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Episode 4148: A WarRoom Christmas Eve Special
Episode 4148: A WarRoom Christmas Eve Special...
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- [00:26]
Ben Harnwell
The Holy Mary.
- [01:21]
Steve Bannon
Okay, welcome. It's Tuesday the 24th of December, the 24th of December, the year of the Lord 2024. It is our Christmas Eve special. Love that song. Ben Harnwell joins me as our co host today. I'm still recovering, coming back strong from Manfest. Ben, thank you for joining us live today from Rome. Tell me about Give me your sense. I particularly love and fond of the, like King's College choir and all the English music of Christmas, particularly during the holiday season. That's kind of like high Victorian Christmas carols.
- [02:08]
Ben Harnwell
Yeah, that's right, Steve. And you had the lessons and the carols. And for many people formally, that is the start of Christmas. And from that point on, even the most pedants, the most pedantic people in the world will wish one another merry Christmas at that point onwards, not before, but after the after the lessons and carols from King's College, Cambridge. That's when Christmas formally starts.
- [02:35]
Steve Bannon
You know, I often wonder the commercial side of Christmas taking over so strongly in the United States, at least the run up to Christmas, because they try to start it in October or even before Thanksgiving. As soon as you hit Christmas Day, the Christmas carols go. We have a tradition here at the show. We play them afterwards. I mean, when I was growing up as a kid, it didn't end on Christmas Day. Christmas Day was kind of the midpoint. You still, we still, you know, did a lot of Christmas stuff, even up to little Christmas, you know, epiphany. But that seems to have stopped here in the United States over the last couple of decades where just kind of it's a hard stop. And Chris, is that the same in Europe or does it go through more of the twelve days of Christmas?
- [03:17]
Ben Harnwell
Well, it's still obviously sort of commercialized here in Europe, probably less, I would say, in Italy than in my, my beloved homeland. However, it is, it is obviously getting worse and worse as I think the practicing Christian element of society fades out and the sense of belonging kicks in, but without the actual substance of the faith to back that up. And then, of course, you grab onto the nearest available thing, and that's the whole, the commercialization, the tinsel and the trees and all the rest of it. But, you know, look up until Sunday, which is the Sunday before Christmas, that's fourth Sunday of Advent, it's really improper to start celebrating Christmas before Christmas Eve itself. And you really, you know, you're absolutely right. You start the carols on Christmas Eve, Christmas Day, and then you carry them on up until Epiphany that's the correct way of doing it. If you are actually commemorating in your family, in your community, even in your own heart, the incarnation of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
- [04:22]
Steve Bannon
You know, when I was a kid, we didn't bring the tree in until late afternoon on Christmas Eve. That was tradition. In fact, I don't think we got the tree until like the day before Christmas Eve. But we would never bring in the tree to Christmas Eve. And it was decorating the tree, it was kind of the family tradition for Christmas Tree Eve and putting up the lights and everything like that. Then we would go to midnight mass and come back and have a little celebration and then get up early in the morning, the crack of dawn and go at it. But it was really Christmas Eve forward. Tell us about Christmas in Rome. You're there, you're a transplanted Englishman. What's Christmas in Rome like?
- [05:01]
Ben Harnwell
Like everything in Italy, it's family orientated. From the vigilia, which is Christmas Eve, you have a huge. Many families will have a larger dinner on Christmas Eve than they will have on Christmas Day itself. That sort of tends to. And you find a lot of people who will go to church as well, even to midnight mass on Christmas Eve, even though technically it might not necessarily start at midnight. It might be brought forward by an hour or two, depending on the parish you go to those. And the churches will be full and there'll be a lot of young people there. But that's Trinity generally Sunday. By Sunday, Steve, you get a lot of young people as well coming to church on Mass, to mass on Sunday, which is pretty much not the case in the uk because practice. Tell me about the sense of it still has a large part to play in life here, Steve. Probably because the Vatican's here, the home of the Catholic Church and the Pope is really in and of himself, almost like a. A secondary head of state. The President of Italy, the president of the public has a much minor role. So because of the presence of that, the role of Catholicism, even if it descends into a form of popular paganism at times, it's still quite surprisingly vibrant. Where it isn't in the uk, which is so secular now.
- [06:30]
Steve Bannon
No, it's had a. With the war going on in Israel and around the Middle east, of course in Bethlehem, a very low key Christmas there for this is a second or third year in a row, maybe even fourth year in a row. Is that not correct?
- [06:48]
Ben Harnwell
Yeah, I think February is coming up to the third year anniversary. February 2020.
- [06:56]
Pastor John Amanchukwu
Yes.
- [06:56]
Steve Bannon
And so there's been in Bethlehem, it's been, you know, traditionally over I shouldn't say traditionally, you know, 10, 20, 30 years, you're starting to get you've had more pilgrims go. I know a lot of people from the US have gone and tried to really been very moved by Christmas in Israel, Christmas in Bethlehem. But that's been really shut down because of these wars, has it not?
- [07:20]
Ben Harnwell
Yeah, it has. It has, Steve. Obviously, the whole of the Holy Land has descended into a sort of a military state. And I don't want to get into the politics of this at this time and give any suggestion of taking sides on that. But the Christians have had a tough deal, and not only since the Hamas invasion on the 7th of October of last year. Steve, Christians, I know a lot of people who've been going, especially recently, they've said that they're being spat at and they're not being particularly welcomed. And that's not by the Palestinians because, of course, there is a proportion of the Palestinian community which is Christian. So there's a deeper story going on in the Holy Land which doesn't really break through into the mainstream media.
- [08:13]
Steve Bannon
Ben has got some fascinating guests from Europe today that he's going to address. Also tomorrow will be the combat history at Christmas. I think this is the 12th, 13th or 14th year in a row that I've done this, starting at Breitbart Radio with Patrick K. O'Donnell. Raheem always does Boxing Day for us. He's done it for the last, I don't know, three or four years for me over at Breitbart Radio also. And then Dave Brat's going to be with me on Friday and maybe even again Saturday. We're going to talk about the end of the year, roll up to our end of the year coverage on Monday and Tuesday. But I think there we're trying to plan on having a number of Christian voices talk about and of course, we're going to be breaking news on all the politics quite unseemly that they decided to drop the Matt Gaetz situation over the Christmas holidays. But hey, you got to do what you got to do. So, Ben, I know you watched AmFest from afar. Give me your assessment. I haven't had a chance to catch up with you. I know we were texting a lot during the during the event itself. What's your takeaway from Amfest to really go through the end of the year?
- [09:22]
Ben Harnwell
It's great, Steve, to see President Trump, and I think your speech also was fantastic. But it's great to see President Trump, I think so. And this is his first. If I'm not, correct me if I'm wrong. I think this was his first speech since being elected president. And it's good to see him being so throwing down so far so hard. And in drawing the whole of the conference's attention to the first 24 hours that will take place on January 20, because there had been, you know, you see certain signs and you don't quite know what the tenor of this second administration is going to be. You can look at the leaves on the teapot and try and draw different patterns out of it, but the flow down on the deportations and everything else I think was pretty good. Very, very comfortably lapped up. And it is interesting seeing Steve, the world's media's attention to this and how they're starting to adjust to the new relatives. Specifically, Steve, I want to make this point. Some of the more intelligent voices coming out with the Democrats realize now that their strategy of just painting President Trump and this show and anyone else associated with a MAGA movement of fascists is no longer going to work because this, this movement has been making serious proposals. The regime attempted to deflect from those, those proposals and those issues that MAGA has been raising by just smearing and the American public are no longer being convinced of that. I would say they've never been convinced of that, by the way. But, but watching Amfest, watching the media coverage to that, I think it's, you know, you look at that Ro Kanaf, for example, the tweet that he put out. Look at the in depth interview they did on you and New Statesman, which is the intellectual magazine of the left, the historic magazine in the uk they're not saying they have to engage with what this movement stands for on the terms Steve, I think you'll be piece of head is on your terms that they're now realizing they have 10 years too late. But they have to come and bring some serious proposals to the table themselves because they're dismissing into terms of pejoratives is part of the reason they were so definitively rejected in November.
- [11:48]
Steve Bannon
Wow. Incredible. We'll get hopefully get into that New Statesman, Ben and I'll get into it even deeper the end of the week there. This is one of the most intellectual magazines out there in politics. Had just incredible piece about the war room and about kind of our populist nationalist beliefs, but don't want to say they've raised the surrender flag, but they're clearly saying that we're kind of driving the discussion. It'll be very powerful Real quickly, Ben, the WHO reported this morning that President Trump's already got his team working on immediate withdrawal on the afternoon of the 20th of January. We're going to be going through a whole laundry list and kind of a drumbeat of what President Trump's going to do. But quick thoughts about that in your favorite town, Geneva.
- [12:30]
Ben Harnwell
Yeah, well, I saw that. I think it was a couple of days ago this first broke out into the press, Steve. That was something else. I think that's off the back of Amfest, this declaration, first 24 hours. Again, coming back to this point, this is putting the world, putting the United States on alert that this administration means business. And one can only hope, Steve, that withdrawal of the who, the World Health Organization and the middle finger that that will give to Ted Ross will be the start of many other withdrawals by America or the corrupted apparatus of the international rules based order. And I would add on to this point if I would like to see somehow, and I don't know if it's going to make it easier if America withdrawals or not, but I would like to see. I'd like to, you know, difficult because of diplomatic community and the fact that its seat is in Switzerland. But I want to know what Ted Rose was doing back in the early days of this pandemic. What did they know? When did they know it? And when did they agree to start lying to the American people?
- [13:35]
Steve Bannon
Okay, hang on for a second and take a break. Birchgold.com Birchcold.com the End of the Dollar Empire make sure you get over the holidays. Modern Monetary Theory. Modern Monetary Theory to check that out. Also by the way, read it over the holidays. Also the book from Dan Fluitt, this amazing book, it could be a late Christmas gift or even a New Year's gift. The Pictorial History. The pictorial history of the War Room Rebels, rogues and outlaws. So check it out. Warpath Coffee. Warpath Coffee 60005 star reviews. Check it out today. Okay. We're gonna leave you with some great Christmas music. Ben Harnwell will return after a short commercial break.
- [15:00]
Ellen Kruger Fantini
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- [16:25]
Ben Harnwell
Welcome back, folks. So I'm going to be taking over the the hosting of the rest of the show and we've got a great show for the next hour. 45, some new guests, some old faces. And the way we're going to do it is like this because tomorrow we're celebrating Christmas Day. I was thinking what better way to do this than to talk about our own private lives in one capacity and also the wider public sphere. I'm going to ask the guests what to pick an example of something that they most closely think was the action of God acting in human affairs and then also the same question for themselves. I'm going to start off with this and as I say, we've got some Catholics on the show, some Protestants on the show, but I'm going to start off with my answer to this and that's the only time I'm going to talk about myself for the rest of the show. With regards to the public aspect, I most consciously think I can see the hand of God. When President Trump was shot in the face, I think probably quite a few of the guests might go for that one as well. Shot in the face, just a few meters away from death. We don't do the gory counterfactuals of how that might have played out, but I think that was a direct supernatural event as far as I'm concerned with regards to my own personal life. You know, I haven't really mentioned this that much on the show, though we did something back in March, but I came to the conclusion of a number of legal cases against me at three separate cases. But the criminal cases after three or four years ended in March. March 7th. And I've been praying up until the very end. The prosecution were trying to get me into prison for a year, for 12 months up until the very moment the judge announced her sentence. Italy, it doesn't have juries for most, 99% of his cases. So it simply depended on the judge. And that was obviously a big thing for me. And I've been praying for that for four years, really. And the consequence of praying every day, every morning, and I still do by habit, I go into the local church and start my day just with a few prayers. But the consequence of that, folks, is that by the time the sentence came around, even though it could have been very bad for me personally, I pray. I obviously prayed to be acquitted. But more than I prayed to God to give me a sense of assurance that things would be okay, however it went. And I did get that sense of assurance. So this is like I'm just talking about me personally in my own personal lives. But I'm very grateful to God for that. And the reason I thought this would be a topic to discuss here on, on our Christmas Eve special is because Christianity, it's not really, I mean, it is a philosophy, but it's also a set of religious beliefs, supernatural religious beliefs. And the point about that is you can have the rules and you can say what you like about the rules. You either don't like them or you like them. I love them. But some people think they're a bit constrained. But the point is, is that the whole point, the whole focus of God's revelation to mankind was incarnated here in human history in Bethlehem. So Christianity is not an abstract religion. It's a very concrete particular religion. And that's why I thought I would ask. All the friends I've asked onto the show today I know are Christian. So I thought this would be a great way to talk about this with the war imposter, just to say how our lives have been changed because of the very real presence of God. My first guest then, Ellen Kruger Fantini, editor of the European Journal, an old friend. She's been on quite a few times when I was guest hosting over the four month period. Ellen, welcome back onto the show. Can I start with you then, please, and just ask you perhaps to give your thoughts on the opening question. Is there anything in the past 12 months where you could say, yeah, I think this was God acting in the affairs of man.
- [20:47]
Anya Hoffman
Hi, Ben, Merry Christmas. Yes, absolutely. And even though I'm the first guest, I thought maybe I'd get the first crack at this question. But we do have the same answer. That miraculous split second when Trump turned his head and wasn't murdered in front of the world. That miraculous split second is my pick. Not just because it was saving a man's life, but because of all of the things that happened after that, including, of course, his election. And I am based in Europe. I'm here in Vienna, Austria, and there are ripple effects of the Trump election that we're going to feelI think we're already feeling here in Europe. Certainly, he's got a chance to set things right in America, but not just for America, for the world, for peace, for stability and security across the world. I think his election will also embolden, embolden European politicians and finally take control over the massively, really frightening security situation. Obviously, your viewers will know about the recent Christmas market attack in Germany, in Magdeburg. There are 20,000 people demonstrating in Magdeburg about what happened. And the alternative for Germany, the AfD, they're the ones who are addressing this problem. So I think there's a glimmer of hope. I think Trump's election really offers that.
- [22:40]
Ben Harnwell
You're very interested that you tie in the ripple effects of what happened in Butler, Pennsylvania, the ripple effects that you're seeing that we're seeing now in Europe. Staying with Austria, one moment. I mean, it's clear that the AfD has been given a great fillip recently, not only because of the market, the Magdeburg market, catastrophe, massacre, but also Elon Musk's throwing his weight behind them. Tell me something. In Austria, however, the fpo, the Freedom Party, would be the closest analogue, I think, to the AfD in Austria. Is there a similar momentum there, do you think? Can you see?
- [23:22]
Anya Hoffman
Well, certainly the Freedom Party, the fpo, did very, very well in the elections and in fact, should be forming a government. But instead, it looks like it's going to be what I like to call the coalition of losers, which is all the other parties who didn't do as well as the FPO because they've been basically firewalled out of being able to form a government. So I don't know what it's going to take for Austria to get it together. I certainly hope that it doesn't take yet another tragedy. The country's had several relating to violence and mass migration, but that's the issue on everyone's minds.
- [24:11]
Ben Harnwell
Would you say that probably the FBI has a slightly more difficult, slightly steeper incline to overcome because the successive Austrian governments haven't been as crazy as the successive German governments?
- [24:30]
Anya Hoffman
Well, I suppose so. I mean, I guess if it takes being as bad as the coalition governments we've seen in Germany, then that's what it takes. But I would say that the coalition governments here in Austria have been completely ineffective when it's come to security, certainly migration, which are interrelated topics. Of course, I'm afraid that if we don't see something extreme, nothing's going to change here. So, yes, it's a steeper incline, partly because we haven't had a recent horrible tragedy.
- [25:14]
Ben Harnwell
We've got three minutes left. Ellen, I know that a couple of days ago I saw the statement on behalf of the European Conservative that you're revamping both the print ed but also the online edition. Perhaps just say a bit about the mission, the work of the European Conservative. I declare an interest, folks, that I do have a titular post on the organogram and I'm absolutely delighted to support it. It's doing fantastic work saying stuff that very few people are just before. However, you just say that. Do you have anything to say about the second part of the question about the presence of God in your own life?
- [25:54]
Anya Hoffman
Well, sure. I mean, actually it's somewhat related to talking about the European Conservative, which is that it's been a year of massive growth for the project and the presence of God has been revealed in the people we've worked with. So because our mission really is about saving the west, saving Western civilization, we've attracted good, selfless people who are in it for the fight, in support of the common good, and they are in it for the long haul. And this year we've seen it more than ever. So I think my answer is that in the faces of the people who've been working with us, God has revealed, of course, because Christ infuses all of these things.
- [26:48]
Ben Harnwell
Beautiful response, Ellen. Just then, quickly, one minute. Then before you go, just say quick a few words then perhaps about the revamp the website. Where do people go? I strongly recommend that they do. They're putting out. You guys are putting out sort of great articles every single day.
- [27:05]
Anya Hoffman
Yes. So the project will have two divisions. We'll have the online division, which will continue with great news, commentary, analysis, and then the print edition, which is where we started. We combine art, beauty, culture and politics. We're going to be growing. You can look for us. We'll have a landing page on the europeanconservative.com website. Do follow us on Twitter and Facebook. You can get all the news about our updates and where to find new content and find out about our next.
- [27:43]
Ben Harnwell
Steps and the social media handles. Alain.
- [27:48]
Anya Hoffman
Yes. So we're Eurocon official on Facebook. On Twitter. Excuse me. And you can just look for the European Conservative on Facebook. We're also on Getter European Conservative. You can find us easily.
- [28:05]
Ben Harnwell
Ellen Fantini, many, many thanks for coming on the show. Wish you a very merry Christmas speak to you soon. God bless. Welcome back, folks. So the next guest is a new friend of the war room, Anya Hoffman, who is the director of the Observatory on Intolerance and Discrimination Against Christians in Europe. Now, just to say a bit of a bit about the Observatory, okay. When I worked in the European Parliament over 15 years ago, when I first worked there, a guy called David Fieldsend, who was basically the dean of all the pro life lobbyists in the European Parliament, he once told me, I asked him who's, you know, what he thinks about our efforts, because he'd been there like for decades. And he said to me the gold standard for him was good run. Kugler, who was then representing the World Youth alliance, she's now in the Austrian. We talked about Austria just a moment ago. She's now a member of Parliament in Austria. But he said, but David Fields then told me that it was good Rune and the work that she did, that he thought that she was the most effective advocate for life and all the affiliated cultural issues that he'd ever seen working in the European Parliament. Goodwin then, then left the World Youth alliance and she founded this observatory, which is a great organ, found it with her husband Martin. Great work detailing the. The persecution of Christians around the world. So, Anya Hoffman, welcome onto the show. You're now the director of the Observatory. Tell us a bit, if you would, for our American audience. Why is there a need for an observatory against intolerance and discrimination against Christians?
- [29:57]
Unknown Guest
Yeah, thank you so much, Ben, for having me on the show. And yes, indeed, the Observatory was founded almost 15 years ago when many people did not yet see the problem of discrimination against Christians, not just around the world, but specifically in Europe. So the Observatory just focuses on its work, which is mainly documenting cases, documenting what is going on in terms of intolerance and discrimination against Christians in Europe. And we try to provide reliable and classifiable data on what is happening. So we are collecting, on the one hand, hate crimes, which means mainly arson attacks, vandalism, attacks on churches, but also attacks on Christians on persons. And then on the other hand, the sphere of discrimination that can be at work that could be against Christian politicians. Recently also, debanking of Christian organization is really broad field. We want to make these problems visible and show the structural problems behind them and also in which areas religious freedom is being limited in Europe.
- [31:09]
Ben Harnwell
Tell me something, because I think you guys were basically the first to come along and coin the phrase Christianophobia, right. Mirrored on Islamophobia, which is part and parcel of contemporary political discourse. You'll find a lot of politicians and media pundits talking about Islamophobia. But until you guys came along, very few people spoke about Christianophobia, which is this obviously the same concept of discrimination against people because they're Christian. Again, for American audience, perhaps you want to say something about that is actually a thing here in Europe. Just give perhaps a few examples of what some Christians have been facing here in Europe, which, you know, it's not the other end of the world. To find Christians being persecuted for their faith here in Europe ought to be extremely alarming.
- [32:05]
Unknown Guest
Yes, indeed. So many people assume that because Christians are a majority in Europe means they cannot face discrimination. So kind of discrimination is only for minorities. That's what a lot of people think. And this is why this concept of discrimination against Christians is really something that people don't easily grasp. And we try to make this visible. And as you were asking for examples, it's really a broad range. But something that stood out to me most in the last year were several cases of Christians who for expressing their moral convictions as Christians, either lost their jobs, their political careers or even were facing court trials. And one of the most shocking, one of the well known cases in this area is the case of the former Finnish Minister of Interior and also current Member of Parliament Pebbi Rasanen, who was accused of hate speech after tweeting a Bible verse and criticizing her own Lutheran church about sponsor the Helsinki Pride Parade. And she just kind of in the tweet asked the question, how do you think this sponsoring the Pride Parade is in line with what the Bible teaches about this? And then she was being prosecuted for that. And that case was thankfully also picked up by the US International Commission for Religious Freedom as one example of how European governments are increasingly targeting believers for peacefully expressing their religious views, which are kind of counter the mainstream views, but not in any way of like inciting to violence or hatred, but really just Christians saying, this is what I believe. I believe God created human beings as male and female for each other. And by just saying that it can in these extreme cases even lead to a court case, but also in the job, it can have immense repercussions.
- [34:00]
Ben Harnwell
I think it's important to underline that this was very, very clear. I mean, it's happening in America, I think, not as to a great degree as here in occupied Europe, but this is one of the, what Ellen Fantini mentioned earlier on in the show, the ripple effects of the Trump presidency. I think that the fact that Donald Trump's going To be in the White House for the next four years is going to put a block, a total block on any progress towards this militant intolerance of Christians in America. And hopefully we'll actually start pulling it back a little bit, pulling the culture back a bit to where it used to be. Tell me something, Anya, because I'm asking this to all of our guests. Is there anything in the past year that you might look at and think, yeah, I think this was God working in human events?
- [34:55]
Unknown Guest
Yes, indeed. I mean, one of the very obvious examples has already been mentioned. But if I think about my sphere about persecution of Christians and intolerance against Christians, I'm just thinking of something very recent. Only last week, after two and a half years of court trial, a mother of five and a Christian, her name is Roda, was acquitted in Nigeria for alleged blasphemy after, and this is super shocking, sharing a video of a girl who was slaughtered, lynched for her Christian beliefs in school. And she shared that video criticizing what had happened and was then accused of blasphemy. And now finally, last week, through a really major legal win, she got free and she is now in a safe place. And this is one of the ways where I see this, just one example, how in these cases, sometimes also in the legal sphere, there can be immense victories through God's help.
- [35:48]
Ben Harnwell
Incredible. And anything in your personal life that you might want to share with the Warming Posse?
- [35:56]
Unknown Guest
Yeah, one thing that really encouraged me personally tremendously during this year was we work a lot with students. We've produced a documentary called Self Censored, which talks about Christian university students all across Europe. They are in a conversation with one another and talk about how to share their faith in a hostile environment towards the Christian belief that they're all experiencing. And during these conversations with different students that I've had following up on this project, I was so encouraged how a lot of them, once you start talking about this phenomenon of self censorship and about being afraid to even say you're a Christian in a public sphere out of fear this will have negative consequences. Once you start talking about this, a lot of young people say, oh, I always thought I'm the only one, but now I realize there's more people out there who have the same problem. And I can actually, we can actually talk about it together and we can kind of break through the spiral of silence and start talking about their beliefs, start raising questions about current worldview that we don't find is helpful for the human person. And they really find the courage to speak out and that's something that, for me, is really a huge sign of hope for our time.
- [37:06]
Ben Harnwell
Yeah, great response. Anya, can you tell me something? How are the institutional Christian churches, the Catholic Church, specifically, how are they with what you're doing? Are they aware of it? No, obviously they're aware of it. I think Cardinal Schoenberg has given a bit of support over the years, but generally, do you find that the institutional Christian churches, and I am specifically asking about the Catholic Church, are really giving you the support that this cause deserves.
- [37:42]
Unknown Guest
So, in general, we are an independent ngo. We are not funded by a church of any kind. So we always have this challenge of fundraising through private donors. But in terms of support, when it comes to the issue, I do see that there is a big support, for example, from the committee, the Bishops conference at the European Union that we closely work together with, who are very grateful for our documenting work. Also the Holy See, obviously, they are represented at the oec, a different international organization, and they do use our work. They use our report to just get this overview and have the data to work with and Dan to find responses or to raise the issue and really raise awareness about this.
- [38:27]
Ben Harnwell
So talking about the reports that you do, how many times has it come out? Yeah, I think one came out like a week ago, didn't it? Ten days ago, I seem to remember. Tell me how often it comes out and the sorts of things that people can find in there.
- [38:41]
Unknown Guest
So our report is published every year, always on November 15 or 16, around the day of international tolerance. And the idea of this report is to really make visible what I've just described as areas of discrimination, of intolerance against Christianity. And we really try to give an overview. Our report has three sections. The first is on hate crimes, very specific government data, police data on how many churches have been attacked in which country. The second chapter, about discrimination against Christians in the work field, in the public sphere, as I said, with banking and all these different issues. And then a third part of our report is about religious freedom or legal freedom restrictions that Christians are facing or that have repercussions on Christians who want to exercise their faith. And there we do legal analysis of different things happening in Europe. And I really recommend to take a look to get this overview and for all those who are somehow working in the field or concerned themselves, I think it's very important for us to know in which ways different laws affect religious freedom and how to raise awareness and maybe call upon members of parliament or the responsible institution, governments, to really be careful to safeguard religious freedom when making.
- [39:53]
Ben Harnwell
New legislation and we've got just two minutes left. You mentioned banking there. Can you just tell the war in posse are people in occupied Europe being debanked because of their Christian faith?
- [40:09]
Unknown Guest
So we've had a few cases now Christian organization, few are speaking about it because it's always a very sensitive issue. But those who do share about it say that because either of sharing Christian views. There was a pro life organization in Sweden last year who faced debanking. There were several Christian NGOs who are working in the global south who do missionary work or support Christians, persecuted Christians around the world who are struggling with this because the anti money laundering regulations have been tightened and banks are very afraid now to work with organizations who work with abroad. But there's also this world review issues. Apparently the Christians say because their organization is very obvious, either involved in pro life work or in some other pro family work, they have faced issues. Sometimes the bank doesn't admit it, but it's a very sudden cut and then it just says the organization doesn't align with the ethics of that corporation. So these things seem to be on the rise and we're trying to look into this more and we think it's a very important issue to keep on track on.
- [41:15]
Ben Harnwell
It's a huge issue. My own organization, the Dignitatis Humanae Institute was debanked here in Italy about three or four years ago. We weren't given any reason, any explanation whatsoever, just given a perfunctory email saying that our bank account was being closed. And by the way, I think we had a couple of hundred euros in that account. They never gave it to us. They cut, they shut down their account, pocketed the money and there's really very little that you can do about it. And I'm very glad that you're bringing this to people's attentions so quickly. Anya, where do people go? 20 seconds. Where do people go? To learn more about the Observatory on Intolerance and Discrimination against Christians in Europe.
- [41:55]
Unknown Guest
Our website is Intolerance against Christians eu and there you can find all recent cases, our publications, our reports. But we are also on social media, Twitter, Instagram, Facebook. It's Duck Europe, which is the abbreviation. So O I D A C.
- [42:13]
Ben Harnwell
Welcome back folks. Well, I'm particularly delighted to introduce our next guest. He's been on the show quite a few times over the past year. Also when I was guest hosting Pastor John Armantruku. Senior Pastor John, you always had this ability to infuse everyone whenever you come on the show. And I know you, you're a great hit with the war in posse. I'm going to cut in straight into my two questions to you. If you could pick an event over the course of the last year which you think you can say, I think this was God acting in the affairs of man.
- [42:46]
Pastor John Amanchukwu
You know, I can't overlook what happened on July 13 as a deranged human being sought to snub and take out the life of now President Donald J. Trump. When you think about that, the Bible tells us that the heart of the king is in the hands of the Lord and he turns it into whatever direction that he desires. We found out on July 13th that not only does God turn the hearts of kings, but he also turns the heads of kings. President Trump turned his head at the right time, avoiding a catastrophic incident. Only almighty God can do that. God turns hearts, but he also turns heads. And I believe that God has ordained this time for him to lead this country. You know, I was just in Phoenix, Arizona for the Amfest event under Turning Point usa and President Trump walked up to the microphone in the beginning and he said that today, now more than ever, we want to say things like Merry Christmas. You know, in the past, many presidents, Obama, Biden, potentially, Harris didn't want to say Merry Christmas. But we now have a president who's not afraid to say that. I believe that President Trump has been ordained for God and by God for such a time as this.
- [44:18]
Ben Harnwell
Perfect response. Pastor John, anything from your personal life that you think that you'd want to share with us to which you're particularly grateful to God for?
- [44:31]
Pastor John Amanchukwu
There's so many things that come to mind. Number one, I'm thankful that over the course of this year, as I've traveled to now, 16 different school board stops this year, but a total of 8, 18 states in total. I'm thankful for my wife who held down the home, who took care of the children, who made it easy for me to go and to transition and to do all of the work that God has called me to do for my children who have stood by me as well, and for many of my funders and supporters who have donated to my work through Inogod US. I'm thankful for Turning Point USA Dr. Bob, who has come alongside me as well to support my efforts in this national campaign to fight against woke tyrants at school board meetings all around the country. We're fighting against gender theory, queer theory and critical race theory. And we have the opportunity to defund, to defund the Department of Education and to send resources back to the state and to protect our children. I am gratefully and amazingly thankful for that.
- [45:40]
Ben Harnwell
Pastor John. Tomorrow's Christmas Day, and the world will either recognize or commemorate or pray along with the commemoration of the birth of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ in the general political battle. And I know, I think we share the same view that the political battles that we have here on earth is basically a reflection of what's going on in the wider spiritual battle. You know, Ephesians 6:12 and all the rest of it. But what would you just say, just in a couple of minutes, what would you just say? How would you tie the incarnation of God himself to the greater political battle that we're fighting here in the secular world?
- [46:25]
Pastor John Amanchukwu
Well, I'm telling people all around this country, and I said this in Phoenix, that the election is over, but the rapture, the coming of Christ, is pending. And so we have much work to do. But we cannot overlook the reason for this season. The Bible tells us in John 3:16, For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth on him might not perish, but have everlasting life. He gave us the ultimate gift, and that gift is available for anyone. Regardless of your past, regardless of the things that you've done, Christ is for you. And so we can take solace in that message, knowing that the birth of Christ is what brings true liberty and freedom. Freedom from the pain of death, freedom from damnation and action, access to Almighty God.
- [47:27]
Ben Harnwell
Father John, 90 seconds. Excuse me. We're going to two minutes. Would you just. Would you kindly lead us in prayer? It's Christmas Eve. Would you lead us in prayer and, and give us a blessing?
- [47:39]
Pastor John Amanchukwu
Yes, Lord, your word tells us that righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a reproach towards any people. You also say in your word that you are coming back for a church without a spot or wrinkle. So, God, we know today that you care for us, you're concerned about us, you love us, and that you want to send your redemption upon this nation. Mankind has rejected you. But God, we believe that there is revival yet upon this land. We pray for eyes to be open, for hearts to be tender, and for people to understand the significance of this season. We thank you, O God, for smiling upon our nation and giving us a president that will soon take office on January 20th of 2025 who has the mindset to do things that uplift the word of God and that speak clearly to the thing that you're most concerned about. We thank you and we bless you for this time to spend with our family, family and friends. We pray that you will be with us and keep us. In Jesus name we pray. Amen.
- [48:46]
Ben Harnwell
Amen. Father John, that's very, very kind of you. Before you bounce, where do people go on social media to stay in touch with your interventions?
- [48:57]
Pastor John Amanchukwu
Yes, they can go to my YouTube channel. It's @Rev w u tr Truth. That's Rev Wutruth at R e v w u Truth. Follow me there. And I appreciate your support.
- [49:17]
Ben Harnwell
Father John Amanchukwe Senior, thank you very much as always for coming on the show and sharing your particular unique spiritual insights with us as we contemplate the political events on a day to day basis. I take this moment to wish you a very merry Christmas. Thank you, Pastor John.
- [49:35]
Pastor John Amanchukwu
Thank you.
- [49:36]
Steve Bannon
Merry Christmas.
- [49:37]
Ben Harnwell
Stay with. Thank you. Stay with us folks. We've got a cracked hour coming up just after this short break. We've got Jenny Holland, we've got Bob Moynihan and Patrick K. O'Donnell as well, answering the same sorts of questions as to the presence and active role of God in our lives. Stand by folks. We're back after this short break. Don't go away.
- [50:10]
Anya Hoffman
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