Part Three: The Orgasm Cult

Summary

Podcast Summary: Behind the Bastards — Part Three: The Orgasm Cult

Original Air Date: May 28, 2026
Host: Robert Evans
Guests: Brett Goldstein, Jamie Loftus
Producer: Sophie Lichterman
Podcast by Cool Zone Media & iHeartPodcasts

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Episode Overview

In the climactic third installment of their deep dive into the OneTaste "orgasm cult," Behind the Bastards explores the evolution and ultimate demise of Nicole Daedone’s exploitative enterprise. This episode traces the cult’s transformation from a fringe Bay Area commune into a Silicon Valley-style self-optimization startup, exposing the dark underbelly of its supposed “female empowerment” practices: financial exploitation, sexual coercion, trafficking, and abuse—culminating in high-profile arrests and convictions.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

I. The Communal Living and Escalation of Control (07:25 - 14:28)

• Transition to Communal Life: In 2006, OneTaste members were required to live together in a San Francisco warehouse, giving up most possessions, sharing clothing and beds (seven or more to a room), and subject to Nicole’s strict authority.
• Isolation & Cult Mechanics: Nicole adopted group critique sessions reminiscent of Synanon’s “The Game.” Complaints about personal possessions were reframed as unhealthy attachments, further eroding individual boundaries.
  • “Nicole starts having these... meeting structures... Everyone sits in a circle and critiques each other. All downhill from Synanon.” — Brett Goldstein [08:00]
• Expansion of Sexual Labor: As the business side grew, Nicole increasingly coerced women into performing sexual acts—“doing her a favor” meant giving hand jobs or other services to secure funding or please donors, blurring lines with prostitution.
  • “A favor is a hand job... She’s pretty regularly crossing the line into prostitution.” — Brett Goldstein [14:13]

II. Recruitment, Exploitation, and Business Model (15:34 - 29:11)

• Tech Bros, Capitalism, and Class: OneTaste targeted wealthy tech men—offering access to sexual partners via expensive workshops, often selling seats that would be filled by cult insiders.
  • “Your life is more exciting than the other fucking engineers at Google... researching orgasm magic with beautiful young women.” — Middle-aged tech member [23:54]
• Business Sheen & Media Complicity: A glowing 2008 New York Times article propelled OneTaste into the mainstream, lending it undeserved legitimacy and coverage that ignored or minimized reports of abuse.
  • “It winds up working as an advertisement for OneTaste... The article was a massive hit.” — Brett Goldstein [18:02]
  • “The New York Times... Both sides of an issue in which there is a clear right side to be on.” — Jamie Loftus [16:54]

III. Transformation into Silicon Valley Startup & Faux Empowerment (29:11 - 56:24)

• Rich Backers & Lifestyle Shift: Nicole began a relationship with millionaire Reese Jones, securing critical funding and moving into a life of luxury while her followers lived communally.
• Pivot to ‘Body Hacking’: In 2011, Nicole shifted OneTaste’s public identity to a self-optimization startup, publishing "Slow Sex: The Art and Craft of the Female Orgasm" and giving a TEDx talk that sanitized and commodified her teachings.
  • “She’s doing a Steve Jobs, she’s doing a fucking Theranos. Trying to thread that needle and doing it very honestly, very successfully.” — Brett Goldstein [37:36]
• Certification Pyramid: Borrowing from yoga’s “teacher training” grift, OneTaste began selling exceedingly expensive OM (orgasmic meditation) coaching programs/certifications ($10K+)—creating an MLM-like, self-perpetuating revenue stream but little value.

IV. Cult Abuse, Coercion, and Anti-Queerness (41:12 - 55:03)

• Heteronormative, Anti-Queer Practices: Nicole sabotaged queer relationships, forcing lesbian members to have sex with men, teaching that “you can’t grow as a queer woman unless you let men OM you.”
  • “All women are hungry for cock. If you're not feeling cock hungry, you're not connected to a part of yourself.” — OneTaste teaching [45:03]
• Extreme Coercion, Trauma Denial: Survivors were invalidated and gaslit—Nicole taught, “Experiences aren't good or bad... You choose the meaning” (47:20), removing the concept of rape or abuse and blaming victims.

V. Full Tech Cultification & ‘Skillful Violation’ (55:03 - 86:40)

• Call Center Culture & Sales as ‘Love’: Members became employees/salespeople, pressured to recruit and upsell—“Sales is love, therefore the universe is made of sales.” (67:04)
• ‘Skillful Violation’ Doctrine: Violence and sexual boundary violation were reframed as advanced OM techniques; members were told to ignore verbal “no’s” in favor of “reading nonverbal cues,” justifying abusive behavior.
  • “Skillful violation means it’s better to push through boundaries even if they say no...” — Brett Goldstein [82:21]
• Deteriorating Community: Lockless rooms in OM houses, sexual assault complaints brushed aside, and dissenters shamed for not being “responsible” for their own abuse.
  • “The easier thing for me to do is to say I was violated; that way I don’t have to look at my part in it.” — OneTaste lieutenant [84:44]

VI. The Bubble Bursts: Lawsuits, Mainstream Coverage, and Downfall (86:40 - close)

• Mainstream Acceptance & Celebrity Endorsements: OneTaste was featured by Gwyneth Paltrow (Goop), Khloe Kardashian, and Tim Ferriss. By 2016, it made $9.4 million/year.
• Final Evolution: Nicole attempted to formalize the “religion”/occult element (priest of OM, $15K sex-magic classes), indicating escalation of the grift.
• Expose and Prosecution: Critical journalism (notably Ellen Hewitt’s 2018 Bloomberg exposé) finally spurred FBI scrutiny, raids, and successful prosecution of Nicole (9 years federal prison for forced labor conspiracy) and lieutenants.
  • “They were committing these crimes the whole time. As soon as that article comes out, the FBI’s like, oh, I guess we gotta look into this. And there’s just immediately tons of shit to make charges on.” — Brett Goldstein [91:50]
  • “She is convicted, so is Rachel, and they are sentenced to prison.” — Brett Goldstein [93:22]
• Open Endings: Despite convictions, the organization’s leadership and core followers remain loyal to Nicole, awaiting her release.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On cult creation:
  “Cults have to be all-consuming... If you come in with this really narrow focus... you have to get creative to make that all-consuming.” — Brett Goldstein [03:17]

• On media complicity:
  “It winds up working as an advertisement for OneTaste more than anything else.” — Brett Goldstein [18:02]

• On the cult’s self-justification:
  “Sales is love, therefore the universe is made of sales.” — Brett Goldstein [67:04]

• On coercion rhetoric:
  "If you get kicked out, your soul will never relax again." — Nicole Daedone, per Jamie’s account [51:48]

• On escalation of abuse:
  “Skillful violation means... even if they say no, you violate them because you’re skillful enough to know they actually need to have their boundaries violated.” — Brett Goldstein [82:21]

• Jamie’s summary:
  “There’s an element of false feminism. There’s an element of capitalizing on male loneliness. There’s a class element... forced labor, tech element... almost became a religion.” — Jamie Loftus [95:41]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Segment | Timestamp | |-------------------------------------------------|------------| | Introduction, setting the stage | 00:01–07:25| | Communal living, escalation | 07:25–14:28| | Recruitment, “business” side, financial exploitation | 15:34–29:11| | Mainstreaming, TEDx talk | 29:11–41:12| | Anti-queerness and sexual coercion | 41:12–55:03| | Full MLM/tech cult transformation | 55:03–67:04| | ‘Skillful Violation’, normalization of abuse | 67:04–86:40| | Exposure, prosecution, sentencing, reflection | 86:40–end |

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Tone and Takeaways

The conversation—laced with dark humor and mutual disbelief—balances sharp critique with appropriate outrage, using the language and bluntness characteristic of Behind the Bastards. Jamie Loftus and Brett Goldstein (with quips from Robert Evans) highlight the cyclical nature of cult tactics, the complicity of mainstream media and tech culture, and the dangers of unchecked pseudo-feminism that ultimately masks deep-seated misogyny, exploitation, and harm.

Bottom Line:
OneTaste’s saga is a chilling illustration of how abusive power structures can cloak themselves in wellness, empowerment, and entrepreneurial jargon—preying on the vulnerable while being bolstered by cultural naiveté and institutional indifference. Its end came only after years of abuse, media neglect, and a trail of ruined lives—making it a definitive case study in 21st-century grift and cult manipulation.

Transcript

[Robert Evans]

Call Zone Media.

[Brett Goldstein]

Welcome back to behind the Bastards, a podcast that you're listening to or like, watching right now. I think like 10% of the audience watches, but it's impossible to tell because streaming numbers are famously opaque. But you know what's not opaque? Our guest for the podcast today, the great Jamie Loftus, here to help us finish the epic saga of One Taste, a Bay Area orgasm cult that went way too far. Jimmy, welcome back to the show.

[Jamie Loftus]

So good to be here. I am famously translucent. It is nice to not be opaque. Yeah, I, I do wonder who's watching, but usually I feel like if someone is watching, they'll let you know and they'll let you know exactly what looks wrong about you. So I'll, I'll get back to you with, with the numbers.

[Brett Goldstein]

Good to know. We also have on the podcast today our producer, Sophie Lichterman, who is not showing up through video because you don't need to. You. You justify that to you, you maniacs watching the show. You don't need to know why Sophie's not going to be on video. She's not deal with it.

[Robert Evans]

Yeah, we don't need another subreddit about if I'm safe or not, guys.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, podcast listeners, you can just continue

[Robert Evans]

ignoring all of this 2026. I'm not, of course I'm unsafe.

[Brett Goldstein]

What are you talking about? Are you excited to conclude this epic story? Because we had a little bit of a break, a longer one than we usually do between the first two parts and the third. So, you know, you know, I expect things have been building up, edging, if you will, as we wait for, you know, the conclusion here.

[Jamie Loftus]

I liked. It did feel kind of like method podcasting that you sort of left me hanging on the edge of something thrilling for like 10 days and now I'm. I'm ready to. What. What is like is enlightenment? This feeling of knowledge coming? Like, what is. If knowledge is coming, what is that? That's enlightenment, nirvana. It.

[Brett Goldstein]

It's interesting. They come to. The longer one taste goes on, the more Nicole Dodone, who is again, like the leader of all this, gets everyone referring to orgasm as if it's like mana in a role playing game or something. Your orgasm is low or you've got a high level of orgasm, your orgasm's powerful. So they refer to orgasm not as a biological thing that happens, you know, sometimes, but as like this. This mana pool that you build up over time, both through like, oming, through, like receiving it if you have a vagina or through giving, you know, oming you build up your orgasm level, and it's almost like this mana pool that helps you gain power. That's kind of how she talks about it as time goes.

[Jamie Loftus]

And that's sort of what you were doing for us and for the. Okay, I see, I see.

[Brett Goldstein]

That's right. That's right. I wanted to raise your mana. Yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

One of my favorite things about stories is just like the moving goalposts and how you're like, oh, you thought that was coming? Well, actually, there's a secret, different kind of come that there is a huge financial barrier to. To access.

[Brett Goldstein]

It's part of this. Like, cults have to be all consuming. They have to, like, fill every space in your life. Colts don't want you to have, like, hobbies or, you know, outside space stuff going on. So, you know, if you're. If it's a cult, like Scientology, where it's supposed to be all consuming, you've got this totally different way of looking at the world and psychology in the mind, that's easier. But if you come in with, like, this really narrow focus, like Nicole did, where it's just about, you know, cunnilingus, basically, you really have to, like, you have to get creative to make that all consuming, because most people just. It's not an option to, To. To have oral sex all day, every day for that to be, like, your only behavior. So you really have to work to make that everything.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah, you should never. You should never start a cult around something that is free to do.

[Brett Goldstein]

Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yes, It's. It's going to get difficult quickly if people figure out they can come for free at their house.

[Brett Goldstein]

Although, you know, Jamie, people have always technically been able to come for free, and yet one of the most reliable ways to make money is assisting them in that. So.

[Jamie Loftus]

That's true. That's true. And I will say, you know, say what you will about Nicole, but she certainly has gotten creative with it so far.

[Brett Goldstein]

She's creative. She's creative.

[Jamie Loftus]

I have never heard quite of this.

[Brett Goldstein]

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[Brett Goldstein]

So in mid-2006, OneTace used Rob's money. Remember our boy Rob who's you know, she's she's turned into like the figure, the male figurehead, a Lot of the time of the cult in this period. She uses his money to lease a warehouse. And Nicole mandates everyone's gotta live together. Now we're all living in this fucking warehouse. This will be the first of two different warehouses that are like communal living spaces.

[Jamie Loftus]

And initially nice warehouses. Warehouse could mean so much.

[Brett Goldstein]

They're in the bay, you know, it's off of. What's it called? It's off of Folsom Street. So it's not like a. It's an expensive area. Like, it's fairly expensive real estate. From the videos, it's like a warehouse, but not a bay. Bad one. I have spent time in San Francisco warehouses that are living well, Oakland warehouses that were living spaces. This seems like one of the nicer ones, right? Okay, so around 50 people move in at first and they have to give up most of their earthly possessions to do so. Once they all live in the warehouse. Clothing, basically, most things are communal and borrowed or shared. People will, like, borrow and take each other's clothes. If you complain that someone's like taken all of your clothes or taking your stuff and that you don't feel like it's equal, you'll be sort of critiqued or attacked for being too obsessed with attachments. Nicole starts having these. She'll go through a couple of different names, but they're all. There's these various different sort of group meeting structures that she'll do where everyone sits around in a circle and like, critiques each other. This is all downhill from Synanon and the game that they played, where everyone gets in a circle and insults each other. There's different versions of this, but it's a way.

[Jamie Loftus]

The radical honesty approach where it's like, I'm actually. I'm being abusive towards you for your self improvement, because this is how a lot of clowns better than everyone else work.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yep, yep.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

So people who complain that, like, hey, all my clothes have been taken by someone else will be critiqued as being obsessed with attachments. You don't want to be too obsessed with attachments. You know, we're doing this for. For the betterment of humankind. You know, why do you care that everyone's taking your shirts? Everybody sleeps. There's one giant central main room with like a dozen or more beds crammed together. Like, it has to be like 20 beds, 20 something beds for 50 people crammed together and like between two and three people for a bed. It kind of seems like. I think it's usually couples, but it does, at least from some interviews. It seems like some people are doing, you know, throuples or foursomes too. So again, at this point you've got a few dozen, maybe around 50 full time members who have like really devoted themselves completely to the cult. And then a few hundred people in the Bay Area who are kind of taking their courses. Some of these folks are casual. Maybe once or twice a year they'll do a thing. Some of these folks are more regular, you know, they're coming in every month or even every week to do a variety. Maybe they're doing a mix of yoga, some OM classes, whatever. And that's kind of how the cult is limping along at this point in time. So they're.

[Jamie Loftus]

So we've 50 people like full time

[Brett Goldstein]

in the warehouse, full time, living together, completely committed, and then a few hundred people who are like paying money. And you wouldn't even call those folks cult members. Right. Colt has a business side, so it'd be more accurate to say there's maybe 50 or so members and then a few hundred customers. Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

Well, I think that that makes sense for San Francisco.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, yeah, right, right. The cult is not at this point financially self sufficient, but it is making enough money that Nicole only needs to like donations from rich people to kind of seal the gaps. So periodically, you know, probably a few times a month she'll be like, okay, we need X thousand dollars. So we've got to find 1, 2, 3 wealthy donors who are willing to put in this much money. And generally what she's doing is kind of, hey, you remember you took this last class. We've got another one. It costs like five grand. But I know you're really attracted to this cult member. She'll be in the class. Don't you want to get right? That's kind of how this is. And that's not quite prostitution, but that's like on the edge, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Well, especially. Yeah, she has too much. She has all the power in that situation. And also I'm assuming that, you know, at least some of the time she's lying about that.

[Brett Goldstein]

Oh yeah, for sure, for sure.

[Jamie Loftus]

So, yeah. So in a way that is trafficking, isn't it?

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, there's definitely trafficking or trafficking adjacent. It's going to get a lot more direct at this point. It's a little, you know, fuzzy and she always frames this.

[Jamie Loftus]

I'm still enjoying the idea of all of the like, hun, like the few hundred people who are just sort of like one toe into the cult. I think we both live in cities where that is the case for about half of the residents where I'm like, yeah, I probably go to a cult a couple times. Yeah, Yeah, a couple times a month. I probably go to a place that I'm gonna read an expose about in a couple years.

[Brett Goldstein]

I don't know easily. Like I said, I'm not 100% sure. I haven't been to parties with like a bunch of one taste people because I got high a lot in the Bay Area around this time.

[Jamie Loftus]

I've never, I mean it's like we're never going to move into the warehouse. But, you know, not out of the question that maybe you've been to the warehouse. You don't know.

[Brett Goldstein]

I've been to a few. Been to a couple of warehouses.

[Jamie Loftus]

You're an open minded guy.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, yeah, I'm an open minded guy. I love a warehouse. You know, I've maybe preferred.

[Jamie Loftus]

What have I done? Stand up at Robert Evans.

[Robert Evans]

I love a warehouse.

[Brett Goldstein]

I love, I love a good warehouse. Warehouse. Yeah. So. And this is kind of so, you know, on one side you've got Nicole reaching out to these folks who are like regular wealthier customers. These are Bay Area tech bros generally who have a good amount of money. So she's got a list of these guys who she's like, okay, we need money. I can reach out to these dudes and maybe that'll bring in five or ten grand that we need. And then on the other side, within the cult, she frames this often as like a game where like she'll go to a specific member and be like, hey, so we're doing a class and it's a high dollar class. I'll give you a free ticket, but I'm gonna have to partner you up with so and so because he really likes you, you know, do you want a free class? Right. And she would ask you to do her like a favor often for you. Right. Or a favor for them. And so even outside of the classes, she's sometimes saying, hey, this guy needs, you know, I want to convince him to sign up. Would you do me a favor? And favor is a hand job generally. Usually when she uses that term, that means like, I want you to jerk this off for me outside of a class. So now we're really. Now we're. Yeah, come on.

[Jamie Loftus]

No, this isn't. The line has been crossed.

[Brett Goldstein]

This is kind of in your. From a very early point, 2005. 6. There. See, she's regularly. It's not always, but she's pretty regularly crossing the line into. Into prostitution. Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

Well, this like exceeds like certain Epstein tactics To me is like, it's not just you're recruiting someone to go to a second location. It's your being trafficked to go give a hand job to get to a second location.

[Brett Goldstein]

Right. To get them into the class where they'll then be going down on you for an hour or for three days or whatever. Depending on the kind of class that they're doing.

[Jamie Loftus]

Depending on how in the warehouse you are.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, yeah. How in the warehouse you are. And. Yeah, that kind of. Over time, this just becomes a major part of how one taste gets by. Certain moneyed men will pay for group workshops where many of the other seats are taken by other people paying for seats, including women. There are women in the Bay Area who pay for these seats, and they get paired up with these guys, too. But a decent number of seats and holes kind of if we. We haven't sold. Oh, there's 24 slots in this. We only found 15 people, and most of them are men. So we need to make up the difference with a lot of young females from the cult. Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

The ratio is off in the cult.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

We gotta get the range.

[Brett Goldstein]

Right. So by 2008, the constant struggle to keep the lights on in one taste because, again, they're never quite the black has made Nicole. Had made Nicole desperate. Right. She. She likes the lifestyle, but it's also not quite working. And there's. I think she's aware of the risk. I think she knows I've crossed the line already and we're still not profitable. Maybe I should either leave or try to, like, sell off my position in the cult to a mark. Right. So she starts wondering, has this thing run its course? And just as she's wondering, like, do I need to cancel or do I need to end things? A savior appears. And that savior is the New York Times. Oh, one of the reporters calls and hears. I've heard there's this Bay Area company that's in orgasm classes, and they're teaching people how to do orgasmic meditation. Sounds like a great story. And Nicole is like, come on by. We would love to have you. Now, I've quoted a couple of times in the previous episodes from that New York Times article. And what I really want to emphasize to you is that this is a bad and irresponsible piece of journalism. The Times does not come in. There's a couple of lines in there where they're like. Some people say this is problematic. And there's a couple references to. They may be blurring some lines, you know, in regards to.

[Jamie Loftus]

It's so crazy to hear about the New York Times. Both sides of an issue in which there is a clear right side to be on. That's so interesting.

[Brett Goldstein]

No, they treat this like it's a cool tech company. They treat this like it's between. Somewhere between that and like an interesting new, you know, kind of alternative health care thing. Like, like cold plunges or something. It's very much written like that. Or like when that dude was talking, doing all those classes on like I can be submerged in the cold. We did episodes on him for crazy periods. It's like that sort of thing where they're treating it like a fucking Malcolm Gladwell book. Like, oh, she made know. Yeah. She says science tells us this about orgasms. You know, they're just trying to be more scientific. Right. That's how it's framed. These are researchers.

[Jamie Loftus]

How like, I mean the New York Times is its whole own set of issues, but how like east coast journalists often talk about like west coast trends where they are just like, they're just kooky, they're just weird over there. Check out these freaks. And you're like, no, those are sex criminals.

[Brett Goldstein]

No, this is bad.

[Jamie Loftus]

Other weird. Conceive of. Yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

And so as a result the, the article winds up working as an advertisement for one taste more than anything else. And it even features. They take photos of om sessions of like women being stroked in and other like otherwise masturbated in these. In these different clinic classes that go on but like really work safe. So you'll just get like Sophie's going to put one on screen for those that you can see and it's this like beautifully lit photo of just like the top half of a woman and she's, she's like, it's reversed so like her head is facing down and so you could just see her head and she's got this like expression of ecstasy. She's wearing like a black shirt or something. It has her hands like kind of folded across her chest and she's lit so that like it almost looks like her face just her face is glowing.

[Jamie Loftus]

She kind of looks like a vampire coming back to life.

[Brett Goldstein]

Why would you attempt to have this

[Jamie Loftus]

picture taken of you? Oh my God.

[Brett Goldstein]

I mean it's beautiful in the article, the framing of it. The title of the photo is Inner Bliss. At a One Taste urban retreat center, A resident practices orgasmic meditation. Partner not shown.

[Robert Evans]

Partner not shown.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah. So first of all, in the article the Times describes Nicole as a literal quote, sex diva. And here's Sophie will show you again there's this photo. Nicole's right in the center. This is her giving a class. She's like, well lit. Sex diva Nicole dedone, One Tastes founder, says women will experience freedom when they own their sexuality.

[Jamie Loftus]

God, how proud was the writer who came up with the phrase sex diva that they had to write it down?

[Brett Goldstein]

God. God. Fucking.

[Robert Evans]

It's an interesting photo to choose because it almost looks like a, like, like a, like a TED Talk.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah. Well, great. Sophie put a pin in there that. So the article was a massive hit for One Taste. Suddenly journalists, including a lot of, like, local TV news journalists in the Bay Area, are crowding in to get the story on One Taste. And most of them are covering it in positive ways. They're kind of bemused. Look at this kooky thing. But it's like, good. No, like, these are not. Generally wondering, is this all like a sex cult, that she's just like, trafficking her members to rich tech guys in order to. To keep the lights on? Right. That's not really qu asked, you know,

[Jamie Loftus]

and is she still, like, playing into the whole. I mean, what has kind of been striking to me about a lot of the marketing we've looked at is that she's getting. She's got the girl boss scam of like, making it seem like this is good for women and women centered. Yeah, yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

This is empowering. This is empowering going with it. Yeah, yeah. Because this is always framed as like, did you know this very large percentage of women have never had an orgasm or never had an orgasm with another partner? You know, and then from there to like, so that makes this a health issue. Right? And that makes this. And then there's all this, like. And here's what we've learned about the health benefits of orgasm. And so there's always this, like, underpinning of actual statistics and actual stuff. And as a result, it gets covered as if it's just part of the broad sort of body hacking, body optimization stuff that's going crazy in the aughts. And so in very short order, One Taste starts picking up some really, like, mainstream partners. Audible sponsors one of their podcasts. They have like an erotic poetry open mic night. And like Audible sponsors turning that into a podcast.

[Jamie Loftus]

They always. Oh, my God. Every cult is trying to get stand up comedians in the door. Some of the worst people to come in your door. They're the site never forget. I. I came very close. I was nearly persuaded in 2015 to go to a Scientology open mic.

[Brett Goldstein]

Oh, that would have been amazing.

[Jamie Loftus]

They have refreshments they have refreshments.

[Brett Goldstein]

It was really tempting. Awesome. I know man.

[Jamie Loftus]

I know my career would be at a better place. I'm sure they still have that.

[Brett Goldstein]

That sounds great.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

So cult members were very active on social media and specifically like a lot of like local social media like in the Bay Area. So there's a lot of like posts about like was at this great house party. Here's some crazy pictures and you'll see these like like giant cuddle puddles of a bunch of young women. And like 30% of the cuddle puddle will be like schlubby Bay area engineer looking dudes, right? These are all very much framed as being like, hey, are you like a nerdy guy with a lot of money who lives in the Bay Area and maybe he's not good with like women? This cult, there's lots of young women who are good to go. All you gotta do is pay to take a class, right? That's very much what the messaging is to these guys. And a lot of new members are drawn and a lot of new male members in particular are drawn in by posts from residents of the warehouse talking about these wild sex parties and you know, these we're doing, we've got a party and they'll throw parties like on the beach. Here's a one taste party on the beach. Come on, like show up. You know, people are being played with drugs often at these events. They're being plied with sex to get them to pay for and come in and take classes and stuff. I watched an interview with and I think this actually was from the Netflix documentary. I've watched a couple of interviews, but I watched an interview from one of these members who joins during this period of time. And this is a like a middle aged nerdy engineer dude who discovered one taste via these posts and at first assumed this is his quote was like, oh, this either has to be fake or if it's real, they'll never have me, right? But when he showed up, he found out that he in fact had what they wanted most, a credit card quote. One night I was living on a boat by myself and the next I was living with like 40 people sleeping in a bed with my research partner. I was like this nerdy tech guy by day and at night I'd go home and be in the middle of this crazy. And that's the appeal. You can keep being because they don't want you to quit your job. If you're like making a lot of money in the tech industry, you can keep being your nerdy tech guy by day, but you don't. You get to actually be cooler than that. You've got a secret life where you're researching orgasm magic with, like, beautiful young women and living in this, like, free love compound. And so your life is a lot more exciting than the other fucking engineers at Google or whatever.

[Jamie Loftus]

And the fact that all of this is because it's like the wish fulfillment thing is very clear. She could. Couldn't have chosen a better location to find this particular kind of guy.

[Brett Goldstein]

No, perfect, but.

[Jamie Loftus]

And also the Silicon Valley. But the Silicon Valley detail of corporate sponsors for the sex cult.

[Robert Evans]

It's great.

[Jamie Loftus]

Is. Mwah.

[Brett Goldstein]

Mm. It's perfect stuff. And you know what else would be a corporate sponsor for a sex cult?

[Jamie Loftus]

Oh, I have a feeling I know

[Brett Goldstein]

the products and services that support this podcast. Podcast. Some of them may have been. We've had audible ads before. Like, this is what. We've shared at least one advertiser with this sex cult.

[Jamie Loftus]

Let's go for two.

[Robert Evans]

More than one. Let's be honest.

[Brett Goldstein]

More than one. Almost certainly. Anyway.

[Robert Evans]

God, what if it's. What if it's. What if it's an ad for dick pills? What if it's an ad for dick pills?

[Brett Goldstein]

There's a good chance it will be, and I know it is.

[Robert Evans]

I know.

[Brett Goldstein]

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[Brett Goldstein]

Do ask your doctor about fewer medicines. Visit devato.com or call 1-877-844-8872.

[George Severis]

This is George Taveras and Sam Taggart from Stratiolab. Okay, picture it. Your apartment after a Saturday workout. The gym bag, the couch, maybe even the car. Mi amor. It's a full novella of and not the glamorous kind.

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[George Severis]

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[Brett Goldstein]

We're back and we're all hoping that the ad you just heard was for dick pills, because they do. We do have some dick pill sponsors. Wouldn't that be fun? Wouldn't that be a good time everybody?

[Robert Evans]

You know comedy.

[Brett Goldstein]

Hahaha comedy.

[Jamie Loftus]

Love it.

[Brett Goldstein]

So Nicole spent the first few years of the Colts life sharing spaces with everyone else. She's living there initially at the warehouse, but after a few years around 2000, 2010 or 11 I think is kind of when this starts to happen. She decides there's too many demands on her retention. Now coincidentally this is shortly after she starts sometime around 2006 or 7, off and on seeing and then eventually dating seriously. This Silicon Valley entrepreneur and multimillionaire named Reese Jones. Right Now Reese, when they meet, this guy's pushing 50, he's not in great shape, but he's just sold his company to Motorola for a shitload of money. So this guy has spent the first of his life building up and he finally cashed out and he's like kind of over the hill and looking to recapture his youth now that he's got a shitload of money. And he stumbles into one taste for the same reason a fly winds up in a Venus flytrap, right. It's made as a trap for this guy.

[Jamie Loftus]

Rhys Jones. Excellent name for an insecure multimillionaire. Couldn't have written it better myself.

[Brett Goldstein]

Had to be a race. Yeah, had to. Yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

And just oh God, the. Yeah. The idea of conceptually, I feel like we, we encounter them all the time. A 50 year old guy that's like, you know, I think I'm ready to settle down. I think I'm ready.

[Brett Goldstein]

I think I'm ready.

[Jamie Loftus]

I was like, wow, huge. Huge. You've really just figured it out, haven't you?

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, I think I'm ready to settle down with a building full of trafficked people. Yeah. So Reese. Yeah. You know, one taste is losing money badly during most of this period and Nicole needs a rich mark like Rhys to prop everything up. He gives them like a million dollars. He's absolutely critical to their survival during this period of time. So Nicole starts dating Rhys and this is going on from like 2006 or so to like 2011. And she's over this period of time spending more and more time with him, less and less time at the warehouse around her members. She's going on vacations with him. She moves out of the warehouse and into a mansion with him because she decides that it's way to live like a multimillionaire than to live with her colleagues at the masturbation store.

[Jamie Loftus]

Another classic cult moment where you're like. And now the leader has decided that personal space does matter. Only for them.

[Brett Goldstein]

For the leader.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

So from this point on, she no longer lives full time in the communal spaces with her cult members who are still technically researchers, but are starting to look a lot more like her workforce. 2011 was the big shift year for OneTaste, where it goes from being a weird self help, culty thing to a Silicon Valley body hacking startup. Nicole publishes. I mean, and this is. There's a couple of big moments that kind of delineate this shift from the past where One Taste is very much like a descendant of these previous kind of orgasm woo cults that we'd talked about. Right, okay. And there's not much to differentiate her from that until she publishes a book called Slow the Art and Craft of the Female Orgasm. And that happens like right after as One Taste is sort of maturing to be more of a service provider and more of like a body hacking thing than a. We're researching, you know, the future. We're researching orgasm magic too. We're selling courses on orgasmic meditation. Right. As that shift happens, it's kind of signposted by. She puts out this book that sells very well called Slow Sex. And it's framed as a guide for both men and women and dedicated to, quote the organization. May each of us find ours now. Right. She's kind of talking again of like or of orgasm. Like it's magic. One of the book jacket quotes for Slow Sex is by Ian Kerner, a sexuality counselor and New York Times bestselling author of she Comes First. Ian said no. Slow sex is.

[Robert Evans]

No.

[Jamie Loftus]

Dude, no. Oh, my God.

[Brett Goldstein]

Slow sex is the real deal on pleasuring a woman. For any guy who wants his 15 minutes of sexual fame, Doan offers practical and inspired guide to the orgasmic bag. Big leagues.

[Jamie Loftus]

What? No.

[Brett Goldstein]

15 minutes of sexual fame.

[Jamie Loftus]

What the male feminist has clocked in

[Robert Evans]

this is why more than one of my female friends has given me a taser.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah. Oh, there's a lot that's like just the. Yeah, it's wow, she comes first.

[Robert Evans]

Wow, she comes first. She tases second.

[Brett Goldstein]

And you get, you, you really see a lot in terms of who the real customers are here. Because it's always framed as we're doing this for women. This is for and by women. But that quote is like, yeah. For any guy who wants his 15 minutes of sexual fame. Do you want to feel like a big shot? You don't feel like you're the best at like sex and pleasure. Right. Like you're a fucking sex God. Like that's what will make you into. Is like really what one taste is.

[Jamie Loftus]

Selling this slow switch to an orgasm is not something that happens for women. Women. But at them in this way that feels really like that. I don't know.

[Brett Goldstein]

Anyway, it's gross.

[Jamie Loftus]

It almost like it feels reminiscent to me of like a Justin Baldoni playbook of like I'm me respecting women. Women is a business that I have.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

And it is marketed at men, but it's for women. And I just happen to be financially benefiting from it.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah. Now Sophie, I told you to put a pin in this. But the moment that most embodied the evolution of onetaste into Silicon Valley startup was Nicole's TED Talk. Nicole Dodone Orgasm. The cure for hunger. That's the name of this speech. And Sophie's gotta play you a long clip from this fucking TED Talk that shows you how Nicole is pitching this to like a mass all audience. This is her gearing, her pitch to like the biggest possible group of people. Right. So here is like the mainstream focused. Look at this.

[Jamie Loftus]

Okay. Sex diva.

[Robert Evans]

I just want to give it for the. For the non Netflix watchers. She's wearing what I can only describe as like peak.

[Jamie Loftus]

Peak, like express.

[Brett Goldstein]

It looks like 2011 in there.

[Robert Evans]

That's pretty Peak Express blazer with like, with like a. With like a. Ooh, is this a tank underneath in purple?

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah, it's a. A serious woman would never show her arms. So she's wearing a tasteful blazer.

[Robert Evans]

But a little bit of cleave is how. Okay, sorry.

[Nicole Dodone]

So I figure we're TED people, we're fast, we're savvy, we're smart. So I'm just gonna break the ice for us. Okay. My topic is female orgasm.

[Brett Goldstein]

Hold for a blank.

[Nicole Dodone]

So that said, I want to thank the people of TEDx for having me on this stage. This has been a dream of Mine that I thought was absolutely impossible. That we could have a relevant, intelligent conversation about female orgasm was just a distant dream for me. I just fell in love with this practice. That's what happened for me. I gave nearly 10,000 hours to this practice. That's a lot of activity hours, A lot. But I learned some key things in that time that I am bringing to you. The first is that female orgasm is vital for every single woman on the planet. The second is it's not so bad for the guys either. The third, and on a much more serious note, is that it roots our fundamental capacity for connection. Connection. It's for this reason that I believe that at some day, at some point,

[Jamie Loftus]

you will hear two women who look

[Nicole Dodone]

so disinterested and orgasm. And you won't hear it. Yoga, meditation, and orgasm. So in 2004, I founded One Taste Urban Retreat Centers.

[Brett Goldstein]

With this in mind, I think that's. Yeah, yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yes, girl, give us nothing. Oh, my God, I love it.

[Brett Goldstein]

I love it. Oh, that's peak 2011 Silicon Valley hype train nonsense. She's very much. She's doing a Steve Jobs, she's doing a fucking Theranos. She's really trying to thread that needle and doing it very honestly, very successfully. This pivot works great.

[Robert Evans]

I mean, you know what she was giving? She was like, I don't shop at Ann Taylor. I shop at Ann Taylor Loft.

[Jamie Loftus]

I. This is. But I, I really love. This is. I feel like a common feature of any time I'm like watching a TEDx talk for whatever reason that mentioning at the top, like, I never thought I would make it here when I can guarantee you any garden variety narcissist can get a TEDx talk. It is not, it is not difficult.

[Brett Goldstein]

I never thought I would email a PR representative and show them, hey, look at how many followers I have on social. Can I have a TedX talk?

[Jamie Loftus]

I never thought, oh, God, like, it's

[Brett Goldstein]

an award and not what every hack and grifter in the aughts and fucking early 20 teens did a fucking TED Talk. Like, I think we can, us olds remember when there seemed to be some prestige around TED talks? But a lot of it was just a con, you know, A lot of it is how a lot of grifters grifted.

[Jamie Loftus]

Particularly TEDx, which is like, particularly TEDx. Yeah, yeah. Sophie. It was reminding me so much of, like, how we were encouraged to dress in high school and college where, like, I'll look at a picture of myself at 19 and be like, why am I dressed like I'm 50 years old.

[Robert Evans]

Why am I wearing business casual to the frat?

[Brett Goldstein]

Why are we all dressed in business casual?

[Jamie Loftus]

I. I should have been dressing like a huge slut. And it was just such a missed opportunity.

[Robert Evans]

I have the exact same regret, Jamie. But you know what? There's always time. We could do that too.

[Brett Goldstein]

I dressed as a huge slut for that period of time, which means I only wore Ed Hardy shir. My pants, Ed Hardy shirts, my underwear, Ed Hardy shirts, my Ed Hardy shirts. Actually not from Ed Hardy. Anyway.

[Jamie Loftus]

That's the sluttiest thing a man could do at one time.

[Brett Goldstein]

That was at one time.

[Robert Evans]

So Jamie and I are out here in our Ann Taylor loft.

[Brett Goldstein]

That's right. Just like Nicole.

[Jamie Loftus]

I'm older than my mother. There truly are pictures of me as a teenager where I think I look older than I do now. It's so bizarre.

[Brett Goldstein]

It was a weird time for fashion.

[Robert Evans]

I will find a pantsuit. I mean, like a little pantsuit skirt picture that will ruin your day.

[Brett Goldstein]

There was a period of time. Yeah. Where we just thought that like, everyone was gonna dress like Hillary Clinton, you know?

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

If only. If only that had taken over.

[Robert Evans]

Hillary Clinton wishes she found this outfit that I definitely got from H and M on sale.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

You know, so while Nicole was absent from the two different warehouses that her cult members lived in over the years, she was always present in spirit. And by that I mean Nicole. Nicole picked who slept in each bed. She had like a seating chart for beds in the commune spaces. And she would decide who was sleeping with who and paired with who as a research partner. And for all that, Nicole, over the years, she would sometimes date women and she would portray herself. And one taste is very queer positive because it's the aughts and the 20 teens and the bay and you have to. But despite all that, one tastes, teachings and practice were very heteronormative and very much like anti queer in a lot of ways.

[Jamie Loftus]

Well, even what. How she was talking about sex and orgasms felt just. Yeah. Like, because she's ultimately. Her customers are men, right?

[Brett Goldstein]

Yes, exactly, exactly. So I mean. Well, not. I mean there are like she. She does have to get a certain of like female like customers buying in and getting into the cult because she needs to use their bodies in order to further the business. So it is true that. And we've talked about this, right. Like in the last episode I showed you, this was kind of the pitch she's making it to a lot of these, these women. But it is like the. The money part of the cult is entirely focused at selling to men, right? She has to sell one taste to women to get the workforce that she. She then basically traffics to get the money from the guys, right? So there is kind of a two part aspect of it, I guess, which is important to see.

[Jamie Loftus]

The name never gets easier to hear, I have to say.

[Brett Goldstein]

No, it's always upsetting. So as I was saying, man is very heteronormative like the actual cult's teaching. And Nicole is like kind of really anti queer past a certain point. Men and women are always pretty much paired together as far as I can tell. And Nicole would even break up existing queer relationships when people joined the group in order to pair them with opposite sex partners because she doesn't think queer relationships are real. The bleakest example of this is probably the story of two One Taste members, Jamie and Caitlyn. They are a lesbian couple who were drawn.

[Robert Evans]

Wait, hold on.

[Brett Goldstein]

Look, I agree. I know what to tell you.

[Jamie Loftus]

I know what to tell you.

[Brett Goldstein]

I think these are fake names. I think these are fake names that the. I believe because I found this account from Ellen Hewitt's book Empire of Orgasm. I think she's using pseudonyms for these people, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

I think she's a Bechtelkast fan or she's a Bectalclass or a Bechdelcast hater

[Brett Goldstein]

or she wants to this pretty sympathetic people. So Jamie and Caitlyn, this Jamie and Caitlyn are a lesbian couple who get into one taste. They're like teenagers. They're young adult, very young adults. And they're broke. And so they're both obviously interested in female pleasure cause they're lesbians, but they also don't have any money. And so being able to live for free in the bay in this warehouse seems kind of rad. As soon as they move in and again they move in as a partnership, as a unit. Nicole tells them, well, this all is about exploration. We're all trying to grow. And you're not gonna grow if you just stay with like the partner that you like. And you're not gonna grow as a, as a queer woman. You can't grow by just having sex with the people you're attracted to. You can only grow, grow by, by having male partners. That's the only way to grow as a queer woman, right? And so you should, you need where you need to experiment with your sexuality by letting men om you, right? And eventually by having sex with men. Now in public, owing is all that onetaste is about. And in public O whim is described in almost asexual terms because they, they really want to avoid the allegations that they're just trafficking and sex. But within the actual commune people aren't just oming two times a day in the morning and two times at night they're being commanded by Nicole to have intercourse. Right. When she's pairing people up for beds. Those aren't just your om partners, you're ordered to fuck them. And so Caitlyn and Jamie are paired with dudes in the cult, often with dudes, you know, maybe who have some money that are that that Nicole wants to make sure stay right. But they're told they have to fuck dudes to level up basically in order to like gain XP in this cult system in order to make your orgasm more powerful, you have to do these things that you're physically uncomfortable with because you're not into guys.

[Jamie Loftus]

And I'm quote from well at this point are Jamie and Caitlyn as an ally to both, are Jamie and Caitlyn paying for this or are they quote unquote being paid in free lodging?

[Brett Goldstein]

Like how they're being paid? I think mostly in free cause a lot of members do pay but a lot of the ones who don't are the women, especially the younger women. And these two are broke. So I don't think they now it may be because they are getting some money when they're working for the company but it's very uneven and onetaste will switch up what you're being paid at the last minute and often you're feeding that right back into the company. So to that extent maybe they're being given money that they then have to. Yeah, I'm not sure how it works for every individual person. It's kind of different for everybody depending on your position and what Nicole is getting out of you. Right. But to quote from the book Empire of Orgasm, Jamie said that in courses she heard a repeated message. All women are hungry for cock. If you're not feeling cock hungry, you're not connected to a part of yourself. Right. This is very anti queer now eventually both women start having sex with male members of the group. And this is psychologically devastating to Jamie who started to feel like her desire for her girlfriend the woman because they've been broken up forcibly by now. But the person who had been her girlfriend was wrong. She convinces herself to push on because Nicole keeps teaching her resistance is key to growth and she really admires Nicole and she also needs this place to live. Experiences Nicole tells Jamie aren't good or bad for you. Experiences aren't good or bad at all. You choose the meaning. So you are. If you're deciding that this is an unpleasant sexual experience, that's because you made a choice. You could choose for it to be a good one. Why aren't you choosing for it to be a good one? Right, right. See how abusive this logic is?

[Jamie Loftus]

This is just like, yeah. And all under and, and it still sort of falls under the like early 2010s definition of like being pro woman is. I mean, you could even extend this to like Sheryl Sandberg logic of like, it is your fault that you are feeling oppressed and abused and it is on you to, to behave the right way to be accepted in this environment.

[Dovato Medication Announcer]

Environment.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yep. And there's bits of all, there's bits of the secret in there, right. You just have to change your attitude and you can change reality. And you can see both how people don't necessarily pick this out as poisonous initially, but also how running with this logic, the obvious instate of this is that like there's no such thing as rape ever. If experiences are not bad or good, there can't be such a thing as rape. You are choosing to be. Be raped if you're raped, because you're choosing to interpret that as a bad experience. This is directly in those words what Nicole will eventually be teaching her followers. Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

And that is so.

[Brett Goldstein]

I know that's really bad.

[Jamie Loftus]

Like that is. Yeah, that's fucking horrific.

[Brett Goldstein]

It's really, really horrific.

[Jamie Loftus]

It's. Oh God. And it's like that even in the way she's like, the number of like pressure points she's attempting to attack is like she's sort of telling people to dissociate, but also telling them that like the failure to do so or the failure to feel pleasure where pleasure doesn't exist because it's abuse is a personal failure. But it also sounds like she's like, well, if you don't like it, then just pretend you're a person who likes it.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, pretend you're a person who likes it. Why can't you do that? And it's, you'll. I mean, yeah, we'll keep talking. So in time, Jamie becomes a coach and she starts to see success in the organization. And this success, the fact that she's moving up the ladder, so to speak, validates is like the first she. Because again, this is a young queer woman who doesn't have a lot of life experience, I think had a pretty rough background. And so this is like the first validation she's gotten as an adult person. So she becomes extremely loyal, even though this is. She's been horribly abused by this cult, which is a common cult story. Right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Sure, yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

So then in 2012, Nicole calls Jamie and Caitlin in for a little one on one one, and she informs them she's breaking up with Rhys, the Silicon Valley millionaire who had kept the cult alive through its bad years. But she still owes him a lot of money from all the, you know, because he's calling in basically, you know, the loans he'd given them and the

[Jamie Loftus]

amount of like discarded one taste guys at this point could like unionize.

[Brett Goldstein]

And it. She hasn't, I don't fully understand the financials here. She does not discard card him. Some reports I've said suggest that she repays him by 2012, that she's repaid him for like the million dollars that he loans the cult. But that's when this is all happening. And that doesn't entirely line up with this because this suggests she's still getting some money from him in 2012. I don't fully know and I don't claim to know, at which point was Rhys giving the cult money? At which point was Rhys receiving money? But whatever the case, at this point in 2012, she still wants to keep Rhys in the fold even though she's breaking up with him. Right. Because she tells Nicole, I'm not gonna, I'm. I have to move to Los Angeles because I have important work to do there, which is she's trying to find more rich guys. Right. But Rhys needs a handler, and I've been his handler for the last, you know, several years. And in my place, I need you two to be Reese's handlers so that I can move on to Los Angeles. And here's how Ellen Hewitt describes what happens next. Jamie paused. Everything she learned up to this point had primed her to say yes to the position. And to do so willingly idolizing Nicol, becoming accustomed to having sex with men and to having sex with any kind of man, getting off on any stroke, being told that she should provide anything to help the company. Plus being asked to be Reese's handler felt like an honor. Jamie knew that only a few women in One Taste's history had held the same position. They were often Nicole's confidants, an admired group. She also knew the unspoken threat. The consequence of saying no is that you would be ostracized, ignored, and stripped of all your power in that world. Jamie said. So I want to be clear that last bit the fact that if you, if you displease Nicole, if you, like, wind up on the outskirts, you'll be kicked out. You'll lose everything that you've gotten from this world. That is something she directly tells people during lectures after everyone has experienced orgasmic meditation. When folks are in, you know, this powerful cathartic afterglow, she will tell them this is a direct quote from one the of her sessions. That's why this place is called One Taste. Once you've tasted being inside of yourself and knowing yourself, there is some part of your soul that will always crawl to get back. The truth is, if you get kicked out, your soul will never relax again. She's very direct about this.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah, I mean, and she's also like, just describing chasing a dragon, chasing a high.

[Brett Goldstein]

And one of the things when this becomes a quirky, people say, no one was ever forced to have sex with anyone. No one was ever forced to, to stay. And they weren't. They were just heavily coerced and basically told that life will be like a gray, colorless hell of an experience if you get forced out of this group because you won't fuck this rich guy. Right, Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

You're like, well, yeah, maybe then in that case we should expand the definition a little bit.

[Brett Goldstein]

So by 2012, OneTaste has totally come around to becoming, like, seen as a tech startup, to fashioning itself that way. Her followers in Public facing communications are talking about. Talking less about all the crazy parties and a lot more about how Nicole is like a philosopher but also like a Steve Jobs figure. Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

What is she selling though? Like, what is the product exactly?

[Brett Goldstein]

Orgasm power. Magic.

[Jamie Loftus]

God. Okay, I guess, I guess it's. At least we're not having children overseas, manufacturing orgasms.

[Brett Goldstein]

Sure.

[Jamie Loftus]

Jesus.

[Brett Goldstein]

So in the years after 2012, you know, one Taste finally gets into the black, right. It had been struggling. It had been utterly reliant upon these, like, infusions of cash from these rich dudes. And that's not really the case. I mean, kind of after 2012, it's, it's, it's profitable. After 2012, the money is still coming from, like, rich guys who are paying for sex, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Sure.

[Brett Goldstein]

But not one rich guy. Not one rich guy. And not her saying, hey, I need a loan. And it's her instead selling courses to these guys. Right. So it's no longer loans. Like, it is a profitable business after this point, in fact, a quite profitable business. Onetaste not only repays Reese, but it starts to succeed on its own, raking in millions a year and they do this, they make this switch in large part by copying something Nicole had seen from the yoga industry. So during the first part of the 21st century, a lot of yoga studios begin offering teacher training. Now this qualifies somebody to teach a different kind of yoga. Most attendees who do teach yoga training don't become yoga teachers because there's not that many yoga teacher jobs. And so it's often they're doing it for self improvement. It's being pitched as like, oh well you take the teacher class because it makes you that much better. Right. And these are expensive. There's. And I'm not. If you do, if you like, that's fine, right? Whatever. There are some cults within yoga, but also it's fine to pay money to get better at a thing that you like to do, right? I'm not, I'm not shitting on it.

[Jamie Loftus]

I'm just saying nice to receive a gentle touch from a beautiful woman. This is what I mean when it's like we all got our toes in the cult, right?

[Brett Goldstein]

A little bit piece. And so she takes that idea and moves it over to one taste. So she starts selling teaching courses. And this is like this will certify you to teach OM and to do classes of your own. Right? And there's often more advanced because there's, there's endless layers and endless. Every teacher always wants to be. You have to be up on the latest thing. So every year there's a new class about the stuff that you have to get to stay certified and it's another five to $10,000 dollars. Right. These are multi day courses. Again, these are a lot of these

[Jamie Loftus]

are hugely expensive and I'm assuming that the teacher, the teacher training also includes abuse.

[Brett Goldstein]

Well, yeah, I mean, yes, like that, that like big. Sure, yes. Now Nicole had offered a coaching program since 2012 and this is, takes off, it's successful. They make money of it. So increasingly One Taste pours all of its efforts into either hosting coaching classes or selling them. Right. They recruit a huge crop of students in 2012 and eventually they are going to license or whatever, more than 1300 people as OM coaches, each of whom have paid probably well in excess of 10 grand to get to that point. Right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Okay.

[Brett Goldstein]

In some cases much more. The company starts turning a profit in 2013 and before long they are making a surprising amount of money. Nicole begins bringing in celebrity, celebrity guests to provide a sheen of legitimacy. They start doing cult events. They have these like one taste mastery for which are like these big, you know, they're these, like, conferences and stuff for the onetaste family, for all the people who are coaches, because now there's one taste houses in different states, they're starting to fill up and people are doing classes outside of the Bay area, so they're doing these courses. And she's hiring celebrities to, like, talk to everybody at the start of these, like, three day and five day events. For one event in 2013, she hires Dr. Jocelyn Elders, the former attorney general, who tells Stuart, you are part of a new sexual revolution. Great. Thank you, Jocelyn. Wow. I'm sure she just cast the joke.

[Jamie Loftus]

It is always wild hearing these celebrities that cults manage to bag for things like this. It's a good reminder that people are desperate for attention and refuse to do even a basic level of research.

[Brett Goldstein]

Of course not. That's offensive. So I want to show you guys an example of an ad for onetaste's mastery program, which is one of their, like, really advanced, you know, certification. So Sophia is going to play that for us now.

[Robert Evans]

Looks like the masterclass logo.

[Jamie Loftus]

I was going to say this is a very tech logo.

[Brett Goldstein]

Masterclass. Master something else.

[Jamie Loftus]

I'm going to let it slide.

[Brett Goldstein]

This is a course in how to open your sex life.

[Jamie Loftus]

It's a way for you to research

[Brett Goldstein]

what your actual boundaries are. I was at one.

[Nicole Dodone]

I like to make sure that my whole mouth, my whole tongue.

[Brett Goldstein]

Sex without boundaries on screen is the wording there. That's upsetting.

[Jamie Loftus]

And it really takes sex to a whole new paradigm. I learned how to slow down and actually feel everything that's happening versus constantly being in my head.

[Brett Goldstein]

This is something I've never done before. And then I said yes once.

[Jamie Loftus]

I said, only I can't wear it in place.

[Brett Goldstein]

And it was hard.

[Jamie Loftus]

Oh, my God.

[Brett Goldstein]

Looks great.

[Jamie Loftus]

Okay.

[Brett Goldstein]

I love that. One of their quotes is sex without boundaries.

[Jamie Loftus]

Now, there's at least three phrases present in the advertising that could plausibly describe assault.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, Energetic.

[Jamie Loftus]

Energetic. Sex also feels kind of like a line also with all of these. I mean, mean, I guess something that, like, feels like a big. Other than like, the techi of this sex cult. It's like, been decades since this has been accessible to anyone who doesn't have an insane amount of disposable income.

[Brett Goldstein]

Because, like, the original is going to be trafficked, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah, right. Where it's like the, The. The earlier sex cults were like, at least you could be. You could be trafficked as someone who doesn't have a lot of money laying around. Yeah, right. Yeah. The. The cuts to rooms full of white people with bad haircuts really does kind of pull it all into focus of like, what's going on here. God, that's so bleak. The footage.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, yeah. Isn't that remarkable? It's so Mlme. It's so. Yeah, it's really upsetting to me. It's upsetting like again, coming out of like the sex positive community, the kink community. Like the idea that anyone could hear the phrase sex without boundaries and not immediately be like, whoa, wait a second, what are you talking about? What do you mean by that? Because that's a, that's a dangerous phrase, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

And it feels so that's why it, like going back to the New York Times article, like, it's so clearly preying on people who don't have basic, a basic understanding. And it's just how they imagine, like non vanilla sex to work.

[Brett Goldstein]

Right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Non vanilla sex to work.

[Robert Evans]

That video really, really, really reminded me of nxivm.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, very similar. And I didn't catch this until right now. But honestly, that's part of what's most upsetting to me about all of this is that she's almost set this up to be like a fly's web in between. People who like, are know that they want more out of like, sex than they're getting know that like, maybe what, they weren't educated, they didn't get a good enough education, like, what sex could be. They want more out of like, their relationships than they feel like they're getting. And there is like a sex positive, a kink community where people like, aren't trying to like, just take your money and abuse you where you can like, learn stuff like that if you're into that. And she's created like the spider's web in front of it to ensnare people, but in a way that is very much different because, like, if you were to like every, every kink commute, every kink event that I have ever been to starts and a lot of like, education that starts with boundaries and boundary setting. And the importance is not sex without boundaries. The important is knowing what your boundaries are and having ways to make sure everyone else knows them and that you're communicating them and that you can, like, that's what's important. Like the, the. It's so fucked up to create this thing that is meant to almost like stand in between that and people who are curious in order to ensnare and hurt them. That's very much what's happening.

[Robert Evans]

Hey, Jamie. Is Barbie naked behind you?

[Jamie Loftus]

Is Barbie naked behind me? No. She's wearing a painted on bodysuit.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah.

[Robert Evans]

Oh, okay, great. I was just making sure.

[Jamie Loftus]

I used to use her on stage, but she does have a bodysuit painted on the doll.

[Brett Goldstein]

Great, great.

[Jamie Loftus]

Thanks for checking in, Robert.

[Robert Evans]

Robert, now that I've checked in on Barbie, it is time for an ad.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, we should do an ad break.

[Robert Evans]

Okay.

[Brett Goldstein]

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[Brett Goldstein]

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[Brett Goldstein]

All right, and we're back.

[Jamie Loftus]

So I just just sort of closing the loop on talking about kink where like I feel like truly kink communities are our best. Community communicators like it and it makes me really sad like you're saying to see people who are seeking something out and then very likely getting scarred to the point where sex at all is going to be indefinitely traumatizing. But at least they were parted with $10,000 in the process.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah, yeah. At least that happens, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

So as the most expensive courses went from thousands to tens of thousands of dollars. And the big money started rolling in. Much the early members had loved about life in the cult changed. The clitoral massages were still a part of life there. But members now were not called researchers. In fact, there's like a big announcement that, like, you're no longer researchers, you're now employees. And now, in fact, most of you are salesmen. Most of you are like doing, calling, right? Like your job is to call people and try to get them to take classes. Right? Like that's the new business is selling and teaching classes. You're no longer. We did the research, we figured it out, right? The experiment's over. So they move to a new warehouse which has semi private rooms. And yeah, everybody's salespeople now. In order to justify this change, Nicole tells her followers the universe is made of love. Sales is love, Therefore, the universe is made of sales.

[Jamie Loftus]

Okay, honestly, based on the lens of cruelty and evil she's capable of, she's half assing it with this one.

[Brett Goldstein]

She's half assing it. That's lazy. That's lazy. I'm sorry.

[Jamie Loftus]

If sales is love and love is huh?

[Brett Goldstein]

Really, Nicole? That's what we're going with, huh?

[Jamie Loftus]

God, yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

It's a measure of her charisma that no one leaves on the spot after hearing that.

[Jamie Loftus]

Sure.

[Brett Goldstein]

So one of Nicole's most valuable members and employees during this period is a young man named said, who first gets drawn into the group because he was in love with somebody. But he goes to like a class and he falls in love with someone who lives at the warehouse named Maya. And he basically tells Maya, hey, I've got a crush on you. And she's like, well, if you're into me, the best way for us to hang out is for you to take more classes here. And eventually he winds up moving in. Now, Saeed is a really conventionally attractive guy, right? And he starts being used by as a lure by Nicole and Rachel, who's like her head of sales, this woman Rachel, and like the other people running the cool Said, both as like, maybe a way to get off themselves, but also here's a really hot guy. We can use him to bring in both hot women that we want to work and join the cult, but also maybe older women who have money to spend on expensive classes and they want to be paired with this hot dude, right? So a separate part of internal one taste culture, as I've said before, these, like, circular meetings where people will, you know, one way or the other, the purpose is for you to get insulted and mocked and derided and have, like, a cathartic experience. Right. So people will sit around and ask Nicole questions, and she'll answer them and, like, coach them and say, this is what that question tells me about you. Right. During one of these sessions, she focuses on Saeed, and she asks him, why do you think so many of the women here like being paired with you, Saeed? And here's how Ellen Hewitt describes what happens next. Because I'm willing to violate them, he started to say. A murmur of surprise shot through the room as said remembers it. And then the students started cheering. He was cut off, but he had wanted to say, I know how to violate them and ways they want to take them to their edge, but I also don't make them feel taken advantage of or left empty or not held afterwards. All he got to though, was violate. After that, everyone started calling him the violator. Another one Taste executives decided she would call him the. That says a lot. Both that.

[Jamie Loftus]

This.

[Brett Goldstein]

They. They love that term because they love the aggression. That's a bigger and bigger part of it is that, like, aggression is good. Some violence is good. Right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Sex without boundaries.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

That is. I. That is not how I thought that anecdote was gonna go.

[Brett Goldstein]

Nope.

[Jamie Loftus]

That is really. I thought. I genuinely thought it was going to be people who were becoming uncomfortable interjecting and being like, yeah, that is what it feels like. But no, it's doubling down and saying, like, so. So we're just deep enough in at this point where it is sexually violent, and we're. And I'm. I'm shocked at how willing they are to say it.

[Brett Goldstein]

They're willing to say it. And the craziest thing to me is at least if this is being reported accurately by Hewitt, and I have no reason to believe it's not. The violator is the one being violated here. Right. Because after Nicole hears this, she loves this as a branding thing. And she uses Saeed as she starts calling him their hook, literally their hook. Because he will pull women into the company's classes and gatherings. And there's a Of. Lot. Lot of women who, like, are. You know, maybe want to explore that kind of thing and maybe want to explore some more aggressive stuff. Saeed doesn't want that, though. He doesn't actually like being the violator. He doesn't like being called in to do all of these, like, violent and aggressive sex acts in order for Nicole to make more money. But she keeps telling him to go do. Go be the violator again. Go do that. This Other. We've got this other woman who wants it and is willing to pay if you'll, like, spend some time with. With her. Right. And Nicole keeps asking him to go further and further. She signs him to have sex with a one taste executive named Emma who thought the violator sounded hot, and she starts using him to rev her up. Is her words before speaking events. She'll. She'll make him come in and masturbate her, and then she'll go out to, like, give a speech. On another instance, one of Nicole's top lieutenants, Rachel, who's also ordering Saeed to have sex with her, periodically orders him to have sex with another female cult member. He refuses, and Rachel calls him an ungrateful petulant and shouts at him and gets everyone else in the compound shouting at him until he agrees to go upstairs and do it again. Sayyid's not forced to have sex. Exactly. He's just berated and mocked and ostracized when he doesn't.

[Jamie Loftus]

Right. He is forced to have sex.

[Brett Goldstein]

He is b. I would say he is B. But like. But in terms of the people who defend this will be like, well, he could have left. He was a big guy. Why didn't. Like. No one's stopping him. Right. Cause there's not a great. Yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

It is wild how. I mean, how Nicole Cole is, you know, doing classic, like, she's. She's going full darvo and. And then, like. I mean, like, all cults like that there. It seems like a lot of why this is working is not only is she preying on, you know, probably his masculinity, but also that berating is a part of the culture, so no one would flinch at someone being berated.

[Brett Goldstein]

That is a part of it, and it's celebrated. She talks a lot about people needing to have sharp scalpels and that she celebrates that we all have sharp scalpels, which means we're good at cutting each other. It's good to cut each other. We need to do that. It makes us stronger. These are. This is Nicole's literal language, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

You just want, like, someone in the room to have a moment of lucidity and be like, so wait, what is the goal here? No, why did we start doing this? It's.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

God, that is. That's really.

[Brett Goldstein]

I mean, it's pretty bleak.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yes.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yep. So, like, a lot of onetaste cult members. Saeed is also queer. He's bisexual, and at one point, he admits interest to a man, to Rachel, and she allegedly calls him the F word. And forces him out of her bed. So again, this is a very like, queerphobic, anti queer environment too, for the people living in it. By the late 2000 teens, OneTaste was more profitable than ever and had transitioned entirely to depicting itself as a Silicon Valley startup. People who'd once been rich researchers exploring the frontiers of desire and sexual power are now operating a call center, spending days at a time awake, struggling to hit aggressive sales targets. Nicole successfully convinced many of them that selling and buying courses was the infinite game. She talks a lot about games, right? This is very much coming out of these other cults, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah, well. And infinite growth.

[Brett Goldstein]

Because we're in Silicon Valley because of Silicon Valley. Right. And anything was justifiable as long as you had to keep the game going. Right. Per an article in Bloomberg quote, One Taste taught members that money is just an emotional obstacle. It encouraged students to take out multiple credit cards to pay for courses, and some turned to such sites as GoFundMe and Prosper Funding for help. The first time I didn't cover my credit card bill, it broke something in my mind, says Ruan Mipalaga, who went to his first One Taste event in 2012 at age 24, worked for the company for about two years, and left owing $30,000 on his credit cards. I was no longer afraid of, of debt. He says, once you break that barrier, 3,000 is the same as 30,000. At one point, Mipalaga complained that he and his co workers hadn't been paid in two months. He says he was publicly shamed for having a scarcity mindset.

[Jamie Loftus]

Oh, and another hot button phrase that's constantly misused. Nice.

[Brett Goldstein]

Love it.

[Robert Evans]

3,000 is very different than 30,000.

[Brett Goldstein]

Very much so.

[Robert Evans]

My guy now 10 times 3,000. Actually, I don't know.

[Jamie Loftus]

It's scarcity mindset, Sophie.

[Brett Goldstein]

None of it's real money. And you're being like in an LLM, you're always being told, what? What's the big deal? You're going to pay ten grand. This will make you so much better. It will open you up. You'll make that much, so much more money than that. Like, once you really get yourself fully right. Right. It's an investment, you know? Now the Art that Blue Bloomberg article was published by Hewitt, the author of the book Empire of Orgasm, in June of 2018. She was not the first reporter to write critically about One Taste, but she was the first to write critically about One Taste and have it matter. The vast majority of mainstream reporting on the company, as it was generally described, was bemused. But Open minded. In fact, if you want a really good study in journalism versus PR, you should read that first 2008 New York Times article the Pleasure of Principle and then Hewitt's article. Now I think the best example of this is how the Times wrote about Vic Barranco, the Morehouse founder. That's like one of the earlier orgasm cults. This is the guy who liked to crush women's vaginas with his hands when he was in a bad mood. Here's how the term described Vic Morehouse's founder. Vic Barranco was a former appliance salesman who called his philosophy responsible hedonism. By some accounts, Mr. Barranco, who died in 2002, used coercive techniques of mind control. It was a huge ego crushing machine, as any valid monastic tradition is said a man who lived at Morehouse for more than 20 years and did not want to be identified. And like that's all you guys had about Morehouse, really? That's all you had? The New York Times. That's all you needed to say about him.

[Jamie Loftus]

You thought, I really. I mean the New York Times is standout for this. But it's God, I mean it's, it's a lesson. Lesson that no one ever seems to learn. And, and even, I mean that's amazing that, that the article that came out eventually did because that had to probably be hard to get through. Like you just have to have an editor that actually cares about stuff in order to get that done. I don't know, I think, I'm sure we all have like, I have like three Los Angeles cult adjacent things that you're just like, well, I guess we'll just see if a journalist manages to get it through at some point. Point. But it's, that's.

[Brett Goldstein]

Thankfully one did right. Human did, you know, and not only for this article. She'd get dozens of brutal accounts inside Life of Life, inside One Taste. Accounts that the Times could have got. Some of them at least the Times could have gotten. But not only that, she forces onetaste in this article to address the worst allegations of abuse. Vlan Vleck, who is the CEO of One Taste in 2018, admitted to her, we took money from people that were we shouldn't have. Right. So she even gets just within the article before the backlash to it, she gets them to like, oh yeah, you know what? This lady has our number enough that we have to cop to some shit. So by the late 2000 teens, one touch had spread to a number of other countries. This started with Nicole ordering Specific offices opened first in New York and then in Austin, Louisiana, London. But also there's a bunch of independent one taste houses that are being established all over over the country. Per the book Empire of orgasm, almost 501 Tay students would live in 33 different OM houses. This informal network mimicked the way many Silicon Valley tech startups were metastasizing rapidly from city to city. Uber, Lyft, Instacart, and other on demand companies prided themselves on blitz scaling and operating with little overhead or liability. To avoid getting dragged down by employment costs, the startups hired drivers as independent contractors and required them to provide their own cars and equipment. Similarly, many of 1 Tay's sales workers were independent contractors paid on commission. It's all the Silicon Valley grift, right?

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah, it's a classic grift and it's kind of a creative grift in that there is actually no real product. Like the overhead couldn't be lower because what you're selling is assault. Yeah.

[Brett Goldstein]

Speaking of that, when Nicole had established the second warehouse commune, you know, they move out of the first on Folsom and into another one. This is the one that has like semi private rooms, which seems like a positive move. But when they move into this place, Nicole makes it be the rule that none of the bedrooms should have locking doors. And after this point, all of these OM house franchises around the country abide by this rule to disastrous effect. Now, periodically throughout this long journey, Nicole and her top lieutenants would experiment with broadening the curriculum. On several occasions, they attempted to create many male versions of the clitoral stimulation workshops. Right, where you're trying to teach people how to give a hand job really well, I guess. And this never works out as a business. Nobody, for some reason, nobody wants to take hand job classes.

[Jamie Loftus]

It's just so hot.

[Brett Goldstein]

It's really funny.

[Jamie Loftus]

It's really funny.

[Brett Goldstein]

No one interested at all in the dick version of this. If you tried to tell people that like, no, the, the, the penile orgasm is actually a sacred and magical. Get the out of here. Get the out of here.

[Jamie Loftus]

No, it's not.

[Brett Goldstein]

You can't sell that. I'm sorry, nobody's buying it.

[Jamie Loftus]

No, that's too free. That's too free. You cannot. No.

[Brett Goldstein]

Dudes are so screwed up. The only way to make money in that ways is to make people stop coming. Like, you can convince people there's magic in never coming, right? But you can't convince people that like a dick is magic. It's just not.

[Jamie Loftus]

If, if it was, we would know by now we would certainly know. So. Okay.

[Brett Goldstein]

It's very funny to me. And the reason Hewitt gives for I like these classes never take off is that one touches ability to recruit young women both to pay for classes and to provide the sexual. Sexual labor crucial to the organization's focusing doesn't work. They're less interested. If there's also hand job classes, that makes this seem like something else. If it's all focused on just people with vaginas being massaged. Right. And if that's the only thing that's happening, you can convince yourself this is like really women led and like women positive. If like there's also jerk off classes that doesn't work, that's just not a good sell.

[Jamie Loftus]

And so the jerk off classes being completely unprofitable, incidental, super funny. That's so good.

[Brett Goldstein]

So a lot of these people are comfortable being massaged, taking an om because they're being told the men are not getting any sexual gratification out of this. Right. So if you add any kind of male sexual gratification classes in there, even though a lot of men are getting gratified, that's kind of how the money is being made. You have to hide that stuff. So earlier in the episodes we talked about a guy named Ken Blackman. He was a former member of the Welcomed Consensus Orgasm cult who once punched a lady because he had been taught that violence was a kind of honest communication. Nicole eventually recruits this guy as a teacher because she knew him at the Welcomed Consensus and because she's reintroducing a lot of these Welcomed Consensus curriculum about like violence into the Onetaste curriculum. And she, she changes the way they frame it and, and her, her, her, her words. The way she describes this, the term she likes to use is skillful violation. And skillful violation means that, you know, it's better for someone to push through their boundaries even if they say no. So you don't listen to the no, you violate them even though they say no because you're skillful enough to know that they actually need to have their boundaries violated. Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

I'm curious what your opinions are on this. Like, is why is it escalating towards such absurd, absurd violence?

[Brett Goldstein]

Because there's nowhere else for it to go.

[Robert Evans]

Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

It's just escalating it to like, how can I retain control? And eventually it just becomes fear tactics.

[Brett Goldstein]

That's right. If you're honestly trying to help people be more sex positive or like teach them kink stuff, there is a point at which, and it's a Pretty quick point at which people are just kind of good to go on their own. You know, they might want to go to, like, parties or events or, like, take specific technical classes on how to use whatever whip or a fucking St. Andrews cross or whatever, but you don't. They don't need to keep paying money to a group. They don't need to keep listening to a guru. You kind of give people a basic. And they're good to go. If you're not gonna do that, in order to keep them following, you have to constantly have more new curriculum, and eventually that's gonna wind up in some really dangerous directions. Right? And for one taste, it ends in skillful violation. And she. Nicole justifies skillful violation being a thing by teaching that only 25% of human communication is verbal. Right? Trained OM experts learn how to read the nonverbal 75% of communication.

[Jamie Loftus]

That's which I'm sure you don't even realize what you're thinking or what you want. Sure, sure, sure.

[Brett Goldstein]

So a skillful violator is someone who's been trained enough to be able to read someone's real desires and then be able to force them to experience those. Right. At their annual conference. Omx one year, one Tay staff wore shirts with with Penetrate written on the front.

[Robert Evans]

No God.

[Brett Goldstein]

Great stuff.

[Dovato Medication Announcer]

Nope.

[Brett Goldstein]

In 2013, a member of an OM House in Austin posted on OM Hub, the Colts internal social network, and claimed that a man had repeatedly entered her room and sexually harassed her. Because again, the doors don't lock. This blows up internally. This is like a causes of problems. People are saying, shouldn't we be able to lock doors? Who was this guy? Should he even have been there? This seems like a problem. And initially Rob comments internally and apologizes and says like, we'll get right on it. But after that, a bunch of Nicole's lieutenants come in, and I think this is actually Rachel, who comes in and is. They're due damage control. And one of her lieutenants posts, as a woman, the easier thing for me to do is say I was violated. That way I don't have to look at my part in it.

[Jamie Loftus]

Oh, okay, great. Okay.

[Brett Goldstein]

Your part. She was in room that won't lock. What was her part like?

[Jamie Loftus]

It is insane how regressive it gets. Yeah, it gets. Okay.

[Brett Goldstein]

Now by this point, Nicole has added a section to her coaching program lecture where she claims to have seen a 2013 study from somewhere which researchers studied in which researchers studied rape victims to see how they'd healed afterwards. And Nicole claimed the women who recovered were the women who took responsibility for the action.

[Jamie Loftus]

Right, right. Okay.

[Brett Goldstein]

So this is part of what she's teaching now. This becomes an increasingly important message for the cult because in 2014, a sales meeting was called and one of Nicole's representatives told the company, it's really important that we not break any prostitution's laws while selling courses. And attendees say, like, oh, that was a moment where I realized they're kind of telling me to prostitute myself, but just not to talk about it that way. Otherwise they wouldn't have brought them that up at all. Now, Nicole increasingly lectures about how sexual trauma is the result of not wanting sex enough. And as she taught, if you change your mental state, the ones that accept one that accepts sex as always a positive thing, you literally can't be raped. And while she gave these courses, she would talk about how she was sexually abused as a child and explain, the only way I healed is that I accepted I had actually caused that situation by coming on to him. And also that was it. It was a good thing, right, that it made me more powerful. Likewise, if someone expressed a fear or a phobia related to sexual trauma, the solution was to embrace that trauma and find a way to enjoy it. People are encouraged, slash forced to participate in rape and bondage play because they'd been raped or subjected to intimate partner violence. As Nicole said, the places you hate are your practice. They're actually your biggest gift. They're the places where you. You get free.

[Jamie Loftus]

This line of deeply depressing because it's like not only practicing dissociation through being actively abused, but again, going back into like all of these. She's capitalizing on these popular narratives about kink and by like suggesting that you would only be interested in this if you've experienced extreme trauma and enjoy dissociate. Like, it's just so. It's such hor. This is a such so dangerous.

[Brett Goldstein]

It's really bad. Yeah. 2016, the company made $9.4 million. Gwyneth Paltrow praised them openly. They do some like, goop stuff Khloe Kardashian talks about.

[Jamie Loftus]

Shocking. It took her that long.

[Brett Goldstein]

Tim Ferriss does like a podcast thing about them. You know, at the most advanced stage of the grift, one taste was breaking into the mainstream, or at least the mainstream part of the Woo self help world. While the public facing part of the company was very much in line with the body modification, self optimization Bay area culture of the era, that's not what's actually going on internally and inside there are ongoing experiments that are like verging on occult nonsense. At one point Nicole starts initiating priests of Om and selling like $15,000 classes where rich guys can participate in these like drug drenched sex magical rituals and get like certified as priests. And I think Nicole's idea, because this never fully turns into anything, I think the idea at one point was that if this is successful enough, if enough guys are interested, if this proves to have legs, maybe we can apply for tax free status and call ourselves a religion. Right. I think Nicole was like exploring and just doesn't quite get the chance to live this grift out.

[Jamie Loftus]

I mean she is convenient committing enough sex crimes I think to qualify as a tax religion. Yeah, yeah, you might as well at that point she's, she's committed enough crimes to be a religion.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yep. So she is getting much more reckless with everything as the years go on. I found at least one account from a former member who claims Nicole plied these rich tech guys with drugs at these high dollar classes. And you know, these are. Not only are they basically paying to get into an orgy, but like at one point this one member says Nicole specifically doses a dude with a bunch of ACT LSD to try to convince him to donate another $250,000 to the company. Right. So that's part of what she's doing.

[Jamie Loftus]

I'm honestly shocked at how, because of how modern this story is that there is no. It doesn't seem like any member of the cult who has that. There's been no significant whistleblowing incident by this point.

[Brett Goldstein]

Not yet. Pieces have come out. But yeah, that's not going to happen until 2018 when Hewitt put that article out. But because the men with money are so core to everything happening here, Nicole's teachings trended towards explaining how it was good for men to be angry and controlling to women. She called this letting out your beast and praised it. Everyone was increasingly encouraged to be brutal towards each other, to cut each other up with their skillful scalpels. Nicole also praised intimate partner violence, most of which seems to have been man on woman. Women were who were beat by their partners, were told that they had caused the situation by goading his beast or not understanding his beast enough. If they sought to escape abusive situations, they were insulted from fleeing from his beast rather than meeting it with love. So these Om priest classes and orgy sessions could net as much as a million dollars for one taste for a five day class. These are the real top dollar things and the guys in these, they are just paying to get into an orgy. With a bunch of young women. Right, Right. And while they have.

[Jamie Loftus]

It has to seem like school as well, it's gotta.

[Brett Goldstein]

Right, Right. And this, you know, this works for years without them getting in trouble, but it couldn't last forever. By 2017, there's a couple of pending lawsuits and there's some, like, rumblings that bad press might be coming. Right. And Nicole decides to separate herself legally from the group in the hope of gaining some sort of plausible deniability. So she sells the company for 12 million million to, like, her wealthiest followers. And this is framed as the company maturing. Right. Nicole's still going to be the spiritual and intellectual leader, but one Taste is going to be run like a normal company with, like a CEO and a normal business chain of command. Right. Now, initially, it seems like maybe this will work. In 2018, 35,000 people had attended One Taste events in cities around the world. And hundreds of members lived in OM houses in multiple countries. OMM ing twice in the morning and twice in the evening, and often quitting their careers to sell courses. But that same year, Bloomberg published Hewitt's first bombshell article about the cult, which described it as looking like a prostitution ring. That article quoted former employees saying stuff like, orgasm was God and Nicole was like Jesus. And I want to quote from an article in the Times about the fallout from this article. One Taste went quiet. It shut down all centers and courses. A group of about 30 senior practitioners, including Nicole, retreated to the land, which is like a chance chunk of land that they're starting a compound on. Right then came a BBC podcast, the Orgasm Cult, a Netflix documentary, Orgasm Inc. A Device documentary, and a Playboy investigation. On June. In June of 2023, the FBI stormed the land. Doone and Cherwitz, that's Rachel, were arrested. The company has spent about $15 million on legal fees since 2018, suing the BBC, suing Netflix, suing a former member, being sued by another member for alleged sex trafficking, and fighting the prison criminal trial. And yeah, that's that. And it's one of those things where they were committing these crimes the whole time. It's. As soon as that article comes out, the FBI's like, oh, I guess we gotta look into this. And there's just immediately tons of shit to make charges on. Rachel is like she accused of targeting vulnerable people by advertising that the company's like, classes could fix sexual trauma, telling people to take on debt to pay for classes, withholding wages from employees. I isolating people by demanding absolute commitment. She's accused of participating in abusive employment practices. Subjecting members to economic, sexual, emotional, and psychological abuse, surveillance, indoctrination, and intimidation. And Doan is accused of, you know, participating in or of. Of sexually trafficking people. Of a whole bunch of bad stuff. Right. And there's a lot we don't need to get into everything that happens in the court case, you know, just a few weeks ago. Earlier this year, Doan was sentenced to nine years in federal prison. She is convicted, so is Rachel, and they are sentenced both to prison sentences. Nicole again gets, like, nine years, which,

[Jamie Loftus]

as, as always, seems low.

[Brett Goldstein]

Seems low. Seems low. Judge Gujarati says that Nicole caused long lasting, if not irreparable harm to former OneTaste employees. What she was doing wasn't about enlightenment or operating in a different dimension. It was criminal. Doan has not accepted any wrongdoing. Neither has one taste. The people currently leading things still stand by her and basically say she's the fucking best. They're apparently, like, at least the way they're framing it is. We're waiting for her. You know, as soon as she gets out, you know, we'll.

[Febreze Announcer]

We'll.

[Brett Goldstein]

We'll be able to get back to the important work.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah. Jesus. Jesus famously returns. That is. What did. What does she end up getting convicted on? I'm curious.

[Brett Goldstein]

Oh, gosh. Let's get the exact list up here. Because, I mean, obviously sex trafficking is part of it.

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah, it's so. Because every time I hear about a case like this and then you hear the actual conviction, it does sound like she was able to probably get out a lot of consequences by being able to argue, well, technically, there was a degree of choice, even though people were so psychologically fucked that I would argue that that's not true.

[Brett Goldstein]

I mean, we'll see how much that help. But she does get like, it's a forced labor conspiracy, like, it's conspiracy to commit forced labor that she gets in trouble with and gets convicted of. Like, forced labor conspiracy, like, is like, the actual crime she's convicted on is forced labor conspiracy alongside a little under 900 grand in restitution and two years supervised release. And it's just so far, seven victims confirmed. Right? That's based on this. The only accomplice who goes down with her is Rachel. Obviously, a lot of other people were complicit and still are, but. Yeah, I don't think OneTaste is gonna have the juice to survive until she's done, but we'll see.

[Robert Evans]

Lord have mercy.

[Jamie Loftus]

I know. Truly, I hope not. I hope not. But usually with something like this, unfortunately, there's Just gonna be another grifter that innovates in the field of, you know, taking advantage of people. So.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yep, yep, yep.

[Jamie Loftus]

Holy shit.

[Brett Goldstein]

Well, well.

[Jamie Loftus]

Holy shit.

[Brett Goldstein]

Robert, has this influenced any of your thinking on how to create your own cult? Jamie.

[Jamie Loftus]

Look, Nicole, this was a truly horrific one. I. I feel like she really did find a way to incorporate almost every. Every grift of the last 20 years.

[Brett Goldstein]

It really is impressive in that a single.

[Jamie Loftus]

There's an element of false feminism. There is an element of capitalizing on male loneliness. There's a class element to it. There's indentured labor, there's forced labor. There's a tech element. I mean, it really does kind of run the gamut. And. And she almost became a religion. I think that really would have been the bingo. Right. Is to rebrand as a religion.

[Brett Goldstein]

That's what I will do eventually when I finally best this with a cult that's about the opposite of orgasming. I'm gonna teach people how to poop. Right. You know, I think that's the next grift.

[Jamie Loftus]

Well, and I think that's also.

[Brett Goldstein]

I mean, you're doing it wrong. Poop Right.

[Jamie Loftus]

A good name.

[Brett Goldstein]

If you get better at it, there's magic. It'll make you immortal.

[Jamie Loftus]

Look, media literacy is at an all time low. I think you should call it Poop. Right. Get to the point.

[Brett Goldstein]

Poop. Right. Call it Poop.

[Jamie Loftus]

Right. One taste. I had to think too hard and

[Brett Goldstein]

like, by three years on, I'll be teaching people that, like, if you're. If you're not eating an all grape diet, like God is going to kill your children or something like that, it'll go crazy after a while. But up to that point, we'll have a lot of fun, you know?

[Jamie Loftus]

Yeah.

[Robert Evans]

And you'll sell so many supplements.

[Brett Goldstein]

So many supplements. It's basically all supplements.

[Jamie Loftus]

Oh, my gosh. She wasn't selling supplements. That's a big. That was a mislead.

[Brett Goldstein]

She wasn't actually. You're right. That was an error.

[Jamie Loftus]

That was. There should have been a useless product.

[Robert Evans]

Yeah. There were so many things she could have sold under the one taste name. She fucked it.

[Jamie Loftus]

God, I. I guess when I'm. When I'm. Signing over my $20,000 check, I. I hope I'll remember to withhold it when you're like, actually, the best way to poop is to punch your spouse before dinner. That's the only way to really release, is to assault someone immediately before taking the healthiest shit of your life.

[Brett Goldstein]

Jamie. I would never do that. But the key to pooping is to live on a boat for several years. Like robbing merchant vessels for me in order that I can, like, sell the proceeds. That's how you do it.

[Jamie Loftus]

That's kind of brilliant to sell a poop only you could take.

[Brett Goldstein]

That's right. That's right. Okay.

[Jamie Loftus]

Well, this is a good blue sky meeting, I think. Yeah, this is good. I feel good about it.

[Brett Goldstein]

Great stuff. Yeah, I think we're, we're on our way here. Jamie, you got any pluggables here?

[Jamie Loftus]

Oh, man, the usuals. I, I, I have a book coming out next year that there's no link for. So I, I'll, I'll let you know when there's a link for it. But for now, listen to the Bechtel cast every week. Listen to we the Unhoused every other week, both on Thursdays and Tuesdays respectively. And, and yeah, take a, take a healthy shift for free at your house tonight. Do that. Do that for me.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yep. All right, everybody.

[Jamie Loftus]

I'm trying to undercut your business.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah.

[Jamie Loftus]

Wow.

[Brett Goldstein]

Yeah. Thank you. All right, everyone, we're done. Go away. Bye.

[Robert Evans]

Behind the Bastards is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more from Cool Zone Media, Visit our website, coolzone media.com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Full video episodes of behind the Bastards are now streaming on Netflix, dropping every Tuesday and Thursday. Hit remind me on Netflix so you don't miss an episode. For clips in our older episode catalog, continue to subscribe to our YouTube channel, YouTube.com BehindTheBastards we love about 40% of you. Statistically speaking,

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