 34:53 | Debating whether the show should end in engagement | | 36:02 | “We lead by example”—the Goldens’ generational responsibility | | 41:09 | Kathy’s appeal to Peg and Mel to reconnect and “show love” |

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Tone and Language

• The conversation is open, candid, warm, and peppered with gentle humor—even as the panel navigates sensitive drama.
• There is a notable emphasis on maturity: the women reflect on what it means to be “golden,” to model behavior for others, and to value kindness and grace.
• Although they critique others’ actions, the speakers largely avoid bitterness, expressing genuine well-wishes and a desire for closure.

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Final Thoughts

In this episode of “Bachelor Happy Hour,” the hosts (and guest Cindy) offer an unvarnished look at what happens behind the scenes after the cameras stop rolling—revealing how the navigation of adult relationships, pride, and expectations plays out even among the so-called “Golden” set. The conversation is equal parts reconciliation, tough love, and nostalgia for the franchise’s roots. Listeners are left with an implicit invitation: to reflect on the true meaning of connection, commitment, and “living golden”—no matter your age.

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To comment or ask questions about this episode:
Visit bachelornation.com/goldenhour

Quote to remember:
"Show the love, guys. Be an example to other people, you know, don’t throw shade." – Kathy (40:20)

Transcript

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[Kathy]

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[Kathy]

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[Kathy]

Welcome back to Bachelor Happy Hour Golden Hour. We are here with Cindy for part two of our discussion with her. Make sure you stick around. You don't want to miss it. I have a question, and this is. This is something I heard. So I know that we talked about Amy feeling bullied. Somebody told me, and I don't know who it was. Might have even been you, Cindy, but I don't know.

[Susan]

I love her energy.

[Kathy]

We love your energy, but someone said that Peg and Terri want to take over Susan's and my podcast. Have you heard that?

[Susan]

What?

[Kathy]

No, I. Seriously, I heard that. Is that true, Cindy? Have you heard that I'm blocked? I don't think I'm blocked, too, but something.

[Cindy]

Well, I heard that they do have some Instagram live presence and they're trying.

[Kathy]

To do their own I love you.

[Cindy]

It's clear those two have aspirations and they've not shared them with me.

[Kathy]

Okay, Susan, Peg, I spent time with.

[Susan]

Both of them in Vegas, and I didn't feel any of that vibe.

[Kathy]

I don't. I'm trying to remember. Somebody said they were fun. Okay, Susan, what do we say to Peg and Terry taking over our podcast?

[Susan]

That ain't happening, baby. I'll have you on my podcast, but not happening.

[Kathy]

Not happening.

[Cindy]

It's embarrassing, ladies. It's embarrassing. We are goldens.

[Susan]

Yes.

[Cindy]

We should have a separate standard for who we are. I. It's an I wish this happy couple. Well, we all want something from the Bachelor to work out forever. Because I feel. I'd like to know how you feel, but I feel that this process can yield a forever love.

[Kathy]

Oh, for heaven. Yes.

[Susan]

I've seen it happen. We have witnesses.

[Cindy]

And stop with this. I think this. What we're seeing, this behavior right now is worse than the younger version. And it's embarrassing, as in golden to.

[Kathy]

To.

[Cindy]

And then to have them represent themselves for our entire generation. Like, back off, sister.

[Susan]

I've never seen anything like that, though.

[Kathy]

Susan, you and I've talked about Gary and Teresa like that debac. And I thought. But. But to your point, Cindy, as a golden, we're all three of us, as goldens. We want to exemplify.

[Susan]

Yes.

[Kathy]

We want to lead. Exactly. Lead by example. And I feel like all this ripping on people.

[Susan]

And Gary and Teresa did it, too.

[Kathy]

Yes, that's what I'm saying.

[Susan]

She was on everybody's podcast, and this. That. His word, her word. I'm like, come on.

[Kathy]

Yeah, you feel the same way, Susan, then.

[Cindy]

And then they feel like they have to defend it and come back with something else. And, you know, this whole back and forth, I feel just. Just.

[Susan]

You don't, Cindy.

[Kathy]

Yeah, you don't have to.

[Susan]

But I will say, woman that knows what she wants, you're beautiful inside and out.

[Kathy]

Yeah.

[Cindy]

Susan, let me ask you a question. What if someone posted on she's all batch and said, Susan is lying? Ooh, how?

[Susan]

Because my reaction, as long as I don't react, I'm better off. But my reaction would be, prove them wrong. But the better person would just laugh and say, it's a shame because you're making a fool out of yourself.

[Cindy]

Bless their little hearts.

[Kathy]

Wait a second. That's. That is a Southern expression, Cindy. Do you want to say what that means?

[Susan]

You don't need to. I think the world knows. I think the world knows. Well, you know the story, Cindy, that I did not know. Wait. I still think hooking up is kissing, but Kathy has screwed up.

[Kathy]

I've had to explain a few things.

[Susan]

Yeah, I had no idea she did.

[Kathy]

I just. But I have to say, you know, I spend my life vacuuming, cleaning out cat boxes, and listening to Megan Pell on Peg and Mel on various podcasts. This is what I spend my life doing. And I gotta say, I. To your point, Cindy, I really wish we could lead by example and be golden. Goldens. And have people be proud of us. And I will say once and for all, I don't understand. You're not perfect, Cindy. I'm not either, Susan. But I truly don't understand the need for anyone to cast aspersions on you. Anyone. I don't care who it is to.

[Cindy]

Come at Ben and Ashley. They weren't part of our show. They were neutral parties. They were asking questions. And then to, you know, throw accusations towards them and to say that they haven't experienced anything. And when they're our age, they'll have a different perspective. Well, I'm your age, and I already have a different perspective. It's just Ben and Ashley have done nothing, and they are class act.

[Kathy]

And, you know, I think Ben and Ashley are amazing interviewers. I think they're lovely people. And I love that Ben said in his rebuttal, if you will, something like, I don't even think about divorce. I am Happily married. I love my wife. We are built on solid rock. I love that. It's as if to say, if you're not getting divorced, you haven't lived. You know, I mean that. Just.

[Susan]

I've never heard, like, a statement made from either one of them against you, attacking you.

[Kathy]

Well, then you haven't listened to the podcast.

[Susan]

What's been said has been. You could take it either way.

[Kathy]

You see Cindy's line?

[Susan]

No, I did not see that.

[Kathy]

I say, you didn't listen to the podcast. You got to listen. It's.

[Susan]

I just listened to Mel's, and the only thing he kept saying was, don't interview anybody else. Interview Peg again.

[Cindy]

Can you just believe that nobody else on our show is worthy of being interviewed?

[Susan]

Everybody's worthy of an interview, really?

[Kathy]

Okay, I have a question. I can't remember. Could somebody tell me is, what does Mel do for a living? And did he play college football?

[Cindy]

He's not just college. He played in the NFL.

[Kathy]

Oh, sorry, sorry.

[Cindy]

Just ask him.

[Kathy]

Yeah, Mel, I'm just. I'm just pulling your chain here. I'm just.

[Susan]

Come on, Mel. Stay happy. Enjoy.

[Cindy]

And I feel bad for, like, there was, you know, we were out in California, and they had evidently called Carol over Christmas, and they were. Left her a video. They sent her a video like, hey, this is us. Here's our. Our promise glasses. Here's our promise bracelets. And just kind of poking fun about a statement that she made about getting a promise ring when she was 14.

[Kathy]

Wait, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Too many pronouns. Who got a promise ring when they were 14?

[Cindy]

Carol got a promise 14. And.

[Susan]

Okay, she shared that.

[Cindy]

Like, why would we end up. No, nobody went on the show to get a promise ring.

[Susan]

Right?

[Cindy]

I had that when I was 14. And so she, you know, she thought that they were being playful with her at Christmas, and so she taped another. A video about looking into a store for a promise ring, but all the jewelry was gone because the store was closed. And she thought it was funny. And then, you know, I think that they took offense to it. So we can poke fun at them, but we don't know what their sensitivities are. Clearly, they're sensitive to something. I don't want to poke fun at a sensitivity of theirs. No, but they can't have it both ways either. You can't.

[Kathy]

Wait a minute. Are you. Wait a second.

[Susan]

Isn't that the statement of you can dish it out?

[Kathy]

Wait, wait.

[Cindy]

Say that it's funny to talk about. It's a promise bracelet and promise earrings. I mean promise sunglasses, but when somebody else brings up a promise, then it's not funny. So it's like you can't have it both ways.

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[Kathy]

So how do you feel about that, Cindy? Do you feel. Forget, you know, forget whatever he said about the ring with Peg. Do you feel like the point of the show was to get engaged? Do you have a problem with. Do you think that was disingenuous for him to say, look, I'm not ready to get engaged? How do you feel about that?

[Cindy]

Yeah, I feel. I, I've said that from the get go. Not only did he stand in front of us in person at the rose ceremony and no one's holding a gun to his head, but he is saying, I think my wife, my future wife might be in this group. I love being married. He talked about marriage as if that was, you know, and everybody goes knowing that that is kind of the path that you're taking and not that you get married at the end of the show and or two months later, but that is kind of why people go on the Bachelor's to find their first. I do love that Peggy, Mel have found their own thing. I don't think that's the example that I want to set for future generations, that when you're in your 60s and 70s, that you can just do whatever you want. I still think knitting together a family, showing those commitments, following through with commitments are a vital part of our society, a vital part of civilization. And I'm not giving up on it.

[Kathy]

So you're saying that you believe going on the show should terminate at some point in a marriage?

[Susan]

No. An engagement?

[Kathy]

No. That's not what she said.

[Cindy]

No, I think that, I think that the, the point of going on the show, if you're going to agree to being the lead or a contestant, you should go in with an open heart, knowing that if you do find your person on the show that you are ready and healed to, to take the next step, to have the commitment to get to know each other better, to further that commitment. And if it doesn't have to end in marriage, there's a lot of reasons why people can't get married again. You know, there's financial reasons that people are nervous about. Sure. Providing the wealth that. That should go to their children. There's just. There's some reasons. But I feel that our generation should do a better job of showing everyone, including ourselves, that commitment is worth it.

[Kathy]

Well, I don't think. I can't imagine anyone taking issue with that. I did find it interesting on the show. Peg said she was looking for. Sorry.

[Cindy]

I think they did take issue with it. That you could live every day and just have fun. And that's. That's their.

[Susan]

That was their kind of thing. That's where they both were. No commitments. Let's just go have fun. But that's not what the show was about for me. I've watched it for years. It was a love story. It's about a love story.

[Cindy]

Thank you. Thank you. Yes, I agree. I agree. Let's do it over again. Your season back.

[Susan]

We're all coming back.

[Kathy]

It's been a couple times. Wait a second.

[Cindy]

We could piece together.

[Kathy]

So. So well, it's interesting because on the show, Peg had said she's just looking for a nice guy. That's what she kept saying on the show. I'm looking for a nice guy. Seems that she found a nice guy.

[Cindy]

Perfect. That you just should not have a lead on the golden bachelor who is not prepared to take it all the way. And they could have met in the wild. They. This was just not the format for that. And. And so if you want to have that format, there's other dating shows. There's. Love is Blind. There's. I mean, there's a lot of other dating shows out there.

[Susan]

Things will happen. Golden Love is Blind.

[Cindy]

That could be fun, maybe, or Love Island. Let's have a golden Love Island.

[Susan]

Love Island. Yeah. Yeah, that'd be.

[Cindy]

That'd be salacious.

[Kathy]

You know, I. Honestly, as a. As an onlooker here, I am sorry that. That there has been so much back and forth, so much unpleasantness. I, you know, I live in a. In a glass half full world where I wish that they had walked into the sunset happily and just enjoying each other and not being critical of other cast members.

[Susan]

Not being critical, that is Kathy and Cindy. Why do you think they even bothered to say anything about anybody else?

[Kathy]

I don't know. Why do you think?

[Cindy]

Cindy, why do you think? Why do you guys think? You guys have more experience with this than I.

[Susan]

Why do you think for somebody to do that, there has to be some bitterness, but nobody did anything to them? I just don't understand.

[Kathy]

Unless I'm insulting Susan, I'm going to say what Cindy won't say. The only thing that makes sense to me is that Mel wanted to pick Cindy and he's bitter that she left and he was left with Pen. And, you know, I'm going to take a lot of heat for that. Not.

[Susan]

But I'm sure there's a lot of fans out there that thought it as well.

[Kathy]

Do you think it's possible, Susan? Do you agree?

[Susan]

Anything's possible.

[Kathy]

Anything's possible. I. I don't understand. If he didn't want Cindy, if it was Peg all the time, then great. You got. I'm envious of that. Envious of Peg and her bold move made him. Yeah, he got what he wanted. He didn't have to send her home. He didn't have to send you home, Cindy.

[Susan]

He got the hardest part.

[Kathy]

So if that's all true, then why.

[Cindy]

Are you so mad about it?

[Kathy]

I don't. That's what I'm asking. I don't. So, Susan, to your point, is he bitter because he really wanted Cindy? You know, I'm not trying to pick a fight with anybody. I'm just looking at what happened, wishing that Goldens could set a better example for our generation and for the youngins.

[Susan]

His fear of that commitment. And she was just a fun, let's go party kind of girl. And they're getting along great. So good for them. But just leave it at that. Everybody wishes you well. That's all.

[Kathy]

And that's what all three of us have said. Just let it go with that. You don't have to rip on Ben and Ashley. You don't have to go on other podcasts. And now I'm sure you and I, Susan, are gonna be ripped on. But, you know, I wish it could just stop here, that Cindy's move.

[Susan]

It does stop here. We're done.

[Kathy]

Well, we're done. I don't know. I'm gonna go on. I'm gonna see if I can get on Ben and Ashley's show and see what Ben really knows about raising a family. Cause you know what, Ben? I don't think you know what raising children's like, because I've raised three, and I'm beginning. I'm joking. I think he knows precisely what he does.

[Susan]

He does.

[Kathy]

Okay. Well, Cindy, last thoughts from you questions for us.

[E Speaker (Tax Season Host)]

I love you, ladies.

[Cindy]

I love your. Your likeness that you bring to the Goldens. I. I've loved every minute that I've had the blessing and we met each other first at the brunch and we've had.

[Susan]

How about us in the airport?

[Cindy]

Oh, yeah, yeah. Waiting for flights.

[Susan]

And.

[Cindy]

And honestly, that's what all of this has been about for me. But it's a shame because it could have been about something a lot more. And, you know, I went on the bouncer to meet a bachelor who was ready to make a commitment, and I was close, and I'm glad I walked. I'm glad he found someone. I'm glad they're happy. It's time to move on.

[Susan]

Amen.

[Kathy]

And you know what? That is a perfect way to end this episode and close this book. Hopefully, that's going to do it. And, Cindy, thank you so much for coming on Golden Hour, for being vulnerable, for just speaking your heart and your truth. We love you. We. We support Mel and Peg, and hopefully we can just leave it at this.

[Susan]

Absolutely. And the next time in Austin, you better make time for us. I think you were busy.

[Cindy]

I've got some places to take you.

[Susan]

Boy, she does come back.

[Cindy]

Shenanigans.

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[Susan]

Kathy, I know this is not normal. We don't normally do this, but we have to talk about what? Everything that just happened with Cindy.

[Kathy]

Like, I mean, we have to recap this episode because I have to say, so much was said, so much was discussed. I don't know. Where do you want to start? Susan?

[Susan]

First of all, she was a perfect lady, as she always is, but I was a little bit shocked that everybody's being blocked.

[Cindy]

Especially you.

[Kathy]

Excuse me, who's everybody? It's me and Cindy. Listen, you know, first of all, let's just say I don't have a clue why I was blocked.

[Susan]

You've always wished them well. You always said positive. We're all genuinely happy for the two of them.

[Kathy]

Well, you and I always say the same thing. Anybody who finds love, any two people who find love, I celebrate it. And I'm happy that Mel and Peg have found love. However that looks to them, I am happy for them. So why were you so? I don't know. But, you know, I got a blocks.

[Susan]

People today and we're all in the same family here.

[Kathy]

I don't know.

[Susan]

I was shocked. I was really shocked.

[Kathy]

Okay, so what did you think about what Cindy said? Like, about her kids saying. Because I remember when they. When they did hometowns and the girls were asking him questions.

[Susan]

Yes.

[Kathy]

He wasn't very forthcoming and.

[Susan]

And Peg's daughter as well was questioned a little bit because that was Mel's personality. And we've already discussed that. We know who he is outside of tv, if you will, when I've been in this company, he's a fun guy and they're having fun. We wish them well.

[Kathy]

He is a lawyer. He played for the University of Michigan football, and he played for the NFL. Just in case you didn't know that detail.

[Susan]

He says that a lot. God bless. But I just don't understand. To me, blocking people would be something if you're hearing negativity from somebody. I don't think Cindy's ever said any ill words towards them or have you?

[Kathy]

I know I haven't. I know I haven't. I've only wished them well. And I'm. I'm. I'm a little disappointed to be blocked, but whatever. I'm more disappointed that. That Terry wants to take over our podcast. That was.

[Susan]

That was. Do you think it was kidding?

[Kathy]

They were not kidding.

[Susan]

It was drinking. Well, because it's not going to happen.

[Kathy]

It's not. But they were on a. They do. Terry and Peg did a live. A live feed. They do that a lot.

[Susan]

Well, that gives us an idea. Cat, since you're living in Texas and I'm in Philly, we're gonna have to go live.

[Kathy]

We're gonna have to go live. And for our coffee talk, we're gonna. You know what? We should do that. But can I just say once and for all, unless our fabulous product producers who, who make this podcast happen, unless Were out. We're not out.

[Susan]

We're not.

[Kathy]

So we've got that one. Okay, but what did you think about Cindy saying that she. Her kids were done with them? She was done with them. Like, why are they still. That's my big question. Why are they talking ill of Cindy?

[Susan]

I don't understand.

[Kathy]

Forget blocking her.

[Susan]

I don't understand. Because we've moved on.

[Kathy]

But they don't seem to have moved on.

[Susan]

But why are they hearing things? Maybe somebody's whispering down the lane Cindy does it. She would never lower herself to talk ill about them. She wouldn't do it.

[Kathy]

I. I will tell you. You know, Cindy and I live in the same town. We get together for dinner. You know, we get together. She has been nothing but gracious. I really. She all the only. I hate the word but I'm going to use it again. Shade she has ever thrown is that. That she's glad they didn't. And. And that's to me personally, that she realizes they were not. She's so glad she left that she realized in that moment they weren't meant to be. So I.

[Susan]

He wasn't giving her anything that she wanted. So it was a great idea.

[Kathy]

What do you think? Okay. We. Cindy feels like, if I heard her correctly, that an engagement should come out of the show. Do you agree with that?

[Susan]

I do agree with that. I most certainly do. Because to me, this show is about falling in love. Now, if you can't find anyone, I know that does happen.

[Kathy]

Yeah.

[Susan]

But to do the promise like they did, because I think they were both on the same page as Wild and Free. You know that song, let's Just Go have a Ball.

[Kathy]

Yeah.

[Susan]

However, I expect somebody to get engaged at the end and I always cry for the person that didn't get it. I mean, that's the whole show.

[Kathy]

Do you feel. What if. Let's just play this out because now you and I are going to be producers and directors. What if they'd gotten engaged and then six months down the road we have a Gary and Theresa. Not a wedding, but a.

[Susan]

That does happen, Kathy.

[Kathy]

So you'd be okay with that?

[Susan]

Yeah. If it doesn't work out, you try.

[Kathy]

I. I want to reiterate, and I'm actually interested in your opinion. How do you feel about what Cindy said about we are goldens and what. What are we? What is the what? How are we setting the stage for other people?

[Susan]

And what I said to her, and I quote, we lead by example. That's not what we want to lead by with what's going down now.

[Kathy]

Yeah, you know, I agree. We've been around a long time. I mean, listen, I've had other women from Cindy's show call me and I think maybe because they think we have a podcast and they say, you know, why don't you put on your podcast? You know, Peg bought.

[Susan]

Follow.

[Kathy]

They tell me. I said, I'm not. You know, whether she did or didn't, I don't care.

[Susan]

It's none of our business.

[Kathy]

It's not my bit you know, if Peg, if you're buying.

[Susan]

I didn't even know you could do that.

[Kathy]

Neither did I. But come to find out, apparently you can. I don't care about that stuff. I care about what you're saying, which is, let's live with Grace. Cindy, I think. And I like Peg. That's the thing.

[Susan]

I know she's fun.

[Kathy]

She's fun. I think they're a great couple. I just wish that.

[Susan]

Do you think maybe they thought you said something? Somebody told them that you said this, that, or the third? Or is it perhaps you and Cindy spend time together since you live in the same town and they see that? Maybe that's why. I can't imagine.

[Kathy]

I don't know. But let me say two things. One, yes, I do spend time with Cindy. Yes, but that's number one. But I like Peg. If she lived here, I'd spend time with her, too.

[Susan]

Yes, absolutely.

[Kathy]

The other thing I will say is I can't imagine saying something so negative, like blocking people saying negative things. I don't understand. It doesn't make sense to me. And you know me, if I say something, I admit to it, right?

[Susan]

You know me stand behind it.

[Kathy]

So I've never said anything about them other than I wish them happiness. So I don't know. I don't know.

[Susan]

And Mel, if you are listening, you got nothing from but love coming from us. And if there's a reason that you blocked Kathy, I wish I knew what it was. Because she's never wished you ill at all. She's very happy for you.

[Kathy]

Honestly. Honestly. Melon Peg, I'm envious. How many times I've said that, Susan.

[Susan]

Yes, Yes.

[Kathy]

I would love to find my person. And I'm so envious, Mel, you could have taken me to Brazil and I.

[Susan]

Or the Super Bowl. We could.

[Kathy]

Or the Super Bowl. Because, by the way, Mel, by the way, I am a New England Patriots fan. I mean, I sat out in the cold for years with season tickets. So, you know, it's not too late. Give me a call. I'll meet you there. With Peg. With Peg. Not trying to steal anybody. I don't know. I feel like this between what's happened with Ben and Ashley, who I admire, I think they are both very good podcasters.

[Susan]

Very good.

[Kathy]

And I admire them.

[Susan]

They're good human beings.

[Kathy]

Good human beings. And I, I just, I, I, I hope that both of them will sit back and reflect on their words and, and when you ask, who else do we have on the podcast? You don't say, no one. You don't dismiss them. You don't have that sort of arrogance about you.

[Cindy]

That was.

[Susan]

That wasn't good. But I kept thinking it was an addiction, fence mode. Like he didn't want them to interview anybody that were going to talk about them. You interview people to see what their experience was like on the show. That's all that's about. Yeah, they're reading way too much into it to make those statements.

[Kathy]

Okay, I'm going to ask you a question. I'm putting you on the spot here. Do you think. Well, no, I am putting you on the spot. Do you think that. Yes, they're together, but do you think that. And I. You know, I hate this expression. Do you think they came on there for the right reasons? Because now I'm doubting it.

[Susan]

No, I do. I do.

[Kathy]

You think Mel came on.

[Susan]

He wanted to find his person. He's different than most men. He did. He says it in every podcast. He says it in every interview. His idea is not all up front. And I'm going to fall in love right now. It takes him time, and I respect that.

[Kathy]

Yeah, that's fair.

[F Speaker (Tax Season Host)]

Fair.

[Kathy]

That's fair.

[Susan]

I don't think it helped the show, but I do respect it.

[Kathy]

Susan, I just have one more question. When are you gonna. And I gonna be the golden bachelorettes?

[Susan]

We're gonna have to create a whole new show for us. Kathy.

[Kathy]

I'm not giving up. I just. I just want to round this out by saying, nothing but hope, nothing but love. Show the love, guys. Be an example to other people, you know, don't throw shade. How many times have I said that today?

[Susan]

It's almost as it. They feel what it looks like, like they're being attacked or something and that they're lashing back out and no one.

[Kathy]

But who's attacking? I don't know.

[Susan]

That's the part.

[Kathy]

Okay, so.

[Susan]

But we wish them well. We wish.

[Kathy]

Wait a minute. Wait.

[Susan]

No problem finding men.

[Kathy]

Follow along over her. Wait, Susan, I was about to say. Peg, Mel, reach out to me and. And tell me what you're thinking. I thought they can't. They blocked me. They don't block me. Please unblock me.

[Susan]

She has your phone number. She blocked it there, too.

[Kathy]

I don't know. You know what? I should. I have not texted her. You know what? Life.

[Susan]

We wish you well.

[Kathy]

And one thing I will say one thing I've learned. And how many times have I said, this life is short. And you guys pay attention to the life you have, because once it's taken from you, it can Never go back.

[Bowen Yang]

No.

[Susan]

Enjoy it. Enjoy.

[Kathy]

And stop. Stop making other people look bad. It's just not a good look.

[Susan]

Be kind.

[Kathy]

Be kind.

[Susan]

You know, she's always been kind. I've always had fun with her.

[Kathy]

So have I.

[Susan]

We've never talked about Cindy. Like. Like, I don't know where that came from. I really don't.

[Kathy]

Well, you heard what I said on the podcast. It's. You know, I'm. I'm. I was on debate team in high school.

[F Speaker (Tax Season Host)]

The only.

[Kathy]

The only logical thing is that he felt humiliated that Cindy.

[Susan]

I could.

[Kathy]

I couldn't. I can see that. I get it. That he felt humiliated, angry and shocked that Cindy left. And then whatever anyone wants to think. You know what? You're left with two choices.

[Susan]

Well, now, either.

[Kathy]

He had to pick her.

[Susan]

I felt bad for Peg, for people thinking that, you know, so do I. So that's not the case. He says he wanted Peg, so.

[Kathy]

And so go on and live your life, you know, and. And be happy together. And I'm going to be trailing right behind you, looking for the guy.

[Susan]

And I'm happy for them. They were just in Rio. They're having a ball.

[Kathy]

Okay, well, this has been great. Listen, please send in your questions and.

[Susan]

Comment about this episode. We want to know what you guys think.

[Kathy]

Please. You know what to do. Go to bachelornation.com golden hour. Send us all your comments. We really do want to hear what you have to say. And Peg and Mel, we love you. Start showing love to the rest of us because we love you.

[Susan]

And that does it for part two of Cindy. Listen to Bachelor Happy Hours golden hour on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you listen to your podcast. Can't wait till next time.

[Kathy]

Have a great week.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

At cvs. It matters that we're not just in.

[Cindy]

Your community, but that we're part of it.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

It matters that we're here for you when you need us, day or night. And we want everyone to feel welcome, welcomed, and rewarded. It matters that CVS is here to fill your prescriptions and here to fill.

[Cindy]

Your craving for a tasty and, yeah, healthy snack.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

At cvs, we're proud to serve your community because we believe where you get your medicine matters. So Visit [e-mail] or just come by our store.

[Susan]

We can't wait to meet you.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

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