Building the Future of Natural Medicine with Matt Brockmeier 10-4-25

Summary

Episode Summary: Building the Future of Natural Medicine with Matt Brockmeier

Podcast: Becker Business
Host: Scott Becker
Guest: Matt Brockmeier, Founder of Entheogen
Date: October 4, 2025

---

Episode Overview

In this episode, Scott Becker sits down with Matt Brockmeier, founder of Entheogen, to explore the rapidly evolving landscape of natural medicine with a special focus on psilocybin and other medicinal mushrooms. Matt shares his journey from healthcare attorney to a pioneering entrepreneur in Colorado’s legal psychedelic industry, details the science and regulatory path for psilocybin, and discusses the challenges and promise of integrated natural medicine businesses. The conversation also touches on broader drug trends, the potential for data-driven health advancements, and the limits of current mental health treatments compared to novel natural therapies.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Matt’s Background and Path to Natural Medicine

• Matt started as a healthcare attorney specializing in payer contracts and hospital systems in Chicago before moving into consulting and policy work in Washington, D.C.
• The 2014 legalization of adult-use cannabis in Colorado inspired Matt’s move to Denver and deepened his interest in natural medicine.
• During the pandemic, he participated in drafting and passing Colorado's 2022 Natural Medicine Health Act, creating the nation’s first legal framework for psilocybin access.
• Matt joined Entheogen, the first known fully vertically integrated natural medicine company in the U.S., handling cultivation, extraction, product development, and administration through licensed facilitators.
  • Quote [01:31]:
    “Entheogen is going to be the first vertically integrated natural medicine business, as far as we’re aware, in the country.” — Matt Brockmeier

Understanding Microdosing and Its Benefits

• Microdosing means taking a “sub-perceptual” dose—a dose too small to cause noticeable psychoactive effects—frequently around 100 mg of dried mushroom (not pure psilocybin).
• The primary interest is neuroplasticity: supporting brain flexibility and new neural connections without the experience of a psychedelic “trip.”
  • Quote [03:17]:
    “You get the benefits of the neuroplasticity of psilocybin but without the trip, basically.” — Matt Brockmeier

Psilocybin vs. LSD: Key Differences

• Both are serotonergic compounds with molecular structures similar to serotonin, but they have varying effects based on their affinity for different serotonin receptors.
• LSD’s longer duration (8+ hours) stems from its higher affinity for certain receptors; both deliver unique subjective experiences.
  • Quote [04:09]:
    “They’re both serotonergic compounds… They have different affinities for different serotonin receptors and that results in a different subjective experience.” — Matt Brockmeier

Neurotransmitters: Serotonin vs. Dopamine

• Serotonin is dubbed the “happiness neurotransmitter,” while dopamine relates more to excitement and anticipation.
• Cocaine is highly dopaminergic, hence its addictive profile and lack of medical benefit—contrasted with psilocybin’s profile.
  • Quote [04:57]:
    “Serotonin is typically referred to as like the happiness neurotransmitter and dopamine is like the excitement or anticipation neurotransmitter… Cocaine for instance… releases a lot of dopamine.” — Matt Brockmeier

Drug Trends: Surge in Cocaine Use

• Scott brings up a Wall Street Journal feature on rising U.S. cocaine use, prompting Matt to reflect on contrasting health impacts and ethical considerations.
  • Quote [05:47]:
    “Mushrooms, you can grow them in your closet and they’re good for you and they’re not addictive.” — Matt Brockmeier

Building Entheogen: From Functional Fungi to Healing Centers

• Entheogen plans to cultivate, extract, and administer psilocybin, leveraging experience from Myco Love Farms (co-founders’ existing functional mushroom venture).
• The operation will include multiple healing centers in Colorado—supervised settings for therapy, not retail sale.
• A unique digital app will track user variables (sleep, diet, exercise) before, during, and after psilocybin sessions, enhancing personalized care and data analysis on strain efficacy.
  • Quote [08:27]:
    “Because we’re growing the mushrooms ourselves, we’ll have access to data about what types of mushrooms work for what types of people and what types of conditions.” — Matt Brockmeier

Current Mental Health Paradigms & Precision Medicine

• Matt critiques the overreliance on SSRIs, citing the need for more effective, tailored options—something the natural medicine model aims to address.
  • Quote [07:29]:
    “We pass this law because people need access to something that works. And the current mental health regime… doesn’t work as well as we hoped.” — Matt Brockmeier

Lighthearted Moment: Mushrooms for Weight Loss?

• Scott jokingly asks if mushrooms can aid in weight loss, to which Matt quips that yoga is the solution, underlining mushrooms’ primary focus on mental health and neuroplasticity.
  • Quote [08:55]:
    “No, that’s just yoga.” — Matt Brockmeier

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• [01:31] “Entheogen is going to be the first vertically integrated natural medicine business, as far as we’re aware, in the country.” — Matt Brockmeier
• [03:17] “You get the benefits of the neuroplasticity of psilocybin but without the trip, basically.” — Matt Brockmeier
• [04:09] “They’re both serotonergic compounds… They have different affinities for different serotonin receptors and that results in a different subjective experience.” — Matt Brockmeier
• [04:57] “Serotonin is the happiness neurotransmitter… Dopamine is the excitement or anticipation neurotransmitter.” — Matt Brockmeier
• [05:47] “Mushrooms… are good for you and they’re not addictive.” — Matt Brockmeier
• [07:29] “We pass this law because people need access to something that works. And the current mental health regime… doesn’t work as well as we hoped.” — Matt Brockmeier
• [08:27] “We’ll have access to data about what types of mushrooms work for what types of people and what types of conditions.” — Matt Brockmeier
• [08:55] “No, that’s just yoga.” — Matt Brockmeier

---

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:24–02:39 — Matt’s career journey to natural medicine and founding Entheogen
• 03:05–03:57 — Microdosing explained and its benefits
• 04:02–04:41 — Comparing mushrooms (psilocybin) and LSD
• 04:41–05:17 — Serotonin vs. dopamine, and habit-forming substances
• 05:17–06:13 — Discussion of cocaine’s resurgence and natural vs. synthetic drugs
• 06:37–08:13 — Vertically integrated model, transition from functional mushrooms, regulatory updates
• 08:13–08:51 — Digital health tracking and personal data in psilocybin therapy
• 08:51–08:59 — Lighthearted question on mushrooms and weight loss

---

Conclusion

This episode offers a comprehensive look into the future of natural medicine, blending personal entrepreneurial journey, regulatory landscape, science, and the promise of data-driven individualized care. Matt Brockmeier’s insights reveal both the challenges and the transformative potential of legal psilocybin therapy in Colorado, as well as broader issues in mental health care. Listeners receive not only an education on the practical science and business of psilocybin but also a sense of the wider cultural and regulatory moment.

Transcript

[A]

This is Scott Becker with a special combined episode of the Becker's Healthcare and the Becker Private Equity podcast. We're thrilled today to be joined by a founder in one of the most interesting areas of business that's out there today. We're joined today by Matt Brockmire. Matt, why don't you take a moment and tell us a little bit about what you do and how you got started in it and maybe also where you're living currently.

[B]

Okay, thanks, Scott. I glad to be here. So I began my career as a health care attorney, pretty standard payer, contracting health care, hospital systems, reimbursement, that type of thing in Chicago. Graduated from DePaul Law School, moved to D.C. a few years after that. Did some management consulting, policy work and academia. And then when Colorado legalized adult use cannabis, around 2014, I moved to Denver to get involved in that area. And then during the pandemic, got interested in some laws that were being written in Colorado by some folks that I used to work with. We passed a ballot initiative in 2022 called the Natural Medicine Health act. And what that did was simultaneously changed our criminal laws in Colorado to allow personal use of some natural medicines, namely psilocybin, mushrooms and some mescaline containing cacti. But also we established a regulated model for adults to access psilocybin, which has shown tremendous promise and potential for treating a number of mental health conditions and disorders, including, but definitely not limited to ptsd, anxiety, alcohol use disorder, substance use disorder. And so I got, I had the chance to participate in the rulemaking process after the law was passed. And then I was approached by a group of entrepreneurs who initially just wanted to hire me to explain, you know, the rules around this new industry that we created. But then they asked me to join the team. And I've been, you know, I've gotten that offer a few times in my career, but this seemed like the right opportunity. So join, join the team. And the company is called Entheogen. So we're a vertically integrated natural medicine business. We're going to receive licenses from the state of Colorado to cultivate my mushrooms, extract the active compounds, put them into products which are permitted under the state law, and then administer them via a licensed facilitator, kind of a therapist in these healing centers. So Entheogen is going to be the first vertically integrated natural medicine business, as far as we're aware, in the country.

[A]

That's amazing, simply amazing. There's somebody who interviewed years ago who was a venture fund investing in these types of businesses. I think their Name was Palo Santos.

[B]

You've seen them from Chicago.

[A]

We're familiar and stuff like that. What a fascinating business and talk about. And what a fascinating business. Let me ask you a question. We have friends now, you know that recreational. Do what they call microdosing. Tell us about that trend.

[B]

Sure. So microdosing is a concept that basically you take a sub. Perceptual dose. That's the key word there. Subperceptual dose of. It could be any substance but typically it's. It's mushrooms. People microdose LSD also. But that's a whole other category. And so you know, you don't actually feel the effects that you would under a larger dose. So it's typically around like 100 milligrams of dried fruiting body. That's not 100 milligrams of psilocybin. That would be a different experience for sure. And what it does is these substances are neuroplastic. So it means they can help you effectively like make new connections in your brain in your new new synapses connect. So you get the benefits of the neuroplasticity of psilocybin but without the trip. Basically.

[A]

Gotcha. And so what's the difference between mushrooms and lsd? Because some of us are just not like.

[B]

So they're very similar. They're both serotonergic compounds which means that their chemical structure is similar to that of a neurotransmitter called serotonin, which we all produce. And that's why these things work is they basically they're. It's like a key and a lock that you know, it's like fits in the fits in the receptor site.

[A]

So they different.

[B]

Have different affinities for different serotonin receptors. And that results in a different subjective experience. LSD has a stronger affinity. So it lasts longer. It's a. It usually lasts like 8 or 10 hours or longer if you, if you take more. So. So you know the experience is different. The molecules are a similar shape and that's why they both fit into the serotonin.

[A]

Take me to. Give me a second. Don't. Between serotonin and dopamine. Because we always talk about dopamine fixes serotonin. I think it was always sort of like longer lasting happiness. How do you think about serotonin versus.

[B]

Yeah, so some of these molecules are both serotonergic and dopaminergic, but in different ratios, I guess. But yeah, serotonin is typically referred to as like the happiness neurotransmitter. And dopamine is like the excitement or the anticipation. Neurotransmitter. Other drugs are much more dopaminergic. Cocaine, for instance, is like, releases a lot of dopamine.

[A]

Let me ask you a question, because you mentioned cocaine. The Wall Street Journal ran a story today, one of their top stories today on this sort of tremendous growth of cocaine again in the country. You know, spiking use, spiking growth. So like that. Why is that, that you're seeing the spike in those kinds of things? Any. Is anything you have a thought on at all?

[B]

You know, I'm not sure. I did mention that I, that I live in Colombia, which unfortunately has a sordid history of the illicit drug trade. I don't really understand why people are, if, if they're in fact, you know, if the use of these other substances is increasing. I'm not really sure because there are no health benefits, as far as I'm aware, to cocaine as opposed to. And it's highly addictive and ruins lives and also linked to the destruction of the rainforest because that's where the illicit production occurs. On the other hand, mushrooms, you can grow them in your closet and they're good for you and they're not. And they're not addictive.

[A]

It's so funny. When I saw the cocaine article today, I was like, it brought me back to the 1980s and I thought like, oh my God, who is. And I don't know people that are using cocaine today. I just don't know them. I don't see it. So I was kind of curious as to where that comes from. There's a whole narrative in the Journal article about. Because this drug was cut off. So that drug is getting hot again. It was just, I thought it was just fascinating. No, but. So you're in the, in the sort of, I can never pronounce it.

[B]

Psilocyl.

[A]

Psilocybin. Natural medicine. Fascinating. Congratulations. And you guys are growing and hopefully the first fully vertically integrated psilocybin.

[B]

Yeah, and it's not just that. So we're, we're going to grow the mushrooms ourselves, extract the compounds and put them into products. Several of my co founders already have a functional mushroom company. They grow lion's mane, cordyceps, reishi, turkey tail. And it's called Myco Love Farms. They're based in, in Longmont, Colorado, which is also where our separate grow facility will be. And so we, they're already doing this with just, with different mushrooms. So we're ready to just as soon as we are receive the licenses, which we're very close to getting, working very closely with the state's natural medicine division, a really talented, committed group of regulators that really understands that this is the will of the voters. And we pass this law because people need access to something that works. And the current mental health regime, you know, where you just, you're throwing SSRIs at everybody and they don't work as well as we hoped. And there are definitely drawbacks to long term use of SSRIs and there's more.

[A]

And more precision medicine that really shows that this doesn't work or that does work. And basically you can, you could be honestly for years and then they're finally doing precision medicine testing and they show that it has really no impact.

[B]

Exactly. And so on, on top of that, though, so we're, we're already prepared to grow the mushrooms. We're already doing this with other, other types of mushrooms. And we're hoping to open multiple healing centers across the state. Just because, you know, everything takes place in these healing centers. It's a controlled, supervised environment. So what you're gonna, it's not a retail model.

[A]

It's like how Vegas was there for casinos. Denver and Colorado is going to become Colorado. Very excited. It was one of the early places for cannabis as well. Yeah.

[B]

One of the first states for cannabis. And now we're leading the way with natural medicine, you know, drug policy reform. But on top of that, we're going to have a digital platform, an app that tracks things like sleep and exercise and diet and ties that into your before, during and after experience with psilocybin. So it really is amazing. And, and we have, because we're growing the mushrooms ourselves, we'll have access to the data about what types of mushrooms work for what types of people and what types of conditions. And we're going to get really granular with this in a way that's never been done before.

[A]

One more question. If I want to lose weight, is there a specific mushroom for that or not? That's not in the same category.

[B]

No, that's just yoga. Just.

[A]

Matt, I want to thank you for joining us and the Becker Business Becker Private Equity podcast. What a pleasure to visit with.

[B]

Thanks.

[A]

Thank you so, so much, Matt.