WarRoom Battleground EP 1042: Traditionalist Catholic “Schismatic” Consecrations In Ecône Switzerland Today

Summary

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WarRoom Battleground EP 1042: Traditionalist Catholic “Schismatic” Consecrations In Ecône, Switzerland

Date: July 1, 2026
Host: WarRoom.org (Ben Harnwell sitting in for Steve Bannon)
Guests: Frank Walker (Canon 212), Jenny Holland

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on the historic “schismatic” episcopal consecrations carried out by the Society of Saint Pius X (SSPX) in Ecône, Switzerland—a seismic event in traditionalist Catholicism. The panel delves into the significance of these consecrations, the legacy of post-Vatican II Church reforms, and the broader implications for Catholic tradition, Church authority, and global Catholic demographics. There’s also spirited discussion on modern Church leadership, syncretism, coverage in mainstream media, and even a modern miracle report in Italy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Significance of the SSPX Consecrations

[01:38]–[09:50]

• Ben Harnwell introduces the episode as a “special” on the SSPX consecrations, calling it “the most important event in traditional Catholicism… in the last four decades.”
• Frank Walker underscores the gravity: “There’s something fundamental about that old Latin Mass that goes back to Christ and the apostles. And you can’t just invent a completely new thing. That’s not the way the Church works.”
  (Frank Walker, 09:50)
• The panel discusses the symbolism around having Bach's Lutheran music in the liturgy, raising questions about Protestantism and Catholic identity.

2. What is Traditionalism in the Catholic Context?

[03:26]–[14:50]

• Traditional Catholics insist the Church is “unchanging throughout time on all essentials… the same doctrines, dogmas as believed at the time of the Apostles.” (Ben Harnwell)
• The episode contrasts “pre-conciliar” (pre-Vatican II) and “post-conciliar” Church, with the former evangelizing worldwide and the latter characterized as having lost evangelical zeal.

3. Media & Institutional Response

[12:32]–[16:15]

• The New York Times’ coverage is criticized for “cynicism” and “malevolence,” relying on “one of the world's most notorious modernist Catholics” (David Gibson).
  • “On today of all days, they go to David Gibson for this anti Catholic screed…”
    (Ben Harnwell, 12:32)
• Discussion of how both liberals and media try to minimize or misrepresent traditionalists within the Church.

4. Schism, Authority, and TradInc’s Failure

[20:42]–[26:16]

• The Vatican’s reaction (and lack thereof) to the consecrations is parsed, with Frank noting, “Today, like at the New York Times. It’s a lament. They are terrified. They’re terrified of what they did. And the SSPX, they treat Leo like… the more you act like, say you’re Pope, the more we’re going to treat you like pope and expect you to be Catholic.”
• Harnwell criticizes “TradInc” (the traditionalist influencer industry) for failing to support SSPX action: “The tide has gone out. No one really expected the SSPX ...when push comes to shove... we have gotten to see who was swimming...without any trunks on.” (Ben Harnwell, 22:21)
• Only Bishop Schneider and Archbishop Vigano are noted for supporting SSPX.

5. Post-Vatican II Syncretism & Elites’ Betrayal

[30:38]–[46:14]

• Harnwell and Jenny Holland critique the Church’s postconciliar focus on “dialogue” and interfaith gatherings.
• Jenny characterizes the Vatican’s recent meeting with Dharmic religious leaders as a “happy, clappy, melty faith gathering” out of touch with the Church’s roots.
• She likens Vatican and British monarchy elites: “They are not interested in serving the people any longer… Their real audience… is their fellow elites who are all buying into… this globalist cast.”
• Harnwell derides the official language of Cardinal Couvacad as “a random calculator of platitudes and throwing our buzzwords together in grammatical order, saying we’ve created a sentence. It literally means nothing.” (42:30)

6. Religious Miracles in a Modern Age

[48:21]–[50:20]

• Jenny recounts a reported miracle in a small Italian village—statue of Padre Pio “weeping blood,” recorded on CCTV and under scientific investigation.
• She reflects, “If we live in a world where smart, quote unquote educated people can believe men can lactate and have babies, then why can’t God produce miracles? I think God producing miracles seems a lot more likely and less crazy.” (Jenny Holland, 50:10)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Tradition’s Meaning:
  “For Catholics, the tradition really comes from the Latin, which means to hand on. And so… they are passing, as St. Paul said, passing on what they themselves have received in an unbroken chain that goes back to Christ and the apostles themselves.”
  (Ben Harnwell, 17:04)

• Media Critique:
  “The New York Times say, ‘Oh, it’s just a tiny fraction of people who are these traditionalists,’ but they love to inflate. ‘Over a billion Catholics out there.’ Well, I mean, do any of them go to church? Do any of them believe the things that the Church teaches?”
  (Frank Walker, 11:39)

• On Bishops Supporting SSPX:
  “Bishop Schneider… in Kazakhstan, an auxiliary bishop. My God, that guy has courage… And Archbishop Vigano, who has already been excommunicated… Those are the only two… who had the courage to come out and support SSPX.”
  (Ben Harnwell, 23:58)

• On Miracle Skepticism Turning to Openness:
  “All my life I’ve been told that those things were superstitions… And yet, with these crazy upside-down times, I find myself much more open to these possible miracles simply because… why can’t God produce miracles?”
  (Jenny Holland, 50:10)

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Segment Timestamps

• [01:38] – Opening and importance of the Ecône event
• [03:26] – Catholic traditionalism explained
• [09:50] – Frank Walker on the centrality and origins of the Latin Mass
• [12:32] – Critique of New York Times coverage and postconciliar Church stats
• [20:42] – Reactions from Church authorities, schism accusations, TradInc's moral test
• [26:16] – Vatican’s uncertain stance on SSPX, speculation on excommunication
• [30:38] – "Outside the Church, no salvation" dogma and missionary history
• [33:54] – Jenny on interfaith Vatican events and the crisis of Church leadership
• [38:42] – British monarchy and Vatican elites as “globalist castes”
• [42:30] – Mocking Vatican platitudes and discussing religious relativism
• [48:21] – Padre Pio miracle story
• [50:10] – Jenny’s reflection on miracles versus modern belief

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Conclusion

This episode presents a passionate, often polemical discussion of the SSPX consecrations and their implications for the Catholic Church, lambasting institutional elites for perceived betrayals of core Catholic identity. The hosts and guests champion the resilience of tradition in the face of modernizing, globalizing, and relativizing trends, while celebrating acts of spiritual courage within the embattled traditionalist community.

Social Media Plugs:

• Jenny Holland: YouTube - Saving Culture From Itself, Substack, SemperFemina on X/Twitter
• Frank Walker: Canon 212 on Twitter and Rumble

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This summary covers all the central content, omitting commercials and non-content sections for clarity and coherence.

Transcript

[A]

Sam.

[B]

This is the primal scream of a dying regime. Pray for our enemies because we're going medieval on these people. Reasons I got a free shot. All these networks lying about the people, the people have had a belly full of it. I know you don't like hearing that. I know you try to do everything in the world to stop that, but you're not going to stop it. It's going to happen.

[A]

And where do people like that go

[B]

to share the big lie?

[A]

MAGA MEDIA I wish in my soul,

[B]

I wish that any of these people had a conscience.

[C]

Ask yourself, what is my task and what is my purpose? If that answer is to save my country, this country will be saved. War ROOM here's your host, Stephen K. Ban.

[A]

Wednesday 1st of July, Anno Domini 2026. Harnwell here at the helm. Let's bring on Frank Walker and Jenny Holland straightaway. Hello guys. Good evening to you both. Jenny's back after after her skiving. Welcome back on to the War room, Jenny. Hope your skiving went well. Okay, so let's replay the the, the footage from Associated Press that was their life five and a half hour feed today showing I think indicating the the seriousness afforded to the consecrations today that took place in a cone. This is our acone special. Forty years, basically, Frank Walker in the making. We've been talking about this every Wednesday for the last few months. This is probably no, this is without any doubt in my mind, the most important event in traditional Catholicism. Not this year, this decade, probably in the last four decades since the last Episcopal consecrations. Folks, we're going to break this down for you and explain over the course of this show today why what has happened today is so important for traditionalism as a concept, certainly for the Catholic Church. But before I do that, Denver, if you wouldn't mind, would you just play a couple of seconds of that footage once again, because something struck out at me and I thought it was odd. And I will ask my fellow panelists opinion on this whether perhaps they just think I'm autistic. Let's go for it. Denver, if you wouldn't mind just playing a couple of seconds of that once again, Does anything strike either of you about curious about that now? I don't know if that was the music that was being played in the church today or whether Associated Press added added that in as background. It's bark. It is, Pastor Calia. BWV 582 in C minor now the last time I checked, Bach, let's see, bach died in 1750, right? The last Time I checked, he was still dead. And he was a lifelong Lutheran. There were many, many great things about Lutheranism. Right. Burke was probably all of them, but he's Lutheran. Strange choice of music to accompany what is the most of overtly Catholic act, I think, since the. The Counter Reformation. Strange choice of music, that's all. I'm gonna, I'm just gonna flag that up. I know there's some people, trads who say you shouldn't have Bach played at all on the church organ in Catholic liturgical settings because he was a Lutheran. I get where they're coming from. I'm not that autistic as to say, oh no, you can't do that. I don't particularly find that sort of strange, though I would read, I would understand why some trads are uneasy about that. But on today of all days, I just thought it was a strange thing. Unless of course, the suggestion is that this is fundamentally a Protestant act, a protesting act against the papal primacy. I don't know. I'm not going to dwell on it. I just thought it was a strange musical choice. And these things, the symbolism is always important. Okay, Frank Walker, let's break this down today. Why today is so important. Because so far, largely American audience are largely evangelical audience. Just to recap what traditionalism is in the Catholic context, the trad Catholics very jealously guard the idea that the Catholic Church is unchanging throughout time on all the essentials. It teaches the same doctrines, dogmas as were believed at the time of the Apostles. Some of these things have been formally defined by the Church, but from the Catholic Church's understanding of what. Of what papal infallibility is when defining dogma, it's simply asserting that X has always been believed right from the beginning of the Church. There's nothing new. This is what Catholics, traditional Catholics say. There's nothing new in what the Church teaches about itself. It might represent certain truths in new ways according to the times, but on all the elements to do with faith and salvation, the substance is effectively unchanging because it comes from Christ. And then of course, on top of that, you have certain things that have grown up throughout time because the Catholic Church has been a pilgrim church throughout human history. It has absorbed certain practices throughout the medieval period, for example, before that from the Dark Ages that are still extant today. And, and they're not essential to Catholic belief, but they're very dearly held on to by. By. By Catholics and quite properly wouldn't be discarded without good reason. And then the Second Vatican Council, which was the Great rupture of the Catholic Church between 60, 62, 65. All of that changed really the, the official justification, especially in the liturgy, but obviously not only in the liturgy, also in terms of the substance of the faith. The ostensible pretext was we're going to make the church, we're going to eliminate all the differences between ourselves and the Protestants and bring the Protestants on board. I say that was a pretext because I think it's pretty clear that the people who are pushing Second Vatican Council had no intention whatsoever of bringing the Protestants on board. They just wanted to stop the Catholics from believing the Catholic faith and understood like that. I think it puts this very clearly on a spiritual plane what has been going on. And 70 years onwards. And after the Second Vatican Council there is a division between the consiglia Catholics which is 99% really of what people will be familiar with when they perhaps see the Catholic Church in their village or what have you, or go to the Mass on Sundays. And then Frank is probably not even 1%. The trad Catholics, where available, will go to the old Latin Mass, the traditional Latin Mass, the Tridentine Rite Mass, which is obviously a product of the formalized during the, the, the Counter Reformation. But the, the unchanging elements of that, especially the canon of the Mass itself goes, goes back to I think the third century. Right. Unchanged. Yes, onwards. Go on, go on. Frank, if you want to say something

[C]

that's often lied about, they, they love to say, the liberals love to say that this, this Mass that you see here and with the SSPX is just another version of the Mass. It's been going on for a long time. And they like this piece of the New York Times today says, you know, they moving from Greek to Latin. There were a lot of differences over time. Now a lot of people aren't European. There's always differences in discussion. No, there's something fundamental about that old, about that Latin Mass that goes back to Christ and the apostles. And you can't just, you know, this we're talking about thousands and thousands and thousands of years. You can't just invent a completely new thing. That's not the way the Church works. And I think that a lot of the confusion like, like you mentioned here, they think of themselves traditionalists. Even these Catholics will call themselves traditionalists. They're deferential to tradition. But really what they are is they're just Catholic and, and they're just going back to what is Catholic because God doesn't care about what's new or what's old. God's always been there and the church is very old. And so today we live in this world where all of the forces, all the power is constantly throwing new things on us. I mean, we're living in a world that's so completely new and invented. We're living in this invented world. And so we look like if you, if you hang on to some things from the past, you're, you're deferential, for instance, to marriage, for example. They tell you that you're a traditionalist, that you just like old stuff. But that's not what this is about at all. This is just like, this is just about being a Catholic. Being a Catholic is something that goes way, way back. And like, like I think you mentioned last week, Ben, human nature is the same all the time and people have the same problems and, and they have the same solutions. So God is the same, human beings are the same, and the Mass should be the same, what it always has been. And I think that people are responding to that and they love to inflate. Like you're mentioning, oh, just a tiny, and the New York Times say, oh, it's just a tiny fraction of people who are these traditionalists, but they love to inflate. How many people that they call, oh, there's over a billion Catholics out there. Well, I mean, do any of them go to church? Do any of them believe the things that the Church teaches? Because that's another aspect to it. It's not just the Mass, it's do they believe the things that the Church teaches? It's not just about being traditional. It's just about are you going to believe a religion that's new today and completely different than it was yesterday? No, you're going to say, well, I'll believe whatever I think is best. That's not how the Catholic Church works. That's not how God works.

[A]

So many things that to, to go through. Right, first thing, first thing, we'll talk more about this David Gibson article. And that just shows the malevolence of the New York Times, right? On today of all days, they go to David Gibson for this anti Catholic screed from one of the world's most notorious modernist Catholics. I mean, honestly, they could have given it to Santa Gido and it wouldn't have come out any more anti Catholic than that. Firstly, look at the cynicism. Look, we'll try and get the link of this article out so people can read it themselves. But look at the cynicism of what Gibson's arguing there, that the Tridentine church was basically European. Well that's a given fact of course. It was the impetus of the pre conciliar faith that pushed the church out to evangelize to bring the gospel to Latin America in all sorts Columbus and all sorts. So that was, that would. That's what happened. Under the preconcilia faith people fulfilled the. The great commandment of Christ to take his teachings to all nations and baptize them in the name of the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit. It's under the post conciliate church that, that what was set up by the preconcellular church has imploded and now the other religions are coming in. Jenny's got more about that which will hit after the break and I do need to quickly go to a shout out in one moment, but I want to come so. Okay, okay. The, the preconcilia church was European. Fair enough. Now the bulk of believing Catholics are in the southern hemisphere. Fair enough. Right. When I say look at the cynicism of David Gibson though that is most stark that reality of the contemporary Catholic church that is most stark the fact that the church fundamentally right now in terms of numbers and vocations is in the southern hemisphere on the teachings on sexual morality and the. And the family.

[C]

Right.

[A]

That is where the conservatism in the Catholic church numerically is right now. Frank Walker it's in the southern hemisphere and we all remember how under a Bergoglia's hijacking of the church under the outer aspects of synodality tried to impose the change on the church. And Cardinal Casper gave an interview and I talked to Edward Penton just right. He just. And then it was so bad. Casper denied ever saying it. And then Ed Penton produced the tapes, said well your eminence is. You did say it. What did he say? Casper said that, that the African church wasn't basically so important in his view on the synod. So here's Gibson saying no, we need to widen the church's appeal because the pre concilia church was European. But actually these people could not care less about what the southern hemispheric church actually believes. They could not kill us. That's why it's all of a pretext. Frank Walker going to come back with you and finish respond to what you were saying. Got to do a quick ad read to shout out to Birch Gold right now up until folks the 10th of July just I think 10 days left Birch Gold Philip Patrick and his team are pushing out a special commemorative two 205th America 251 ounce silver round. Not a coin, folks. It's around. I hope you know the difference. You want one of those coins rounds, then you've got a set. Text Bannon B a double n on to 989-898 and take advantage of of their free America 250 Silver Round Special limited edition offer with qualifying purchases. Again, it's before July 10th. Text Bannon B A N O N to 989898. I'll give you that number again in the second half of the show. The thing to think about right now is that gold and silver particularly now are at extremely competitive prices. So if you want to get in there what, what, what investors call buying the dip, get in now. Speak to Philip Patrick now and say, look, I realize that that gold especially is it has a competitive price and I'm interested in converting an old 401k into a physical IRA in gold because I want to hedge against inflation. That's what you do if you have the fear of missing out. And just remembering to yourself that 10 years ago the spot price of one ounce of gold was about $1,200 and today it's touching around $4,500 huge increase over the last 10 years. And if you want to get in now in anticipation of similar gains over the next decade, speak to Philip Patrick and his team once again. 989-898. Bannon to 989-898. Frank Walker, let me come back to you and then, and then I'll quickly go over to Jenny and get her reading on this. But what you were just saying right now and that the traditionalists aren't just basically cultish cultists over stuff because it's old really needs we need to just give a shout out to the what traditionalism is in the Catholic sense. And it's not like in the secular sense where tradition is something, oh, let's put a tinsel at Christmas time, put tinsel on the tree because it's traditional, as in like we did it last year. It's been done every year for 100 years. You know, we'll put a mistletoe and kiss under the mistletoe because it's a tradition. That's not what the Catholics understand by tradition. For Catholics, the tradition really comes from the Latin, which means to hand on. And so when Catholics use the term tradition, that the idea is that they are passing, as St. Paul said, passing on what they themselves have received in an unbroken chain that goes back to Christ and the apostles themselves. That's why Catholics or traditional Catholics are so reluctant to change and even less reluctant to embrace novelties. Before I go to Jenny, Frank, I just want to run this past you because this is fundamentally the importance here. And you said this actually on, on previous Wednesdays, but it is the most important point to make today of all days. But not all tradinc won't agree here, right? The Latin Mass is important. It's the heart and soul of the traditionalist movement. But it is not the full story. Right. Because if you're going to the Latin Mass because you like the Latin and you like to see your priest in lace, but on the other hand, you've wholesale abandoned the faith that lies underneath that, then what you are cultivating isn't the Catholic faith. That is really, that is cultish behavior. Right. Very few trads that I know do do that. But there are a few, right? There are a few. The importance is that the traditional Latin Mass nourishes the traditional Catholic faith because that is the faith that was passed on from St Paul Dowage Frank, I'll go to Jenny, but first, if you, if you want to respond to that, because I know you do say that constantly, I just hand over the word quickly to you.

[C]

Yes. And Ben, you mentioned that you didn't think that they would come down too hard on them because of this today. Looking at the yesterday, Leo was condemning them, telling them to turn back and Cardinal Mueller was calling them schismatic. Today, like at the New York Times. It's a lament. It's a lament. They are terrified. They're terrified of what they did. And the sspx, they treat Leo like, well, the more that you, you act like, say you're Pope, the more we're going to treat you like pope and expect you to be Catholic. So even his political ploys, like sending a letter tell him to turn back. They come back with love. We know you can do it, Leo. We love you. We want. They just give him Christian leadership. And they are terrified at the deep state New York Times today, they're like the whole Leo stunts over. It's a crisis. These populists are going to rebel. Now. Everybody is so upset because now there are six traditional bishops at the sspx. And I think you're right. I don't think they're going to come down too hard on them. But it remains to be seen. They're hopeful. David Gibson is hopeful that Leo might come down hard because he's not like a political guy. He's like a Nazi. He can do what he wants. But this is the golden goose. When they lose the Catholics from the Leo Church, then they have nothing. They have no growth. And so I think that everybody is going to try to be very nice. Cardinal Mueller is moving back to the Benedict era. He's turned into this nice guy. When he was attacking everybody yesterday, he's saying tradition was bad. They shouldn't have canceled the Latin Mass. They should be nicer. You know, it's just today is a new day. After the courage that these Catholics showed, you can see it all over the world.

[A]

That's so important. Jen, Jenny, please bear with me on this. I was going to come to you, but look, we really see today how badly Tradinc has failed, right? Too important. Frank, what you're saying, not to respond to this. What have we seen? The Austrian school economists have a saying that when the tide goes out, you get to see who was swimming without any trunks on. For 40 years we've had Tradinc who set themselves up as the arbiter of what is legitimate Catholicism and what is not. They sit there on the, you know, as Berth Golia would have said on the. On the judgment seat of Moses and act as arbiter, right? As the ultimate word in what traditionalism is. You and I are the same heart of this. We cannot have more contempt for these people. The tide has gone out. No one really expected the sspx, though you and I were calling for this basically since we started this show a year ago, that the SSPX needed to provide for its future security and consecrate some bishops. But when they announced it a couple of months ago, it rather took the world by surprise. And Tradinc, right, almost universally has come down against this schismatic act as. As Pope Leo called it yesterday. And what has been even more discouraging, Frank Walker, is that all the. All tradincts, and I'm not going to embarrass them and name them, right, but all of Tradinck's pocket cardinals, right, all of them have come out and said the SSPX shouldn't go through with the consecrations today. As I, by my counting, correct me if I'm wrong, by my counting, there are only two bishops, one bishop, one archbishop, who came out and supported the sspx. Bishop Schneider, right. In Kazakhstan, an auxiliary bishop. My God, that. God, that. That guy has courage, right? That guy has courage to. To do that. Bishop Schneider, who's been on this show with Steve and Archbishop Vigano, right, who has already been excommunicated by Pope Francis. Those are the only two that hierarchs that I can name who, who had the courage to come out and support their suspects. That does not show the moral bankruptcy of Trad Inc. Who for the last 40 years have been grifting a living of pretending to be trads of acting as the arbiter for what is legitimate Catholicism. And when push comes to shove, when the tide goes out, we have gotten to see who was swimming in the sea waters of traditionalism without any trunks on. Right.

[C]

All of them basically desperation. It was desperation. They went to them at the last minute too and they, you know, because they had nothing else they can do. But even today Cardinal Kissy Fernandez who is supposed to be threatening excommunication says well maybe we can do some more dialogue that we haven't, we haven't dialogued enough with them. So you know, I think that this is a great day for the Catholic Church and with six bishops the SSPX is going to continue to grow and hopefully they'll continue to work together with these guys and, and help them to come more this way. Which is what they're terrified about in the deep state. Remember they sick the FBI on the, on the SSPX because they're so awfully afraid of them politically. It's all about politics. They're afraid of these people that do not have this new Vatican to world this openness that they created that they foisted on the Church. They're rejecting what placed on and they're fake Pope. This is what the new Catholic Pope.

[A]

This is what the New York Times gets right in its headline that this is Leo's first crisis. Right? And the first crisis and we'll see how he's going to handle it because correct me if I'm wrong, but since we came on air there hasn't been any note out from, from the Vatican to say that the sspx, the bishops, the, the bishops who consecrated, the bishops who have been consecrated or even the laity who participated whether they have been excommunicated. You're right. I did say previously. I don't think though that they will be. But let's, let's, let's wait and see. I think Leo wants to keep the game going of getting trading.

[C]

Yes,

[A]

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[A]

Welcome back. Well, I think it's called the thrice proclaimed dogma because it's found its way into three separate dogmatic pronouncements over the. Over the 2,000 years of the Church's history. Extra ecclesia nullus. Outside the Church there is no salvation. And that is really crystallized some of Christ's own teachings like no one can come to the Father except through me and what have you to drive the missionary spirit of the church for 500 years from, by the time basically from when man was able to navigate the oceans in boats, sailboats, the, the missionaries went out with the explorers on the base, on the necessary, the necessary need to bring the gospel of our Lord to, to whatever peoples they might find in the corners of the world. As Christ said, go therefore to all nations adigentes. So what we were saying in the first half that after the first half of the show that after the Second Vatican Council that direction, that moment, that momentum has inverted and now other cultures are coming to the West. There is no clearer example of my thesis. I, I don't want to attribute it to Frank Walker as well unless he wants to do that. That the hierarchy of the Catholic Church is in the hands of usurpers that don't hold the Catholic faith, that hate the Catholic faith. Then what took place recently in the Vatican Jenny Holland's got the details here that the Church welcomed representatives of the dharmic religions, that is to say Buddhists, Hindus and what have you hosted by what I like to call the dicastery for the promotion of religious syncretism that is effective effectively what it is. We'll read through some of its the syncretic pronouncements in the declaration the. The presiding cardinal released after this event. It's horrific to see this, but it really does illustrate the absolute difference between the pre concilia church and the post conciliar church. Because the pre concilia Church was interested in evangelization and did evangelization and racked up huge numbers of martyrs in doing so in taking the faith out to the peoples ad gentes. The post Cantilla church is interested in dialogue which isn't which has no end to it. It's just a process but pretty explicitly and obviously does not have as its focus bringing the gospel of Christ to people who don't have it. Jenny, what took place in the Vatican under the patronage of the Vatican a couple of weeks ago and what conclusions do you draw from that in the light of everything we've been discussing on the show today on our a special.

[D]

Yeah. So as you said last week there was a convening of faith leaders from the dharmic religion. So the sub Indian the Indian subcontinent, Hinduism, Buddhism, Sikhism and Jainism. And they came and they sat and had a sort of talking shop with Vatican. The Vatican through the dicastery of I'm blanking on the rest of the name religious interreligious dialogue. Dialogue. Thank you. Interreligious dialogue. So I mean my big picture big picture as not as not a non Catholic and as the resident atheist of the show I would put the big picture here is good strong fences make good neighbors. As a general statement, I find this to be very very accurate and very apt. Does Europe have strong fences at this particular time? No, it does not. So I think the idea of a happy, clappy, melty faith gathering where everyone sits around and shares bread and wine and has great discussions and claps each other on the back, that's a wonderful idea. We when your own church is robust and confident and deeply rooted and deeply connected with the salt of the earth people who make up the church. And none of those things are the case for the Catholic Church today. As you were just going over in fascinating detail with Frank. So the dicastery as you would probably be able to explain better than me, Ben has its sort of an appendage maybe from the Vatican two days and the kind of modernization of the church that is sort of so much of the focus of your ire and I I believe rightly so again not exactly having a dog in this fight. I think that the thing that is that makes the church most vibrant and most interesting today is not the elites hobnobbing and pow wowing with each other in the halls of the Vatican and pretending like the pop Europe isn't facing a multitude of crises, many of which are directly tied to let's call it an abundance of diversity on the continent of Europe instead of facing that reality and nurturing the tradition and the thing that makes the Catholic faith so revered and for centuries, for millennia, it's turning its back on those assault of the earth members and turning instead to kind of a globalist, you know, play acting. Everyone's pretending to be statesman, everyone's pretending to be Nelson Mandela, everyone's pretending that it's all the Nobel Peace Prize. And isn't this great? And aren't we also very civilized where conditions on the ground are becoming less civilized every passing day? I really think it's very interesting that this happened last week because something that I'm not sure has crossed your notice yet, Ben, but something happened last week with your king, King Charles, whose office released a sort of a yearly statement, a kind of administrative account of the sovereign grant. And in the preamble or the introduction to this document, the language describing King Charles's role was changed from defender of faith to something like defender of religion in a multi religion nation. I can get the exact language for you here now in a moment, but in so doing, basically, although this is not an official title change, like it's not going to be put on the pound coins or on the money anytime soon, but it is a bureaucratic. Tell that within the, what do you call it, administration of King Charles. I'm not sure, sorry, I'm an American, as you can see from my shirt, I don't have a king. But the.

[A]

Well, hang on, hang on, hang on. We'll put the, what's that expression that the Supreme Court used this week, the unitary theory of the executive, to one side for one moment as we're talking about Americans not having things. Please go on.

[C]

Well,

[D]

King Charles is now, his job is now to protect the space for faith within the multi faith nation. So that is your King, Ben, claiming that he now protects the space for faith within the multifaith nation. Once again, this is the same exact problem, this is the same exact theory of mind between the elites ruling Britain, including your own king and the Vatican. They are not interested in serving the people any longer. They are not interested in serving in particular the indigenous people or the original believers, the people who built the church and stayed with the church for thousands of years through all sorts of terrible events. The elites are so ahead. They're so, as they say, they've lost the run of themselves, as we would say here in Ireland. They believe that they know better than the people. They believe that they are far, far above the people spiritually and in fact don't even need to deign to lead them any longer because Their real audience, their true audience is not God. And it's certainly not the subjects of the British Crown. It is their fellow elites who are all buying into, if you want to be glib about it, this trend. I mean, I personally think it's deeper than that, but they, they sort of flounce around the world acting like it is some kind of trend in which they're all part of a special cast, not of Christians or Catholics or Church of England, but of rich elites and it's a globalist cast and they share the values that. But they are, they are skin walking on the old traditions and they are wrapping themselves in the mantle and the majesty and the authority of the old traditions, whilst completely abandoning the people who make the traditions, who have made the traditions for thousands of years and who. And also the very belief system that sustained those people. It's an absolute travesty on both counts.

[A]

I learned something that I didn't know that perhaps I should have known from what you were saying, and that is that the, that the palace has announced the, the revision of the defenso fidei title bestowed on. Was it Henry viii? I think it might have been Henry viii, Defender of the Faith by, by Pope Leo X, and to which all of Henry VIII's heirs and successes have include down to Charles.

[D]

Have.

[A]

Have also used that title, Defender of the Faith, which we're now sort of. Which will probably kick off a huge debate, an existential debate in, in the UK that is. That came from the. The Pope bestowed it on the English monarch and the English monarch then, then passed it down to his heirs and successors, and now he's changed it. Okay, but you know what you're saying, the statement that the palace put out, justifying that change is very similar, is it not, to what the Vatican was saying in this meeting with the dharmic religions. Let's have a look at what Cardinal Kuva, Cad, open brackets, crazy name, crazy guy, close brackets said. Because it's, it's a whole load of cliches and platitudes. Look, I read this statement, I went through it with my marker pen and I, I tell you this, right? AI wouldn't have written something. If AI had been charged of writing something, it wouldn't have written something so bad.

[D]

It would have sounded more human.

[A]

It would have said, yeah, less robotic. This is full of some of these things. Like look at, and I quote, right? Looking to Europe, Cardinal Couvacad recalled the continent's cultural and religious heritage and its history of diverse groups living together amid migration, globalization, and demographic change. What does that even mean? It's just like getting a random calculator of platitudes and throwing our buzzwords together in grammatical order, saying we've created a sentence. It literally means nothing. How about this? The cardinal described Europe as a rich melting pot of ethnic groups, languages and religious traditions. Really? Your Emmons, is that what you think Europe is? A heritage he said should be valued in order to build, and I quote, an inclusive, cohesive and harmonious society that respects human dignity and human rights, including Frank Walker, the right to profess and practice one's own religion. This is a fundamental division between the preconcellular Catholic church and the post conciliar expression. Because the pre concilia church was very clear that you have no right to religious, basically to religious error. So you have no right to practice a false religion. If his eminence Cardinal Couvrecad was really pushed by charity, a true charity, I mean the word fraternal is all over this. But if he was really pushed by fraternal charity, he would be bringing the truth to people who are in darkness. Right? The fact that he's not doing and he's indulging them and allowing them to stay in darkness is an indication to me that his, his charity is. Is somewhat fake. And it's all, as I say, it's all. By the way, let me just read this to you because we've got to go on to the next story of Jenny's right. They had this meeting, this the Castry for the promotion of religious syncretism. It was organized at the Pontifical University of St. Thomas Aquinas. Well, that shows you that they've got a sense of humor right under the theme, and I quote, and I quote, so help me, I quote. Buddhists, Christians, Hindus, Jains and Sikhs in Europe colon building fraternity through dialogue and club collaboration. Really? Really. You listed them Vatican, my dear Vatican, in that order, right? Buddhists, Christians, Hindus, Jains and Sikhs. Christianity is just one, one amongst many, right? The relativism here is in your face. It's disgusting. Yes, Christ said, right, no one can come to the Father but through me. And yet here these usurpers, right render Christ is just one holy itinerant prophet in a pantheon of false gods. And we did see, on the subject of which we didn't go through Denver sitting with the finger at the ready to start going through all the photos of Leo and. And Francis of unhappy memory, bowing down to Pachamama, the false idol blessing blocks of ice. This is where their heart is. And yet when it comes to the sspx, they demand obedience.

[D]

Right?

[A]

I would not. I. I would not. I do not, I will not put my obedience in the hands of these Hiling shepherds. Jenny, quick shout out to, to Birch Gold and then we'll come to you for the, for the concluding story. Because we have three minutes left, folks. Get your phones out and text Bannon B A N o N to 989-898. Speak to Philip Patrick and his team. Say you want in. You've got first of July today, you've got nine days to take advantage of their special America 250 limited edition commemorative 1 ounce silver coin on qualifying purchases above $10,000. Philip Patrick and his team waiting for your call. Just tell him you want information, you want in, because you think that gold's gonna rocket ahead and you, you want in. What could you do? What could you do with an IRA in physical gold? Speak to him. No, no, no. No commitment. He's not gonna twist your arm behind your back and force you to buy, but he will talk you through what your options are. Bannon B A double N o N to 989-898. Jenny, we've got two minutes. And the subject that I've been waiting all show or to come over to talk to you about, a little village church in Italy had in its vestibule, if I'm not mistaken, under the watchful 24 hour day CCTV camera, a statue of Saint Pio, Padre Piotr China. There's a blood tear emerged on his face and the priest went back, tried to, bizarrely tried to wipe it off first, then went back, checked the footage and nobody was seen on that footage. Going on and applying this. The folks at home, even if they're not Catholic, might be interested in this story. Can you just give the bare essentials as we leap towards the closing seconds of the show?

[D]

So it's a small town near Naples called Casalba, I believe. And yeah, exactly as you said, the statue, which is made of fiberglass, was seen to have produced a single sort of track of a tear. And the priest described it as so precise in its sort of path along the face of Padre Pio that it couldn't, it could not have even been put there by Michelangelo. That's how, that's how specific and so tidy it was. And they have sent the. Yeah, in addition to checking the CCTV footage which showed no one interfering with the statue and putting the. Putting material on it, they've sent the. What they think might be blood off to a lab to get tested. And so, you know, as I've seen with other similar stories, that the priest is not making a big sort of sort of carnival esque show about this. In fact, it seems to be treating it with some kind of caution and not kind of running with a fake miracle kind of angle. And I mean, that's kind of how I approach all of these, when you send them my way is sort of skeptical, but curious because I still live in the material modern reality world where all my life I've been told that those things were superstitions from the past and from mountain people and unsophisticated people who didn't know how to read and didn't know the science, TM peace be upon it and all that kind of stuff. And yet I find that with these crazy upside down times we live in now, I find myself much more open to these possible miracles simply because, well, if we live in a world where smart, quote unquote educated people can believe men can lactate and have babies, then why can't God produce miracles? I think God producing miracles seems a lot more likely and less crazy. We'll see.

[A]

Jenny. Jenny. 10 seconds, social media. Where do people go? Sorry to cut into you. We've got a heart out here. Where do people go on social media?

[D]

Best place is YouTube at saving culture from itself and save. And on substack, jennyeholland, substack.com and

[A]

semper femina on X Frank Walker. 10 seconds, social media.

[C]

Canon 212 and it's all spelled out on Twitter. And at Rumble and Gloria tv you can see the Daily Update, which is in the right hand column at Canon

[A]

212, folks as never before. Check out Canon 212 this week for the fallout on the SSPX consecrations. That's all, folks. Back next Wednesday thanks to Will at Real America's Voice.