← Bald Ambition
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- [00:02]
A
Hello and welcome to the Bald Ambition podcast. I'm your still very bald host. MOOKIE SPITS and the ones with a whole lot of ambition today are Rob and Jane from Ping.
- [00:16]
B
Hey, how's it going? Yep, we got the hair too, you know, so we can balance out. Yeah. In aggregate.
- [00:23]
A
An immediate advantage. I'm already jelly and I love your concept. You guys describe for automating using AI, using robotics, ostensibly the barista experience.
- [00:41]
B
Yeah, it's a fully automated drive thru experience and this whole thing started about three years ago. I had three teenage daughters in high school at the same time. They made me go through a bunch of drive throughs and I have like Joe Pesci level luck in the drive thru. It's pretty horrible. And one day I was whinging about having to wait 20 minutes for something that will probably come out wrong. And Jane said, you know, between the two of us, you know, you have all the robotics and technical experience and Jane, she has all the customer experience background. Like, we could totally fix this. We started looking at it. Turns out it's a huge opportunity, so we're doing it.
- [01:20]
A
And you've got a location up and running already. So you guys aren't just concept. This isn't smoke and mirrors. You guys are in oper. Can you tell us the user experience? You got an app, they order, people roll up in their car, they get their drink, turn us onto it.
- [01:40]
C
That's pretty much it. We tried to create the least, like the most seamless experience you could have. Like, we want you to wake up, feel it like needing your caffeine fix and this is like the best way to do you feel like Lee feeling victorious. So yes, you order on our app, then you just show up on our site. We detect who you are, so you don't have to talk to anyone if you don't want to. You don't have to scan a QR code. You just roll up to the window and the window will present your drinks at exactly the right height. We have like a vision system that'll measure the height of your car window so you can just like easily grab it whether you're in a big pickup truck or in your low sports car. We've never had one drink spilled as a result. And we really tried to use robotics and AI to complete an experience that is less than one minute. So you're on site, hopefully less than one minute.
- [02:31]
A
As a country, we're ahead of the game in so many ways and in ways behind. And one way we're behind is in Vending machines. Like I grew up with those vending machines. You put the quarters in and then you pull the thing and then you get candy or cigarettes. And meanwhile, a lot of the world has, has really advanced. Like Japan comes to mind and they have automated stores pretty much and supermarkets. There's other startups like Robo Burger where they're bringing some of that dynamic, AI driven, robotically integrated customer service to bear. And you guys are cutting the swath, from what I can tell, in a unique way that cuts into and as you point out, augments the Starbucks experience. So can you share how it's similar and how it's different? Jane, you just mentioned one big benefit. You don't have to talk to anyone. It, it's expeditious. You don't have to go stand in line at Starbucks, deal with the crowds. And it's all to your point, Rob. Like in and out Burger here in California, you could just roll in and get your stuff. How is, how is it, how are you guys changing the game?
- [03:50]
C
Yeah. So today, basically like if you went to a Starbucks or Dunkin and you order on a mobile app, well, you basically have to time it to whenever they get the drink ready. Right. They'll give you an eta. With our system, you don't actually, you can just like come whenever you want. So you. We've had customers who ordered the day before and then they show up and their drink is made super fresh for them because we don't make your drink until we. You enter our geofence. We've had moms want to like drop off their kids, come get something or run errands first. Come get something. So it's really up to you when you want to get it. We're using technology to create that customer experience that is completely catered to you. And our whole thing, our whole mission is speed and convenience. Like Starbucks today, they're going back to that whole third place. Sit down, they're redoing their stores. They got rid of their Express to go stores. So we are looking at a different customer segment that they're not addressing today. And it's a big segment.
- [04:50]
A
Starbucks has always been that in between place. That's how they started. Like on my way to work, I can chill for a little bit. And then it created a whole ambiance. And it's a physical lived experience of in between commuting and getting where you need to go. So it's kind of like a little safe place. But you're highlighting a different customer segment which is immediacy personalization, hyper convenience with all the AI goodies plugged into it. So you describe analyzing how tall your car is, so presumably when you get served, it's accurate. You mentioned geo fencing, so it'll know where you are and activate when you're nearby. So that's an added ordering convenience. And what about the drinks themselves? I'm assuming it's automated inside the little box. There's no gnomes in there or. No, it's, it's pure magic.
- [05:49]
B
If you ever saw Star Trek, it's just like that. It just magically appears, you know, real gray, hot. That's all you have to. No, it's inside. So our pod is about as fishing as we can make it. And so we made it out of a shipping container and it's a giant refrigerator. And so inside there, there are these two robot work cells, you know, one behind each window making the drinks. And it looks like a giant 3D printer for drinks, rail mounted systems, you know, moving the cup around underneath a bunch of dispensers. It all happens, you know, pretty quickly between, you know, 30 and 60 seconds. You know, we can make a drink and we put it out into the window and our goal is to make that just before you get there so it's nice and fresh, you know, kind of perfectly timed and you can adjust the drink to whatever you want. Eventually. There's a ton of cool things that we can do. Like right now we're working on the, you know, the basics of the experience, but eventually, you know, now you can take AI and dial the whole menu to your sweetness level. You could, you know, tell it a few things that you like and it can create new drinks for you, you know, using just 10 different ingredients in varying amounts that have never been used before for or. The other fun part is we're putting labels on the side of the cup. Now we can do an AI generated label based off of a couple of prompts, you know, to, to make it really personalized for you.
- [07:09]
A
It sounds super fun and it sounds wired into somebody's lifestyle. So some people might push back and say, hey, I got a Keurig at home, right? And in your office, especially corporate situations, they have those bigger kind of automated machines, right, to make espresso latte americano. And then you go through the menu manually and that it pumps it out for you. But it seems like your focus is very experiential too. So you got the soccer mom driving, you got people commuting, they don't want to wait and have that in between Experiences Starbucks. So you have a nice niche target, which is people who are on the fly in their cars and want a quick drive through experience with a nice fresh, customized cup of coffee with extra kudos for your little label and with preventative maintenance so it knows how to serve you and it doesn't mess up your brew. Does that sound about right? That's what you guys are going for.
- [08:09]
C
That's right. And we want to, we want to deliver high quality drinks too. We know that people think automation leads to poor quality drinks. Right. Like you mentioned the Keurig, for instance. And we know that taste is completely subjective. So we're not out here telling anyone that like the Keurig isn't great. But like we went out there and we sourced the best quality ingredients that we could find to do this as well. And not only are we serving up like traditional coffee shop favorites, like your lattes, things like that, we have energy drinks, teas, lemonades. Like we have a whole category for the family. So you can't necessarily get that out of a Keurig. Right. So, like, it's all about personalization and feeling really appreciated and valued as a customer. Like everything around the experience is tailored to you.
- [08:56]
A
And it sounds like you guys are scaling up too. So now you have a basic menu, you've got one location and crawl, walk, run. I'm assuming is a sound business model.
- [09:07]
B
Exactly. Yeah.
- [09:09]
A
So what's the current menu like? I'm an espresso guy. When I go to Starbucks, I always do the triple iced espresso in a grande cup with a splash of skim milk. That's how I roll. That's my thing. I know others like their Americano, they like their mochas, they like their flavored drinks. And Starbucks has done a pretty good job at matching menu item with audience expectation without it turning into a supply chain disaster.
- [09:39]
B
Right.
- [09:39]
A
You gotta, you gotta balance feasibility with inventory with supply chain and customer interest. So how'd you guys get that golden, golden mean out of the gate? And what can customers expect now? And as your kiosk experience evolves.
- [09:59]
C
Yeah, you could do a lot with just a few ingredients, like putting together coffee shop drinks, sort of like Mexican food. Like, it's all kind of the same ingredients and you're like different formats. So that's kind of what we're doing.
- [10:12]
A
Modular and scalable.
- [10:13]
C
Exactly. So if we have lemonade, it can be lemonade with like tea, but we can also put lemonade in our energy drinks just somehow like how people like it. Now we could also Use our, like, the same syrups and energy drinks as well as your lemonades as well as your teas. So there's a lot of, like, cross, like, capabilities there that we. So that it can, like, enhance and make our menu, like, more attractive to more people. So we really are trying to maximize the ingredients that we can. But we have in there.
- [10:45]
A
You mentioned that they're top quality. So you're differentiating from just the R2D2s that people have in their homes. Which is, which is, which is cool. And let me, let me bring up some potential concerns that, that folks obviously do, that you guys can address off the top. The first one is what happens with no people around. What if, you know, the cup's upside down or it spills or it's the wrong drink? What do you do? What's the backup? Since customer service has to be so indirect.
- [11:19]
C
Yeah, we found that. Well, we've done tons of customer testing, by the way. Like, tons. And we talk to our customers every single time. So we do plan to have a site host and that they'll be there during peak hours because you do need someone to, you know, direct people who haven't downloaded the app yet to a specific spot on our site. And then for people who have already downloaded, you usher them through the line quickly, but, you know, just like answering pretty typical questions and figuring out any queuing issues, things like that. So we will have during peak hours a site host. And we found that even though people are oriented to the speed and convenience, like, that's why they came sometimes. Just like a quick, like, human touch, like, they really like that. Just this. Hello. They love it when you remember things about them. And we can do that too with AI. But having a human presence is, of course, still very necessary and something we will need and that. But we don't need as many people. We just need that person to be like a rock star.
- [12:18]
B
Yeah. And then we can operate overnight. And, you know, we have a big friendly help button basically by each window. And also through the app, you know, if you're. If you drive away, don't panic, but. Exactly. Answer is 42.
- [12:34]
C
Yeah. And just make sure that we have as many channels as possible for customer service. Right today. I get texts, I get phone calls, people. We just make sure that in the app, people really understand how they can reach out to us immediately so that we can fix any problems before they leave the site. We have, like, two customer service, like, parking spots so that if they aren't happy with something, they can park. We can take care of it right away before they leave. So we just want to make sure that customer service, that we're both very accessible and that the service is really good.
- [13:04]
A
AI and robotics is a double edged sword. So people love them when it benefits them and then they freak out when they sense disruption, uncertainty, and even a threat to their pocketbooks and even jobs. You guys did a great job delineating your positioning as being distinct from Starbucks. Let's say it's not the in between spot. People who would normally not go to Starbucks anyway would think of doing a ping stop because it's a different kind of market experience, it's a different kind of segment. But I'm sure some people are expressing concerns that you're taking away barista jobs. The Starbucks union just had a huge situation. They had strikes of employees. They feel their jobs are threatened, their benefits, their pay. And now you guys are introducing an AI robotic. I'm doing air quotes. If you're on audio replacement for the barista, can you address some of those concerns and calm people down and show how you're not eating other people's lunch with your startup?
- [14:15]
C
Yeah, I think it's a really fair question. And I think that there will always be a need for baristas. Absolutely. Like there are always people who want to go to their neighborhood coffee shop or they want to sit down and work or talk or catch up with a friend. That's why we're always going to need baristas. So we don't think that it's necessarily like we're taking away the jobs. They still exist. Baristas today are also really stressed because they're metric on the drive through time. Right. And so all they do today is they make drinks as fast as they can and get it out and they have less time to focus on the customer service aspect, which is actually what they're really good at. So this will help alleviate some of that as well. And last of all, like, I just think that we don't have as many baristas on site, but we still will have site hosts. We will have technicians that come to the pod and service the pod, resupply the pod. There'll be a lot of like supply chain and logistics behind all of that. So we still will need to hire a lot of people and really creative people to fill in for stuff. So I think that it's not necessarily taking away jobs, it's just creating a whole subset that supports the robotics and what we have going on.
- [15:29]
B
And you know, on top of that, our original business case was to address the 30% of line bulk, meaning the customers that wanted an order installed the long line and went without, they left, you know, because they, they just couldn't wait in that line. Right. So we're really trying to service the people that aren't being serviced right now. But the other really cool part about this, and it's my, you know, kind of personal passion because I, I, I like that our site can actually be, you know, created and put into operation for under 200k of opening, pre opening cost. And so if you compare that to a Duncan's, you need at least a million liquid in the bank. You have to be rich to, to franchise Duncan's. Whereas we're going to be able to offer like an affordable, affordable franchise option for other people like us that have some money, just a lot of motivation. And now instead of, you know, having a job in a shop, you could own it, right. And you could start with one pod and you could grow and grow and grow. So I, I feel like this is like the perfect example of robotics creating opportunities, you know, serving us in a way that will allow people to, to grow. Right. You know, not only, you know, professionally but you know, financially. And I just think that's super exciting. I think this is exactly what robots should be used for, for serving us for, you know, being helpful in that way and letting humans do what humans are good at, this talking, you know, that site post piece where they're interacting with other people, that sort of thing. I think that's exactly how automation should be used.
- [17:00]
C
I think back to when I got my MBA in 2009 and being a social media manager was not a thing, of course dating myself, but like it wasn't like nobody. But now there's a giant ecosystem of social media managers and directors, influencers, right? Like that, that did not exist before and I think that that is going to be true for robotics. Like we're just going to have a whole new ecosystem that people can participate in.
- [17:25]
A
I totally agree. There's tons of disruption and disruption freaks everyone out. But with every technological quantum leap or milestone there's a realignment of human capital and that's happening in AI now. And you guys illustrate the key benefits. So number one is a almost strategic shift. If the lines are shorter at Starbucks or it's not as crowded because you're taking off the extra, extra burn on that, baristas will have more time to relate and do the barista thing, which is what customers want, is not just a cup of coffee but a human experience. And that's endemic for a lot of AI in the corporate world. AI is now enabling people to do less grunt work and concentrate on more customer facing work, maybe think more strategically. Then you have the business angle. You're going to be hiring a bunch of people, but in different roles. So you're not hiring baristas, but you're hiring supply people, people maintaining and servicing the pods, and even potentially marketing people, because you have a burgeoning franchise business. And that. And there's the other benefit I heard, which is this is a viable business opportunity to entrepreneurs who might not have a million to slam down for a Dunkin Donuts, let alone a Starbucks, if they even could, but own their own business for one fifth the capital expense. And you guys are built to scale, so it's lock and load, right? Like Mookie the podcaster. All right, I'm gonna roll my 401k into.
- [19:05]
B
Hey, that sounds great.
- [19:07]
A
You guys sold me already. It's. It's basically an opportunity to grow with you and then participate in. In that kind of growth. And the growth is kind of automated. Like your business model. It's plug and play. It works here, it'll work here. And then you build up brand reputation and you do the franchising thing.
- [19:26]
C
Yes. I could have put it better. That was actually a great summation of what we said.
- [19:31]
A
Yeah, yeah, okay. On podcasts, it's good because people are now cooking and they're driving and they don't always hear everything. So I try to. I'm like the roadrunner with the little
- [19:43]
B
sign, meep, meep, turn ahead. Yeah, yeah.
- [19:48]
A
So. So let's look under the hood now. You guys sold me on it. I'm converting my retirement into my first ping. As far as consumers go, it sounds like a really viable thing. I'm sure most people listening and watching would be like, that would be awesome if I had a ping like a mile away as an alternative to pit stopping at Starbucks or cranking out my Keurig at home. It's a nice kind of middle solution to that. Rob, how did you think of this idea? How did you partner with Jane? You've got that AI expertise, and, Jane, you've got your customer service expertise. So how did peanut butter and chocolate come together to make Reese's in this. In this idea?
- [20:32]
C
Well, Rob and I actually met working together on the same product development team at Shark Ninja. We were on the Ninja brand making kitchen appliances. We had a small but, like, mighty team. Just really enjoyed it. It was super fast paced, super entrepreneurial. Rob Set the tone. He's a people leader. So the culture of our little team was great. We just really enjoyed working together, so we knew that we could. So I think that's what really drove us. And then there's the part of it where he's the technical founder and he has all this amazing experience from iRobot, Amazon Robotics, BAE, like Just Ton of experience. And then for me, I'm voice of customer. I'm brand marketing, product marketing. We worked on product development together. I'm also, as you said, customer service as part of the customer experience. I used to be an analyst leading a team of customer experience analysts. And so I lend a very different perspective than Rob. And we're like the yin and yang of our company. So I think it's a good matchup. We really do need more of the customer voice whenever we're developing anything for customers.
- [21:38]
B
It's funny, I brag to other robotics founders that, you know, I have a gene and they don't because, you know, I think it's really easy for roboticists to get super obsessed with the technology and get a little bit lost on what they should be making. Right? You know, they don't have that direct line to the customer. And so with Jane, she, she doesn't care how hard it is for us to do. Technically, she, she just knows like what she wants, like the customer to have access to and she's going to, you know, put her foot down until we figure out how to make it happen. And she knows how to prioritize without, you know, getting obsessed about some cool new robot or like, ooh, lasers, you know, like that's the kind of stuff we do all the time. And Jane, you know, kind of reels us back in. So yeah, it's, it's a great partnership and it allows us to move quickly. I think we also have this somewhat, you know, unfair advantage to other robotics companies because we're using our own robots. We're not, we're not trying to make a robot for somebody else to try to figure out how to use. We're not trying to match their requirements. We're actually the users. Right. So we're developing systems that, you know, we can make all of these trade offs almost in real time in a lot of ways. So, you know, it just gives us a ton of flexibility in terms of what we're able to offer and how quickly we can do that.
- [23:02]
A
I was going to ask you. It's not like you guys plug in Amazon robots from the warehouse and instead of moving stuff around and from bin 86C to 2912, it's. They're making coffee. But you guys have designed and developed the ping. What do you call them? A ping pod. A ping kiosk.
- [23:23]
B
Ping pod. Yeah. Yep, it's a ping pod. A two podlets inside.
- [23:27]
A
Yep, ping pod with two podlets inside. Say that three times really fast and you get your own, you get your own franchise. So you guys have engineered it and built it up from scratch? Pretty much, yeah.
- [23:40]
B
Yeah, exactly. I mean, you know what we didn't want to do is what a lot of. So there's other automated coffee out there. So sort of my pet peeve of automation is when somebody pulls a human out of a process, drops a 6 degree of freedom manipulator, big robot arm that's super expensive in there with two fingers and you know, says, oh yeah, I've automated it. It's usually not the right answer at all. Right? It's usually the right answer is usually taking a process, pulling it apart completely and then putting it back together in a more efficient way. And so that's what we've done with our podcast. And we've also had an eye for scalability and manufacturing. This thing was basically made to go in a contract manufacturer. So that's the nice thing. Having scaled a bunch of programs and things like Amazon, I've seen things operate at scale because once the robotics becomes boring, it's a logistics and operations problem that you have to solve. And so that's where, you know, I get to really leverage my background at Amazon.
- [24:44]
A
And what you mentioned is interesting. There's often this conflict between the engineers, the technical people, and then the front end customer service. So to your point, customers don't really care about what's going on inside. They just want that ideal customer service experience. If you go to a movie and your mind is blown by the cgx, they don't care how those things were programmed, they don't care about the work that went into it. They just want to be wowed. And a disconnect that often happens is the engineers get all obsessed with the details and the customer service people don't understand how it works. And it seems like you two have a good, a good conversation.
- [25:26]
B
Yeah, oh yeah, no, it definitely. It just helps so much to actually see in real time your product being used, your robot or whatever piece being used and get direct customer. Like I'm talking directly to the customer. I'm the site host right now. Right. So I get to see what is happening on the other end. And you Know, it drives everything we do. Like, you know, the customer feedback and, you know, the way all of that works is just, you know, it's right there in front of us and we just have to solve the problems that we see. We get to do an after action review after every test and just go through and are like, oh, this dashboard didn't work quite the way we want. So let's do this, this, and, and then, you know, a couple days later we have our new dashboard. And so, yeah, there's a lot, there's a lot that we can do in very real time. Right.
- [26:17]
A
Take us through that experience. So I know you guys got an app. Obviously you're app driven. You're a mobile app with a physical ping pod with two pods inside. Take us through that experience. So we're gonna have links in the description below for your website for people to sign up. I'm assuming you're. It looks like you guys are on the iPhone. IPhone app. You're gonna have the Android version soon. We have one just doing. You have it already?
- [26:47]
C
Yep, it's out there.
- [26:49]
A
Okay. I was trying to do my homework and I'm behind the time. So what happens here? They go to the app store, download your stuff, they start ordering and it's got to be. You have one location so far. So where is it and how can people start pinging up?
- [27:09]
C
It's in Hudson, New Hampshire, which is a pretty short drive from Mass up to Hudson. Yeah. All you have to do, we have both the iOS, we have the Android, stay on the app, come by. Or if you just want to come by when we're testing with customers, then we can help you with the download and take you through it. But it's really, really simple. You can save as many favorites as you like and it's a two click reorder. So we have a lot of returning customers who do that. We made it simple because we once were trying to reorder something that Rob enjoyed and it took 13 clicks on the Starbucks app. So how do we make this the easiest experience ever? So we think a lot about accessibility in our mobile app since it is the digital touchpoint for our customers.
- [28:01]
A
Cool. So I'm a soccer mom. I don't look like one, but let's just say I am. And then I got your app on my iPhone or Android, got the little icon, I click on the ping. And then if I've ordered before, I'll have my favorite. And then I don't have to specify a time. It sounds like you guys know when I'm around. That's super cool aspect of this. So I know that between 10 and noon, I'm going to be in need of caffeine. I'm not quite sure when, but if I do that setup, and presumably I can even order days in advance, right, you guys have a scheduler and boom, it'll be ready. And then what exactly happens? You mentioned geofencing. So you come in and it recognizes when my car is near and it's. And the robot's start to do their thing. Is that right?
- [28:51]
B
Yeah, that's exactly right. You share your location. And so when you start getting close, we see you on the geofence. So that's a gps. And then we have some local sensors that help us figure out exactly where you are in terms of the sequence with the other cars, whether or not two orders are in the same car. And so once we have that all figured out, the robot makes your drink, serves it in the window. Like Gene said, you know, the AI figures out your, your window height, serves
- [29:20]
A
it at the right height.
- [29:21]
B
You just grab it and go. No scanning, no waiting, no tipping.
- [29:25]
A
That is very cool. Now this will bring up concern number two. Concern number one was the disruption caused by AI, and you guys had three really good answers, including the franchise one, which was, which was, which was enticing in this sense. We're talking about data privacy and security. So you guys know where I'm at because you got to know when I'm nearby to know the drink. And then there's all the signups and data. So for those types of concerns, what's your response?
- [29:59]
C
Yeah, I mean, we are very, very aware of customer concern over data privacy. We do know when you enter our geofence and when you leave the geofence and then when you're on site. But we don't store any of that data today. So we're not tracking anyone. We don't, we don't scrape your license plate. We don't take images of your face, for example. So we're very, very aware of that in terms of the data that's all stored in the cloud we use. Square is our pos. And so Square owns all of your information in terms of like, your credit card and all the payment information. We don't own it, so all of that is secure. So, yeah, we really try to make sure our customers feel that they can come without any, like, detriment to their own privacy.
- [30:53]
B
Yeah. And, you know, so the nice thing about having worked at Amazon, other people from Amazon started, you know, a software company that they, they wanted to help support startups. That's where we get our software. You know, a lot of our software work from. And so, you know, they have a deep understanding, you know, from Amazon, you know, how to make sure we're able to protect, you know, the customer's data on. On the app, how to, you know, do all this in such a way that you're only getting tracked when you get close to the site and you have an active order, you know, nobody else can come in and try to take that data or do anything with it. So, you know, having all those protections in place and also making sure that the software you're loading onto your phone, you know, that that app itself is, you know, in good shape, isn't going to have any malware or anything crazy like that. And then, you know, also, like, just the way the app is structured to make sure that, you know, it's actually the one connecting to a beacon and then sending you the data. So. So all that app, you know, work is. Is just very much structured to protect the privacy of all of our customers. And. And, you know, it's kind of funny because Jane will only download an app when she absolutely has to. Otherwise it goes on my phone and even she's downloaded. So that. That's going to say something, I think.
- [32:17]
A
So if Jane. If Jane considers your app safe, then go for it.
- [32:22]
B
Yeah, she. She refuses to download apps. And so that's the mindset. Oh, yeah.
- [32:30]
C
I'm not, I'm not gonna say I'm a Luddite, but I do have an iPhone 10. That's an old phone.
- [32:38]
A
I'm surprised they still even let you use it. And the battery isn't like, at 12% all day long.
- [32:45]
C
It is possibly, but we use it
- [32:48]
B
for backward compatibility for our, like. Oh, what about our older users? We use Jane's phone for that.
- [32:56]
A
Yeah. If they have to relaunch the space shuttle, they're gonna. They're gonna contact Jane to get her iPhone 10.
- [33:04]
B
Yeah, that's right.
- [33:05]
A
You're. You're giving us assurance that your AI and robotics aren't going to take over the world or take our jobs. And you're assuring us that the data is private. You're using proprietary safe services and. And also different folks are handling the data. So Square is responsible for your transactions. They've got their own security situation. And obviously your app is available through the iPhone store and the Android app marketplace, so. Right on. It's like you're at least as safe as the other apps. That people are already using. So that's good assurance.
- [33:43]
B
And it's pretty rigorous. Right. I don't know if you've ever tried to get an app approved by, you know, the App Store or Google, but it's tough, it's not easy. You have to go through, like a series of, you know, there's security requirements and, you know, performance requirements, all sorts of things. So we often have to go through several cycles of making sure we've met every requirement before it's approved. Yeah.
- [34:05]
A
And then you're not, you're not sleeping the night before because if they reject you and you're not on the store, then where are they going to get you?
- [34:14]
B
Yeah.
- [34:16]
A
Yep. And how are you guys scaling up? So you got the one ping pod with the two pods in there. Are there going to be, you know, more ping pods with lots of pods all over the place? And what's the timing look like for your scale up?
- [34:33]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [34:34]
A
Ping, ping, ping, ping.
- [34:34]
B
Right. So right now we're working on, you know, making this thing run perfectly. And, you know, it's funny, when you first envision something and exactly how it's going to work, it changes completely when you get on site and you start actually operating and you start serving customers and you're like, oh, okay, I need to change that a little bit. And you find all these little corner cases, like, I never thought to drive through this backwards, you know, those sort of things. And so working through all of, you know, those improvements and bug fixes and that sort of thing. But we're raising a seed round pretty soon to go ahead and make all the improvements to the hardware design of the pod, because we built one, learned a ton of lessons, but we really want to make it much more manufacturable. You know, we, we learned all the lessons on, on how to put this thing together and do it in a much more efficient way. So all that will get rolled in. We're going to build three more that the company runs ourselves. We're going to get our operational process down super smooth. And. And so, like I said, when the robotics become boring, then it's an operations problem. Right. And logistics. And so we'll get that running smooth. We use the hub and spoke model. So we have one hub that's a commissary. That's where we do all of our cleaning and refilling of all our containers. And then, you know, we bring them out to the pod, you know, wipe down the pod and do all the replacements. One of the nice side benefits, I don't know if I mentioned this earlier, but we don't require water per sewer because we bring all of our own filtered water to the pod and there's no waste because everything goes directly into the cup. So it's a very efficient system overall. But anyways, we're going to get all those processes down and then after that we plan to scale. Like this thing is designed to go in a contract manufacturer. You can crank these things out in a factory. And then, you know, we, we love the, the, the model of going out and allowing people to find the sites for us, you know, so once we had the franchisees, you know, coming to find the site and you'll do this like now that you understand, like, oh, you could use this little parking lot for a pod. You're going to be like, oh, I can put one there, I can put one there. You know, your town, right? So you're, you're going to find all these sites. You'll know if the town is, you know, open to this sort of thing. That'll bring all the sites to us and it'll give people, you know, opportunities and a place for a way for us to scale very, very quickly. So I think the next, you know, three to five years is just super exciting in terms of like what we're going to be able to do and how quickly one of these will start showing up in your own neighborhood.
- [37:07]
A
Well, sounds scalable. And you beat me to the punch about investor capital. So I'm assuming your single location now is your beta test. So it's live, it's working, you're experimenting, you're tweaking and then once you nail it down, then you're able to replicate and, and make it, make it more official.
- [37:26]
C
Exactly right.
- [37:27]
A
And you are taking investor capital. So if you want we can put that link in the.
- [37:33]
B
See the link below.
- [37:35]
A
See the link below. So you know, look at, look at it as an opportunity to check it out at the location. Look at it as an opportunity to invest early and then down the road once things become operational. Participate in a franchise partnership.
- [37:50]
B
Absolutely.
- [37:51]
A
Well, it's a great model and it's a nice middle mid range solution between the Starbucks where you need to dedicate usually 15, 20 minutes of your life whether, whether you settle down into it or not, and then rushing into the kitchen and popping out a Keurig or an analogous kind of, kind of little custom coffee experience. The next question is, is aspirational in the sense of what I was hinting at earlier with the Japanese self serve stores and the super Deluxe vending machines. Because not only are you scalable in terms of these individual pod locations, but you can expand your menu and you can get into other stuff, too. Is that kind of at the back of your mind when you're designing these things? Are you thinking about more than just coffee? I mean, really, the sky's the limit as we automate and integrate AI into so many aspects of our lives, especially food and drink service.
- [38:53]
B
Oh, yeah. I mean, it. It's not just at the back. It's like. Like swirling around inside. And. And we have, like, this incredible room because right after we finish with drinks, we want to go to package snacks, convenience items. I've always been excited. I'm a foodie. I. I even had a food truck. And I've always thought that food and automation could come together in this, like, crazy cool way and create these new experiences for people. So. Oh, yeah, we. We have a ton of things that we want to do, a lot of things that we want to offer in the future in the very similar format, because we focused on making sure we have a great pickup experience. And so that is our number one focus here. You know, coffee and drinks, like, they were fairly easy to automate, and we thought people would understand, you know, ordering from an app and driving up to a pod and grabbing it more so than, like, a convenience store. So we thought that was the right place to start. But. But, yeah, the sky's the limit, and the hardest thing for us is, like, picking what to do first. You know, it's like, okay, we gotta focus. We gotta get the basic thing down, and then we can do all of this, you know, cool, expansive stuff, because, you know, it can go all the way from offerings there to, like, how you order. Like, just, hey, Siri, order my next ping. My favorite ping. Oh, crap. I just set off, Siri. But, you know, order my favorite ping thing, and I'll stop at the next pot.
- [40:11]
C
I mean, I think that, yeah, from day one, we've had this vision that we could take it further. We just want. We picked the drinks because it didn't require any change to customer behavior. Yeah, there's a long Runway ahead of us. And we reimagined the whole experience of picking up a drink in your car. We were like, why wouldn't we reimagine everything else? So today, if you got, like, a breakfast sandwich, you're in the car, you've picked it up, it's sort of like falling to pieces, like, in your hands. It's very inconvenient. Right. I've had that happen to me a lot. We're like, well, why does it have to be in that shape? Why does it need to be in that format? So this could be a way for automation to work. Makes you a delicious breakfast sandwich in a way where it's not like disintegrating all over the place. So I think that for everything we're envisioning going on in the future, we can reimagine it, redefine what that experience
- [41:00]
A
is and tweak the end product itself as well as the customer experience. It's kind of cool. Every touch point in the transaction, you can optimize and you can integrate AI and robotics. So really the sky is the limit in terms of offering that kind of value. And an even bigger obstacle, I think. And you bring this up, Jane, and you hinted at this, Rob too, is not only to get the tech right, but to get people accustomed to this huge change in their lifestyle. Like, look at the development of every digital application. Like, remember Friendster?
- [41:39]
C
Yeah.
- [41:39]
A
Oh my gosh, what happened to that? Right? And everyone evolved into Facebook and Twitter and the technology was already there. There was nothing revolutionary about it was just getting people to change their user behaviors, catch up to the technology. And your crawl, walk, run works good for your beta testing, but it also market conditions your audience to get used to the fact that that AI driven robots are going to prepare a drink, a meal and provide products and services. That's a huge state change for people to get acclimated to.
- [42:16]
C
Yeah, absolutely. Every time a customer comes through the first time, even their second or third time, they have their phone out, they're taking photos or video or sharing with somebody, they brought a friend, for example. But once you've gotten past that first or second experience, the next time it's like if, you know, you know, like our customers come, we have customers that come almost every day, they hardly stop their car, they've got their arms like stretched out of their window and they just like whiz by. Like they've already been conditioned to accept the new norm. Like, this is their new norm. It's like when Amazon launched Prime, everybody was getting their packages in weeks. And then prime was like two days. And then everyone became used to it and that just became the new norm. That's really exactly what we're seeing in our customers today.
- [43:04]
A
It makes sense and it's exciting.
- [43:07]
C
Yep.
- [43:07]
A
And then, and to your point, the sky's the limit. It can be really, really transformative. So good, good luck to you guys. This is an exciting startup that is pushing the boundary not only for technology and the user experience, but our overall evolution into a situation where AI and robotics isn't the enemy, but they're heightening convenience and they're shifting roles and responsibilities and jobs, even in the workforce. And not necessarily for the worst, but it could even be better. So you have people doing some of the menial stuff that could be doing other and better things. And meanwhile, to your prime example, I mean, toilet paper in 12 hours. Who would have thought? And they sell just about everything now. And we're used to it. How did we ever live before Google Maps and Amazon Prime? And if you guys are lucky and successful, then how could we have ever lived without a nearby ping pod?
- [44:10]
C
I like that.
- [44:15]
A
You guys are great. Thank you for making time on the Bald Ambition podcast. Like, subscribe, share, and as we mentioned several times. Please check out the links, go to their website, check them out. They're already operational. They're also soon to be taking more investor capital, if you liked what you heard. And be on the lookout when they go full franchise so you can get a piece of the action in a way that's much more economical than starting your own Dunkin Donuts or coffee shop with all the overhead and capital and hassle. Just plug and play. And you're not even stealing the local water. Maybe a little. A little juice. That's nothing compared to the data center, which is across the street.
- [45:05]
B
Yeah, we're very efficient. We have solar panels. It's okay.
- [45:10]
A
Solar panels. And you got hamsters and habit trails powering the robots.
- [45:17]
B
Jane's out back on a treadmill.
- [45:21]
A
Thanks so much, Rob and Jane. You guys are awesome. Best of luck to you with Ping.
- [45:26]
C
Thanks, Mookie.
- [45:27]
B
Thank you very much.