Unidentified Patriot/Chorus (1:21)

Hey, hey, hey. Freedom ain't free. No, it comes with a price. Rest in peace, Charlie. Can't believe they took your life. Didn't make it back home to your children and wife by any means we have to keep freedom Aspire beach alive. Hey. Rest in peace, Corey. All the fires that you fight to the cops in military that been fighting day and night so we could have liberty and our God giving rights to all the mothers and fathers that's just trying to protect their child. Hey. Freedom worth dying for. Dreams worth fighting for.

Steve Bannon (1:54)

It is Tuesday, January 6, 6th January, 2026. Five years to the day of Patriots Day. What did they say in this song?

Jim Rickards (2:06)

We're gonna.

Steve Bannon (2:07)

In the introduction song. Will never stop fighting for this country. That's the folks of January 6th, the J6ers. Julie Kelly's gonna walk us through the testimony of Jack Smith, and we'll talk about that in a moment. We're packed in this hour, so I want to get on with it. Enrique Terrio, sir. You were not even on, I think, the property that day. And the Justice Department went after you. And I believe you got 22 years or 25 years in prison. I want to say something about some of the unsung heroes. Your mother is a patron hero. You're standing here today because of the fight your mother had. I would go to these conferences. I would go to the CPACs. I always saw your mom, and she was sitting there and she was fighting for her son. And it just. I can't tell you what a warrior she is.

Enrique Tarrio (2:56)

I mean, Steve, she, she's great. She's amazing. And to tell you, you know, I knew I, she had it in her, but I didn't know how much she had in her until I went away. When I went away, she kind of, you know, she wasn't, she wasn't pro Trump. She wasn't pro anything. You know, she just went to work 9 to 5. And when I went, when I went away, you know, like, her eyes opened and like, she didn't stop. And she didn't stop until literally I was already pardoned. And she didn't stop until I was on my flight back from Dallas to Miami. So I really appreciate her and everything she's done.

Steve Bannon (3:36)

I mean, she was totally apolitical. When we talk about low information, low propensity voters, your mom is not that their intelligence or education, they're just not that into politics. It's just not part of their lives. She was a classic person that really didn't pay attention. It was only when J6 happened, she realized how rigged the system. System is, sir.

Enrique Tarrio (3:57)

And she did. You know, I think the, the most political comment my mom ever said to me is in 2016, I was trying to turn out some voters for Trump and she, she's like, no, I'm going to vote for Hillary. And, and I go, why, mom? And she said, because she's a woman, you know, And I was like, you know what? That's, that's why you wanted to vote for, you know. You know, go ahead. But, yeah, she's full MAGA now. Ultra maga.

Steve Bannon (4:26)

Talk to me about your journey. It's been five years today. This is historic. In the commemoration you guys had, I think was incredible. Real America's Voice, the press conferences, all of it. We just done a film, by the way. Go to itunes, download the song, let's keep it as number one. Go to the Rev app, you get the film. The film is very moving. Your journey. I spent four months in federal prison. I can tell folks, four months in federal prison is a long time. They sent you. They had you for 22 years. Was it 25 years?

Enrique Tarrio (4:59)

It was. I got a 22 year sentence. I did three years. And the full time that I was there was spent in solitary confinement. And they moved me 40 different times in those three years.

Steve Bannon (5:14)

We call that diesel therapy in the. In prison. Right? Were you at mediums? Did they have you in mediums? People should k Bannon would last 24 hours in a medium. Medium or gladiator schools. I mean, that is. They are the toughest because the penitentiaries are tough, but people are in isolation or in solitary. In mediums, it's gladiator school. Those are the most dangerous places in the United States of America, sir.

Oscar Blue Ramirez (5:41)

Yeah.

Enrique Tarrio (5:41)

And I was in one of the most dangerous mediums in the country. It was pollock medium. And what's crazy is our points. And, you know, you went through this. My points were camp points. So they manipulated their own system to go and boost me to a low and then boost me to a medium. But I didn't spend a lot of time in the medium, Steve, because I was moving around 40 different federal prisons, county jails, and federal holdovers in that time. So being here today in DC Was truly magical. I've been in DC since my release, but today was truly magical because it's the first January 6th I've ever been in D.C. i've never been to prison. I mean, I've never been to D.C. on January 6th.

James Immerman (6:30)

Wow.

Steve Bannon (6:31)

Enrique, hold on for one second. I want to bring Julie Kelly in. Julie, today of all days, you're not a lawyer. I mean, you started going to these and sitting in to these courthouses, and you came to us, you started writing, and you said, the American people are going to be shocked of how rigged this thing is, how dishonest it is, how corrupt it is, how wrong it is. Talk to us about that. In particular, you got an opportunity to see Jack Smith's deposition. Your thoughts and observations, ma'.

Enrique Tarrio (6:59)

Am.

Julie Kelly (7:06)

And just kind of thinking back, understanding what the Biden DOJ was doing to American citizens, what the FBI was doing, you know, getting calls late at night, getting calls over the weekend from people at the D.C. gulag, some of the people who were charged alongside with Enrique, and then trying to figure out how to. How to learn legalese enough to interpret that for regular Americans, including myself, to make sense of what they were doing, holding people on pretrial detention for nonviolent offenses, like Enrique, for example. And so it's hard to believe it's been five years, but you can sense, Steve, the frustration and the fury of Democrats, never Trumpers in the media, that this has backfired so spectacularly in their faces because they really thought that January 6th would result in the death of the MAGA movement, the isolation of Donald Trump, and the imprisonment of Donald Trump. And not only did that not happen, people on social media are just mocking January 6th and mocking reporters and Democrats who are lying about it, perpetuating the idea it was this armed insurrection incited by Donald Trump. They never saw this coming. So I Know, for me as a reporter and someone who knew a lot of these defendants and their families, including Enrique and his mom, I think his mom was the first person to call me on January 20th to let me know that she had heard people were being released from prison. I think she knew before I did so. But of course I covered the Proud Boys trial as well. I saw what the prosecutors did to Enrique and his co defendants with the help of Judge Tim Kelly. I think just one of the most egregious cases that the DOJ brought against them. But I think what the next piece we have to talk about, Steve, and I know Enrique and he will agree, I know, is the accountability measures that have to be imposed for the people who did this to American citizens. The prosecutors, the DOJ officials, the FBI officials, the investigators, agents, everyone who is involved in this unconstitutional, egregious, unprecedented attack on the constitutional rights of thousands of American citizens have to face consequences. And this is the year it has to happen.

Steve Bannon (9:31)

So what do you mean by that? I mean. Cause the people that came after me all ran over, all crawled over to the White House and all got pardons, including the staff and the staff. One of the staff members perjured herself. I didn't really have a trial. It was a joke. They wouldn't let me put on a defense, so I just sat there. But they put on a witness. She just sat there and perjured herself. And then they all crawled on their bellies to the White House and got preemptive pardons, which never happened in the country's history. The accountability. What happened to Enrique, what happened to the Proud Boys? What happened to all the J6ers, some of these people. And as our guest at the top of the first hour, Sarah Maccabee said, they're not broken, but they're bent. And some of them were bent a lot. I mean, this took Enrique Terrio and folks, these medium security prisons are kill zones. To send a man who didn't do, who did nothing on January 6th for 22 years to a medium. Whoever did that should be sent to prison themselves. So what are we going to do about it? And what is going to happen, ma'?

Oscar Blue Ramirez (10:33)

Am?

Julie Kelly (10:35)

I don't know, Steve. I mean, the MAGA base is very frustrated today. In addition to just mocking the January 6th propagandists, there is a lot of frustration justified that this looks like a repeat of Russiagate, where we know what happened, we know who did it, we know the crimes that were committed. Of course, this is on a much broader scale and they're all going to get away with it. I mean, we talked about Jack Smith's testimony last week. He lied repeatedly to Congress about those two indictments, about what they meant, about the sort of evidence that he had collected. So what's going to happen with him next? There is a pending criminal referral against one of Jack Smith's top henchmen, Tom Windom, sitting at DOJ for obstructing Congress, for refusing to answer questions under oath during a subpoena deposition. So, I mean, things have got to happen very quickly. I think the MAGA base was frustrated but patient in 2025 as the Trump administration, the DOJ, was fielding all of these lawsuits I don't think anyone really saw coming. And the judges, of course, being exposed as nothing more than partisan hacks, which is what we saw in the federal courthouse. Tim Kelly being one of the worst, unfortunately appointed by Donald Trump. But, you know, where's the impeachment proceedings against Jeb Bosberg? We've been talking about that for months. You had Republican senators who had their phones spied on by Jack Smith, Republican senators like Ted Cruz saying a few months ago, we're going to hold him accountable. Well, what does that look like? Where's the roadmap? So if we don't start seeing things happen in the next few weeks, you're going to see a huge uprising in the MAGA base justified because we cannot let what happened to 1600j6ers and the ones who weren't charged. We should talk about the documents that Rand Paul posted today. Seventy pages of FBI documents of a two and a half year investigation into an innocent woman who was snitched on by a former friend. And the FBI physically surveilled her house, meaning her family, four times, put her on the TSA terror watch list, which Enrique is familiar with, hearing and talking to J. Sixers. And then the summer of 2022, the FBI tells D.C. u.S. Attorney Matthew Graves, we don't have evidence, we have no facial recognition, she's not in the geofence warrant, etc. Etc. Matthew Graves says, I don't care, we're going to prosecute her on misdemeanors anyway. So this is an unprecedented attack on the constitutional rights of thousands of American citizens. And we cannot just let this go with a bunch of letters and hearings that no one is paying attention to and production of records, which are very helpful. But if that's as far as we get, what's the point?

Steve Bannon (13:25)

It turns out too, Peter Navarro tells me, I think the guy that supervised Our prosecutions is over DOJ and got promoted last week. I'm going to get more of that later this week as I get some more details from Dr. Navarro. Got promoted. What is your recommendation before we get. There's no doubt in your mind, and you believe you can prove that, that Jack Smith purged himself under oath, lied under oath on his deposition that he gave, that he. He was so big, he wanted to go in front of Congress on national TV and give it, Ma'.

James Immerman (13:56)

Am.

Julie Kelly (13:58)

He did. He talked about, I think, a few things that stood out to me. He talked about the president repeatedly obstructing the investigation, classified documents case. That is a brazen lie. In fact, it was the basis of several weeks of struggle between the FBI and the Department of Justice about authorizing that armed FBI raid on Mar A Lago in August of 2022. They were fully cooperating from the very beginning, dating back to the spring of May 2021, then voluntarily producing 15 boxes of documents to Nara, who was threatening to charge them. Even though there's no federal enforcement, it's not a criminal statute, the Presidential Records Act. So they were fully cooperating. So he lied about that. He lied about the charges for January six. He said, you know, this is where the evidence led us. The evidence led you to three extremely vague conspiracy statutes, including one that's hardly ever used, conspiracy against rights, that actually Jack Smith and his team should face themselves. And of course, two of the four counts in the J6 indictment, obstruction of an official proceeding and conspiracy to obstruct, had been tossed by the Supreme Court in June of 2024. When it came to J6 cases, this would have been the same situation for the president. And then he stumbled around who he talked to. We're not even sure, Steve, that he took the oath of office, which appears to be very problematic as an officer of the court. He didn't remember if he took it, who administered it. Was it on zoom? Was it over the phone? He couldn't say. Then we find out. And this is something I'm writing about this week. Jack Smith actively sought to be involved in the Trump investigation. Months before he was appointed special counsel, he reached out to Lisa Monaco, the deputy Attorney general. You and I have talked about her a lot, her chief, her chief deputy, and said, I want to be involved. I'm looking to leave the Hague. He was in the Hague with the Kosovo war crimes case. I want to come back to the Department of Justice in the domestic terror unit. What was the domestic terror unit doing going after Donald Trump? His associates and his voters. So the idea that Jack Smith was just plucked out of the Hague here, he was just toiling away, trying to put away, I think it was Kosovo president for war crimes. Then all of a sudden he just came out of nowher. That's not it. He actively sought to be part of the effort to prosecute and imprison Donald Trump. So the guy's a snake. He's a dirtbag. His investigators were caught doctoring evidence, they were caught tampering with evidence, possibly missing evidence. They said towards the end they couldn't find some of the files that had been taken out of those boxes. We know that one of his deputies, Jay Bratton, threatened the defense attorney of Donald Trump's co defendant, Walt Nada, threatened that if he didn't get Walt, not a flip on the president, one of his closest personal aides, that he would make sure that this attorney didn't get a judgeship that he had Applied for in D.C. these are the most corrupt, dirtiest prosecutors you can find, and that's saying a lot. So there's plenty of things that Jack Smith and his team can be criminally referred for. Does Congress have the stomach, though, to work with the DOJ and the president and the White House to get that done? I think Republicans in Congress have been the biggest wimps, the biggest obstacles, and that's why we're sitting here now with no indictments.

Steve Bannon (17:40)

This has to be a high priority in the White House. And I know President Trump wants to make it. We'll get to that in a moment. Just hang on, Enrique. A diesel therapy in the Bureau of Prisons is done for the worst hard court prisoners that just won't get with the program to break people psychologically. What it is, they shackle you, they put you on a bus, and then with none of your belongings. And then every night, every day, you're at a different prison, a different processing. It's to break people psychologically. Right. And normally, just even after a couple what they call diesel therapy, you break, you did 40. Do you have any idea who in the Bureau of Prisons ordered that? Sir?

Enrique Tarrio (18:19)

So I don't know if I'm pronouncing his name right. His name's Crudge. I've already referred him to the doj. We also found a whistleblower within the BOP that's willing to come forward and talk about some of those transfers and some of the treatment that came from the bop, which is an arm of the Department of Justice. And then I want to touch on something that Julie said too, is you know, the MAGA base is angry. I'm one of those, you know, I understand completely that things take time. Building cases take time. I'm not, I'm not immune to that. But it's so simple to go into somebody, somebody's office in the DOJ and be like, you're fired, you're gone. And one of those people is Jocelyn Ballantyne. And I don't, Steve, I don't know if you've heard of Jocelyn Ballantyne, but she was one of the heads of the capital Siege division at the doj. And currently she's not only working for the doj, she has one of the highest profile cases. She's in charge of one of the highest profile cases in J6 history, which is a pipe bomber case. And along with FBI agent Special Agent Hannik, which was a special agent in charge of our case. So how aggravated we are. And it comes through because the simple things aren't done done. It's not that we haven't gotten these deep state arrests. I really do want the deep state arrests. But like the simple things aren't even done. So we're growing impatient. And I'm seeing the MAGA base, including J6ers and regular everyday people that are just had enough with the appointees.

Steve Bannon (19:55)

Let me ask you if you had a chance to have a few minutes with the President today in the Oval Office at the end of our commemoration of this historic 5th year anniversary which will be known as Patriots Day in years to come, what would you tell the President? What are the two or three things say, Mr. President, got the greatest respect for you. I know people are working like crazy, there's so much stuff going on. But in regards to this, which is a super high priority for President Trump, he told Charlie Kirk on that stage in December of 2024 after he won, that the reason he came back to do that and to go through everything, the bankruptcies, the 92 charges, the 373 years in prison because they wanted to put him in prison and have him die in prison. He did it because he said, I won the 2020 election and if that's not sorted out, we're not going to have a country. If they know that they can have a coup and actually steal the country, then we don't have a republic. So what would be the two or three things that you would tell the President of the United States?

Enrique Tarrio (20:54)

Sir, I would. The first thing is I tell them I love them for giving me my life back. The second, I would focus on getting Sometimes I hate using this word, I hate using reparations because it has such a negative connotation to it. But a lot of these J6ers need to get their lives back together. And I think that the only way that we'll do that is with some type of compensation through lawsuits, torts or whatever. We're currently suing the United States government. We have a hearing next Thursday. So I want to see what his position on if he can do anything about that. A third, I probably tell him I love him again, because I. I would have spent another two decades of my life, which would have been the rest of my life, to be honest with you. And, you know, that's it. I mean, I've met. I got to meet the president.

Steve Bannon (21:45)

You would have gone. You would have gone. You. You would have gone insane because you're an innocent man and you had your life taken away from free people. This is the kind of demons we're dealing with. He's an innocent man. He's an innocent man. They worked against it to send so many innocent people and destroy their lives. And Enrique's thing, have him die in prison, just like they wanted Trump to die in prison, sir.

Enrique Tarrio (22:07)

Yeah, yeah. And look what. What happened to all of us is, is. Is horrible. And I think that there's a lot of ways that, that things could be made right. But one thing that I'll never be mad at is the President. I think he's done an amazing job. I'm pro what he did in Venezuela. I just think that his appointees need to really show out for him.

Steve Bannon (22:30)

Listen, hey, let me tell you something. Let me tell you something. One of the most important people in this thing, because I saw that drama play out, is Julie Kelly. Julie Kelly spent two hours with the president, given all the details because Julie Kelly had sacrificed her life to go sit in those courtrooms and President Trump. And I'm not faulting anybody because it's very tough to know the details there. She knew him. And when the president knew the details, that is one of the most central things that had President Trump thinking. I'm gonna either commute them all or pardon them all. But they're all gonna go, right? Because of what Julie Kelly did. Enrique, we gotta bounce. Where do people go on your social media? We're at the top of the first inning in getting this sorted. We gotta get this sorted inside of DOJ and the FBI. We have to, or we don't have a country. Where do they go, Sir?

Enrique Tarrio (23:17)

They could go on X right here. It's showing on the screen X at Noble 1. That spelled out Noble 1. Steve, thank you for having me on. Julie, love you. Thank you for always being there. Thank you for being as loyal as you are to the truth, not just to people, but to the truth. So I appreciate you and thanks, Steve. Thanks again.

Steve Bannon (23:37)

Thanks. And give your mom a hug. We love her.

Enrique Tarrio (23:41)

We will.

Steve Bannon (23:41)

She's the epitome of the MAGA movement. Julie Kelly, you're a patriot and a hero. Five years. Five years and we still haven't started even scratching the surface on the assassination of Ashley Babbitt and others that were killed that day. Your thoughts? What's the two or three things? And I gotta tell you, you're a hero because in that week, right before, right before, right before Inauguration Day, you did yeoman's work. And the reason it was so powerful, you were a witness to it all. You basically gave up your life to go sit in these courtrooms. And I remember seeing you, you were so aghast about what's going on. When you would tell me this stuff, I go, that can't be true. Because some of these guys, including my judge, were all Trump appointees.

Jim Rickards (24:26)

Right?

Steve Bannon (24:27)

And the horror stories of these judges, the horror stories, the story of this and what legally they did to these citizens is one of the greatest crimes in the history of this republic, full stop. And that's why it's got to be sorted out. We cannot just kick the can down the road. And if you want to see a bunch of gutless people, those people up on Capitol Hill that prepare today, they didn't want to be near it. Let's be blunt. They set up this thing over at the Kennedy center today for this all day briefing. And I'm all for having conferences and all day briefings. And they, they want to get to legislation. I'm 100% support that. But they did it today, on January 6th, because they didn't want to be near. They didn't want to be near the Capitol to have reporters. Oh, what do you think about January 6th?

Jim Rickards (25:10)

That's how gutless they are, where they.

Steve Bannon (25:13)

Go, julie, get your stuff, get your material.

Julie Kelly (25:15)

Well, I'll tell you this too, Steve. I was told early on, after the President won, that there were going to be a lot of hearings in 2025 featuring January 6th defendants, their families, their attorneys.

James Immerman (25:25)

It's.

Julie Kelly (25:26)

Etc. We got none of that. So a lot of this is the weakness, the lack of accountability originates. I believe in Congress, so they better step up because people are very frustrated.

Steve Bannon (25:39)

Where do we go? Substack all of it.

Julie Kelly (25:41)

Substack with Julie Kelly on substack and then X Julie underscore Kelly too.

Steve Bannon (25:49)

Ma', am, if we didn't have you, we wouldn't have anything. This is one of the reasons we put you on the show all the time. If we didn't have Julie Kelly and she had not sacrificed those years of her life, her life to go do this, we wouldn't have anything. She was an eyewitness to what happened and she reported it every day. Reported every day. And if it had not been for Julie Kelly and the credibility she has and the President of the United States, who's a very savvy guy, understood. As soon as you start talking to her, this woman knows what she's talking about. Nobody would have gotten pardoned. Nobody would have gotten commuted. Julie Kelly, 100%. Ma', am, you're a patron hero. Thank you.

Julie Kelly (26:31)

Back at you, Steve. Thank you.

Steve Bannon (26:37)

Five years on outrageous to know a young man like Enrique Theriault. 22 years in a fashion federal medium security prison. Are you kidding me? That's a death sentence. And they knew it was a death sentence. Every one of them ought to be keel hauled. The most corrupt, disgusting, revolting people in that Justice Department, in that FBI, and in that federal court. Short break. Back in a moment.

Jim Rickards (27:12)

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Steve Bannon (27:26)

Card and other debt?

Jim Rickards (27:27)

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Enrique Tarrio (32:17)

Here's your host, Stephen k. Ban.

Steve Bannon (32:22)

Okay, 972 Patriot call it right now and talk to what does Glenn Story call it? A hillbilly East Texas accent when the customer service a United States citizen. This is a company that has your back, believes what you believe, supports the causes. This Friday night we're going to have a huge event in Texas that I'm going to be one of the featured speakers of. We're pulling together all I think over 22 grassroots groups organization about this situation with Islam in Texas. Got huge announcement on this tomorrow morning and Glenn Story is going to join me on the show. 972 Patriot they've got your back. Why don't you check out their service 972patriot Best mobile service around. Also Rickards, Jim Rickards, one of our contributors. If you like capital markets, geopolitics, the strategy, all of it. He's one of the best guys around. That's why he's a contributor here. Go torickards war room.com you get asset access to strategic intelligence. That's his newsletter read by Chairman CEOs players throughout the world. You can get it too. And he'll he'll give you a deal. Throw a free booking about artificial intelligence and fiat currency. Now more than ever in a turbulent world you need great sources of information. It doesn't get better than Jim Burger. Just go check it out. The whole strategic intelligence is based upon predictive analytics. That's why Jim's legendary for having called shots. So go check it out. Today James Zimmerman joins us. James, you're a clarinetist, a classical musician, trained symphony orchestra, correct, Sir.

James Immerman (33:58)

That's right. I'm a symphonic clarinetist by trade. Or at least I was.

Steve Bannon (34:04)

Symphonic. Okay, you've been and you have a curriculum veto of the schools everything and performances. You've been fired. Not by one. You've been fired by two symphony. Highly regarded symphony orchestras, I believe in the Volunteer State, both in Nashville and Knoxville. What in the hell did you do to get fired by two of the top symphony orchestras in the country, sir?

James Immerman (34:29)

Well, my time in the first orchestra, the Nashville Symphony, lasted a dozen years. I resisted a DEI takeover by a temporary black oboist who I thought was my friend, and we had a chance to take him out illegally after a botched blind audition that he won. But I stood up on his behalf. But after that, he did a Jussie Smollett type narrative about me, harassed management till they couldn't take it anymore and blackmailed them into firing me so that they could avoid being sued by him for racial discrimination. This is kind of a long and complicated story, but I just wouldn't bend the knee. They kicked me out right before the pandemic. I've been working in tech ever since. My stint in the Knoxville Symphony never really got started. I won a blind audition for them back in September. This means I play for a panel of judges. They don't see who I am. They don't know my race. They don't know my gender, my age, my curriculum vitae, anything about me. They judge me solely, solely on my playing the most meritocratic system imaginable. And yet, after I won the job, they did a little digging on my history, decided I was too untouchable, and kicked me to the curb and said, we're never going to talk to you about this. So I'm suing them for damages for my time spent practicing and a year's salary. But more importantly, I'm trying to push back against them and send a message to the rest of the industry that this woke stuff has got to stop. Because if we don't have the best players in these jobs, we're going to go bankrupt as an industry. There will be no more orchestras and no more clarinetists in the war room either.

Steve Bannon (35:57)

I thought, you know, for people that love symphony music, love classical music, I thought when you went and you see people on stage, I thought they were all chosen because they've passed these rigorous auditions, et cetera. Are you telling this audience that that's not the case? That there's actually not just politics, but kind of DEI has infected this. So they're not meritocracy. So when you're sitting there, you're not hearing the best that was available at the time?

James Immerman (36:25)

Well, they're still mostly meritocratic, but there's all kinds of pressure from the outside to make it easier to diversify the orchestras through these processes, you know, creation of diversity fellowships so we can get more people of color on the stage. Advantages in the meritocratic process for minorities or women or actually women are the people who have benefited the most from blind auditions. When blind auditions were instituted 50 years ago, it only took one generation for orchestras to go from virtually all male to 50, 50. It's just that some of the, you know, browner minorities have not experienced the same spike in the last 50 years. So there's huge effort. They all say it's because of systemic racism, but it's a lot more complicated than that. I'm certainly not against helping out the underserved and bringing music into communities that. That haven't been able to afford it historically. But you have to draw the line somewhere and, you know, telling musicians that they're racist just because they're great players and they haven't done enough of their share to uplift the underserved and, you know, harassing them into struggle sessions and dragging them into HR all the time, it's a. It's a nightmare. If you're like me, if you're white, male and Christian and Catholic and Republican and straight.

Steve Bannon (37:44)

Talk to me about that for a second. When they say it's systematic racism, what do they mean by that? Because I thought for a lot of these people in the crazy woke left, they hate all that kind of. They hate classical music, classical painting, classical literature, because they say it's all white culture and they don't want to be a part of it. But when they say it's systematic racism in music, what are they specifically pointing to?

James Immerman (38:10)

They don't know what they mean when they say that. They just see a white dominant profession, and they say, well, there must be racism somewhere. What else could it possibly be? So they look at the audition process, they look at the music itself, all of which has mostly emerged from Europe, and they say, you know, we. We need to include the music of Africa. We need to include more music that originated in the black community, like jazz, which. Jazz and classical music have plenty of overlap. But the thing to understand is they don't understand what they're saying when they say there's systemic racism. They see that the. The blacks are not as represented, and so they. They know there's racism somewhere, and they have to find it. So they try to find it in every single interaction with their white colleagues and with the repertoire itself. And they're on a mission, and you have to respect their willingness to destroy their opposition. That is something that has really Put, put right wingers in the arts on their heels because we don't fight back hard enough. So I'm trying to change that culture on my side.

Steve Bannon (39:12)

How are you trying to change it?

James Immerman (39:14)

With this lawsuit? There's nothing else to do. I could walk away with my tail between my legs having won this job in Knoxville fair and square, or I could put some feelers out. I have a Great foundation in D.C. that's running point on this. You know, I've got Harmeet Dillon on the case and I've got the Department of Justice looking into this. And, you know, we have to starve these woke orchestras of their funding if that's what it takes. They receive federal money all over the place. And if they're going to fund anti conservative bias, maybe they shouldn't get any taxpayer money, especially in a red state like Tennessee. You know, Nashville and Knoxville are pretty blue pockets, but you know, at large. This is a deep red state. I don't think. Go ahead.

Steve Bannon (39:53)

It's one of the, is one of the ways you said something previous. So when they went to blind auditions and that's where you just listen to the music, you don't see who's actually performing. You said orchestras essentially went roughly from all male and principal, I guess all white male, to now 50% women. Did that mean before there was definitely structural anti, I don't know, feminism or there was a biased against females in these orchestras up to that time. Until they went to the blind audition back what, decades ago?

James Immerman (40:26)

Yeah, it was kind of an all boys club. And that's what the big objection from union types was. It's like we need to give everybody a fair shot at getting into these orchestras. Because back then if you didn't have money, if you didn't have pedigree, if you didn't have connections, if your family wasn't well connected to classical music already, there was really no way for you to get into an orchestra. So the musicians said, let's have a fair system where we compete. And it was widely adopted by all orchestras. This is standard operating procedure. This is the way into the game. And when they put the screen up, women started to compete, you know, in a blind situation with men. And now orchestras are full of really high level playing women all over the place. It's just that, that that same boom hasn't been seen for certain races. So we're figuring out ways to have they go. The pressure.

Steve Bannon (41:12)

That's my question. They've gone to. They still stay with blind, in fact. But you got the position because of that. Are all the auditions blind? And doesn't that get you the cream of the crop? Because people are hearing it with their ears and they're making that decision instead of looking at somebody's physical attributes, whether it's male or female or whether it's any type of race. Isn't that the way to do it? And if they're doing that now, what is that producing?

James Immerman (41:39)

Absolutely. That is the best way to do it. It's a flawed system. And sometimes you can't tell everything about a player from a blind audition. They're sitting on stage by themselves, for example. That's why after you win the blind audition, you get a one year probationary contract where you're being evaluated for an entire season. Can you show up on time? Can you listen to your colleagues? Do you have a good personality? Do you take direction well from the conductor? Those are the things that you evaluate over the year. So there is where the DEI types are saying there's a lot of stuff, systemic racism, because, you know, plenty of black players win blind auditions. But then they struggle a little bit in the tenure process because of all the factors. They mentioned about how it's so uncomfortable to be a minority on stage. There's not enough representation. So they will chip away at every stage of the process until they get the outcome they want, which is, you know, the same number of blacks and orchestras as in this country, 13%.

Steve Bannon (42:37)

So how do people find out more about your case? How do they get up to speed on what's going on? We'd love to have you back on. Particularly you're making this fight for the arts in general. Where do people go to get more information about this?

James Immerman (42:47)

Best place is my X account. James Immerman. It's two ends at the end. Yep, there it is. I hope you like pictures of bread too. I put up a picture of bread every morning. It's another way that I express my obsession for beautiful things is in the food that I eat. So you get a free picture of Brett every day. You get a little bit of me playing clarinet and me talking about what's going on with my legal fight. That's the best place to follow along.

Steve Bannon (43:10)

Okay, we'll follow up on you and see how we can help on this. I want everybody Grayson movie could push out. James, thank you so much. Look forward to finding out more about your fight.

James Immerman (43:20)

Thanks, Steve.

Steve Bannon (43:20)

You love high culture here in the war room. Thank you, sir. I've got a cold open from Oscar Blue Ramirez, and I can't say enough. Oscar as you know, for the last five years. You know him from the Darien gap and from all the daring do of really helping his fellow citizens in Mexico about this onslaught that came through Mexico into the, into the American southern border. But his reportage now on Venezuela is second to none. He's had so many cold shots just in the last couple of days. Let's play the cold opener. We're bringing Oscar. Oscar. There's been a lot of gunfire down there over the last couple of nights. It seems like nighttimes gets a little uneasy. President Trump is trying to have a peaceful resolution of this. He doesn't want occupation. He's an America firster. This is because of the hemispheric defense and the security of our own country. He's been kind of forced in to do this. He tried to give these guys every alternative. It's not working out. But you've highlighted the saying, hey, right below the surface there's a lot of problems and a lot of dangerous problems. What do you got for us?

Oscar Blue Ramirez (44:32)

Well, that's the main guy and that we talked about it, Stephen, that we broke the news right here in the war room, that they, you know, the Venezuela government has two more agitators and bad actors. And this is the guy that he's in charge of these collective groups, these mercenary groups that they are in charge of terrorizing and basically oppressing the population. These collective groups, they are armed and they are armed by him. He gives them the guns. There's videos already on viral social media where they are being armed right now as we speak to terrorize the population, to oppress the population, and to basically tell them that there's gonna be curfews now around 9 or 10 o' clock, they have to be back home. This has been happening to the Venezuelan people for years now, Steve, and the situation as we speak right now, it is that this is the guy that needs to be extracted immediately. This is the guy that has been torturing political prisoners. This is the guy that is in charge of Elicoyo. That is the prison that possibly Donald Trump is going to be closing right now. And it is the guy that needs to be extracted immediately. And we talked about it. And also in the contrast also with Padrino Lopez, it is another figure that actually he's complete terrorist also and in charge of also. It's ahead of the Cartel de los Oles.

Steve Bannon (45:50)

Are you recommending that the president and people around him start thinking about extractions of these individuals or the way President Trump's got it now, they've got A couple things they have to do, stop the drug trafficking. They've got to remove all the, you know, whether it's CCP or Russians, and particularly, you know, Marcos, because he's a neocon focused on Hamas and Hezbollah.

James Immerman (46:13)

And.

Steve Bannon (46:13)

They'Ve got to make efforts to help kickstart investment into the oil and gas business. Is that enough or you think that these guys are going to try to disrupt that? And are you recommending to the President that he actually do extraction of these two individuals that you've named Immediately?

Oscar Blue Ramirez (46:32)

You know, immediately. This needs to be done immediately. And Marco Rubio knows that Yozalo Cavallur is the number one enabler in the number one that is in charge of the violence and in the criminal activity. Just recently, Josel Cabello gave out statements saying that if he. If this doesn't stop and if this is not enough to terrorize the citizens, he will ask Iran for guns and he will ask for firearms. Also yesterday there was a confusion among these collective groups shooting at each other because they saw some drones flying in the sky. One of the drones said is the name Mojara. These drones are made by Iran, with Iranian intelligence, by engineers that they were trained by Venezuela in Iran. You know, this is something that is better known as Arpia, these drones. And they were. These are the drones that they are being flying around in the part of Caracas. So this guy, it is inevitable, a number one priority to extract, to basically create the change with Dercy Rodriguez. That Dercy Rodriguez also be extremely careful. The people of Venezuela, they're completely upset. They're saying this is another person that needs to be extracted, it needs to be removed. And this is the person that shouldn't be in government, shouldn't be in charge of a Venezuela country. And also Dercy Rodriguez was just seen as she was sworn in as to be the next president. She immediately went and saluted the ambassadors of China, ambassadors of Russia and ambassadors of Iran instead of going to their own political figures and all political people. So this tells you that it's not going to be easy. These two agitators and two bad actors need to be extracted immediately so they can create the peace and they can move forward with the plan that United States has over Venezuela. Steve.

Steve Bannon (48:13)

The collectibles, do I have that? Collectives or collectibles? These. These young people on these with guns that are on motorcycles, almost like motorcycle gangs. Tell us about that. How dangerous is that?

Oscar Blue Ramirez (48:25)

Extremely dangerous. This is how Trender operates. This is the motor operandi of Trender. And it is the right Hand man at the right hand of carte de los oles cartel de los oles completely constructed and reconstructed trend. That's the way that they operate. That's the way that they go. Assault and extortion, kidnap, distribute narcotics inside of Caracas and inside of the whole country of Venezuela. And these people are armed and they have the authority and the full freedom to oppress the population and to ultimately extortion and kidnaps and normal average citizens. These people are extremely dangerous. This is the more operandi that it was put on on Pablo Amelio's cobargaviria back in the day with these campaigns and drug dealers. They have been operating like this in Colombia and it is a copy paste of what they're doing right now in Venezuela. These are the people that they're agitating and not basically disturbing the peace right now in Venezuela's leave. It is extremely dangerous. What is happening right now on the floor in Caracas.

Steve Bannon (49:23)

In 60 seconds. You're sitting with Marco Rubio who knows this region pretty well. What's your recommendation to him of what action he should take today?

Oscar Blue Ramirez (49:32)

Oscar immediately pressure Delsey Rodriguez. She needs to understand that the next one to be extracted and they don't need to tell her the next one to be extracted will be the Ozado Cabello close Elicoida. That is the torture and is the torture present right now. And also just be aware Padrino Lopez it is going to be next as soon as you extract the Ozado Cabello pressure more Terci Rodriguez that if she doesn't bring the peace to the citizens of Venezuela and she doesn't start threatening the peaceful citizens of Venezuela then Padrino Lopez will be extracted and this is the only way that they are going to understand that she has been consistently seen on rallies threatening and also saying that they are still in government and they are still in power and the socialists and Chavez move are going to continue this. So immediately they need to extract Josado Caballo as the next strategy to create peace among the citizens of Venezuela and ultimately move forward from that. Steve.

Steve Bannon (50:26)

Oscar, I want everybody get access to your social media 247 where they.

Oscar Blue Ramirez (50:30)

Go Ex Oscar Ramirez TJ our webpage Oscar Blue Ramirez Oscar Blue Ramirez News and of course Steve, thank you so much for the invitation. Real America's voice you Steve they can find me that.

Steve Bannon (50:44)

The shows, your show and Javier show when do they play and where can people go get them on the Hispanic version of Rav we have where they go.

Oscar Blue Ramirez (50:52)

Yes, absolutely, absolutely. I forgot about that. Steve Rav Espanol you know real America's voices were moving in Spanish we last night it was a premiere of Raymond Assad. He did phenomenal, you know on just basically expanding the information of what is happening also in Venezuela. Remnants are he is a producer and also is a presenter. He's from Venezuela and he, you know he did a phenomenal show and we're going to be doing our own show also from Monday to Friday possibly. Steve on you know on the the next incoming weeks. We're waiting on that to be premiering on Raven Espanol. Be sure to be following Raven Espanol, Real America's Voice news bringing you the news and the reality and the truth in Spanish. Steve.

Steve Bannon (51:33)

Thank you sir. Appreciate you. Great work, courageous work. Scott Bessant, you know him as a contributor here. Secretary of the treasury also has a another job, collateral duty. Head of the irs. Right. You know we got a two trillion dollar deficit. Scott's been mandated by the president to close that deficit. Tax Network USA 800-958-1000 if you have a problem, haven't filed or you filed, if there's a, a gap between the bid and the ask on your tax returns, what you should do is go to the people at TNUSA. Do it today, tnusa.com or 800-958-1000 they've solved a billion dollars worth of people's tax issues. There is nothing that you have that they haven't seen before. So go check it out. You get a toll free consultation. They'll tell you what your, what your chances are here. They're experts in negotiating with the correct IRS agents. So go check it out today. Also American Family Pharmacy if you want. Medical freedom is not just getting away from big pharma, but it's also the distribution system America. All family pharmacy.com Bannon10 you get a 10% discount. This entire business was set up to make sure that, that you have medical freedom. They're doing an amazing job. Licensed professionals go through and hear and make sure that you're totally squared away on the medicines that you need. Go check it out today. All family pharmacy.com Bannon10 for 10% off. We're going to be back at 10am Eastern Standard Time tomorrow morning when you'll be back in the world. See you then.

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