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Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Leadership Insights for 2026 with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods 12-6-25
00:15:34
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- [00:00]
A
This is Scott Becker with the Becker Business and the Becker Private Equity Podcast. We're thrilled today to be joined by one of the smartest people yet to work with and talk to on a regular basis. We're talking today to David Pivnick, who's a partner at McGuire Woods. Literally brilliant person who's crazily effective as well. David, I'm going to talk to you today about leadership. We'll call this Leadership with David Pivnick. You operate at the sort of intersection of strategy, operations, legal risk. You yourself do litigation, but lots of diligence as well for big private equity funds looking at investments in healthcare space. When you think about leadership, what leadership traits are most important when guiding organizations through complexity and constant change, what leadership chit traits you think of as the most important?
- [00:56]
B
Yeah, thanks Scott. Appreciate you having me on and happy to chat about this or anything else you want. You know, first thing that I think is very important with, with leaders is having a holistic understanding of the business and the industry that you're operating in. So being able to look at both internal facing pressures and considerations, but also the external environment and being able to sort of put things in perspective, identify goals and targets and think about the big picture of how to get there, I think is one of the most important traits that effective leaders have. Because you really need to be able to do that, you know, 360 degree analysis in order to best position the company and to make the best possible decisions. I think the second part of that is, is instilling confidence in your team and making sure that your team is consistently of the opinion that you are the right person for the job. That doesn't always mean everyone's going to agree. It doesn't. I don't think the goal should be to have a bunch of yes men or yes women around just saying everything you're proposing makes sense, but it needs to be that they respect that you've got the best interest of the entity in mind, that you're thinking about things in the right way and they understand and respect where you're coming from, while also knowing that you're willing to take constructive criticism and receive feedback if there's disagreement. And then the third thing I think is really a strategic skill set, the strategic acumen to be able to look at the different pieces on the board and figure out how best to deploy resources to get, you know, where the, to get the entity where it's trying to go and to accomplish the goals and that you first identified.
- [02:44]
A
Thank you. And David, you work with Large health systems, physician groups, investors. When you see organizations thrive versus those that don't. Any thoughts? And what separates organizations that thrive versus those that struggle?
- [03:02]
B
Yeah, I think the biggest thing, it's a great question, and if there was an easy answer, I think everybody would just sort of adopt whatever it was. And I think the biggest thing is understanding context. And so particularly in the healthcare industry, you know, represent a lot of companies that are both for profit entities and not for profit. Some different goals that may exist, but the reality is healthcare is a heavily regulated industry. There's no way around that. It's a very tough regulatory landscape. And I think that that is something that is constantly evolving and coming up, that needs to be addressed. And so with that in mind, I think one of the things that separates the truly successful entities from others that are perhaps less successful is being able to understand the overall context of the industry. Not just thinking about what they're doing internally, day to day, but thinking about how best to serve patients, how best to handle and treat their own people, whether it's, you know, business, employees, billers, coders, but most importantly or very importantly the providers, and recognizing that the different providers are at different levels of demand. So figuring out how to navigate that and then looking at the regulatory landscape as the challenge that it is, but reacting appropriately. One of the discussions I often have with clients that can be a difficult discussion is prompting them to make an appropriate allocation of resources to their compliance and legal functions, which I recognize in light of what I do for a living, can sound self serving, but I think it's important because ultimately building a culture of compliance is something that I think does pay off, you know, at an entity level and help drive successful entities in the healthcare space in particular. So sort of instilling that culture and focusing on it from day one and keeping in mind the macro level industry that you're operating in is very important and does help separate the better and more successful entities.
- [05:13]
A
Thank you. I've seen you counsel clients, companies through high stakes decisions, whether to settle a Department of justice case or not, whether to continue along with litigation or not. And sometimes those are big, big decisions. Sometimes it's as clear as should we buy this company or not based on this underlying risk. How do you watch leaders balancing sort of ego and humility and trying to make those decisions. How do you think about advising in those situations?
- [05:52]
B
Sure, great question. I mean, for me, the biggest thing that I think, you know, everybody gets with me for better or worse, whether, whether it's family, friends, clients, colleagues, you name It I'm a pretty transparent, candid person. I'm very much an open book. I don't believe in false talk. I try and very much, you know, do what I say and say what I mean. And I think that's the most effective way to communicate in general. And I think it applies in full force in connection with making big decisions. So the first thing that I would generally say is if you develop a relationship, and I certainly try and do this with my clients, where from day one they understand I'm going to answer questions directly. I try and avoid lawyers speak or just relying on it depends or I can't answer that. I try and give direct answers to questions unless there's a reason I can't do that. And when I can't give a direct answer, I'll take the time to explain why not and what variables or factors are preventing a sort of black and white cut and dried answer. So I try and build that from day one. I also make it clear to my clients through my advice and my actions, I'm always going to be looking out for their best interest. I will routinely tell clients I did this yesterday when a client wanted to proceed in litigation. I told them directly, I don't think this litigation is likely to succeed. I think you're going to spend X dollars audit. And in light of the relative, relative worth and risk of the litigation and the amount of money, my advice is you let it go. And ultimately that was declined. Heeded that advice. I think that that earns a little bit of credibility. And that was a smaller dispute, a smaller item, smaller relevant relative amount of money that they would have spent on fees. But I think it's important to always give that kind of candid advice. And if they wanted to proceed, I would have done that. Ethically, I could have. There was nothing wrong with filing the claim they wanted. It just was unlikely to succeed. And so it became productive to give that advice. And so then when it comes to high stakes decisions, you know, my view is building brick by brick the rapport in the credibility with clients so that they understand I'm looking out for their best interest. I am thinking about things in the right way. I've got an understanding of their industry, of their goals and objectives and what they're trying to accomplish. I can look at the big picture and then I'm going to give candid advice. I think it allows me to just communicate in that same format afterwards. So to me, the biggest key is just developing the relationship and the understanding of who we are, who they are who I am and how we work together from day one so that when we get to the high stakes decisions, it's not an, you know, all of a sudden, David, we need you to weigh in on this massive issue. It's day to day. They understand, I'm going to weigh in, I'm going to give them good advice, I'm going to give them my honest feedback candidly and with their best interest in mind. And that will include small decisions or big, so that they can take those big decisions and act appropriately.
- [09:00]
A
Do you ever have clients? And back in the day when I was more involved in advising clients directly, we'd periodically get clients with big bravado that were like, no, we got to sue them or we're doing this deal no matter what. And we might have caution on that. Do you ever have that situation? And then how do you manage that relationship with the client? Ultimately, it's their decision. But how do you manage your advice without stepping over the line of telling them you absolutely just should not do that? How do you. Do you ever find yourself in that spot where you've got a client and often they might have a different or sometimes a better view than we do, but we might see it differently. How do you deal with some of those situations?
- [09:46]
B
Yeah, it's a great question. The short answer is, yeah, those situations absolutely do come up and they can be tricky to navigate. Some of it really goes back to what I said in my last answer, which is, you know, most of the clients I'm working with, I've worked with for a while. We've had a long standing relationship. We know each other well. You know, I recently had a situation with the client come up where they said, look, we hear you, you're our guy. We've been, you've been our litigator for years, but we want to pressure test your advice and we might talk to a different lawyer by immediate response. That was, you should, this is a big decision. It's important. I take no offense. Let me know if you want me to be involved in liaising with that discussion, if you want to handle it. But I totally support it. And I think that that's my approach when it comes to those tough decisions. I will not shy away from telling a client, I think this is what you should do. And this is why I think you should do it this way. Here's what my experience says, here's what the law says, here's why I think this is the best approach. And if a client says, I don't see it, that way, I'll make sure I've laid out the relevant considerations. I'll make sure that I've made it very clear to them where I think the risks lie. And I'll also give them guidance on if you're going to go down this road, notwithstanding the fact I may not think it's the absolute best road. Here are some of the things that I think you ought to do proactively to make sure that that road lands as well as it possibly could. And so I think the short answer to your question is the situation does come up. And the best thing I think lawyers can do for their clients in those situations is give them the best available advice. Make sure the client understands that advice. It's not at the expense of belaboring the point of beating the client over the head with it. It's just making sure that the risk and the benefits are understood. And then the client can make an informed decision. And if it's not a decision that is consistent with our advice, I'll usually make sure that that's clear and again, lay out how best to position it against that backdrop. But ultimately, as you said in your question, the clients get our advice and they get to make their own decision.
- [11:57]
A
Thank you very, very much. One last question. Advising juniors, others, evolving leaders, and how to develop this judgment and ability to communicate with clients the right way to think about things, the right way to strategize. Right. Any advice for emerging leaders?
- [12:14]
B
Sure. The first thing I tell folks on my team and others coming through our summer program or junior associates as they start, is that there isn't a one size fits all career path or approach to dealing with folks internally or with clients. And so I tell people all the time that the first thing they should be thinking about, and it's something that I think is an evolving process but should start on day one, is what are you trying to get out of your career? What are you trying to get out of your practice? What are you trying to accomplish? Some people want to go to big law and become a partner. Some people are looking to pick up, training and develop skills over a few years and then go do something else, whether it's go in house, go to public interest, whatever it may be. And so I think one of the keys is thinking about what the individual is looking to get out of their career long term, because if you don't know what you're trying to accomplish, you're gonna make it hard to accomplish that. The second thing I tell folks all the time, which I think is just Good life advice, but certainly applies to the practice of law, is trying to stay true to yourself and recognizing the practice of law. But again, most things in life are not sort of one size fits all. Different people have different styles and there's lots of ways to be a very effective lawyer, there's lots of ways to be an effective partner in a law firm, there's lots of ways to be an effective associate, etc. And so I think it's very important to recognize you're going to get a lot of exposure as a young attorney or a young professional generally to different leaders, different bosses, different supervisors. And they're going to all have their own styles and you can and should learn from each of those individuals, but none of them are going to sort of have the one and only secret sauce that you have to rely on. And so figuring out how to best blend those styles, figure out what works with your own approach, and then meshing that with some of the others is really important. And then from a management standpoint, I think some of it is just learning. I don't think you can just some people are innate leaders and innate managers. They have that skill. Obviously Holly Buckley is someone who spits that mold with exceptional interpersonal skills and a great demeanor to help lead others understanding of the team and its needs. Others have to work at it. But I think again, emulating and looking at how other people are doing things effectively and figure out where you can be accretive and how you can fill a leadership role as the opportunity arises, I think is very important.
- [14:51]
A
Thank you no one and I love that. And I do think this concept of as you evolve as a leader, you see different techniques and tactics from a million different people and you sort of work with those and then really develop your own leadership style. And I think you're right on. And almost for all of us, it is a work in process and an evolution. I think that just is a great way of looking at it. David, it is always brilliant to visit with you again. David Pivnick, one of the smartest people I ever get to visit with. Thank you for joining us today on the Becker Private Equity and the Becker Business podcast. Thank you very much.
- [15:28]
B
Thank you for having me, Scott.