“Are You On or Off the Bus?” with Liz Hutson of EGH, LLC 11-20-25

Summary

Podcast Summary: “Are You On or Off the Bus?” with Liz Hutson (Becker Business with Scott Becker)

Date: November 20, 2025
Guests: Liz Hutson, Founder & Principal Consultant at EGH, LLC
Host: Scott Becker

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Episode Overview

This episode of the Becker Business podcast features a lively and thoughtful discussion between Scott Becker and Liz Hutson on a central leadership challenge: recognizing when team members are no longer aligned with the mission (“off the bus”), how to address persistent misalignment, and the broader impacts on team morale and business outcomes. Liz shares her experience and strategies for handling difficult team dynamics, making tough separation decisions, and communicating change effectively.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The “On or Off the Bus” Dilemma ([00:00]–[01:40])

• Liz Hutson introduces the challenge: Every leader eventually faces someone on their team who simply won't “get on the bus” despite efforts for team alignment.
  • Quote: “You still have one person who just refuses to get on board...not just passively not on board, they may be actively not on board... quietly under-delivering to the detriment of the team.” — Liz Hutson [00:47]

2. Final Attempt at Alignment: One-on-One Honest Conversations ([01:52]–[02:57])

• Liz’s approach:
  • Before making any final decisions, initiate an honest, one-on-one conversation with the team member.
  • Seek to understand the root of their misalignment—sometimes people need to be heard, need clarity, or have valuable suggestions.
  • Be transparent that continued misalignment is harming morale and team progress.
  • Quote: “Have a one-on-one conversation, a real one with them, asking what's driving this misalignment. Is there something we’ve missed?...Sometimes they need to feel heard.” — Liz Hutson [01:58]
  • Emphasis: This conversation is the “last stop” before potentially parting ways.

3. Knowing When to “Cut the Cord” ([02:57]–[04:31])

• Triggers for ending the relationship:
  • If after honest efforts, the misalignment persists, it’s time for firm action—letting the person “hop off the bus.”
  • Becker asks about the pain of this step; Liz acknowledges the discomfort but highlights the necessity.
  • Quote: “If you've made every effort to align...and the misalignment is still there, keeping them in that role certainly does more long-term damage than letting them go or moving them to a different project.” — Liz Hutson [04:06]
  • Perspective: Leaders must balance the discomfort of losing knowledge and a “set of hands” against the greater damage of retaining misaligned members.

4. The Lift of Letting Go—Addition by Subtraction ([04:31]–[06:26])

• Relief after difficult decisions:
  • Both agree that letting go brings relief, even if there’s initial guilt; the team dynamic improves.
  • Prolonging action isn’t fair to the person or the team.
  • Passive or active misalignment is “contagious,” drags the team down, and erodes trust.
  • Sometimes “it is better to have no one in that role than someone who’s resisting.”
  • Quote: “That misalignment actually can become contagious. It drags people down, causes mistrust...often it's better actually to have no one in that role than having someone who's actively or passively resisting.” — Liz Hutson [05:31]
  • Takeaway: A truly aligned team is one of the strongest predictors of success.

5. Managing the Fallout When Well-Liked Team Members Are Let Go ([06:26]–[09:32])

• Addressing team concerns after someone’s exit:
  • Recognize valid feelings of uncertainty or sadness.
  • Emphasize the rationale: It’s about alignment with goals, not personal faults.
  • Quickly reaffirm commitment and alignment within the remaining team.
  • Quote: “Making sure that people really understand...the reason for this is actually synergistic to everybody.” — Liz Hutson [07:07]
• Dealing with camaraderie and “buddy” dynamics:
  • It’s natural to feel loss when a friend leaves, but the team’s purpose comes first.
  • Camaraderie is good, but must not supersede the mission.
  • Quote: “The team camaraderie doesn't come before the purpose of why that team came together in the first place. We miss them, too. This was not personal.” — Liz Hutson [09:06]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Sometimes they really do have an idea that, when they're heard, might actually improve the path forward. But... it just can't continue.”
  — Liz Hutson [02:09]

• “Keeping them in that role certainly does more long-term damage than letting them go... sometimes it's really the healthiest thing for everyone, just letting that person hop off the bus.”
  — Liz Hutson [04:13]

• “A fully aligned team... is one of the strongest predictors of whether a project is going to succeed or fail.”
  — Liz Hutson [06:13]

• “Being friends at work... it's nice when that happens, but that's not the primary objective... The team camaraderie doesn't come before the purpose.”
  — Liz Hutson [09:04]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:00–01:40] Intro, team alignment & “on the bus” challenge
• [01:52–02:57] Final honest conversation to explore misalignment
• [02:57–04:31] Deciding to part ways, weighing discomfort versus necessity
• [04:31–06:26] The relief of letting go and positive impact on team
• [06:26–09:32] Managing departures, addressing ripple effects, and focusing on team purpose

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Tone and Atmosphere

The conversation is empathetic, practical, and candid. Both speakers acknowledge the human side of tough business decisions while keeping the discussion grounded in the realities of organizational leadership and team performance.

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Summary Takeaways

• Leaders must proactively address misalignment through direct, honest conversations.
• If alignment can’t be achieved, decisive action—even when difficult—is better for individual and team wellbeing.
• Open, compassionate communication to the remaining team helps manage uncertainty and maintain morale.
• Ultimately, full team alignment is critical to achieving success; friendships are valued, but organizational purpose takes priority.

Transcript

[A]

This is Scott Becker with the Becker Private Equity in the Becker Business podcast. We're thrilled today to be joined by brilliant speaker and leader Liz Hudson. She's going to talk to us about, I think, one of the most interesting subjects in business and in team building, in everything, which is this concept of how do you decide whether somebody or a plan or an effort should be continued or not? When do you abandon it? When do you double down on it? How do you think about it? Whereas let me ask you to take a second to introduce yourself and also introduce the topic more fully.

[B]

Absolutely. Scott, great to talk with you. Yeah. My name is Liz Hudson and I am the founder and principal consultants of egh. We focus on healthcare products and services. We are a consulting firm. We mostly focus on the private equity space. And today I thought we'd talk about this idea of something that every leader really eventually faces, which is that moment when someone on your team just isn't on the bus. Right. You've done everything, right, all the things that we've talked about here in this podcast before, and a number of areas before where you're working to gain alignment. You meet the people where they are. You've listened to the key stakeholders, you built the future state together so that everyone has a voice in the plan. But you still have one person who just refuses to get on board. And they may not just be passively not on board, they may be actively not on board. They're naysaying, they're steering the conversation sidewise, they're dropping snarky comments or just quietly under delivering to the detriment of the team. So what do you do when someone just won't get on the bus? And that's where I thought we'd spend some time today, Scott.

[A]

No, thank you. And how do you deal with that? At what point do you cut the cord? At what time do you, do you. How do you think about that? Or can you rehabilitate the person or get them on the bus? How do you think about that?

[B]

Yeah, I like what you just said. The rehabilitation. Right. I do like to see if we can give them one more shot. Right. We've had the conversation with the broad team, with the broad organization, but I love to, as a leader, start with one final honest attempt at alignment. That's the first thing, right? Have a one on one conversation, a real one with them, where we're asking them what's driving this misalignment. Is there something that we've missed? Is there a suggestion maybe that they could offer that would make the plan better and help them reengage because sometimes they just need to feel heard. Sometimes they need clarity, they need that one on one guidance on that. And sometimes they really do have an idea that when they're heard might actually improve the path forward. But in this conversation, this last shot, I think it's important to be transparent that their lack of alignment is slowing the team down, it's hurting morale and it just can't continue. This is really kind of the last stop before we've got to make some decisions.

[A]

Thank you. At what point do you say we're done? What are triggers that cause you to say we're done? It's time to move on, purchase, taking a spot they're not producing or they're just causing more trouble than they're worth. At what point do you say we're just done?

[B]

We're just done, right? Yeah, I think hopefully you get some insights in that. One on one and they're, they're honest about it and they're saying, hey listen, I just can't get up on board with this. And you have a mutually understood conversation of like we just need to part ways. Perhaps they say in their words, yes, I'm on board, I'm going to be there. But you continue to see behavior that's still not aligned after that one last ditch effort. Now is the time where you say that's it. Right. And this part isn't fun, Scott. Right. This isn't easy for any leader to have to make this call and it's not something to take lightly because it brings discomfort for everyone. For you, for the team, for the, for the individual. And you're also losing a contributor. You're losing a set of hands, you're losing the tribal knowledge. You might have to take down extra work yourself or slow the project down a little bit. But the truth is if you've made every effort to align on that and the misalignment is still there, keeping them in that role certainly does more long term damage than letting them go or moving them to a different project. Within the organization, I think we just have to be thoughtful, we have to be objective and we have to be firm because sometimes it's really the healthiest thing for everyone just letting that person hop off the bus.

[A]

Thank you very, very much. And right. At some point there's always this concept when you get rid of somebody who's not aligned or not contributing, there's almost always that feeling of relief in addition by subtraction. And I know there might be some guilt in Feeling that way. But it seems to me when I've let go of a team member that wasn't really producing or didn't we want to produce or for whatever reason, it always feels like a lift off the shoulders. You talk about that for a second.

[B]

Yeah, absolutely. That's so true. I think it is an initial sting. It does feel not great for everybody. But to your point, once that decision is made and you move quickly, and you need to move quickly on that, because first of all, that employee probably isn't happy when they're doing something that they're not on board with. Their morale isn't there? Right. They disagree with the direction every day that they're in that role. Frustrating for them. You're not getting their best work and you're not doing them any favors by prolonging that. But the other thing, and this is important, is that it's not good for the team morale either. Like you said, it's a lift off the shoulders when that thing that's pulling back, the team is removed. When everyone else is aligned, working hard, they're pushing forward, and that one person refuses to engage. That misalignment actually can become contagious. It drags people down, causes mistrust, and it sends a message to the team that this kind of behavior of not being aligned and not being on board is tolerated. And often it's better actually to have no one in that role than having someone who's actively or passively resisting. You know, a fully aligned team, a team that's just genuinely everybody's on the bus, is one of the strongest predictors of whether a project is going to succeed or fail.

[A]

And talk for a second about this. Sometimes you get rid of somebody and the person is well liked by others in the company, but at the same time just isn't doing their job or isn't producing. How do you manage some of the fallout from that when that happens?

[B]

That's an important question. Because while you have that situation where that person has moved off the project, maybe to a different part of the organization or maybe outside the organization altogether, there is a little bit of a feeling, surely, of other people around the team that wonder, hey, am I next? Is it possible that I'm going to be exited from this boss as well? But here, in this particular situation that we're talking about, it's not that this individual is necessarily a bad person or doesn't do good work. It's that they weren't aligned with what the team was trying to do, what the organization was trying to do so. I think making sure that people really understand that the rationale, the reason for this is actually synergistic to everybody. And then coming back and reaffirming them of like the rest of us. We are on board with what's happening here. We are all aligned and committed to that single. So coming back and reaffirming the team, I think is a very important, quick next step.

[A]

Thank you. And what about the situation where not only not so much people are worried that they might be next, but they're. They're collegially upset because that was one of their colleagues in the place that they liked, that they were friendly with. You know, sometimes you have low performers or performers that hang out together, and sometimes not just the. The issue of they feel they might be next, but they're like, oh, that was my buddy. That was my friend.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Do you come across that? Because we certainly come across that some.

[B]

Yeah, sure. It's a tough one. And I think.

[A]

No.

[B]

Yes. It's great when we have a camaraderie within the team, within an organization that is strong and it's solid and it makes coming to work fun. Right? It makes. It makes it fun when you're working with people that you enjoy. And at the end of the day, as we are put together on a team for a common shared purpose, we're there for that common shared purpose. And so I think it's a little bit of like, you can continue to be friends and have that social interaction outside of work, but being friends at work, like, you're not looking for your family, you're not looking for your friends at work. It's nice when that happens, but that's not the primary objective there. You guys are all in a shared organization moving towards a shared common goal on this. And you want to have a good team camaraderie. But the team camaraderie doesn't come before the purpose of why that team came together in the first place. So I think it's a little bit of a. A conversation, a hard conversation sometimes that we have to have with our team to say yes, I feel you. We miss them, too. This was not personal. This really just had to do with our inability to be successful with that individual on the team. And so we had to make a change so that the total team could be successful.

[A]

Thank you. No, we couldn't agree more, Liz. I love this subject. I love the thoughts. It's always a challenging thing. Thank you so much for joining us today. I'm the Becker Private Equity, the Becker business podcast. You're one of the best there is. We really appreciate it. Thank you very, very much.

[B]

Thank you, Scott. Always such a pleasure. Thank you.