Episode 5395: 250 Years Remembering The Ultimate Sacrifice Cont.

Summary

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Podcast Summary

Bannon's War Room, Episode 5395: "250 Years Remembering The Ultimate Sacrifice Cont."

Date: May 23, 2026
Host: Steve Bannon
Guest: Patrick K. O'Donnell, Combat Historian and Author

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Episode Overview

In this special Memorial Day weekend episode, Steve Bannon is joined by acclaimed combat historian Patrick K. O’Donnell for an in-depth conversation reflecting on the sacrifices of America’s warriors from the Revolutionary War to the present. Using O’Donnell’s latest trilogy on the American Revolution as a springboard, the discussion explores forgotten battles, unsung heroes, the nation’s founding DNA, and the importance of remembrance as the United States approaches the 250th anniversary of its founding.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Honoring the Fallen: Past and Present

Timestamps: 00:00–04:38

• Respecting the War Dead:
  Bannon opens with reflections on the solemn promise to treat the remains of American soldiers with dignity, citing ongoing efforts to recover remains from WWII sites like Peleliu and Tarawa.

  • "There's an implicit contract that their remains will be treated with dignity and that the remains will be brought back or buried with appropriate ceremony at one of our many magnificent cemeteries throughout the world." —Steve Bannon (01:37)

• Historical Limits on Remembrance:
  O’Donnell notes that the legal mandate to recover and honor war dead only extends back to World War I, leaving earlier wars—Revolutionary, War of 1812—largely neglected.

  • "The statute for bringing back the remains of our fallen extends to World War I and beyond. Wars prior to that, it doesn't extend to." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (02:56)

2. Forgotten Heroes of the Revolution: The Maryland 400

Timestamps: 03:38–07:04

• The ‘American Thermopylae’ in Brooklyn:
  Bannon and O’Donnell recount the dramatic charge of the Maryland 400 at the Battle of Brooklyn (1776)—a nearly lost episode memorialized on a small Brooklyn plaque, not a grand monument.

  • "One of the most important moments of combat in the history of this country took place essentially in downtown Brooklyn." —Steve Bannon (03:48)
  • O’Donnell describes how these men’s sacrifice allowed Washington’s army to escape and survive, forming the core narrative of his book Washington’s Immortals.

• Recent Rediscovery:
  O’Donnell shares a modern story: 44 remains from the 1775–76 invasion of Canada were found in Lake George, NY and reburied with full honors in 2019, demonstrating both advances and gaps in memorial culture.

3. Obsessive Campaigns and High-Stakes Revolutionary Gambles

Timestamps: 07:08–14:06

• The Obsession with Canada:
  The early American obsession with conquering Canada is traced from the Revolution through the War of 1812, a struggle often overlooked in mainstream narratives.

• The Benedict Arnold Enigma:
  Both recall Arnold’s remarkable leadership during the invasion of Canada, emphasizing grit amid horrendous conditions—marching through the Maine wilderness, starvation, and tragedy—before his later betrayal.

  • "He's probably one of our finest field commanders. He really showed his metal in this Canadian operation." —Steve Bannon (08:35)
  • "A man that led from the front, a tactical genius, just incredible amount of courage." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (08:55)

• Women in the Revolution:
  Jemima Warner’s bravery is spotlighted—after her husband collapses and dies, she carries on with his rifle, becoming the first known female combatant killed in American service during the Battle of Quebec.

  • "She will become the first female combatant in the United States to lose her life at the Battle of Quebec. And a forgotten and untold story that I tell in [Revolutionary Snipers]." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (10:38)

4. Pathways of Invasion and Turning Points

Timestamps: 13:12–14:58

• Hudson River Valley as Invasion Highway:
  O’Donnell explains how the route up the Hudson—via Albany and Ticonderoga—was a strategic corridor, both for American offenses into Canada and (later) British assaults from the north.

• Arnold at Saratoga:
  Repeatedly, Arnold emerges as a decisive battlefield hero, particularly at Saratoga—a major American victory and a turning point in the war.

5. O’Donnell’s Revolutionary Trilogy

Timestamps: 16:34–26:55

• Overview of the Three Books:
  O’Donnell presents the scope of his trilogy:

  1. Washington's Immortals: The Maryland Line, America's ‘first elite unit.’
     • "It was the first Band of Brothers... based on pension applications and files... nonfiction, but reads like fiction." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (17:31)
  2. The Indispensables: The Marblehead Regiment, their naval feats, and Washington’s iconic river crossings.
  3. Revolutionary Snipers: Focuses on riflemen, special operations, and technological innovation in the long rifle.
  • "When you read these books, you are so proud that you're an American. You're so proud you came from a country that would produce giants... Ordinary Americans doing extraordinary acts of heroism." —Steve Bannon (14:40)

• Firsthand Accounts:
  O’Donnell emphasizes that his works rely almost exclusively on contemporary memoirs and archives, offering the reader an immersive, real-time view.

6. The Grit Factor: Ordinary People, Extraordinary Deeds

Timestamps: 22:53–27:03

• America’s Survival on a Thread:
  Bannon highlights how the revolution hung on razor-thin margins and divine providence, with regular people repeatedly refusing to quit.

  • "If you don't quit, you win. The revolution shows you that if you don't quit, you'll eventually win." —Steve Bannon (24:54)

• What is the Greatest Generation?
  O’Donnell shares how WWII veterans, including Darby’s Rangers, told him the founders were truly the greatest generation.

  • "'Patrick, what about the boys of '75 and '76 who fought for the cause? That's the greatest generation.' And I will. I totally agree with what he said." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (25:52)

7. Interpreting Memorial Day & the 250th Anniversary

Timestamps: 31:58–39:06

• Meaning of Memorial Day:

  • "They’re responsible for securing our freedom through their sacrifice, and therefore it’s absolutely critical that we honor and remember them." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (31:58)
  • Both discuss the danger of collective amnesia about the full meaning and legacy of U.S. military service.

• The Spirit of '76 and the Upcoming 250th:

  • "I think that we've lost much of what they fought for. And I think there's a need in some ways to retrench, to look back at the ideals of freedom and liberty that they forged through their blood, sweat and tears." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (36:33)
  • O’Donnell recounts a “forgotten declaration” at Fort Gower (Ohio River), months before the Revolution—a scene that opens Revolutionary Snipers.

8. The ‘Revolutionary Snipers’ and American Ingenuity

Timestamps: 39:06–44:00

• Birth of the American Long Rifle:
  The ten original rifle companies in the Continental Army—armed with advanced Pennsylvania Long Rifles—represent early special operations, technology, and cunning.
  • "They're just fearless men that are also, happen to be expert shots that will form the foundation of the Continental army." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (43:28)

9. Final Reflections: American DNA & Lessons from History

Timestamps: 46:24–50:37

• Thread Across Generations:
  O’Donnell repeatedly underscores that history’s inflection points, from the Revolution to WWII, were shaped by ordinary Americans choosing to do extraordinary things.

  • "It’s about individual agency, individuals that are able to bend and shape history. They're not supposed to do it, but against all odds, they somehow do it." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (46:54)

• Lessons from the Past:

  • "There are times when we feel like this could have never happened in the past, or things are so bad that we'll never be able to get through them. And then we look at what our great ancestors accomplished... it just provides an incredible perspective." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (49:28)

• Why It Matters:
  The ongoing recovery of the fallen, the need to remember forgotten warriors, and the obligation to recall the true cost of freedom are all recurring themes as America approaches its 250th Independence Day.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Ordinary people, extraordinary consequences:
  "These giants, guess what? They're ordinary people. Ordinary Americans doing extraordinary acts of heroism." —Steve Bannon (14:48)

• The cost of forgetting:
  "We do not remember our heroes as we should." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (32:05)

• The challenge for modern America:
  "I think that we've lost much of what they fought for. And I think there's a need in some ways to retrench, to look back at the ideals of freedom and liberty that they forged through their blood, sweat and tears." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (36:33)

• On letting the sources speak:
  "There's no agenda other than to let them tell their story and let history unfold. And in many cases, that's very gritty and dirty and bloody. But it’s the reality of conflict and also the reality of history." —Patrick K. O’Donnell (49:52)

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Major Segments (Timestamps)

• 00:00–07:04: Honoring the war dead; Revolutionary War stories & the Maryland 400
• 07:08–14:06: Revolutionary operations in Canada; Benedict Arnold; Jemima Warner
• 16:34–26:55: The trilogy—Washington’s Immortals, The Indispensables, Revolutionary Snipers
• 31:58–39:06: Memorial Day’s meaning and the revolutionary spirit approaching the 250th
• 39:06–44:00: Rise of the riflemen; technological and tactical innovation
• 46:24–50:37: Individual agency and American character
• 50:50–51:44: Where to find O’Donnell’s books and follow his work

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Further Resources

• Patrick K. O’Donnell’s website: patrickkodonnell.com
• Social Media: @CombatHistorian on X (Twitter) and Getter
• Books:
  • Washington’s Immortals
  • The Indispensables
  • Revolutionary Snipers (upcoming)

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Episode Takeaways

• Memorial Day is about more than barbeques: It's a call to remember not only the recent fallen but the earliest heroes whose sacrifices made America possible.
• History hinges on decisions of ‘ordinary’ people: The revolution, like every American war, was won by regular men and women called to act in extraordinary times.
• The past echoes the present: The 250th anniversary is a chance to retrench, reflect, and renew the foundational ideals of freedom and courage.
• Letting stories stand: O’Donnell’s narrative approach—to let sources and participants speak for themselves—keeps the history immediate, relevant, and powerful.

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This summary is designed to capture the depth, tone, and patriotic spirit of the conversation, providing clear, timestamped insights and memorable quotes for listeners and readers alike.

Transcript

[Steve Bannon]

Sam. Sat 23 May in states the United of our Lord 2026 Memorial Day weekend. We're here with the finest combat historian of his generation, Patrick K. O' Donnell, as we do every year. In fact, we did it over at Breitbart Radio for many, many, many years. Patrick, want to thank you. Patrick, thoughts on we were going to do as you and I discussed. We're going to do live coverage on Monday, but we were going to try to focus this on America250 because of the Declaration of Independence on the 4th of July. And then you and I will be doing a lot of coverage of the British expeditionary force that was there to crush the independence of the nation in the crib in the first 30 to 60 days. And we want to give the run up to that and focus on in your books and other things have been written about these tremendous patriots, many lost to history that gave all in the beginning of the formation of this country. But I had to start because of the situation that's going on in Peleliu and Tarawa in other places. Your thoughts? It is, you know, the country owes its warriors, obviously if you're wounded, a full recovery. But to the warriors and the parents and the wives and the children or the husbands, there's an implicit contract that their remains will be treated with dignity and that the remains will be brought back or buried with appropriate ceremony at one of our many magnificent cemeteries throughout the world. I mean no other nation on earth has, as Colin Powell said, that little patch of earth in these different countries fighting for the freedom of those people. And giving all your thoughts about all that, sir,

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

I'm just going to sort of bring in a connection. One thing that is striking to me is the statute for bringing back the remains of our fallen extends to World War I and beyond. Wars prior to that, it doesn't extend to. And you know, I, I found this firsthand when I was dealing with Washington's Immortals and the potential mass grave that's in Brooklyn of the Maryland 400 or Washington's immortals, the men that, that gave everything in a desperate charge that allowed the Continental Army.

[Steve Bannon]

This is one. This is one. This is, this is one that bugs me no end. I'm so glad you brought this. I made this connection.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

There's, there's.

[Steve Bannon]

And then like I found, I found, I found out. I found out about this. I thought I KN everything because people know I'm a know it all. I thought I knew everything. I did know this. The American Thermopylae took place one of the most important moments of combat in the history of this country took place essentially in downtown Brooklyn, right in the very opening days of the revolutionary war. And. And Patrick, you told me, says, hey. The only thing to remember this is a little plaque on, I think, a tavern wall that says the battle essentially took place here. But we're not sure that's the right thing. They said, hey, there is a mass grave somewhere around here that has the remains of the individuals. You wrote the book back book about the Washington's immortals. Tell us that story, because people understand it's not just terrible in the Pacific. It's here in the greatest city in the country in hipster Brooklyn, sir.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

It's men of family fortune and honor from Maryland's finest families that formed the first Maryland regiment that had the American thermopylae, Arguably one of the most important small unit actions in history, in the American revolution in particular, where they fought against Cornwallis. They made a series of charges, you know, three or four bayonet charges. They were one of the only units that were armed in the revolutionary army at that time, the continental army, with bayonets. And they charged Cornwallis position, which was bunkered in a stone house. This charge allowed the continental army, it created a gap in the lines to escape to the fortifications in Brooklyn heights. This is told in my book, Washington's immortals, as well as the indispensables in my newest book, Revolutionary snipers, Because the riflemen will play a key role in this battle as well, but kind of in a more contemporary sense. Just Today and yesterday, Steve, 44 teen soldiers, including a woman, we don't know her exact. She might have been a camp follower from Lake George, New York. Their remains were found in 2019 when they were excavating an apartment, were reburied today with full military honors up in Lake George.

[Steve Bannon]

Tell me that story where these were the boys.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

They were found in Lake George, New York. There were 44 remains. And this is. They were part of the. The expedition to attack Canada in 1775 and 1776, which relates directly to the book that I just wrote, Revolutionary snipers, where the riflemen are part of the main prong that goes after Quebec City. And it's very possible that within the 44 remains that some of these men were in the unit that I discussed, because they found a button from the 1st Pennsylvania Battalion. Not exactly. Not directly the Pennsylvania unit that I. That I write about, but very close. But it's. It's these men that. That fall back from Canada after the boarded attack At Quebec.

[Steve Bannon]

Hang on.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

And they were there.

[Steve Bannon]

I want to.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

We've had.

[Commercial Announcer]

We've had a.

[Steve Bannon]

We've had an unhealthy obsession. Shouldn't say unhealthy. Isn't it true, sir? We've had. We were obsessed with taking Canada in the Revolutionary War and all the way up to the War of 1812, which is. Half of that war was fought on the Canadian border.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

I mean, and rightfully so. It. It's the 14th column.

[Steve Bannon]

Yeah, go ahead.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

And we don't look at it that way, but. And many of these guys, 100. They were French first and very much looking forward to potentially getting rid of British rule. It's an incredible story that I tell in Revolutionary Snipers of. I mean, of basically two rifle companies that are in Pennsylvania, as well as Virginians under Daniel Morgan, along with other units that make this amazing trek through the main wilderness. And that story is epic. I mean, they're. They're using rafts that are made.

[Steve Bannon]

This is the greenwood. This is the. Hang on. This is the. This is the expedition to Canada. One of the junior officers in command was. This was Benedict Arnold, Right? This is.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

That.

[Steve Bannon]

That is one of the greatest. They left in frozen. They left in frozen. You want to talk about hell on earth? Is that Expedition Expeditionary? No. It was unbelievable. They were first. They were snake bed. Right. They're a little unlucky, but you make your own luck. I mean, it was. I, I, when I read about it and I said, I couldn't have done the first three miles. They're leaving Maine. They're going to march up to Canada through the Maine woods. I go, what a wonderful idea. This is. Who thought this. And Benedict Arnold, who had a. Until he betrayed the country, he was on a roll. He's probably one of our finest field commanders. He really showed his metal in this Canadian operation.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

One of our finest field commanders and a brilliant general, a man that led from the front, a tactical genius, just incredible amount of courage. Leads the men on this expedition through the forbidding Maine wilderness. They're short on supplies. They're starving. Many of the men, they have to resort to eating their pouches that are made out of leather in their shoes. They're so hungry. And within this story emerges an incredible cast of heroes, including, I really highlight, one of the first female combatants who's a camp follower, and her name is Jemima Warner. And she is marching with the men because her husband is a rifleman and she is a strong woman. I mean, this is a woman that is only 17 or 18 years old and her husband is in his early 20s, and he decides to just quit. It is that hard. And he just falls down. And she tries everything for a day to convince him to move forward because she knows with snow falling everywhere that he will die of starvation in the elements and nothing can convince him to move forward. And he dies in the main wilderness. You know, a forgotten member of the Continental Army, a forgotten hero. She storms forward with his rifle in hand and will play a role in even, potentially even the. They try to get Quebec City to surrender, and they send her in, and she will become the first female combatant in the United States to lose her life at the Battle of Quebec. And a forgotten and untold story that I tell in Revelation.

[Steve Bannon]

Why did they send her in?

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

Because the first party that they sent in under a white flag was shelled with artillery rounds by the garrison commander. And they thought that they sent in a woman with a white flag that they might have a chance. And it did work. They let her in, she delivered the message, and then she was released. But in the midst of the siege of Quebec City, it was an artillery duel for a short period of time, and she would lose her life in that.

[Steve Bannon]

Remember, in the siege, remember, Quebec City was a mon calm in General Wolf and General Wolfe. This is back in the French and Indian wars for people that just to get everybody up to date, you don't see more savage fighting by the United States of America. Really in that period was 17 from the. Before the French Union wars, and then when it started all the way through the war of 1812. Because I. My premise is that the revolution really didn't stop at Yorktown. It really. The. The military, the British, in the British aristocracy's obsession with controlling the United States in this vast wilderness of which drove King George George III even more insane than he was understanding what he had lost. It was only when Andrew Jackson and that group of it was a ragtag force of freed slaves and buccaneers and Cajuns and good old country boys from Alabama, crushed the British army at New Orleans on the 2nd or 3rd of January of 1815. That's when the war really stopped. But if you want to see just brutal daily combat and real heroism, you go from the French and Indian War, because that's where Washington won his spurs as a junior officer, all the way through the War of 1812. You look up in those Northern. You know, you look up in Vermont and Maine, upstate New York, all the way to Michigan and Lake Michigan. Man, it is brutal. And they're not given any quarter like

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

it's a path of invasion.

[Steve Bannon]

Talk about the path of invasion. Because that's always been our. I think the path of invasion is actually up through New York State.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

More.

[Steve Bannon]

But go ahead and tell us about it.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

This, this, this area, not, not Maine per se. We're talking about up the Hudson River Valley, through Albany and Ticonderoga. This is the path of invasion to, to Canada and also their path of invasion to the United States later on. It's, it's a, just a brutal. And then as, as well as in 1777 when General Burgoyne launches a massive army out of, out of Canada towards what would now be, you know, Saratoga, which is another aspect of the book that I really get into in this is a Rifleman because the first snipers that will have a huge role in that.

[Steve Bannon]

Who's the hero there? Wait for it. Oh, Benedict Arnold. Once again, Benedict Arnold shows up in the, in all his glory on the battlefield, really turning the battle around and saving it for the Americans. But we'll get into all that. Patrick K. O' Donnell. His third volumes out, just amazing. The trilogy on the American Revolution. Patrick, I'm so glad you took, was it six years your life and turned it on the American Revolution. And just extraordinary, extraordinary works about people, I think that had been lost in the midst of time. When you read these books, you are so proud that you're an American. You're so proud you came from a country that would produce giants like in these books. And these giants, guess what? They're ordinary people. Ordinary Americans doing extraordinary acts of heroism.

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[Steve Bannon]

Okay. Welcome back, Patrick. Just to do a reset for the. For the audience on a Memorial Day special you've done. This is the third in a trilogy of books you've done on the American Revolution. And you're going back to the archives and going back to the original sources and the memoirs. It puts you there. It's like a novel, but you're in the middle of it. And every one of them is filled with action. You're filled with Americans stepping up. And at the very beginning of the country's history. This is the very beginning of the country's history. What we were. This is the DNA of this nation. Just walk me through. So people have a level set here, the three books, who they're about, because all of them are about ordinary people that do extraordinary things. And you're filled with this true patriotism as you read these books, sir.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

Yeah, I'm very proud of all three of the books that I've written. The first book is really a miracle book in many ways. It's called Washington's Immortals. It was a book that my original editors didn't want me to write. They wanted me to write only about World War II. And it's like all the books have found me in one way or another. And this is the case with Washington's Immortals. I was with Colonel Willie Buell in New York City, and he wanted to know if I wanted to go to the Met. I said, no. Hey, let's do a battlefield tour of the Battle of Brooklyn. So we started out at Greenwood Cemetery, where the most infamous and famous New Yorkers are buried. But it's also the site of the opening rounds of the Battle of Brooklyn. We started there, walked through Battlefield Hill, where the. The Marylanders and other Americans kind of faced off against the British. And it's. We then walked down towards the Michael Raleigh American Legion Post and found a rusted old sign that said, here lie 254Americans, Maryland heroes. And it was there I wanted to know, this is a mass grave of who are these men? And I found out that Mordecai Gist, who's one of the main characters in the book, survived along with others. And I wrote what was the first Band of Brothers. It was a breakthrough book of the American Revolution, and every word of it is true. It's based on pension applications and files. This is nonfiction. It's not fiction, but it reads like fiction in the sense of that much of it is in the words of these individuals. And it's about the Maryland line. These are an elite unit, one of America's first elite units that, as we mentioned earlier, they fought the American Thermopylae, which buys Washington's army in Brooklyn, which is about 10,000 strong an hour, more precious in our history than any other, allows the army to escape to Brooklyn Heights and fight on. And it's the Marylanders that then are this elite unit that will fight in the north and the south, and they will play a huge role. Places like Cowpens and Guilford Courthouse and even Yorktown, where Mordecai Gist will face off against his old nemesis, Cornwallis, who he faced near the Stone House in Brooklyn, and he will see Cornwallis, you know, surrender at Yorktown. And that was my first book, which was a tremendous success. All the books that I've written on the American Revolution, and actually the last five, four or five books have been bestselling books. And the next book in line is the Indispensables. And this is about the Marblehead regiment. These are the men that rode Washington across the Hudson river. Or I mean, the. The. The Delaware River, I should say, and then the east river in Brooklyn. It's where, after the American Thermopylae, Washington has to decide to stay or fight. And two days later, he decides to evacuate Brooklyn. And the greatest evacuation in military history takes place. And it's on the backs of the Marblehead mariners, which assemble small boats and row Washington's army, the remains of it, all of it, across the East River. And, you know, it's here that the miraculous fog sets in, that this is a condition that's not. It doesn't happen all the time, ever. Hardly happens at exactly the right time in right place, which screens the movement of lovers, men, and they bring the rest of the army back to Manhattan. And there. This book is also about the origins of the first Navy, which happens to be John Glover's fishing boat, which is repurposed into a armed schooner, and they asymmetrically attack the British. You know, there's a little bit of shades of Straits of Hormuz here, if you want Will, because it. It causes the insurance rates to skyrocke with the British. The British had been using civilian transports for their logistics to bring over supplies, ammunition, and men from London to North America. And these schooners were interdicting them and seizing boats causing the insurance to go to skyrocket. It also is the origins of the United States Navy. Some of these captains within the Marblehead ranks are true giants. They, they really, they bring in crucial powder gunpowder at exactly the right time when the, the Continental army has none and they save the war. And Glover's men, you know, just play a huge role throughout the 14th Continental of saving the army multiple times during the American Revolution.

[Steve Bannon]

Hang on, I want to go to this and see how the third book ties in. But if you read the first two books you realize people that are prepared to fight and give all for their country, although at the time the actual formation of the country was new. We had been a. They had been colonies, but we didn't really have a national sense or a national purpose. It is how close things were. So many times there's so many situations like at the American Thermopylae in Brooklyn that if Washington's morals had not continued to charge the Stone House, the British very easily could have swept Washington's army from the field. And the revolution's over in 60 days. Done by September you're finished. It's over. This is the thing that you sit there and you're in awe and you talk about divine providence and we being a. This nation being a city on the hill in a chosen land. You see it in these books and the books are from first person memoirs or accounts at the time. It's not people after the fact putting together a pattern recognition narrative. You're seeing it through the eyes of the participants. And many of these participants died. I mean what's so amazing is how many people willingly gave their life on things that were hanging by a thread. And in the first two books, I don't know about the third because I haven't really had a chance to jump into it. But the first two books you are outmanned and outgunned and I mean like 10 to 1 every time. These aren't close fights. These are, these are where you're overwhelmingly the underdog. Yet in the cussedness, stick to itiveness and grit of Americans, they just won't quit. Why do I say all the time if you don't quit, you win? The revolution shows you that if you don't quit, quit, you'll eventually win. That's what the revolution is about. I don't think we won too many of these strategic battles. There weren't a lot of Saratogas. Let's say that there were not a lot of Saratogas, but there was this Cussedness. They weren't going to stop. And you see that because until the events happen, these are just normal people going through their lives. All of a sudden, they stand up like you. You look back at Roman history and Greek history of these armies that stood up at the time and just, wow, you remember their names down through thousands of years. That's what happens here. We just haven't had the Patrick K. O' Donnells that go back and do the archival research. O', Donnell, how many years? And I realize you wrote a Civil War book in between, but if you take all three of your trilogy on the revolution, how many years of both research and writing Collectively did all three take?

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

16 years?

[Steve Bannon]

Six.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

Starting in about two. What, 2010.

[Steve Bannon]

You got masterpieces. 2010, yeah.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

Every one of them has been a journey. I've written multiple books at once, but they, these have been, you know, truly a pleasure and an honor to, to just to go to places like Bunker Hill, which are the most storied ground, legendary ground, or Battle Road, where my own ancestors fought the mills. That's just, it's just, it's so powerful, you know, And I'm also taken by. I've interviewed, I think, about 4,000 World War II vets, and I'll never forget I interviewed a member of Darby's Rangers, and I said, are you the greatest generation? And he said to me, patrick, what about the boys of 75 and 76 who fought for the cause? That's the greatest generation. And I will. I totally agree with what he said.

[Steve Bannon]

I think he may be right. And that's coming from the greatest generation, I think. And it's because Darby's Ranger, I think Darby's Rangers, nailed it.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

This is. This guy was great because he. Well, let me. I believe it's true because we fought against our fellow Americans in our first Civil War because there were many loyal Americans. I mean, this is not a clean fight at all. It's an insurgency as well as a civil war and a conventional war against the greatest power, land and naval power at the time, the British Empire. And it's somehow we spawn ideas of freedom and liberty that are more powerful than anything else that will change the world from this generation and continues to change the world. And it's really, you know, as we look today at the change, it's our. It's that revolutionary generation that will save us from so much of what's going on as we fall back to the foundations and pillars that this generation founded.

[Steve Bannon]

Hang on for a second. Patrick K. O' Donnell is with us. It's Saturday and we are doing our special Memorial Day weekend live coverage from 10am to 2pm on Monday. Patrick carried on is also going to

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[Steve Bannon]

You move. Foreign. Welcome back. Patrick K. O'.

[Commercial Announcer]

Donnell.

[Steve Bannon]

One of the reasons you've become a bestseller author is your books are first hand accounts through archival research or interviews. You started with the oral histories of the greatest generation. So you, you have done thousands of individual interviews, I mean thousands and tens of thousands of hours and done archival research for years to get the first person count through the eyes. And since your books don't deal with big strategy, I mean, you lay all that kind of out, but this is really all different from every different war really focused on Americans in combat. And I might say, although there are no average Americans, the average American in combat, the ordinary person doing extraordinary things. What does Memorial Day do you think? And you made the comment, hey, when we did the battlefield, the recovery of the remains, we didn't go past World War I. What do you think for the heroes and patriots that gave their lives for this country, what Memorial Day would mean to them if he had the opportunity to talk to them about it?

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

I think it would be giving us our tomorrow and our today. They're responsible for securing our freedom through their sacrifice, and therefore it's absolutely critical that we honor and remember them. I think that that's at times a shortcoming, that we do not remember our heroes as we should.

[Steve Bannon]

Memorial Day today in the 250th. Given that you've just written the third book of your trilogy on the revolution and on the fighting men of the Revolution, fighting men and women, I might add to the revolution, the 250th. What does it mean to you as we go through this and now the lead up to July 4th? And folks, that's not ending our coverage. I would actually say from I would maybe not realize America's voice. They're going to be part of all of it, as we will. But particularly for the war room, we've always made a big emphasis that Fourth of July is obviously very important. It is the document. It's the Declaration of Not Just Independence. It's a declaration of war against an empire, because I think that you had the American Revolution, then you had the War of Independence, then you had building the nation. They were kind of in three big blocks. The signing of the Declaration brings to the end, I believe the curtain comes down on the first part, which is the American Revolution, to actually get these loyal sons of England to essentially write a document that declared independence and therefore going to war against their mother country. Then you had the Revolutionary war itself that went on for what, seven or eight years. Like I said, if you don't quit, you're going to win. Now in the 250th, our coverage, I think, will actually get more intense after July 4th, because we're going to go through with Patrick, the importance of that first six months, because the British were quite smart. They created a empire with a bunch of pirates, essentially Francis Drake and company being pirates down in the Caribbean being pirates, stealing the gold from the Spanish and defeating the Spanish empire. They built an empire with really nothing. And the Americans, which could have been the foundational element along with India, said, we're out. We're going to opt out of this. We want our independence. We want our freedom. We want to be able to call our own shots. It's in that 250th. And the British realized immediately we must put this down and the only way to put. We've talked enough, we're through talking. There's no diplomacy, there's no talk. This has to be crushed in a vast military expedition. And they sent the largest expeditionary force in the history of the world at the time. 300, I think, combat ships, 300 warships in New York harbor, the British army expeditionary force in Staten island, and then, and then landing on Long Island. And as Patrick so brilliantly discusses it time and again, the Battle of New York. Retreat, retreat, retreat, just at the very last second, like almost a movie that's written. You know, they, they save themselves, they save the army till they, they retreat all the way through Manhattan and then to New Jersey and get their ass kicked all the way down till they cross the Delaware and they get back to Pennsylvania and they say we got to regroup. Until that time, even a signer of the Declaration from New Jersey had asked for a pardon from the British because it was over. We had nothing but a string of defeats. Now it was heroism and bravery. American Thermopylae, the American Dunkirk. As Patrick says, you know, these ordinary people doing extraordinary things to save this, this country, this republic in the cradle. But the British understood we're going to crush it militarily in the cradle. So given that as we, and people barely, the general population barely understands the Declaration of Independence. Your thoughts on this? 250, Patrick, since you, for 16 years you've lived with the spirit of 76, that Darby's Rangers greatest generation member ain't wrong. He says, hey, the greatest generation, Patrick, don't forget the boys of 75 and 76. What would they say about our 250th, sir?

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

They would say that I think that we've lost much of what they fought for. And I think there's a need in some ways to retrench, to look back at the ideals of freedom and liberty that they forged through their blood, sweat and tears to, to go back in many ways to, to what, you know, those sacrifices were all about and that was about, was about freedom. I mean, revolutionary snipers opens up in a, in a forgotten, in a forgotten battle. And, and that battle is on October 10, 1774 months before the Revolutionary War at a place called Point Pleasant in the Ohio territory. And these men, I mean the opening scene of this is like something out of Indiana Jones where two men are sent out to. Several men are sent out to go hunting to find forage of a thousand for a thousand man army. They're to go out hunting and as they're. It's in the, you know, the early twilight of the morning, and they stumble upon an Indian camp of hundreds, if not over a thousand men, warriors that are about to pounce on them. And these men are then running for their lives as they're avoiding musket rounds from the Indians. And they make their way into the camp. One of them is killed, and they then blurt out that they're about to be attacked. And it's the, you know, an epic battle that nobody's even heard about, hardly for, you know, over 14 hours. These men are nearly overrun by a native army, a massive army of warriors. And it's the technology that they are wielding, a Pennsylvania long rifle, that saves them in many cases. But what comes out of that, Steve, is an even more forgotten aspect of the American Revolution. It's really one of the first declarations of our independence at a place called Fort Gower, which is on the Ohio river, where these men assemble after this war takes place and they assert their rights of liberty and freedom and that they will defend those rights as Americans. And that's the opening of Revolutionary Snipers.

[Steve Bannon]

It's amazing you chose the Ohio Valley. Correct me if I'm wrong, sir, your book starts in Ohio Valley. If memory serves me, in the Treaty of Paris, the one thing the British demanded is that all movement of the colonists would stop at the Appalachian Mountains. And in fact, the Ohio River Valley was specifically what they said they were not going to allow to be touched. Correct. I mean, this, of course, being Americans, not only did we bitch and moan about being taxed for our country at the time Britain to fight the French and Indian War on our territory, which led to revolution, but the prohibition against going into Ohio Valley. The American colonists or American citizens then said, hey, how about this? Screw you, we're going to go where we want to go, and flooded the zone. So it's quite interesting that you started in the Ohio Valley because that was considered, I think, by many people to be the jewel of the crown. Right? That, that expansion into that vast wilderness with all the natural resources and beauty and farmland, all of it. I mean, it was even beyond the Indians. It was obviously, although they were nomadic, their territory, but the Brits and, you know, the French knew what they lost, but the Brits were not prepared to lose that. Correct, sir.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

That's. That's part of it. But what I, what I really get into here is that that army was almost sacrificed. That's a. It's a long story to the Native Americans. And what I wanted to focus on was what came after it. And it's a declaration. They do a two way thing. They kind of declare their allegiance to the Crown, but they also leave a veiled threat that they are armed and ready to fight for their liberty if need be as Americans. And it's a very much a forgotten chapter of the American Revolution, but also just the full arc of the Revolutionary War.

[Steve Bannon]

When you say revolution, the revolution begins. What was that when you say revolutionary snipers? Was this because the Americans with the long rifle were such good marksmen and we had proven, particularly on the retreat that we killed so many British regulars on the retreat back to Cambridge and to Boston, that this was going to have to be dealt with, that the Americans were actually not just good shots, but because of the frontier nature in Lexington and Concord you saw on the march back, it was brutal. Did you get inspired for the book, given the fact of how good we were, that we had a strategic advantage as far as snipers and the ability to shoot?

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

A very complicated story, but the first 10 companies of the Continental army are riflemen and they are armed with pathbreaking technology. The Pennsylvania long rifle, which spawns in early 1700, 17 oh, 1709, roughly in. In Lancaster, Pennsylvania. It's there, it's imported from gunsmiths in Switzerland and Germany, which take German weapons and make them better. They're. It's a product of the environment. It's expanded, it's longer, it's lighter, and it's more deadly. And the book is about the technology of the long rifle, but also the tactics and doctrine that go along with it. But it's really a band of brothers on these men who are the best shots in Washington's army. It's an untold story until this book. It's also a book about early special operations. And these men are really precursor to special operations forces. They're doing long range reconnaissance. Several of these men are.

[Steve Bannon]

Are.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

They're. Before the war, they're known as long hunters. They will go into the wilderness against, you know, all odds, Native Americans, whatever, and hunt and come back. They will make, you know, hundreds of miles in the Alleghenies alone or with a small group of men and to hunt and come back. They're just fearless men that are also happen to be expert shots that will form the foundation of the Continental army. The first 10.

[Steve Bannon]

Hang on one second. We're gonna take a short commercial break. Our kickoff to Memorial Day weekend here in the world will continue this morning.

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[Steve Bannon]

Go check it out. Hey, welcome back. Patrick K. O'. Donnell. We finished the trilogy. The book's gonna be coming out. Give me your thoughts as we roll in. You're gonna be here with live coverage we always do every Memorial Day as we wrap up our Saturday kind of kickoff coverage. We started in the Pacific with the bloody battles of Peleliu and Tarawa and the remains of our heroes that have not been brought home or given proper burial at one of these magnificent cemeteries we have throughout the world and particularly in the Pacific. Your thoughts, Patrick K. O'. DONNELL?

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

My thoughts are that this is, you know, the books I've written are about ordinary Americans that do extraordinary things. They're about untold stories, in many cases, smaller stories that tell a larger story of a larger conflict. It's about individuals that are on the inflection points of history, be it Saratoga or on Battle Road or at Bunker Hill or at Tarawa or at D Day where, you know, it's members of the 2nd Ranger Battalion, two men, really, one man that disables the big guns at Point D Hawk. It's about individual agency, individuals that are able to bend and shape history. They're not supposed to do it, but against all odds, they somehow do it. And I think that that's the lesson, the great lesson of history. It's the great lesson of American history that, you know, we can under. We can. That it's something that's in our blood. Revolutionary snipers brings back rugged individuals that change the odds, that did things that were just absolutely extraordinary, that shouldn't have been done, but somehow they do it. And it's. It's a theme that runs through all of the books that are written. And also within those books are Americans that have given every last bit of their devotion, their last full measure, that have fallen for our country. And it's what Memorial Day is all about. It's about honoring those individuals in their sacrifices.

[Steve Bannon]

Your books, and I want to close on this. Your books have done an amazing job of showing people that are normal Americans going about their lives. And then the call to action is about in defense of this republic in many different places throughout, because you've covered every major war, and they're. Up until the time of their call. They're ordinary people. They're just going about their lives. And once they come into these conflicts, they. What they do, you sit there and you read and say, this is like a novel. I can't believe these folks, against all these odds and all this hardship and all this, all these deprivations, they pull together and they're able to achieve extraordinary things that put us on the path to the success that we've had to get here today. Give me a minute or two about that before we wrap up, and I'll see you back on Monday. Is that the theme of your. If you read all of your books, the theme is ordinary people doing extraordinary things. Your thoughts, sir?

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

Extraordinary things that are on, in many cases, the inflection points of history. And it's history that is alive that it provides us with perspective. Once, you know, there are times when we feel like this could have never happened in the past, or things are so bad that we'll never be able to get through them. And then we look at what our great ancestors accomplished, and we realize it just provides an incredible perspective of what they accomplished and what they achieved. I'll say this, too. The books are the Good, the Bad and the ugly. I don't. I just let them tell their story, and I tell it from all perspectives. There's no agenda other than to let them tell their story and let history unfold. And in many cases, that's very gritty and dirty and bloody. But it's the reality of conflict and also the reality of history.

[Steve Bannon]

The books are extraordinary. Where do they go? Get your writings. We're going to wrap up, and I'll see you On Monday. Where do, where did we get all your writings and where do people go on social media to keep up with your comments? You've always got great stuff up on Breitbart all the time.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

Where do people go pre order American Snipers on Barnes and noble.com or Amazon.com all the books are best selling books. You know which Revolutionary Snipers is coming out in a few months, but the others you can get at any bookstore. I'm at Combat Historian on X for Twitter as well as Getter and my website is patrickkodonnell.com all my books are up there as well. And you can see there's just, you know, hundreds of reviews from everything from the Wall Street Journal to the Associated Press, you know, on the books as well as, you know, like for instance, indispensables. We have nearly 2,000 five star reviews from readers.

[Steve Bannon]

Amazing.

[Patrick K. O'Donnell]

You know, many of them are War Room readers, which I appreciate

[Steve Bannon]

your books. Okay, Patrick, fabulous job. I'll see you on Monday. Monday at 10am we're going to 10am to 2. 10am to 2. We're going to do live coverage of the commemoration on Memorial Day with the President. United States want to thank you and we'll leave you with the magnificent rendition of Minstrel Boys from Blackhawk Down. I want to thank everybody that pitched in Real America's voice. Everybody helps with this special every year. And don't forget history flights, extraordinary work on the remains of our fallen heroes. Keep in mind 80,000 from World War II still not recovered. Have a great weekend. We'll see you back here at 10am Eastern Daylight Time on Monday for live coverage for four hours of the commemoration of Memorial Day in the 250th anniversary of the founding of this republic in the year of our Lord 2026. See you. Far away, Sam.

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