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BibleThinker
Will Anyone Hold Him Accountable?
01:12:24
Dear followers of Che Ahn, I am doing this for you more than for anyone else. I hope you heed this warning and protect yourselves. My video on Shawn Bolz with important background info for this video is HERE. Ron Cantor's videos on Che Ahn. He will have a new one out very soon:1. Che's former sister in law shares her story of Che covering things up: Click Here2. Another story of coverup by Che Ahn: Click Here3. Ron’s video about his meeting with Che Ahn. Che did the same stuff to Ron that he did to me: Click Here My series of videos on Coverup Culture in the Charismatic Church: Click Here My website: https://BibleThinker.org
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Transcript67 lines
- [00:00]
A
Che told me I have a witness for this. And Che, you want to say I'm a liar? You can sue me. I hope you don't because you've wasted my time and money. But I will not back down. You lied. You lied to me. You lied to everybody. You're lying right now. One of the biggest apostles in America has been lying to everyone. I'm going to expose that right now in this video. I actually spoke with this guy yesterday. He lied to my face. And I had told him at the beginning of the meeting that if he did that, if he was dishonest, I would hold him publicly accountable. And this video is me trying to do that. This is part of my series of videos on Cover Up Culture. I'll link them down below. None of these videos are monetized. I'm not making anything from this and I'm sad to bring it to you, but you need to understand who this guy is. This is Cha Ahn, Chae Ahn. He's kind of a big deal. He is a mega apostle, at least that's my term for him. An apostle who is head over countless individuals. He is the pastor of Harvest Rock Church in Pasadena, California, which is just an north of me about an hour, which is why I was able to have an in person meeting with him yesterday. The NAR is an organization that has long been talked about and whispered about and critiqued. And a lot of the folks who were involved in some of the practices people critique about the NAR related to apostles and prophets and end times stuff and church government and things that I believe lead to the disaster of COVID up culture that we've been seeing in the Charismatic church. A lot of those churches will deny it. They'll be like, we're not part of the NAR because they don't have officially used the term. He stands. For those who know, I won't get into this in detail. For those who know, he sits in the footsteps in the seat of Peter Wagner. He is in charge of that organization and he is kind of a big deal. If you look at their network here, let me put this up on your screen. This is what they claim on their website about their network. So you gotta get the backstory. I'm gonna give you all the details today and if you're in a hurry, I just suggest skip towards the end of the video because that's where I think the most egregious lies will be demonstrated. But I want to give it all here today because I want to do this evidence dump and then Move on to other things. Well, the next thing, I have a few more videos in this series I need to make before I get back to doing verse by verse stuff. So it says we're a global apostolic family with more than 25,000 affiliated ministries and organizations in over 65 nations. HIM, that stands for Harvest International Ministries. That is the current branding for the NAR is actively advancing the kingdom of God through his love and. And his power across the globe. All right, kind of a big deal. In our private meeting with me and him and there were two others, I brought a witness and he brought a witness, and both of them were taking notes. So I've got notes from it as well. In that meeting, he actually told me he had 70,000 pastors under him and it was in 73 countries, implying that this website information is actually old and greatly understated. Apostle, in other words, to thousands and thousands of churches. If him. If Cheon's ministry was listed as a denomination, which I don't believe it is, it would be one of the biggest denominations, Protestant denominations in existence. It's huge. He's actually running for governor right now. Governor of California. This is Cheon running for governor. And I think we probably have similar politics. I'm strongly conservative, and that's the same direction he's running from. Running on, I should say running for. I don't know how you say it. He's also best friends with Bill Johnson. Allow me to actually show you this. Him and Bill Johnson have a very close relationship. And here's a clip of them together where you can kind of get this demonstrated. I think I should be on the bottom left for this part. Him and Bill, good friends. Good, good friends. They like to vacation together.
- [03:51]
B
Welcome to Equipping the Saints. I'm your host, Chae Ahn, and I'm with one of my closest friends whom I love. We're Covenant brothers and we actually go on vacation together. We call it a retreat, but it's actually a vacation where we have a lot of fun. And we've been doing that, Bill, since 2006. So it's been amazing.
- [04:08]
A
Almost 20. So 20 years of going on vacation together, spending time together, best friend years
- [04:13]
B
worth of hanging out. And when you are with someone for a whole week, you really get to know them. And I just wanted to say, Bill, you're the real deal. But you are from the. In the pulpit where most people see you. I know you personally, and you are such a Christlike leader. In fact, I see Bill as my apostle. And so it's Such an honor to have you here. I love you so much.
- [04:36]
A
So Bill is his apostle. Let's keep this in mind. Because he's an apostle. He has an apostle. Don't ask me to explain that. Everybody's supposed to be under an apostle in this system, the NAR sort of value system and belief in how you get gifts funneled to you and the unlocking of your prophetic powers and your ability to have the full work of the Holy Spirit, it connects to you getting under an apostle. So 70,000 pastors are under Che, he says. Che, he says, is under Bill. Great friends. Now let me explain why I'm making this video. I'm not suggesting that just because they have a friendship there's something nefarious there. Not at all. But when you see that in light of the rest of this video, you'll understand why. This shows that Bill and Che did the same thing with Sean Bowles. They both did the same thing with this guy. They both. This is Shambles. Please. If you haven't seen that big video that's more important than the video I'm doing. I'll link it down below. Just stop watching this. Watch the Shambles video. I will link it in the description and you can check it out. But if you already know it, you know, sexual deviant, all kinds of inappropriate domineering behaviors in that regard towards people that could probably could, I believe, could file lawsuits rightfully. So then there's the fake prophecies. And he was propped up as a prophet to the world. And then he was exposed. He was exposed by not the leaders who knew about it for years and years, but by others who wouldn't hold their tongue and stuck their necks out to expose it. Anyway, I did a whole video on that and all the COVID up that was around that. The reason why I'm making this video today is because in the course of making these Bulls videos, the one Big Bulls video, and some other stuff after that, I've exposed Shayan and I exposed that he appointed Sean Bowles as a prophet multiple times. Let me give you some examples because this is the backstory that will make today's video make sense to you. So multiple times Che put in shamboles as a prophet. Here is one of those examples. I'll put on your screen. This. It says here, and I shared this one earlier, but we need to get caught back up. It says there's a special night, Chase 2015 post special night commissioning apostles and prophets at the leadership conference at H Rock Church. That's his church. Here we have Brian Simmons, one of the chief apostles in Cheon's network, the author of the pastor translation. I believe a fraudulent translation. That's my understanding, and I've done a lot of work to try to expose it. These guys are keeping the sales going for Brian Simmons anyways. He's giving an anointing here to Sean Bowles. You've got also Patricia King at the anointing. You've got Cheyenne at the anointing. You've got Bill Johnson at the anointing and other people here, Cindy Jacobs and others in the same picture. So that's one of the times in which Che actually appointed him as an apostle. Now, if you. Or as a prophet. Excuse me. If you appoint people, if you commission them as a prophet, you're obviously responsible for them. Che is going to deny that he had direct responsibility to expose sham bulls. And this demonstrates that that's not the case. There's another one I want to show you on this. This is the kind of way in which Che would talk about Sean. He says, you can't help but be encouraged when Sean Bowles. Let me get this where you guys can see it a little bit better. You can't help but be encouraged when Sean Bowles shares words of knowledge. This man carries. I'm doing a very poor job. Here we go. This will do it. This man carries humility and love. This is exactly January 14, 2016. This is exactly when Sean is making up stuff. He's looking up things on Facebook. He's lying to people in the name of God. He's blaspheming God's name. It's a deceitful and evil sin. Right. And Che agreed. In our conversation, this was a very evil thing, what Sean was doing. But Che helped prop him up. He helped encourage other people to follow him, to believe him, to trust that the man carries humility and love. So he's a trustworthy man. Right? And he's appointed and commissioned multiple times. I just showed you one of them by Cheon as a prophet. So that was the first issue. He appointed Sean Bowles. Number two. He had Bowles directly and officially under his authority as a prophet because Sean Bowles had signed up for the HIM network and was underneath Che. He was officially in their network. He was not officially in the Bethel network. There's no official connection there. There was a lot of unofficial, very important connections, but nothing like paperwork related like this. And then, number three, he knew about Bowles fake prophecy and sexual abusive behaviors to employees. In 2020. In 2020, he distanced himself from Bowles. He washed his hands of it. Ultimately, he didn't warn pretty much anybody, despite what he will imply in a recent video. He didn't warn people like he should have. And he Then after 2020, Che endorsed two of Sean Bowles's books. I think I may have reported both. I know I reported at least one of them. Two of them wrote endorsements for two of Sean Bowles's books. One of them is right here. The book Encounter, right where Cheon wrote an endorsement, calls Sean my good friend. This is way after he was exposed and Chase endorsed. He did the exact same thing Bill Johnson did, endorsing the man who he needed to expose. Then recently, recently, after my video went public on Shambles, it was a while later I did a little update and that included more information on Che. Che comes out and he makes a video, a short video. It was clipped from a larger message where he tells his church things that I believe were totally deceptive. And I'm going to show you the evidence that he was deceiving the masses about his involvement with Sean and what he did afterwards. And he denies having done cover up. He was doing cover up in that very video. I'd like to show you that he was trying to do it in a meeting with me just yesterday. And I'd like to give you guys the update on that. So you're going to get all that stuff today. So he recently deceived the masses about this and did more cover up culture while denying that he was doing it. So after seeing his video, I was like, I'm going to reply to this. Okay, his video goes out. And shortly thereafter, as soon as I had the time, I sent an email to Che. And let me put that email on screen so you guys can see it. This was on February the seventh. I sent an email in and initially I sent it through his website. And you don't see the whole text here of the email because this is their contact form. So I just got a screenshot to demonstrate. Like, hey, I actually did send this email. I didn't get a reply immediately. So I went ahead and somebody gave me his private email address. And so I was able to send out an additional email. And that one went out. Let me find it real quick in my notes. That additional email, you can tell I'm trying not to spend too much time on this video because there's so much other stuff. We'll come back to that later. So much other stuff that I have to deal with and I want to get onto those things because I want to move on from this project. So then I sent the following email and I think transparency is the best thing for this stuff. This is not entertainment. This is actually about creating an evidential record of what has happened in order. Because the details, the facts of the details, that's what matters. In order to expose, cover up culture. And what happens is they'll try to move to intentions. Oh, but I meant this and I intended this. And what we need to do is focus on what actually happened. That will reveal more about intentions and people's claims about what they were trying to do. So I said, hi, Che, on February 7. I believe you have been misleading people in your public statements about Sean Bowles, but I want to give every opportunity for you to be defended. Well, I think I meant as well. And I am more than willing to applaud your integrity and honesty and publicly state as much if I can confirm I'm wrong about what you've said and done. You've said you warned him leaders about Shawn, which seems to comprise 20 to 25,000 ministries and pastors. You claim this happened in 2020. Can I have the proof of this warning in the form of a copy of an email, a letter, a statement of some kind that traces back to 2020? You also endorsed Sean's book, which came out in 2022. Can you explain that, please? I'll be honest, Che. I'm currently convinced you're lying, but I genuinely want to know the truth and will champion your innocence if I'm shown it through evidence that contradicts all the evidence I already have. Please respond promptly and know that this is not a threat or meant as a way to control you. You're free to respond or ignore me. I'm a Christian who's trying to help my fellow Christians, many of whom me seem. Many of whom always. I try to say that many of whom seem to have been lied to by you very recently. I will follow what scripture says about how to handle a leader and who does what it looks like you are doing. So in other words, I'm going to expose that's what Scripture says. It's a public sin to lie to millions of people and it should be dealt with publicly, not just privately. And if he won't deal with it publicly, correct it, then it's okay for other people who have influence and the ability to do so. Well, that's what we're going to do right now. It turns out that he responded to this email. This email, he actually responded. I think it was a couple days later and said, hey, let's get together and meet. So we planned a meeting March 3rd. That's yesterday morning. From the time that I'm recording this video, we actually met four people in the room. Che and his guy, me and my guy, and we just each brought someone, and that person was just taking notes. There was not a recorded meeting. At least I didn't record it. And he said he didn't record it. And I did tell him at the beginning of the meeting. I want to hear you out. I'm really grateful for this meeting. But I also want you to know that if you are misleading or if you try to mislead in this meeting, I intend to hold you publicly accountable. So here is the evidence that Che needs to be held publicly accountable. Because Che's people, the people at Harvest, I hope you guys, above all else, I hope that people who follow Chay on will watch this and see this, because you guys deserve to know that you're being misled by your apostle Che, by your papa Che, that he's misleading you. And he continues to do it. Okay, here we go. Let's get into the details. I exposed coverup culture on January 17, 2026. Much of what I share was already known to the leaders. It was just now you guys knew, it was weeks later that Che responds. And we're going to go through his response video. February 1, 2026. He also did, and I'll show you a better version of this, but he also did a written response that he sent out to people that was also misleading. I'll talk about that, too. This needs to be accountability for this, because I'll tell you what, if you'll do this with Sean Bowles, you will do this with a list of other people that I believe you have done this with. But I can only show you guys what I can show you guys. So February 1st, this is what Chaeyeon did. He made a video and it went out, and it was problematic. Okay, I'll show you the screen, what the video looked like, and then we're actually going to play through the clips and see the problems demonstrated to you. This was the video. It was Pastor Chaeyon speaks on accountability within the church. You might notice his YouTube channel is not very big. That's because his primary platform, unlike me, is not YouTube. His primary platform is his HIM Network. And this is the stuff he's saying to the HIM network. So we're going to start playing through those clips right now, and I want to take this opportunity to set the record straight and show what's true and also demonstrate deceitful lies and sometimes just misleading stuff where it's like, well, is that technically a lie? Well, it's definitely misleading. You definitely put an untruth into the minds of the people listening to you. We're going to walk through all of that. Here is the beginning on April 8th,
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B
when I get a call from Patricia King in 2020. She called about one of our HIM members, Sean Boltz. He joined us in 2013. I have the application.
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A
We will talk more about that application later. They actually showed it to me in our meeting. We'll talk more about that now.
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B
When you applied to be a member, we ask you if it's your primary alignment or secondary and send the application paper down. Hm is my secondary. My primary is Bethel and Global Legacy. I told Patricia what you're telling me. We need to tell Bill. We need to tell Chris because they're the reason why we have primary. Secondary, because we have anticipated there'll be pastors who will fall. But the question then is who will be responsible for bringing discipline and restoration?
- [16:58]
A
You get the idea. I'll just tell you now. You get the idea that, okay, he's not actually responsible for bringing discipline and restoration. He's telling you that's not his job. On the document, it says primary. Secondary. We're secondary. He's listed as primary. They brought to the meeting the document that shows this. They actually brought Sean Bowles application to the HIM network. I didn't try to take a photo of it or anything. I felt like that would be like, inappropriate for me to grab my phone and do that because it's probably some privileged information on there. But they did show it to me, willingly showed it to me. I looked through the document and I couldn't find a place in it where it says that Chaeyon is the secondary and that Bill Johnson and Global Legacy is the primary. I couldn't find it. And so I asked, can you show me where this is? And they looked through it and stuff and then they handed it back to me, said, it's right here on the front page. It says, you know who you have to name a leader that you're under. You have to name them. That's part of the application. You're not just rogue. You have someone who you can appeal to. And he did list Shambles, listed Bill Johnson. Here's the thing, it didn't say primary. Secondary. There's no primary language, there's no secondary spot to list a secondary person. Where he wrote cheon that doesn't exist. This is an application to become underneath Chae On. This is the. My interpretation is I want to be under Chae On. I want to be under him officially. Okay, well, name a leader here who you can say you're responsible to. And you put Bill Johnson in my mind, he's responsible now to both of them. But because Bill's not even part of him, it's ultimately he's responsible. As far as Chae On's concerned, he's responsible to Chaeyoun. That's how I interpreted it. I pushed back in the meeting and I said, hey, it looks to me like the primary secondary language that you leaned on in your. In your public address doesn't exist in your documentation. And they told me that in their internal language that's what it means. But that's not what he said. I'm going to play it back. It's not what he said. What he said is that on the document, it lists primary. That's what it's called. And then there's another line where it says secondary, which didn't exist. So we're going to play it again because I believe this is just the first of several misleading statements applied to be a member.
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B
We asked you if it's your primary, alignment or secondary.
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A
Okay, so there's a question. Is it your primary or your secondary? That was not on the application. That statement. And this was a handwritten, filled out application. It was handwritten, so it's not like he filled it out and there was a question and he answered it digitally and then it was transferred to the application later or something like that and sent the application.
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B
He put down H as my secondary, my primary as Bethel and Global Legacy.
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A
I saw the document. I didn't see anywhere on it where it said him is my secondary or the language. Primary. Secondary. I didn't see it anywhere on the document. I asked them to show it to me. They looked at it. They pointed to the spot where they said it was and it didn't exist. That's what I'm going to say happened. They're going to. And then their response was, but in our internal language, that's what it means. First off, that sounds convenient. Secondly, though, that's not what you said, Che. It's not what you told your people. I'm going to play it again. This is one of the most significant
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B
misleading statements, alignment or secondary, and send the application paper down. H. I'm my secondary. My primary is Bethel and Global Legacy.
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A
Okay. He didn't put that down. That's not what I saw. That's not what I saw. To the best of my knowledge, he did not put that down.
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B
And so I told Patricia what you're telling me. We need to tell Bill, we need to tell Chris because they're the. The reason why we have primary, secondary, because we have anticipated there'll be pastors who will fall. But the question then is who will be responsible for bringing discipline and restoration. We expect the primary ones to do so.
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A
Again, this is him saying, it's not our responsibility to do this. Remember, this is exact. This is a mirror image of what Bethel was thinking at the time. After my video, after Chris Velatin went up and he gave a very bad response on Sunday night. Then they later said, you know what? It was our job. We should have. Because we platformed him, we should have said something. He was actually officially not just platformed by. He was platformed by Che, but he was officially under Cheon and the HIM network. And Che is saying here, I told Patricia, oh, oh, it turns out he's under Bill. So it's not really my thing. It's for Bill to do. I'm going to give you a few reasons to think that that's a misleading thing to say. Later on, I'll play more information clips where Patricia King, the same woman he's talking about, she has already talked to Che and Che has promised to take this case on and to be the point person on it. And she's assured. I don't think I'll play this part of the clip, but she assured the victim, one of the victims of Sham Bowles, that Che was a brave man and he'll do the right thing and he'll take care of this. But what he tells his people is not what was being said behind the scenes. It's a different story. All right?
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B
But he was a member of him. And so she said, I'm going to send both you and Chris this confession tape of this young man that was sexually harassed in a very perverted way.
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A
I'm going to play for the first time ever some of the clips from two clips from this confession tape. I'm not going to play the part where the young man talks. He'd rather not have his voice on there. There's plenty of people in his. In his own personal life who may know who that is, but he doesn't want it to be out for everyone to see. And then it's just his preference. So I'm going to honor that. But I will play some clips of Patricia King. And you'll see how what she says about Che is not what Che now says about her and their engagement years later when everything hit the fan. Now there's a new version of the story and that is what has gone on consistently. So let's look at the next clip. Now clip number two. Che talks about meeting with a witness. This is another one of his. I would call it a lie. Best case scenario, it's a oops, I said something that wasn't true and assured people of things that didn't happen.
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B
And I'm listening to this message and I'm absolutely devastated by it. Shocked because I've known Sean since now, looking back around 20 years.
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A
So he's known Shawn for 20 years now. This message he listened to was well over an hour worth of audio of this individual talking and talking and a couple other people on the call too, adding more information or interacting with him. And he heard this thing. It was the testimony of all of the sexual perversion stuff and the oppression and character issues with shambles as well as some other stuff. Oh man, I don't want to get ahead of myself here. But he heard that that's what he's referring to. And listen to what he says next.
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B
Back then he joined him 2013. So this is seven years later. I called this young man up just to talk to him personally. And it was very, very credible. It was a Bethel student, three year student, Love loves Jesus. And he was just absolutely traumatized by what he encountered with Sean. Bolts.
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A
I'm going to read to you here. I'll show it to you as well. This is the message that I received from the young man. The day that Cheon made this video. The day that. Sorry, I'll make it bigger. The day that Cheon made this video, the day that he said these things. This is the message that he sent to me. I screenshotted it and I removed so you can't see his name and stuff. But Monday, February 2nd at 8am he sends me this as soon as he sees this video. I think it was as soon. And he says these three things which you may have already read. Che had said he called me to talk to me personally. Not true. Che never ever called me. He also, number two, Che said I attended three years at the Bethel School of Supernatural Ministry, BSSM as a student. Nope, I only did one year and three, he said. Again, I interviewed this young man and the young man tells me voluntarily, I didn't even ask him about it. He says, not true. And he says, I Don't know if you want to do anything with this mic, but just so you know, I've had this sitting, you know, for over a month in my phone. I gave Che a chance to explain it. Now, when I met with him, when I met with him, I asked him about this. He doesn't know I've texted with this guy. I said, che, you said that you interviewed the young man. And I thought, I don't want to make it too easy. If he's going to lie to me, I don't want to make it too easy for him to do so. So I asked him, you interviewed with the young man? He said, yes. I said, was that over zoom? Was that in person? And he says, it was a phone call. That's how our conversation went. I said, was it over Zoom in person? He volunteered it was a phone call. So he remembers the discussion enough to know it was on a telephone or on a cell phone. I then said, well, he texted me, and I read the text to him, and I said, he told me these things. And then Che responded with, oh, well, I thought I did. I kind of think I did. I thought I did. And he's like, I wish I could ask the young man myself if he was here right now. The guy told. He's already given you the answer. That was one of the earlier lies that I've verbally caught him in as I let him tell me some of this stuff, and then I started revealing some things that I knew that Che didn't know that I knew. All right, let's look at the next clip. This is number three.
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B
I met with Sean right here in this auditorium in the lower floor. I immediately called him because he was pastor right here in LA expression 58 at that time. Now, when I met him, he denied everything. But now, keep in mind, the Bible says, don't bring an accusation against an elder unless there's two or more. But it was so devastating and the. The confession was so credible when I interviewed this young man that I immediately asked him to step down from him, and I canceled him speaking at our conference that year. I said, you're not going to be speaking at. And not only that, I'm going to not allow you to speak at any of our churches. That was my word to him.
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A
That sounds very noble when you present it that way. He goes, how is my word to him? The way he's posturing, the way he's handling himself sounds very noble. There's another interpretation of these events, and that is in light of you endorsing his book, two of his books afterwards. Che, the other interpretation of this event is that you distance yourself and your ministry from a guy and then you asked other people to hold him accountable, and then you moved along, and then you actually went on, endorsed his. His work later on. And even in the endorsement, lied. In the endorsement for the book, lied to the public about Sean and your relationship with him. And I'll talk more about that later. This I confirmed even in our conversation just yesterday. This interpretation of the events is the same as what Bill Johnson did and what Bethel did. As much as they might have moral ire directed at Sean, what they did was they distance themselves, they separate themselves, they get away from him, but they don't protect other people from him. They don't warn people about his prophecies that he's already given or to tell people. I appointed him as a prophet, Che. I appointed this guy as a prophet. Guess what? He's been faking prophecy. I think I should probably tell you guys this. He didn't do this. So I don't think that this was noble. I don't think that this was righteous. I don't think this was as solid and upstanding. Now, the thing about witnesses, I asked Che about this. If they had tried to find other witnesses, he goes, we should have more than one witness. You know, there were multiple witnesses about him already regarding faking prophecy. There was lots of witnesses, and there was an amount of evidence already existing along with that one witness talking about the physical, sexual stuff that Sean was up to. But they didn't make an effort to find other witnesses. Che made no effort to try to find other witnesses. He didn't try to. He didn't attempt to. To call up other people or discuss things with them. And so any complaints about lack of witnesses is not relevant in regards to what evidence was available to us. I also think Che thinks a witness has to be a person. And it can't just be corroborating evidences. It can't just be, oh, we have this, we have this, we have this. Any piece of evidence is a witness. Biblically, rocks can cry out. They build structures of stone to stand as a witness about an event that has happened. You know, so you can have DNA evidence as a witness. Anyway, I won't go on. I've talked about this in the past. Look at the next clip.
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B
In many ways, I felt even kind of, did I go too, too harsh? Was I going too far with them? Maybe I should have just waited for another person to come forth before I gave them this mandate. But I just felt in my heart that I needed to do that. And then I called Chris and said, Chris, Sean says you're his primary alignment. And so Chris came down and flew down to LA to meet with him.
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A
This sounds convenient. Chris, you're his primary alignment. Sean says you're his primary alignment. Now maybe Sean really said this to Che, but it's not the whole story. It's not the whole story here. He's trying to suggest I definitely didn't do cover up. Whatever happened, it wasn't cover up. I didn't cover up for Sean. Right. Listen carefully to the details though, because I'm going to expose some problems with them later on in this video.
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B
The reason why I'm saying this is that the aspersion that has been cast on me that was covering up for Sean is absolutely a lie from the pit of hell.
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A
That is absolutely a lie from the pit of hell. What Che just said.
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B
There was no cover up.
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C
Amen.
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B
There was no cover up. If anything, I erred on the side of being harsh.
- [31:00]
A
He's going to break his arm bending over to pat himself on the back for this stuff. You endorsed two of his books, Che, after this. Now when he made this announcement, I don't think he was aware that we knew and that other people were going to find out that he had endorsed Sean's books. And so he doesn't, maybe he doesn't get into it at any point in this video. I think it was later when he actually mentioned the books because it started coming out. I'm going to show you the endorsements though. It's important that you actually see this stuff. But he says there was no cover up. And I think that in Che's mind, cover up requires evil intentions. And he can always say, I had the best intentions. I don't think so. I think covering up is simply I took something that I was responsible for exposing and I didn't expose it. I would then go on about my life not exposing it. I didn't do my job. That's effectively covering up the thing instead of exposing it. Cover up culture is a thing that results in the covering up of somebody who should be exposed. That's cover up culture. And that is exactly what Che participated in, in a very active way. There's another type of. Some people put this way, Ron Cancer wants to say pass. And I think it's a wise way to analyze it. There's active cover up and passive cover up active. You know, you're deliberately working to hide something and passive is you're failing to expose something that you morally should. And I think Che ultimately did both in different ways. Definitely did a lot of the passive, and I think he did some of the active, too. He's doing it right now for himself. Right now for himself. He's doing active cover up. And I think this video will make that clear.
- [32:30]
B
I've never covered up for anyone's sins, by the way. You know that. I could give you a scripture verse for that. That's an abomination before the Lord if you cover up someone's sins. I did what I thought was the best thing to do.
- [32:47]
A
You really think it was the best thing to endorse two of his books after this? To not tell your people who you put him on stage prophesying to the people in that room and that you never warned for years. You didn't warn them that he was looking up their data online and faking prophecies and that they were basing some of them. Probably they're basing their lives off of these prophetic words. You didn't know that that was the best thing to do. You thought the best thing to do is to be silent about it, to distance yourself, to cut him from your network, but then to just say, he's not my responsibility. I don't believe that. I don't think your own people believe that. I think that's going to be the problem next is that your own people aren't going to believe it once they see that you are actively deceiving them. And that is what it looks like to me. So let's look at him talking more about this cover up stuff. Now he talks about how it was Danny and Chris. So Danny and Chris are two at the time, two of the pastors at Bethel. And they're the ones who confronted Sean. In addition to Shay knowing, in addition to Patricia King knowing, Danny and Chris knew. Bill was aware. There's a debate about how much he knew, but Bill knew some stuff anyway. Here's the clip where he talks about how Chris and Danny from Bethel, two Bethel pastors, they're going to take responsibility for this.
- [34:04]
B
And so Chris and Danny Silk took responsibility. Now I got realized that this is the midst of COVID this 2020, April 2020, and we were in a lawsuit. We sued Governor Newsom July 2nd. And then the first fall, it was just everything was upheaval and okay, so
- [34:33]
A
this is lockdown stuff. Their church was open very quickly after lockdown. They had governmental issues, things going on there. And I probably did the right thing in that situation. But I want to show you this because he says that Chris took responsibility. That's his statement. Chris took responsibility for what? For Sean. Okay, but what does Chris actually say? Well, this is what Chris told the victim, the same guy that Che's talking about that he says he interviewed. Who says he never interviewed me. That never happened. Chris told him, you're going to have to understand that I have no authority over Sean. He doesn't work for me. He doesn't belong to my organization. And I flew down to meet with him and spent the entire day there and flew back. I told him to clean up his mess. He's not going to minister in our network. This is the same thing that Sean did. Oh, he's not part of our network. So this is a way of washing your hands. If he's not part of my network, if he's not connected to me, I don't have to do anything more to warn people about him, how they handled it. So he's not part of the HIM network. Could be part of a cover up. He takes no responsibility for them. Chris takes none. He says, Chris, you know, Chase says, Chris took responsibility. Chris is like, I didn't take responsibility for that. I think that's pretty significant. The story that the people hear isn't the real full story.
- [35:47]
B
Then we hit 2021, we started to open up, we started planning campuses. We're really, really busy. So I didn't follow up on Chris until like a year and a half later.
- [35:58]
A
Now we're going to plead ignorance. His good friend Sean Bowles, his good friend who he anointed as a prophet, is exposed as a fake and as a sexual predator, deviant guy. And he doesn't even follow up for a year and a half. He doesn't make a phone call. His best friend's Bill Johnson. They go yearly on retreats for like a week at a time. He says, did they go during that year? I don't know. But he doesn't text him. You don't find out what's going on with his Shanghai for a year and a half. Do you guys believe that? I think it seems unlikely.
- [36:34]
B
It just was out of mind, out of sight, out of mind. It's not just on my. I seconded him over. He's now in their hands. And of course, I love Bethel.
- [36:43]
A
I love.
- [36:43]
B
Bill's one of my best friends,
- [36:47]
A
by the way.
- [36:48]
B
Bill was not involved. You know, it's like Chris and Danny took responsibility.
- [36:55]
A
Bill was not involved. This is, I think, Che also trying To. He's going to cover for himself. He wants to cover for. Chris and Danny are supposed to take the fall here. This is honestly, in some ways, how Bethel was posturing themselves as well, is like, Chris can take the. Take the heat. Danny Silk isn't there anymore, and they've kind of tried to leave his name out of it as much as possible, I think. But Bill, he is only being held accountable because of the community around them. That's saying, bill, you're responsible for this. I think that that's. That's my interpretation of the events. You guys can make your own. I've been trying to follow closely with this stuff going on with Bethel. So he says Bill was not involved yet. Yet earlier he had said Sean's primary accountability is Bill Johnson, and it was not Bethel. Bethel was not his primary. On the document that he refers to, I saw it with my own eyes. It was Bill Johnson. That was his primary accountability. They use the word accountability. It doesn't say that in the document. It doesn't say primary, even their retelling of the story. But the name he listed there, it was Bill Johnson. Yet he says Bill was not involved. Yet Bill is the one keeping Sean accountable. Now, was Bill not involved? Is that true? We know from subsequent statements from Bethel that are public now that Bill said he was the one that kept Sean from being exposed. That that's how I interpret his words. He says that these guys were convinced, Chris, Danny, that, yes, Sean's absolute bad guy. Absolute bad guy. And Bill was the one that held them back. Bill's the reason why this stuff didn't get bigger. So Bill was involved, at least in the suppression of the exposure of Sean. So that is also not true about Bill Johnson. Hey, guys, I'm editing this video right now, and I realize I forgot to add in this section this letter from Chae on this is the letter he released. I believe this came first, then his video came later. And this is a different story. Remember, he said, just as I share in the video you're watching right now, that he just said Bill wasn't involved. Right. Here's what he had said before he said this. He says, Around 2020, I was made aware of serious allegations of sexual misconduct against Sean Bowles. I confronted Sean, and he denied all the allegations. I sought the Lord, and I believed him to be a brother in Christ needing some serious help. I asked Sean to submit to his pastor at the time, which was Bill Johnson, and asked him to resign as a member of him. He agreed to both. So in this Letter. He's saying that Sean agreed to submit to Bill. That is not something that is echoed by Stacy Campbell later in this video towards. I guess towards the latter part. You'll see that he says after that conversation, him immediately removed Shawn as a member of him and removed him as a speaker. Speaker for any and all future events. Sean has never been involved in any events that him and Harvest Rock Church have hosted since. I was deeply saddened to learn that despite Sean calling Bill Johnson his pastor, it appeared he did not want to submit to any of the discipline that Bill required. Ultimately, Sean was removed from the Bethel Network. There's two issues I've got with this. First, he says here that Bill required discipline for Sean. Bill required it. That's what he told his people. That's what he told you. That's what he told everybody here. He says Bill wasn't involved. Why is that? Why is his tone changing? You could say, oh, it's just a misunderstanding. Everything seems to be misunderstanding, miscommunication, or, I didn't mean that. But when you add it all together, you go, oh, well, now he's saying it's all going to be on Danny and Chris. Bill wasn't involved anyway. The other issue is this. Sean was removed from the Bethel Network, the Global Legacy Network that is Bethel's network. I don't know if Sean was ever even part of that network officially. It's a little hazy to me. I have no evidence that he was. This letter is implying Bethel's responsible. He's part of their network. You know, he's separate from our network, really. It was just Bill, to my knowledge, that was listed as the person he was, you know, connected to and not Bethel. Although Bethel had a connection. I'm just saying it wasn't through the official network, Global Legacy, as far as I know if it was. If, on the other hand, Chayan's statement is correct and Sean was actually part of Bethel's network officially, that just brings more accountability to Bethel. And why didn't Bethel tell us this? The statement so far, multiple times from stage and print, is like, he wasn't part of our network. So this is just weird stuff. So that's the other letter I mentioned. I wanted to read to you. How many things are not true? Well, there's more. I didn't give it a count, so I won't try to pretend I have one. But there are more than just the ones that we've shared. So this is where Shay is going to talk about his one mistake. The one mistake that he made.
- [41:38]
B
Now, this is where, when I got all the flack for covering up, I said, I didn't cover up, but I said, lord. And I think we have to all be teachable because, you know, God's using all this to prune us, to discipline us, and he's disciplining the church. And one of my main.
- [41:57]
A
This is again the thing where you make what's happening to you about the entire body of Christ. It's a lecture. We all have to be teachable. He's disciplining us, the church. It's deflective because it's embarrassing and awkward to be a leader standing up, admitting a failure with your people. And so he's admitting as little as possible. And he's turning into a lecturer as well.
- [42:18]
B
Prayers where it says, search me, O God, know my heart, try me, know my anxious law See if there any evil way within me.
- [42:26]
A
This reminds me of Todd White's recent apology where he talked about how much he loves Jesus and how much great work he's doing in the Lord. That's not an apology.
- [42:36]
B
And then the Lord did correct me and convicted me. Because as soon as I heard that he didn't receive correction from Chris and Danny, I should have come back to this house and made the announcement that we're marking him publicly. I did it with our leaders in. Hm.
- [42:57]
A
But I'll play. I'll replay. I'm cutting him off. I know. I'll replay. Remember that phrase? I did it with our leaders in him. I appreciate the admission. I should have done this publicly. That's the big change. And that change would not have happened without videos being made and people raising their voices and the leaders going, these people will not accept me saying this is not my responsibility. They all think I should have done this. And that's what Scripture requires. 1 Timothy 5, 20, the end of Matthew 18. You tell it to the church. That stuff is ignored routinely. And it's good to see the cognizant awareness of that's wrong, that should have been exposed. But it's one thing to say I should have done the exposure back then and something else to admit. There's others I should be exposing right now, today, and there's others I should have exposed 10, 20 years ago. And I need to come clean. And it will devastate the movement, but it'll devastate it even more if you don't. So listen carefully again to what he says here. This part's important.
- [43:56]
B
He didn't receive correction from Chris and Danny. I should have come back to this house and made that announcement that we're marking him publicly. I did it with our leaders in H im, but I didn't tell you. And the reason why I should have told you is twofold.
- [44:15]
A
Number one, I will listen to his reasons in a second. I want to highlight. I did it with our leaders in him. I didn't do it with you. Who do you think the leaders would have been in him? He's got, according to his personal conversation with me, 70,000. 70,000 pastors that are part of his movement leaders. According to the website, there's 20, 25,000 that are part of it. And he says, I told our leaders. So is that like, that's got to be at least. I mean, it should be like 20, 25,000 at least, right? Or maybe it's at least like 500 people, 1,000 people. How many people are leaders in your magnificently large network? It certainly is a lot. I asked him about this in our conversation, and he told me that the people he actually told weren't the leaders as a broad category in him, a broad network, but it was the Apostolic Council that is a much more narrow group of leaders in the network. In fact, I'll put them on screen this on the website. This is the Apostolic Council. Che and sue on Wesley and Stacey Campbell, Charles and Ann Stock, Brian and Candace Simmons, Mark and Ann Tubbs. And he added one more name in our conversation of people who knew, and it was James Gaul. Those are the people that he told. According to the conversation I had with him, when he talks to his congregation, you'd think he had told quite a large number of people. I leaned in hard on this. I went on social media and I was like, hey, are you a leader in the HIM network? Surely somebody who follows me knows a leader in the HIM network. Send me the email that Che sent you, the message, the text, the notification about Sean Bowles and about how he notified you guys about his issues in 2020. Send that to me, please. Or maybe it was a year and a half later and nobody crickets, nobody responded with anything. I asked Che, can you provide me with that? In my email to him, when I got there in the meeting, I asked him about it again, and he said it was just that group of people. Remember Brian Simmons? Remember Stacey Campbell? Remember James Gaul? According to him, those people knew about it. Now, later, he said in the same conversation, he goes, well, actually, I don't know for sure if Brian Simmons knew. He had a lot going on, that he was kind of busy. He might not have Been at the meetings. Okay, so maybe Brian Simmons didn't know. I'm reporting what he said. Okay? It's not that I believe it or trust it, but it is what was said in that meeting. Because there will be one thing that they're not being which is transparent. Let's look at the rest of this video. Then we'll talk about why you should remember those names. Because that's. Yeah, it's a thing.
- [46:50]
B
Number one is because he preached from this pulpit to you. But number two, I didn't know there were other victims until all this hit the fan.
- [47:03]
A
If Cheon didn't know there were other victims, if it was because he didn't seek to find other victims, there was no attempt to address the. The issues of other victims. Let me give you a specific example, okay? Che's best friend, Bill Johnson. One of the people who's come out saying I was a victim of Sean Bowles that's come out subsequent to my video is a guy named Jeremy Boutros. I only share his name because he went public on his YouTube channel, and he made a video talking about this. He talked about his issues and the things he'd experienced with Sean Bowles. He confirmed these things. I spoke to a number of victims myself. There's a number of other ones who I haven't talked to, but we know exist. Jeremy Boutros was the assistant of Bill Johnson in his ministry. He was not assistant. Excuse me. He was an intern. He was an early intern for Bill Johnson for a significant period of time before he went on to work for Sean Bolles. How hard is it for them to call him up? He's part of their family relationships, right? The attempts were not made. I spoke to Jeremy Boutros, and he tells me nobody even called Bill didn't call him. He didn't call him. Hey, Jeremy. I heard. Sean, does this stuff. Has anything happened to you? Are you okay? Nothing. The attempts to find these other victims, I believe, were not present. Especially with Jaehon. Okay, so he's like, I found out there were other victims. If you didn't know, it's because you didn't want to know. But let me play some more of this clip.
- [48:27]
B
I didn't know there were other victims until all this hit the fan the last two weeks.
- [48:33]
A
That's the part I wanted to catch. The last two weeks. So he's referring to my video, right? From the timing of this, he's got to be referring to Mike Winger's video. Except there were other videos and talk of victims that lots of people knew. About way prior to my video. Okay. I was able to actually bring their testimony forward and share examples from three specific victims who told me things that I was able to repeat on camera. But there are. Jay, I don't believe you.
- [49:04]
B
And it could have prevented. And I'm thinking along those terms of if I had made the announcements that, you know what? We disciplined Sean, he didn't receive from us. The two of us went. I went to him private Chris went to him with the same allegations, same tape, the same tape testimony he didn't receive from Chris. And now we have to tell it to the church. And I didn't do that. And I take full responsibility. And I asked you, and I asked the victims who fell under his. His prey for forgiveness. So will you forgive me for that?
- [49:48]
A
If that was the whole story, that would be a great apology. But there's deception interspersed throughout it. Just throughout it. And because of that, this video, I think, should be made. So we're going to talk more about this. Let's talk about the book endorsements. So I had a conversation with him about these book endorsements. This is something that I don't think he knew was going to go public. This is my impression. Right. This is what I think. I don't think he knew it was going to go public because he didn't talk about it. And it seems extremely relevant in that very video that he made that he should have said something about those endorsements. Then when it did go public, only one of them went public. But I confronted him about both of them in my actual video or conversation that we had yesterday. So here is the first page I'll put in front of you showing endorsements. This was on Sean Bowles actual website. He's showcasing endorsements for his book. And he says here, move it just a bit. He says here there was endorsements here from John Arnott, from Bob Hasson, from Cheyenne, and here in Chayon's endorsement. He says all it takes is an encounter with God for your life to be forever changed. In his new book, my good friend Sean Bowles shares astonishing God encounters and biblical truths that will stoke your hunger for more. And these books involve stories that come from deceit, prophetic deceit that he knew about at the time he endorsed this book. So his mistake was just not being more public. No. You endorse this book. I want to show some other endorsers too. I think this is important because a lot of these people knew. They knew what Shawn did. And here they are doing endorsements. Brian Simmons. Brian Simmons. Is one of the leaders in the HIM network. He is one of. He's part of the Apostolic Council, top of the top leaders. There's like, Che and then there's like this list of a very small handful of people. These are the people that Che says he told. When he says, I told the leaders in our network. He says, maybe Brian had been told, maybe he wasn't. I don't know. I don't know. Maybe he said that as well. I'll just acknowledge it. I don't understand how he could not have heard. Do you really think these guys don't talk about this, that they don't know Brian's endorsement? He says, wow, this book is going to be one of your favorites of all time. He talks about how these encounters have shaped Sean's life in God and they'll imprint on you forever. Brian Simmons, Seth Dahl did an endorsement. Sean Smith, Kim Walker Smith did an endorsement as well. You can see on the bottom of your screen there. And there was one third page of endorsements I'll just mention real quick so that we can know. It's just really one endorsement I'll put on your screen. And this is Rick Joyner. Rick Joyner. Rick Joyner. Rick Joyner. Is there a bad guy he hasn't endorsed? You think I'm being sarcastic? You think I'm being over the top? You guys don't understand. Rick Joyner, the guy who says Mike Bickle should be put back into ministry. The guy who has tried to. Still trying to reinstate Todd White, from what I've heard. Excuse me, Todd Bentley. Todd Bentley, from what I've heard. And it just goes on. Graham Cook also did an endorsement. Imagine the callousness that you have to have, because this is what happened. Bill Johnson, it was when he endorsed Sean after knowing what he was. That's the part that caused people to go, wait a minute, wait a minute. You're taking the trust people have in you as a spiritual leader and you're giving it, handing it over to this evil man. I had a conversation with Cheon about this, and I said, jay, you said in your endorsement that Sean was your good friend. Was he your good friend? Che answered very simply, and he said no. He said in our meeting. I'm going to read now from the notes from my friend who was with me. He says in calling Sean a good friend, I was absolutely wrong in that I asked him why he did it. Why did you endorse the book then, Che? And he said his endorsement was, and I'll quote here from the notes my friend took. It was my way of saying, I love you. You don't say, I love you by helping increase the sales of a fake prophet and a predator. You say, I love you by going to lunch with the guy and saying, how are you doing? What's the update on your life? Have you gotten counseling? Have you reconciled with the people you've sinned against? You really got to take this stuff seriously, man. I heard you won't even listen to the guys at Bethel. You need to repent, Sean. This is not okay. That's how you show him you love him. You don't endorse his book and increase his financial pocket because of the sales that he's going to get because your name is on it, and you're like the big mega apostle Cheon. In calling him a good friend, he was lying. I pointed out that Brian Simmons also endorsed it. And I called this a deep betrayal that Che did this. I called it a deep betrayal. Che agreed with me, and he says, I agree that it was a deep betrayal. So then I said, and this was where. I'm just trying to get him to agree with everything we just conversed with right there. I said, so you lied to people who trusted you. Right? You lied to people who trusted you. And you're like, that's my good friend. Because he says he was not his good friend now at that time. And he says, no, I didn't lie. There's where the conversation got squirrely. What did he say then? It was a mix of, well, he was my good friend at one point in time. Maybe not when the endorsement happened, but he was at one point in time, he was my good friend. Or I was just trying to show him love and compassion. I just, you know, our movement, if we have a mistake, if we offer too much grace and things like that. But ultimately, that was a lie that you gave after you already knew, long after the issues had come out. You lied to the people who trusted you. I also confronted Che about another book. First I asked, and this is how you have to deal with these guys. I asked, was there any other books you endorsed from Sean? Was that the only one? And he says, there was no other book. That was the only one. I said, well, there was a book that you endorsed. It was called Wired to Hear. Wired to Hear. And it was written by Sean Bowles and Bob Hasson. Bob Hasson, who you saw, endorsed his other book and Bob Hasson, who also was on his board and refused to remove Sean when reportedly Chris contacted the board and said, you guys should pull him out of ministry. And Bob Hasson was on that board along with guys like Sean Foyt, who still will not talk about this stuff because he knows the second he does, it's just going to get worse. So I said, no, there was an endorsement. It was in the book Wired to Hear. And Wired to Hear was published. It was published after all these things, all these events took place. Let me give you the exact date Wired to Hear was published by. I forget who published it, but it was Sean Bull's book, and it was May 4th of 2021. Now, that's significant because that puts it a year after Chae On's I removed him from my Network April of 2020. Endorsements usually come months before a book is released, maybe six months before a book's released. You don't really get endorsements. It's very weird to get them a year before. But Chayan, at this point, he went from insisting that he didn't endorse the book. And when I mentioned Wired to here, I should add this, I said, you endorsed Wired to Hear. He actually doubted me. He goes, do you have any proof that I endorsed it? So I read to him his endorsement. And as I sort of read the first sentence and then he cut me off, he goes, oh, well. But I endorsed that before I found out about Sean. So he went from saying he didn't do this endorsement at all to suddenly having a clear memory of exactly when he endorsed it. It was a year prior, which doesn't really happen in publishing, generally speaking. That's not typically how it works. So I don't believe him. I don't believe him. And he had already lied to me about some other stuff in that meeting. Okay, now we get to probably the worst part of our conversation together and the most revealing part. And if this is the one thing you click to this video, then I hope that you found this part. Chase said in this conversation that he didn't know that there were allegations of Sean data mining and faking prophecy until weeks ago. Weeks. He said this to me. I have a witness. He says, I didn't know about the data mining until weeks ago. Now he just dropped this casually in the midst of saying other things, and I just let it sit. I came back to it later when it seemed like it was wise, and I said, I just want to confirm you didn't know. You didn't know that there were allegations of his data mining until weeks ago. Right. You didn't know in 20, 20, 22, 24 you didn't know in 2025. You knew in weeks ago, in 2026 when I made my video. So he says, yes, he didn't know. Then they went on to act like, because data mining is a really big deal, that's blasphemy to data mine. You data mine a fake prophecy that's very, very evil. You can't do that. So yeah, they only found out weeks ago. So in our meeting, Che couches things I'd only known about the sexual perversion stuff. That's all he knew about. Unfortunately for Che, I know more than he knows I know. And I know what he knew because I listened to the same recording of the victim that he listened to. I have the whole recording. I have listened to it. In that recording there's like a 40 minute section where they deal with the prophecy stuff, where it's not all, but a significant portion of a 40 minute section of a recording is dealing just with the prophecy stuff of Sean Bowles faking prophecy and data mining prophecy. So I told him this. I said, I know that you did. You said yourself that you listened to this recording. Now you didn't interview the witness, but you did listen to this recording. In that recording, it has the data mining information in there. And he then responded by saying, oh, well, I forgot. Then quickly said, well, maybe I did hear about it, but it was so crazy to me that I didn't believe it. The allegation that there was the data mining, it was so crazy to me, I just didn't believe it. But earlier he had said, I believed the young man's testimony. He said so in video form. I believe the young man was sincere in telling the truth and he at least heard that guy giving his testimony about the data mining. Then he went on to say, but there was no documentation for it. There was just one guy's claim. So he's going to fall back on only one witness. Except that is also not true. In the recording, there are multiple people talking about the data mining. And I'm just going to play you, I'm going to play you two clips from that recording. This will be audio from that recording. Here's the first clip. This is what Chae on heard, among other things, that he says he never heard about the data mining until a few weeks ago.
- [60:45]
C
I'm so sorry to hear this. This is never, of course, what anyone wants to hear, but it's important that things get brought into the light. So what we're going to do is submit this to Che. Che promised me that he would review everything I sent him and then he would make decisions on the next step based on that. And I will follow up with him, I promise you.
- [61:11]
A
This is Patricia King talking here and she's gathering the data. She's interviewing this victim along with someone else who's on the call. And there she says, che promised he will follow up. I'm going to send him all the data. Che has agreed to be the point guy on this. You'll hear another clip where he actually agrees to be the point person, where later he goes, oh, it was Bill, it was Bill, it was Bethel, and Bill didn't even know, but it was Bill and he wouldn't listen to Bill. But Bill didn't even do anything and Bill didn't know. And then it was Chris. It was really Danny and Chris. He does all that here at the actual moment in 2020. Patricia has already conversed with Che Sembulls this and that. And Che has agreed, according to Patricia, I will be the point person. I will get the data and I will do what needs to be done.
- [61:58]
C
We'll follow up with him. There were some other people that who have approached me as well, who have information. So I'm going to send Che all the files and then once he has time to review them, then I'll connect with him. And so I should be able to give an update with you on if anything is going to happen.
- [62:20]
A
When she finally did give an update, it was, I'm sorry, there's nothing I can do. Che doesn't want to deal with the Chris, Danny, none of them are going to do more. And sorry, that was the final update that this person got from Patricia. Che promised he would deal with it. He was being sent all the files. And this is after the conversation about the fake prophecy stuff. And in fact, these audio recordings are addressed to Che directly. She opens up going, che, this is our discussion with so and so about all the things. And then Che, here's the prophecy stuff and there's a packet of information. This is key. Che told me, I have a witness for this. And Che, you want to say I'm a liar, you can sue me. I hope you don't because it's wasted my time and money. But I will not back down. You lied. You lied to me. You lied to everybody. You're lying right now. And it is cover up culture. You're cover up culture. You're a prime example of it. Okay, you were given a packet of information from Patricia King. There were other witnesses who had gathered packets. Jason, let me Give you guys the real story, right? As I understand these things, and I've talked to many witnesses and I've seen a lot of evidence. Jason Smedley in 2017, 2017, gave a packet of. Not a packet, but a document with a list and links of words that Sean had gotten from Facebook. Gave it to Stacey Campbell. Who's Stacey Campbell? Asked you to remember her name. She's one of the Apostolic Council for him, for Che. She ghosted the guy. Didn't talk to Jason again after that. 2017, that was not the first time. In 2016, people were trying to get Bethel leadership to say, hey, he's a bad dude. Before he went viral, before he went viral, Bill was warned about Sean Bulls. Nothing happened. Then 2018, they're getting packets of information being sent around all over the place. Everybody's getting a look at it. Still, nothing's being done. 2020, certainly this packet exists. Ben Fitzgerald is providing documentation he painstakingly went through to get evidence about Sean that ended up being suppressed ultimately by Bethel and by Chaon, who told me yesterday that he didn't even hear about the data mining stuff. And then when he admitted he heard about it, he said he didn't believe it. How could it possibly be true? Even though he said he believed the testimony of the witness. Then he told me, well, it was just one witness. It wasn't a packet. There wasn't actual data to back it up. And here, in the very recording that Chevy didn't realize I listened to, he's being sent a packet of information. Here's the next clip. The only other clip I'll share from this meeting. Nobody's heard this before except me, as far as I know. Well, me and Chae on and Chris Valatin and Danny Silk and leadership at Bethel.
- [65:14]
C
And so we need to pray for Che because he has agreed. He is the point person on this and we're bringing all the information to him. I'm bringing it all to him from every one that submits it. And so he's got a big look, he's got a big weight on his shoulders. So let's pray for him and believe that God's grace, will and wisdom will help him walk through this. Because this is not okay, what's happened, and this has to be looked at. So I'm going to give him your contact information because. Because I'm sure he's going to want to follow up with you.
- [65:52]
A
I have more on this. Okay, so he didn't follow up with this guy. He didn't call him he didn't interview him, even though he publicly told everybody he did. That's according to his testimony and I believe him. There's another element of this that people haven't maybe put together well and not like it's your guys fault. It's just there's so many facts and pieces flying around. In 2022, the following recording was made of Stacy Campbell. Again, Apostolic Council, top of the top, inside him, underneath Che. She's one of his important people. She knows all about this stuff. And she says the following about who's responsible for Sean Bowles. According to Sean Bowles. And guess what, it's not Bethel, it's Cheon. Listen to this. And he went and told other leaders because he didn't know what to do. Patricia reached out and you know, tried to talk to Sean. Sean would not talk to her. So she talked to Che and she said, because Sean said, I'm under Chase leadership, so talk to Chris. Because they were having an irregularity. And Sean said to Chris and Rill,
- [66:56]
B
I'm not under Bethel, I'm under Che.
- [66:59]
A
And Shay tried to talk to him and it didn't go. So I said, So at one point we have a report from Stacy Campbell. Actually Che said, I don't want to talk to Chris and Bill. Or Sean Bowles said, I don't want to talk to Chris and Bill because I'm under Che. Che reports, well, he's under Bill. He's not going to deal with me. He's under Bill. Chris reports, well, he's not under our authority. What do you want us to do? Let's not forget what actually happened. Okay? Now maybe Sean is telling some people, like if Che maybe. Let's be as gracious as I can here. If Che comes to him and he's like, hey, you're accountable. He goes, well, I'm under Bill. And then he goes. And Chris is like, well, hey, you're accountable. And he goes, well, I'm under Che, but do these guys not have the ability to text each other? Does he not have this power of having a conversation with your best friend? Hey, Bill, I guess he's telling your guys he's under me. Well, actually Che, he's telling your guys he's under me. Didn't they get to do this? Can they have this conversation? But instead it's just wash our hands, get as far away from this as possible. Shaun is the leper. You want to get him away, but you don't want to like protect other people from him. He walks away with his leprosy and he just infects more people because you don't deal with it. So Che lied to me. Lied to you is lying to you. If he continues with the same story he's been telling. He misled you. Please don't let him punt to motives. Don't let him punt in your conversations with him. Those who are part of H Rock, those who are part of his him movement, please don't let him just punt to motives. Okay? There can be forgiveness, but there has to be truth. You can't have forgiveness of lies. You can't have forgiveness based upon. Please forgive me as I lie to you about what I just did. That doesn't work. That's not how it works. It's not how forgiveness works. There's confession. It's important. So Che misled you is misleading you. Don't let him convince you that his great heart and his great big compassionate self, his motives were really good in spite of all he did. No, it's pretty bad stuff. It's pretty bad stuff. There's more of this. There's more. He's part of COVID up culture. He did the exact same thing as Bill Johnson. Yep. Publicly distance. Don't actually publicly expose and then go endorse his books afterwards. There's more to this though. Ron Cantor, and this is where you guys may want to follow up. As this video ends, Ron Cantor has interviewed Che's former sister in law who's talking about more cover up stuff related to her experiences and her testimony, which involves, according to her, which seems credible to me. But there's more coming out on this. Ron has more updates coming very shortly, very quickly on this. Ron met with Che the day before I did and according to Ron, Che lied to him. And he's going to be able to share those things with you. So I'm going to link down below evidence, the stuff that Ron Kantor has to share about this and about Che's former sister in law saying that she had asked Che for help regarding. I hate to say this, but here's why it's important. With his role as leader, with his role of saying, I would never tolerate sin, I'd never cover up anything, then it does become important you force the issue that your former sister in law is saying. I came to you and said, I believe my life was in danger as I was being physically beaten by my husband and I was afraid for my life. And your counsel to me was maybe God's calling you to be a martyr. These things run in patterns. If it happened in These situations, it's guaranteed happened in many other situations throughout the years. It just seems like a no brainer here. So I'm sorry again, I should say I'm not sorry. I'm sad to make another video on these issues. And there's some more coming. The public stuff that's being done right now, it looks across the board for most of the ministries that have been exposed. Most of the guys, it looks to me like damage control and cover up more than it does sincere and full throated attempts at accountability. There was some promising stuff with Bethel. Unfortunately it has teetered the wrong direction and I won't get into all that you guys can look up. There's other people, some of them just drama queens, but others who are doing real attempts to provide help to the people, not just to the leaders in this time for Bethel. And you guys can find that stuff on your own, I'm sure. So that's all I've got to say for today. That's the update and I'd like to not ever talk about Chehon again if I can help it. I'm going to pray. God, we know that you call us to a type of accountability that regards leaders as people who have a responsibility that equals a higher accountability. And not many of us should seek to be teachers. And I live in fear of that, proper godly fear of that, that there's moments like this that can come which were all avoidable if at any point in time any of those guys had just been open and honest with the people. Father, we pray lest I turn a prayer into a lecture. Father, we pray for purity in your church, for restoration to believers who've been disenfranchised by leaders who blew it and wouldn't admit it. And we ask that you'd cause more people to rise up for the next generation of leadership that will have integrity, that will have smaller ministries with larger amounts of integrity. In Jesus name, amen.