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Growth, AI, and the New Era of Venture Investing with Benjamin Lerner & Jason Zins 3-25-26
00:31:06
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- [00:00]
A
This is Scott Becker with the Becker Business and the Becker Private Equity Podcast. I'm thrilled today to feature two brilliant entrepreneurs, one in venture capital, one in executive search and business. We're so thrilled today. Jason Zins with us and Ben Werner with us. They're going to talk about their businesses, what they do, how they're growing, trends are watching, and a lot more. Ben, can I ask you to take a second to introduce yourself and tell us about your business and then Jason will ask you to do the same.
- [00:32]
B
Sure. Scott, thank you so much for having us. So I co founded and run an executive search firm called the Find. We work with early growth stage companies all the way up to Fortune 1002 and support them cross functionally with executive search. We work with a lot of private equity firms after they acquire businesses and help in transformation. So thank you for having really excited.
- [00:59]
A
And Ben, how did you get the business started? What drove you to start and found your own business?
- [01:05]
B
Yeah, so I started the business four years ago with my partner Felicity Hassan, and that was really driven by an eagerness to take greater ownership of delivery and culture. And I think an executive search, you find that search firms are of course driven by volume of work. And for us, we wanted to build a business that allowed us to really be very thoughtful about our partners and be able to build a business that supported them across their different leadership roles at different stages. And this is slightly atypical because executive search firms usually specialize in in a very specific industry or function. And for us, we're so eager to think about individuals and their transferable skills and how we could bring unique talent into search processes. So that was a big driver for us.
- [02:04]
A
That's fantastic. And Jason, tell us about the funds that you've founded in your backstory and background as well.
- [02:12]
C
Yeah, thanks Scott. Thrilled to be here. So Jason's in founder and managing partner of Nomi Capital. I founded the firm about two years ago. Prior to that, worked at several other, really two other multibillion dollar asset management firms within the alternative investment space. Has always wanted to do something on my own over the years and felt like it was as good a time as ever to give it a shot. And so ultimately founded Nome Capital in May of 2024. And what I really saw was a hole in the market when it comes to venture capital. And when I say venture capital, I don't do early stage. I'm usually growth stage, later stage onwards. But when you look at the evolution of the markets today, let's take the US equity markets. They've shrunk by half over the last 25 years, meaning the number of investable companies in the US public markets have shrunk by half over the last 25years, which I don't think you would guess given the amount of growth and capital formation and company formation that we seen. On top of that, you've had significant consolidation and concentration around the largest public companies. And so the reality is that today companies are staying private longer than ever. I think back in the late 90s, the average age of a company that was going IPO was like four to five years. Today it's 12 plus years. SpaceX, which will go public later this year, was founded like 25 years ago. When you look at earlier IPOs, Amazon, Nvidia, Netflix, all went public under billion dollar market cap. So the market structure today is very, very different. And I think for investors, and I focus largely on high net worth investors and less so on institutions, it's difficult for them to access these private markets. But given those dynamics that have played out, I think it's integral to have exposure there within a broader portfolio. And so I really founded the firm to try and provide access, thoughtful access to that segment of the market for high net worth investors.
- [04:28]
A
Jason, are there types of companies specifically or niches that you're looking at in terms of investing or how do you look at what you invest in?
- [04:37]
C
Yeah, we've been primarily focused on AI and defense since founding the firm two years ago. One, there's obviously a lot of activity going on there and two, to echo some of my earlier comments, very difficult to get pure play AI and pure play defense tech exposure in the public markets. Obviously there's Nvidia and some other companies, but as far as the OpenAI's, the anthropics of the world, they're all private. Similarly, on the defense side you have the legacy defense contractors like Lockheed and Raytheon and Boeing and others really bad business models under fire when it comes to the Trump administration and the DoD as far as their activities right now. And so really exciting opportunities in both those spaces. We've been very active over the last two years. We've actually pulled back pretty meaningfully on AI over the last 12 plus months, just given where we think valuations have gone too. But on the defense side, we launched a defense fund earlier this year and prior to that had been very active in the space as well.
- [05:43]
A
We're seeing increased interest. The second person I've talked to in the last week or two who's focused on the defense and this Other fund happens to be defense and industry. Is that something we'll see more of people focusing on defense and industry? It seems like it's forever since I heard people really focusing on defense and industry. And I know you have mentioned industry directly, but defense and AI but is that something we'll see more of people focusing on defense again and opportunities in defense? Fascinating to me, 100%.
- [06:13]
C
I mean, I think you had a scenario where five years ago, certainly 10 years ago, when it came to private capital, largely venture capital, defense investing was kind of off limits. It just was viewed as sort of uninvestable. Not for financial reasons, more for just kind of moral or philosophical reasons or however you want to look at it. But the reality is, is that our defense industrial base is in pretty bad shape. Right. As far as being able to produce the munitions and missiles that are required to sustain our deterrence and some of the conflicts we're involved in around the world. And on top of that, technology has really changed the nature of the battlefield. When you look at what's gone on in first Russia, Ukraine, but now in Iran as well. And the existing defense contractors, they're not so great when it comes to new technology and software driven types of solutions. So there's both a national imperative to invest in our defense industrial base. But along with that, I think there's an attractive financial component as well. When you have this sort of massive disruption going on in a very large, very old industry, it doesn't happen often and it can create very exciting investment opportunities which we're focused on. We're certainly not the only ones. To your point, Scott, it is becoming more popular and I expect that to, to continue. I think we're, we're in the, the early innings here.
- [07:42]
A
Absolutely fascinating. And Ben, let me ask you this. What sort of both of you are founders of the last several years? Fantastic. It seems like there is. Are you seeing people return to being founders and entrepreneurs or do you not see enough of that in watching people of your generation that are out there trying to figure out business, figure out, you know, the entrepreneurial situation? I go back and forth in this in terms of trying to understand what the entrepreneurial urge looks like of this generation. Any central thoughts on that, Ben, and what you're seeing out there? You've seen lots of young emerging founders and what is your sense of that, Jason? I'd love to ask you the same thing.
- [08:27]
B
Yeah, I would say that given sort of the emergence of AI from sort of a consumer standpoint and the ability that it provides you to Drive efficiencies in ways that weren't feasible previously. I think I have seen and will continue to see more founders building more technologies than perhaps ever before. I think the barrier of entry given the access to AI allows individuals to grow much faster than ever before. So my expectation is that there will continue to be more founders as, as AI becomes more prevalent and particularly with younger individuals who are growing up with it. Essentially, I suspect it'll only continue to grow.
- [09:18]
A
Jason, any thoughts there?
- [09:20]
C
Yeah, I mean, I think entrepreneurship and risk taking have obviously been central to the, you know, American culture, if you will, for, for quite a while. But I would echo Ben's point. I think tools like AI have, have now allowed smaller groups to do more with less. And that ultimately I think will mean more, not less. Company formations and entrepreneurs. And you also have, you know, for, for some younger generations, right. Cost of living has gone up, salaries have not kept up with it. People feel like they can't make as much money as they want or need when working in corporate America. And I think that drives, you know, risk taking as well, which is probably good and bad. When I think of just the, you know, the, the handful of guys that Ben and I grew up with, Ben obviously started his own business. I have my own business. Out of our kind of five closest friends, I think four of us have taken the entrepreneurial route. So I think, I think that sentiment is alive and well and to Ben's point, probably accelerates with things like AI.
- [10:25]
A
That is really encouraging and positive, quite frankly. I love to hear that, that of your crew of people you grew up with four to the five down the entrepreneurial route. And I think it's so healthy for the country to have so many emerging entrepreneurs doing a fantastic job. Jason, let me ask you, the, the, the trends you're watching in the, in the growth equity business, the investing business, what are some of the trends that you're watching closely? Obviously there's been an explosion of funds. There's a huge sort of range out there of the performance of funds. What do you see out there? What are some of the trends you're watching in the investing in funds business?
- [11:03]
C
Yeah, I mean, you know, the, the private market space broadly is I think, super interesting right now.
- [11:08]
B
Right.
- [11:08]
C
There's, there's some well known issues and concerns around private credit, which, you know, I won't get into. But on the private equity and venture side, given how dormant the IPO markets have been, there's been a lack of distributions and exits which have impacted the space. And so you're at this unique, unique moment right now where it's actually fundraising for VC funds is actually very, very challenging right now. The majority of the capital is going to the, you know, the top five top ten firms. Whereas, you know, as you know Scott, there's always been a very large kind of emerging manager cohort in these segments, capital included. At the same time you have these large private companies like OpenAI and Anthropic that are raising mega, mega rounds. And so there's a bit of a mismatch. You don't have a lot of capital being raised in traditional venture funds, but there is significant need for capital from private companies. And so a big trend that you've seen is what's called silver pv. Single purpose vehicles come into place where managers will just raise capital, raise a fund for a specific investment, AI or otherwise. And that I think has, has definitely become very popular. There's good and bad to that. A lot of clients like it because they get to, you know, invest in a specific company as opposed to a traditional blind pool with a manager. So I think that likely continues. I think later this year is going to be very interesting with the SpaceX IPO. I'm skeptical that OpenAI and Anthropic will go public later this year.
- [12:56]
B
We'll see.
- [12:57]
C
SpaceX I think is highly likely to go public at $1.52 trillion. Who knows? There are investors, institutions, venture funds, high net worth investors that have been invested in SpaceX for 5, 10, 20 years that are up 50, 100,000, 5,000x. Right. So this is going to be a massive liquidity event unlike anything we've ever seen. The wealth creation that will result from that, both for investors and SpaceX employees, is going to be massive. And I think and hope that that will result in two things. One, reinvestment into venture funds in the venture space and two, more entrepreneurship and risk taking from SpaceX employees and former employees that now have capital to live but to take risk by founding their own company.
- [13:51]
A
Fascinating. What do you say to an investor who had probably 10 different chances to invest in SpaceX and ultimately said no each time up that ladder? How do you console that investor?
- [14:03]
C
It's tough. It happens. There's plenty of great investments out there and I think a lot of times we all need to be careful psychologically to chase the hot thing. SpaceX has been the hot thing for a while. I think it's an incredible company. I think the, you know, the sky is the limit for them over the next five or ten years, but I have no view on if this is an attractive valuation or not to buy in at.
- [14:29]
A
No, I know. I feel like I missed 13 different opportunities to invest in it. And now as it's going down, you know, I do have that sort of feeling of like Lucy with the football in the Peanuts cartoon where I missed that one. But it is what it is. But Ben, talk about the search business. What are some of the trends you're watching in the search business and how does the economy impact the search business? Talk a little bit about it. Are there people moving? What's going on? What do you see out there?
- [14:54]
B
Sure. So I would say that the biggest trend that we are seeing, and keep in mind, we work cross industry and cross function, but the biggest trend that we're seeing is as organizations continue to invest dollars in in AI and with the myriad of use cases that these organizations can use, the technology for that is directly trickling down into executive hiring in terms of bringing people in to drive those initiatives. So, you know, for example, we just ran the head of AI search for one of the largest global media businesses, and the use case there is focused on how do we leverage AI to allow our business to create more content in a more efficient and effective manner than ever before? How do we use technology to be able to take all this information in of all this content that we're being pitched to, better sift through that in a more effective way so that we continue to produce more content? And then equally, we place the head of technology at a $10 billion consumer goods holding company and he talks about how the way that they're decreasing their agency spend because they're able to do all these different photo shoots much quicker, much more efficiently, and use data and analytics to apply all their advertising and personalize in a more effective way. So as organizations continue to invest in a and that sort of the endless use cases there are depending on the organization that has been directly trickling into executive search and be able to bring the right executives in to drive that. So I would say, Scott, that is the biggest trend that we're seeing on our end.
- [16:52]
A
And then, Ben, when you look at the rest of 2026, I mean, it sounds like you're quite active in some really interesting spots that you're working with. What are you most focused on and excited about as you go to the next part of 2026 for the rest of this year?
- [17:08]
B
Yeah, I think for us, what's most exciting is organizations continuing to invest in these technologies, because what we find is that almost all of our clients view AI as something that can enhance their business. And with that, while I think there is a lot of skepticism about how that's going to drive cuts, I think the reality is for us and what we're seeing is that there's going to continue to be a need for executives to take ownership of the growing opportunities that these organizations will have through the investment in technology. So I think we're going to continue to see more work with more software businesses and more private equity firms that are investing in these companies to help them find operating executives. Thank you.
- [17:58]
A
And Jason, let me ask you the same question. As you look at the rest of this year, what are you most focused on and excited about?
- [18:06]
C
Yeah, as I've alluded to, we're pretty exclusively focused on defense investing right now. I think you've had a sort of combination of long term and short term trends that are coming together here. Long term, you've had this shift away from the big legacy defense contractors towards emerging players like an Anduril and others that are a little bit more technologically advanced or software first types of systems. You have a shift in the way that the Department of Defense procures or buys weapon systems these days, which has been a long time coming and then more short term. Obviously you've had several conflicts, Russia, Ukraine, now in the Middle east, which has, and I'm not going to comment on the geopolitical, political, human side here. I'm talking purely financial investment side of things. But we've gone from theory to reality. We've known that we need to do more on autonomy and drones. We know that we need to do more on hypersonic missiles and counter drone technology. But now we're seeing it. And I think that's continuing to accelerate the shift that I discussed. And on top of that, the last point would just be budgets. You know, we've, we've got a trillion dollar defense budget already. The Trump administration is likely to propose a $1.5 trillion budget for next year. We'll see if that passes or not. But in the meantime, the Defense Department, I think just today is now asking for a supplemental $200 billion to fund the activities in the Middle east and Iran. But more so in many ways it's like I said, teaching us from theory to reality that we need to do more in building out things like our supply base for missiles and munitions. And so you have all these trends coming together in the defense space. A lot of activity going on as far as private companies raising capital, new companies being started, people leaving Palantir and SpaceX and Anduril to start their own businesses. So there's a lot of activity and that's really what we're focused on for the foreseeable future. I think, I think you're in the very early innings here. It doesn't mean that can't change quickly. It doesn't mean that you buy everything. You still need to be disciplined as far as valuations and the types of things that you're investing in. But a lot going on right now in the defense tech world.
- [20:36]
A
Thank you. And Jason, I'll start with this question with yourself and then move to Ben. I'm not going to ask you. I will do this. And just to go off, off script for a moment here, of the five guys that you grew up with, the close friends that you grew up with and you know, fashion sense, how do you rank them? 1 to 5? Jason, where do you, where do you go on that? 1 to 5.
- [21:01]
B
This is, this is brutal, Scott.
- [21:03]
C
As I think you know, when we, when we ran into each other skiing, the clear answer is me. And, and it's, I, I judge my fashion by whether Ben has a, has a negative reaction to it. So, you know, I was wearing a great sheepskin jacket. Deer Valley, perfect place for it. It was both functional, very warm and comfortable as well as, as, you know, very trendy and fashion forward. And Ben hated it. So that was, that was really all I needed to know that I was in good, a good spot.
- [21:35]
A
But, but I think you would mention that of the five of the guys that you grew up with, four of the five founders, entrepreneurs. Can you give us any sense or Ben, maybe you could help us, you know, taking Jason's comment aside on ranking him first and you fifth, how do you rank the rest of your close friends? Where do you put them in that category of fashion?
- [21:57]
B
I would say this one of them runs a very successful mental health business and real estate business. He, he thrives in the athleisure world. So I think he, he, he probably has every single Vori outfit one could have. Now he lives in Southern California with me. So I think you can make an argument that he might be trendier than Jason. It's possible. The other, the other two, one is dispute that one is a shareholder and one of the largest global law firms. So he's a bit more business casual but was an early adopter to State and Liberty. I don't know if you've heard of that brand. It's, it's, it's, it's performance shirts. So like polo shirts but with performance sort of material that, that hold up and they have dress shirts that are made of that. So in the New York summers you could, you could keep it together. He might have every color there. And then he's also Jack.
- [23:10]
C
So he, he needs, he needs something like that.
- [23:12]
B
Yeah, he's the most physical fit, I would say. And then the last one works for his full time job as one of the largest sports teams. So he's, he's in a suit every day. So he might actually have the least, I would say faction sets.
- [23:29]
A
Thank you. And I have a question around. Vuori Vori was like, was so hot for a period of time. Is it starting to lose its leadership as the next hot thing? Like I felt for a period of time was getting all the T shirts and shirts and it seems to have just, just slightly started to lose the excitement that it had at one time. I mean I know they've been hyper successful but where do you see that are they started to lose their edge and starting to not be the next new thing because they've already been now they've already reached that peak. What do you see there, Ben, any thoughts there?
- [24:03]
B
I'll say this, observing what people are wearing here in Orange county, it still sits on top. And if you walk by their store in Newport, it is always crowded. So I don't know, I'm sure there'll be something coming behind it. But for now I think they're still perched on top.
- [24:22]
A
Got it. Fantastic. Thank you. Ben, let me ask you, you founded your own business several years ago. Any advice you would give to emerging founders? And then Jason, I'll ask you the same question.
- [24:33]
B
Yeah, I would say this. I think in my journey and I think as I've talked to others there's always. And relevant with Jason as well. There's always some sort of action, that open thing that happens that you can't control. You don't necessarily understand that if you've been curious about entrepreneurship puts you in a position where it's like, oh, this could really be the time. And what I would say is that if you back yourself and it's hard sometimes to believe in yourself, particularly if you've always worked for organizations where or you've been at organizations where you perhaps are led to believe or feel that it's really the organization and not the people, it's the brand that is driving the business. But if you believe in yourself and take the risk because it's the most rewarding way to spend your time. And I think professionally for me, when we, Felicity and I. When we got our first check that came in from a search and it became real, it was probably the most humbling and exciting moment in my professional career. So there will be trials and tribulations. Things will not go your way all the time. But on balance, if you believe in yourself and give yourself a chance, because at the worst, you're going to learn so much.
- [25:56]
A
Talk for a second because you noted one of the favorite points in a founder's sort of world is that first check that comes in. Talk about getting that first deposit, that first check, that first payment for something you did and how sort of gratifying that is, even though it's only that first one. It's almost like people used to put that first dollar bill up in their business to show the first dollar. It's really meaningful, isn't is probably one
- [26:24]
B
of the most validating feelings I've had professionally, where you know you can do it, you believe you can do it, even if other people are sort of doubting you. And when that happens, you get for a moment this. Just exhale that this is real. And then very quickly, as a founder, you're back to, okay, how do we get the second one? When is the second one coming in? What do we need to do to continue to grow and scale? But that feeling is something that, I don't know, you could replicate.
- [26:59]
A
But it is one of the great grinds of an entrepreneur that if you put up a great year or get your first check, all it means that you've now raised the ante for next year. So you got to stay excited and after it. Jason, any advice for emerging founders?
- [27:15]
C
Yeah, I mean, I would certainly echo everything that, that Ben just said. It's, it's never easy and, and especially right at the beginning. I mean, I remember when I started Nomi, this was May of 2024. I resigned from my job, I bought a laptop from Best Buy, and I was sitting in my one bedroom apartment in Chelsea and it was like, all right, now what? So it's definitely not for everyone and it's definitely very hard to get going. But I would say I also learned a lot from a failed attempt. Several years ago, I had planned to start a fintech business. Had been working it on, working on it on the side for, I don't know, maybe a year and a half, trying to get everything perfect, make sure the platform was perfect, not go public so that someone could rip us off, make sure everything was. Was ready to go, and ultimately failed. And so I think what I would say is, and I'll steal. I guess a Nike tagline is just do it. It's never going to be the perfect time. You're never going to be fully prepared. You're never going to have all the answers. But if you want to do it, just go all in and see where it goes and hopefully it works out over time. If it doesn't, it's not the end of the world. You'll have learned a lot and you can move on from there. But I would say just taking that first step and going all in is really most important.
- [28:41]
B
I'll just add to that. I think what you'll find is that when in 100% agree with Jason when you take that first step. I think one of the things that humbled me and excited me the most was just the amount of people that are going to be willing to help you.
- [28:57]
A
Right.
- [28:58]
B
And I think, you know, I can't tell you amongst the group of five guys that we've alluded to here, how many, how lucky I've been to be able to get perspective and feedback and insight about things as a founder that you just never would have thought you had to deal with. And I think people are so eager, will be so eager to help. And those who haven't taken the leap, I've found that there's, there's an equal eagerness to help and it's based on sort of the fact that maybe it never came to fruition for them and there's an excite in terms of dig in the entrepreneurial jump and they just want to help and see you succeed. And I think, you know, if you treat people well and respectfully, people are going to want to help you and you'll be really surprised about who will come to the table to support you on your journey.
- [29:54]
A
I, I, I, I love that advice. I love the thoughts from both of you. I think it's fantastic for me to get to interview brilliant, fantastic entrepreneurs like Jason and Ben literally makes my day. I want to thank both of you for joining us today on the Becker Business and the Becker Private Equity Podcast. A true gift to get to visit with both you. Just fantastic. And I hope that you're, you really did a very nice job of saying relatively nice things about your other three friends, fashion sense. And there wasn't even seemingly a shot at any one of them. And I give you credit for that. I don't think you could do that with me and a couple of the guys I grew up with without us inadvertently or childishly taking shots at the other guys. But I appreciate the unexpected and unusual maturity of Jason and Ben.
- [30:45]
C
I'll say this, Scott, Ben is nicer than me, and given it's a podcast, we try and keep it pg. But next year in Deer Valley we'll have a couple more Negronis and we'll have another conversation.
- [30:57]
A
Looking forward to it, particularly if we can get it on here. Thank you guys so much for joining us. A great pleasure. Thank you.
- [31:03]
C
Thanks so much.
- [31:06]
D
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