WarRoom Battleground EP 783: Manufacturing Renaissance; Next Generation Of Digital Manufacturing

Summary

WarRoom Battleground EP 783: Manufacturing Renaissance; Next Generation Of Digital Manufacturing

Release Date: June 5, 2025
Host: Stephen K. Bannon
Guests: Kevin Zinger (Founder & Chairman of Divergent), JD Vance (Entrepreneur and Former Marine Corps Rifleman)

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Introduction

In Episode 783 of WarRoom Battleground, host Stephen K. Bannon welcomes Kevin Zinger, the visionary founder and chairman of Divergent, and JD Vance, a seasoned entrepreneur with a rich background in both athletics and military service. The episode delves deep into the transformative potential of digital manufacturing technologies and their critical role in reinstating America's manufacturing prowess.

Setting the Stage: The Manufacturing Crisis

The conversation begins with Bannon expressing frustration over mainstream media narratives and highlighting the urgent need to revolutionize American manufacturing. He introduces Kevin Zinger, praising his extensive experience and innovative approach to modern manufacturing challenges.

Revolutionizing Manufacturing Through Digital Technologies

JD Vance elaborates on Divergent's groundbreaking approach to manufacturing:

"This is an extended range attack missile, otherwise known as a cruise missile. [...] Ten weeks later we had, using AI, generated the most advanced optimized design possible in an automated way, 3D printed it while reducing the number of parts you normally have, a couple hundred to less than a half dozen..."
[03:05]

Key Points:

• AI-Driven Design: Leveraging artificial intelligence to simulate and optimize designs rapidly.
• 3D Printing Efficiency: Transitioning from traditional manufacturing, which might require hundreds of parts, to fewer, more integrated components through 3D printing.
• Speed and Cost Reduction: Divergent's methods drastically cut down both the time and financial resources typically needed for product development.

JD Vance further explains how their system bypasses the protracted and expensive traditional Pentagon procurement processes:

"We could immediately go into full production when necessary."
[04:04]

Challenging China's Manufacturing Dominance

A significant portion of the discussion addresses the pressing concern of China's overwhelming industrial capacity:

"If you look at global manufacturing market share in 2000, the US had over 25%. China had about 7%. Today... projected global manufacturing market share for China over 40% versus 11%."
[06:54]

Insights:

• Declining U.S. Share: The U.S. manufacturing share has plummeted from over 25% in 2000 to an anticipated 11% by 2028 without decisive action.
• Aggressive Growth of China: China's market share is projected to surge beyond 40%, solidifying its position as a manufacturing hegemon.

Bannon and Vance argue that traditional methods, such as tariffs and re-establishing old manufacturing plants, are insufficient to counter this trend. Instead, adopting advanced digital manufacturing techniques offers a "leapfrog" strategy:

"We don’t need to bring back old style manufacturing, we need a leapfrog China strategy."
[08:05]

Divergent's Triple-A Approach: Design, Print, Assemble

JD Vance outlines Divergent's comprehensive manufacturing system, highlighting three core components:

1. Design Engineering:

   • Utilizes AI to simulate and perfect designs in a virtual environment.
   • Achieves optimal structures by minimizing material and energy use through algorithmic optimization.

2. 3D Printing:

   • Employs advanced 3D printers capable of producing complex structures with minimal parts.
   • Uses materials like aluminum alloy, titanium, and specialized steels to fabricate durable components.

3. Automated Assembly:

   • Features a universal assembler that can seamlessly integrate printed parts into final products.
   • Ensures rapid assembly times, often completing complex structures in minutes.

"Everything is getting calculated until it said everything worked through the full simulation, and it used the minimum amount of energy and material."
[13:03]

Defense Implications: Rapid Production of Military Hardware

The discussion pivots to the strategic advantages of Divergent's technology in the defense sector:

"Traditionally manufactured for something like say an anti-ship cruise missile, you might be able to build 4 or 500 a year. One of our printers can print 400 of those a year. 10 of those could do 4,000."
[42:03]

Key Takeaways:

• Scalability: Divergent's printers can exponentially increase production rates, transforming defense capability.
• Cost Efficiency: Unit costs of producing military hardware are significantly reduced, enabling larger quantities without proportionate financial burdens.
• Strategic Deterrence: Rapid production serves as a robust deterrent by quickly deploying extensive defensive measures against potential threats.

Overcoming Bureaucratic Hurdles

Despite the promising technology, JD Vance acknowledges the challenges posed by entrenched bureaucratic systems:

"The short answer is yes. [...] They are in a position where they're in a system and they're told this is the manual that tells you how to validate and do airworthiness for a process that's 75 years old."
[40:07]

Solutions Proposed:

• Policy Support: Strong backing from high-level officials, including the White House and Pentagon, is essential.
• Urgency in Implementation: Emphasizing the immediate need to adopt advanced manufacturing to preclude strategic disadvantages by 2027.

Catalyzing a Manufacturing Renaissance

Kevin Zinger discusses the broader economic and industrial implications:

"Imagine that this network of factories is sharing data and upgrading itself. And so you have permanent manufacturing footprints in those communities that just grow and learn."
[38:51]

Highlights:

• Localized Manufacturing: Establishing factories across various regions to reduce logistics and transportation times.
• Economic Revitalization: Creating sustainable jobs and manufacturing hubs that adapt and scale with technological advancements.
• Versatility: The system's design-agnostic nature allows it to produce a wide array of products, from automotive parts to advanced defense systems.

Conclusion: A Call to Action

Stephen K. Bannon wraps up the episode by emphasizing the critical need for immediate action to adopt Divergent's manufacturing solutions. He underscores the potential for these technologies to not only restore but also propel America's manufacturing capabilities to unparalleled heights.

"We don’t have an hour to waste."
[46:37]

Final Remarks:

• Transformational Impact: Divergent's technology represents a pivotal shift in manufacturing, combining AI, 3D printing, and automated assembly to create a resilient and advanced industrial base.
• National Urgency: Addressing the manufacturing deficit is not just an economic imperative but a strategic necessity to safeguard national security against rising global threats.

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Notable Quotes:

• JD Vance: "Absolute perfection. Pareto optimized perfection."
  [18:43]

• Stephen K. Bannon: "We don't have an hour to waste."
  [46:37]

• JD Vance: "There is absolutely [...] no reason why that shouldn't be done."
  [43:50]

Further Information

For those interested in exploring Divergent's innovative manufacturing solutions, visit their official website. Stay tuned for upcoming live factory floor tours and additional insights into the future of American manufacturing.

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This summary captures the essence of Episode 783, focusing on the transformative technologies discussed, their applications in defense and commercial sectors, and the urgent call to action to adopt these innovations for national and economic revitalization.

Transcript

[Stephen K. Bannon]

This is the primal scream of a dying regime. Pray for our enemies because we're going.

[Kevin Zinger]

Medieval on these people.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

I got a free shot at all these networks lying about the people. The people have had a belly full of it.

[Kevin Zinger]

I know you don't like hearing that. I know you try to do everything.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

In the world to stop that, but.

[Kevin Zinger]

You'Re not going to stop it. It's going to happen.

[JD Vance]

And where do people like that go to share the big lie? MAGA Media I wish in my soul.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

I w that any of these people had a conscience.

[Kevin Zinger]

Ask yourself, what is my task and.

[JD Vance]

What is my purpose?

[Stephen K. Bannon]

If that answer is to save my country, this country will be saved. War ROOM here's your host, Stephen K. Ban. Okay, welcome. Wednesday. Excuse me. Thursday 5 June Euro 2025 we got a special edition of the 6 o' clock hour because of kind of a evolving emergency. As everybody knows, we had Joe Allen down at the Eric Schmidt conference for the first couple of days of the week. Monday, Tuesday, doing all the updates on artificial intelligence and military technology. Want to introduce a old and dear friend of mine, Kevin Zinger who's now chairman, I guess founder, chairman, CEO of Divergent. Is that. Is that Divergent technology Diversion technology. And by the only Zinger is has the thousand yard stare. I knew him when he was a young man coming out of Yale and then law school. Was Yale or did you go to Harvard Law School? You guys are 100% just kind of a. JD Vance.

[JD Vance]

Exactly. Just plus entrepreneur plus the.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

But you played for you. What did the football coach at Yale say? You're a much bigger guy. When we recruited you at Goldman, right. You were 30 pounds bigger.

[JD Vance]

I was probably 20 pounds bigger and I played probably 30 pounds heavier. I played for a wonderful coach, Carm Koza. The most famous famous is in the College Football hall of fame. ESPN said he's a top 100 college coach. And I don't know if it's correct but it was his point of view. He said I was the best player ever to have played for him in 33 years and the toughest player that ever played for him in 33 years.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Definitely the toughest. Yes, definitely the toughest.

[JD Vance]

Thanks. Why?

[Stephen K. Bannon]

And I want to step back and make sure people understand this. We've got actually in the war room for the first time and we're trying to cut a deal so we can keep it here. This is actually a cruise missile. Correct. We don't have a warhead or we can't claim to have a warhead or the Capitol police will come on, roll us up. What, what is sitting here next to you in the war room right now? This, because this is having been on a Navy destroyer, this is, it feels, looks in ways like a, like a cruise missile.

[JD Vance]

You're correct, Steve. So this is an extended range attack missile, otherwise known as a cruise missile. And it's one that didn't take a couple years to develop. It's one where we were brought the requirements by a prime and that was the very start of engineering. Ten weeks later we had, using AI, generated the most advanced optimized design possible in an automated way, 3D, printed it while reducing the number of parts you normally have, a couple hundred to less than a half dozen, and then automatically printed it and assembled it and test fluid that all took place in a tiny fraction of the time with a tiny fraction of the money it ordinarily takes, and we could immediately go into full production when necessary.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Traditionally, if you did this in the Pentagon, you got those requirements. This is a multi year process and cost hundreds of millions of dollars just to get to the position to get signed off for full production. Is that, is that what I'm comparing it to?

[JD Vance]

That's correct. But what we're doing with divergent technologies would basically be taking the United States from the typewriter era of manufacturing or maybe the IBM typewriter that added two lines of memory by adding a little more robotics to the factory to full on in one step. Mac desktop publishing. This is only in America, made in America, fully digital AI enabled automated engineering and manufacturing.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Because the concept I'm going to get into what 3D printing is, what all this is, the AI because it can get a little confusing for folks. Essentially what the key to this is is that looking at President Trump's tariff strategy and particularly what we call reassuring and bringing these advanced manufacturing jobs or manufacturing jobs back. The Peter Navarro theory. President Trump is going down. You're saying, hey, I understand that, I get that. But in requiring these plants to come back, even with the investment they're going to make, you're looking at a decade before things can get back, the ecosystem around it can be built and you actually go into full production. You're saying you have a system that's a plug and play that you can bring manufacturing back here at the levels we're talking about for production in a matter of months. Is that essentially what, what the, what the alternative, what these two alternatives are exactly.

[JD Vance]

We don't, we don't have that decade right now. The Chinese, because of what's happened over the last 20 years plus of offshoring have way greater industrial capacity than we do. I mean, the Chinese have more industrial capacity than the US and all of its allies combined.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Give me that again. What do you, what did you say?

[JD Vance]

If you look at global manufacturing market share in 2000, the US had over 25%. China had about 7% when they came in.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

When they had finished coming into the World Trade Organization and most favored nation, we were over 20 and they were at 7.

[JD Vance]

We were over 25 when they were at 7. Today, entering into the current administration that had fallen from 25 plus to under 15. With the trend showing by 2028, absent what this administration does, it would fall down to about 11%.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Wow.

[JD Vance]

The Chinese. So think of that 11% projected without the administration that we have taking action against the Chinese, which had 7% in 2000. At the end of 2028, projected global manufacturing market share for China over 40%. So over 40% versus 11%.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

So you're saying even with President Trump's program, we don't have that decade of everything having to come back in a traditional way, that that decade, a lost decade, will still give the ability, even if the tariff system works and President Trump's redoing the commercial relationships, just the physicality of bringing that back is actually looking at it almost too in the rearview mirror. And we would be destroyed by China as a manufacturing hegemon by that time because that would still be a lost decade. And this combined artificial intelligence, 3D printing others is a solution that you can plug and play today and actually within a year start to really bring things back.

[JD Vance]

I would say we can start replicating factories almost immediately. You know, there's a plan that I'll share in a second, but first I want to address the question you had, which is bringing back factories as they exist today overseas in China with current manufacturing isn't going to allow us to dominate in manufacturing again. Our strength is technology innovation. We don't need a bring back old style manufacturing, we need a leapfrog China strategy. And so what we're really doing is, you know, if you look at when Sputnik went up, you had Kennedy come into the administration. Werner von Braun, who was running NASA space at that time, came in. Kennedy's like, how do we catch the Soviets in Sputnik orbit? And he's like, you don't you go.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

For the moonshot, you gossane in Sputnik, you're in Earth orbit. They already dominate that. That's old. You've got to leapfrog them and do something they can't do.

[JD Vance]

Exactly. We can't be chasing China in what they're already dominating, taking 10 years to do it. We only have a couple of years in reality, like 2027 is what, as you know, people are talking about. This is a total leapfrog. This is not anymore R and D. We're actually shipping. This is a dual use technology. So we not only use it for defense, but we use it for automotive. We're shipping to companies like Aston Martin the most important safety structures of vehicles and they're out on the road in passenger cars. Nobody thought that would happen for 20 years. So the idea is take commercially available, but the most advanced existing on the planet, which is here technology and start to replicate it as fast as possible and put China technologically way in the rearview mirror.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Okay, hang on for a second. I want to go to. Because I'm sitting here with folks you should know. This looks, feels ways like a cruise missile, although you don't have the guts of it. I want to go back to the Pentagon or someone calls you with a set of specifics. How do you go from that phone call or getting that information to actually having a real cruise missile? Unless I have to go through lots of R and D, lots of engineering specs, lots of drawings, testing all of it, and then a big manufacturing facility that can make a prototype and then convince people that I can go full production. Just walk me through the big component pieces, the AI part of this, the, the printing part of this. And what is printing? I mean, how can this actually be printed? How do you manufacture it afterwards? Just walk people through the whole value chain.

[JD Vance]

Okay, so there are three components to a total system. One component is the design engineering part of it. One is taking that design and printing it, and one is taking what gets printed and assembling it. Normally on the engineering side, you're taking months, years with because you have teams.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Of engineers, you're doing calculations, you're having staff meetings, you're going through your differential calculus. This is wrong. This is not quite right. Boom, boom, boom. And that's a team engineering process.

[JD Vance]

Yes. Imagine and there are different teams. There's a team that's going to work on thermal. There's a team that's going to work on the mechanical load characteristics, its stiffness, durability, aerodynamics. Imagine that those are actually algorithmic services, meaning there is a computational simulation of flight, for example. So just like we see simulations of different things in the, in the video digital world, right. We've seen the revolution from analog content to digital content. Imagine that, that engineering is being done in a virtual world. That flight, say this, you know, if you look, this gets attached, say, to the wing of a fighter jet. Obviously there are different loads where the fighter jet is flying. There are different loads when it gets released. All of that is being simulated, or a car on the road is being.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Simulated through artificial intelligence. And the computers constantly simulate and much, much more, much faster than humans can actually work it and have meetings and do their own calculations.

[JD Vance]

Yeah. So imagine you were playing a video game with race cars on the track.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Except, do we have his audio? Fine. I just want to make sure, because. Okay, keep going.

[JD Vance]

Imagine you have a video of, like, cars racing or a rocket going through there, except that video is actually doing, you know, the microsecond calculations of what's physically happening to the.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

And this is what artificial intelligence we talk about. This is what it's giving us. This is one of the great advantages of artificial intelligence. Ability to do these on algorithmic age, to do massive types of computation rapidly and in conjunction.

[JD Vance]

Yes. And so what it's doing then is imagine as it's calculating these loads across this entire structure, it's adding and subtracting material in the different parts that are being subjected to different stresses.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

It's playing around with it.

[JD Vance]

Yeah. Until it. It's perfect. So it's not like, hey, make something light after you've built it and then see if it works. This is. Everything is getting calculated until it said everything worked through the full simulation, and it used the minimum amount of energy and material. And therefore, it's actually a perfect design for your requirements. And that doesn't take place in 15 months. It takes place in 15 hours. And it doesn't take place with lots and lots of teams and iteration. It's actually first time perfect.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Then the second stage says three phases. Then I go to. When you say print, people think of the industrial process, that you line this out, you've got, you know, tool and dies. You do all that on a more sophisticated level. When you say, print out a 3D printer.

[JD Vance]

Right.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

What is a 3D printer? Because this sounds totally Buck Rogers.

[JD Vance]

Sure. And I'll just take a step back and say nothing that we're doing today is commercially available in a counterpart to what we're doing. This was literally, this is your system. This is a total system development. All of the software hardware in house.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Because you had had 20 years from this fraternity of kind of Goldman Sachs guys that know everybody. The reason I've got Zinger in here is that people, the brightest people, some of the brightest people I know were part of that fraternity, M and A. And everybody's been telling me for the last two years, said, you've got to get to Zinger's factory. He's revolutionizing manufacturing. Because you've spent a couple of decades in working in different aspects of this area and coming up with the big idea of how to pull it all together. So you've got 20 some years of actually doing this and now to have a total system approach. Because from the vice president's office to Capitol Hill, when you go make these presentations, people are telling me, hey, this is the way that we not just catch the Chinese Communist Party, but we can leapfrog the Chinese Communist Party. But this comes from literally decades of experience of you to pull the entire system together.

[JD Vance]

Correct? Exactly. Spot on. So this is, as I said, going from the typewriter to Mac desktop publishing. And revolutions occur not when you take a single technology, even one as powerful as AI, but it's when you take multiple technologies, say AI plus robotics plus 3D printing plus materials science plus machine vision, and you combine them all together in a system. That's when you make a revolution. And so previous to this, with another Goldman partner, John, I had an AI company. And so as you're looking, you're going, yes, we finally have enough computational power that we can fully simulate not only in the digital world of digital content, but in the actual physical world of atoms. We can now do those simulation.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

This is just not digital. This is where you actually go from that to actual physicality.

[JD Vance]

Right? And so this is really the literally, in planetary history, the first full physical digital system for generating a perfect structure with fidelity, printing it, and then assembling it. So let me move to the printing part of it. So when you look at these structures, like this missile system, for example, if you ordinarily were manufacturing it, it would have over 200 parts. The reason is that you would have a separate fuel tank and baffles and bracketry. AI is doing things in the same way that nature designs a human body or flora or fauna, right? Those are competing over eons for material and energy. This is saying, what's the minimum amount of material energy that I can have this thing remain intact and competitive, right? Have it win right in the material energy world. And that means that it integrates the fuel tank into the skin of this. It integrates in the fuel lines. And what that means is you're reducing the number of parts. And by the way, most of Those parts were outsourced now to manufacturers that only exist in China. You get rid of that part of the supply chain, you make the supply chain much more efficient, you make the final assembly much more efficient, but you radically reduce the number of parts to simplify that supply chain. Then the question is like for the first time, instead of for example, Steve taking the same gauge, the same thickness, say of sheet steel and simply stamping, right? So everything's the same. This is adding, subtracting, so the material is varying everywhere just to meet those.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

An absolute perfection.

[JD Vance]

Absolute perfection. Pareto optimized perfection. And that means then you have to find a way not to pour metal into a mold. Because that mold is not in three dimension structure, doesn't have internal structure or stamping something. It means you have to be able to build in all of those different internal, external dimensions, thicknesses. And so something like this. Imagine there's a fuel tank inside of an outer skin with different conduits. The way that you do that is you take that structure and imagine that the machine digitally in the software slices it into hair width slices, 100 micron slices. And then digitally it sends those slices to a machine. And I'll super simplify. Imagine the machine is a big box. And at the bottom of that box there is laid down, coated a hundred micron layer. Very quickly of it can be an aluminum alloy, it can be a titanium, it can be a margin steel for a munition, it can be a Haynes230 for a hypersonic. It lays down that material and then like scanning the back of a television screen with a picture for that hundred micron layer, it scans the picture of what that looks like onto that metal. But when it scans that, and you're using 12, two and a half kilowatt lasers, it's creating actual solid metal out of that metal powder. Then it's adding the next layer again, scanning, adding the next layer. And because it's melting in between the layers, you end up with a solid object. So imagine that this was cut into thousands of slices. And inside that box you had coding, scanning, coding, scanning, coding, scanning. And then all of a sudden, and there's videos of us doing this on the web.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

We've got B roll up now.

[JD Vance]

You'll see that. And it can. And what happens there is of those.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Coats and things, when does the final one, all those sheets start to come together to have, because this is the output.

[JD Vance]

What happens is say a missile like this would be in 1, 2, 3, 4 sections. Those four sections would all be located within that box, they'd be all fit together optimally. So you pack as many different pieces as possible in and as you're scanning each layer might be scanning all four of these different pieces in different sections of that build plate. And so what comes out and say this is 30 kilograms of aluminum and you're, I'm using round numbers and you're printing at three kilograms an hour per machine. You run 10 machines in one hour, you've got this. Then the next thing you have to be able to have a structure that has all of these unique geometries, all of these unique functional integrations of things and write materials. You've got to do that with fidelity. You do that through the machines that we've created over decades. First we worked with another company and now we're doing it all on our own internally. Then the question is, okay, how do you assemble that? Right? So it's design, print and assemble. And I'll take one step back by saying my 31 year old son who's now running the day to day operations of the company. Lucas Zinger, soccer player, Division 1 soccer player in college, electrical engineer, also an inventor. He was the lead inventor on the assembly system. I was the lead overall inventor. I have over in this company, just this company, I have over 220 filed patents that are a wide range of patents. The company itself has over 750 filed patents. But on the assembly side you can say I can now generate with compute power and AI the perfect structure. I can print the different perfectly optimized LEGO blocks of anything in this printer. Now how do I put them together? And one of the big problems with factories and I grew up working class, youngest of five as you said, played football. That got me.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

You're the only one that went to college? Yes, working class out of the Cleveland was the Cleveland area.

[JD Vance]

Yeah, I was in Parma, Ohio. This was kind of the working class Eastern European work in the steel mill section of Cleveland. I worked summer labor at Jones and Laughlin steel mill. I'd say a name from the past in college. Yeah, a name from the past. I mean in college I rough necked and worked derricks out of Morgan City, Louisiana to make money in the summer during, during college. And so the problem is factories are built even today, whether it's Toyota or Tesla for one or two different models because the factory itself has the fixturing, has what it takes to align different things and say weld them together. We revolutionized things by saying don't build assembly into the factory and make the factory design specific. Make it design agnostic by putting the assembly features, printing the assembly features into each structure. So imagine you've got the perfectly optimized LEGO block in digital form. You send it to a machine, that machine then prints those with fidelity, creates those with the right material. Then you have the same assembly cube that's basically a universal assembler. So what we build for Aston Martin for the Aston Martin Vantage like this is fully commercialized. There are Aston Martin Vantages out there driving with divergent Southern California designed, manufactured and shipped to England frames, or whether it's a Lockheed Martin cruise missile system system, we're generating those, those structures. You know, the same printer is printing and then the same assembly cell picks up those LEGO blocks on a little mobile robot, lifts them up, uses a patented system we have, which is a machine vision system, to align these pieces together. And imagine the LEGO blocks just come together, boom, boom, boom. So this takes a couple of minutes to assemble. A couple of minutes to assemble, yes. And by the way, this can immediately shift from assembling for Aston Martin or Mercedes or Bugatti or McLaren, all of whom are customers, to assembling for Northrop or General Atomics or Andrew or anybody out there, right? This is design agnostic, meaning you know how Amazon Web Services can process anybody's data. This is a system where these tools will anything that's generated on these tools.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

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[Kevin Zinger]

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[Stephen K. Bannon]

Here's your host, Stephen K. Ban. Okay, welcome back, Kevin, You've. You stuck the landing. So in the first part, we went all the way through from theory to actual get the end of a product. And that product could be a commercial product for an automotive company, high end, medium end. It could be a cruise missile, advanced weapon system or anything in between. I want to walk now because so many smart people, people have been your friends and colleagues for years that have said, you got to see what Zinger's doing. He's revolutionizing manufacturing. We understand the war rooms at the edge, the cutting edge of Hayne reindustrializing America. Also people in this city, whether it's over the Defense Department, whether it's on Capitol Hill, in the White House, in the West Wing, people are saying this may be our solution to, as you said, not play at the Sputnik level, but get to the moon level like we did back in the 60s. Walk us through. First off, is the concern, is one of the concerns you're going to wipe out all the manufacturing jobs here, or is this product that we don't have right now that we need to have built in this country?

[JD Vance]

I think it's a fundamental fallacy to look at some technology and say, oh, is this going to bring back the jobs that we had in the same kind of factories from 1950? Obviously, people do not go back in time. They advance. If you look at Amazon Web Services, for example, what happened back in the 1990s, if you and I wanted to start a software company, we literally had to set up our own server factory, right? Huge capital barrier, huge time barrier. Then you have Amazon Web Services. All of a sudden you didn't have tens of developers of products. You literally had tens of thousands of developers in an ecosystem provided by the infrastructure of a company that said, here's the cloud, here are the tools. Imagine that happens in the United States and these factories, not one factory in Torrance, but hundreds of factories across our nation, across our allies, countries are all in a network of where people locally can develop almost anything they want. So companies, from large companies to small startup companies, all of a sudden they have the economics of an Apple. But unlike Apple, they're not using Foxconn. They're using a much more advanced digital version of that, localized nationally across the United States. That's how we should think. That's how our president, who's a disruptor, does think. That's why I'm thankful to be on this show, because I think it gives us the opportunity to say, look at this, you've got a dead serious, fully commercialized solution at that point where in America, America owns this, all we need is the will and the planning to scale it, and we can make this happen in a transformational way.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

When you say your design agnostic, too, for the assembly, you're also saying, I'm not chained to have to go to refurbish older manufacturing facilities, et cetera. Because your facility in Torrance, correct me if I'm wrong, because Torrance had a lot of light manufacturing. You actually went into an old facility, FedEx warehouse, a deposit, distribution center. You took that over, right? That is your manufacturing facility today, your beta site. Test.

[JD Vance]

Yes. So imagine, and I was talking about the printing of the six parts of this system and then their assembly in a cell and the printing taking about an hour and the assembly taking a few minutes. Imagine you have one cell and tens of printers all doing different things. Each of those printers is design agnostic. Meaning, say I have, across that nationwide network I was talking about, we'll just make up a number, 10,000 different things that I'm doing. A printer literally could have data sent to it from any one of those 10,000 things and print it in one hour and have some other thing sent to it the next hour and print that. And any of them can then send it to the assembly cell and have it assembled. So it is like Mac desktop publishing. Think of Mac desktop publishing plus AI. AI generates a comic book or it generates a novel, it doesn't matter. Format sends that to a machine, and the machine simply prints out what that is. That machine doesn't change, it doesn't reconfigure. That's what we're doing with printing and with assembly that allows. And this is a core part of the vision. Each factory, each machine is for multiple industries, multiple companies, multiple products.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Give me an example of that.

[JD Vance]

Automotive across any number of different types of vehicles. Unmanned air, land, sea and space vehicles. Bell crank for the Tail rudder of the C130 as a maintenance part, you know, an intercooler we just printed for Indo Pacom for an amphibious vehicle. Another part that we just did for the US Army. Thousands of different sustainment parts. Everything from existing missile systems that we use to all of the newest lower cost need for adaptation unmanned airland, sea and space vehicles. Each machine can print many, most or all of the different parts of those and then that assembler assemble them in a designed agnostic way, meaning shifting capacity in whatever way.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

And you can also, since you can do these in any size you want, you could put it to, you can cut logistics time and transportation time actually building the fact this your factory close to. If there's other like near the, near the automotive industry or near the aerospace industry or near whatever, if the some of that, let's say down in Alabama where they've got some of the arms manufacturers, you can put a factory right there that can then feed it right into the bigger process.

[JD Vance]

Yes. So that you know, we're, we're working with every single major prime, plus many of the new primes and smaller defense contractors. Prime defense contractors. And we're in discussions with many of them about our locating and owning and operating for them facilities.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Is the capital investment in these plants so high? Is that prohibitive or is it that lower and makes it more attractive? I'm trying to think of every negative, we have every negative argument here.

[JD Vance]

We have about a six month capital payback per factory.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

That's it.

[JD Vance]

That's it. Less than six months. And by the way, we build, we build the machines of our factory, our printers and assembly systems in our factory. So this is a localized factory that replicates itself and that versions itself. So whereas like you were having communities gutted in places like Ohio because a factory that could only do a couple of products became obsolete, this imagine is this network of factories is sharing data and upgrading itself. And so you have permanent manufacturing footprints in those communities that just grow and learn. That's why America can capture the future.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Now one of the things we've been talking about is this huge fight that's going on with, with the deficits and the debt and the budget and the war room is very much into this. And we've argued for a while, you got to cut the defense budget, you can't get to a trillion dollars, you got to cut $100 billion. One of the things, correct me if I'm wrong, that you've run up against is kind of that mid level senior people see the vision and see why this is needed so rapidly because we got to leapfrog the Chinese Communist Party. But just the way the system works. Right? And I'm no defender of Elon, but he got a little bit of this in Doge when he was going around. We do have a system in place in the imperial capital that just the way things roll, and it's got its own ways it rolls, is that what's holding this back from us rolling this thing out and getting people in back of it? Is that just to get the approval, at least on the side of the defense industry, where you could be making a lot of different products, everything from vehicles, not just cruise missiles, but your actual jets, you know, tanks, Humvees, all of it. Is that. Is it the mid level that you're stuck at?

[JD Vance]

The short answer is yes. What I would say is you have people you know and you served. I served in the Marine Corps Reserves as an infantry rifleman. You know, these are people of goodwill. Yes, but they are in a position where they're in a system and they're told this is the manual that tells you how to validate and do airworthiness for a process that's 75 years old, forecasting. And then they're being asked to all of a sudden look at something that is 20 years more advanced than any other place on the planet.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

They can do it in 15 hours. They're not 15 hours people.

[JD Vance]

Then they're saying, yes, we want to do this, but how do we understand it? Who gives us the top cover? And part of why I'm in Washington is that at the command level, we've got super strong support. At the White House level, up through the vp, we've got strong support. At the Pentagon level, we've got strong support. In Congress, people like Chairman Cole, Chairman Calvert are giving us very strong support that needs to, though with a real sense of urgency, look and say we can transform things. We've proven that this technology works. And it's already in an adjacent area fully commercialized. It is absolutely urgent. We now need to apply it and give these people, you know, of good intent and goodwill in that frozen middle, the capability and the tools. Not in the normal cycle of years and years and years, but something that says China 2027 is real. Like, we don't have the next hour.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

To waste when you say 27, because.

[Kevin Zinger]

We'Re going to get to the commercial.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Side in the time we get remaining. But back to the defense side, it is quite evident that particularly with the fall of, as we talked about, on the show today, the fall or yesterday, the fall of Korea, Hexa says, hey, a attack may be imminent in Taiwan that deals with the South China Sea and the ability to us to defend something. It's only 90 miles off the coast and the seventh fleet may not be up to it. You're saying if their timeline is 2027, this right now of all the alternatives out there is the only alternative that can get us to a place that we could actually defend ourselves from an attack by the Chinese Communist Party, the People's Liberation Navy.

[JD Vance]

You know, respectfully, and most respectfully because I, you know, I was an 0311 rifleman, I was a lance corporal carry carrying an M16 at that time. But you know, I obviously know a bit, what I would say is you look at systems like this, traditionally manufactured for something like say an anti ship cruise missile, you might be able to build 4 or 500 a year. One of our printers can print 400 of those a year. 10 of those could do 4,000. Right. 100 of those, which you could easily build could do 40,000. That's a wall of steel that between now and 2027 could be built. And that's real deterrence. And there is absolutely respectfully no reason why that shouldn't be done.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Not just a wall of steel, but correct me if I'm wrong, the unit costs would be a tenth of much lower, Much lower half.

[JD Vance]

Much lower.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Much lower.

[JD Vance]

Much lower. I mean, you're talking about systems that are in the hundreds of thousands rather than in the many millions. Yes.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

In a time that you shrink down from concept to the battlefield of months instead of years or decades.

[JD Vance]

And let me add two additional aspects to that. Right. In the Ukraine we saw adaptation is super important.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Right.

[JD Vance]

Like you're changing constantly.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Yes.

[JD Vance]

Everybody is saying the problem with hardware is you can't develop it as fast as software. Here you can develop hardware as fast, if not faster than software. Something happens. It's not like you've built up a bunch of inventory. You need to put a new seeker in this. Any machine anywhere, you generate a new design. Any machine anywhere can print and assemble this seeker anywhere. You have an ally, say somebody in Aukus or NATO, goes, hey, we want to use our 150 pound thrust gas turbine jet engine for this cruise missile. You generate a variant and you build it wherever they're at. That allows you to adapt super fast, extend the supply chain, have suppliers compete and be qualified for every single part. And the machine itself then becomes the integrator and an integrator with Zero tooling, zero fixturing and design, agnostic production and assembly.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

One last time in the way the Pentagon looks at it in our national security community, the 2027, which is like the year people are most worried about, you're saying that your total system is the only way practically that we can leapfrog, get even to the Chinese and practice and leapfrog them on just the quantity and quality of weapons systems today?

[JD Vance]

Well, I would say saying it is the only way. The only way. I know maybe somebody has another way. I mean, I haven't been present, it hasn't presented.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

It hasn't been presented yet. It hasn't come up through the system.

[JD Vance]

You know what I'd say is we're working even with the major primes who are saying we need to work with you. What do I know? 100% Missouri, prove it to me. We could take anybody to our factory, show them the rate at our machine, show them the stability, show them how fast we do this and say, can you, could we do 40,000 anti ship cruise missiles by 2027? Absolutely, positively, everything on the line. Yes, yes, yes. And then I would say, you know, MacArthur said that the one thing that he knew about how you fail in war is be too late.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Right.

[JD Vance]

And you know what? We don't have an hour to waste.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Against the Chinese Communist Party. Okay, I want to go to the commercial side. We just got a couple of minutes for people out there saying, hey, this would be perfect in our community, etc. On the commercial side, not related to defense, what you're doing for certain automotive industry, other component parts. What's holding you up from rolling out this system throughout the country?

[JD Vance]

I'd say what we need to do is have a catalyst. We shifted about two years ago because of the need of the defense industrial base for this technology to focus on that. What I would say and what we're talking to the government about is building within the next year five factories for about $250 million. I think that would catalyze factory or.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

No, 50 million per factory.

[JD Vance]

Million per factory. And that means these would be factories up and running and producing parts, sustainment parts, existing missile systems, new missile systems. So this is up and running, producing at capacity out of these five factories, I believe. And I mean, you know, you know, the capital markets, they would look at this and go, okay, money should be going into this. I think we do that. We, we have that catalyst. We're going to have 100 plus factories quickly work during this administration that will transform this country in ways that are unimaginable.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Where do people go? I want to make sure people go, we've played the B roll. I want to make sure people go see the videos, live stream or whatever you have at the Torrance Factory, your social media website, all of it. Because I know you're going to go out and do a lot of media. But we want to make sure the audience, the audience loves the receipts. They'd love to get into the, the live streams or whatever. You have the factory. Where do people go to get all the information about. About Divergence. And is this, do you have this a simple type of presentation up on the website people can go through?

[JD Vance]

Yes. You'd go to divergent 3D calm. If you go. And that has all of the videos. It has a short video. Obviously we don't show everything on that video because there's a lot of.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

In some projects and certain classified. I'm sure.

[JD Vance]

But I'm Lucas and I, my son Lucas and I are super looking forward to hosting you there.

[Kevin Zinger]

Now we're going to come, we're going.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

To come out and do the war room from the factory floor. I want to take people around and show them everything. Right.

[JD Vance]

You know, I've had one of the most famous technology companies out there. The CTO walked out and said when I had this first explained to me, I thought no way.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Right?

[JD Vance]

It's like this is, this is Westworld for the world.

[Kevin Zinger]

Because the guys, you know, we, we.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Came up with, they're not technologists like you. They didn't shift their investment bankers or financiers, but they're smart people. I've had so many of that crowd say you got to see chemist thing, but they're not technology guys. Then when I heard that this is so important for defense, I started doing checkings and people that are heavy duty on the manufacturing side told me, consider this is the future of American manufacturing. You want to have a manufacturing renaissance quickly. That this is the way to kind of turbocharge us. And so everything I've seen, of course bringing the cruise missile into the war room. We greatly appreciate it.

[JD Vance]

Kevin Zinger, thanks so much.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Founder and you've done a God bless you. No, dude, you're, you're the, you're the, you're the American story. Working class family.

[JD Vance]

We're the American story.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Ethnic. Served in the Marine Corps, went to a pre woke Ivy League school and of course now serving your country and doing this and this is going to be a big deal. We appreciate you coming in and sharing it with the war room because now people can start to understand it. And we'll prep everybody for our live factory floor with. Which is right next to where Mo Bannon was raised in Manhattan Beach. Torrance is right there. It's the inland city of it. So we're looking forward to coming out there and seeing you.

[JD Vance]

Looking forward to it. And I'd just say to all the Marines out there, Semper Fi.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Semper Fi. We got a big veteran. So Marine, Marine turned out good. Not an X Marine. Former Marine, as all you guys are.

[JD Vance]

And by the way, I have the great honor of having General Peter Pace on my board.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

Wow.

[JD Vance]

Former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs and a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful human being.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

And by the way, real quick, Paycom, Indo. Paycom. Talk about the. The admirals have been out and been blown away by.

[JD Vance]

I mean, I, I can't. I don't think I've ever been more impressed by a. A human being that I am. By Admiral Sam Paparo, who is the commander of Indopacom. That's for your audience. 60 of our entire military.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

The weights are his shoulders against the ccp.

[JD Vance]

He spent a lot of time in here. He always says to me, kevin, tell people the extensive engagement I have in this. I believe in this great. He's an amazing man. And I'll say he has a great quote. And I was just speaking at an AI conference. Number one, sustainment is what won the Second World War, and that was America. Number two, we're not going to AI our way out of material deficit.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

We're gonna see you tomorrow morning at.

[Kevin Zinger]

10Am Will you be back in the war room?

[Stephen K. Bannon]

See you then.

[Kevin Zinger]

What if he had the brightest mind.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

In the war room, delivering critical financial research every month?

[Kevin Zinger]

Steve Bannon here. War room listeners know Jim Rickards.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

I love this guy.

[Kevin Zinger]

He's our wise man. A former CIA, Pentagon and White House advisor with an unmatched grasp of geopolitics and capital markets, Jim predicted Trump's Electoral college victory exactly 312 to 226, down to the actual number itself. Now he's issuing a dire warning about April 11, a moment that could define Trump's presidency and your financial future. His latest book, MoneyGPT, exposes how AI is setting the stage for financial chaos. Bank runs at lightning speeds, algorithm driven crashes and even threats to national security. Right now, War room members get a free copy of MoneyGPT when they sign up for Strategic Intelligence. This is Jim's flagship financial newsletter, Strategic Intelligence. I read it.

[Stephen K. Bannon]

You should read it.

[Kevin Zinger]

Time is running out. Go to Rickards War Room.com that's all one word. Rickards War Room records with an S. Go now and claim your free book. That's rickardswarroom.com do it today to provide.

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