Three's A Crowd With Matt Matthews

Summary

Podcast Summary: Barely Famous – "Three's A Crowd With Matt Matthews"
Host: Kail Lowry
Guest: Matt Matthews
Release Date: September 26, 2025

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Overview

This episode of "Barely Famous" dives into the complexities of friendship, fame, loneliness, and unconventional relationships. Kail Lowry and comedian Matt Matthews share a riveting, hilarious, and deeply personal conversation about their unlikely friendship, the isolating impact of public life, and Matt’s wild journey through a polyamorous relationship (“the throuple”). The discussion is filled with raw honesty, candid humor, and a no-holds-barred examination of what it means to maintain real connections—and boundaries—while living in the public eye.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Unlikely Friendship & Industry Loneliness

Timestamps: 01:40–06:16

• Kail and Matt reminisce on meeting via podcasting and quickly becoming genuine friends, a rare occurrence in their industry.
  • “You’re like the only person that I remained, like, really close with.” – Matt (01:46)
  • “I don’t think I gave you the option. I was like, we’re friends.” – Kail (02:08)
• They discuss the alienation and loneliness that come with fame, the distrust it breeds, and the longing for “real life” moments.
  • “Everybody wants to be famous… But what comes with that is a lot of negativity.” – Kail (02:39)
  • “My phone will not ring unless it’s an agent or manager… nobody’s calling me to say, hey, do you want to grab dinner tonight?” – Kail (03:53)
  • Matt and Kail highlight how they don’t fit into LA/New York celebrity culture and crave down-to-earth connections.

2. Opening Up About the Throuple ("V") Relationship

Timestamps: 06:35–14:31; 15:31–25:12

• Matt shares the story of unexpectedly entering into a polyamorous arrangement involving his husband, Rob, and a third man.
  • “Not the greatest decision of my life—but it was an experience.” – Matt (06:39)
• Kail asks for details; Matt candidly reveals it began with friendship, exchanged daily snaps and FaceTime calls, not sexual in nature at the start.
• Matt owns past prejudices about polyamory (“That’s never gonna work, they’re just hoes”—08:04), admitting real feelings can happen for multiple people.
• The dynamic wasn’t a true throuple; it was more like a “V” (Matt as the connecting point), with no romance between Rob and the third.
  • “Rob really liked him as well… not in love, but they enjoyed each other’s company.” – Matt (12:53)
• The authentic parts of the relationship were strong, but boundaries and trust issues surfaced quickly:
  • The new partner struggled with sharing, ghosted Matt during a crucial moment (while Matt was filming a comedy special), and later returned apologetically.
  • “I was so heartbroken that, like, he didn’t message me to say, hey, congratulations… nothing like that.” – Matt (16:24)

3. The Breakdown of the Relationship

Timestamps: 25:14–39:20

• Matt describes a pivotal moment full of red flags: being left in a stranger’s camper during a “mud ride,” feeling abandoned and disrespected by the new partner.
  • “He was mad at me because he thought I was faking a headache because I didn’t want to hang out with his friends.” – Matt (25:14)
• After multiple reconciliations, repeated patterns emerged of the partner pulling away, offering empty promises, and never consummating the relationship.
• Kail probes the psychology; Matt and Kail speculate his ex had a “dismissive attachment style” and narcissistic traits.
  • “He cannot handle his own emotions, so he can’t even begin to handle you.” – Matt (36:06)
• The relationship ends after months of dysfunction (including Matt paying for dental work), the partner moves out, and quickly moves on to someone else, confirming suspicions about his authenticity and motives.

4. Lessons Learned & Polyamory Reflection

Timestamps: 42:12–44:16

• Despite the pain, Matt feels more in love with and grateful for his husband, Rob.
  • “It made me fall way more in love with my husband… 11 years, not one time have I ever felt like he didn’t love me.” – Matt (42:24)
• Both agree the “V” didn’t fail because of polyamory, but due to the third person’s narcissism and inability to handle honesty or commitment.
  • “It didn’t not work because there were three of us… it didn’t work because he was a narcissist.” – Matt (43:46)
• Matt says he now sees it’s possible to genuinely love two people at once, under the right circumstances.

5. Personal & Career Updates

Timestamps: 46:00–51:14

• Matt has a new house (“residual income”), a sauna, a gym, and is “skinny as a needle” at £173.
• The pair discuss future adventures like barrel racing and skydiving together.
• Matt’s career is thriving: sold-out comedy tours (arena show coming up in December), new music releases, and a candle collaboration with Kail.
  • “First arena show in December.” – Matt (48:09)
  • “We do have a candle collab coming out… Peace, Love and Custody Battles.” – Matt & Kail (60:07)
• Kail addresses public misconceptions, especially how people perceive her family and decisions owing to being on TV young.
  • “If we’re all on TV at 16 years old, none of us were great people at 16. It’s called growth.” – Kail (49:43)

6. Burnout & Self-Worth Tied to Work

Timestamps: 55:01–56:38

• Kail and Matt open up about their identity being tied to work, struggles with burnout, and the challenge of switching off.
  • “I don’t feel like I have a life without working. If I don’t work, what purpose do I serve?” – Matt (55:23)
  • “What is my life if I’m not performing?” – Kail (55:57)

7. Mortality, Family, and Dark Humor

Timestamps: 57:45–59:24

• They exchange candid thoughts on family loss, grief, and Matt’s conflicted feelings about his father’s impending death.
  • “I’m gonna go on a comedy tour because I’m gonna be really funny once he dies. That’s the plan. I’ll be joining you on tour making dead dad jokes.” – Matt (59:04)
• Kail reflects on losing her biological and adoptive mothers as a teenager:
  • “I still think about her every day… I was 14 when she died.” – Kail (58:40)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Fame & Trust:
  “You don’t know if people are really out for your best interest.” – Kail (02:08)

• On Polyamory:
  “I always thought it was very weird… but I learned you can love two people at the same time.” – Matt (08:04, 43:35)

• On Relationship Red Flags:
  “I spent three grand to fix his teeth with his seven cavities… and I just got to the point where I was just pissed off.” – Matt (38:02)

• On Moving On:
  “To think that I almost let a man fuck up my bag. Then I went and performed two sold out shows and made over six figures in his hometown.” – Matt (44:55)

• On Friendship & Growth:
  “If we’re all on TV at 16 years old, none of us were great people… it’s called growth.” – Kail (49:43)

• On Self-Worth:
  “I don’t feel like I have worth without working.” – Matt (55:28)

• On Family Grief:
  “I still think about her every day… she was an addict, an alcoholic, so… but at 14, it was just like, damn.” – Kail (58:40)

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Episode Highlights by Timestamp

• 01:40: Kail & Matt discuss the rarity of real friendship in the influencer/entertainment world.
• 06:35: Matt opens up about his polyamorous (“V”) experience.
• 16:24: The fallout after being ghosted during a comedy special taping.
• 25:14: Matt’s story about feeling abandoned at the mud ride—a critical turning point.
• 36:01: Dissecting the ex's attachment style and narcissism.
• 42:22: How the experience strengthened Matt’s marriage.
• 49:43: Kail’s passionate defense of growth after reality TV adolescence.
• 55:01: Honest discussion of burnout and self-worth.
• 58:40: Heartfelt reflection on parental loss.

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Tone & Language

Conversational, irreverent, brutally honest, and consistently laced with humor even in uncomfortable or vulnerable moments. The rapport between Kail and Matt creates a space for both levity and deep sincerity.

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Closing Thoughts

This episode offers an unfiltered glimpse into navigating high-profile friendships, unconventional relationships, mental health, and healing from betrayal. Both hosts’ willingness to go “there,” share failures, lessons, and hard-won wisdom, is as refreshing as it is moving.

For more updates, follow @mattmatthews and @kaillowry. Tickets, merch, and music at mattmatthews.com.

Transcript

[Kale Lowry]

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[Matt Matthews]

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[Kale Lowry]

That's okay.

[Matt Matthews]

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[Kale Lowry]

Experian.

[Matt Matthews]

Welcome to the shit show. Things are going to get weird. It's your fave villain, Kale Lowry, and you're listening to Barely. Rolling. Rolling, rolling. Hey, Matt.

[Kale Lowry]

Hey.

[Matt Matthews]

Welcome to Barely Famous Podcast.

[Kale Lowry]

Never been here.

[Matt Matthews]

You've never been here.

[Kale Lowry]

Never been here.

[Matt Matthews]

But you've been to Barely Famous Podcast.

[Kale Lowry]

Been here.

[Matt Matthews]

One thing that always resonated with me about you and our friendship is like, after we first met to do the podcast, you're like the only person that I remained like, really close with.

[Kale Lowry]

And everybody's like, how did y' all become friends? I'm like, I did her podcast and we immediately clicked.

[Matt Matthews]

Immediately.

[Kale Lowry]

Immediately.

[Matt Matthews]

But I don't have, like, there are people that I click with, but we never speak again. And I just, I don't think I.

[Kale Lowry]

Gave you the option. I was like, we're friends.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah, we're besties now. And I actually love that though, because you said something to me. I think it was off camera, though. It was about how this industry is really lonely and nobody else gets it unless you're in it. But Then we're all looking out for ourselves in this industry because we all have to figure out a way that is going to keep us to stay relevant and things like that. But then when you go home and you were texting me about it, and I was like, no, I get it. Like, so, so, so alone. But do you ever talk about it?

[Kale Lowry]

I mean, yeah, because, like, people feel that's the biggest thing is, like, people. Everybody wants to be famous, you know, and it's like, everybody wants to be rich. You know what I mean? Like, especially when you grew up the way that we grew up. You know, when you grow up poor, like, you never want to be poor, so you want to make coin. Coin. And, you know, like, you want to have the dollars. And I get that because I'm the same way. I want to make money. But unfortunately, the biggest, like, thing that comes with making a lot of money is fame and people knowing who you are and what. What comes with that is a lot of negativity and people talking badly about you. And, you know, people always commenting on, you know, your life and what you're doing wrong and what you should be doing and what you shouldn't be doing. And then you have the people that want to be your friend, your friend because of who you are and because you are notable and because people know who you are and because you have a lot of followers, they want to be your friend. And so it's like, you don't trust people, right? And so it is hard to trust people, number one in general. But it's even harder to trust people when you are somebody that people knows and you have a career and you're. And you're working and you're hustling because you don't know if people are really out for their best. For your best, best interest.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

And so it's lonely because, like, you don't have any friends, you know? And it's like, I feel like I said that my phone doesn't ring sometimes when I'm at home. Like, my phone will not ring unless it's an agent or manager or just somebody calling me to talk about work. You know what I mean? Nobody's calling me to say, hey, do you want to go grab dinner tonight? Hey, do you want to, like, order in and watch a movie and just, like, chill in our pajamas? Like, I don't have that. I have, like, three really close friends, you included, and y' all all live in different states.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

You know what I mean? So, like, it's very lonely and And I mean, there have been times where I have been so lonely that I went to the grocery store just because I'm like, I have nothing to do. I'm so bored, and I just need somebody to tell me something, like, talk to me.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

You know, like. But then you get to the grocery store and everybody just wants take a picture with you. I'm like, bitch, tell me. Tell me, like, tell me about your husband cheating on you.

[Matt Matthews]

You know, Tell me why you're getting this produce.

[Kale Lowry]

Tell me. Yeah, like, tell me something. I don't want to talk about me.

[Matt Matthews]

And you have Rob, obviously your husband, and he works with you and for you, but he only can get it to a certain degree because he's not the one. Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

He doesn't understand that because, like, he's not in that world, you know? And so it's very. And I hate to even say, like. I hate to even, like, sound like I'm complaining about it because, oh, poor piddle for you, you go, you know, but it's like, it is a lonely industry, you know, and you live in.

[Matt Matthews]

A place, and I live in a place where it's not like we're in New York or la, where other people who are going through the same thing can. We can't. And I don't live close to each other. There's nobody else in Alabama that's in your position. There's nobody else in Delaware that's in my position.

[Kale Lowry]

But also, like, I don't want to hang out with celebrities either, because 98 of them are so just enveloped in themselves that they don't care about other people. You know what I mean? And I get, like, being out for yourself, I get, like, wanting to be successful for yourself and, like, hustling. I. I understand that, but at the same time, like, be a human being.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

You know, and that's real, real, real.

[Matt Matthews]

Hard to find when you're at home and you're not working. Do you ever just, like, look around and you're like, okay, I love my life, but, like, what is it all for if I'm by myself? Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. I mean, at least you got seven kids.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

I mean, I got my horses and my dogs and my chickens, but it's still, like, they don't care about me. I mean, my dogs do, but them chickens are like, you.

[Matt Matthews]

Well, to be fair, you cuss them out every day.

[Kale Lowry]

Well, they deserve it.

[Matt Matthews]

Why do they deserve it?

[Kale Lowry]

Get cussed out, too.

[Matt Matthews]

Not by me. Will you talk about the throuple that you're in? You Will.

[Kale Lowry]

Not the greatest. Not the greatest decision of my life.

[Matt Matthews]

But it was an experience.

[Kale Lowry]

It was an experience. And you were involved in the whole experience.

[Matt Matthews]

I was involved in the holy one, but also the amount of messages and comments that I would get. Asking me to clarify your romantic life, I was like, why are people asking me to do that? If Matt's not answering it, what makes you think I'm to go tell his business?

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

So how did this happen?

[Kale Lowry]

So it happened like, just full transparency. And my poor husband, he's just like. He knows because of what I. Number one, my mouth. I don't have no filter. But number two, my life, you know, like, my life is a show because eventually I take the things that I go through in my life and I put it into a show and I perform it, you know? So, like, if you thought that I went through all this hell with this Dusty, and I wasn't gonna make it into some. Some material, that's why you had me twisted like a pretzel. So. No, my husband has. Has always been. First of all, let me preface with. I always thought that was the weirdest thing.

[Matt Matthews]

What was the weirdest? Like, polyamorous.

[Kale Lowry]

People that were polyamorous. I always thought it was very weird. I thought, like, that's. That's never gonna work. Like, that's. They're just. They're just people that are just like hoes, basically. You know, Like, I genuinely. That was. That was my mentality, my judgment of something that I didn't know about.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

You know, and so I prejudged a situation. I was like, they're just hoes and they just want to. You know, And I didn't think, like, you couldn't love two people at the same time. You know what I mean? I'm like, this is not. That just doesn't work. So Rob is the most non jealous man on the planet.

[Matt Matthews]

I love Rob.

[Kale Lowry]

Like, I mean, he's the best. He is the best. He is my ride or die, my biggest fan, my biggest supporter. Order. You know, like, if I come up with a crazy idea, he's like, well, it. Here we go. You know, like, let's give it a shot.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

And so I met this guy and I was like, it wasn't like a romantic thing at first. It was like, strictly just like, this dude's funny. As I don't have any friends. I don't have anybody that's close to me that I talk to.

[Matt Matthews]

Right?

[Kale Lowry]

Like, you know, my. My three, like, best friends are in different states, you know, so I'M like, I find this guy. He's funny. Like, we. We instantly jived. And so I'm like, okay. And he was kind of cute, but I didn't. It wasn't like a.

[Matt Matthews]

He wasn't that cute, and he wasn't. Oh, ugly ass.

[Kale Lowry]

It was just. It was. It was just an. There was an instant connection there.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah. Like, not sort of like us.

[Kale Lowry]

Yes, absolutely. So it was an instant connection. And so I was like, okay. Well, we just started talking every day, you know, like Snapchat and every day. And. And it was never anything dirty. Like, it was never sexual.

[Matt Matthews]

Right.

[Kale Lowry]

We were not sending Tally Whacker pictures.

[Matt Matthews]

Do y' all do that?

[Kale Lowry]

Who?

[Matt Matthews]

Like, when you and Rob were talking, did y' all send Tally Whacker?

[Kale Lowry]

Not really.

[Matt Matthews]

No. No, because, like, dicks are ugly, obviously. I mean.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, but so is a coach.

[Matt Matthews]

No, they're not.

[Kale Lowry]

Yes. That's a sea monster.

[Matt Matthews]

Mine's nice.

[Kale Lowry]

Oh, I don't do. I don't do roast beef. I can't do.

[Matt Matthews]

I don't have that. Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

People ask me all the time. They're like, did Kale have all seven of her kids?

[Matt Matthews]

Five. Okay, five.

[Kale Lowry]

That's the number one question that I get.

[Matt Matthews]

I'm get laser, though.

[Kale Lowry]

Period. Anyways, you know, we talked about this on the first podcast.

[Matt Matthews]

Well, people forgot.

[Kale Lowry]

We talked about that. You wanted to get your laser.

[Matt Matthews]

I just haven't had the time. Like, I'm trying to schedule a mental breakdown that's coming soon.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

So when I schedule that, After I schedule that, I'll schedule the laser for my. For my cat. So when you and Rob were talking, you didn't send Tally Whacker pics? I mean, like, is that something that y' all don't do?

[Kale Lowry]

It's not. I mean, to me, it's just kind of. I mean, I guess it's just not to me, like, something that I'm just going to, like, just send to anybody.

[Matt Matthews]

So homeboy that y' all had a throuple with didn't send you?

[Kale Lowry]

No. So, like, no dick pics, no sexting, no nothing.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay. Just platonic.

[Kale Lowry]

Straight platonic. Well, not straight. We were gay, but, like, gay, platonic, Gay, platonic.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

Like, that is it. Like, that's. That's it? That's all.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

How long is this podcast? Because they're getting an extended version. Oh, period. Okay. So, I mean, very platonic. Like, not anything like that. Right. And I would FaceTime him almost every day. Like, we would FaceTime. Like, that was his thing. He wanted to FaceTime. Every day. All day. All day, every day. You know, like, that was the thing.

[Matt Matthews]

Yes.

[Kale Lowry]

So when we would FaceTime, Rob would be there a lot of the times. So Rob kind of got to know him, you know, with you. Through me. Yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

Or through you.

[Kale Lowry]

So, you know, and he. He straight up told me, like, after two days, he had come from, like, a bad relationship. And he had told me after two days, he was like, I think I've fallen in love with you. And I'm like, oh, you're like, me too.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, kind of same. But it was very weird. I was like, okay, I am developing feelings for this person because, like, we are talking every day, all day. But what's crazy. And the thing that scared people, I think, was, like, what if this hurts your relationship with Rob?

[Matt Matthews]

Well, and I think I brought that up to you. It was just like, what will this do? How will this change the dynamic between you and your husband? Because you and your husband are married. It's not like you guys are in a relationship.

[Kale Lowry]

Right.

[Matt Matthews]

And then you add somebody to the relationship. It's a marriage. And then adding someone.

[Kale Lowry]

And also. Let me also clarify that it wasn't technically a throuple. Like, he and Rob were never romantic.

[Matt Matthews]

It was.

[Kale Lowry]

It was me and him. Me and Rob. So is. I think. I think they call that a V. I don't know. I'm not very. I'm not. Is that what that's called? Do y' all know what that's called? Yeah. Okay. I mean, it's polyamory, but it's called. It's. It's. I think it's called a V. So like, one person is the. Is the bottom, you know, like the.

[Matt Matthews]

The point.

[Kale Lowry]

The point. And then they have two, you know, significant others. Yeah. Okay, so it was never, like, a. A thing with them. So basically, you know, but Rob really liked him as well. You know, like, not, like, in love with him, but they, like, they enjoyed each other's company.

[Matt Matthews]

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[Kale Lowry]

And so we talked every single day. And at one point, he was like, look, I can't ever be with you. Like, if it ever got to that, I couldn't be with you because I can't share you. Like, I can't.

[Matt Matthews]

Rob said this?

[Kale Lowry]

No, he said this. The boyfriend, the boy, The. The. Yeah, we were just friends at this point.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

So he's like, I can't share you. Like, so this will never work. And I'm like, okay, totally respect that. Like, that's a valid point. And I'm never gonna leave my husband for somebody else. Like, because I adore him. You know? Like, he's been with. We've been together for 11 years.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

So I'm like, that's never gonna happen. So I totally understand where you're coming from. Well, he ghosted me for a while. Remember that? Yeah, I told you about. I mean, you've literally been there since, like, you went through all of this with me. So, like, you know, like, he ghosted me, and I was, like, devastated. I remember he ghosted me when I filmed my very. I filmed. I was filming my special.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

I was filming my first. My first comedy special. And that was, like, when he ghosted me. And I was so heartbroken that, like, he didn't message me to say, hey, congratulations. You're filming yourself. I'm so proud of you. Like, hey, you know, nothing like that.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

So a few weeks go by, he kind of comes back. I let him back in, and, you know, he was like, I'm. I'm so sorry that I did that. I'm never going to do that again. I'm never gonna. I'm not gonna lose you. Like, I'm not gonna be that person again, you know? Like, you and Rob are great. Like, you. You know, like, so whatever. So finally, Rob was like, why don't you just come visit? So he came and visited and spent the whole weekend, and we did not have sex. We didn't do anything. We just spent the weekend together. And it was immediately, when we saw each other, just like. Like, instant connection.

[Matt Matthews]

Like, y' all knew each other.

[Kale Lowry]

Knew each other the whole time. There was never any weirdness. We had the best weekend together. Like, it was absolutely incredible. And from then. From that weekend, we were like, you know what? We're gonna. We're gonna be like, we're gonna do this.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

And he was like, let's do it. And Rob was like, see where it goes.

[Matt Matthews]

Like, he was supportive of it.

[Kale Lowry]

Rob was so supportive. He was like, I don't give a. He was like, I'm very secure in our relationship.

[Matt Matthews]

Like, he knew you were.

[Kale Lowry]

He was like, I know you're never leaving me. I know. Like, and Rob is not jealous. You know, where I'm the crazy. I would never. If the roles were reversed. This ain't never happening. Yeah, you ain't no. You can go a donut, but you ain't nobody else. Like, you got me twisted. You go find a hole somewhere. Like, but you ain't nobody. So from that point on, we were like, okay, we're gonna date. And he came back the next weekend. He came back the next weekend, finally. And he lived in. He lived in Arkansas. When we started talking.

[Matt Matthews]

How far is that from Alabama?

[Kale Lowry]

Six hours drive. Six hours. So he lived in Arkansas. Just came out of a bad relationship. So, like, had a roommate, had a little job, got fired from his job because he was out doing some stupid. I'm sure. And had to move back home to Louisiana with his parents because his parents had a construction company.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

And, like, a. You know, whatever. So he would. He went back home and worked with his dad because he needed a job. So I went to Louisiana, met his family, you know, and they were like, a real. This was a real thing. Yeah, yeah, very real. And his family was like, we love him. We don't even care. Like, at first they were like, well, it's a little. Like, it's not what we would probably have chosen, you know, but they're like. Because it is weird, you know, you're like, this is a person that's married, you know? Like, how the. Does this work?

[Matt Matthews]

Oh, you mean, like, the relationship part of it? Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

But then they were like, oh, my gosh. Like, we love Matt. This is. Matt is the best person you've ever been with. Matt like, grounds you. He wants you to stop drinking energy drinks. He wants you to. He wants you to quit vaping. He wants you to, like, be better for yourself, you know? And so I fell in love with his family. They were just incredible people. They fell in love with me. Like, it was great. And was just back and forth, back and forth every weekend. Finally, he was like, the guy. Our best friend that does In Alabama that does, like, hay. Like, we get our hay from him. He was like, I need. I need help. Like, I can't find anybody. I can't get any help. And I was like, so what if he came and, like, worked for you? And he was like, oh, my God, Would he. And I'm like, yeah. So he came. He's supposed to come for seven days. Like, he was supposed to come, stay for seven days just to help my friend.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

Just for that week and make some money, you know?

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

Because he was like, I need money, friend needs help. He came for seven days, never left for how long? Like, almost six months.

[Matt Matthews]

Was it that long? Yeah, it was that long. For some reason. Look, like running it back in my head, if I thought it was like two months, it was like six months.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, almost six months.

[Matt Matthews]

That's a long time.

[Kale Lowry]

And I never got no dick. Never. Not one time, not once, which is up.

[Matt Matthews]

How did that make you feel?

[Kale Lowry]

Like a raggedy. Like, you know, I'm like, why are you not wanting to have sex with me?

[Matt Matthews]

You know, like, is there something wrong with you? Is there?

[Kale Lowry]

Yes. And in my mind it was. So I automatically knew that this was a red flag before he ever moved in, because he already ghosted me once. Then the second time, I'm in Louisiana visiting him and we went on like this, this, like they go on like these mud rides, right? Like where they go just like southern Louisiana. Yes. Yeah. Like, they all have like these big side by sides and like, mud ride whole thing.

[Matt Matthews]

And that's what they do for funsies.

[Kale Lowry]

Yes. Oh, couldn't be us.

[Matt Matthews]

I mean, we should do it for Patreon.

[Kale Lowry]

We should.

[Matt Matthews]

But, like, on a regular basis.

[Kale Lowry]

Give us their side by side to do that.

[Matt Matthews]

Honestly, I bet listeners of this podcast will offer them up.

[Kale Lowry]

Anybody have a side by side that wants me and Kale to shake our titties in them?

[Matt Matthews]

I'll do it.

[Kale Lowry]

I'll do it. I still want to go skydiving.

[Matt Matthews]

No, I'm down.

[Kale Lowry]

So we go. Okay, so we go to this. To this mud ride, right?

[Matt Matthews]

Okay, so you guys go on the mud. Mud ride. I am going to find somebody with side by sides. I know someone's with side by sides in North Carolina. So you go to North Carolina.

[Kale Lowry]

So I'm going. I'm driving to his house for the weekend and he calls me and he's like, hey, there's this mud ride. All my friends from Arkansas are there. Can we, can, can we go? I'm like, sure, let's go. You know, like, I've never done it before. We get there and I like, my whole life I've suffered with migraines.

[Matt Matthews]

Oh, okay. I actually didn't know that.

[Kale Lowry]

And, well, like, when I do really good about eating and, like, being really clean, I don't get them as much.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

And so I hadn't had one in a min. And we get to this mud ride, and, like, we're going through all day, and my head starts to, like, throb. I'm talking about so bad that I'm about to throw up. And we're, like, on this mud ride all day long. His ex shows up at the mud ride.

[Matt Matthews]

A man.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. And I'm like, this is just so awkward. We're riding around with these people all day long. I have a throbbing headache. And I'm finally like. I'm like, can I lay down? Like, I don't. I really, really don't feel good. And these people, I don't even know, they're like, yeah, you can go lay in our camper. So I, like, go and lay in their camper and put, like, an ice pack on my head. I don't feel good. All these people know who I am, you know? Like, really. He just probably. He just wanted to show off that he was with me, so. And so I, like, lay down in this man's camper, and I go to sleep for, like, several hours. And he goes back out and rides.

[Matt Matthews]

And for several hours.

[Kale Lowry]

And I wake up, it's pitch dark. I'm in these people's camper. I don't know where I am. I don't know what time it is. I look at my phone and I. And I hear nothing from him. And so I text him. I'm like, where are you? And he's like, oh, we're coming back to get you. So he comes back to the camper, and he's up, like, so drunk the.

[Matt Matthews]

Way that I would riot if someone left me.

[Kale Lowry]

Just wait, it gets better. I literally was like, where am I? Where are you? He's like, we're coming back to get you. He comes back, and he's so up, he can barely get into the camper. And I'm so. I'm like. I'm. My head hurts so bad that I'm seeing spots. Like, it is the worst headache I've ever had. And mind you, we're in his friend's truck because. And his friend, side by side, because he didn't have one. Okay? And he's like, yeah, loser. Yeah. And so he's like. I said, I don't feel good. I have got to go home and go to bed. Which he lives with his parents. So I'm like, okay, I gotta go home. I gotta go to bed. He's like, okay, well, do you care if I stay? So I leave and get in this man's truck who. I don't even Know who this man is? And I drive back to his parents house.

[Matt Matthews]

You drive the friend's truck to his parents and this is the first time you met his parents?

[Kale Lowry]

No, no. This is like the second or third weekend that I've stayed with them.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay. But still.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. Yeah. So I drive back home to their house and he stays there.

[Matt Matthews]

No.

[Kale Lowry]

With his ex and all rounds for divorce. And so that was. That should have been my first red flag, you know?

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

And so I go home and his family is just livid. They're like, we are so sorry. I can't believe he did this.

[Matt Matthews]

Like, well, it's an embarrassment to them at that point. Because your son doesn't have his life together.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. He's.

[Matt Matthews]

Doesn't have his own truck. No.

[Kale Lowry]

I mean.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay. Doesn't have a side by side leaving you to fend for yourself. He left you in somebody's camper.

[Kale Lowry]

But I mean, that's what. That's. So that's what happened. So I went to bed and like, I texted him and I was like, I hope this was worth it for you. I'm done.

[Matt Matthews]

You said that?

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. And I went to sleep. So the next morning I get up to drive home and his. His mom's like, please stay and talk to him. Please stay and talk to him. Just at least talk to him. I was like, fine. You know, I'm a grown up, you know, so like, I can do that. You know? So they call and they're like, do you want to. You, you need to get home. Like, you need to come talk to him. So he comes home and like we sit at his house and I'm like, what do you want to do? Like, what do you want me to do?

[Matt Matthews]

How can he expect you to.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, he was mad at me because he thought I was faking it. The whole time. He thought I was faking a headache because I didn't want to hang out with his friends. Make that make sense.

[Matt Matthews]

Even if you didn't have a headache, the whole situation is.

[Kale Lowry]

The whole. Yeah, I mean, the whole situation.

[Matt Matthews]

The hole wasn't the hole, but the situation was.

[Kale Lowry]

But the situation was.

[Matt Matthews]

It was.

[Kale Lowry]

So as we're sitting there, I'm like, what do you want me to do? Do you want me to leave? Do you want me to stay? What would you like to see happen here? And he just looked at the ground and he's like, all I know is I. I do love you and care about you. That's all he could say. I'm like, so that's your way of saying you want me to leave because.

[Matt Matthews]

Why wouldn't you just say, I want you to stay. I love you, I want you to stay.

[Kale Lowry]

Yes, let's fix this. I'm sorry. He's like, all I can say is I do love you and I do care about you. So I left. I drove all the way home. I remember.

[Matt Matthews]

I feel like you called me on the way.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, I called you on the way home.

[Matt Matthews]

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[Kale Lowry]

He called me and he crying. I'm so sorry. I up. That was the stupidest thing I've ever done. Like I'll never do that to you again. I'm so sorry. Can I please. I want to drive six hours just to hug you and kiss you. Like just to tell you I'm sorry. Like blah blah blah blah. And I was like, okay, what was.

[Matt Matthews]

Rob's involvement up until this point?

[Kale Lowry]

Oh, Rob was. Was pissed.

[Matt Matthews]

So you told him?

[Kale Lowry]

Of course. Like I tell Rob everything He knew the whole thing. He was like, you've got to be kidding. He's like, I'm gonna beat his ass. You know, Like. And so he caught. He was like, I literally. I'm gonna. I'm about to get in my car, and I'm about to drive six hours to Alabama so that I can hug you and kiss you and apologize to your face.

[Matt Matthews]

So did he?

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. And he stayed.

[Matt Matthews]

That's. I don't understand people, especially just immature people in relationships like that. Like, you just did all that. That to turn around and have to bend over backwards to go make it right. You have to drive six hours. You got to take off.

[Kale Lowry]

Well, you know how many times that we've gone through this?

[Matt Matthews]

So this is now the second or third time, second or third time that.

[Kale Lowry]

He'S done some like this. He moves in. Okay. He moves in after maybe a month, and it gets so much better after a month and a half or, like, you know, whatever of us being together. Like, things are great. And he's telling me this whole time, I don't want to have sex with you because I used to be such a hoe. And I promised myself the next person that I fall in love with, I would not sleep with them for, like, X amount of time because I wanted to make sure that the next person that I sleep with is the person that I spend the rest of my life with. And I respected that because I believed him. The problem was he's a narcissistic liar, So I believed him. Right? So then he lives with me. Then it's just posting about me on the Internet at all the time.

[Matt Matthews]

All the time.

[Kale Lowry]

All the time. All the time. All the time. First weekend he stayed with me, as soon as he left, he posts a video of me on Tick Tock talking about, this man just doesn't realize how in love with him I am. Already it's been a weekend.

[Matt Matthews]

I remember that Tick Tock, it went.

[Kale Lowry]

Viral, and people were like, where's Matt's husband?

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It did. I mean, it had views.

[Kale Lowry]

It had views.

[Matt Matthews]

So do you feel like he used you?

[Kale Lowry]

Yes. 100 stuff. So he stayed there. We're together. We're still not having sex. We're still not doing anything. It's basically like, he was just our best friend that lived with us.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

Like, him and Rob got along great. He.

[Matt Matthews]

Did y' all kiss?

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, we would kiss, but, like, that was it. We, like, he helped around the house. He worked at. He worked, you know, on the Hayfield, like, with Our best friend. He did. That's. That was his full time job. He did Incred. They loved him. He did incredible things. Were really good.

[Matt Matthews]

Good.

[Kale Lowry]

Then come around October, he broke up with me and was like, but here's where it gets good. He's like, I love you. I'm in love with you.

[Matt Matthews]

Because they're different.

[Kale Lowry]

Yep, they are different. He's like, I am in love with you. You're the best thing that's ever happened to me. But I cannot share you, and I can't do this. Like, I love you. I love Rob. Y' all are both so great. I never want to lose y' all in my life.

[Matt Matthews]

Life.

[Kale Lowry]

Because y' all are so pivotal to me in my life. And you've done so much for me. And. And to me, I was like, I cannot fault you for that.

[Matt Matthews]

Right.

[Kale Lowry]

Like, I love you too, but if this is not something that you can do because you know in your heart that you can't share me with another person, I have to respect that. And I did. And I was like, look, I respect that and I get it. I understand. If you can't share me, I cannot fault you for that.

[Matt Matthews]

Right, Right.

[Kale Lowry]

And I was like, that's a real valid reason. So what can I say? So he was like, you know, what do you want me. He was like, I don't want to leave. I don't want to leave Alabama. I don't want to leave you. I don't want to leave Rob. I don't want to lose y'. All. He was like, I just can't be with you and share you. So I was like, we're building our house at this time. And I'm like, well, we're going to be moving in like two months anyways, so why don't you stay here? You know, just like, nothing's changed. Cuz we're not anyways, you know, so, like, really nothing changed like that? Like, nothing changed at all. So I was like, why don't you just stay here, keep your job, you know, help our friends that need help, you know, like, keep your job. You make really good money. Everything is. Nothing changed here, you know, so just stay.

[Matt Matthews]

Just stay.

[Kale Lowry]

And then when we move, you can rent my house. You can rent this house that we have because we wanted to keep it as a rental anyways. Yeah, we'll move to our new house. You stay here, we'll be best friends.

[Matt Matthews]

And it's like, what, like an hour?

[Kale Lowry]

Hour? Yeah. And I was like, we'll be best friends. And I genuinely thought that we could be best friends because we weren't anyways, right? So we really were just best friends.

[Matt Matthews]

Right, Right, Right, right, right.

[Kale Lowry]

And so this is October. November rolls around. He's like, I love you. I'm in love with you. I love Rob. I've realized, I think it was because I drank so much that I felt those feelings because I was so up, I drank so much. So for the month of November, I want to be sober. I don't want to drink, I don't want to vape, I don't want to smoke. I don't want to do anything. The month of November, I want to focus on my health. I want to focus on the things that I need to do for myself. And I'm so in love with you. And I'm so happy. It's so incredible to be loved by two people. You know, my family loves y'. All. Like, everything is great. So the whole month of November, it was amazing. He didn't drink and we weren't. We, like, obviously we weren't together. But the thing was, okay, December 1st.

[Matt Matthews]

You'Re gonna be together.

[Kale Lowry]

We're gonna be together. Because the nova. The whole month of November is your time to focus on you and get your together fair. And I was like, you deserve that for yourself. Like, because he drank a lot. And I was like, you deserve that for yourself. So he didn't drink.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

He was losing weight. He was like, mentally in a really good place. So I'm thinking, like, oh my God, this is it.

[Matt Matthews]

Like, this is like you saw changes.

[Kale Lowry]

And I was like, this is actually, like, really going to work. So, like, December 1st is gonna happen and we're going to be together and like, it's our fresh start.

[Matt Matthews]

Yes.

[Kale Lowry]

His family came and stayed with us at Thanksgiving. Incredible.

[Matt Matthews]

At the new house or the.

[Kale Lowry]

At our old house. We hadn't moved yet. His mom and dad came and stayed with us. It was amazing. Like, they loved Rob, they loved me, they got us Christmas gifts. Like we cooked Thanksgiving dinner at the house. I mean, it was really amazing.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

This was Thanksgiving, December 1st. And he's telling like all his friends December 1st is gonna come. We're gonna be together. I'm gonna. I'm gonna the out of him. Like all these things. Right. Cuz it's been almost six months. We hadn't had sex.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

You know, so like the sexual tension was building strong.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah, I'm sure.

[Kale Lowry]

So December 1st rolls around. He did. He left for work, didn't kiss me. Cuz he wouldn't even kiss me in November would not kiss me, would not do nothing.

[Matt Matthews]

I need to know the psychology behind all of the things that he's saying.

[Kale Lowry]

He's narcissist, right? I mean, what do y' all think about this?

[Matt Matthews]

Well, we just had a psychologist on yesterday. He's de. Definitely dismissive attachment style.

[Kale Lowry]

Like, boom.

[Matt Matthews]

He cannot handle his own emotions, so he can't even begin to handle you. He can't even figure his own out. He has no, like, emotional, like, intelligence capacity at all. But I also just, like, don't understand, like. Well, actually I do, because I did it to somebody where I was like, oh, on this date, we'll be together. Oh, this is why we can't be together right now. So when this happens, I'll be with you.

[Kale Lowry]

But see, like, in my mind, the first time that he broke up with me, me, it was so. It was, I can't share you.

[Matt Matthews]

Right? And then he brought it.

[Kale Lowry]

That was such a real. That was such a real valid thing that I couldn't fault him or be mad at him at all for that, right, bro? I love you. I care about you. Let's, like, let's just. Let's that up. Like, let's just be friends.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

Because we have a great friendship. And so. But then when he rolled back to, okay, well, now that I've been sober all this time, I've realized that was because I was drinking so much. I am in love with you, and I am happy. And the whole three, like, the three of us doesn't scare me anymore. Like, that doesn't bother me. Things were told totally fine. And then December 1st came come around.

[Matt Matthews]

He didn't acknowledge.

[Kale Lowry]

So he left the house that morning for work. Didn't kiss me, didn't say anything, left for work. And I was immediately just hurt. Hurt. Because I'm like, December 1st, he's about to wake up, and he's like, well, number one. Also, we wouldn't share a bed. The entire time that all this was happening. I would sleep with him. I'm not cuddle. Like, we're not cuddling nothing. December 1st happens, and he's like. Like, hey, just sleep with me tomorrow. I just want to sprawl out tonight.

[Matt Matthews]

The fact that he was in Yalls house, literally, and acting like that, too.

[Kale Lowry]

And how many times did he FaceTime you telling you how in love with me he was?

[Matt Matthews]

Oh, he FaceTimed me all the time. Oh, I love Matt so much. Like, I love him. Yeah, please shut the up.

[Kale Lowry]

So December 1st, he's like, he decides you Know what? I can't do this. And that's when I was like, then you got to get the out. Cuz I'm done at this point. Yeah, now you, now you have you. I gave you the shot. I gave you the, the benefit of doubt the first time.

[Matt Matthews]

Time.

[Kale Lowry]

Then it was, now it's back to loving me again. And it was. I believed you because you got sober. And now we're doing this again. I'm like, get the out. Like, you can't stay here anymore. This is not a halfway house. You know, not only that, not only that, but I spent three grand to fix his teeth with his seven cavities. Oh, said what? I said, oh broke down. And I just got to the point where I was just pissed off.

[Matt Matthews]

Fair.

[Kale Lowry]

So he left, cried to his friends, you know, like about this whole thing. But the thing that pissed me off was he left and told everybody. I just never loved Matt. I was just never in love with him. It just never was there for me. I was never sexually attracted to him. Like, it just wasn't there for me. I wanted it to be, but it wasn't.

[Matt Matthews]

But then telling you complete something completely, which is so funny.

[Kale Lowry]

So I was finally like, you know what? I'm. I can't, like, I don't feel bad anymore. I. I love you, but I'm don't. You got to get the out my house. We're done doing this. Like what you move back to. He quit his job at the Hay, you know, the Hay Company, moved back to Louisiana, and within a month he was in a relationship, living with somebody else.

[Matt Matthews]

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[Kale Lowry]

Say that a narcissist falls in love with the next person they can live with.

[Matt Matthews]

I hate that for you.

[Kale Lowry]

It was a lesson learned.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay, so with that being said, it.

[Kale Lowry]

Made me fall way more in love with my husband.

[Matt Matthews]

That's what I was about to ask you is how do you feel about Rob now?

[Kale Lowry]

Like, it made me so much more.

[Matt Matthews]

Obsessed with my husband because you're like, I have somebody by my side that would never even think twice about love loving me or being with me or kissing me.

[Kale Lowry]

11 years and not one time in 11. Now, don't get it twisted. He will piss me the off as they do. Like, we will fight, we will cuss each other out. He will make me so mad, I will want to choke slam him. But in 11 years, not one time have I ever felt like he didn't love me.

[Matt Matthews]

Like, you never questioned.

[Kale Lowry]

Never questioned it. I've never questioned that he had Doesn't Love love me? Where the whole entire time that I was with this guy, you questioned your word? I questioned my worth. I questioned if he loved me. I, like, wanted to make him so happy that, like, I would put my career on the back burner, you know, Like, I would do all, like, all these stupid things.

[Matt Matthews]

Would you ever do a throuple again? And I only ask that because I do feel like loved can multiply.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

In the right. Under the right circumstances.

[Kale Lowry]

That was the thing was, like, I realized because was madly in love with my husband and I was in love with him.

[Matt Matthews]

So you believe you could.

[Kale Lowry]

I believe that you can love two people. Like, I think that's a thing. Like, it's not impossible. Is it difficult? Yes. And that's what I tell people all the time. Like, it didn't not work because there were three of us.

[Matt Matthews]

Right.

[Kale Lowry]

It didn't work because he was a narcissist that did not know what the he wanted for himself. You know? Like, it didn't work because they were three, and that's. Oh, I told y' all it wasn't going to work. No, that's not why it didn't work.

[Matt Matthews]

No, because Rob was.

[Kale Lowry]

Rob was great the whole time.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

We didn't fight over it. We never argued over it. Rob was like, okay, hey, me and you're gonna go on a date tonight. Tomorrow, you and him will go on.

[Matt Matthews]

A date and fed.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. I mean, and it has to be like. It has to be a certain type of person, you know, I mean, I wasn't getting by him, but.

[Matt Matthews]

Right, you were by Rob.

[Kale Lowry]

I mean, thankfully, Rob was still laying it down, but, like, you know, but he was not. She's like, what the.

[Matt Matthews]

Everybody's gay here except for the guys over there.

[Kale Lowry]

It was definitely a weird, weird time in my life. Yeah, it was a hard time in my life. I mean, you know how difficult that was for me. Like, I. That was very mentally. I remember I went. I did a TV show. It was during all of this. And I just remember doing that show and just being in such a up place mentally. Not Only did I. I didn't enjoy this doing the show. But, like, the whole time I'm thinking, like, I can't even enjoy this because that's all I'm thinking about. It just consumes you is my. What's happening back home.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

You know?

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

And so. And now I look back at that and I'm like, damn. To think that I almost let a man up my bag. And then I went and performed two. Two sold out shows and made over six figures in his hometown after we broke.

[Matt Matthews]

As you should. As you should. And his parents went to the show.

[Kale Lowry]

And his parents went to the show.

[Matt Matthews]

Imagine, he just shows up and like, begged for you back. What would you do?

[Kale Lowry]

You.

[Matt Matthews]

I did have to unfriend him, though, on Facebook, because I was. He was like. At first I just, like, kept him for a minute just to make sure that he wasn't posting. No. About you. And then at some point, I was like, I gotta get rid of him. Like, I can't.

[Kale Lowry]

I think I texted you one day. I was like, delete him. Yeah, I'm done. Because, like, he only. He wanted to meet you so bad. He was obsessed with. He was obsessed with the Matt and Kale saga, like, which everybody is. I mean, but I mean, like, he was. And it was all a fame thing. He just wanted the clout.

[Matt Matthews]

What a weirdo.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

I don't like him.

[Kale Lowry]

I don't like.

[Matt Matthews]

So if you're listening to this, I don't with you.

[Kale Lowry]

We don't with you. And you had it made in the shade.

[Matt Matthews]

Wait, so did you end up selling that house then?

[Kale Lowry]

No, I rented it. Oh, good, good, good.

[Matt Matthews]

That's good. Residual income, baby. How's your new house? That's the bigger question. I know. And you have a sauna.

[Kale Lowry]

I have a sauna. A gym that I don't use.

[Matt Matthews]

No, you sent me a picture in the gym.

[Kale Lowry]

I've used it like, a few times. Times.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah. So you're basically 20 pounds lighter now.

[Kale Lowry]

I mean, skinny as a needle.

[Matt Matthews]

Period, period.

[Kale Lowry]

£173.

[Matt Matthews]

What's our next activity? So we went crabbing.

[Kale Lowry]

We went crab.

[Matt Matthews]

I want to go barrel racing. I want to get on the back of a horse and go barrel racing. I'll wear a helmet.

[Kale Lowry]

A helmet.

[Matt Matthews]

Shoulder pads, knee pads. I'll wear my son's football stuff and I'll get on the horse and just, please, can I.

[Kale Lowry]

Yes, yes.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay.

[Kale Lowry]

Yes. If you show up and you put all that on, I'm putting you on a barrel horse.

[Matt Matthews]

No, I need to get On I want. How do you hold on?

[Kale Lowry]

Please, Kale. I'm dead.

[Matt Matthews]

No, no, I'm dead.

[Kale Lowry]

Do you know that will break the Internet?

[Matt Matthews]

I'll do it. I'll do it. Just say I won't and we'll make money.

[Kale Lowry]

You have to put on the whole like a helmet.

[Matt Matthews]

I'll put on my son's football uniform, his shoulder pads, his leg pads and I'm.

[Kale Lowry]

How do you hold on?

[Matt Matthews]

Like, how do you hold on?

[Kale Lowry]

You're not going to have to worry about falling, holding on because you're falling off immediate as it takes off.

[Matt Matthews]

Does it hurt real bad? Did you fall off a horse before.

[Kale Lowry]

I fall off a horse, I've been riding for a long time. So like you got to learn to ride.

[Matt Matthews]

I know how to ride. While it's like.

[Kale Lowry]

No, you don't.

[Matt Matthews]

Trotting.

[Kale Lowry]

No. You rode those poor skeleton of horses at the beach that were not taken care of and were half dead.

[Matt Matthews]

You know what? You don't have to call me out like that.

[Kale Lowry]

You have not ridden Max, professional 24.

[Matt Matthews]

Year old horse that I got. Exactly 24. 24 years old.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. He's half dead.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

And you got on him.

[Matt Matthews]

I did, but I want to get on a barrel horse.

[Kale Lowry]

Okay, I'm putting you on Luna, my black horse.

[Matt Matthews]

Will she take off?

[Kale Lowry]

Yes.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay, so when are we doing this?

[Kale Lowry]

I'm ready. I, I, I start back tour in September, so you better come on.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay, let's talk about tour for a second. So you had a sold out tour in 2024 and 2025. Do you have an arena show coming up first?

[Kale Lowry]

Arena. Arena.

[Matt Matthews]

First arena show in December.

[Kale Lowry]

December.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay, what else? I feel like there was something in.

[Kale Lowry]

September I'm playing two sold out shows at the Ryman and filming my second special.

[Matt Matthews]

And then you also had music come out since the last time I had you on the podcast.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, we're. I forgot about that.

[Matt Matthews]

How do you forget about this?

[Kale Lowry]

Released my first two singles earlier this year when we went to the, we went to the ACM Awards together which got a money that just really rocked people's worlds. They were just very upset about that.

[Matt Matthews]

Why were they so upset about that? I didn't.

[Kale Lowry]

I don't know why people hate. Hate that we're friends. Like they love to hate that we're friends.

[Matt Matthews]

They love to hate or they hate to love?

[Kale Lowry]

Both. Like, I mean it kills me because like I the comment because here's my thing. I'm a ride or die friend. Like I am. I am a loyal friend and do I think that you. Here's your social media clip. Okay.

[Matt Matthews]

I don't know what the you're about to say.

[Kale Lowry]

Do I think that you have made incredible decisions in your life?

[Matt Matthews]

No.

[Kale Lowry]

Do I think that you have made dumb mistakes? Yes. Do I judge you for some of your. Absolutely. Because that's just who we are. Have I made mistakes? Yes. But guess what? If we're all on TV at 16 years old, none of us were great people at 16 years old, okay? So if I was on 16, if I was on TV at 16 years old, people probably wouldn't like me either. But it's called great growth. It's called we all grow and we all become better people as we. As we get older. You were just on TV with yours at 16 years old.

[Matt Matthews]

I think people's biggest gripe with me is that I made the same mistake over and over and over. And.

[Kale Lowry]

Well, I mean, you're a little slow, so it takes you a little bit of time to figure it out. But you did figure it out, you know? And here's the thing that pisses me off when people are like.

[Matt Matthews]

Well, you're a little.

[Kale Lowry]

I mean, she is a little bit. Like, it pisses. It pisses me off when people are like, I used to be such a big fan of Matt, but I don't like him anymore because he's friends with Kale. And I'm like, all you know of her is what you've seen on TV when she was 16 years old. That is all you know. All you know is she's got four baby daddies and seven kids. That's all you know. But who the cares how many kids that somebody's got? You're taking care of your kids, so why does it matter how many kids had. It's nobody's business. And what I tell everybody at the end of the day, Kale has made dumb decisions. I have made dumb decisions. We've all made dumb decisions.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

Our dumb decisions just weren't aired on national television at 16 years old. And we've all grown up since then. And no matter what Kale has done in her life, in the years that I have been friends with Kale, she has been nothing but a good friend to me.

[Matt Matthews]

Me.

[Kale Lowry]

And a supportive friend to me and cared about me and loved me and been a good friend to me. So whatever Kale has done, I don't give a about that, because that's not.

[Matt Matthews]

How I to you.

[Kale Lowry]

That's not what you are to me.

[Matt Matthews]

Right?

[Kale Lowry]

And, like, unless you're willing to get to know someone and take time to know a person and not just what you've seen of them. You can't judge somebody what you've seen from 16 years ago.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah, okay. Are you tired of waking up and having a hangover worrying about what happened last night? Well, here's the solution. Willies. And I say that because I have it. I have two bottles of Willies sitting out on my counter right now and I'm obsessed. And if you're somebody that likes to drink but you don't like the effects of a hangover like me, I don't want to drink. I don't want the hangover. Willies is the perfect solution. Willies is a premium THC infused social tonic crafted by the legendary Willie Nelson. And it's inspired by Willie's way of living where peace flows freely in Hangovers are a thing of the past. It's a low calorie, low sugar alcohol alternative that actually works and it delivers fast acting, euphoric social buzz without the regrets of alcohol. Right. I would talk about that all the time on the podcast is like I'm too old to be feeling hungover. Not that I would drink anyway, but like I don't have a day to give after a night of drinking. So this is a great alternative. Willies is not that feared edible that you ate too much of in college. Each bottle of Willies is third party lab testing for accurate dosage so you can trust and customize your experience. Willie's unique blend of thc, cbd, CBG and L Theanine delivers a feeling of calm, clarity, euphoria and relaxation. One shot of Willies helps you relax, unwind and de stress. Perfect for taking the edge off at the end of a long day. Or maybe you need to recharge your social battery with friends. And Willie's offers the kind of feeling that makes good company even better. Willie sold out three times in the first six months with over 50,000 happy customers and they just received restocked. Willie ships directly to your doorstep in 40/states and you can order now at drink willys.com and use code famous for 20 off your first order plus free shipping on orders over $95. And enjoy life in the high country. So what do you have to say to people who think that about you? Like oh, you're, you're this or you're that. Do you give a?

[Kale Lowry]

I don't give a no. Because if you know me and you genuinely know who I am as a real human being, not a person on the Internet, not A comedian, not a performer. You know that I'm a good ass human being. That I love people. Not really. I love animals. I love the people that I love.

[Matt Matthews]

Right, right.

[Kale Lowry]

You know what I mean? I'm loyal, I'm supportive, and I'm a ride or die. You know what I mean? So the people that don't like me because of what they said, they can suck my whole.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

I don't give a. The whole thing. I don't give a. I appreciate that, though.

[Matt Matthews]

Like, I. I respect it because you don't find a lot of people that are. That authentic, I guess is the right word.

[Kale Lowry]

And don't get it twisted. I will cuss you, slap the out. But I'll be damn if somebody else is going to.

[Matt Matthews]

You're like, kill. You have four baby daddies.

[Kale Lowry]

Yes. Yeah, I will. I will be the first to tell you. Like hell. That wasn't smart.

[Matt Matthews]

I don't think you're that nice about it, though.

[Kale Lowry]

I'm not nice about it. I will. I would call you a dumb. I'm like, are you dumb? Yeah, yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

It's fine. It's fine.

[Kale Lowry]

I'll be damn if somebody else does.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah. Nobody else can say it.

[Kale Lowry]

No. I'll a up.

[Matt Matthews]

So what else is coming? New music. Your arena. Your arena date.

[Kale Lowry]

Album comes out, tour comes out.

[Matt Matthews]

All at the end of this year.

[Kale Lowry]

All at the end of this year.

[Matt Matthews]

So 2025 is a big year for you.

[Kale Lowry]

I don't know.

[Matt Matthews]

You're like, we'll see what the next day brings.

[Kale Lowry]

Me and Kayla are gonna go. Go ride side by side, side by.

[Matt Matthews]

Sides, Barrel racing and skydiving.

[Kale Lowry]

Skydiving. When I start back on tour, there's no time. I have zero. I'm doing. I'm gonna be doing six shows a weekend in the fall.

[Matt Matthews]

Oh, two Friday.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. Six shows a weekend. And then I'll be home for two days.

[Matt Matthews]

Wait, can we talk about that for a second? Because I do feel like we relate on that level too. Is like the burnout of, like, always having to be able to turn it on for the shows and like, going on tour and then coming home and you're like, I don't feel like I have a life without working.

[Kale Lowry]

Yes. I don't feel like I have a. I don't feel like I have. I don't have a life.

[Matt Matthews]

I don't feel like I have worth. Without working.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

So like, recently went through something. I don't want to call it traumatizing, child, challenging. And the girls were like, you can't work Today, because it's coming through. Like, we can see it. Right. And I'm like, but if I don't work, I don't know what my. What purpose do I serve?

[Kale Lowry]

Right.

[Matt Matthews]

What good am I to literally anyone if I don't work? And I feel like that's a unique. Well, maybe not. I feel like that could happen in traditional jobs too. Right. Like, if we're not working, who are we?

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. I've been off for two months, and I literally said I was like, what is my life if I'm not performing?

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah. That's how I feel. My business and how I make money is my personal life.

[Kale Lowry]

Correct.

[Matt Matthews]

So it feels like I live like a double life, sort of. And I know that you feel the same way. So it's like, I don't. And I don't know anyone else that struggles with that the same way I do.

[Kale Lowry]

And I, you know, like, that is why I had that. I mean, I did, for a split second, have that thought of, like, okay, do I need a key kid? You know, because, like, what do I'm. What am I living for if, like, all I do is work? And then I come home and I'm just like, here. Here I am.

[Matt Matthews]

I told Matt when we went to the CMAs that I would carry his child.

[Kale Lowry]

ACMS.

[Matt Matthews]

ACMS. Thank you.

[Kale Lowry]

If I ever decided to have a baby, that Kell would be my surrogate.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah. The gift of life.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. Let me tell you something. Do you know the we would get for that? We'd give it to. We'd get a TV show. That's for sure.

[Matt Matthews]

Oh, we would absolutely get a TV show.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

Without a doubt.

[Kale Lowry]

The TV show would happen for sure.

[Matt Matthews]

You think we could have, like, twins? And one could be mine and one could be yours?

[Kale Lowry]

You don't need no more.

[Matt Matthews]

Say Kale.

[Kale Lowry]

Kale.

[Matt Matthews]

Kale.

[Kale Lowry]

Kale.

[Matt Matthews]

Kale.

[Kale Lowry]

Shut up.

[Matt Matthews]

Music.

[Kale Lowry]

A second book.

[Matt Matthews]

A second book. Okay, so that's what I was gonna ask, and then.

[Kale Lowry]

No, it wasn't.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

You didn't even know about it.

[Matt Matthews]

I was gonna say, what other projects?

[Kale Lowry]

You know, just over here getting skinny for the people. Maybe only fans.

[Matt Matthews]

You're not getting on only fans. What about Wiki Feet Picks?

[Kale Lowry]

Not.

[Matt Matthews]

Would you sell Feet picks?

[Kale Lowry]

I mean, for the right price, hell yeah. I'll get a pedicure.

[Matt Matthews]

Get the one with the fish that.

[Kale Lowry]

You don't like people touching my feet.

[Matt Matthews]

You don't? No, I put my feet everywhere.

[Kale Lowry]

I know.

[Matt Matthews]

I, like, put my feet up on the dash in the car.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. Cuz you're Nasty. Ain't got no home training and don't.

[Matt Matthews]

My dad's dying.

[Kale Lowry]

Oh. How do we feel about that?

[Matt Matthews]

Conflicted. I met him once.

[Kale Lowry]

I know.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah. So your mom passed away, right?

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, both of them. My bio mom and the woman that adopted me.

[Matt Matthews]

With your bio mom, did you have conflicting feelings surrounding her death?

[Kale Lowry]

Well, I was 14.

[Matt Matthews]

Oh, you were young.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah, I was 14 when she died. She was an addict. She was an alcoholic, so. But at 14, it was just like, damn, you know, dead. Like, you know, it means when. When you spend your life, like, popping prescription drugs that are not prescribed to you and drinking a bunch of alcohol, like, what do you think's gonna happen?

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

So there wasn't really conflicting feelings. I missed her, and I was devastated, you know, because I was 14 years old.

[Matt Matthews]

Right.

[Kale Lowry]

And I mean, now. I mean, I still. I still think about her every day. I still. And it's been 15. No, 2000. She died in 2007.

[Matt Matthews]

Oh, wow.

[Kale Lowry]

Almost 14. I'm 32 now, so it's been a long time.

[Matt Matthews]

I just. I have conflicting feelings about it. And I was just curious because I know that you have a parent that was. That passed away.

[Kale Lowry]

I mean, when they did. They did.

[Matt Matthews]

Yeah.

[Kale Lowry]

You know, so what do you. What? I mean, what is there?

[Matt Matthews]

I'm gonna go on a comedy tour because I'm gonna be really funny once he dies. That's the plan. So I'll be joining you on tour making dead dad jokes. Can I be your opener?

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay. Who is Eunice gonna be your opener again? I'll be the second opener.

[Kale Lowry]

Okay.

[Matt Matthews]

And I'll just do the dark humor.

[Kale Lowry]

And you'll do dad jokes.

[Matt Matthews]

Yep.

[Kale Lowry]

Okay. Can you run the jokes by me first?

[Matt Matthews]

I thought you were gonna write them for me.

[Kale Lowry]

Oh, okay.

[Matt Matthews]

No, yeah. Okay, perfect.

[Kale Lowry]

Well, we know that you're not gonna come sing because your ass is tone deaf.

[Matt Matthews]

I'm not singing ever, in front of anyone ever. Okay. Where can people find you on social media? Where can people buy comedy show tickets? And where can people stream your music?

[Kale Lowry]

Matt matthews.com. they can stream music on all stream streaming sites.

[Matt Matthews]

We also have a candle collab coming out.

[Kale Lowry]

I forgot about that. We do have a candle collab coming out. Yes. Do you know what you're going to call it?

[Matt Matthews]

Custody Battles and vanilla.

[Kale Lowry]

Wait, no. It was Peace, Love and Custody Battles.

[Matt Matthews]

Right, right, right. Peace, Love and Custody Battles is my second.

[Kale Lowry]

Don't you love that name?

[Matt Matthews]

Baby Daddy Burnout.

[Kale Lowry]

Yeah. Baby Daddy Burnout was another one.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay, so Matt matthews.com stream his music on Spotify. Buy tickets on matt matthews.com. there's merch, there's bags, there's candles, there's.

[Kale Lowry]

That's all of it.

[Matt Matthews]

Okay. And go follow him at Matt Matthews.

[Kale Lowry]

Yep.

[Matt Matthews]

On social media.

[Kale Lowry]

Love you. Bye.

[Matt Matthews]

See Sam Foreign.

[Kale Lowry]

CBS hits are streaming free on Pluto tv. I'm coming in. For this month only you can watch full seasons of the CBS shows you love, from the courtroom drama of Matlock to the heroics of Fire Country. Go back to where it all began in NCIS Origins, or watch the hilarious hauntings of ghosts. All for free. Full seasons of the CBS shows you love this month only on Pluto tv. Stream now. Pay never. Hi, I'm Adam Rippon, and this is Intrusive Thoughts, the podcast where I finally say the stuff out loud that's been living rent free in my head for years. From dumb decisions to awkward moments I probably should have kept to myself. Nothing's off limits. Yes, I'm talking about the time I lost my phone mid flight and still haven't truly emotionally recovered from that. There might be too many sound effects. I've been told to chill. Will I? Unclear. But if you've ever laid awake at night cringing at something you said five years ago, congratulations. You found your people. Intrusive Thoughts with Adam Rippon is available now wherever you get your podcasts.