Is intelligence just compute plus data? And if so... what happens next?
In this episode, Dwarkesh Patel, host of one of the most respected AI podcasts and author of “The Scaling Era”, joins us to break down the exponential rise of artificial intelligence. We explore how scaling laws became the engine behind modern models, why AI still can’t learn on the job, and whether we’re truly on the brink of AGI.
From coding to consciousness, from geopolitics to governance, Dwarkesh shares a grounded but urgent perspective on what it means to live through the transition and how we might prepare for what’s coming.
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TIMESTAMPS
0:00 Intro
6:59 What Is the Scaling Era?
9:31 Compute + Data = Intelligence?
15:08 Are We Building God?
17:57 The Catalyst: Discovering the Scaling Laws
20:54 Model Capabilities
24:35 Why Coding Is the AI Frontier
31:43 What AIs Still Can’t Do
36:26 AI Isn’t Around the Corner
46:01 Is AI Really Smart?
50:54 Inside the Black Box
54:46 AI Safety and Alignment
1:03:49 Who Controls the Models?
1:08:16 Swiss Cheese Safety & Liberal AI
1:19:30 Scaling Inputs: Energy, Compute, Data
1:26:40 Jobs, Growth & the Intelligence Curse
1:32:07 Why 60% AGI by 2040?
1:36:14 Dwarkesh’s Personal View
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RESOURCES
Dwarkesh Patel
https://x.com/dwarkesh_sp
Dwarkesh’s Book
https://www.amazon.com/Scaling-Era-Oral-History-2019-2025/dp/1953953557
Dwarkesh’s Podcast
https://www.dwarkesh.com/
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LIMITLESS - Dwarkesh Patel: The Scaling Era of AI is Here