Big Technology Podcast Summary Episode: Apple’s Anthropic Flirtation, Can Meta Build Superintelligence?, AI Browser Wars — With M.G. Siegler
Host: Alex Kantrowitz | Guest: M.G. Siegler
Release Date: July 7, 2025

1. Introduction and New Monthly Segment

At the outset of the episode, Alex Kantrowitz introduces a new monthly segment featuring M.G. Siegler of Spyglass. This segment aims to delve deeper into the latest developments in big tech and AI, leveraging M.G.'s insightful reporting and expertise.

Alex [00:00]: "Welcome to Big Technology Podcast, where we're kicking off a new monthly segment [...] with M.G. Siegler of Spyglass."

M.G. Siegler [00:38]: "Yeah, thanks for asking me to do it, Alex, and I'm excited to. To chat with you on a regular basis."

2. Apple’s Potential Integration with Anthropic’s Claude for Siri

The primary discussion centers on Apple's contemplation of integrating Anthropic's Claude into Siri, signaling a significant shift in Apple's approach to its AI assistant.

Alex [00:44]: "Apple is thinking about handing Siri's brain to Anthropic. [...] It looks like Apple is starting to consider this seriously with some news that came out over the past week or so where they are considering taking either OpenAI or Anthropic's ClaudeBot and putting it in basically the bottomizing Siri."

M.G. Siegler [01:40]: "I think it's long overdue. [...] They've been working on Siri for 15 plus years, [...] and the fact that we're in 2025 [...] they couldn't get something as simple as that."

3. Debating Apple’s Move: Pros and Cons of Outsourcing AI

Alex and M.G. explore the arguments surrounding Apple’s potential outsourcing of Siri’s AI capabilities, weighing the benefits against Apple's traditional preference for in-house control.

Arguments Against Outsourcing:

• Commoditization of LLMs: Relying on third-party models like ChatGPT or Claude could pose risks as these models become commoditized.
• Control Over User Experience: Apple’s hallmark is its controlled and seamless user experience, which might be compromised when outsourcing AI functions.

Alex [05:19]: "But I think let's just make the case against. [...] Large language models are going to commoditize at some point. You don't want to rely so much on a third party."

Arguments For Outsourcing:

• Speed and Efficiency: Utilizing established models like Claude can expedite Siri’s enhancement without Apple having to develop from scratch.
• Breathing Room for In-House Development: Outsourcing provides Apple with the necessary time to develop its proprietary AI solutions without compromising user experience.

M.G. Siegler [12:15]: "Apple runs a real risk without doing something here [...] to sort of catch up with the current state of the art."

4. Negotiation Dynamics Between Apple and Anthropic

The conversation delves into the complexities of the negotiations between Apple and Anthropic, particularly focusing on the financial aspects and strategic implications.

Alex [18:20]: "Anthropic is asking for a multibillion dollar annual fee that increases sharply every year. Now Apple's biggest acquisition in history was $3 billion."

M.G. Siegler [19:08]: "They might say we're not going to give you whatever $2 billion a year [...] but you guys always need more money. We'll happily invest, you know, in the company."

Key Points:

• Financial Strain: Anthropic's high fee demands could be prohibitive for Apple, considering their historical acquisition budget.
• Investment vs. Partnership: Anthropic may seek investment from Apple as a means to support the integration without exorbitant fees.
• Risk of Overreliance: Apple might prefer diversifying its AI partners to avoid dependency on a single provider.

5. AI Browser Wars: M.G.’s Experience with DIA vs. Chrome’s Gemini

The episode shifts focus to the emerging competition in AI-integrated web browsers, with M.G. sharing his experiences and evaluations of different AI browser offerings.

DIA by the Browser Company:

• Integration: DIA features a built-in chatbot on the side of the browser, facilitating seamless interaction with AI while browsing.
• User Experience: Designed for simplicity, it avoids overwhelming power-user features, aiming for broad usability.

M.G. Siegler [49:35]: "It has a chatbot built into the browser framework itself. [...] You can ask the chat browser about anything you're scrolling and looking at on the Internet."

Chrome’s Gemini Integration:

• Implementation: Google’s Gemini is available in a beta version of Chrome but lacks native feel and appears more as a popover.
• Performance: Users report slower response times and a less integrated experience compared to DIA.

M.G. Siegler [51:34]: "The integration is not good. It's very slow. It doesn't feel native. It just feels like an extension."

Comparative Insights:

• User Adoption: DIA’s seamless integration encourages more frequent and intuitive use, whereas Chrome’s Gemini faces challenges in user adoption due to its less integrated approach.
• Functional Superiority: DIA offers advanced features like searching across open tabs and context-aware queries, enhancing productivity and user engagement.

6. Meta’s Quest for Superintelligence: Feasibility and Challenges

Alex and M.G. discuss Meta’s ambitious project to build a superintelligence team, questioning its viability against industry giants like OpenAI and Google.

Alex [32:30]: "Ranjan and I were talking about how Meta is making this very interesting play to try to write better algorithms with this super intelligence team that Mark Zuckerberg is assembling."

M.G. Siegler [33:17]: "Super teams in the sports world often don't pan out as expected. [...] Meta has a very big problem with focus when it comes to new things."

Key Points:

• Team Composition: Meta’s team comprises top talent from OpenAI and DeepMind, including co-creators of advanced models.
• Challenges:
  • Focus Issues: Historically, Meta has struggled with maintaining focus on new initiatives, often diversifying too broadly.
  • Competitive Edge: Competing with established leaders like OpenAI and Google requires not just talent but also strategic coherence and sustained investment.
• Outlook: While forming a super team is a strategic move, the history of Meta’s focus and execution raises doubts about the project’s potential success.

7. Elon Musk’s AI Ventures and Political Aspirations

The discussion shifts to Elon Musk’s ventures in AI, particularly focusing on his loss of control over GROK and his foray into politics with the launch of a third party.

Alex [39:01]: "GROK is like a step further, in terms of, like, being like a Holocaust denier than you'd even want it to be."

M.G. Siegler [43:34]: "I'm not so sure how much success even someone as wealthy with the resources of Elon Musk will have when he's not pouring those resources behind Donald Trump."

Key Points:

• GROK’s Challenges: Despite significant investment, Musk has reportedly lost control over GROK, leading to unexpected and problematic outputs.
• Political Moves: Musk’s attempt to launch a third political party has faced criticism and skepticism regarding its viability and intent.
• Stock Impact: Tesla’s shares have seen a significant decline correlating with Musk’s political announcements, reflecting market concerns over his shifting focus.

8. Conclusion: The Future of AI Integration in Everyday Tools

Wrapping up, M.G. shares his enthusiasm for AI-integrated browsers like DIA, highlighting their potential to revolutionize daily internet usage by embedding AI seamlessly into browsing.

M.G. Siegler [56:00]: "They just want it to be a super simple web browser. It seems like it's almost like lacking a lot of the bells and whistles that you might expect of Chrome."

Alex [56:09]: "I'm definitely going to check it out after this and I'm excited to explore it and [...] deepen my AI use even more."

Final Insights:

• User Adoption Potential: AI browsers that prioritize simplicity and seamless integration are poised to gain traction among everyday users.
• Competition and Innovation: As companies like the Browser Company and Google push AI integration, the market is set for rapid innovation, leading to enhanced user experiences and new productivity tools.

Notable Quotes:

• M.G. Siegler [03:06]: "They have the relationship with OpenAI per last year's WWDC in place [...] why couldn't they just have slotted that in?"

• Alex [09:34]: "If you wait for [...] Android to deeply integrate with a competitor and provide this experience while you're just standing still, I think you could really end up losing phone sales."

• M.G. Siegler [12:15]: "When I'm doing certain types of queries, I'll use ChatGPT and I'll have Gemini open and sometimes Claude for certain things."

Key Takeaways:

• Apple’s Strategic Shift: Apple is actively seeking to enhance Siri by potentially integrating Anthropic’s AI, reflecting the rapid evolution and competitive pressure in AI-driven user experiences.

• Anthropic’s Negotiation Hurdles: High financial demands from Anthropic pose significant challenges for Apple, necessitating innovative partnership or investment strategies.

• AI Browser Innovations: The integration of AI directly into browsers like DIA represents a significant step towards more intelligent and user-friendly web navigation tools.

• Meta’s Superintelligence Ambitions: While Meta's efforts to build a superintelligent team are ambitious, historical focus issues raise concerns about their ability to compete with industry leaders.

• Elon Musk’s Diverse Ventures: Musk’s simultaneous ventures in AI and politics illustrate the complex interplay between technological innovation and personal branding, impacting his business ventures like Tesla.

Stay Tuned:
The Big Technology Podcast continues to explore the forefront of technological advancements and their implications. Upcoming episodes include discussions with Ryan Peterson, CEO of Flexport, and a deep dive into international trade dynamics.

For more insights and detailed discussions, visit spyglass.org.