Riley Bray (1:50)

Everybody. Yeah.

Michael McMillan (1:51)

So guys, put your pitches into the. What title would you give Riley? And we'll include them in future episodes. So we have a very special episode today. We are paying tribute to the one and only David lynch. And here to help us do that is one of the best friends of the show. I mean, the warmest presence we've possibly ever had in the clubhouse club. Scouts of all timeline, please welcome back to the show. Actor, heart performer, meditator, comedian, beautiful mind. Eric Edelstein is with us. Eric, welcome back to the show.

Eric Edelstein (2:35)

Hi, brothers. How you doing? Thanks for, thanks for having me. And it's an honor to honor the great man with you.

Michael McMillan (2:41)

Well, and you know, here's what happened the other day. Riley and I were on the phone discussing the podcast and he had to take a call on the other line and as he was on the other line, friend of the show, Dave Keith, texted me that David lynch had passed away. And I was shocked. And then Riley came back on the line, and I said, riley, David lynch just died. And Riley said, well, that's our Patreon episode this week. We have to talk about David. David Lynch. And I was like, a hundred percent. And then I was like, wait a minute. We have a club scout who actually worked with the man in Twin Peaks to return and has practiced meditation. And that's you, Eric. So, so welcome. I'll kick this off by saying this. I have obviously no more ownership over David Lynch's work. I was at Bob's Big Boy in Burbank this morning at the vigil, and I brought a bag of Cheetos and laid it at the Big Boy's feet.

Eric Edelstein (3:42)

Perfect.

Michael McMillan (3:44)

So I know what an impact he had. I will say this. I've never been more affected by the passing of an artist. I think in.

Riley Bray (3:55)

In.

Michael McMillan (3:55)

In recent memory, there's been a few. David Bowie, Philip Seymour Hoffman. When we got off the phone the other day, Riley, I sobbed. I sat down on the couch. On the couch and I sobbed. So it's so strange to mourn and grieve for a stranger in my life. I can't imagine, Eric, what it's like to mourn for somebody that you actually worked with.

Eric Edelstein (4:18)

Well, I think part of it is he's not a stranger to you. You guys knew him. And you also know, spoiler alert, he was exactly the same. The guy delivered, delivering. The weather was even better in person. So for all the people, he's not a stranger to you. He very actively made the choice to make himself available to all of you. And he also did it primarily to boost meditation. And if there's anything I can belabor right now, sometimes people say, oh, so and so would want you to do this. I know how David lynch would want to be honored if everybody would listen to his book Catching the Big Fish and perhaps explore transcendental meditation. And there's ways anybody can get it on a sliding scale. It's not a cult. It's not a religion. It's a practice. It's a technique. You learn it so quickly. But that's why a big reason why he made himself available to everybody was to try to spread this thing in this crazy world, to be able to leave for 20 minutes twice a day and clear cortisol levels and everything else. I'm truly just doing what he would do, which was he would meet everybody at the Ace Hotel, sign every book Deal with every person because he just wanted this message out there. But for everyone out there, he's not a stranger to you. He made himself known to you. And you know, it's one thing to be that kind of director, but the weather reports and the YouTubes and today I'm thinking of the Bob Dylan song Things have Changed and he, he was kind of like all of our cosmic grandfather in, in a way.

Riley Bray (5:51)

Yeah.

Eric Edelstein (5:51)

And then just in meeting him, it was for me that expression, don't meet your heroes is absolute and total bullshit. He was just the greatest soul ever and there's a giant void. And he also was kind of, to me felt like one of the big beating hearts of Los Angeles. Totally. And I know a lot of people like to make fun and tease Los Angeles, but I always felt like there was this thing of like, well, the coolest guy in the world loves la, so it can't be that bad. So you can think whatever you want, but I know LA is awesome and David lynch knows LA is awesome.

Michael McMillan (6:26)

It was odd timing, wasn't it? With his passing sort of lining up with the fires. I feel like.

Eric Edelstein (6:33)

Yeah, yeah, it's, it's almost too much.

Riley Bray (6:37)

Yeah. In a way very like Lynching and surreal though, for him to depart while this is all happening. It's just like, it is like a weird fever dream. Like the, the whole last few, this last week has been like just so bizarre and it is, I mean, it is like this, you know, this grand dream in a way. And like for him to depart, like while that's all going on, it's. I don't know, I'm not trying to like make something out of the fires, but it's like, it's almost bizarrely fitting in a way or something like that.

Michael McMillan (7:12)

I mean, I think it all ties in existentially to what we've been going through. And that's the other thing about like feeling a weird sense of ownership. Right. Like I'm at the end of a 12 month cycle that began with my mother passing away and the year being full of surprises change. A lot of stress, a lot of strife, and then it's ending with my favorite living artist passing away. It feels, it's hard to not feel like, connect, especially because of what his work was. To not look inward when something like this happens or look at the symbolism around you as it's happening and go, when you. What does it mean? You know, and it may mean nothing, but for me that's what the work was about, was it doesn't provide answers the films never provide answers, but they. But they force you to ask questions about our own existence and the world that we live in.

Riley Bray (8:03)

Yeah.

Eric Edelstein (8:04)

You would say, well, life doesn't provide answers, so why would you expect art to do it?

Michael McMillan (8:10)

I love that.

Riley Bray (8:11)

I was driving yesterday and I had KCRW on, and they started playing the Twin Peaks theme, and I was looking at the palm trees as I was driving down Hollywood Boulevard, and I was thinking about that quote that he said about the light in LA and just how it makes him feel so free and about his love for la. And I was. It just like, man, it felt like a dream. Like, it just hit me and I just, like, I feel like I keep having these moments where I'm thinking about all these things that he said, just like. And these images that he's made also. Like, his painting. Like, his painting is incredible. Like, dark, surreal, funny. Like, so funny. I just. I don't know, I just, like. I keep kind of having these moments of thinking about them. But, Eric, you brought up Catching the Big Fish and that. That little book had such a huge impact on me as far as, like, my artistic practice and even just, like, life practice. And I just. Like, we should. We should talk about that. That book a little bit and, like, sort of some of the wisdom that it contains. And what.

Eric Edelstein (9:12)

Yeah.

Riley Bray (9:13)

What's your kind of, like, takeaway from that or how is that?

Eric Edelstein (9:17)

Well, for me, what I always tell people, you know, it's the perfect midwife to meditation. And meditation is this gift. And it's. So I always say, do the audiobook, Riley. Right? Like, listen to him read it. And even his newest book, listen to him read it. Because he improvises. He doesn't stick to what he wrote. It's. It's. It's the best, man. Like, he's just, you know, talk about somebody who created in the second every second he was in. And I got to watch it on Twin Peaks, and it was so beautiful and amazing to watch. Like, he would add shots, he'd add whole things during the day, and his crew had been with him for 30 years. And also what I will say, you know, his whole crew meditates. We're all in with him. So I've never been on a happier set. It felt like a day at the spa. It felt like Disneyland. It felt like opening day at Dodger Stadium. There's this feeling when everybody's meditating and they do group meditations at the David lynch foundation where you just feel whatever this is that's bigger than us. You feel It. And, yeah, for me, Catching the Big Fish was wild. Riley. Because I read it just as a fan and feeling, I think, like you guys of, you know, I was an outcast little kid in the Northwest watching Twin Peaks with. On the couch with my mom at age 12. And so, because I love David lynch so much, this. The book was a midwife to this. And then I read it, and then that's what brought me to meditating. And then very magically, all this other stuff happened that I never could have dreamed of, but I'm the ultimate example of, like, yeah, definitely Reed catching the big fish.

Michael McMillan (10:54)

So you were into the meditation, and did you start practicing TM before you even got cast on Twin D?

Eric Edelstein (11:00)

No, this is a funny story. And I kept it very, very quiet for a long time, but then Michael revealed it. So I will say what happened, and it's pretty magic. I had read Catching the Big Fish, and then I was very interested in tm. And then my buddy Michael Sarah reached out and said, I'm thinking about starting tm. Are you interested? And it felt like cosmic interweaving. Because it's like, oh, wow. Yeah. Okay, let's do it. And I had no money at the time, so I went there. I did it with Michael, Sarah, and my buddy Simon and his wife. And it was right when the David lynch foundation started in Los Angeles. And then on the last day, one of the TM teachers, Pookie Freeberg, she's amazing. Said, hey, David has heard that there are some actors that just learn meditation. And the foundation just started here. He'd like to invite you out to his house to meditate. And Michael and I just looked at each other in shock, you know, both with sheer reverence and like, this. This can't be real. This is not gonna happen. We're gonna go out and we're gonna get rolled. We're gonna. In Tijuana without a kidney. Like, this can't be real. But instead, we went out to his giant concrete mansion, and it was just shocking. And the first thing I said to him, I just look at him like, Mr. Lynch, I'm from Spokane. Oh, are you kidding me? You're from Spokane? Oh, I can still smell those ponderosa pines and hear the Air Force planes from Fairchild from overhead. Because we know now Spokane is kind of blue velvet. And it was incredibly influential on him. And then immediately I could tell that he was just looking at Michael. And I know now he was already starting to write that Wally Brando. And then when I got. So then I stuck with Meditation and loved it. And when I got the Twin Peaks audition, I'll take a little time to tell us, you know, God damn it, these people pay good money.

Michael McMillan (13:00)

You should.

Eric Edelstein (13:03)

I assumed it was because I went to his house, and I was actually wrong. I got the audition. Just. I got the audition. And then thank God, because you're at this industrial thing in the Valley auditioning, and you hear people. And I was like, okay, just try to be myself. Don't perform so they don't have any lines for you to memorize. So it's just Joanna Ray asking you questions on camera to get a sense of you, because he would use people's real personalities to write.

Riley Bray (13:32)

Wow.

Eric Edelstein (13:32)

So she's like, so, do you know why you're here? And I'm like, twin Peaks. And she's like, and what do you think of that? I'm like, just trying to keep it casual. And I giggled. And you can actually see it on the dvd. There's a behind the scenes that this giggle burrowed in him. And he. You can see him decide to hire me because he goes, wow, could there be three detectives? And thank God Mark Frost and Sabrina Sutherland immediately went, yeah. And he goes, okay, I want to hire that big guy with that laugh. And then he just started breaking down what my character was. He may not look it, but he's an ace detective. And there's the three brothers, but he's the sweetie of them. And I showed up and there was nothing in the script. And he would just give me stuff to do. He's like, okay, blurt out two giggles and, like, suppress the third. And I go, that's it. Okay. And then he give me little lines. And then one day he was like, okay, in this scene, I want to have you ask your brother about paying 287 bucks for a tail light. That's outrageous to you. So I was like, okay. So he did the first time. And he's like, yeah. I mean, he. That's 287 bucks for a tail light that you got to really get him on that. That's. That's kind of crazy. You think he might be kind of dumb for that? So I did it. And we're all waiting expectantly, like, I really hope I nailed the gravity of the tail light. And then everyone's kind of looking around, and we were about to shoot another scene, and everyone's kind of nervously waiting to move on. And then he just kind of paused. He goes, okay, yeah, we did it, guys. We got to go see that tail light. So he Adds a scene where we go out in a parking lot to look at a tail light. And meanwhile, costumes is freaking out because they have to do a wardrobe change for us now for this thing to match continuity. So they're all freaking out, and I'm like, does he know that they're freaking out? Can he tell? Does he care? And then he goes, okay, detectives, take off your ties. And Detective 1, hand your tie to Detective 2. Detective 2 to 3. Detective 3, you hand your tie to Detective Fusco 1. And then he just smiled real big. He goes, okay, our wardrobe change is done. So I'm, like, wearing David Koechner's tie. That's like, you know, let's be honest, not. Not quite long enough for the big band. But, you know, he just over and over again would do that. And then my other favorite, favorite, real favorite memories, I used to have real life recurring nightmares of being on set and not being able to remember lines.

Michael McMillan (16:01)

Sure.

Eric Edelstein (16:02)

And I was thrilled. Mike, you know me, I'm a character actor. I'm thrilled. Doing very little. I love being on set. I love mixing it up. I am great with it.

Michael McMillan (16:11)

Yeah.

Eric Edelstein (16:12)

But then one day he came. He's like, okay, bucko, today's the day. You got a monologue. And they're lighting the scene. They are lighting the scene. And he pulls out this monologue that he's written by hand. And I'm like, oh, God, this is. I've literally had this nightmare of having to memorize quickly for David lynch or Neil Young, like, oh, my God, here. And hopefully Neil Young will hire me one day. We got to do that. We're playing house money already. But he's so intuitive, and, no, he looked at me and could tell him in that moment. I'd had a recurring nightmare about memorizing for him. And then he quickly looked. He's like, you can have the paper right there. I don't care about that. It looks like detective work. What I care about is your mother is lost and driving around the hills, and you're the only person that will help her because your brothers won't, because you're a sweetie. So I just started memorizing these lines, and it was just like, all heaven sent. Because my brother on the show, Larry Clark, is an acting teacher. And then I'm sitting there with Don Murray, who was the secret star of Twin Peaks the Return, who is nominated for an Oscar in 1956 with Marilyn Monroe. And they all just started helping me. And sure enough, I got it memorized in, like, 15 minutes. I did have the paper there. Hilariously, he said, we won't see it. You can see it, but it looks like detective work. Like I took a statement, but I never even needed to look down at it because he empowered me with his way of leadership, which was pure love.

Michael McMillan (17:41)

Wow.

Eric Edelstein (17:41)

To memorize lines and get over this lifelong fear. And then that fear went away because of him.

Michael McMillan (17:49)

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Eric Edelstein (20:27)

Yeah, and then he was just making him happy was the greatest, greatest feeling in the world. And every day with him was, was just truly a dream. I never wanted it to end. I still can't believe it happened. Sometimes I even now wake up and I'm like, man, you're in Twin Peaks. And it's one of those things where, like, I always feel like I'm playing with house money out here. If it all went away tomorrow, I work with David Lynch. I got in Peaks and like, he, he made me a better actor and through meditation, made me a much better person.

Michael McMillan (21:00)

And I think what people listening may not understand is, like, a lot of directors aren't like that. You might assume that directors are, like, getting in there with the actors, giving them confidence. I mean, Eric, I know Riley too. We've all been on sets where the director is so busy with other things that they just kind of expect the actor to show up, do their thing. They might get a couple notes, and oftentimes you're going, am I doing a good job? Do they like what I'm doing here? I'm, you know, I've, I've had to learn that, like, if you're not getting a ton of feedback, that's usually a good sign. But I'm somebody who loves that interaction like that and loves feeling like, okay, the fact that he set a tone of safety and confidence as opposed to, like, I'm so scared that I'm gonna fuck up on this set because that really makes you tense up as a performer. And then you're not, you're not really connecting anything because you're worried about stepping, stepping on the wrong line or something, you know?

Eric Edelstein (21:53)

Yeah, yeah. And like, just the love that he has for actors. He. He wraps everybody. He gets his bullhorn. If you have one line on Twin Peaks, he would get the bullhorn. Okay, everybody gather around. And he would do a giant send off for everyone. 1. And when the show started airing, I got invited to a party at Kimmy Robertson's house, who I'd never met. And I'm like, oh, it's, it's a, it's a watch party or something. And then you walk in the room and there's Kimmy, there's Carol the Giant, there's Russ Tamblyn.

Michael McMillan (22:28)

Wow.

Eric Edelstein (22:29)

Little did I know they did this because My first episode was airing that night. Like, everything they do is so curated. So I'm sitting here around my childhood heroes, and then I pop up on screen, and then everybody comes over to, like, welcome me to this family. And we all still get together. We got together at Michelli's, like, three months ago.

Michael McMillan (22:48)

Wow.

Eric Edelstein (22:49)

And he just created this family, and everything he did had so much love behind it. And he was kind of one of the most loving people I've ever met in my life. And again, like, you know, to go through and meet every single person at the Ace Hotel, only because he wanted to push meditation on people as a way to survive this crazy world. How much love is that? Like, you know, there's some. There's some interesting folks out there. He met every single one of them, accepted every single gift, and made every single person feel like a million bucks because he cared about meditation so much. I watched this thing he did last night where he was talking to Putin after he invaded Ukraine, and it was the most beautiful thing ever. Basically, he was telling Vladimir Putin, you're gonna have a karmic debt, and you're gonna have to probably come back in many lifetimes if you. If you don't stop this fucking behavior, you're gonna keep coming back. These are lessons you need to learn. Why start war? And it was just, like, the beauty of it. And I believe the man.

Riley Bray (23:52)

Yeah. Yeah. There's such a sincerity in every. Everything he has done. And, like, it's like, we, as, like, fans of the work, like, love it so much, but then, like, it's like the story that you just told, and like, every other person that I've ever heard of talking about working with them, It's. It's that same story where it's just like, there's as much. As much love of the work as it's being made as. As, like, the love for it when it's completed. And it's just like. It's so clear when you. When you watch it and when you engage with. With everything that he's left for us that. I remember when you popped up watching, I was like, I can't believe I know someone that's in Twin Peaks.

Eric Edelstein (24:34)

This is unbelievable.

Riley Bray (24:36)

You see that? It just exudes from it. And also, just for. As strange and weird and free as he would be with everything, everything always feels so grounded. Your character is like. That laugh has a whole backstory, you know, about the relationship with the brothers and this personality and that you're a sweetie. And it's like you can just feel that in everything. And I just. He left this gift to the world in, like, just, like, truly authentic art making and doing it not as a place that's like serving ego and serving the great director. It's like. No, it's like he's acting in service to all these people and creating this community and helping you get over a lifelong fear. And, like, all of these things, and it's just. It just exudes out of the work. And I feel like it's just going to reverberate for, like, forever, really, as long as people are engaging with media. You know, like, he. He's just such a cornerstone for cinema, art, meditation, just how to live, how to be, how to. How to approach life and think about other people and think about yourself. And. I don't know, it's just that. That story. It's very touching. It's very inspiring.

Eric Edelstein (25:49)

I mean, he brought a cow to Hollywood and La Brea. They couldn't afford an Oscar campaign. And he loves Laura Dern so much and wanted to find a way to get her for your consideration. Like, you know, he went and sat there. You can see YouTube videos of people coming up with their phones and say, I'm here because Laura Dern should be nominated because it's the best performance of 2006. Like, how selfless is. He sat in Hollywood in library with a goddamn cow.

Michael McMillan (26:18)

Ah, I love that. And you really see it in, I think, the Return and in Inland Empire, that the. He really felt like in his last two big pieces, that he is kind of painting cinema as he goes along. He's assembling the movie and the story in the. In the moment. And that is just so inspiring, too, to go. You know, when. When you come from a place here in Hollywood where you're like, drill, drill, drill. To have the outline down, to have your pitch perfect. If you're gonna, like, try to make a movie like you. You get all this commercial, and some of it is structurally sound, obviously. Like, some of it is, like, trying to guide you towards a process that will help help you write a screenplay. But to see a filmmaker who's just sort of painting the cinema and bring in, bringing the piece together and saying it doesn't have to have traditional form. It doesn't have to have a traditional beginning, middle. And I was just listening to Terry Gilliam talk about Spielberg vs. Kubrick. Nothing to do with really with David lynch, but. But he was talking about how. But I think this the same thing that Gilliam's talking about Kubrick applies to lynch. Where Spielberg's a filmmaker who wants to wrap everything up with an answer by the end of the movie. And sometimes those answers aren't totally satisfying. But go home feeling good, and you go, I know what happened. And I know what I'm supposed to take away from that, from that story. Kubrick didn't do that. 2001, you have an ending that you don't totally understand, but you think about it. Twin Peaks to Return especially, is that way. For me, I think about the ending of Twin Peaks to return weekly, if not daily. The, the, the stuff that David lynch has made, and I'm a late comer. I, I'll be honest. Like, I saw Mulholland Drive in college, and I was obsessed with it. I loved it. It left a huge impact on me. But it wasn' later that I finally jumped into his filmography and watched Twin Peaks and then all of his movies. Lost highway was a huge one for me, and I want to mention that in just a second. But. But, you know, I'm a guy sitting here in my office surrounded by Star wars and comic book collectibles, and obviously Star wars is a movie that I think about a lot, but I really think the thing I think about most, it is Twin Peaks. I think about the. I think about Firewalk with me all the time. I think about Twin Peaks, the Return all the time. I'm carrying that entire story, that world with me on a daily basis in a way that I, I. Nothing has really gotten to me before. Wow.

Eric Edelstein (28:57)

You know my favorite. Do you know the great Lost highway story of casting Robert Loggia?

Riley Bray (29:01)

No.

Eric Edelstein (29:02)

Oh, this is another great one. This is another great one. So, Mike, I'm sure you've had this, but, I mean, I can think. You know, we used to have a lot more in person auditions, but there's that place on Wilshire I'd go to.

Michael McMillan (29:13)

I think I do know the story, but tell it.

Eric Edelstein (29:14)

Oh, it's the best. And it just shows how he creates and how he comes up with this stuff. So you go to these auditions sometimes and you can hear people offering the part you're about to read for to other people on the phone. It's just one of those things you have to deal with, but it's humbling. And it's also like, oh, man, this is hard. So I just go with the, okay, I'm gonna go in there and make a. Make a fan. I'm gonna do the best I can. Maybe they'll offer me another part, which has happened, but it still sucks because you're like, that guy's more famous than me. They're offering that to him. Like, I have to audition, and they're just offering it to him. Like, that guy. God, man, come on. But it's one of those things. It's just one of those things. Well, Robert Loggia auditioned for Blue Velvet and he's in there auditioning, and then he hears them talking about how they are finalizing Dennis Hopper's deal. They forget to tell Robert Loggia. He's still sitting out there waiting. Apparently, he's waiting about an hour and a half, hearing people buzzing, how happy they are to hear Dennis Hopper playing Frank Booth, which I'm sure Robert Loggia felt he was best for. So he leaves and he's gonna go find this fucker. He's gonna go find the art house guy. So sure enough, he finds lynch and screams at him with such a terrifying rage about his lack of respect. You motherfucker. Basically, everything he does in Lost highway, there's a road rage incident. Robert Loggia unleashes a brilliant scene. Unreal. Terrifying level of anger. Almost as terrifying as Robert Blake in that movie. Almost. Not quite, friends, let's be honest. But David lynch is sitting here being screamed at and gets a smile on his face. And then instantly, he knows how to use him. So down the road, when Lost Highways coming up, he realized 10 years later, that's it. That's it. And that's what he did. He would create out of space and allow anything to influence the creation. Wow.

Michael McMillan (31:14)

He's like, get me that guy who screamed at me. I knew him in this movie.

Eric Edelstein (31:18)

Yeah. And you know, you think you scream, you scream at an auteur, it's not going to end well for you. But for Robert Loggie, it got him one of the best parts of his life.

Riley Bray (31:25)

That's the strongest audition.

Eric Edelstein (31:27)

Yeah, you're right, Riley. That's the strongest audition there is.

Michael McMillan (31:32)

This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Listening to this podcast.

Eric Edelstein (31:36)

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Michael McMillan (31:38)

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Eric Edelstein (31:45)

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Michael McMillan (31:47)

Just another way to save with a personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state. Transform your home during blinds.com's Cyber Monday Super Sale. Get up to 50% off site wide, plus huge doorbuster deals on popular styles. Go DIY and do it all 100% online or choose white Glove service with expert design help and professional installation, Both backed by Blinds.com's 100% satisfaction guarantee. Blinds.com Cyber Monday Super Sale is here. Save up to 50% site wide and get a free professional measure. Limited time offer rules and restrictions apply. See blinds.com for details. Lost highway was actually the movie that brought me back to Lynch. And it was after we started the podcast and, and I don't remember, it was maybe a year in maybe a year and a half into doing bcc and I was home late one night by myself. I was like, I gotta pop something on. What am I gonna pop on? And Lost highway was available. And I was like, you know, I've heard bad things about this movie. I want, you know, I want to get back into Lynch. I loved Mulholland Drive. Let's just put this on. And I was captivated for the entire movie. And then Robert Blake's character has such similarities to a character out of, of high strangeness folklore. Indrik Cold, the grinning man from Woody Darren Burger. This, this, this person, this white faced grinning man who came out of a UFO and approached a traveling salesman late one night on the road. And I watched this, I watched this and I went, he knows. I went, david lynch knows that story. He must know about. Injured Cold. This character is just like him. And, and, and I went, this is high strangeness. I was like, this man knows how to capture high, the feeling of high strangeness on camera. And then that's what led me to go, all right, I'm in. Let's go Twin Peaks. Let's do it all. And the more I watched his stuff, I watched it through that lens using the vocabulary that we kind of discovered here on the podcast. And certainly with Mark Frost, you know, in, in Twin Peaks, you get into UFOs, you get into all this stuff. I was like, they know, they get it. They understand how reality is not really reality, right? And that we are in touch with forces within us that we that are subconscious, our shadow selves and there. And that we are often influenced by energies outside of our time and space that we have no comprehension of. Oh, you're on mute, buddy.

Eric Edelstein (34:33)

And we're talking high strangeness. We got to give big ups to our buddy, Steve Berg. Oh, has that. You know, he understands lynch at a level even way, way beyond me. But Mark Frost is heavily involved with like, the Theosophical Society and he's up in Ojai doing all that stuff. And I know we lost a lot of that library, which is just devastating. But I think he filled in a lot of that for lynch as well. And then the other hilarious thing was, you know, it's Lynch's deal. Like they're his ideas. And I believe it was Robert Blake's idea for the kabuki makeup. They're like, Robert has an idea. And then Lynn, you know, normally, I think lynch, it's his. It's his. His vision usually. And lynch showed. And Robert Blake showed the kabuki makeup. He's like, it was just so terrifying. I had to say, yes, my God. That was, of course, how it had to be. So I think lynch is so. Because he medit meditates like he does. He is so pulling from the subconscious, from the collective consciousness, from all that high strangeness stuff in such a remarkable way. And then I always just remember when I introduced him to my wife, she had just started meditating and she's. I don't think she's seen any. Anything from lynch yet. So she didn't. Doesn't have quite the reverence. And she's just incredibly wonderfully honest about everything. So she went up to him, she's like, God, do you really do the meditation every day? Twice a day. And he looked at her and it was like David lynch, the auteur went and the meditation teacher. I have done it every single day, twice a day since 1973. Imagine collective bliss. And it was so amazing. He did not mind. He did not mind her lack of reverence. If anything, he was kind of enjoyed it. And then he just went into her, explaining to her why you need to meditate twice a day for 20 minutes. It worked. It worked. Clearly it works. I know for me, it's just helped me a ton. And, you know, I know I'm just a much happier person and I'm able to pull out. I mean it literally. The main reason I recommend catching the big fish is he gets into the science of lowers cortisol levels. They measure your brain waves, heart waves. Like the actual curative effect on the big body is staggering. And that's why he made it his primary focus in life, to spread it.

Michael McMillan (37:00)

Yeah, I've threatened to do this before. I'm gonna say I'm dragging you.

Eric Edelstein (37:04)

I'm dragging you.

Michael McMillan (37:05)

Well, you do it.

Eric Edelstein (37:06)

You seem like such a meditator.

Riley Bray (37:07)

I am a meditator. I've never actually learned specifically transcendental meditation. And I would love to like, explore that.

Eric Edelstein (37:14)

Yeah. But also say, I think. And he would say, any meditation is amazing. It's just amazing. But if, If Y' all want to do it? They've, they've, they've made it very easy here in Los Angeles and more and more cities. My friend in Spokane is about to go to Seattle to do it. But you know that that's the best, best way to honor him. And boy, you'll end up really honoring yourself because I'm shocked. The things I'm stressed about just go away.

Michael McMillan (37:37)

I ran into Eric a few months ago during a particularly stressful moment in my life, and you brought it up with me and you're like, maybe, maybe you should check this out. And I've been thinking about it. I'm like, is it soon as the holidays are over and all this stuff, you know, we're, we're. I'm back in LA and ready have time. I really want to. And now with him passing, it seems like another sign because the thing that I find really interesting about this moment of being in, you know, grieving over an artist is I'm suddenly feeling inspired to be like, okay, it's up to us now. We have to carry the baton. He's gone. He showed the way. Let's. Let's create, let's make this art, let's do this. And so I'm like, this is another sign that I need to get into this. And I've really been thinking, it's funny, like the past. I've really just been on my timeline on Instagram, just watching video after video of him, and it's really been more about him in the past 24 hours than the movies and the stuff, the, the art and just realizing what a fascinating, cool role model this guy is. And I kind of want to up my game and of want to, you know, be a soldier for David lynch moving forward, you know, I love it.

Eric Edelstein (38:52)

I just love it. The other movie I will heartily recommend right now is the Straight Story.

Michael McMillan (38:57)

Oh, my God, that one.

Eric Edelstein (38:59)

So that one is. That one, I think is also for those that are newer to Lynch. I think it's a great Midwife. And it's also amazing because it's G rated. It's a, it's a movie he sold to Disney and it's.

Riley Bray (39:10)

He loved that it was Disney plus right now.

Eric Edelstein (39:12)

Yeah. But there are so much, so many things in there that he would later use in the Return. Like with the sound editing, there's moments of terror that are completely ominous.

Michael McMillan (39:22)

Tractor going down the hill. You're like, oh, this is very lynching, all of us.

Eric Edelstein (39:27)

Death is coming in this movie. And really it's more terrifying than a lot of R rated movies.

Michael McMillan (39:34)

Mm.

Eric Edelstein (39:34)

They just rate those based on, you know, nudity or sex or swear violence. But the. You feel the impending doom and death coming for Richard Farnsworth the whole time and. But it's just so sweet. It's so wonderful. It vibrates at this. Just incredible energy. So for a lot of people now here, if you're not a Lynch head yet, that's a great way to start and you will leave that movie affected.

Riley Bray (40:02)

I agree. I'm glad you brought up sound too because, like, I think we often focus on his visuals because they are so interesting and compelling and strong. But man, is he an incredible sound artist. Like, there's the music. Like, he's been a huge influence on me as far as like using synthesizers and getting into all that. And the way he explores music that's. Or like the record he did with Sparkle Horse is incredible. The track he did with Flying Lotus where he's like telling that story is so cool. But then like, you hear the stories of like him working with his composers. Like, one that comes to mind is when he was working with Trent Reznor for. I mean, this is just something I've read. You know, I wasn't there, but like he was working with Trent Reznor to get the score for Lost highway. And like, Trent Reznor is expecting like to see picture and like, you know, like, you know, the traditional sort of scoring session. And he said David lynch just came in and was like, imagine snakes flying at you. Okay, now give me that. Trent was like, okay, you know, but. And you hear the same story about when he and Antonio Battlementi. That's his name, right?

Eric Edelstein (41:05)

Yeah, yeah.

Riley Bray (41:06)

Doing Angelo. Thank you. Thank you. Angelo. Doing the score for Twin Peaks. And you know, they would just sit at that Rhodes piano and just talk and play. And like his approach to sound and music, I think is equally compelling to the storytelling and the visuals and everything else.

Michael McMillan (41:23)

Well, because it is. The music is a story that the clip you were just talking about, there's clips of them doing Laura's theme where he's like. And now it's getting closer and you're in love with her and she's getting closer to you and closer and you're in bliss. And now she's going away again and you're losing her and. And you know what I mean? And it's like that whole lore steam is the idea of falling in love with something that you can never fully know and then it being leading to death and leading to loss. It's so the music is. This is the story.

Riley Bray (41:51)

Yeah. And then in the Return, like, the line between sound design and music is so cool. Especially in those, like, super surreal scenes.

Michael McMillan (41:57)

In the episode eight. I mean, the episode eight, you're just spending, what, five, five, ten minutes with a nuclear explosion and it's all sound. That's a really. And Trent Reznor, it's like, does a full performance before you go into that segment.

Riley Bray (42:15)

Yeah.

Michael McMillan (42:16)

Eric, that reminds me. We were talking about Twin Peaks, I think, on this show, a number of years ago, and we were talking about the Return. And you said you had a theory about episode eight, the Woodsman. And the actor who played the Woodsman was like a famous. Guys, if you don't know what we're talking about, I apologize. If you do know what we're talking about, join us. The actor who played the Woodsman, the lead woodsman in that, was a Abraham Lincoln impersonator. And you said you had a theory about what the Woodsman were in the Return.

Eric Edelstein (42:47)

Yeah, the great Robert Broski. And that's his. That's his life. As he impersonates Lincoln, his wife impersonates Mary Todd, they go to Civil War reenacting. He goes to school and talks. But, you know, episode eight is, to me, one of the. The great works of art of this century.

Michael McMillan (43:03)

Yeah, I would agree.

Eric Edelstein (43:04)

It's been shown at the Metropolitan Museum of the Art. My buddy George Griffith is just incredible in it with Kyle. But I think it's. And he would never. I never brought it up to him. I never asked. He would never say it anyway. So let's get around that. But I think it's very deliberate that there's an Abraham Lincoln impersonator, an evil Abraham Lincoln setting a path of destruction after we do the first ever nuclear test.

Michael McMillan (43:30)

Right.

Eric Edelstein (43:31)

I think he's basically. I think just my theory that he's basically saying, once we shot off that first nuke, we made our deal with the devil.

Michael McMillan (43:40)

Yeah.

Eric Edelstein (43:40)

And when you do that, a parallel universe of evil has to rise up as well. So of everything that was good in this world, the inverse has to. Has to show.

Riley Bray (43:50)

Yeah.

Eric Edelstein (43:51)

Which means there's an evil Abraham Lincoln. Instead of leading us through the Civil War and abolishing slavery, leading us toward pure evil.

Michael McMillan (44:00)

Yeah.

Eric Edelstein (44:01)

And killing people.

Michael McMillan (44:02)

And that apply. I mean, I think all of Twin Peaks, especially the Return, is about the shadow, is about the. The dark side of yourself. The Twin Peaks, obviously. And with. With Laura Palmer being someone who was. This is a woman who. A girl who was dependent. She worked on meals on wheels. She was the most. She was the homecoming queen. She was the most popular girl. All the boys were in love with her. Even some of the men were in love with her. And then we find out, oh, she was, you know, a sex worker. She was addicted to drugs. She was running cocaine. Like she was the dark and the light. And that's what the whole thing is about, right, is how do you. How do you hold the darkness and the light together at the same time? And which one prevails? And does the light ever prevail over the dark?

Eric Edelstein (44:50)

Perfectly said.

Michael McMillan (44:52)

Well, let's wrap it up by. I know, I know, obviously, TM is the big thing for you with David. And obviously David lynch. And obviously would be. You've already mentioned the straight story. Do we have any other. Like, here's my favorite. Like, I mean, Jack the Monkey.

Eric Edelstein (45:11)

Monkey. I mean, isn't that the best? Yeah. And did you see. I just saw that Father John, Misty wanted Jack for a song. No, he was interacting with, I believe, David speaking for Jack. Well, Jack's drunk right now. He was in Guatemala. But, like, you know, there were a lot of people who weren't lynch heads that loved that last short he did with. With the Money. It's. It's brilliant, right?

Michael McMillan (45:37)

It's still on Netflix, isn't it?

Eric Edelstein (45:38)

I believe so, yeah.

Michael McMillan (45:40)

Makes me so sad that we're not getting that Netflix series now.

Eric Edelstein (45:44)

I mean, that's a whole other thing. But what an indictment of Hollywood these days that he wanted to make more. All these. Our most brilliant directors want to make stuff and can't find a way in this new world.

Riley Bray (45:54)

So crazy.

Eric Edelstein (45:55)

Yeah.

Michael McMillan (45:56)

Thank you, Showtime, for making Twin Peaks to return.

Eric Edelstein (45:58)

Seriously, thank you, Showtime. And, you know, they gave him the.

Michael McMillan (46:01)

Freedom to do whatever he wanted, much to their chagrin.

Eric Edelstein (46:05)

Hey, man, they did it, though. Bless their. Bless their hearts like nowhere else. Could you say, we gotta see that tail light and then go out to the parking lot, we're shooting a tail light. And he did that over and over and over again.

Michael McMillan (46:17)

That's money that costs.

Eric Edelstein (46:19)

No, it just didn't matter. He had to. The muse. He had to see that tail light. He had to see it.

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Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug.

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Eric Edelstein (46:46)

Cut the camera.

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Michael McMillan (47:27)

Riley, what's your favorite bit of David lynch work?

Riley Bray (47:33)

I guess all that's popping into my head right now is my very first experience of David lynch, which was. I may have told this on the podcast before, but it was when I was pretty young. There were still Blockbusters then and not a lot of Internet. I had seen the Eraserhead image on punk rocker T shirts, and I was.

Eric Edelstein (47:50)

Like, what is that?

Riley Bray (47:51)

That is cool. I gotta find out what that is. And so then I saw that image at Blockbuster and I rented it with my mom, and I was like, can we rent this thing? I don't really know what it is, but I see it around and it looks cool. And I sat and I watched Eraserhead with my mom in silence, just like. And I was just, like, blown away. It blew my mind. I had never seen anything like it. And like, to this day, the lighting in that is such an influence on the way that I like to shoot and, like, everything. But we watched it. We did not say a word. You know, credits roll, long sort of awkward pause. And my mom goes, you didn't like that, did you? And I went, you know, Mom, I really did.

Eric Edelstein (48:33)

And that opened it all up for me.

Riley Bray (48:36)

That's where it all started, you know? So that's just. That's where my mind went for that one.

Michael McMillan (48:40)

Yeah. I have a core memory of watching Mulholland Drive, the first thing I ever saw by him.

Eric Edelstein (48:44)

And.

Michael McMillan (48:45)

And what was amazing about it is we rented it on. It was early DVD days in college. We rented it on DVD from Blockbuster. Friend and friend and me and a friend and I. And we watched. We got super high. And the whole opening where there's like, the swing dancers and it's like the Technicolor 1950. I was like, what is happening? I've never seen anything like this. Got the dumpster lady, like, got. So I was like, oh, my God, this is like a dream, you know, like, powered through all that, we got to the opera scene, and just as they opened the box in the opera, the DVD started Scratching and, and, and, and failed. It stopped playing. So we were like, no. And we couldn't watch the second half of the movie because the DVD was damaged. And, and this is like Friday night in Pittsburgh. Blockbuster is already closed. We have class all that week. So we had to wait an entire week talking. We'd only seen the first half of the movie. We're like, okay, we re rented the movie from a different blockbuster. We made sure the disc worked. We popped it in and then we were like, what is happening? So, like, if you know anything about Valhalla Drive, the second half of the movie, we're like, wait, is this the same movie? What are we watching? So it was kind of like a wild way to explain experience that film, you know, to carry, like really have an act hard act break.

Eric Edelstein (50:20)

Right.

Michael McMillan (50:20)

When the whole thing transforms and then think, what's gonna happen? What's gonna happen? They're like, okay, I did not expect any of this. It's just wild. But yeah, I, I, I, I, I'm, I'm so thankful that, that he existed. I'm thankful that he made Weird Cool, you know, I think we can give a lot of credit to him for making Weird Cool in this, in this world. I think we should. I'm gonna pitch this to you, Riley, if you're interested. We, we, we have another episode dropping next week on the Patreon. I think for Movie Club, we should maybe do Lost highway and watch it and maybe we can talk about how it had such a. Brought up the high strangeness stuff for, for me and see if that's a shared experience.

Eric Edelstein (51:07)

Eric.

Riley Bray (51:08)

Yes, piggybacking on that too. Just to the listener. The art life right now. Criterion Channel. Yes, yes, for free. You don't have to have an account if you haven't seen that or if you have. It's so inspiring and it's so fun and just like warm and just, it's so lovely. So I know that that's right now they're doing like a celebration over there on Criterion. So go watch that.

Michael McMillan (51:33)

Absolutely.

Riley Bray (51:34)

You know, and just absorb it and see how it applies to your own life and your own practice, you know. So that's my, that would be my, my recommend to little listener.

Michael McMillan (51:44)

Definitely. Eric, let's thank you for joining us. I kind of want to leave it with you. Any final thoughts? Anything that you're thinking about in the passing of David lynch this week?

Eric Edelstein (51:53)

Oh, I just love you guys and thanks for having us on and it's awesome to be able to celebrate him with you. There's a void that. That can't be filled. But I think you're right, Mike. It's up to all of us to grab that creative baton, sing our song, make stuff, see the tail light.

Michael McMillan (52:13)

Yeah.

Eric Edelstein (52:13)

You know, as.

Michael McMillan (52:14)

As he's quoted many times this, this weekend already with that void, focus on the donut, not the hole.

Eric Edelstein (52:22)

Absolutely. And that, that's its own mantra. Like, you know, there's so much we have to be grateful for, even with everything crazy in the world right now. And he, he truly lived that. So, you know, if you start to find this world bringing you down and things are too much, try any kind of meditation, anything works. And then focus on the donut, not the hole. You got two legs that are working for you. Put them. Put them forward and just keep moving and do anything creatively. Put yourself out there to honor the greatest.

Michael McMillan (52:55)

I love it. Well, thank you, Eric. Eric Edelstein, we love you so much. Thanks for being here once again.

Eric Edelstein (53:00)

Y' all are the best.

Michael McMillan (53:01)

We love you guys. We love you, too. Listening. Thank you. We're back 2025. We're so excited. We will see you next week for a new episode on the main clubhouse feed and back over here for another episode. We love you. Where there's love, there's kisses.

Eric Edelstein (53:20)

Thank you, Patreon.

Michael McMillan (53:33)

Bigfoot Collectors Club is produced and engineered by Riley Bray and executive produced by Riley bray and Michael McMillan. Our theme song, come alone is by Suneaters, courtesy of Lotus Pool Records. Follow Suneaters on Spotify for three bonus episodes every month and ad free episodes. Check out BCC the Other side at patreon.com bigfootcollectorsclub.

Eric Edelstein (53:55)

Sam.