Big Technology Podcast: "What The Heck Happened To The Internet? — With Ryan Broderick"

Release Date: January 8, 2025

Hosts and Guests:

• Alex Kantrowitz – Host of the Big Technology Podcast
• Ryan Broderick – Reporter, author of the newsletter Garbage Day, and host of the Panic World podcast
• Ranjan Roy – Founder of Margins

1. Introduction and Context

In this enlightening episode of the Big Technology Podcast, Alex Kantrowitz delves deep into the transformative shifts that the Internet has undergone, especially in the wake of the COVID-19 pandemic. Joined by Ryan Broderick and Ranjan Roy, the conversation explores the evolution of online culture, the rise of new viral phenomena, changes in social media algorithms, and the broader implications for media and politics.

2. The Pandemic's Impact on Internet Culture

Alex initiates the discussion by highlighting viral moments like Hayley Welch's controversial TikTok comment and the emergence of "Costco Guys" as examples of how internet fame has become more accessible and diverse. He posits that the shift from a "follow" model to "for you" algorithms has democratized content visibility.

Ryan Broderick agrees, noting the era before these changes felt like a "digital monoculture" where similar content prevailed globally:

"We kind of lived like that for about a decade. The biggest difference now is apps like TikTok are breaking that by showing you hyper-personalized feeds of content specifically for you." ([03:07])

Ranjan Roy adds perspective on how the pandemic transformed online engagement:

"The Internet stopped being a subcultural space." ([05:12])

3. Rise of the Zinternet and Normie Culture

The trio discusses the concept of the "Zinternet," a term coined by Ryan's associate Max Reed, describing a segment of the internet populated by everyday individuals engaging with straightforward, relatable content.

Ryan elaborates on how platforms like TikTok now cater to everyday humor and relatable scenarios:

"If you're a super normal person who likes really basic stuff... TikTok's algorithm identifies that and shows it to you." ([07:31])

Ranjan connects this to generational shifts, reflecting on his own experiences as a 40-something dad:

"The Zinternet captures the 4U verse following dichotomy pretty well." ([08:17])

4. The Emergence and Potential of Blue Sky

A significant portion of the discussion centers around Blue Sky, a social network aiming to revive more traditional follower-based interactions amidst the algorithm-driven feeds of platforms like TikTok.

Ryan is optimistic about Blue Sky's growth, comparing its potential trajectory to Twitter's user base in 2011:

"If it continues at the pace it's at, it will hit it [100 million users]." ([12:40])

Ranjan appreciates Blue Sky for fostering genuine networking and engagement:

"I'm posting for the love of posting, just pure love of posting. It's from my actual network." ([19:55])

Alex expresses skepticism, questioning whether Blue Sky can sustain its growth amidst a saturated social media landscape:

"With so much interesting things happening within the group chats, why would you go to a sort of less relevant social network to sort of see what's going on?" ([16:16])

5. Subcultures and the Depths of the Internet

The conversation shifts to the resilience of smaller online subcultures and their existence beneath the mainstream Zinternet.

Ryan underscores that while these communities still exist, they are now "deep, hidden under layers of dark social in group chats and discords":

"They're not nearly as visible... until something happens in one of those communities." ([11:05])

An example discussed is the controversy surrounding a Muppet fan account's misconduct on Twitter:

"All the malfeasance was happening in DMs." ([11:53])

6. BuzzFeed's Struggles and the Changing Media Landscape

Ranjan highlights BuzzFeed's recent sale of assets like First We Feast for $82.5 million as a sign of the media company's financial troubles:

"BuzzFeed as a business is in a lot of trouble and is just trying to clean up their balance sheet." ([36:51])

Ryan criticizes traditional digital media companies for being ill-equipped to handle successful internet properties:

"Buzzfeed doesn't know what to do with [First We Feast]. The media companies of the 2000s and 2010s... are a missing link between two very different eras of how media is made." ([38:06])

Alex connects this to the shift in social media algorithms, suggesting that platforms like BuzzFeed thrived when aggregating similar viral content before algorithms took over:

"The core purpose of BuzzFeed is no longer needed as social media's algorithms became so effective." ([41:03])

7. Monetization of Viral Content and OnlyFans’ Role

The discussion transitions to the monetization strategies of viral content creators, particularly focusing on OnlyFans.

Ryan explains how OnlyFans has become a lucrative platform for creators like Lily Phillips, who employs viral stunts to drive subscriptions:

"She's trying to monetize this stuff... porn stars and sex workers online now have a much easier way of directly making money off of going viral." ([28:19])

Ranjan observes that public content often serves as lead generation for paid content:

"The public content is just lead gen for the paid stuff." ([34:37])

Alex notes the shift towards more provocative content as creators aim to drive audiences behind paywalls:

"The algorithms are pushing that very hard... It's all getting lazier and sillier because it's trying to get you to go behind the paywall." ([33:00])

8. Political Realignments and the Decline of the Culture War

A pivotal segment of the episode examines the intersection of internet culture with political dynamics, particularly the waning interest in traditional culture war topics.

Ryan posits that age cohorts influenced by long-standing online culture wars are beginning to shift focus:

"I'm waiting to see what replaces it... the culture war is a direct result of sort of reconfiguring society." ([51:53])

Ranjan reflects on the generational disinterest in repetitive political narratives, suggesting that new forms of identity and conflict are emerging:

"The algorithm demands something new. You can't keep saying the same thing over and over again." ([52:45])

Alex speculates whether the Republicans' recent victories have muted the intensity of culture war narratives:

"Is it possible that the culture war is less interesting, basically, because the Republicans won?" ([50:45])

9. The Future of the Internet and Media

In their closing thoughts, the hosts and guests contemplate the future trajectory of the Internet and media consumption.

Ryan references Jonah Peretti's master's thesis on identity in late-stage capitalism, suggesting that fractured identities are leading to the decline of traditional culture war content:

"Identity has become so fractured and I think so boring for people that I am waiting to see what replaces it." ([52:55])

Ranjan echoes this sentiment, emphasizing that the current moment marks the beginning of a new era in digital consumption:

"We're definitely at the beginning of something new. Hopefully, it's not too scary." ([56:15])

Alex concludes by highlighting the ongoing transformation and the uncertainty that accompanies it, inviting listeners to stay engaged as the digital landscape continues to evolve.

Key Takeaways

1. Algorithmic Shift: The transition from follow-based to algorithm-driven content feeds has democratized viral fame, allowing everyday individuals to gain widespread recognition without traditional follow networks.

2. Pandemic’s Role: COVID-19 accelerated online engagement, transforming the Internet from a niche subculture to a mainstream cultural influence, profoundly affecting consumption patterns and mental engagement.

3. Emerging Platforms: Blue Sky represents an attempt to revive traditional social networking amidst a crowded landscape of algorithm-heavy platforms, emphasizing genuine engagement over viral algorithms.

4. Media Industry Challenges: Traditional digital media companies like BuzzFeed struggle to adapt to the new Internet dynamics, leading to asset sales and questioning their long-term viability in a rapidly changing environment.

5. Monetization Through Platforms: Platforms like OnlyFans have capitalized on the shift by enabling direct monetization of viral content, prompting creators to adopt more provocative strategies to drive subscriptions.

6. Political Shifts: The traditional culture wars are losing steam, with younger generations seeking new forms of identity and expression online, potentially leading to significant political realignments.

7. Future Uncertainty: The Internet is at a critical inflection point, with ongoing changes in user behavior, platform dynamics, and content monetization shaping the future of digital media and online culture.

Notable Quotes:

• Ryan Broderick on the shift from digital monoculture:

  "We kind of lived like that for about a decade... have moved away from the follow model on social media." ([03:07])

• Ryan Broderick on the deeper, hidden subcultures:

  "They exist. It's just they're not nearly as visible... as they used to be until something happens in one of those communities." ([11:05])

• Ranjan Roy on Blue Sky’s authentic networking:

  "When I do get engagement, it's from people that I've interacted with online for years... that's the latter, which is good." ([19:11])

• Ryan Broderick on Blue Sky's potential growth:

  "If it continues at the pace it's at, it will hit [100 million users]." ([12:42])

• Alex Kantrowitz on the diminishing role of platforms like BuzzFeed:

  "The core purpose of BuzzFeed is no longer needed as social media's algorithms became so effective." ([41:03])

• Ryan Broderick on OnlyFans' impact:

  "Porn stars and sex workers online now have a much easier way of directly making money off of going viral." ([30:53])

• Ryan Broderick on the end of the culture war era:

  "A lot of people right now are saying, okay, well, this thing that's going viral, should I care about it? It's just happening." ([32:08])

• Ranjan Roy on the new inflection point:

  "We're definitely at the beginning of something new. Hopefully, it's not too scary." ([56:15])

This episode offers a comprehensive exploration of the evolving Internet landscape, providing listeners with valuable insights into the forces reshaping online culture, media consumption, and political discourse. Through engaging dialogue and expert analysis, Alex Kantrowitz and his guests shed light on the complex interplay between technology, society, and individual behavior in the digital age.